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Old 01-04-2013, 09:57 AM   #31
dawnball
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Originally Posted by Jenny3 View Post
I disagree with this; your agent can call the seller's agent but should not contact the seller themselves. (unless it's the same agent? Don't think that question has been answered yet)
Sorry, that was sloppy phrasing on my part. I really meant "communicate with" more than "pick up a phone", and was glossing over the details of how many parties would be involved.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:02 PM   #32
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Sorry yes it is listed in the listing 2 seperate times that the house comes furnished!! and I looked it up on several times and found it stated furnished in all the listings and the open house flyer!
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I would take that information and the sales contract to the lawyer ASAP. Once the furniture is sold your really out of luck.
I would certainly at least try this (would probably have the agents meet first though to see if it can be resolved amicably). Honestly, it sounds like somebody is trying to pull something crooked - probably legal, but certainly not ethical. They knew full well that you thought the house came furnished.


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Originally Posted by WebmasterKathy View Post
Sounds like your real estate agent is the one who dropped the ball here. She should have written/reviewed the contract to be sure it included EVERYTHING you expected it to. That's what you have an agent for!

If the contract did not include the furniture, I don't think it makes any difference what the listing said.
This is probably true. If a meeting doesn't resolve the issue, you may have to contact a lawyer to see what recourse you have (if any). Your agent should have "caught" this, I would think.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:04 PM   #33
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Sorry yes it is listed in the listing 2 seperate times that the house comes furnished!! and I looked it up on several times and found it stated furnished in all the listings and the open house flyer!
So... you signed the contract and didn't make sure it was listed there BEFORE you signed? Things can change between the listing and the contract. Items can be negotiated. As such, it all comes down to what you AGREED to IN the contract. When you signed, you AGREED to those terms... no others.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:10 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by LilyWDW View Post
So... you signed the contract and didn't make sure it was listed there BEFORE you signed? Things can change between the listing and the contract. Items can be negotiated. As such, it all comes down to what you AGREED to IN the contract. When you signed, you AGREED to those terms... no others.
I'm pretty sure they've figured that out by now. Obviously, the sellers knew that nothing changed between the listing and the purchase. While they can legally do just what they're doing, they're taking advantage of the situation.

I agree with you. I don't sign anything that I don't read first. I'm guessing the OP hasn't bought many houses (or any) and didn't realize. Their agent should have realized though.

Sadly, they may be stuck, and it may turn out to be an expensive lesson. I still feel sorry for them though and think they were taken advantage of.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:56 PM   #35
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Sadly, they may be stuck, and it may turn out to be an expensive lesson. I still feel sorry for them though and think they were taken advantage of.
I don't know that they were necessarily taken advantage of. The sellers may have thought the OP didn't want the furniture since it wasn't included in the contract and figured they might as well make some money off of it since the buyer didn't want it.
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:46 PM   #36
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Not to beat a dead horse, but it all comes down to the contract as signed. When I purchased my most recent house there was some strange exclusions, but surprisingly the one exclusion that I didn't see was that draperies were excluded. Well there were these beautiful silk lined drapes in the bedroom that I adored, so I added a line in the addendum that said all blinds and drapes should stay. Well lo and behold a few days before closing, the sellers via their agent wanted to take the drapes and while I hated to say "too bad so sad" it was explicit in the contract.

Furnished to me is a very vague statement and I would have gone over that with a fine tooth comb? Were the original owners still occupying it? I would have walked the house and listed every single piece I was expecting in the sale.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:40 PM   #37
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Did you specifically engage the broker you are working with to be a buyer's broker? Or did you just work with him after he greeted you in his office or at an open house for the first time?

Unless you engaged him as a buyer's broker in writing, he really works for the seller. It would have been up to you or an attorney you engaged separately or yet another broker you engaged separately to go through the purchase and sales agreement to see that everything you want included is included.

And you probably would have needed to make a list of the items to be included with some identification of each piece, such as make, model, color, etc. Otherwise, just "furnished" in the P&SA could mean completely different, probably cheaper, furniture brought in.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:57 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by bdcp View Post
Sure they do. Obviously not always, but vacation homes in particular, as well as homes in estate sales do.
BUT when you sign the papers EVERYTHING must be listed, ie: washer, dryer, range,etc.
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Old 01-04-2013, 06:50 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by seashoreCM View Post
Did you specifically engage the broker you are working with to be a buyer's broker? Or did you just work with him after he greeted you in his office or at an open house for the first time?

Unless you engaged him as a buyer's broker in writing, he really works for the seller. It would have been up to you or an attorney you engaged separately or yet another broker you engaged separately to go through the purchase and sales agreement to see that everything you want included is included.

And you probably would have needed to make a list of the items to be included with some identification of each piece, such as make, model, color, etc. Otherwise, just "furnished" in the P&SA could mean completely different, probably cheaper, furniture brought in.


As an example, when our neighbors sold their home the contract listed the appliances that were included (i.e., fridge, stove/oven, dishwasher). What wasn't listed was a specific description of the appliances.

The morning of closing, but before the final walk through, the sellers moved out the original fridge. A really nice high end one. They moved in what we would call a garage fridge - a plain, older model that sits in the garage and stores extra soda, beer, any surplus from the kitchen fridge.

Once we got to know the buyers they brought it up, and some other things about the house they didn't know about. While they were upset, and it was pretty sneaky of the sellers, they didn't have any recourse. Technically a fridge was in the house.

Anymore you do have to be quite specific. You never know when someone will be sneaky. Or, when there just might be a simple misunderstanding between parties. If everything is fully spelled out you can avoid trouble, or most trouble, down the road.
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:51 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by horseshowmom View Post
I would certainly at least try this (would probably have the agents meet first though to see if it can be resolved amicably). Honestly, it sounds like somebody is trying to pull something crooked - probably legal, but certainly not ethical. They knew full well that you thought the house came furnished.
You can't assume that. Lots of people don't want other peoples stuff. They did not ask for it in the contract, even though it was offered, so why is it unethical to sell it?

If there is an issue here it is that the buyers agent does not know what they are doing and/or made a major error. I would claim their bond/insurance if I thought it was material.

I have had situations where we contracted for the house to be "empty and broom swept" and had to have people clean their left behind junk out before we could close. If I wanted your stuff I would have contracted for it.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:00 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Belle0101 View Post


As an example, when our neighbors sold their home the contract listed the appliances that were included (i.e., fridge, stove/oven, dishwasher). What wasn't listed was a specific description of the appliances.

The morning of closing, but before the final walk through, the sellers moved out the original fridge. A really nice high end one. They moved in what we would call a garage fridge - a plain, older model that sits in the garage and stores extra soda, beer, any surplus from the kitchen fridge.

Once we got to know the buyers they brought it up, and some other things about the house they didn't know about. While they were upset, and it was pretty sneaky of the sellers, they didn't have any recourse. Technically a fridge was in the house.

Anymore you do have to be quite specific. You never know when someone will be sneaky. Or, when there just might be a simple misunderstanding between parties. If everything is fully spelled out you can avoid trouble, or most trouble, down the road.
Pretty sad, huh? They knew that when they said applianced inscluded in the listing, people looking at the house would think it meant the appliances that were in the house, not what junk they swapped out. I guess you need to list serial numbers to make sure you get what's in the house.

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You can't assume that. Lots of people don't want other peoples stuff. They did not ask for it in the contract, even though it was offered, so why is it unethical to sell it?

If there is an issue here it is that the buyers agent does not know what they are doing and/or made a major error. I would claim their bond/insurance if I thought it was material.

I have had situations where we contracted for the house to be "empty and broom swept" and had to have people clean their left behind junk out before we could close. If I wanted your stuff I would have contracted for it.
They knew how they listed it, and the agent knew that they were expecting to get everything in the house. Now, did the sellers know specifically? Since they likely weren't there, I can't say they did, but their agent knew I'll bet.

If it is indeed a completely honest mistake, once this is brought to their attention they should be more than happy to leave everything instead of selling it since they got top price for their house.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:14 PM   #42
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Pretty sad, huh? They knew that when they said applianced inscluded in the listing, people looking at the house would think it meant the appliances that were in the house, not what junk they swapped out. I guess you need to list serial numbers to make sure you get what's in the house.
I've wondered since then if as a buyer you would be allowed to take pictures or videos of the appliances and then reference the photos or videos in the contract?
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:45 PM   #43
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I've wondered since then if as a buyer you would be allowed to take pictures or videos of the appliances and then reference the photos or videos in the contract?
Sounds like it might be a good idea, but you could also list the appliances by brand and serial number. That way you would know you were getting those EXACT appliances. That should cover it.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:59 PM   #44
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Sounds like your realtor screwed up
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:15 PM   #45
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I wish the OP would report back. While I feel badly for them that they aren't getting everything they expected, I don't think their is so far any indication that the seller is cheating them. If furniture wasn't in the contract then they likely think that it wasn't wanted. Lots of things that are included in listings to attract potential buyers don't make it into the contract- selling price being an example.

We bought our house from very motivated sellers. They had already been transferred and wanted to get out of this house so that they could reunite their family and eliminate the expense of separate households in distant cities. The listing offered carpet allowances, seller paying closing costs, fencing allowance. Basically they were willing to negotiate anything that a buyer might dislike. We didn't take them up on any allowances preferring to offer a much reduced selling price. We couldn't then claim "but your listing promised new carpet and a fence!"

What's in the contract? That's all that matters.
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