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Old 12-16-2012, 06:08 PM   #16
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Sony RX100 point and shoot (as close as you cna get to a DSLR that fits in your pocket.)

Olympus OM-D for mFT. or pick up ahuge deal on a Panasonic G3 or if you are into video a GH2.

Review of OM-D:
http://blog.mingthein.com/2012/06/02/omd/

Review of SONY RX100
http://blog.mingthein.com/2012/08/06...rative-review/
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Old 12-19-2012, 10:18 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
Thanks.

Costco actually has a good deal on the J1 right now. $499 for a bundle with 2 lenses, the body, and a small case.
I've been reading about the 1 Series, and I have played around with the J1 and V1. Interestingly, I have read some reviews of the new V2 -- The V2 is really made for a photo enthusiast, with a ton of manual controls.
The J1/V1/J2 are designed more like a point and shoot, but with interchangeable lenses. Many of the manual controls are hidden or entirely lacking. For example, I believe ISO control, while possible, is buried in menu options, instead of being simple to reach. (But there it can be accessed with 1 button on the V2). All the cameras entirely lack bracketing exposure. Still, with the V2, they have aimed at those who want a compact advanced camera system. While they were previously focusing on point & shooters, who wanted higher quality.

There are some great deals on the J1 and V1 as they are being cleared out of stock. I saw the V1 for $299. But I just can't recommend the cameras for someone looking for advanced dSLR type controls.
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Old 12-19-2012, 01:29 PM   #18
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I wasn't able to play around with one as the store I went to had them unplugged (plug broken actually) but that is the impression I got as well.

Kind of a glorified point and shoot.

Reviews weren't stellar either.

Dawn

Quote:
Originally Posted by havoc315 View Post
I've been reading about the 1 Series, and I have played around with the J1 and V1. Interestingly, I have read some reviews of the new V2 -- The V2 is really made for a photo enthusiast, with a ton of manual controls.
The J1/V1/J2 are designed more like a point and shoot, but with interchangeable lenses. Many of the manual controls are hidden or entirely lacking. For example, I believe ISO control, while possible, is buried in menu options, instead of being simple to reach. (But there it can be accessed with 1 button on the V2). All the cameras entirely lack bracketing exposure. Still, with the V2, they have aimed at those who want a compact advanced camera system. While they were previously focusing on point & shooters, who wanted higher quality.

There are some great deals on the J1 and V1 as they are being cleared out of stock. I saw the V1 for $299. But I just can't recommend the cameras for someone looking for advanced dSLR type controls.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:19 AM   #19
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Oh good grief~!

I had no idea all that was out there. I have spent the last many days reading reviews, comparing side by side DPReviews, thinking of what it is exactly that I need, scouring Craigslist for possible last year's models, watching YouTube reviews and comparisons, and looking at CNET's top 10 compact system cameras for 2010, 2011, and 2012.

GAH!!!!!!! I am more confused now than I was before!

I have ruled out the Nikon J1 and V1 as options.

I like the Sony Nex from what I have seen so far, but that lens is quite large for a carry around.

I still like the Canon G15 and Sony RX100, but am still feeling like I like the interchangeable lenses and deciding if I need/want that feature.

Looking now at the Olympus PEN and the Pentax Lumix compact systems.

I am trying to determine shutter speed differences, ease of changing settings, and sensor sizes.

Our local camera store has shut down and the closest real dedicated camera store is 20 miles away. I haven't been able to get there with the Holidays. Best Buy had NOTHING when I went......mostly P&S, two or three DSLRs and the J1 as the only compact system camera.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:10 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
I am trying to determine shutter speed differences, ease of changing settings, and sensor sizes.
With shutter speed differences, do you mean frames per second burst speed? Actual shutter speed shouldn't be an issue... As it's pretty rare you are likely to shoot at 1/2000th of a second.
Burst rate -- frames per second -- will be an issue if you are shooting sports and such.
Shutter lag may also be an issue, and really comes down to focus speeds. Cameras don't shoot until focus is locked. So a slow autofocus system, or hunting for focus, can create annoying lag between shots. Typically, dSLRs and SLTs will have the fastest focus systems. Most mirrorless cameras and advanced compacts use Contrast detection autofocus, which can be a bit slower. But with a good enough processor and enough focus points, it can be almost as fast as a dSLR. There are a handful of non-dSLRs that use dSLR-type autofocus (phase detection). This is where the Nikon 1 series shines, I think the newest Nex cameras shine here, but I haven't tried them first hand.

Ease of changing settings is huge, if you want more than a "point and shoot." Usually, this is where dSLRs shine. The experience can vary widely between mirrorless and advanced compact systems. Of the models I have hands on experience with, the RX100 does shine here. It has every manual setting you would find in a dSLR, and almost as accessible. It has a handy control ring. It has customizable buttons, so you can set the manual settings you use most. It has a "memory" function for 3 different set ups. Really, the RX100 is more customizable than my dSLR, which says a lot.

Sensory size -- Certainly matters. But careful getting hung up on small differences. For example, my experience with the 1-inch sensor found in the J1 and RX100 -- Much bigger than most P&S cameras, but smaller than dSLR, and smaller than most mirrorless -- It is "big enough" for most purposes. The RX100 handles low light exceptionally well In good day light, IQ is very high, pictures are sharp. Where it doesn't perform like a bigger sensor is in depth of field. It's not easy to get great background blur in portraits, etc. (You can get some, but you may need to get awkwardly close to your subject).
So if taking portraits with nice background blurring is a priority, then you may want a bigger sensor. If that isn't a big issue, then a smaller sensor may be okay with you.

If you are leaning towards putting a lot of weight into being able to change lenses, then the next question is do you already own multiple Canon lenses that you value?
If so, and you don't want to invest in a whole new set of lenses,then you may simply want to look at a newer Canon dSLR like the t3i -- It is a fair amount smaller and lighter than the 40D. Not "small".. but at least a bit smaller. And it would upgrade other aspects too.
If you aren't already tied to Canon lenses, than of course you have more freedom. For example, the Sony A33/35/27 is half the weight of the Canon 40D, and slightly smaller dimensions. (And if you know what to look for, you can get some great old Minolta lenses for Sonys)

I think the first question really is, how small do you want to go?

Personally, I feel I "need" both. I love having something super high quality that can fit in my pocket. Thus, I can get near-dSLR quality anywhere I go. I can take just the RX100 on vacation, and not really feel like I'm sacrificing quality.
But when I do want to be more serious, when I do want to play with different lenses, when I want great portraits, I can pull out my dSLR.

Definitely an investment to have both, but for me, it's worth it. Having 1 "in between" camera wouldn't make me happy. It would still be too big to carry everywhere.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:56 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havoc
Personally, I feel I "need" both. I love having something super high quality that can fit in my pocket. Thus, I can get near-dSLR quality anywhere I go. I can take just the RX100 on vacation, and not really feel like I'm sacrificing quality.
But when I do want to be more serious, when I do want to play with different lenses, when I want great portraits, I can pull out my dSLR.
And this is where everyone differs. I like my dSLR and my micro 4:3 mirrorless when I want something smaller. But honestly, lately I've been enjoying my iPhone. Just upgraded from the 3 (whose camera was marginal) to the 5 (whose is a lot better) and I like using it a lot. On Christmas Eve I was halfway down the street when I realized I forgot my dSLR. Almost turned around, but then decided to just use my phone. Very pleased with the results, and didn't have to mess with any gear or a camera bag whatsoever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
Looking now at the Olympus PEN and the Pentax Lumix compact systems.
If you like these, don't forget to check out the m4:3 flagship, the Olympus OMD, which was mentioned above. Yes, more expensive initially, but may be less in the long run.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:20 PM   #22
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Thank you for this. I think these are questions I need to look at really hard.

Blur in background is a very nice look and I would like to get some of that.

As for shutter speed.....I do shoot action of my kids when we are out and about, and I do shoot pics of my pets......they do NOT pose for more than 2 seconds.....but it isn't crucial, it would just be nice to be able to not have a longer lag time.

I did hit another Best Buy today and took a look at the NEX. They had the Nikon J1 and the NEX.....other than that they had P&S and full size dSLRs.

The NEX doesn't have a flash, not even a little one????? That is a bit of an issue for me. I don't want to have to take along an external flash. But the size of the kit lens seemed very large as well for a carry around lens. So I am leaning away from that one, even though I did like it when I played with it.

I NEED to get up to the camera store and see if they have a wider variety and play with them!

I *think* between the RX100 and the Canon G15, the Canon is winning out. Partly due to price (RX100 is almost $300 more and I can't see what more it does compared to the Canon G15, but maybe you have more insight) and partly due to my already having a Canon and making an easy transition. Yes, the Canon is larger, but it still isn't TOO large to not be able to carry it around.

But I have others on my list as well that I haven't looked at yet.

Dawn

Quote:
Originally Posted by havoc315 View Post
With shutter speed differences, do you mean frames per second burst speed? Actual shutter speed shouldn't be an issue... As it's pretty rare you are likely to shoot at 1/2000th of a second.
Burst rate -- frames per second -- will be an issue if you are shooting sports and such.
Shutter lag may also be an issue, and really comes down to focus speeds. Cameras don't shoot until focus is locked. So a slow autofocus system, or hunting for focus, can create annoying lag between shots. Typically, dSLRs and SLTs will have the fastest focus systems. Most mirrorless cameras and advanced compacts use Contrast detection autofocus, which can be a bit slower. But with a good enough processor and enough focus points, it can be almost as fast as a dSLR. There are a handful of non-dSLRs that use dSLR-type autofocus (phase detection). This is where the Nikon 1 series shines, I think the newest Nex cameras shine here, but I haven't tried them first hand.

Ease of changing settings is huge, if you want more than a "point and shoot." Usually, this is where dSLRs shine. The experience can vary widely between mirrorless and advanced compact systems. Of the models I have hands on experience with, the RX100 does shine here. It has every manual setting you would find in a dSLR, and almost as accessible. It has a handy control ring. It has customizable buttons, so you can set the manual settings you use most. It has a "memory" function for 3 different set ups. Really, the RX100 is more customizable than my dSLR, which says a lot.

Sensory size -- Certainly matters. But careful getting hung up on small differences. For example, my experience with the 1-inch sensor found in the J1 and RX100 -- Much bigger than most P&S cameras, but smaller than dSLR, and smaller than most mirrorless -- It is "big enough" for most purposes. The RX100 handles low light exceptionally well In good day light, IQ is very high, pictures are sharp. Where it doesn't perform like a bigger sensor is in depth of field. It's not easy to get great background blur in portraits, etc. (You can get some, but you may need to get awkwardly close to your subject).
So if taking portraits with nice background blurring is a priority, then you may want a bigger sensor. If that isn't a big issue, then a smaller sensor may be okay with you.

If you are leaning towards putting a lot of weight into being able to change lenses, then the next question is do you already own multiple Canon lenses that you value?
If so, and you don't want to invest in a whole new set of lenses,then you may simply want to look at a newer Canon dSLR like the t3i -- It is a fair amount smaller and lighter than the 40D. Not "small".. but at least a bit smaller. And it would upgrade other aspects too.
If you aren't already tied to Canon lenses, than of course you have more freedom. For example, the Sony A33/35/27 is half the weight of the Canon 40D, and slightly smaller dimensions. (And if you know what to look for, you can get some great old Minolta lenses for Sonys)

I think the first question really is, how small do you want to go?

Personally, I feel I "need" both. I love having something super high quality that can fit in my pocket. Thus, I can get near-dSLR quality anywhere I go. I can take just the RX100 on vacation, and not really feel like I'm sacrificing quality.
But when I do want to be more serious, when I do want to play with different lenses, when I want great portraits, I can pull out my dSLR.

Definitely an investment to have both, but for me, it's worth it. Having 1 "in between" camera wouldn't make me happy. It would still be too big to carry everywhere.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:38 PM   #23
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Some cameras you won't find in stores, which makes it difficult when you're interested in certain ones and want to get your hands on them. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't consider them, necessarily. (And it doesn't mean that those in stores are better than those that aren't, necessarily.) But this is where you sort of have to do your homework and rely on specs that are important to you, and various reviews.
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:04 PM   #24
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Yes, I do know that. We used to have a Wolf Camera right up the street, but they have long gone now.

I am also doing a lot of YouTube and CNET review watching.

I realize too that with all reviews it comes down to personal preference as well.

Dawn

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pea-n-Me View Post
Some cameras you won't find in stores, which makes it difficult when you're interested in certain ones and want to get your hands on them. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't consider them, necessarily. (And it doesn't mean that those in stores are better than those that aren't, necessarily.) But this is where you sort of have to do your homework and rely on specs that are important to you, and various reviews.
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:22 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post

The NEX doesn't have a flash, not even a little one????? That is a bit of an issue for me. I don't want to have to take along an external flash. But the size of the kit lens seemed very large as well for a carry around lens. So I am leaning away from that one, even though I did like it when I played with it.

Dawn
The NEX all come with a flash that you can put on or leave off. It's compact and if I think I need a flash I just leave it attached. But the new NEX 6 and the slightly older NEX 7 both have built in flash. I'm not certain about the other new NEX and what they have done on them.

There are also different kits for the NEX than what Best Buy carries. The NEX 6 is available with a 16-50mm retractable. I'm waiting to buy that lens when it is available on it's own but it's already available with the kit. There is also the 16mm pancake lens (which I got as a kit with the NEX 5n and I assume it's still available in kits). That is what I use when I want to be very compact but of course a 16mm isn't for every situation.

So an FYI that Best Buy is nice to see the NEX camera but you can order different options from other places. I love the NEX camera and first owned a NEX 3 and then upgraded to the 5N. If I were buying today it would be the NEX 6 with the retractable 16-50mm.
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:25 PM   #26
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Good to know. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KAT4DISNEY View Post
The NEX all come with a flash that you can put on or leave off. It's compact and if I think I need a flash I just leave it attached. But the new NEX 6 and the slightly older NEX 7 both have built in flash. I'm not certain about the other new NEX and what they have done on them.

There are also different kits for the NEX than what Best Buy carries. The NEX 6 is available with a 16-50mm retractable. I'm waiting to buy that lens when it is available on it's own but it's already available with the kit. There is also the 16mm pancake lens (which I got as a kit with the NEX 5n and I assume it's still available in kits). That is what I use when I want to be very compact but of course a 16mm isn't for every situation.

So an FYI that Best Buy is nice to see the NEX camera but you can order different options from other places. I love the NEX camera and first owned a NEX 3 and then upgraded to the 5N. If I were buying today it would be the NEX 6 with the retractable 16-50mm.
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Old 12-26-2012, 04:13 PM   #27
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my husband got me an olympus pen mini e-pm1 and it's wonderful. think he spent $350 but I'm not 100% sure. I absolutely love it so far. It's a huge step up from my Nikon Coolpix.

eta: here's where he bought it.
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:25 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
Thank you for this. I think these are questions I need to look at really hard.

Blur in background is a very nice look and I would like to get some of that.

As for shutter speed.....I do shoot action of my kids when we are out and about, and I do shoot pics of my pets......they do NOT pose for more than 2 seconds.....but it isn't crucial, it would just be nice to be able to not have a longer lag time.

I did hit another Best Buy today and took a look at the NEX. They had the Nikon J1 and the NEX.....other than that they had P&S and full size dSLRs.

The NEX doesn't have a flash, not even a little one????? That is a bit of an issue for me. I don't want to have to take along an external flash. But the size of the kit lens seemed very large as well for a carry around lens. So I am leaning away from that one, even though I did like it when I played with it.

I NEED to get up to the camera store and see if they have a wider variety and play with them!

I *think* between the RX100 and the Canon G15, the Canon is winning out. Partly due to price (RX100 is almost $300 more and I can't see what more it does compared to the Canon G15, but maybe you have more insight) and partly due to my already having a Canon and making an easy transition. Yes, the Canon is larger, but it still isn't TOO large to not be able to carry it around.

But I have others on my list as well that I haven't looked at yet.

Dawn
For side by side, look at this:

http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-Po...shot-DSC-RX100

Basically, the rx100 is better all around. Much bigger sensor. Therefore better low light, less noise. Bigger sensor will give you better background blur. Also a faster shutter burst rate and faster focus system. Far better image quality. So the question is whether the higher quality and performance is worth the higher price.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:09 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post


I NEED to get up to the camera store and see if they have a wider variety and play with them!

I *think* between the RX100 and the Canon G15, the Canon is winning out.
yes, check them out at a store if at all possible. Don't rely on comparison sites like "snapsort" !

Last edited by bob100; 12-26-2012 at 07:20 PM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:39 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post

I NEED to get up to the camera store and see if they have a wider variety and play with them!

I *think* between the RX100 and the Canon G15, the Canon is winning out. Partly due to price (RX100 is almost $300 more and I can't see what more it does compared to the Canon G15, but maybe you have more insight) and partly due to my already having a Canon and making an easy transition. Yes, the Canon is larger, but it still isn't TOO large to not be able to carry it around.

But I have others on my list as well that I haven't looked at yet.

Dawn
Have you checked out the dpreview.com article about the compact zooms?
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/236...ompact-cameras

They talk about the Canon G15 and the RX100 among others. I think getting your hands on them in person is a good idea, but I also think it's good to do as much research as you can.
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