Give me the low down on the fast pass situation...

[mesaboy2]

Originally Posted by maxiesmom

So someone can be steadfast in believing one way, but not the other? That is what I am getting here.

I do not pass my beliefs and observations as facts, nor do I state that those who don't agree with me are in steadfast denial, i.e. outright wrong.

If you're really bored, go back and read my many posts on the subject. You will find they pretty much all say "I believe...", "Many/Most reports are...", "Many/Most posters say...", or "What I saw was..."; and are often followed by "none of us here know the whole picture". They are not written like these:

Originally Posted by KellyNY

I choose to believe facts, not rumors and speculations and FP increase is a pure speculation. As for testing, I do not know what exactly they do, neither do you, so any assumption is just another speculation.

Originally Posted by KellyNY

Of course, I am pretty sure that flying pigs can contribute but unless FP cannot produce what we see now and there are strong evidence that there is something else at work that cannot be explained by new rules, I choose to work with facts and not mysterious possibilities which are nothing but speculations created and spread to diminish enforcement benefits.

Originally Posted by KellyNY

Facts are facts, no matter how much some would love to call them observations, speculations or any other word to diminish those facts and to justify their own speculations.
Truth is, some refuse to admit enforcement benefits and will go great distance to come out with any other explanation why it is what it is, esp. when some people who spread those rumors are the same people who were predicting end of the world after enforcement. Too obvious.

Yet when I asked what "facts" this poster is working with, the predictable response was a complete dodge--I should go back and look over old threads. They are incapable of citing even one, though the entire argument is based on a multitude of supposed facts.

Originally Posted by maxiesmom

I disagree. During Spring Break we were able to get Fast Passes for Space Mountain as late as 6 pm. Splash Mountain too! We have never had that luxury before. I do believe that people grabbing FP after FP resulted in them being gone A LOT faster than they are now.

Just my observation.

Nothing wrong with this post--it makes complete sense and doesn't preach facts and truths.

Originally Posted by maxiesmom

Not for sure, no. But after many trips of not being able to get FP late into the day, the one trip we take after the time enforcement starts, we are able to. Seems a logical conclusion to draw.

(insert here all of the reasons the people who hate the FP enforcement can come up with to explain the later availability of FPs. Phase of the moon, global warming, or whatever they can come up with. Or the steadfast denial that FP are available later).

Moving on. I do know logic is not proof, but I really don't care. I just like not having all of the FPs gone when I go to grab one. Makes for a much nicer park experience.

Then an anecdotal observation passed off as universal fact. Note the use of "are"--not "might be", not "could be", not "sometimes".

Do you get where I'm coming from? At all?

How's this for a possibility to explain your "one trip" where FPs were available later? Were the parks open later that day or those days? Wouldn't a simple difference in park hours greatly impact the time that FPs ran out? My point is this is such a complex system that there are too many variables for any one of us to effectively analyze and come away with a meaningful conclusion. This is a big reason why I find the discussion so interesting--it's a very complex problem.

I think I am officially bored now.

[WillAustin]

Originally Posted by mesaboy2

How's this for a possibility to explain your "one trip" where FPs were available later?

I think it's a good possibility. The complexity probably increases based on the crowd sizes too.

Anecdotally , CM's have said, both on the boards and in the parks, that they have increased the number of FPs. And they can change that number every day, so one day may not correlate with another.

It doesn't really matter, but I'll be in WDW tonight.

[mesaboy2]

Originally Posted by WillAustin

I think it's a good possibility. The complexity probably increases based on the crowd sizes too.

Anecdotally , CM's have said, both on the boards and in the parks, that they have increased the number of FPs. And they can change that number every day, so one day may not correlate with another.

It doesn't really matter, but I'll be in WDW tonight.

Have a great trip!

[WillAustin]

Originally Posted by mesaboy2

Have a great trip!

Thanks!

I can't believe we are just barely missing the FP+ test. I would have liked to try it out.

[mom2rtk]

Originally Posted by WillAustin

Thanks!

I can't believe we are just barely missing the FP+ test. I would have liked to try it out.

Welll, turns out we'll be there with everyone else getting to enjoy it. But we're not part of it. Figures.

Have a great trip!

[KellyNY]

Originally Posted by mesaboy2

I do not pass my beliefs and observations as facts, nor do I state that those who don't agree with me are in steadfast denial, i.e. outright wrong.

If you're really bored, go back and read my many posts on the subject. You will find they pretty much all say "I believe...", "Many/Most reports are...", "Many/Most posters say...", or "What I saw was..."; and are often followed by "none of us here know the whole picture". They are not written like these:

Yet when I asked what "facts" this poster is working with, the predictable response was a complete dodge--I should go back and look over old threads. They are incapable of citing even one, though the entire argument is based on a multitude of supposed facts.



Nothing wrong with this post--it makes complete sense and doesn't preach facts and truths.

So, you want another posters to reread your posts but you can't follow mine on this very thread?
Or the fact that every FP not grabbed by someone in a morning is left for later use and therefore creates longer availability is not good enough for you? Or the fact that FP longer lines are only occasional and happened before? Or that there is no evidence of FP increase and all supposed reports are rumors? What facts you are looking for that you did not see on this thread already? Seriously.

[Don Disney]

Originally Posted by LisaBi

This is different. If someone with more financial means chooses an expensive restaurant, it doesn't impact my ability to eat at a less expensive one. If someone pays more for a deluxe suite, it doesn't impact my ability to book a standard room. If they pay for other extras, it doesn't impact my ability to buy the perks that fit me. But if they pay for ride access, that DOES impact my own ride access (assuming that if there were more takers on extra fast passes or paid FOTL, that makes for less free fast passes and longer lines.)

Thank-you.I could'nt find the words to express what I meant as well as you did!That is exactly the point I was"trying" to make.Well put!

[KellyNY]

Originally Posted by Don Disney

Thank-you.I could'nt find the words to express what I meant as well as you did!That is exactly the point I was"trying" to make.Well put!

Each form of FP creates unfairness. However, I think paid FP is most fair out of any FP form we saw so far.

[kris4360]

Originally Posted by mom2rtk

You can observe that FPs are available later.

But you can't observe the reason why.

You people have way too much time on your hands! IMO

[Don Disney]

Originally Posted by kris4360

You people have way too much time on your hands! IMO

Amazingly enough...so do you.

[Don Disney]

Originally Posted by KellyNY

Each form of FP creates unfairness. However, I think paid FP is most fair out of any FP form we saw so far.

What exactly is unfair about FP if EVERY guest has the opportunity to obtain them?Paid FP IS unfair to those who can't AFFORD it!A family with 4 children,on their first,and possibly only trip to WDW,who have saved for 2 years to make said trip.... Yeah,lets charge them,and EVERYONE else MORE for FP! Sure,regular FP is unfair....On what planet though?

[mom2rtk]

Originally Posted by kris4360

You people have way too much time on your hands! IMO

Hey.... everybody needs a hobby. You choose yours, I'll choose mine.

[luvthemouse71]

Originally Posted by kris4360

You people have way too much time on your hands! IMO

Everyone is flipping out over the new Fastpass + system. I'm not crazy about it either but I'll give it a go. I tried to choose things like the new Fantasyland experiences and parades. I was able to choose 4 things for MK and 3 for DHS. We'll see how it works out.

At the end of the day these are first world problems. I refuse to get freaked out over a theme park, as much as I love WDW.

[KellyNY]

Originally Posted by Don Disney

What exactly is unfair about FP if EVERY guest has the opportunity to obtain them?Paid FP IS unfair to those who can't AFFORD it!A family with 4 children,on their first,and possibly only trip to WDW,who have saved for 2 years to make said trip.... Yeah,lets charge them,and EVERYONE else MORE for FP! Sure,regular FP is unfair....On what planet though?

The unfair part is very principle that there are not enough of FP for everyone. First come first serve scenario is nice but family with runner who will take care of all the FP is not the same as a single mom for example, whose running will be much more limited. We are not in Sparta. When system is based on fast legs, there is no fairness. With paid system, I am sure if family go to Disney, it is expensive no matter how cheap you can get, still a lot, family can save a bit longer and invest in FP+ or staying onsite which is most likely how this payment will be presented.

[Cyrano]

Thread being closed as folks are continuing to debate the rights and wrongs of FP.

This board is for trip planning.