What is going on with ECV - policy change Nov 1. 2012

[disney david]

Originally Posted by dis-happy

Wow,, are off-site stroller companies next? And if not, it would seem like a double standard.

Yes this apply to them to

[SueM in MN]

Originally Posted by bac2010

We reserved with Walker for the first time because I thought they would be exempt from the new rules as they were one of the three preferred vendors. I was told that for our departure from Disney World in November that we would have to personally meet a driver to pick up our scooter - no drop off at bell services. They were not even sure they would be allowed in the parks after November 1st so I think alot is up in the air with the new policies. We had previously used Care Medical and never had a problem.

Originally Posted by culli

FYI we got a call from Walker today and they told us the policy and from my understanding they are not a vendor that can drop off with Bell Services. Real bummer as we have used them numerous times and have been very happy...I guess we might give apple a try?

Even the preferred vendors might be erring on the side of caution in the next few weeks.
It would be better for them to assume there might be some problems and just arrange for pick upand delivery - even if they don't have to.

I can see why they are doing it.
STORAGE: On our last stay at OKW, we saw many ECVs sitting in one area for a whole week at a time. I looked at some of the tags on them, and the majority should have already been picked up days before.
This used to be a nice little porch area, overlooking the water, but for at least the past 2 years, it was totally filled with assorted scooters, wheelchairs and strollers.
When I first became aware of off-site rentals for wheelchairs and ECVs, there were a handful of companies. Now if you do a search for rentals in Orlando/WDW area, there are pages and pages.
Add to that, the huge number of stroller rental companies. And, keep in mind that some of the large strollers folded are as large as my DD's wheelchair with her sitting in it.
The amount of storage space for all this stuff must be huge at some resorts - and it's not something Disney agreed to do (except with the companies they are working out relationships with). The companies just took advantage of something that was set up for another purpose (temporarily holding guests' bags).

LIABILITY: I'm sure some of the companies find damage on the item when they pick it up. The renter may say it was not damaged when they left it for pick up and say Disney must have damaged it while it was sitting.
The company may try to blame Disney, but Disney never agreed to take any care of it.
As reported on one recent thread, a company may try to blame another company for 'taking' their ECV. And, with a stroller or wheelchair just sitting out, someone unscrupulous could take it and no one would know until the company it belongs to contacts the real renter to find out where it is.

EXTRA WORK FOR DISNEY: I have seen things on the Internet (not on this board), where people indicated that when they left, they just left the ECV parked in or outside of their room.
We apparently saw that one time when we saw the same ECV parked outside (where it would get rained on) at DVC Beach Club. After seeing it there at all hours for almost a week in a row, I looked at the tag on it and saw the rental dates were over, so it should have been picked up. I called Bell Services to let them know. I wonder how many are left in various places where WDW would have no idea if that was the pick up spot the renter and the company had agreed on? My guess is those would be some of the abandoned ones in Disney's letter.

SECURITY AND OTHER CONCERNS: As someone already mentioned, there is a possibility that all the delivery people are not on the up and up.
There have been issues in the last 5 yrs or so with people slipping advertisements under resort doors. I read that some of these are just ploys to get people's credit card numbers. Because people find them under the door, they assume they are Disney approved. After they get their pizza (which I've seen reports was not even good) they find extra charges on their cards.

WDW doesn't want random people roaming around - someone picking up or delivering might take advantage of being on site to look for open doors, open cars, etc.

There are also some ECV rental companies that are sort of 'fronts' for other companies. I've seen one that advertised 3 days free rental if you go on a condo tour that the company is connected with.

So, I think this move by Disney is a good move.

[SueM in MN]

Since there is already a long thread discussing the new policy, I am going to add the specific Walker thread to this more general one.

[ejud]

Originally Posted by cynzilla

I just got the call from Walker Mobilty regarding :




They were more than kind and told me they are happy to meet me ANYTIME I WANTED for the return of the scooter ( since we are leaving Novemebr 3rd) 2 days after this cut off time for dropping at Bell Services.

Dizzy Corp sinks to a new low.

Jud

[stitchlovestink]

Originally Posted by ejud

Quote:

Originally Posted by cynzilla

I just got the call from Walker Mobilty regarding :




They were more than kind and told me they are happy to meet me ANYTIME I WANTED for the return of the scooter ( since we are leaving Novemebr 3rd) 2 days after this cut off time for dropping at Bell Services.

Dizzy Corp sinks to a new low.

Jud

I think that is a matter of opinion...and quite frankly, I disagree.


Posted from Disney Forums Reader for Android

[SueM in MN]

Originally Posted by ejud

Dizzy Corp sinks to a new low.

Jud

I would disagree for the reasons I posted 2 posts before yours.

I am actually surprised it took this long.

[Paula Sedley-Burke]

Originally Posted by SueM in MN

Even the preferred vendors might be erring on the side of caution in the next few weeks.
It would be better for them to assume there might be some problems and just arrange for pick upand delivery - even if they don't have to.

I can see why they are doing it.
STORAGE: On our last stay at OKW, we saw many ECVs sitting in one area for a whole week at a time. I looked at some of the tags on them, and the majority should have already been picked up days before.
This used to be a nice little porch area, overlooking the water, but for at least the past 2 years, it was totally filled with assorted scooters, wheelchairs and strollers.
When I first became aware of off-site rentals for wheelchairs and ECVs, there were a handful of companies. Now if you do a search for rentals in Orlando/WDW area, there are pages and pages.
Add to that, the huge number of stroller rental companies. And, keep in mind that some of the large strollers folded are as large as my DD's wheelchair with her sitting in it.
The amount of storage space for all this stuff must be huge at some resorts - and it's not something Disney agreed to do (except with the companies they are working out relationships with). The companies just took advantage of something that was set up for another purpose (temporarily holding guests' bags).

LIABILITY: I'm sure some of the companies find damage on the item when they pick it up. The renter may say it was not damaged when they left it for pick up and say Disney must have damaged it while it was sitting.
The company may try to blame Disney, but Disney never agreed to take any care of it.
As reported on one recent thread, a company may try to blame another company for 'taking' their ECV. And, with a stroller or wheelchair just sitting out, someone unscrupulous could take it and no one would know until the company it belongs to contacts the real renter to find out where it is.

EXTRA WORK FOR DISNEY: I have seen things on the Internet (not on this board), where people indicated that when they left, they just left the ECV parked in or outside of their room.
We apparently saw that one time when we saw the same ECV parked outside (where it would get rained on) at DVC Beach Club. After seeing it there at all hours for almost a week in a row, I looked at the tag on it and saw the rental dates were over, so it should have been picked up. I called Bell Services to let them know. I wonder how many are left in various places where WDW would have no idea if that was the pick up spot the renter and the company had agreed on? My guess is those would be some of the abandoned ones in Disney's letter.

SECURITY AND OTHER CONCERNS: As someone already mentioned, there is a possibility that all the delivery people are not on the up and up.
There have been issues in the last 5 yrs or so with people slipping advertisements under resort doors. I read that some of these are just ploys to get people's credit card numbers. Because people find them under the door, they assume they are Disney approved. After they get their pizza (which I've seen reports was not even good) they find extra charges on their cards.

WDW doesn't want random people roaming around - someone picking up or delivering might take advantage of being on site to look for open doors, open cars, etc.

There are also some ECV rental companies that are sort of 'fronts' for other companies. I've seen one that advertised 3 days free rental if you go on a condo tour that the company is connected with.

So, I think this move by Disney is a good move.

Actually this post really made me think and for that I thank you SueM. Whilst staying for many enjoyable years at SSR there has been an ongoing issue of the pizza advertisements and me and DW have never felt comfortable about people wondering around who aren't guests. We do not want people randomly wondering around either as I like the safe feeling of Disney especially being disabled. So if this new policy aids the security I am in favour. Also re my scooter company ( too late to change as I have already paid for my trip this month ) I am wondering why wont they pay the fee to store the scooters and to access the parks when others will and are the same rate? Next time I will use an approved dealer for my own safety and because I cant push a broken down scooter to a park entrance. If I could do this I would not need a scooter! I was shocked when I asked them what happens if it breaks down in the parks and they told me if the scooter breaks down bring it to the park entrance!

[ejud]

Originally Posted by SueM in MN

I would disagree for the reasons I posted 2 posts before yours.
I am actually surprised it took this long.

You make several good points, and maybe you are right, but I do stand my ground for other reasons including personal. I have been using an ECV at WDW since 02, and on occasion before that.

First, reasons can always be found to justify any position. So though each of your points is valid, it is still a choice made by Disney.

Second, over the years I have seen an ever increasing move toward financial concerns over magical concerns. Given that off site rentals tend to be about half the price of on-sight, my own observations of the situation overall over the last decade do tend to lean toward this as more of a financial move than a security and liability move.

The actual effects of this are null on me as I have and carry my own ECV, but I do sympathize with those who will be adversely affected by this.

And maybe you are totally correct.



Jud

[stitchlovestink]

Originally Posted by ejud

You make several good points, and maybe you are right, but I do stand my ground for other reasons including personal. I have been using an ECV at WDW since 02, and on occasion before that.

First, reasons can always be found to justify any position. So though each of your points is valid, it is still a choice made by Disney.

Second, over the years I have seen an ever increasing move toward financial concerns over magical concerns. Given that off site rentals tend to be about half the price of on-sight, my own observations of the situation overall over the last decade do tend to lean toward this as more of a financial move than a security and liability move.

The actual effects of this are null on me as I have and carry my own ECV, but I do sympathize with those who will be adversely affected by this.

And maybe you are totally correct.



Jud

Yes, but the numbers of ECVs in use at Disney even in just the last couple of years have increased Dramatically!! And I think Disney's hand was forced to deal with this matter is some way. And they couldn't single out ECV rentals and allow stroller rentals so they had to do an across the board policy.
Now I do think that they could deal with offsite stroller rental issues by making their own stroller rentals a more reasonable price. They have just increased their own stroller rentals to ridiculous prices!

I am wondering if the 'inconvenience' of this will have some who may not really need an ECV full time reconsider renting from outside vendors. I'm wondering if it will have people consider using the park rentals and/or using wheelchairs more often. Maybe it won't have an impact, but I'm thinking it just might....not a huge one, but a somewhat noticeable one over time. But it may make 'some' reconsider their rental options and choose differently. Now granted these are MY opinions, as I think some rent because they need the ECV at the resort as well. Some rent because it's cheaper even if they only need it part of the time. But Now I think maybe some who do not need full time use may reconsider...maybe not. I guess time will tell. I also think that we may see people who were torn between renting a wheelchair or ECV for Grandma/Grandpa may now lean more towards the wheelchair again if they don't need it full-time especially because you will have to wait for it and turn it in ahead of time which is using up valuable 'Disney' time IMO. I know this is probably not making sense to most of you, by the way I am explaining it...but it does to me.
(Say "said person" doesn't really need an ECV full time but needs to rest some. So you rent a wheelchair from the park instead because said person can walk enough to get thru the gates and the like... Well you don't need to leave early, to take the ECV back to meet the rental company before departure because you HAVE to make sure that they have taken back position of the ECV before you depart, and if they are running behind this could be a problem for the renter if they are flying. So if you want to be sure it is turned in plenty early well then said person has nothing at that point so they are forced to sit out or you 'rent' from the park for that day. So I think if people start really thinking about this, they may reconsider offsite rentals esp for shorter trips ...is this making any sense now?? LOL)
This change may not effect the numbers at all. But something else to consider is that it 'appears' that since Bell Services isn't going to take deliveries of ECVs, I am thinking that there is a good possibility that they are no longer going to allow people to charge their ECVs there either. Especially since the way that letter is worded, it would be confusing to know for sure which ones are considered abandoned, etc... It sounds like now they want the guest to be in full control and fully responsible for their ECV. So I have a pretty strong suspicion that guests are now going to be responsible for charging their ECV in their room or risk having their ECV considered abandoned according to that letter. Maybe I am wrong. But it sorta kinda sounds that way based on the way that letter reads if you read between the lines. I figure I'll be arriving on the 31st of this month and I'll ask the manager at our hotel what the policy is so I can share it on our hotel thread because people sometimes suggest this to others and if the practice is being discontinued it'd be nice to let future travelers to that hotel know it.

[ejud]

I think some rent because they need the ECV at the resort as well.

Have you experienced the journey from the front desk to a room in some of these places???

First time I went with my own ECV, it died long before I did (not a real problem these days) and I went to Guest Services to see if they had a place I could plug in. The CM was incredibly nice and told me to take it over to ECV rentals and they would plug it in and give me a new one. Clearly he didn't understand, so I pointed out quite emphatically, this is my scooter, not one of yours! He said, I understand- no problem. And this is exactly what happened! This was in 04.



Now, just plugging in seems to be asking for the world. And the niceness isn't anywhere near what it used to be.



As to "so many", well, so many people now!!! They have all but eliminated "slow periods" with the special room and dining offers. The place is packed with people- of all types, walking, preambulating and scootering these days.

I figure I'll be arriving on the 31st of this month and I'll ask the manager at our hotel what the policy is so I can share it on our hotel thread because people sometimes suggest this to others and if the practice is being discontinued it'd be nice to let future travelers to that hotel know it.

That is a very good idea, cause no matter the argument, agreements, disagreements, as Walter used to say, "And that's the way it is."



Jud

[MaxsDad]

We are arriving on Nov. 2 and when I saw this post I was worried because we rented a wheelchair through caremedical for my MIL. My wife just called them and was told that there shouldn't be an issue because they are a preferred vendor. Thought I would add that update since I hadn't seen it mentioned.

Also sue, any thoughts to updating the FAQ sticky with this new policy?

[kaytieeldr]

Originally Posted by ejud

You make several good points, and maybe you are right, but I do stand my ground for other reasons including personal. I have been using an ECV at WDW since 02, and on occasion before that.

First, reasons can always be found to justify any position. So though each of your points is valid, it is still a choice made by Disney.

Second, over the years I have seen an ever increasing move toward financial concerns over magical concerns. Given that off site rentals tend to be about half the price of on-sight, my own observations of the situation overall over the last decade do tend to lean toward this as more of a financial move than a security and liability move.

The actual effects of this are null on me as I have and carry my own ECV, but I do sympathize with those who will be adversely affected by this.

And maybe you are totally correct.



Jud

I would have to disagree about this being a financial issue related to the price of onsite rentals vs. offsite rentals. There's no comparison because Walt Disney World doesn't allow its mobility assistance elrentals to be available for use by the renter 24 hours a day, or anywhere the renter wants to use it.

This change is entirely about responsibility, liability, and WDW choosing to no longer provide a complimentary service to only certain guests that takes away from the regular services they provide all guests.

[dis-happy]

As DVC members we were told that when they eliminated free valet parking (for DVC guests) it was because Bell Services had been switched to a contracted out company. So not really "Disney" anymore and my guess is that the bottom line of their services is the biggest reason.

At the time of the DVC switch there was a lot of commentary on the boards as to whether or not the members were tipping regularly for their cars. Similarly, I wonder if those using Bell Services were regularly tipping for ECV/stroller, etc. drop off and pick up. Additionally, last year or so Bell Services said they would no longer aid in those numerous fridge swaps. Many changes to Bell Services have been taking place over time.

[disney david]

Originally Posted by dis-happy

As DVC members we were told that when they eliminated free valet parking (for DVC guests) it was because Bell Services had been switched to a contracted out company. So not really "Disney" anymore and my guess is that the bottom line of their services is the biggest reason.

At the time of the DVC switch there was a lot of commentary on the boards as to whether or not the members were tipping regularly for their cars. Similarly, I wonder if those using Bell Services were regularly tipping for ECV/stroller, etc. drop off and pick up. Additionally, last year or so Bell Services said they would no longer aid in those numerous fridge swaps. Many changes to Bell Services have been taking place over time.

I know valet is a contracted out company but never heard bell services was.

[dis-happy]

Originally Posted by disney david

I know valet is a contracted out company but never heard bell services was.

You what? You are right. I was confusing valet parking with bell services...they all kind of hang around the front door of the resort and where pretty uniforms. My apologies!