PSPX5 or try Adobe Elements/Lightroom/Photoshop?

[havoc315]

Because I don't do a ton of RAW processing, and as it had all the basic features under 1 roof for an affordable price, I've used Paintshop ProX3-4 the last couple of years. It always felt like it had the same basics as Adobe Photoshop, for less money. Even allowed me to do HDR merging.

As I began shooting with the Sony Rx100, I have been shooting exclusively in jpeg, as there was no good RAW support out yet. But now, my understanding is that Lightroom supports the RX100, and PSPx5 was just released, and supports it as well.

Upgrading PSPx would cost me under $100. Just Lightroom, I believe, would cost $150... obviously much more if I also want Elements or full Photoshop.

So for people familiar with all the products, what do you recommend?
What are the advantages of the Adobe products versus the cheaper PSPx?

I'd like to use RAW images to bring out more details, shadows, highlights, etc. Especially crisper bluer and more details skies in scenic pictures. (Far too often I'm getting a blown out white sky).

I also want to retain the ability to do basic editing, red eye removal, blemish removal from portraits.

Any advice or recommendations?

[photo_chick]

While Photoshop is the industry standard I know a lot of people who use other software and are perfectly happy. It's about finding what meets your needs. That's why I usually tell people to go download the free trials. And don't stop at Adobe. Check out Bibble as well.

Lightroom or Photoshop is a big debate. To me, if you're only going for one... well Lightroom is basically Adobe Camera RAW (what you use for RAW processing in PS) combined with really great image management. But it's not a Photoshop replacement. Will it do 100% of your RAW processing? yes. Will it do basic jpeg editing? Yes. It is awesome when you work on a global scale. But if you want to do a lot of local editing you really need Photoshop. If you're only buying one and you want more than basic editing, go Photoshop Elements.

Also, see if you can find a student to help you out if you're purchasing up front. Or if you want access to Photoshop CS6 and LR4 check out the Adobe Creative Cloud. It's not cost effective for Elements, but is for CS6.

[havoc315]

Thank you for the helpful feedback Photo Chick. Can you do HDR merges on Lightroom?

[zackiedawg]

If you've been liking PSPX4 already, and don't otherwise need a reason to upgrade, you might note that when the newer versions of PSP come along, the cameras added to RAW support for older versions are usually available as updates - though not at quite as speedy a pace. An X4 update or patch may come along to add more cameras.

Also, another RAW converter option you could consider would be Corel's After Shot Pro, formerly known as Bibble...it would have decent compatibility with your PSP X4 and could handle the RAW processing side before shipping it to PSP for additional processing if desired.

You can also use Lightroom the same way - alongside Photoshop or PSP, rather than trying to replace one of those. That way, you wouldn't have to worry about camera RAW support on an older PSP version, since you would only need the updated Lightroom RAW support.

[havoc315]

Good advice Zackie. I'll probably do the trial version of Lightroom...
But still trying to get a grip on -- what's the advantage of the Lightroom raw converter (or After Shot Pro converter) as opposed to the PSP or Elements converter?
Is the converter fundamentally different somehow?

[photo_chick]

Originally Posted by havoc315

Thank you for the helpful feedback Photo Chick. Can you do HDR merges on Lightroom?

No. And honestly even the HDR tools in CS6 leave something to be desired. They're OK, but Photomatix is better for HDR.

Originally Posted by zackiedawg

You can also use Lightroom the same way - alongside Photoshop or PSP, rather than trying to replace one of those. That way, you wouldn't have to worry about camera RAW support on an older PSP version, since you would only need the updated Lightroom RAW support.

Actually... if you edit in Lightroom and then choose the open in Photoshop option rather than exporting you need an equal or better version of the RAW codecs in Photoshop if you don't want Lightroom to render the image first. It's a nit-picky thing and depends on your workflow if it makes a difference for you. The RAW updates are free if you have a legal copy of the software and are done automatically if you turn on auto updates.

And I didn't realize Corel bought Bibble. Good move for them since Bibble was pretty awesome.

[Renysmom]

LR is not PSP or Photoshop. It is a starting point software, but with the advances in version 4 it is now an end point for many as well.

You use LR to bring your photos into the computer and to start the organization and processing . It does not do layering so no you can't HDR multi shots in it. You can though do one shot HDR's pretty well.


I have PSPX4 and Elements 10 and see no reason to up grade to PSPX5 at this point.

If I were you I would spend the money on LR. It is always on sale somewhere it seems and as others said, if you have a student in the house you can order the education version (there is NO difference) except for a discount. When you get it, sign up for the free 30 day trial of Kelby Training and take the LR 4 course. It will out you so far ahead in use than if you try it on your own.

From LR you will either export your images to Photomatix to create the HDR's or to PSPX4 to tone map. You can also export from LR to Topaz Lab plugins easily.

Let me know if you have any questions.

(oh and I have no problems with the RX100, LR4, PSPX4, Topaz Combo)

[havoc315]

Originally Posted by Renysmom

LR is not PSP or Photoshop. It is a starting point software, but with the advances in version 4 it is now an end point for many as well.

You use LR to bring your photos into the computer and to start the organization and processing . It does not do layering so no you can't HDR multi shots in it. You can though do one shot HDR's pretty well.


I have PSPX4 and Elements 10 and see no reason to up grade to PSPX5 at this point.

If I were you I would spend the money on LR. It is always on sale somewhere it seems and as others said, if you have a student in the house you can order the education version (there is NO difference) except for a discount. When you get it, sign up for the free 30 day trial of Kelby Training and take the LR 4 course. It will out you so far ahead in use than if you try it on your own.

From LR you will either export your images to Photomatix to create the HDR's or to PSPX4 to tone map. You can also export from LR to Topaz Lab plugins easily.

Let me know if you have any questions.

(oh and I have no problems with the RX100, LR4, PSPX4, Topaz Combo)

Thanks for the advice. I did upgrade PSPX5, as the upgrade price wasn't too bad. Some of the Nik effects and the ability to create HDR from one raw image, are working pretty nicely.
But I do think I'm going to get Lightroom.... I'll start with a 30 day trial. But I'm putting it off until I finish some other projects, so I have time to really use the 30 days. And I may wait for Lightroom 4.2 for full support of the RX100. For now, I'm trying to finish sorting and editing the 1200 jpegs from my last Disney trip.

[nbaresejr]

I just upgraded from Lightroom 3 to 4 and its amazing. Big upgrade over Lightroom 3. I also have Photoshop Elements 10 and use it very little to edit. Mostly to remove items from pictures.

For HDR Photomatix is the best software i have used.

Being a teacher i was able to just get lightroom 4 for 29.99 and i took advantage of the 2011 holiday season to get Elements 10 for $50

[havoc315]

So not a great photo, but here is something I started with and made edits in PSP5x, just really to enhance the sky.
I'm doing this, to ask the simple question --- What is the advantage of getting Lightroom? I can probably get it at the student/teacher rate. If it's as good as people say, I'll happily invest in it. But using these photos as an example, what exactly would I be getting from Lightroom? THe ability to do the same things but easier? Better?


20120905_170 by Havoc315, on Flickr


epcot edited by Havoc315, on Flickr

Before spending money, just trying to figure out what the real advantages are.
Making these adjustments on PSPX5 was ..... moderate difficulty, time and annoyance. Didn't take hours, but certainly took 30 minutes or so to compose the layers, make the adjustments, etc. Could I have done the same things with lightroom faster, with more ease, and possibly better results?

[Renysmom]

Originally Posted by havoc315

Before spending money, just trying to figure out what the real advantages are.
Making these adjustments on PSPX5 was ..... moderate difficulty, time and annoyance. Didn't take hours, but certainly took 30 minutes or so to compose the layers, make the adjustments, etc. Could I have done the same things with lightroom faster, with more ease, and possibly better results?

In Lightroom you could have done this in about 2-3 minutes. Seriously!

Lower highlights increase shadows, adjust whites, adjust blacks, adjust contrast, adjust clarity, adjust exposure, noise reduction and done.

Those are the steps

[havoc315]

Originally Posted by Renysmom

In Lightroom you could have done this in about 2-3 minutes. Seriously!

Lower highlights increase shadows, adjust whites, adjust blacks, adjust contrast, adjust clarity, adjust exposure, noise reduction and done.

Those are the steps

Alright, maybe I'm sold. I looked at the Kelby training site --- Not sure I would have time to take advantage of it, but I also didn't see a free 30 day trial listed anywhere.
Now, there are quite a few lightroom tutorials on youtube, and even some free lightroom training apps on the ipad/iphone. So maybe I'll start with those.
While I understand adjusting exposure, brightness, contrast... I really don't know anything about adjusting whites or blacks, etc. (And don't fully understand how that would have made the blue sky darker without affecting the rest of the picture).
I can't keep the difference between highlights and shadows straight..
Adjusting highlights adjusts the whites... bring out blown out elements, while adjusting shadows will bring things out of the dark? Or do I have it confused.