Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Just for Fun > Community Board
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 05-02-2012, 04:38 PM   #46
LisaR
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 8,935

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikitaZee View Post
I agree with all of this. Sad for the adoptive parents, yes. But the father filed when the baby was 4 months old - that (to me) isn't too long to realize you want to raise your own flesh and blood. The SC law that states a man gives up those rights by not supporting the pregnant mother are ridiculous IMO. I would also like to hear more of the father's side of the story, but I think it was a good thing that he requested a gag order - look at the publicity the adoptive parents/birth mother were garnering. How can the publicity be good for the little girl?
I'm not taking sides on this one because there isn't enough information. However, I can not give the father a pass on your comment. The time to decide if you want to raise your own flesh and blood is when you find out you fathered a child. He had 9 months of pregnancy to make that decision but he needed an additional 4 months after birth, so 13 months to decide if he wanted a child?? Should we give him another 13 months of time with Veronica before he decides if he wants to keep her permanently? I have zero sympathy or respect for him if he couldn't man up at the right time. That doesn't mean I don't support him if he was duped into signing termination papers. If so, he should receive full custody. He had a chance to prevent this from happening in the first place by telling his pregnant fiancee that he didn't want to be with her for the rest of his life but he wanted custody of their child.
LisaR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2012, 11:48 PM   #47
cornflake
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,656

Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaR View Post
I'm not taking sides on this one because there isn't enough information. However, I can not give the father a pass on your comment. The time to decide if you want to raise your own flesh and blood is when you find out you fathered a child. He had 9 months of pregnancy to make that decision but he needed an additional 4 months after birth, so 13 months to decide if he wanted a child?? Should we give him another 13 months of time with Veronica before he decides if he wants to keep her permanently? I have zero sympathy or respect for him if he couldn't man up at the right time. That doesn't mean I don't support him if he was duped into signing termination papers. If so, he should receive full custody. He had a chance to prevent this from happening in the first place by telling his pregnant fiancee that he didn't want to be with her for the rest of his life but he wanted custody of their child.
We don't have his side of the story though. We don't know what he knew or when he knew it - when he knew she was born, whether he thought he could raise her alone or whether he was lininig up childcare for his deployment, etc. We also don't know that the biological mother isn't or wasn't lying about what he'd said and what she told him. Maybe she's not, but who knows.

In general, I totally see what you're saying. However, given we don't actually know when he knew what...or, as you point out, what he was told..
cornflake is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 05-03-2012, 06:41 AM   #48
duffy
The Tag Fairy did not give me this tag...I wrote it myself.
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,631

Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaR View Post
I'm not taking sides on this one because there isn't enough information. However, I can not give the father a pass on your comment. The time to decide if you want to raise your own flesh and blood is when you find out you fathered a child. He had 9 months of pregnancy to make that decision but he needed an additional 4 months after birth, so 13 months to decide if he wanted a child?? Should we give him another 13 months of time with Veronica before he decides if he wants to keep her permanently? I have zero sympathy or respect for him if he couldn't man up at the right time. That doesn't mean I don't support him if he was duped into signing termination papers. If so, he should receive full custody. He had a chance to prevent this from happening in the first place by telling his pregnant fiancee that he didn't want to be with her for the rest of his life but he wanted custody of their child.
Good to see that you're not taking a side. Other than, of course, in the rest of your post where you take a side.
duffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 06:56 AM   #49
snarlingcoyote
I know people who live in really carpy school districts
 
snarlingcoyote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 5,641

I'm curious why no one is calling the birth mom and the agency out on all this. She didn't know the baby daddy was Cherokee? Seriously? And the agency? They had a baby whose daddy came from Oklahoma and they didn't investigate the daddy by at least asking if he was part Indian? Really?

As for the Indian Child Welfare Act, it was an act that stopped Adoption agencies from passing Indian and part Indian children off as White. (This was what happened to ME - I was born a few years before the act was passed.) and stopped adoption agencies from forcibly taking Indian children and adopting them to White families with no information about the child's past or birth family.

It's a difficult law, but if the adoption agencies had worked in good faith, it wouldn't have been necessary; from cases like this, I think the law still needs to be in place.
__________________
Our family:
DH Me
Our menagerie:
snarlingcoyote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 07:16 AM   #50
tammymacb
Under da sea, under da sea, darlin' it's betta down where it's wetta take it from me!
 
tammymacb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,956

Quote:
Originally Posted by cornflake View Post

In general, I totally see what you're saying. However, given we don't actually know when he knew what...or, as you point out, what he was told..
They guy was in the military? You think he didn't have access to council? To read a contract before he signed it?
tammymacb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 07:22 AM   #51
tammymacb
Under da sea, under da sea, darlin' it's betta down where it's wetta take it from me!
 
tammymacb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,956

http://www.saveveronica.org/wp-conte...-Lawmakers.pdf

Here's a copy of a letter that says that pre adoption inquiries did not show that the father was registered with the Cherokee Nation. I've posted before that the father joined when he went to court, ( though I can't currently find the old info ). But, this supports that he joined the Cherokee Nation after she was given up.
tammymacb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 07:46 AM   #52
Poohforyou
DIS Veteran
 
Poohforyou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,411

And people wonder why international adoptions are so popular. As an adoptive parent I can't imagine the heartache this couple feels.
Poohforyou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 07:52 AM   #53
cornflake
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,656

Quote:
Originally Posted by tammymacb View Post
They guy was in the military? You think he didn't have access to council? To read a contract before he signed it?
I don't know anyone in the military but I assume they don't actually have access to counsel unless, like anyone else, they're charged with a crime.

Do they really have access to legal counsel they can call up for personal matters who will advise them, read documents, etc. for free because they're in the military?! That's... nuts, if that's true.
cornflake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:21 AM   #54
duffy
The Tag Fairy did not give me this tag...I wrote it myself.
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,631

Sounds to me, like the father decided to use all the resources available to him. Decided to research, found facts that he could use to help his case, and availed himself of them.

As would anyone.
duffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:24 AM   #55
LisaR
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 8,935

Quote:
Originally Posted by duffy View Post
Good to see that you're not taking a side. Other than, of course, in the rest of your post where you take a side.
If this man knew his fiancee was pregnant and he waited 13 months to decide if he wanted to be a father, you will never convince me that he isn't a scum bag. Sorry if that appears as taking sides to you. I don't have to like him to admit that he should still receive custody if he was duped into signing termination papers.
LisaR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:34 AM   #56
luvmy3
When I drink I find its easier to watch my children because I see all 3 of them double, so all 6 of them of them take all my attention
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,034

Quote:
Originally Posted by duffy View Post
Sounds to me, like the father decided to use all the resources available to him. Decided to research, found facts that he could use to help his case, and availed himself of them.

As would anyone.
I would think anyone would do that before signing any papers stating they wouldn't contest an adoption.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaR View Post
If this man knew his fiancee was pregnant and he waited 13 months to decide if he wanted to be a father, you will never convince me that he isn't a scum bag. Sorry if that appears as taking sides to you. I don't have to like him to admit that he should still receive custody if he was duped into signing termination papers.
Makes you wonder why he didn't do his research and use the available resources long before Veronica was born, doesn't it?
luvmy3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:36 AM   #57
tammymacb
Under da sea, under da sea, darlin' it's betta down where it's wetta take it from me!
 
tammymacb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,956

Quote:
Originally Posted by cornflake View Post
I don't know anyone in the military but I assume they don't actually have access to counsel unless, like anyone else, they're charged with a crime.

Do they really have access to legal counsel they can call up for personal matters who will advise them, read documents, etc. for free because they're in the military?! That's... nuts, if that's true.
My husband is retired from the Navy. My step son finished two tours in Afghanistan.

Military bases have attorneys on site to review legal documents for active military members. It's a free service.

They also have access to an attorney prior to being deployed to set up a will, a POA etc. This is also free.

He wouldn't be eligible for a "free lawyer" to represent him in a non military matter, but he definitely had access to an attorney to review the documents he "didn't understand" prior to signing them.
tammymacb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:57 AM   #58
duffy
The Tag Fairy did not give me this tag...I wrote it myself.
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,631

Quote:
Originally Posted by luvmy3 View Post
I would think anyone would do that before signing any papers stating they wouldn't contest an adoption.




Makes you wonder why he didn't do his research and use the available resources long before Veronica was born, doesn't it?
No, it just makes me think that he didn't feel the need to, until after he changed his mind.
duffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 09:23 AM   #59
sunshinehighway
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,404

How do we know the bio dad didn't want to help from the beginning? The mother could have refused all help he offered so she could turn around and say he didn't help her. It wouldn't be the first time something like that happened.

It seems like this adoption was set up long before the baby was born. It could be a case where the bio mother pushed the father out of the picture from the start.

It really appears the adoption agency and/or couple's lawyer failed them. I do feel bad for them. I don't like the way they are going about things now. Their story is so biased, I can't help but question it.
sunshinehighway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 09:29 AM   #60
luvmy3
When I drink I find its easier to watch my children because I see all 3 of them double, so all 6 of them of them take all my attention
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,034

Quote:
Originally Posted by duffy View Post
No, it just makes me think that he didn't feel the need to, until after he changed his mind.
If he changed his mind 4 months later, then how is it he was "duped" into signing anything before she was even born?
It sounds like to me that he knew exactly what he signed, and yes he may have changed his mind, but according to State law it was too late for him. Only then did he find this loophole in some archaic law and try to use that. Its just another example of how our justice system is far from fair sometimes.
luvmy3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:37 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.

You Rated this Thread: