Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Trip Planning Forums > The DIS Unplugged Podcast
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-18-2012, 07:18 AM   #1
lodgelady
DIS Veteran
 
lodgelady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 842

Q&A: Bad behavior & "guest experience"

I've been reading with growing alarm these posts about outrageously rude people at Disney. We noticed on our last visit (week before Christmas) that there was a marked increase in the level of incivility- in cast members as well as guests.I am an older person, so my first worry is "our society is going to hell in a handbasket!"
However, after considering these questions, my husband and I came to the conclusion that Disney is responsible for some of the bad behavior we saw in the parks due to their poor oversight, or policies that favor Disney's interests over the guest experience.

Here are some questions we discussed:

**Please take into account when considering these questions that some people are not interested in being rule-followers at Disney or anywhere else. You will not change human nature.**

1) Does the very high ticket price contribute to aggressive behavior?

2) Are C.M.'s trained as well as in the past at WDW? Are they matched as well to their positions? Are they paid a living wage for the Orlando area? Are there enough of them on duty in extreme crowd conditions?

3) Disney allows people to pre-pay for a sit down meal each day, but do they insist that guests make ADR's when they buy the plan? Is this setting first-time visitors up for disappointment/anger?

These are just the questions we discussed. Feel free to ask some of your own.
__________________
Born to teach!


lodgelady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 08:58 AM   #2
kermit116
"Here you leave today and enter the world of yesterday, tomorrow and fantasy."
 
kermit116's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,124

Quote:
Originally Posted by lodgelady View Post
:

**Please take into account when considering these questions that some people are not interested in being rule-followers at Disney or anywhere else. You will not change human nature.**

1) Does the very high ticket price contribute to aggressive behavior?

2) Are C.M.'s trained as well as in the past at WDW? Are they matched as well to their positions? Are they paid a living wage for the Orlando area? Are there enough of them on duty in extreme crowd conditions?

3) Disney allows people to pre-pay for a sit down meal each day, but do they insist that guests make ADR's when they buy the plan? Is this setting first-time visitors up for disappointment/anger?

These are just the questions we discussed. Feel free to ask some of your own.

1 - If the ticket prices do contribute to bad behavior, I think it just goes to the fact that people are inconsiderate and feel unreasonably entitled. Like Kevin said on a podcast once, it's not a situation where you're the only person who paid lots of $$ for your ticket, and everyone else in the park got in for free. Tickets for WDW have been expensive for a long time, but I think people have grown to have a certain attitude that they believe they are entitled to special treatment and therefore everyone else must bow to their wishes.

2 - Not really sure on this one. I've heard (and read) on the DIS that WDW employees off-duty police to wander the park in plain clothes. Not sure if increasing their presence would help. Then again, you don't want Disney to appear like a "police state." Perhaps if there were more managers on hand to help cast members who don't necessarily have control to change things or take more serious action if a guest gets out of control.

3 - I think this could be a big contributing factor, but I'm not sure how Disney would remedy it aside from requiring everyone to make all their ADRs as soon as they reserve their trip. I guess Disney could put up a big warning with every reservation that restaurants get busy, so you should make ADRs early and don't expect to get your favorite restaurant without an ADR. Of course, that would be very unmagical & un-Disney to have a big red printed warning screen on the computer when you reserve your trip online. I guess they could find a way to do it & get the info across without sounding nasty. But, that still probably wouldn't deal with the issue of these people who come up and scream at CMs, and then get seated immediately. People who do that with any sort of regularity will continue to do it even if there's a warning when they book their trip, because that's just the kind of people they are.

Unfortunately, I think it's just a sign of the decline in good manners that is prevalent in our society. Not sure there's anything Disney can really do to stop it. Nasty people will continue to be nasty - the only recourse may be throwing them out of the park if they get too nasty, and I don't see Disney doing that in response to a guest screaming at a poor CM in a restaurant.
kermit116 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 10:04 AM   #3
lugnut33
DIS Veteran
 
lugnut33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 6,255

The price of a vacation to Disneyland or Disney World has a huge influence on the behaviour of people. When you pay a lot of money you expect a lot in return. I think a lot of people get turned off at WDW because of the huge crowds everywhere. They expect the experience to be more relaxing instead they end up waiting in line for everything, especially those who do not plan ahead.

Just look at pro-athletics nowadays and how easily players and teams get booed as an example of how money influences people. People easily get upset because they think that due to the high cost of the tickets they expect the team to be championship calibre, and if the team isn't then they feel cheated. If a guy isn't giving 100% effort on the field or court, they feel the need to yell names at that player.

As for CM training, no they are not trained like they used to be. The orientation process changed when Disney focused on profit and brought Meg Crofton to FL. It won't change until Iger is gone and you better hope Crofton doesn't assume the CEO position. There seems to be a movement out in CA for better CM training, and that goes back to Kaligredis (not sure I spelled that right) who is genuinely in love with the parks. Hopefully that mindset moves east to FL, but I'm not betting on it.
__________________
lugnut33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 11:11 AM   #4
DEA
DIS Veteran
 
DEA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 1,469

1. People who are courteous and people who display uncivil behavior basically pay the same price, right? Sure, for some people, the ticket prices and concerns about getting their money's worth may increase their stress level, but their behavior is still their choice, and there are plenty of people who focus on enjoying the experience and acting in a civil manner.

2. Based on all the reports I've heard, the training for CMs has been shortened over the years. They do not get paid a great wage, especially just starting out. Some CMs seem to get rewards from being a part of the show at WDW, while others seem to not care one way or the other. I am not sure if their respective demeanors would change that much if their wages were increased. The CMs who are motivated by the magic would still be more motivated and more guest-focused than those motivated solely by a paycheck.

3. I blundered around on my first trip to WDW, with the dining plan and only a couple of ADRs. I was able to make more once I was laughed out of the first TS restaurant at which we tried to eat. I think it would be great for CMs to suggest that guests getting the dining plan review the dining options and make ADRs for those restaurants they particularly want to visit. However, there are a lot of people making reservations online, who would not get that CM interaction. Disney could certainly make suggestions on the website about making ADRs, but I imagine it would be a low-probability that people would read everything that pops up on the screen.

#3 is a good reason to use a Travel Agent. When I have booked through Dreams Unlimited, the agent has made some suggested ADRs, then cancelled them after I waved them off because I had already made the reservations.

There are, of course, trade-offs involved in Disney's business interests and guest experience. I would imagine a lot of us would like to have a park to ourselves, for free, and dinner at Victoria and Albert's in the evening, wearing whatever we want, for the price of a Happy Meal. It just can't be done. Similarly, capping park attendance at a lower number means that more people will be shut out, which those inside the park will enjoy a better experience.
__________________
--
Me DW DD(9) DD(7)

DIS Dads Member #432
DEA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 11:45 AM   #5
WaltD4Me
PS...I tried asking for water cups once
I am actually a princess
 
WaltD4Me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: N.E. Ohio
Posts: 9,729

Disney has never been a cheap vacation. I remember people commenting about how expensive Disney is after my first trip over 30 years ago. I do think the price plays a part in it, but I think more so is the extremely high expectations people have. Disney set a standard and really high bar that they have cultivated and advertised for years. People expect the "Disney Difference" and the internet has hyped up that expectation even higher. They read about other people's magical experiences, no matter how randorm or rare and they expect the same thing.

I also think there has been an uptick in bad behavior no matter if people are Disney World or Mc Donald's. People are just much more demanding these days. Not everyone of course, but you see much more bad behavior everywhere, not just at WDW. Beyond that, you also hear about bad behavior more easily....we read about it right here on the DISboards every day. 15 years ago if you saw someone behaving badly at WDW, you came home and told a few of your friends, today you come home and tell thousands of people on the internet.
__________________
Lisa 1980 Poly, 92' Grand Floridian, Oct 98 Teddy & Doll Convention, Dec 2004 POFQ, May 05 40th Birthday!, May 06 OKW 41st Birthday! May 07 OKW 42nd Birthday! Feb 08 Pirate & Princess Party! Oct. 08 at OKW! 1st Solo Trip May 09! / November 2010 at OKW, 2013 at WDW and Crusing on the Dream
WaltD4Me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 12:05 PM   #6
dmccarty
DIS Veteran
 
dmccarty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 1,227

Some people are just rude. They get worse at WDW because of the crowds, they do not want to wait, and the stress with being with family for days on end.

Certainly politeness is not as strong in today's society than in the past.

I think another added stress at WDW is that it is a WORLD now. When I was a kid there was only MK. I do not think most people spend the entire vacation at WDW aka MK. We did not. We spent one day at MK. On vacation you might spend a day or so at MK, maybe Seaworld, go to the beach for a few days, etc. One was not at the parks, with the crowds, and spending money, for the entire vacation as most people do today. I think that adds stress which adds to rudeness.

There are just more people at the parks now. With just MK and a few resorts, there were only so many people onsite. Now with DTD, four theme parks, and two water parks, there are just that many more people at WDW. Even is there is only a small percentage of rude people, there are just more of them.

Disney does need to start enforcing its rules more strictly. Clean streets stay cleaner. Dirty streets get dirtier. If people knew that they could be removed from the parks for cutting in line, smoking in the wrong places, taking flash photos where forbidden, etc, the rudeness would decline.

Heck, I would pay extra for more security to enforce the rules.

Later,
Dan
__________________
May 2013 VBR
Oct 2009, Oct 2010, Oct 2011 AKV
Mar/Apr 2008, Apr 2009 AKL
Oct 2007 CBR
Apr 1998 and May 1997 CR
70's to 1997 too many trips to count.

Disney is a lens that focuses on people.
Sometimes it exposes the worst.
Most of the time it highlights the best.
dmccarty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 08:15 PM   #7
pxlbarrel
They won't allow any kind of cow though
Geez, I gotta start cleaning your rooms so I can get those treats
 
pxlbarrel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Richmond Hill, ON CANADA
Posts: 2,726

You get the same rude behaviour at crowded shopping malls and parking lots. People who are rude in the park would be rude at the shopping mall so I don't believe the cost has anythign to do with it ... unless it gives some people a sense of heightened importance.

As for ADRs and the Disney Dining Plan.... you could explain to every single person the intricacies of the Disney Dining Plan and how they should make sure they have ADRs but there will still be people who refuse to do the research or book ahead. We, on this board, are planners. I'm not going until November and I've already trying to figure out what restaurants we should be making our ADRs at. But there are people who will always fly by the seat of their pants. The last minute people. They don't want to plan ahead, they just want to wing it.

Hey, there are lots of people who are bummed out that they can't eat a restaurant of their choice because they didn't think ahead BUT not all of them are exhibiting the bad behaviour that we've been hearing about in the Podcasts and here in the forum. These are just plain rude and obnoxious people who would be the same rude and obnoxious people at home. I think being at WDW amplifies their disgraceful behaviour but I don't believe that WDW causes it. Some people just aren't nice.
__________________
1975 WDW Fort Wilderness | 1983 Disneyland | 1992 WDW Offsite | 1996 Disneyland (DL Pacific Hotel)| 1999 Disneyland | 2000 WDW Dixie Landings | 2002 Disneyland | 2003 WDW Offsite | 2004 Disneyland | 2005 WDW Offsite | 2006 Disneyland | 2007 Tokyo Disneyland /Disney Sea / HK Disneyland (Disney's Hollywood Hotel) | 2008 Disneyland | 2008 WDW Offsite | 2009 Disneyland Paris | 2009 Disneyland | 2009 WDW Caribbean Beach Resort - DCL Disney Magic | 2011 Disneyland | 2011 Disney Magic Mediterranean | 2012 Disneyland (VGC) | 2012 ABD -Enchanted China | 2012 HK Disneyland | 2012 DCL Disney Magic NYC/Canada | 2012 WDW Boardwalk | 2013 Disneyland | 2013 Disney Magic Mediterranean Greek | 2013 Disney Dream Bahamas | 2014 Disneyland (VGC)
pxlbarrel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 08:48 PM   #8
Justin Jett
I will do my Elvis impression at DAP, if Kevin will do a duet with me
I'm signed up and ready to go
 
Justin Jett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 2,244

Quote:
Originally Posted by pxlbarrel View Post
But there are people who will always fly by the seat of their pants. The last minute people. They don't want to plan ahead, they just want to wing it.
I am one of those people. I frequently buy the dining plan, but I do not make ADRs if there are less than 5 people in my party. I have made a total of 2 ADRs since 1988.

With that said......I do not just sit down and demand to be served. I go up to the podium and tell them the number of people in my party, they give me the little buzzer thingy, and I wait my turn.
__________________
Skip AKA "Justin"
"Pursue the passion, not the money. If you follow your passion and you're good what you do, the money comes." -Pete Werner
Justin Jett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 08:55 PM   #9
pxlbarrel
They won't allow any kind of cow though
Geez, I gotta start cleaning your rooms so I can get those treats
 
pxlbarrel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Richmond Hill, ON CANADA
Posts: 2,726

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Jett View Post
I am one of those people. I frequently buy the dining plan, but I do not make ADRs if there are less than 5 people in my party. I have made a total of 2 ADRs since 1988.

With that said......I do not just sit down and demand to be served. I go up to the podium and tell them the number of people in my party, they give me the little buzzer thingy, and I wait my turn.
Exactly .... because you're not a rude and obnoxious person when you're at home(well, I'm assuming you're not. ) so why would you be at WDW?

I think there's a difference between being snappy and having a bad day at the park from being a bore who struts up to the hapless CM and demands to be served. One can be in a bad mood and still be polite. However, if you're used to being a bully, it doesn't matter what mood you're in...you're just a bully.

(My 2 cent pop psychology opinion )
__________________
1975 WDW Fort Wilderness | 1983 Disneyland | 1992 WDW Offsite | 1996 Disneyland (DL Pacific Hotel)| 1999 Disneyland | 2000 WDW Dixie Landings | 2002 Disneyland | 2003 WDW Offsite | 2004 Disneyland | 2005 WDW Offsite | 2006 Disneyland | 2007 Tokyo Disneyland /Disney Sea / HK Disneyland (Disney's Hollywood Hotel) | 2008 Disneyland | 2008 WDW Offsite | 2009 Disneyland Paris | 2009 Disneyland | 2009 WDW Caribbean Beach Resort - DCL Disney Magic | 2011 Disneyland | 2011 Disney Magic Mediterranean | 2012 Disneyland (VGC) | 2012 ABD -Enchanted China | 2012 HK Disneyland | 2012 DCL Disney Magic NYC/Canada | 2012 WDW Boardwalk | 2013 Disneyland | 2013 Disney Magic Mediterranean Greek | 2013 Disney Dream Bahamas | 2014 Disneyland (VGC)
pxlbarrel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2012, 09:10 PM   #10
Justin Jett
I will do my Elvis impression at DAP, if Kevin will do a duet with me
I'm signed up and ready to go
 
Justin Jett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 2,244

Quote:
Originally Posted by pxlbarrel View Post
Exactly .... because you're not a rude and obnoxious person when you're at home(well, I'm assuming you're not. ) so why would you be at WDW?
I always try to be a nice guy, but at home I rarely wish people a magical day.

My personal feeling on ADRs is that if I am willing to wait for an attraction, I should be willing to wait for a restaurant. If I cannot wait for some reason.....there are snacks available.

As someone who spends every summer as a front line employee at the local water park.....I have noticed that park crowds are getting ruder over time.
__________________
Skip AKA "Justin"
"Pursue the passion, not the money. If you follow your passion and you're good what you do, the money comes." -Pete Werner
Justin Jett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2012, 01:51 PM   #11
FireDancer
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 13,282

I don't think people are really that much more rude today than in the past, we just hear about it more because of message boards. 20 years ago you would only know about the rude people you personally encountered but now you hear every story that gets posted online.
FireDancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2012, 02:22 PM   #12
WaltD4Me
PS...I tried asking for water cups once
I am actually a princess
 
WaltD4Me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: N.E. Ohio
Posts: 9,729

Quote:
Originally Posted by FireDancer View Post
I don't think people are really that much more rude today than in the past, we just hear about it more because of message boards. 20 years ago you would only know about the rude people you personally encountered but now you hear every story that gets posted online.
I totally agree that you hear about the bad behavior more now than you would have 20 years ago, but I do think people are ruder too and definitely more demanding. I've worked in customer service for the last 18 years and believe me it's waaaaaaaaaaaay different now than when I first started.
__________________
Lisa 1980 Poly, 92' Grand Floridian, Oct 98 Teddy & Doll Convention, Dec 2004 POFQ, May 05 40th Birthday!, May 06 OKW 41st Birthday! May 07 OKW 42nd Birthday! Feb 08 Pirate & Princess Party! Oct. 08 at OKW! 1st Solo Trip May 09! / November 2010 at OKW, 2013 at WDW and Crusing on the Dream
WaltD4Me is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:33 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.