Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Trip Planning Forums > disABILITIES!
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 09-30-2012, 12:58 AM   #1
mom2rj
Earning My Ears
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13

Going, going.............

I wanted to share some info with all your faithful readers. GACS are indeed going to be phased out. The timeline is fuzzy, but according to 2 castmembers in higher castles than those in Fantasyland, they won't be around forever.
All new attractions and many older ones have been designed or re tooled to allow wheelchairs. Additionally, these lines are, for the most part, in the shade and often cooled. Now the Disney geeks have gone one step further and every new attraction has some type of interactive activities added. If you don't mind the plethora of germs, enjoy these (some very clever) ways to pass the time.
We, the general public, may need to be more aware of our health needs, and alter our touring patterns. I learned this the hard way last month. I can no longer tour in the heat of day in August. We had to switch everything around, skip a few favored attractions, tour in the evenings only, and learn that it wasn't the end of the world! (pun intended) I think it may come to a place where some of us will need to make shorter visits to the parks, or travel during a different time of year. I believe that Disney has been very patient to overcome all of our various ailments and DXs to make the parks accessible. Then there has always been the issue of those who have no disability and have often been the nastiest with CMs. The bottom line is that Disney World may not be for everyone. There, I said it!! I'm not interested in an argument or a bunch of criticism, but I am interested in making the World more accessible to all.
I have met with people who could make changes in the way things are done, and sent many suggestions that WDW remove all wheelchairs from the front of the parks. Give them to 1st Aid. They usually aren't very busy, and I think some fakers would not be willing to take that chance with someone medical. Also, I think by the time some of the folks got to 1st Aid, they will have already been captured by the magic and blow right on by. Anyone want to start a letter writing campaign???
Anyway, lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnng post I know, but maybe we can make WDW better by continuing to network together.
mom2rj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 02:05 AM   #2
cmwade77
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,947

There are still items that will not be addressed without GACs, so I seriously doubt they would do away with them all together. There will most likely be some changes to them, such as requiring I.D. at every attraction and/or going to a system where the scan your GAC at each attraction and you not being able to use it again for the length of the standby line. But from what the executive offices in charge of disability services, they are NOT going to eliminate them. I would think that they would be in the know above all else, as these are the decision makers that I have been talking with.

They are also legally required to provide equal access, eliminating GACs would eliminate equal access for many disabilities. I would not suggest starting a letter writing campaign unless there is an official announcement made. Disney World (as any place with public access) is for everyone under the law and equal does mean equal access, meaning wait times should be the same (not longer or shorter), must be able to get on and off the attraction, etc.

I don't think having first aid rent the wheelchairs would be a good idea as people may not be able to walk that far to rent one. I do think that having first aid give out GACs could be a good move to reduce abuse though.
cmwade77 is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 09-30-2012, 06:09 AM   #3
bookwormde
Heading out now, another adventure
Have a good time, WDW is a magical place
 
bookwormde's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,575

GACs were ahead of their time when initiated and are now "dated", but I to expect them to be phased out over time as better technology is brought in. I see virtual waiting lines using RFID, which will eliminate most of the uses of GAC except for limited mobility access, which is being addressed as attractions are being updated. Stroller as a wheelchair tags will likely remain until all CMs have RFID reading devices.

It well be one of those win/win situations where disability needs will advance everyone's enjoyment of the parks (unless you enjoy standing in lines). I can see similar advancements with bus scheduling and loading.

As far as WDW not providing accommodations for the broadest array of disabilities, there will not be a backslide there.

bookwormde
__________________
bookwormde is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 05:01 PM   #4
dis-happy
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 6,147

Quote:
Originally Posted by bookwormde View Post
Stroller as a wheelchair tags will likely remain until all CMs have RFID reading devices.

I would think/hope they remain beyond RFID. I know of a child with mild CP who uses a stroller as wheelchair and the tag is needed for things such as getting into The Land, not just rides.
dis-happy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 05:50 PM   #5
OhanaDreams
Cute and Fluffy
 
OhanaDreams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Kansas
Posts: 69

We have been to Disneyworld 2x with our 6 year old son. Looking at him you would think nothing is wrong other than he looks old for his age. He has a inoperable cyst in his brain the size of a melon. He has normal intelligence, but he also has severe autonomyic and sensory disorder.

Last time we were at Magic Kingdom we could not go visit Mickey or go on the Dumbo ride. The new buildings was "up to code". It had wide enough aisles for his stroller, but the noise level that was in the room and in lines would have been intolerable for him to stand. The noise created by all those bodies waiting in line is a barrier to him. It actually becomes painful. What rights does he have? We skip many different attractions like the parades and fireworks shows because of this disability. The rides were his chance to be a normal kid for a while. He was approached last week about a Dream Factory wish. Should we look elsewhere? Is Disney only going to be friendly to certain disabilities? Isn't that also discrimination?

My child can walk short distances, but the longer he is on his feet the more irregular his autonomyic functions become. People are surprised when he gets out of his stroller and can move freely. What they don't see is within 5 minutes his hands and feet are freezing cold and lips are turning blue from lack of oxygen. In another 5 minutes he may start to trip and fall. 5 minutes after that we get into cognitive changes. Not a fun way to grow up. Do not judge a book by its cover. We endured nasty comments and strange looks on our last 2 Disney World trips. Not all disabilities are readily visible.

If anyone has an address or phone number on who to call about these changes please post them.
__________________
'Ohana means family, family means nobody gets left behind. Or forgotten.

Buglet's Wish Pre-Trip Report


~1997 All Star Music~~2002 Coronado~~2010 All Star Music Family Suite~~2012 Caribbean Beach~2013 G.K.T.W. Dream Factory Wish Trip
OhanaDreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 06:35 AM   #6
Schmeck
Funny thing is now my 17 year old naps almost every day and so do I!

 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Massachusetts Strong!
Posts: 8,535

Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2rj View Post

I have met with people who could make changes in the way things are done, and sent many suggestions that WDW remove all wheelchairs from the front of the parks. Give them to 1st Aid. They usually aren't very busy, and I think some fakers would not be willing to take that chance with someone medical. Also, I think by the time some of the folks got to 1st Aid, they will have already been captured by the magic and blow right on by. Anyone want to start a letter writing campaign???
There is no law (that I can find anyways) that says only the "disabled" get to use wheelchairs. It's a common misconception for a lot of people, that accessible devices are the exclusive property of the "disabled". If someone wants to use a wheelchair, then they have the right to use one. Or to use crutches, an ECV, a sling, an eyepatch, etc. If there is some 'benefit' given to using these devices at WDW, then WDW is in violation of the ADA. (See section 12182(b)(1)(A)(ii)).
__________________
July '13 - CBR Aug '14 - PC
Mar '13 - PC Aug '12 - PC (Best Trip Ever!)
Aug '10 - PC June '08 - ASMo (school trip)
Aug '05 - BC Aug '04 - PC, AKL
Oct '02 - AKL, POR May '99 - CBR
May '96 - CBR Dec '80 - offsite
Schmeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 09:57 AM   #7
Michigan
Mom of the Rolling Crew
 
Michigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Westland, MI in the summer Clermont, FL in the Winter
Posts: 2,095

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmeck View Post
There is no law (that I can find anyways) that says only the "disabled" get to use wheelchairs. It's a common misconception for a lot of people, that accessible devices are the exclusive property of the "disabled". If someone wants to use a wheelchair, then they have the right to use one. Or to use crutches, an ECV, a sling, an eyepatch, etc. If there is some 'benefit' given to using these devices at WDW, then WDW is in violation of the ADA. (See section 12182(b)(1)(A)(ii)).
There is no "benefit" from using the devices. However, there are some who do not need the device but get them denying someone who does need it equal access. I worked with someone who's daughter sprained her ankle and decided after that every time they go to WDW they now get a wheelchair so they get wheelchair seating for shows. Their sitting in wheelchair seating takes away the equal access that my 2 daughters that are paraplegics need to access the show.
__________________
Snowbird living the dream 8 miles from Disney Oct-April
Michigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 01:31 PM   #8
Schmeck
Funny thing is now my 17 year old naps almost every day and so do I!

 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Massachusetts Strong!
Posts: 8,535

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michigan View Post
There is no "benefit" from using the devices. However, there are some who do not need the device but get them denying someone who does need it equal access. I worked with someone who's daughter sprained her ankle and decided after that every time they go to WDW they now get a wheelchair so they get wheelchair seating for shows. Their sitting in wheelchair seating takes away the equal access that my 2 daughters that are paraplegics need to access the show.
Equal access means that the seating is available, not that everyone is guaranteed a spot. Ablebodied people get turned away when a venue is full too. So, you have been given access, you just have to wait your turn, like everyone else.
__________________
July '13 - CBR Aug '14 - PC
Mar '13 - PC Aug '12 - PC (Best Trip Ever!)
Aug '10 - PC June '08 - ASMo (school trip)
Aug '05 - BC Aug '04 - PC, AKL
Oct '02 - AKL, POR May '99 - CBR
May '96 - CBR Dec '80 - offsite
Schmeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 03:31 PM   #9
Michigan
Mom of the Rolling Crew
 
Michigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Westland, MI in the summer Clermont, FL in the Winter
Posts: 2,095

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmeck View Post
Equal access means that the seating is available, not that everyone is guaranteed a spot. Ablebodied people get turned away when a venue is full too. So, you have been given access, you just have to wait your turn, like everyone else.
I can tell you from personal experience that the accessible seating is full way before the able bodied seating is.
__________________
Snowbird living the dream 8 miles from Disney Oct-April
Michigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 03:38 PM   #10
Sparkly

Then a bunch of people started commenting on it
I wondered if people really lived there and got to watch them every night
 
Sparkly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: England
Posts: 2,273

I really hope the OP is just trolling, because the GAC has really helped me enjoy the parks more!
__________________


Nov 2003, Feb 2005,Aug 2006, Apr 2008, Feb 2011, Feb 2012, Feb 2013!, Feb 2014, March 2015


Last edited by Sparkly; 09-30-2012 at 03:51 PM.
Sparkly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 08:50 AM   #11
ttintagel
DIS Veteran
 
ttintagel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,364

While I can believe that they'd go to some other system than the GAC, I have a tough time believing that they'll stop accommodating non-wheelchair disabilities altogether. They've built up a reputation as a disability-friendly destination, and I doubt they'd risk losing that.
ttintagel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 09:23 AM   #12
SueM in MN
It's like combining the teacups with a roller coaster

 
SueM in MN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Twin Cities area,Minnesota,USA
Posts: 30,929
DISboards Moderator

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmwade77 View Post
Well, this is a violation of ADA, there must be viewing locations that provide equal views to what any non disabled person can get. In other words, if even one non-disabled person can get a better view than the best view a disabled person could get (but may already be full by when you get there), then they are violating ADA. We recently went through this at DLR with WOC when they decided that they were only going to put ADA sections in the back and this was the final determination which forced them to restore the original areas. Now, due to other changes in the viewing areas, they have had to slightly modify some of the locations since then, but they made sure they did not have the same problem as when they tried to put everyone in the back.

This is specifically related to theaters in recent ADA guidelines (I think it was 2010). Please note that these guidelines only clarify older ADA rules and do not grandfather older venues in. These guidelines specifically state that they apply to any venue built or remodeled since something like 1992.

The guidelines also state that there must be at least two companion seats per wheelchair/transfer seat in the same row that must be reserved until all other seats are filled. There also must be a certain percentage of Aisle seats that are transfer seats and a certain percentage of total seats that are aisle seats. There also must be a certain percentage of seats that are for disabled access.

Now, this doesn't mean every ADA area provides equal viewing, because not every not every non ADA viewing area provides equal viewing. But, at least one must be equal to non ADA viewing areas.
Many WDW theaters actually do have seating in more than the very back row.
The back row usually has the most seating, so guests who want to sit somewhere other than the back may find only the back is available hn they arrive.
The theaters that don't have multiple seating areas are ones that were built longer ago and fit the guidelines in effect when they were built.

Mickey's Philharmagic opened in 2003, but uses the same seating as was used for the previous show there - Legend of the Lion King, which opened in 1994.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michigan View Post
I can tell you from personal experience that the accessible seating is full way before the able bodied seating is.
That is true in our experience too.
There are limited numbers of wheelchair spots and they are usually filled while there is still general setting available.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dis-happy View Post
I would think/hope they remain beyond RFID. I know of a child with mild CP who uses a stroller as wheelchair and the tag is needed for things such as getting into The Land, not just rides.
Keep in mind that RFID is more than just fast passes.
It is a link to a file and the file could include a lot of other information.

This is all conjecture since I don't have any specific information except for reading about RFIDs and how they work.
It could be very specific information regarding that guest and could even be location specific so it tells a CM at a ride entrance what that person needs related to that attraction - for example, if the person needs front row seating for a show, that information could pop up on an RFID reader screen for the CM at those shows where it is pertinent.
They may still always need certain things, like tags identifying strollers as being used as wheelchairs, but a RFID enabled GAC would be a smart GAC, rather than the current cards, which really have very little information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhanaDreams View Post
We have been to Disneyworld 2x with our 6 year old son. Looking at him you would think nothing is wrong other than he looks old for his age. He has a inoperable cyst in his brain the size of a melon. He has normal intelligence, but he also has severe autonomyic and sensory disorder.

Last time we were at Magic Kingdom we could not go visit Mickey or go on the Dumbo ride. The new buildings was "up to code". It had wide enough aisles for his stroller, but the noise level that was in the room and in lines would have been intolerable for him to stand. The noise created by all those bodies waiting in line is a barrier to him. It actually becomes painful. What rights does he have? We skip many different attractions like the parades and fireworks shows because of this disability. The rides were his chance to be a normal kid for a while. He was approached last week about a Dream Factory wish. Should we look elsewhere? Is Disney only going to be friendly to certain disabilities? Isn't that also discrimination?

My child can walk short distances, but the longer he is on his feet the more irregular his autonomyic functions become. People are surprised when he gets out of his stroller and can move freely. What they don't see is within 5 minutes his hands and feet are freezing cold and lips are turning blue from lack of oxygen. In another 5 minutes he may start to trip and fall. 5 minutes after that we get into cognitive changes. Not a fun way to grow up. Do not judge a book by its cover. We endured nasty comments and strange looks on our last 2 Disney World trips. Not all disabilities are readily visible.

If anyone has an address or phone number on who to call about these changes please post them.
There is contact information in a post in the disABILITIES FAQs thread, but again, I hope people do NOT start letter writing campaigns or complaints based on rumors.
The last time that happened was when there was a rumor that DisneyLand was eliminating GACs and all they were doing was switching to the same way as WDW did it, to be in compliance with the ADA.
PEople started letter writing complaint websites with no information, threatening boycotts, etc on a lot of rumors that were no where near the truth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ttintagel View Post
While I can believe that they'd go to some other system than the GAC, I have a tough time believing that they'll stop accommodating non-wheelchair disabilities altogether. They've built up a reputation as a disability-friendly destination, and I doubt they'd risk losing that.
As I posted before, they will still need to comply with the ADA.
Most of the really specific measurement type things are based on wheelchair accessibility because those are very easy to write out and inspect against.
They are not all that is covered by the ADA though.
__________________
SueM in MN
Moderator of disABILITIES
Link to disABILITIES FAQs thread

Spaceship Earth: We are all passengers together.
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans......John Lennon
Be a rainbow in someone else's cloud. Dr. Maya Angelou
trip report link in Memory of eternaldisneyfan, who lived these words: Some people are always grumbling because roses have thorns. I am thankful that thorns have roses. Alphonse Karr

Last edited by SueM in MN; 10-01-2012 at 02:00 PM. Reason: Typos
SueM in MN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 03:53 PM   #13
utterrandomness
Mouseketeer
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 163

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michigan View Post
There is no "benefit" from using the devices. However, there are some who do not need the device but get them denying someone who does need it equal access. I worked with someone who's daughter sprained her ankle and decided after that every time they go to WDW they now get a wheelchair so they get wheelchair seating for shows. Their sitting in wheelchair seating takes away the equal access that my 2 daughters that are paraplegics need to access the show.
Do they get a wheelchair for the seating, or do they get a wheelchair because she has lingering issues with walking long distances? Even if they are faking, how do you know who is and isn't faking? Who are you to judge that? I don't see why people should have to suffer just because you want to eradicate some of the fakers. How do you make sure that you're only cutting out the fakers?

My physical disability is the result of an accident, and in theory once I get surgery it will be "fixed" but I will always have some pain from walking long distances and standing for extended periods, exactly the conditions at WDW. Are you telling me that I don't need access as much as people with "worse" disabilities, so I should just give up my holidays so that they aren't inconvenienced? What about people who are fine with walking but can't do stairs, GACs can help those people indicate to the CMs that they can't do stairs, but under your logic, them using the elevator takes away from the people with "real" disabilities. That's what it seems like you're saying, by the way, that people who aren't "as disabled" as your daughters don't deserve what they need for equal access. Accessibility is for everyone that needs it, not just the people who have it "worse".
utterrandomness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 04:16 PM   #14
Michigan
Mom of the Rolling Crew
 
Michigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Westland, MI in the summer Clermont, FL in the Winter
Posts: 2,095

Quote:
Originally Posted by utterrandomness View Post
Do they get a wheelchair for the seating, or do they get a wheelchair because she has lingering issues with walking long distances? Even if they are faking, how do you know who is and isn't faking? Who are you to judge that? I don't see why people should have to suffer just because you want to eradicate some of the fakers. How do you make sure that you're only cutting out the fakers?

My physical disability is the result of an accident, and in theory once I get surgery it will be "fixed" but I will always have some pain from walking long distances and standing for extended periods, exactly the conditions at WDW. Are you telling me that I don't need access as much as people with "worse" disabilities, so I should just give up my holidays so that they aren't inconvenienced? What about people who are fine with walking but can't do stairs, GACs can help those people indicate to the CMs that they can't do stairs, but under your logic, them using the elevator takes away from the people with "real" disabilities. That's what it seems like you're saying, by the way, that people who aren't "as disabled" as your daughters don't deserve what they need for equal access. Accessibility is for everyone that needs it, not just the people who have it "worse".
Wow, I guess people comment without reading all the posts. Way back at the beginning someone said that they should move the chair rentals to first aid in an effort to stop those that get them without a need might not get one. Then another person posted that you don't need a medical reason to rent a chair because that would be against the ADA and I commented that I know someone who has a daughter that does this and by doing so her family can have front row seating for shows she is stopping what the ADA intended by giving people like my kids and SueMN's daughter access to seating that they would not have without ADA. She gets one and brags about it. I NEVER said anyone disability was more important then anyone else!
__________________
Snowbird living the dream 8 miles from Disney Oct-April
Michigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2012, 04:38 PM   #15
utterrandomness
Mouseketeer
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 163

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michigan View Post
Wow, I guess people comment without reading all the posts. Way back at the beginning someone said that they should move the chair rentals to first aid in an effort to stop those that get them without a need might not get one. Then another person posted that you don't need a medical reason to rent a chair because that would be against the ADA and I commented that I know someone who has a daughter that does this and by doing so her family can have front row seating for shows she is stopping what the ADA intended by giving people like my kids and SueMN's daughter access to seating that they would not have without ADA. She gets one and brags about it. I NEVER said anyone disability was more important then anyone else!
You said that almost exactly actually, when you said that people who you think are faking are taking away from your daughters.
utterrandomness is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
gacs



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:22 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.