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-   -   A glimpse of an RFID magic-banded future (http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3075879)

JR864 03-06-2013 11:45 AM

A glimpse of an RFID magic-banded future
 
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

Just returned from a too-short trip to WDW. I have an Annual Pass, and stayed at Caribbean Beach with the dining plan added.

I was on my own for the first day (Friday), so I headed over early to Old Port Royale for breakfast around 7:15. The place was fairly deserted (though not for long) and only 2 registers were open.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.

By this time, I had a couple people behind me in line. Now, I'm holding my key well away from the touchpad and it lights up on its own. She tells me to enter my PIN, but it won't enter (the little keypad screen still said "Welcome" or something to that effect).

People in line behind me now shrug and sigh and move to the other line.

The cashier is embarassed at this point. I look at her screen and see that the system is now rebooting. She apologizes profusely, calls over two separate managers, and I go stand in the now ever-growing line for the other register. I wasn't irritated in the least -- stuff happens after all with point of sale registers even using debit/credit cards.

I was surprised to see how she was grilled by the managers -- "what keys did you touch?" "why is this screen showing?" -- I thought they were unnecessarily rough on her (especially since they were 3 feet away from the line to the other register).

Her system comes back up and she motions to me to come back. I laugh and say, "should I risk it?". She apologizes again, and I tell her not to sweat it. Still no response from the touchpad, so she takes my KTTW card and swipes it, and I'm on my way (after verifying that I in fact didn't accidentally use three counter service meals).

A minor inconvenience, but think about the implications here. In the amazing Tomorrowland magic-band future that Disney is envisioning, I would not have a KTTW card -- just a groovy wristband emblazoned with the requisite amount of flair.

So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Now replay this scenario once FP+ comes into play and you're in line for Peter Pan. Imagine what that does to the wait (both FP and standby) when the Mickey posts stop responding!

Aside from the many valid concerns raised in earlier posts, I think the lack of a viable, readily available backup to the magicbands will prove to be the most distressing, and could prove to be their undoing. When a point of sale keypad goes down at Target, the cashier can always swipe your credit card themselves, or if that fails, just key in the card number. Neither of those backup steps is available once you put all your eggs in the magicband basket. And remember -- [insert Paul Frees here] -- there's no turning back now....

So, when the RFID readers go down (and they will -- that's natural), what does that do to the unlucky souls who dutifully made their FP+ reservations months in advance? And what does it do to the line while everything grinds to a halt while one CM after another tries the required next steps before contacting tech support?

I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Joe

parkhopping 03-06-2013 11:51 AM

I wish I could be optimistic, but given Disney's track record so far with new technology (website, app, etc.), I'm afraid your prognosis is correct. I'm reminded of my Dad's reaction to getting a new truck with power windows - he sighed heavily and said, "Just something else to break..."

dsneprincess 03-06-2013 11:54 AM

You are not alone. We had a few issues with the RDIF cards not reading on the touchpad during our stay as well. It was pretty random as to when you had to swipe card vs tap card. Sometimes one worked & other didn't. Sometimes tap needed pin & sometimes it didn't. I would NOT want to be anywhere near WDW when this first goes live; it is not going to be pretty. However, I am not a fan of MagicBand, nor do I want to decide what I want to ride or eat 180 minutes in advance. JMO

ghtx 03-06-2013 11:57 AM

All new technologies have glitches.

All of the arguments that OP made about MagicBands could have also applied to original FP when it was first introduced, or to KTTW cards. Those systems seem to work pretty fine.

All technologies occasionally don't work. Every so often I swipe my credit card and it can't be read. Cars have been around for more than 100 years, and still people's cars occasionally break down.

It's overly pessimistic to conclude, from one bad incident (which occurred during a trial period for a new technology, when kinks are to be expected), that the new technology is doomed to failure.

DizDaD7 03-06-2013 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

Just returned from a too-short trip to WDW. I have an Annual Pass, and stayed at Caribbean Beach with the dining plan added.

I was on my own for the first day (Friday), so I headed over early to Old Port Royale for breakfast around 7:15. The place was fairly deserted (though not for long) and only 2 registers were open.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.

By this time, I had a couple people behind me in line. Now, I'm holding my key well away from the touchpad and it lights up on its own. She tells me to enter my PIN, but it won't enter (the little keypad screen still said "Welcome" or something to that effect).

People in line behind me now shrug and sigh and move to the other line.

The cashier is embarassed at this point. I look at her screen and see that the system is now rebooting. She apologizes profusely, calls over two separate managers, and I go stand in the now ever-growing line for the other register. I wasn't irritated in the least -- stuff happens after all with point of sale registers even using debit/credit cards.

I was surprised to see how she was grilled by the managers -- "what keys did you touch?" "why is this screen showing?" -- I thought they were unnecessarily rough on her (especially since they were 3 feet away from the line to the other register).

Her system comes back up and she motions to me to come back. I laugh and say, "should I risk it?". She apologizes again, and I tell her not to sweat it. Still no response from the touchpad, so she takes my KTTW card and swipes it, and I'm on my way (after verifying that I in fact didn't accidentally use three counter service meals).

A minor inconvenience, but think about the implications here. In the amazing Tomorrowland magic-band future that Disney is envisioning, I would not have a KTTW card -- just a groovy wristband emblazoned with the requisite amount of flair.

So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Now replay this scenario once FP+ comes into play and you're in line for Peter Pan. Imagine what that does to the wait (both FP and standby) when the Mickey posts stop responding!

Aside from the many valid concerns raised in earlier posts, I think the lack of a viable, readily available backup to the magicbands will prove to be the most distressing, and could prove to be their undoing. When a point of sale keypad goes down at Target, the cashier can always swipe your credit card themselves, or if that fails, just key in the card number. Neither of those backup steps is available once you put all your eggs in the magicband basket. And remember -- [insert Paul Frees here] -- there's no turning back now....

So, when the RFID readers go down (and they will -- that's natural), what does that do to the unlucky souls who dutifully made their FP+ reservations months in advance? And what does it do to the line while everything grinds to a halt while one CM after another tries the required next steps before contacting tech support?

I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Joe


1st off:welcome:to the disboards.

2ndly. I think your point is spot on.....I'm hoping that it was just a bad day.....I know that's probably not the case, but let's for arguments sake, hope they have plan b, c, & d in place.

auntfrannie 03-06-2013 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghtx (Post 47717803)

All of the arguments that OP made about MagicBands could have also applied to original FP when it was first introduced, or to KTTW cards. Those systems seem to work pretty fine.

All technologies occasionally don't work. Every so often I swipe my credit card and it can't be read. Cars have been around for more than 100 years, and still people's cars occasionally break down.

So true! I was at the F&W festival last year and there were people waiting in long lines only to get to the front and when they tried to use their room card for the dining credits were told that the system wasn't working!

newdeal 03-06-2013 12:05 PM

they will get it worked out. Have you ever had to wait because the biometric scans didn't work or because the turnstiles wouldn't work? Well actually now that I think about it perhaps you have, and they scan your tickets bar code. Perhaps the magic bands will ahve bar codes just like the tickets. Although I find it very rare that this happens and mostly because the stripe has demagnetized

ManyMinnie 03-06-2013 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

Just returned from a too-short trip to WDW. I have an Annual Pass, and stayed at Caribbean Beach with the dining plan added.

I was on my own for the first day (Friday), so I headed over early to Old Port Royale for breakfast around 7:15. The place was fairly deserted (though not for long) and only 2 registers were open.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.

By this time, I had a couple people behind me in line. Now, I'm holding my key well away from the touchpad and it lights up on its own. She tells me to enter my PIN, but it won't enter (the little keypad screen still said "Welcome" or something to that effect).

People in line behind me now shrug and sigh and move to the other line.

The cashier is embarassed at this point. I look at her screen and see that the system is now rebooting. She apologizes profusely, calls over two separate managers, and I go stand in the now ever-growing line for the other register. I wasn't irritated in the least -- stuff happens after all with point of sale registers even using debit/credit cards.

I was surprised to see how she was grilled by the managers -- "what keys did you touch?" "why is this screen showing?" -- I thought they were unnecessarily rough on her (especially since they were 3 feet away from the line to the other register).

Her system comes back up and she motions to me to come back. I laugh and say, "should I risk it?". She apologizes again, and I tell her not to sweat it. Still no response from the touchpad, so she takes my KTTW card and swipes it, and I'm on my way (after verifying that I in fact didn't accidentally use three counter service meals).

A minor inconvenience, but think about the implications here. In the amazing Tomorrowland magic-band future that Disney is envisioning, I would not have a KTTW card -- just a groovy wristband emblazoned with the requisite amount of flair.

So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Now replay this scenario once FP+ comes into play and you're in line for Peter Pan. Imagine what that does to the wait (both FP and standby) when the Mickey posts stop responding!

Aside from the many valid concerns raised in earlier posts, I think the lack of a viable, readily available backup to the magicbands will prove to be the most distressing, and could prove to be their undoing. When a point of sale keypad goes down at Target, the cashier can always swipe your credit card themselves, or if that fails, just key in the card number. Neither of those backup steps is available once you put all your eggs in the magicband basket. And remember -- [insert Paul Frees here] -- there's no turning back now....

So, when the RFID readers go down (and they will -- that's natural), what does that do to the unlucky souls who dutifully made their FP+ reservations months in advance? And what does it do to the line while everything grinds to a halt while one CM after another tries the required next steps before contacting tech support?

I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Joe

Considering Disney's record with technology, you raise very valid points.

jenjordan 03-06-2013 12:33 PM

I agree. At least credit cards have a backup system in case the magnetic stripe fails, so I hope that the magic bands will have some kind of barcode that can be used in case of a technology breakdown.

sweetpea29488 03-06-2013 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

Just returned from a too-short trip to WDW. I have an Annual Pass, and stayed at Caribbean Beach with the dining plan added.

I was on my own for the first day (Friday), so I headed over early to Old Port Royale for breakfast around 7:15. The place was fairly deserted (though not for long) and only 2 registers were open.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.

By this time, I had a couple people behind me in line. Now, I'm holding my key well away from the touchpad and it lights up on its own. She tells me to enter my PIN, but it won't enter (the little keypad screen still said "Welcome" or something to that effect).

People in line behind me now shrug and sigh and move to the other line.

The cashier is embarassed at this point. I look at her screen and see that the system is now rebooting. She apologizes profusely, calls over two separate managers, and I go stand in the now ever-growing line for the other register. I wasn't irritated in the least -- stuff happens after all with point of sale registers even using debit/credit cards.

I was surprised to see how she was grilled by the managers -- "what keys did you touch?" "why is this screen showing?" -- I thought they were unnecessarily rough on her (especially since they were 3 feet away from the line to the other register).

Her system comes back up and she motions to me to come back. I laugh and say, "should I risk it?". She apologizes again, and I tell her not to sweat it. Still no response from the touchpad, so she takes my KTTW card and swipes it, and I'm on my way (after verifying that I in fact didn't accidentally use three counter service meals).

A minor inconvenience, but think about the implications here. In the amazing Tomorrowland magic-band future that Disney is envisioning, I would not have a KTTW card -- just a groovy wristband emblazoned with the requisite amount of flair.

So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Now replay this scenario once FP+ comes into play and you're in line for Peter Pan. Imagine what that does to the wait (both FP and standby) when the Mickey posts stop responding!

Aside from the many valid concerns raised in earlier posts, I think the lack of a viable, readily available backup to the magicbands will prove to be the most distressing, and could prove to be their undoing. When a point of sale keypad goes down at Target, the cashier can always swipe your credit card themselves, or if that fails, just key in the card number. Neither of those backup steps is available once you put all your eggs in the magicband basket. And remember -- [insert Paul Frees here] -- there's no turning back now....

So, when the RFID readers go down (and they will -- that's natural), what does that do to the unlucky souls who dutifully made their FP+ reservations months in advance? And what does it do to the line while everything grinds to a halt while one CM after another tries the required next steps before contacting tech support?

I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Joe

So you had to have a pin# even though you were using the dining plan and not charging? Just trying to figure this thing out. When we go I won't be putting a charge card on our account but we will have the CS dining plan. Will we need a pin# even though their won't be a credit card on the account?

mickeyluv'r 03-06-2013 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.


So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Under the old system- I have experienced errors a good number of times.

More than once, we had a problme with DDP, and had to use my cc. Then I had to wait in line at the resort's concerige desk to get the charges reversed.That's how they resolve it when your dining plan does not show up. It acn be quite time consuming. I imagine the new system will be the same.

Also, once I was in Epcot- I''ve posted this story before. It was an EMH day, and it was almost dinner time. Many times I've sued my own lanyard/ID holder withotu problems. That trip I had bought a WDW version. It broke. My ID was gone.

the middle of Epcot/WS is the worst place to have this happen. None of the WS CM's really had much of an idea. I finally talked to a Manager who told me my options, and let me use a phone. In short- if you lose your ID you can goto Guest RElations, or you can go to the concerige desk at your resort.

Going back to the resort would have meant missing my whole dinner and most of emh..so my only realisitc option was to hoof over to the GR in the back exit of Epcot. For the most part, the CM's were all directing me to go to my hotel,and when I pressed GR at the front of the park. By that point though, I was partway around the WS.

the GR booth only had one person,and the wait to get my ticket/KTTW card replaced was long- but mostly because there was only one person- and she was not in any rush, shall we say. The restaurant was actually pretty nice- even though I was half an hour late. (Luckily this was before no show fees!)

So yes, I hear your concerns. On one trip- we tried to put two cc on noe room for charging. It totally messed up everythign, and took multiple visits to get fixed. It was pretty time consuming.

Often though, when Disney messes up on a thign like that- they have offered me some small compensation in addition to reolving the issue. I'd prefer not to have the problem, but they usually make some effort to conpensate your aggravation, which is more than I can say for many companies these days.

larryz 03-06-2013 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Thanks for posting your experience.

I'm sensing that management is taking some heat over the less-than-stellar roll-out of the RFID-enabled system at WDW. Can any CM's comment on the extent of training they're receiving on how to cope with the changeover?

As for your concerns about proof of purchase, each band will have a unique ID number on it, which will doubtless be registered to your reservation account. They can probably pull up any information they might need from that.

GillianP1301 03-06-2013 12:58 PM

The OP's point about needing a backup plan is going to be key to a successful roll out of this technology. And the backup should be part of the testing that is going on, which clearly it's not. If a scanner is down (which will happen, it's technology), they need to be able to react to that with minimal negative impact to their customers. I'm seeing no evidence of it and anything I have seen them attempt to roll out from an IT perspective in the last little while, doesn't show evidence of being well thought out either. Their website alone is really not appropriate or acceptable for a company of the magnitute of Disney.

CuteAsMinnie 03-06-2013 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR864 (Post 47717682)
Been lurking for a while, especially in the last couple months; however, this is my first post.

Just returned from a too-short trip to WDW. I have an Annual Pass, and stayed at Caribbean Beach with the dining plan added.

I was on my own for the first day (Friday), so I headed over early to Old Port Royale for breakfast around 7:15. The place was fairly deserted (though not for long) and only 2 registers were open.

This was my first use of the KTTW RFID card to make a point-of-sale transaction (specifically to use my first counter service meal). After the young lady rang me up, I tapped the Mickey pad --- didn't light up. She touched a couple keys and asked me to try again -- I did -- didn't light up.

By this time, I had a couple people behind me in line. Now, I'm holding my key well away from the touchpad and it lights up on its own. She tells me to enter my PIN, but it won't enter (the little keypad screen still said "Welcome" or something to that effect).

People in line behind me now shrug and sigh and move to the other line.

The cashier is embarassed at this point. I look at her screen and see that the system is now rebooting. She apologizes profusely, calls over two separate managers, and I go stand in the now ever-growing line for the other register. I wasn't irritated in the least -- stuff happens after all with point of sale registers even using debit/credit cards.

I was surprised to see how she was grilled by the managers -- "what keys did you touch?" "why is this screen showing?" -- I thought they were unnecessarily rough on her (especially since they were 3 feet away from the line to the other register).

Her system comes back up and she motions to me to come back. I laugh and say, "should I risk it?". She apologizes again, and I tell her not to sweat it. Still no response from the touchpad, so she takes my KTTW card and swipes it, and I'm on my way (after verifying that I in fact didn't accidentally use three counter service meals).

A minor inconvenience, but think about the implications here. In the amazing Tomorrowland magic-band future that Disney is envisioning, I would not have a KTTW card -- just a groovy wristband emblazoned with the requisite amount of flair.

So now replay this scenario -- when the Mickey keypad goes on the blink (or in this case, off the blink) -- how do I prove that I'm on the dining plan? And how do I complete the transaction without shelling out cash or a credit card since there's no magstrip to scan from my nonresponsive (but pretty!) band. And what does this do to the poor schlubs in line behind me while multiple managers attempt to fix the issue (and grill the cashier CM) before shuttling me off to a different register.

Now replay this scenario once FP+ comes into play and you're in line for Peter Pan. Imagine what that does to the wait (both FP and standby) when the Mickey posts stop responding!

Aside from the many valid concerns raised in earlier posts, I think the lack of a viable, readily available backup to the magicbands will prove to be the most distressing, and could prove to be their undoing. When a point of sale keypad goes down at Target, the cashier can always swipe your credit card themselves, or if that fails, just key in the card number. Neither of those backup steps is available once you put all your eggs in the magicband basket. And remember -- [insert Paul Frees here] -- there's no turning back now....

So, when the RFID readers go down (and they will -- that's natural), what does that do to the unlucky souls who dutifully made their FP+ reservations months in advance? And what does it do to the line while everything grinds to a halt while one CM after another tries the required next steps before contacting tech support?

I have seen the future -- and it looks surly!

Joe

Thank you for sharing! I think you're spot on!

JR864 03-06-2013 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetpea29488 (Post 47718394)
So you had to have a pin# even though you were using the dining plan and not charging? Just trying to figure this thing out. When we go I won't be putting a charge card on our account but we will have the CS dining plan. Will we need a pin# even though their won't be a credit card on the account?

Yep, I had to enter the PIN for most times where I used the card for counter service or snack credits -- no requirement for table service though.

There was a credit card tied to the KTTW, but I never used the card for charging (it was my buddy's credit card).

Joe


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