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-   -   DVC is getting out of controle with point increases (http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2667402)

Mr. Tight 02-27-2011 09:29 PM

DVC is getting out of controle with point increases
 
If Disney continues to increase the points needed to stay at the resorts I'm gonna end up selling and paying out of pocket and staying in a studio over at the value resorts.I'm being forced to choose a shorter vacation now or stay in studios instead of a 1 bedroom.We used to be able to do 2 vacations of 5 days at SSR in a 1 bedroom for around 200 points.Now they raised the points to stay every year since we've purchased DVC.My 2 vacations per year at SSR now costs more than the 200 points to stay in a 1 bedroom both times.Ive settled for a studio for out may trips and a 1 bedroom for out October trips.At this rate I'm gonna be stuck with a studio all the time if i want the 5 day vacations.Disney's excuse to my wife and I was that there's cheaper value priced rooms been added to AKV to compensate the rise at SSR and other resorts. This does nothing for me.I feel there slowly pulling the old bait and switch on us. And If I came out of pocket for the value resorts they will even give me free food most of the time!. DVC members get nada.Just a fancy monthly payment to be in the club.Does anyone else feel the same way?

Mr.Tight
Villain in Training

Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:55 pm
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disneygal922'sboy 02-27-2011 09:42 PM

I'd like to agree with you, but my wife and I have not been effected by either of the recent point changes. We own at BLT and our vacationing hasn't been forced to change....yet ;)

Sandisw 02-27-2011 09:45 PM

As frustrating as it is for some, for others, the changes helped. The good news is that the 2012 points charts were unchanged and hopefully, another adjustment won't be necessary for years.

But, if rooms at DVC resorts were going unused on weekends and difficult to get on weekdays, then I believe they had an obligation to adjust. Remember, while things went up for some rooms and days, they went down elsewhere.

vicki_c 02-27-2011 09:45 PM

It is my understanding that there have been only 3 point reallocations in the entire history of DVC - in the 90s, and now 2010 and 2011. It's just your bad luck that it's impacted you negatively, for some the changes have resulted in stays that cost less. Any point increases for particular dates, seasons, days of the week, etc. are being offset by reductions somewhere else.

adminjedi 02-27-2011 09:50 PM

There is no bait and switch, it is in your contract that you signed on nearly every page. :surfweb:

They aren't increasing the points to stay at the resorts....they are redistributing the points within the resort. And, point distribution at other resorts has nothing to do with SSR point distribution.

You may be personally experiencing an increase in points required for your stay in a 1 bdrm, but in order for that to occur other people are experiencing a decrease in points required for their stay. You should look for different time of year to see if you can regain your 5 days in a 1bdrm or, different days of week.

SamSam 02-27-2011 09:52 PM

The point reallocation didn't hurt us because we usually stay at least a week, sometimes 2, and we don't move on weekends. We're still very happy with our DVC membership.

Chuck S 02-27-2011 09:55 PM

I wouldn't call 3 point reallocations in nearly 20 years of DVC as out of control. And as previous posters said, if there is a substantial pattern of imbalance for reserved nights DVC is somewhat obliged to try to correct the situation. The means to do that is through point reallocations, instituting minimum stay requirements, or suspending banking and borrowing. Of those options, a reallocation is the easiest to live with.

Mr. Tight 02-27-2011 10:53 PM

Since 2007, 2 out of the last 4 years or our membership they have increased points needed per night at SSR.A jump from 25 points per night for a 1 bedroom in May to 31 is out of control in a 2 year span.Part of this is my bad luck on the timing of my DVC purchase but what is to stop them from getting raise happy cause they just feel like it for whatever reason.We were sold on DVC on the promise that the point values would never increase per day to stay.I guess we were misinformed.At this rate 1 bedrooms are gonna be in the 40-50 point range in 10-20 years.The value of the DVC is decreasing for us with each point increase.Lets hope there done for a while with adjustments.

Sammie 02-27-2011 11:11 PM

Sadly you learned the hard way that what a DVC sales agent will promise you, is not always the truth.

tjkraz 02-27-2011 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Tight (Post 40121037)
Since 2007, 2 out of the last 4 years or our membership they have increased points needed per night at SSR.A jump from 25 points per night for a 1 bedroom in May to 31 is out of control in a 2 year span.Part of this is my bad luck on the timing of my DVC purchase but what is to stop them from getting raise happy cause they just feel like it for whatever reason.We were sold on DVC on the promise that the point values would never increase per day to stay.I guess we were misinformed.At this rate 1 bedrooms are gonna be in the 40-50 point range in 10-20 years.The value of the DVC is decreasing for us with each point increase.Lets hope there done for a while with adjustments.

You misunderstand what has happened.

Legally DVC cannot arbitrarily increase any point costs across the board. The total points in any given resort (which is the number of points required to book EVERY villa for EVERY night of the year) cannot change.

However what DVC can do--and some would say they have a fiduciary responsibility to do--is rebalance the points periodically so that the charts continue to be representative of member demand.

The vast majority of the changes in 2010 and 2011 were designed to rebalance weekdays and weekends. Over the last 15 or so years, the point charts have been set so that weekends cost 2-2.5 times more than a weekday. At one time, that disparity was apparently required in order to keep members from flooding the resorts on weekends, thus leaving weekday nights open.

But over time, more and more people continued to use DVC points exclusively for weekday stays. Resorts would sit half empty on weekends as members either stuck to the Sunday-Thursday night pattern or paid cash for their weekend nights.

If you look at the charts, what you will see is that weekday prices were increased while weekends decreased. Right now they are pretty close to equal in cost in many instances.

Until DVC decides to make changes to the seasons (entirely likely at some point) there really isn't much more they can do to negatively impact the cost of weekday trips. In fact, it's possible that weekdays will someday go back down in cost as member habits change again.

Mr. Tight 02-27-2011 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjkraz (Post 40121187)
You misunderstand what has happened.

Legally DVC cannot arbitrarily increase any point costs across the board. The total points in any given resort (which is the number of points required to book EVERY villa for EVERY night of the year) cannot change.

However what DVC can do--and some would say they have a fiduciary responsibility to do--is rebalance the points periodically so that the charts continue to be representative of member demand.

The vast majority of the changes in 2010 and 2011 were designed to rebalance weekdays and weekends. Over the last 15 or so years, the point charts have been set so that weekends cost 2-2.5 times more than a weekday. At one time, that disparity was apparently required in order to keep members from flooding the resorts on weekends, thus leaving weekday nights open.

But over time, more and more people continued to use DVC points exclusively for weekday stays. Resorts would sit half empty on weekends as members either stuck to the Sunday-Thursday night pattern or paid cash for their weekend nights.

If you look at the charts, what you will see is that weekday prices were increased while weekends decreased. Right now they are pretty close to equal in cost in many instances.

Until DVC decides to make changes to the seasons (entirely likely at some point) there really isn't much more they can do to negatively impact the cost of weekday trips. In fact, it's possible that weekdays will someday go back down in cost as member habits change again.


Thank you for the brake down of the new point system.I know it can be confusing and subject to change.I'm still getting used to the adjustment in my scheduling of reservations.I'm just gonna have to get even more creative with my planning and go at different times than I'm accustom too.I'm not a huge fan of the studios rooms anymore but i guess I'm gonna be seeing more of them in the years to come.200 points only goes so far now when we like to vacation twice a year 5 days at a time. Disney is a sport.You gotta have a good game plan and practice to be good at it. LOL!

SanDeeKath 02-28-2011 12:10 AM

Since DH and I both work, we find that the reallocation of points has actually HELPED us (we can usually on stay Fri, Sat and maybe Sun nites)! Disney cannot change the total points -- they can just require more points on some days (and balance it with less points on other days). Overall the net change is 0.

We have been happy with the changes for 2010 and 2011....

Katherine

Mr. Tight 02-28-2011 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SanDeeKath (Post 40121483)
Since DH and I both work, we find that the reallocation of points has actually HELPED us (we can usually on stay Fri, Sat and maybe Sun nites)! Disney cannot change the total points -- they can just require more points on some days (and balance it with less points on other days). Overall the net change is 0.

We have been happy with the changes for 2010 and 2011....

Katherine

We've been the Sun-Thurs vacationer so this new reallocation has changed the way and times we can stay.I have to rethink all my trips instead of the usual times .We like our 1 bedroom! I just sleep better in a king bed cause im a tall guy and the extra room to stretch out is better than my real home.Weekend visitors must be thrilled with the changes. I don't want to get into the borrowing points game year to year or purchase more points.So were gonna adjust accordingly but it stings a little cause jobs and life often dictates our options in booking reservations.

Brandis 02-28-2011 03:41 AM

I'm also a rather new member (Sept. 2009) but my guide was very up front with how the point systems work, telling me that while they were fixed in total that they still could change over the course of a year.

I think that's a great system, while it allows Disney to be flexible about changing booking patterns it still makes sure the value of our points (for vacation use) does not diminish.

I bought a (at that time) minimum contract of 160 points and I'm quite happy what I was able to book with those points until now (of course some banking and borrowing was needed, but still...)

2010: 4 nights Value Studio (Savannah view) at AKL, 7 nights 2BR at VWL
2011: 3 nights Standard View Studio at AKV, 3 nights Ocean View Inn Room at VB and 4 nights 3BR Grand Villa at OKW.

Carl'n'Ellie'sDad 02-28-2011 05:10 AM

Count our family as negatively impacted by the changes, but understanding why they were made. We took advantage of the earlier system in 2006 and 07, staying in a studio on points for 2 Sun through Thurs, and paying cash for Fri and Sat. Didn't do WDW in 08 due to the birth of DD, which allowed us to do a 1 BR the same way in 09.

I can remember that parking was tight in the grandstand section every day except Friday and Saturday night, when the lot was about half empty. Obviously, the point structure was creating some incentives which were leading the resort to be used in a less than efficient way -- a half empty resort on a weekend?

The next change that might take place is in pricing 1BRs vs 2BRs. When trying to plan this year's trip, I noticed that split staying in a studio for 6 nights and a 2BR for 6 was cheaper in points than our previous 10 nights in 1BR stay. This also no longer requires us to pay for the weekend nights. When you add in that the "2BR" is a Treehouse, it seemed the smart move. With two little ones the studio will be doable, though that will change for us in a few years. But we are excited to use what I feel is a luxury bargain in the Treehouses.


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