Disney's $1 billion dollar bet on magical wristband - Wired

wallrock · Mar 30, 2015

jade1 said:
But why would you reduce the costs when it's packed now.

Couldn't you do that when the doomsday hits?

That's a different subject. The topic was figuring out how to encourage those on limited budgets to get in the parks. To your point around the crowds...Disney doesn't have to cater to those on a limited budget at present because they don't need them, but if you want them in the cost is going to have to come down.

jade1 · Mar 30, 2015

wallrock said:
I don't recall making that assumption, .

You didn't. Planogirl did.

LL assumed that is only first time visitors-which I don't believe. I think all visitors to WDW want that-some more than others.

Planogirl said:
They want the characters and classic rides and so on and THAT is what is selling.s.

jade1 said:
Exactly, the rest is just noise for the most part.

lockedoutlogic said:
True...if the "unending" supply of first time visitors doesn't run out...

jade1 said:
With 4 Million newborns a year in just America (128 Million WW)-probably won't run out.

Plus who said only first timers want that.

lockedoutlogic said:
Where are they getting their jobs/money from to go to wdw?

I get this alot...20th century assumptions

jade1 said:
And that's assuming only first timers want the characters and classic rides.

jade1 · Mar 30, 2015

wallrock said:
That's a different subject. The topic was figuring out how to encourage those on limited budgets to get in the parks.

It was? When?

wallrock said:
To your point around the crowds...Disney doesn't have to cater to those on a limited budget at present because they don't need them, but if you want them in the cost is going to have to come down.

Exactly-but you would do that now? Again-why not wait?

wallrock · Mar 30, 2015

jade1 said:
It was? When?

I was responding to your inquiry around getting new faces with limited funds in the parks, not addressing the crowd level in the parks.

jade1 said:
Exactly-but you would do that now? Again-why not wait?

I guess I'm missing what you're question is. Our back and forth has been around getting people on limited budgets in the parks. And I don't know what you're referring to with waiting.

jade1 · Mar 30, 2015

you said:

wallrock said:
If you tell someone on a limited budget that they can save upwards of 20K by using FastPass+ they may decide to take a vacation elsewhere after they've emerged from their fainting spell.

According to Lake Travis that 'savings' is spread across multiple trips over multiple years. What about the folks that their trip is a once in a lifetime? Sorry, but the saving 20 grand isn't exactly a selling point.

And yes, jobs are (should be) a default. The problem today is that they are few and far between. I work in the tech sector and for every 20-something that shows up fresh out of college their are a hundred others from overseas that will take the job at half the rate, and they have experience. Now that will eventually change when the offshore salaries start to creep up to US levels (it's getting pretty close actually when you peel away the cultural membranes), but it won't change enough where people can consider the value of FastPass+. They'll be more concerned about funding the ticket just to get in the park.

I said:

jade1 said:
But again-why is there an assumption that only first time visitors (and ones with no jobs) want "characters and classic rides"? That ends it right there for me.

Meaning why just address the limited budget, FP+ can save money for others as well like LT.

wallrock said:
I was responding to your inquiry around getting new faces with limited funds in the parks, not addressing the crowd level in the parks.

I guess I'm missing what you're question is. Our back and forth has been around getting people on limited budgets in the parks. And I don't know what you're referring to with waiting.

But regardless, lets start a new conversation of just

How to get limited budget guests to WDW.

Lower the price.

But why do it before you need to?

.

wallrock · Mar 30, 2015

jade1 said:
But regardless, lets start a new conversation of just

How to get limited budget guests to WDW.

Lower the price.

But why do it before you need to?.

That's the key - I don't need to. From a Disney perspective I'm not interested in those folks because they aren't going to leave the parks with plenty of those shiny blue bags with Cinderella's Castle on the side filled to the brim with low grade sweatshop material.

But if we want to get those folks in and we can't lower the price it's going to take a lot more than a FastPass to get them in. People who are on limited budgets are going to count every nickel, dime and quarter they spend, so if it's a 'free' item like a FastPass it's not going to factor into their decision on whether to come or not.

To get them in it is really going to boil down to money because that's what they - the guest in this demographic - are most concerned with.

Planogirl · Mar 30, 2015

I said earlier that classic rides and so on were selling the parks to people. I said nothing about low income and stagnant salaries at that point and I don't see how that even be tied to my later comment. Where did that assumption come from?

People were later commenting that income was up and more people were coming to the parks. It's also clear that Disney is working on ways to get more money from people. What I said was "That aside, salaries have been stagnant for a long time now so this notion that people somehow have more disposable income doesn't add up. Prices have certainly gone up everywhere and yet supposedly there is a wage problem." I see that some people did get my point.

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

Planogirl said:
I said earlier that classic rides and so on were selling the parks to people. I said nothing about low income and stagnant salaries at that point and I don't see how that even be tied to my later comment. Where did that assumption come from?

Exactly-from L Logic (maybe inadvertently but none the less), and I've been fighting it ever since.

Planogirl said:
People were later commenting that income was up and more people were coming to the parks. It's also clear that Disney is working on ways to get more money from people. What I said was "That aside, salaries have been stagnant for a long time now so this notion that people somehow have more disposable income doesn't add up. Prices have certainly gone up everywhere and yet supposedly there is a wage problem." I see that some people did get my point.

Yea I missed that, so you were saying there "IS" plenty of money. So why lower prices at WDW, when everything else is going up? I agree.

Planogirl · Mar 31, 2015

jade1 said:
Exactly-from L Logic (maybe inadvertently but none the less), and I've been fighting it ever since.

Yea I missed that, so you were saying there "IS" plenty of money. So why lower prices at WDW, when everything else is going up? I agree.

You are close to my meaning.

I said that prices are going up and salaries aren't so therefore it would seem logical that a trip to WDW should be more difficult for many people. I can't see WDW lowering prices though unless something catastrophic happens.

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

wallrock said:
That's the key - I don't need to. From a Disney perspective I'm not interested in those folks because they aren't going to leave the parks with plenty of those shiny blue bags with Cinderella's Castle on the side filled to the brim with low grade sweatshop material.

But if we want to get those folks in and we can't lower the price it's going to take a lot more than a FastPass to get them in. People who are on limited budgets are going to count every nickel, dime and quarter they spend, so if it's a 'free' item like a FastPass it's not going to factor into their decision on whether to come or not.

To get them in it is really going to boil down to money because that's what they - the guest in this demographic - are most concerned with.

Why couldn't you lower the price?

If doomsday hits, excuse me-when doomsday hits, dropping the price will get them in, and the unaffected ones as well.

FP- won't help either.

But with FP+ you could offer 8 for deluxe, 6 mod 4 for everyone else similar to free dining, or with free dining.

Or just 8 for Sept/Oct (example) for everyone. If needed can offer multiple parks or rerides, or no tiers etc.

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

Planogirl said:
You are close to my meaning.

I said that prices are going up and salaries aren't so therefore it would seem logical that a trip to WDW should be more difficult for many people. I can't see WDW lowering prices though unless something catastrophic happens.

I'm close sorry. So when you say "prices are up EVERYWHERE"-do you mean everywhere, or everywhere in WDW?

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

Planogirl said:
Prices have certainly gone up everywhere and yet supposedly there is a wage problem.

Actually not sure on this either, why is it salaries are stagnant, but then "supposedly" a wage problem?

Cormoran · Mar 31, 2015

Planogirl said:
You are close to my meaning.

I said that prices are going up and salaries aren't so therefore it would seem logical that a trip to WDW should be more difficult for many people. I can't see WDW lowering prices though unless something catastrophic happens.

It would be logical if most of our society didn't live on credit cards and from paycheck to paycheck. IMO, our country is filled with people who are into immediate gratification. Saving money is not in their vocabularies.

clsteve · Mar 31, 2015

Planogirl said:
Did you notice that LT was only spending part of his time at the Disney parks? It's not all going to Disney.

lockedoutlogic said:
Because consumer debt is rampant...forming a bubble...that will burst and the bill will come due.

Disney has expertly positioned itself to have their parks essentially wiped out by it...as what's left of the "middle class" will be destroyed and that is the core Disney park clientele..

Planogirl, you're on to something interesting

Take the saving 20K part out of Lake's thread. It's the spending time and money off property that's key.

And Jade, you've used the same strategy as Lake - sched your FPs in a tight window so you, like Lake and others, can go somewhere else and do other things. That strategy seems to be coming up a lot.

That's not the scenario they drew up on the whiteboard and sold to the Board. Keeping guests on-property and spending while dropping expense was the deal.

Right now, economy booming, lots of first-timers, no problem.

But converting more to DVC while raising prices and pushing AP's lower down the totem pole....

It's their own bubble, in some ways.

Now, if they had plenty of capacity, it wouldn't be a potentially big issue - get the multi-stay and repeats out of the Park after their rides so they can (hopefully) go back to the Resorts and spend money there, while freeing up Park capacity to bring more into the Parks (like first-timers) to spend money in-Park. A larger portion of guests grabbing that sought after capacity and then heading out off Property.....

I don't know. Nobody's tried exactly this type of thing before. But, it's always a risk expecting humans to do anything you planned on them doing. Central Fla is gaining so many new things to do - and not just Universal. Things like the Eye, the Vertical 'coaster, etc., their infrastructure and expense line really isn't set up for just being home base for guests to go do other things. It's an interesting thing you bring up...

lockedoutlogic · Mar 31, 2015

clsteve said:
I don't know. Nobody's tried exactly this type of thing before. But, it's always a risk expecting humans to do anything you planned on them doing. Central Fla is gaining so many new things to do - and not just Universal. Things like the Eye, the Vertical 'coaster, etc., their infrastructure and expense line really isn't set up for just being home base for guests to go do other things. It's an interesting thing you bring up...

No illusions...it's always been the brand that tied it all together and made the parks a ridiculous success. That is still the model.

The difference now is they're taking that model for granted and they are running parks differently - like the other divisions.

They've Convinced themselves that they will always have that -
No matter what...and now the parks are run IP based. As evidenced by the rape of Norway...it doesn't matter if you slap paint on an old ride - as long as you put a known face on it. Midway mania is much the same... As is whatever we "think" we're getting at animal kingdom.

CMB thinks it's not about the ride, the feel, gravity...they'll take whatever as long as they pipe show tunes over the speakers...

In a way...they're right. That's the way to cheap profits...

But as more entertainment becomes available at our fingertips daily and the world becomes smaller...
Maybe gravity again will be more exciting? The things you can't get down the street...

Just a theory/something to watch out for...

Or you can assume that Peter pans flight will have a 1 hour wait forever...
No way to know.

wallrock · Mar 31, 2015

jade1 said:
Why couldn't you lower the price?

If doomsday hits, excuse me-when doomsday hits, dropping the price will get them in, and the unaffected ones as well.

FP- won't help either.

But with FP+ you could offer 8 for deluxe, 6 mod 4 for everyone else similar to free dining, or with free dining.

Or just 8 for Sept/Oct (example) for everyone. If needed can offer multiple parks or rerides, or no tiers etc.

From an earlier exchange I mentioned that a price reduction at present isn't going to happen, so it's more or less off the table. If it were on the table that would be the single factor in motivating that demographic into the parks.

Fast passes, whether they are the old version or new won't be a factor in their consideration because it's not a cost to them. As others have pointed out the savings illustrated by lake travis are for multi-trip visitors and those that do more in Orlando. And telling someone with limited funds that they can save 20K on fast passes isn't going to make them ponder the decision with any greater degree. As I said, you lost that demographic when you put a five figure value in front of them.

As for your doomsday scenario... Those less fortunate and those impacted will have other things besides Disney on their minds when that happens.

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

wallrock said:
As for your doomsday scenario... Those less fortunate and those impacted will have other things besides Disney on their minds when that happens.

I far away from the one claiming that.

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

wallrock said:
Fast passes, whether they are the old version or new won't be a factor in their consideration because it's not a cost to them.

I disagree-with the group "on the fence" anyway. Many folks in a recession (and especially slow times of the year -like free dining, actually far from free) have money but are afraid to spend it-additional FP+'s can be used to entice.

wallrock said:
As others have pointed out the savings illustrated by lake travis are for multi-trip visitors and those that do more in Orlando. And telling someone with limited funds that they can save 20K on fast passes isn't going to make them ponder the decision with any greater degree. As I said, you lost that demographic when you put a five figure value in front of them.

Agreed, but it's still "one group" that can save money with FP+, that is all I'm saying.

clsteve · Mar 31, 2015

lockedoutlogic said:
But as more entertainment becomes available at our fingertips daily and the world becomes smaller...
Maybe gravity again will be more exciting? The things you can't get down the street...

Just a theory/something to watch out for...

Or you can assume that Peter pans flight will have a 1 hour wait forever...
No way to know.

Nah, as soon as the wait gets down to 45 minutes, that live action Peter Pan movie will go straight into production - Hook 2 -The Crocodile Awakens....

jade1 · Mar 31, 2015

wallrock said:
From an earlier exchange I mentioned that a price reduction at present isn't going to happen, so it's more or less off the table. If it were on the table that would be the single factor in motivating that demographic into the parks.

That's interesting-some on here are saying the worst mistake WDW has made was constantly raising prices 11 years-yet it's off the table for you. Hmm.

And again-I agree-they can always lower prices if "needed".

Disney's $1 billion dollar bet on magical wristband - Wired

Mouseketeer

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

Mouseketeer

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

Mouseketeer

I feel the nerd in me stirring

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

I feel the nerd in me stirring

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

Registered

"It takes a very long time to become young..."

DIS Veteran

Mouseketeer

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

"It takes a very long time to become young..."

I spend half my money on WDW, and waste the rest.

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