Who is refusing Common Core tests for 3rd-8th graders?

jodifla · Mar 2, 2015

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles...ing-scores-plummet-in-common-core-assessments

Minnesota Reading Scores Plummet in Common Core Assessments
The results of Minnesota's first Common Core-aligned tests showed a sharp decrease in reading scores.

Students in Minnesota scored significantly lower in reading when the state issued its first set of assessments aligned with college-and-career readiness standards in the 2012-13 school year.

While students' scores overall only dropped slightly in mathematics, every grade showed a noticeable drop in reading scores, according to the 2013 Minnesota Comprehensive Assessment scores released Monday. Statewide, the number of students who scored as "proficient" in reading dropped from 76 percent in 2012 to 58 percent in 2013. Mathematics proficiency scores dropped from 62 percent to 61 percent.

While all grades experienced sharp decreases in reading proficiency, one of the largest changes in the scores came from third-grade reading results. In 2012, 80 percent of third-graders tested as proficient in reading, but with the new assessments last year, only 57 percent met that benchmark.

"It's important to look at today's tests results for what they are: a snapshot in time that tells us how students are doing in mastering our state standards," Education Commissioner Brenda Cassellius said in a statement. "What is needed now is to focus our efforts and stop moving the goal posts so teachers and students have a consistent target to hit."

undertheradar · Mar 2, 2015

To those who are against CC, what is your cost effective solution to test students nationwide on material learned? What is your cost effective solution to design and employ a standard for learning that can be measured within all 50 states?

Gumbo4x4 · Mar 2, 2015

I have no issues with it. Around here, nobody teaches "to the test" though. They teach the material in a traditional manner & let the test results speak for themselves. Not surprisingly, we still have numerous kids score "advanced".

JanaDee · Mar 2, 2015

mnrose said:
Minnesota is not part of Common Core...I think because our state's standards already exceeded those of Common Core. So, it's not like Common Core sets impossibly high standards or anything. Might seem high to those states who were already behind, but it's pretty much "status quo" here in Minnesota. All this discussion got me wondering whether there was some new testing this year, and there is not for us. Same old same old.

MN adopted the CC reading standards only.

nugov2 · Mar 2, 2015

Gumbo4x4 said:
I have no issues with it. Around here, nobody teaches "to the test" though. They teach the material in a traditional manner & let the test results speak for themselves. Not surprisingly, we still have numerous kids score "advanced".

I think where the big issue lies is people are shocked to see how far behind their schools/districts are and it is shining a light on this issue. The problem with many schools and the way they teach are widening the gap and that isn't just in low income areas. There are whole states that are really going about it the wrong way and it is easier to blame the government rather than also looking into how they can do things better. They are hiding their head in the sand. I'd be furious too if my district spent weeks teaching to a test. That is ridiculous that they think that is a good idea especially when it continues to not produce any better results. Until that changes for some areas they wil continue to fail with or without parcc. These schools teaching to the test were doing that long before parcc was around so blaming the test for that is silly. I think cc/parcc roll out is showing many parents the harsh reality of being in a school district that does the bare minimum. Let's buy the curriculum in a box, lets teach to the test and not create innovative lessons, lets threaten students that we will lose our jobs. These are all examples of poor decision making by both administrators and teachers and cannot be blamed on testing or standards. It also cannot be blamed on money. It takes a lot of time to write your own curriculum, but not a lot of money. I don't blame parents for being upset, but they are not holding everyone who is contributing to tje issue responsible. Opt into change in your district and holding administration and teachers to higher standards instead of opting out and blaming a test for the issues in your school. The testing is not great, but pretending that these issues in some of these districts don't run much deeper is just putting blinders on. If this wasn't the case there wouldn't be so many districts still thriving. I'm still not saying parcc is great or that the government doesn't need to put kids first and agendas of big corporations second, but I just think that other reasons schools are failing need to be recognized too.

Colleen27 · Mar 2, 2015

nugov2 said:
I think where the big issue lies is people are shocked to see how far behind their schools/districts are and it is shining a light on this issue. The problem with many schools and the way they teach are widening the gap and that isn't just in low income areas. There are whole states that are really going about it the wrong way and it is easier to blame the government rather than also looking into how they can do things better. They are hiding their head in the sand. I'd be furious too if my district spent weeks teaching to a test. That is ridiculous that they think that is a good idea especially when it continues to not produce any better results. Until that changes for some areas they wil continue to fail with or without parcc. These schools teaching to the test were doing that long before parcc was around so blaming the test for that is silly.

That isn't what I've seen at all. Our district is fairly well regarded and almost all our grads go on to college, some of them to highly selective schools, despite a low enough income profile to be a Title I district. But as the testing has gotten higher stakes the emphasis on test readiness has become a more and more dominant feature of the whole system. What I'm seeing isn't a light shining on existing failures, it is attempts from on high to fix something that wasn't broken and making one heck of a mess in the process.

dismomtfj · Mar 2, 2015

Everyone talks about testing "back in the day" but what they fail to realize is that back then, testing was tied to achieving potential, not whether or not you passed to the next grade. Like most private schools now, testing was used to evaluate a child's actual grade performance against ability/knowledge level.

Teachers unions complained that you couldn't fire teachers without measurable basis applied to all, thus testing became less about the student and more about the teacher. Then parents/unions/etc. complained that the wrong things were tested, or federal money was tied to a test so another layer was added.

Oh...and we have to hire administrators and personnel to handle all this...

So fast forward to the present day when most (note I said most, not ALL) school districts spend more money on bureaucracy and teachers focus more on testing (because the Unions who are supposed to make their lives easier pushed for it), and "no child left behind" turns into "every child left behind" because the actual welfare of the student is a distant 3rd or 4th priority to most districts (notice I said DISTRICT, NOT TEACHER).

Given the choice, I would opt out because more testing is not the answer to our children's inability to learn and achieve.

nugov2 · Mar 2, 2015

Colleen27 said:
That isn't what I've seen at all. Our district is fairly well regarded and almost all our grads go on to college, some of them to highly selective schools, despite a low enough income profile to be a Title I district. But as the testing has gotten higher stakes the emphasis on test readiness has become a more and more dominant feature of the whole system. What I'm seeing isn't a light shining on existing failures, it is attempts from on high to fix something that wasn't broken and making one heck of a mess in the process.

I respectfully disagree. Each state decides how high stakes the test are. Not all states use it to decide if a test means you pass or fail. I also IME see minimal difference here in testing now vs 14 years ago. It was still a state test with multiple district mandated testing. Yes PARCC is longer (and unnecessary so IMO), but if you don't waste 80+ instructional days teaching to it the difference isn't as significant. Teaching to the test doesn't work so when a district decides to do that they are setting themselves up to fail. That is their decision and IMO a failure on the district's part. If it was an example of how all schools are emphasizing test readiness, then all schools would be seeing these issues and parents everywhere would be upset. Even in all of the upset posts and articles I see online I see tons of parents and teachers saying we don't do that here and our kids are doing great. If the system wasn't broken before why so many issues...because each state could pick a test that fit their high or low standards. Now all schools are being held to the same standards and the light is shining on how ill prepared many schools/districts/states are. Those schools need to stop and reevaluate their methods and the government needs to recognize their mistakes in the roll out. Almost like a clean slate. If states and districts would have been diligent in preparing for the changes much of this wouldn't be the case as well as if the government would have given more time with a reasonable time table for all areas to complete the change a lot of this could have been avoided. Now in the areas ill prepared they want to point fingers and place blame and the government wants to put their heads down and push forward full steam ahead. Hopefully for the sake of our children everyone in a position of power will stop and acknowledge their role in this mess and it will slowly be fixed. It still IMO shows the sad state of affairs in many states/districts and schools across this country.

IndyRnRfan · Mar 2, 2015

What I find interesting is our state and I pressume many others is they are huge on data. Well, come to find out, many districts in my state will not hold any child back in any grade for failing their classes or the ISTEP. Data says that retaining kids back does not help them at all. WTH, so let's pass children on that can't read at grade level or pass most or all classes. How does this make since? I have a few friends in education and one had a 6 th grader who missed 30 plus days of school and failed every course at the end of each semester plus the ISTEP and the school passed them right on to 7 th grade.

IDoDis · Mar 2, 2015

Today was the first day of PARCC testing here. Students at schools across the state walked out. Most students sat for the first day of testing, but the walk-outs still made national news. I said this before and I'll say it again -- this testing is a big deal here. This state is doing things with graduation that many other states haven't implemented yet.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/mexico-students-planning-walkouts-tests-29324819

TaylorEar · Mar 3, 2015

I've been watching this thread with great interest, as I'm preparing to student teach in the fall. I live in Texas, one of the few states that has not officially adopted common core, but still heavily relies on its own standardized tests (STAAR testing). All of my classes have field observation/practicum requirements. I switched my content area, so I have had the opportunity to observe in several different districts across the spectrum; multiple content areas, urban/suburbs, high-performing/low-performing, elementary-high school. Every single classroom that I have observed (with the exception of the "specials" classes - art/music/theatre) spent a vast majority of the time "teaching to the test". Some teachers were a little more creative about how they went about it, and some just plain said "I'm teaching you how to pass the test". Every single teacher told me they wished they didn't have to spend so much time on test-prep strategies and trying to teach their students how to properly word the correct answers (as opposed to how to reach the correct answer). When I observe I am supposed to critique the classroom/teacher according to how well they portray/implement the teaching methods that we study in our classes. What I have discovered is that the ideal teaching-world that my textbooks portray does not exist. The ideal methods, learning strategies, and evidence-based practices that I am being taught to implement don't really fit in to the realities that exist in the classrooms, due to the one-size-fits-all end "goal" that a culture of standardized testing creates.

nugov2 · Mar 3, 2015

IDoDis said:
Today was the first day of PARCC testing here. Students at schools across the state walked out. Most students sat for the first day of testing, but the walk-outs still made national news. I said this before and I'll say it again -- this testing is a big deal here. This state is doing things with graduation that many other states haven't implemented yet.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/mexico-students-planning-walkouts-tests-29324819

From an article about the walkout you posted:

Many of the students said they'd refuse to take the PARCC test at all. Others said while they did choose to walkout and make a point, they didn't formally opt out.

MOST STUDENTS TAKE TEST

However, the vast majority of students stayed in their classrooms, and many of them say the students who protested were a distraction.

Miramontes said he didn't get what the big deal was, and didn't want to risk not getting a diploma, the chance other students are taking by choosing not to tests.

"That should be consequence. Honestly it's not that bad; it was just seven questions. The hardest part was just analyzing the essay," Miramontes said.

For Albuquerque Public Schools, 1,730 students have opted out

http://www.kob.com/article/stories/s3721534.shtml#.VPWsvPnF-cI

1700 students out of over 88,000 students or 2% of students opted out of PARCC.

I do think the ABC version sounds more sensational and certainly sells on National news much better than saying: This just in, 2% of students in New Mexico are refusing/opting out of parcc testing. My guess is that many students opted out of their standardized testing in the past, but we didn't hear about it b/c there previous test wasn't the new Measles or Ebola outbreak story new outlets are trying to sell.

I do think it is a big deal that a state is tying it to graduation though. I don't blame anyone for being upset about that issue. I am curious how is that possible though, if results aren't available until October?

nugov2 · Mar 3, 2015

TaylorEar said:
I've been watching this thread with great interest, as I'm preparing to student teach in the fall. I live in Texas, one of the few states that has not officially adopted common core, but still heavily relies on its own standardized tests (STAAR testing). All of my classes have field observation/practicum requirements. I switched my content area, so I have had the opportunity to observe in several different districts across the spectrum; multiple content areas, urban/suburbs, high-performing/low-performing, elementary-high school. Every single classroom that I have observed (with the exception of the "specials" classes - art/music/theatre) spent a vast majority of the time "teaching to the test". Some teachers were a little more creative about how they went about it, and some just plain said "I'm teaching you how to pass the test". Every single teacher told me they wished they didn't have to spend so much time on test-prep strategies and trying to teach their students how to properly word the correct answers (as opposed to how to reach the correct answer). When I observe I am supposed to critique the classroom/teacher according to how well they portray/implement the teaching methods that we study in our classes. What I have discovered is that the ideal teaching-world that my textbooks portray does not exist. The ideal methods, learning strategies, and evidence-based practices that I am being taught to implement don't really fit in to the realities that exist in the classrooms, due to the one-size-fits-all end "goal" that a culture of standardized testing creates.

I am sure that is very disheartening as a future teacher. I know if that is what I experienced when I was getting my teaching degree I wouldn't have been happy. I am just wondering(b/c that is not something promoted here) do the administrators tell them they must spend X amount of hours teaching lessons that teach to the test or is that something the teacher does themselves b/c they fear the tie in to their evaluation. I am just wondering where this is the in thing to do who is the one responsible for that. If it is more of a teacher decision at least you know that is something you will not do to your students, and if it is district guided maybe that is something you can change after you have some time in a district. There are lots of reliable studies that show teaching to the test doesn't work and schools who do not implement this policy do better. I'd recommend looking into the Superintendent of the districts you are applying to, because that really can make a huge difference. Do they get the community and teachers involved or don't they.

FlightlessDuck · Mar 3, 2015

mnrose said:
Minnesota is not part of Common Core...I think because our state's standards already exceeded those of Common Core. So, it's not like Common Core sets impossibly high standards or anything. Might seem high to those states who were already behind, but it's pretty much "status quo" here in Minnesota. All this discussion got me wondering whether there was some new testing this year, and there is not for us. Same old same old.

Actually, according to here, Minnesota did adopted the Common Core English Standards in 2010. From what I understand, your math standards aren't scheduled to be revised until this year.

Your state, like mine, develops their own tests.

kamik86 · Mar 3, 2015

jodifla said:
OK, let's talk about Kentucky in 2014, 4 years of Common Core instruction, and 3 rounds of tests:

http://restoregedfairness.org/lates...ing-and-passing-the-2014-pearson-vue-ged-test

Note that in high school only 55% of all of their students could pass the CCSS reading test and fewer than 40% could pass the CCSS math test. Among their minority, ESL and low income students only about 40% could pass their CCSS reading test and 27% could pass their math test! And the results in Kentucky are not unlike the results found in New York, the other state that has CCSS test results of two or more years available. Analyze New York's results here. Kentucky here.

Ok I have been out of high school for 11 years now. However those numbers don't surprise me.
As I said I was in high school when MA first started their high stakes, pass or don't graduate test.

We did have a lot of students especially the first time they took the test fail the test. Many said the test was too hard, however I completely disagreed... many of the students in my school just really didn't understand math. Oh and my school had one of the highest passing rates in the area...

Heck I remember freshman year (so the year before we got this test) when we had a rotation to see if a certain shop class was a good fit for us the teacher stated that alot of math is needed and so that we were going in with eyes open gave us a math test. I was amazed at how many of the students in the class couldn't remember let alone understand that any number divided by 0 is undefined... not 0. So since more then half of the people in the room failed that was it a bad question? Should freshman in high school not understand this concept? Or could it really just be that there is a problem with our education system that so many people didn't know this?

Happy Snowman · Mar 3, 2015

IDoDis said:
Today was the first day of PARCC testing here. Students at schools across the state walked out. Most students sat for the first day of testing, but the walk-outs still made national news. I said this before and I'll say it again -- this testing is a big deal here. This state is doing things with graduation that many other states haven't implemented yet.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/mexico-students-planning-walkouts-tests-29324819

Maybe they are trying to boost the educational quality in your state. Presuming the 69% of kids that took the ACT did so for college, an average score of 19.9 is really low. Have the kids thought about that?

http://www.act.org/newsroom/data/2014/states.html

IDoDis · Mar 3, 2015

nugov2 said:
From an article about the walkout you posted:

Many of the students said they'd refuse to take the PARCC test at all. Others said while they did choose to walkout and make a point, they didn't formally opt out.

MOST STUDENTS TAKE TEST

However, the vast majority of students stayed in their classrooms, and many of them say the students who protested were a distraction.

Miramontes said he didn't get what the big deal was, and didn't want to risk not getting a diploma, the chance other students are taking by choosing not to tests.

"That should be consequence. Honestly it's not that bad; it was just seven questions. The hardest part was just analyzing the essay," Miramontes said.

For Albuquerque Public Schools, 1,730 students have opted out

http://www.kob.com/article/stories/s3721534.shtml#.VPWsvPnF-cI

1700 students out of over 88,000 students or 2% of students opted out of PARCC.

I do think the ABC version sounds more sensational and certainly sells on National news much better than saying: This just in, 2% of students in New Mexico are refusing/opting out of parcc testing. My guess is that many students opted out of their standardized testing in the past, but we didn't hear about it b/c there previous test wasn't the new Measles or Ebola outbreak story new outlets are trying to sell.

I do think it is a big deal that a state is tying it to graduation though. I don't blame anyone for being upset about that issue. I am curious how is that possible though, if results aren't available until October?

I never insinuated that most kids didn't take the test. In fact, I stated otherwise. The news here, especially that station has very biased reporting and is sugar-coating things. Among other things, it failed to mention the middle school where over 150 kids walked out. This is a mid school where there's a high percentage of students whose parents are college professors and doctors -- not students who are destined to fail. I told my DS not to walk out. Even though kids didn't walk out, that didn't mean they were okay with the test. It's not that taking a test is the problem. That's been going on for years. But this test is not the same as in the past. It's the millions of dollars being spent for political gain on the backs of our kids on a difficult test that is set up for mot kids to fail so that more money can be spent. Meanwhile, the school's lack many of the basics needed.

As for the test being tied to graduation, seniors don't take the test, so this year's senior class is good to good off of last year's test. It's the juniors who won't be able to get a diploma next year. This is just the first year. The movement will grow as results come back next October. There are only 9 states now plus DC giving the PARCC. Other states have dropped out. It's easy to sit and judge when you live in a state that probably has more wealth, more money for education, and has a better test than the PARCC which is not being given to your children.

IDoDis · Mar 3, 2015

Happy Snowman said:
Maybe they are trying to boost the educational quality in your state. Presuming the 69% of kids that took the ACT did so for college, an average score of 19.9 is really low. Have the kids thought about that?

http://www.act.org/newsroom/data/2014/states.html

Test scores are tied to the poverty rate nationally. The numbers don't lie. The higher the poverty rate, the lower the scores. Have you ever thought of that? Giving the kids a test is not going to solve that problem.

Happy Snowman · Mar 3, 2015

IDoDis said:
I never insinuated that most kids didn't take the test. In fact, I stated otherwise. The news here, especially that station has very biased reporting and is sugar-coating things. Among other things, it failed to mention the middle school where over 150 kids walked out. This is a mid school where there's a high percentage of students whose parents are college professors and doctors -- not students who are destined to fail. I told my DS not to walk out. Even though kids didn't walk out, that didn't mean they were okay with the test. It's not that taking a test is the problem. That's been going on for years. But this test is not the same as in the past. It's the millions of dollars being spent for political gain on the backs of our kids on a difficult test that is set up for mot kids to fail so that more money can be spent. Meanwhile, the school's lack many of the basics needed.

As for the test being tied to graduation, seniors don't take the test, so this year's senior class is good to good off of last year's test. It's the juniors who won't be able to get a diploma next year. This is just the first year. The movement will grow as results come back next October. There are only 9 states now plus DC giving the PARCC. Other states have dropped out. It's easy to sit and judge when you live in a state that probably has more wealth, more money for education, and has a better test than the PARCC which is not being given to your children.

I guess I'm lost. Just about every state has some grad standard testing where if kids don't pass, they don't graduate. I don't see anything wrong with this. There are procedures in place for those kids that are not capable of passing the tests but why are they so bent out of shape that the state wants to show that the students are capable of the basic skills needed to graduate from high school?

IDoDis said:
Test scores are tied to the poverty rate nationally. The numbers don't lie. The higher the poverty rate, the lower the scores. Have you ever thought of that? Giving the kids a test is not going to solve that problem.

Solve the problem, possibly--it will show them areas that need to be addressed and developed so kids are learning what they need to learn??? Yes, there are more variables involved then just testing that help kids succeed, but why are you, and others, so afraid to test to help direct students to achieve? There is no perfect answer to this but you can't just assume kids know what they need to know and send them on to the next level...

nugov2 · Mar 3, 2015

IDoDis said:
I never insinuated that most kids didn't take the test. In fact, I stated otherwise. The news here, especially that station has very biased reporting and is sugar-coating things. Among other things, it failed to mention the middle school where over 150 kids walked out. This is a mid school where there's a high percentage of students whose parents are college professors and doctors -- not students who are destined to fail. I told my DS not to walk out. Even though kids didn't walk out, that didn't mean they were okay with the test. It's not that taking a test is the problem. That's been going on for years. But this test is not the same as in the past. It's the millions of dollars being spent for political gain on the backs of our kids on a difficult test that is set up for mot kids to fail so that more money can be spent. Meanwhile, the school's lack many of the basics needed.

As for the test being tied to graduation, seniors don't take the test, so this year's senior class is good to good off of last year's test. It's the juniors who won't be able to get a diploma next year. This is just the first year. The movement will grow as results come back next October. There are only 9 states now plus DC giving the PARCC. Other states have dropped out. It's easy to sit and judge when you live in a state that probably has more wealth, more money for education, and has a better test than the PARCC which is not being given to your children.

I didn't say you said that. It was the news article that insinuated that. I also didn't bold the part of my post, that was from the news article I c/p from. I think the news cuts both ways. They also sensationalize things that aren't a big deal. I think that there are kids taking the test who don't want to, but I think that is the case with ALL standardized testing. As I continue to state and you are confirming your state is in an educational crisis. You are at a crossroads. Obviously your students are not as prepared as other states, so what is the answer? I do not think it is standardized tests, but if people view these tests as 2 grades above level than across the nation there are states that are doing a huge disservice. All states have poverty all states are tight with the budget. Your state spends about $1000 less per pupil than my state on average. So yes that can factor in, but I'll also say our district spends less per pupil than your state average. Something needs to be done to help students achieve and I maintain my stance that this is showing how so many states are doing it all wrong. Teaching to the test doesn't work no matter what the standardized test, so opting out of parcc is saying you don't like that test, but were OK with the ones in the past even though the teachers were doing the exact same thing?? That makes no sense to me. We need a change in how things are done, not just what test is given to the kids and that is what people in these struggling areas should be focusing on. Take the test and like everyone says the vast majority will fail and then say to your district, state and the government...now what? You taught to the test for over 3 months and it didn't work, lets look to districts who are having success and see how they are doing it. I just think this opt out movement is focusing on the wrong thing. The test isn't the problem(nor the solution), but the sad state of what some districts think is an acceptable curriculum/lessons.

You say your schools lack the basics needed...what can YOU do to fix it? Does opting out fix it? Why not start a district foundation and get all of these upset parents together to start raising funds? The ones who are too busy to meet can spend some free time writing grants to get these much needed funds and purchase these basic needs. Why is that not a better stand to take? I find when you just fold your arms and say nope, not doing it you aren't going to get any results. I'd say, no I don't like the tests and I think we need to find a better way, but the bigger red flag, the bigger issue is lack of proper education and lack of resources and that IS something you can fix as early as 6 months from now if you start working on it now.

ETA we are taking PARCC in my state.

Who is refusing Common Core tests for 3rd-8th graders?

Who is refusing Common Core tests for 3rd-8th graders?

Refusing all Common Core related Tests

Allowing the State to test my child

other ( because there is always an other)

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