Newbie w/questions re multiple contracts (direct/resale combo).

[smc1107]

Hi All!

First, thanks to you all for the great info on these boards. Very helpful. What a great community.

We're a family of 4 (kids 3 and 5). We're more seriously considering a DVC purchase after several years of pondering.

If we do purchase, we're likely to be looking at acquiring around 300 points for a variety of reasons (size of accommodations/views, banking/borrowing for big trips with lots of folks, etc.)

A few question about the direct purchase benefits, adding on multiple contracts at other resorts and how buying resale plays in with point usability. Welcome all insight. Here goes...

If you buy some amount of points direct from Disney and later buy other points via resale, are all of your points "in play" for a reservation that takes advantage of the direct buy purchase (i.e. concierge collection, RCI resorts, etc.)?

Does purchasing multiple home resort points allow you to book those home resort using all of your points (even those attached to other home resorts)?

If you buy contracts for multiple resorts, do you get the 11 month booking window for each of those resorts? And can you use all of your points (including those from other resorts) for that booking?

Basically, we're thinking we'd like to buy one contract (say 100) direct from Disney. We understand we'll pay a premium. Then, we'd like to buy two more contracts (say 100 each) at two other resorts, likely via resale to save money. So we have 300 points spread across three different resorts. But we're likely to book one big trip a year or a really big trip every 2-3 years. So we'll want to use all the points at once and would like: (1) the options/access that the direct from Disney purchase provides in case we want to use it, (2) the savings that the resale purchase gets us, and (3) the flexibility that goes with having multiple home resorts.

Is that doable or are we trying to have our cake and eat it too?

Thanks in advance for your insight and guidance!

 

[DisK]

Hi All!

First, thanks to you all for the great info on these boards. Very helpful. What a great community.

We're a family of 4 (kids 3 and 5). We're more seriously considering a DVC purchase after several years of pondering.

If we do purchase, we're likely to be looking at acquiring around 300 points for a variety of reasons (size of accommodations/views, banking/borrowing for big trips with lots of folks, etc.)

A few question about the direct purchase benefits, adding on multiple contracts at other resorts and how buying resale plays in with point usability. Welcome all insight. Here goes...

If you buy some amount of points direct from Disney and later buy other points via resale, are all of your points "in play" for a reservation that takes advantage of the direct buy purchase (i.e. concierge collection, RCI resorts, etc.)?

Does purchasing multiple home resort points allow you to book those home resort using all of your points (even those attached to other home resorts)?

If you buy contracts for multiple resorts, do you get the 11 month booking window for each of those resorts? And can you use all of your points (including those from other resorts) for that booking?

Basically, we're thinking we'd like to buy one contract (say 100) direct from Disney. We understand we'll pay a premium. Then, we'd like to buy two more contracts (say 100 each) at two other resorts, likely via resale to save money. So we have 300 points spread across three different resorts. But we're likely to book one big trip a year or a really big trip every 2-3 years. So we'll want to use all the points at once and would like: (1) the options/access that the direct from Disney purchase provides in case we want to use it, (2) the savings that the resale purchase gets us, and (3) the flexibility that goes with having multiple home resorts.

Is that doable or are we trying to have our cake and eat it too?

Thanks in advance for your insight and guidance!

Unfortunately, most of the answers are 'no'.

If you buy some amount of points direct from Disney and later buy other points via resale, are all of your points "in play" for a reservation that takes advantage of the direct buy purchase (i.e. concierge collection, RCI resorts, etc.)? Only the points bought Direct will qualify. If you own 100 direct and 200 resale, you'll only be able to use 100 points to book a concierge collection. RCI points you could use together.


Does purchasing multiple home resort points allow you to book those home resort using all of your points (even those attached to other home resorts)?


No. Only the points owned at that resort can be used. The other points can be used at 7 months....if there is availability.



If you buy contracts for multiple resorts, do you get the 11 month booking window for each of those resorts? And can you use all of your points (including those from other resorts) for that booking?
Same answer. Yes you get 11 month booking at each resort, but only points OWNED at that resort can be used until the 7th month mark.

 

[macemc12]

We bought our contract direct and if I had only known about the resale market, we would have definitely bought resale. We are pondering a contract at another resort at the moment and plan to bank & book alternate years with the 2 contracts. Having contracts at multiple properties will ensure that you get what you want when you want it. Especially if you travel during peak periods.

I am curious as to why you would buy the first contract direct? You can still trade in to RCI if you wanted to with resale points (not an equal trade, you are on the losing side). The concierge collection and ABD/cruising are not the best use of points. You can easily rent your points through David's and use the cash to book. You will end up using less points.

I encourage you to look through the boards and thoroughly research the benefits of resale. For what we paid for our direct points, we could have bought almost twice as many resale. I wish we had!!

 

[smc1107]

Very helpful responses already. Thank you. That clears up a lot for us. Or at least changes my thoughts about purchase "strategy," which would have been different if the answers had been "yes" instead of "no."

As to "availability" at the 7 vs. 11 month mark, do those four months usually make a meaningful difference? Or does that depend on the resort? I could see a strategy be to book what is available with resort-specific points at the 11 month mark and then upgrade the accommodations at the 7 month mark. But if the shorter booking window finds no units available, then I suppose that strategy goes out the window.

 

[chalee94]

As to "availability" at the 7 vs. 11 month mark, do those four months usually make a meaningful difference? Or does that depend on the resort?

depends on the resort, the time of year and sometimes the specific villa type.

if you expect to book a value villa at AKV or standard view at BWV in early december at 7 months out, you will likely be disappointed.

OTOH, a savanna view villa at AKV in june at 7 months out is pretty much a lock.

if you have a strong opinion on where you want to stay, buy there and book early. that is the safest route.

but if you are happy just being onsite, buy a cheaper resort like SSR or OKW and see how things work out at 7 months...

 

[smc1107]

So at the 7 month mark, do all of your available points (including those from other contracts/resorts) become available for any/all resorts (and for any home resort you might have booked at the 11 month mark)?

 

[disneynutz]

So at the 7 month mark, do all of your available points (including those from other contracts/resorts) become available for any/all resorts (and for any home resort you might have booked at the 11 month mark)?

Disney won't let you eat cake.

Yes you can combine your contracts to book at 7 months.

If you want to get the resort you want, when you want it, you need to buy there and still depending on the resort, time of year, room size and category, you may not always get what you want.

You will read posts where people report never having any issues booking but I am here to tell you that there are a lot of factors that come into play.

The design of the cake system dictates that you should buy where you love to stay. Disney holds all of the cards and their goal is to pack the resorts and parks. They are working every day coming up with ideas on how to increase attendance and during a 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 year ownership, there can be major changes. Most of the events that happen today weren't around 20 years ago, F&W. F&G, MNSSHP, MVMCP, and Pop Warner, Jersey Days, Runs and Walks, you name it they will dream it and you will be trying to find a room around it.

Bill

 

[LisaS]

So at the 7 month mark, do all of your available points (including those from other contracts/resorts) become available for any/all resorts (and for any home resort you might have booked at the 11 month mark)?

If you want to book a particular resort more than 7 months out, you need enough of that resort's points to pay for that reservation. For example, if you want to book BLT 11 months out, you must pay with BLT points. If you are booking at 7 months or less from check-in, any points can be used to book any DVC resort, subject to availability.

I'm not sure what you mean by "and for any home resort you might have booked at the 11 month mark". Let's say you own some BWV points and use them to book some nights at BWV 11 months out. At 7 months, you want to extend that reservation (if there is still availability) using some SSR points. Yes, you can do that. On the other hand, let's say you booked some nights at BWV 11 months out and at 7 months out you want to substitute some SSR points into that BWV reservation to free up some BWV points. You can't really do that unless those nights at BWV are still available to be booked at that time.

ETA: Owning a particular resort does not allow you to book there 11 months out. Having enough points from that resort is what allows you to do that. The points have the booking priority.

 

[nalajms]

But we're likely to book one big trip a year or a really big trip every 2-3 years.

You're better off buying the points at the same resort and UY, unless you're ok with split stays. Even during non-peak DVC times, it can be difficult to get a reservation for a long stay at the 7 month mark.

Make sure you factor in that studios go quickly, and 2bd room as well. You're best bet is with a 1bd room.

 

[Deb & Bill]

The busy time for DVC is late Sept through mid-January with the first week of Dec the hardest time to book (so you book that at eleven months out or see what you can get -if anything- at seven months out). Busy times for DVC do not match busy time for WDW all the time. But Christmas/New Years will be hard to book at less than eleven months out.

Most members book their home resort at eleven months out or during the four months they have home booking advantage. Then at seven months out they see if they can change to a different resort. But there are some booking categories that go quickly at eleven months out. So if you really want one of those five two bedroom lockoffs (or the studio or one bedroom that make them up) at AKV, you need to own there are book it when booking opens for the day at eleven months out. If you want that BW view at the BW villas, you need to book that at eleven months out. If you want the Theme Park view at BLT, you need to book it at eleven months out. And if you want GFV, you need to own there because it is so small.

 

[LisaS]

The busy time for DVC is late Sept through mid-January with the first week of Dec the hardest time to book (so you book that at eleven months out or see what you can get -if anything- at seven months out). Busy times for DVC do not match busy time for WDW all the time. But Christmas/New Years will be hard to book at less than eleven months out.

For 2014, they are starting the Food & Wine Festival a week earlier than usual. It opens on Sep 19th this year. If this becomes a permanent change, it will be interesting to see if the busy time for DVC starts in mid-Sep instead of late Sep. It's hot in mid Sep so maybe that will keep the crowds down despite the earlier start. We'll see...

 

[smc1107]

This is all excellent and very helpful information. Thank you.
Is it safe to say that the Magic Kingdom loop DVC properties are consistently in high demand?

Are resale prices for those (new) properties much lower than the original purchase prices? I have seen some discussion of people actually reselling their contract for more than they paid per point (though I didn't note if those were resort-specific situations).

Does buying at a more popular resort play into any benefit when it comes to booking at another property (maybe trading with someone else or renting your points for cash and then renting someone else's points at another property)?

Thanks again!

 

[Deb & Bill]

This is all excellent and very helpful information. Thank you.
Is it safe to say that the Magic Kingdom loop DVC properties are consistently in high demand?

Are resale prices for those (new) properties much lower than the original purchase prices? I have seen some discussion of people actually reselling their contract for more than they paid per point (though I didn't note if those were resort-specific situations).

Does buying at a more popular resort play into any benefit when it comes to booking at another property (maybe trading with someone else or renting your points for cash and then renting someone else's points at another property)?

Thanks again!

Unless you include VWL in your MK DVC properties, I'm going to guess that both BLT and GFV resales will be at least what the current owner paid. I will guess that some VWL resales are less than what people paid originally.

Sometimes the newest resort (ala GFV) is the hot property. So even the non-members want to stay there. So if you find a non-member who wants that resort, you can make them pay more per point. Especially if they wait to book at seven months out and nothing is available.

But some members are pretty cutthroat about renting their points. If they see somone renting GFV points for $15 a point, they will rent theirs for $14 a point.

 

[disneynutz]

This is all excellent and very helpful information. Thank you.
Is it safe to say that the Magic Kingdom loop DVC properties are consistently in high demand?

Are resale prices for those (new) properties much lower than the original purchase prices? I have seen some discussion of people actually reselling their contract for more than they paid per point (though I didn't note if those were resort-specific situations).

Does buying at a more popular resort play into any benefit when it comes to booking at another property (maybe trading with someone else or renting your points for cash and then renting someone else's points at another property)?

Thanks again!

MK and Epcot are the more popular parks but I have had rental requests for all of the WDW resorts except OKW and SSR.

Bill

 

[Kidanifan08]

I am curious as to why you would buy the first contract direct? You can still trade in to RCI if you wanted to with resale points (not an equal trade, you are on the losing side). The concierge collection and ABD/cruising are not the best use of points. You can easily rent your points through David's and use the cash to book. You will end up using less points.

Not so fast, my friend! The recent new agreement with RCI appears to disadvantage resale owners even further. See post #3 in this thread:

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3238742

Of course, this change would not make me less likely to recommend purchasing a DVC contract via resale. It is just an example of how DVC is going to do everything in their power to further devalue resale contracts.

Personally, we bought DVC to use at WDW annually. I don't see us using our points to trade into RCI, and I can't even speak to whether it is a good use of points, as I have never looked into it. But, it makes me re-assess the idea of selling my pre-3/20/11 resale purchase contract, which together with my direct points would allow for an occasional exchange into a wider range of RCI resorts.

 

[WebmasterDoc]

Not so fast, my friend! The recent new agreement with RCI appears to disadvantage resale owners even further. See post #3 in this thread:

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3238742

...

This modification of the agreement between DVC and RCI does not disadvantage resale owners at all since the RCI options for those purchasers is the same as it has been for some time now.

In this case, the new DVC/RCI agreement offers a new benefit for direct purchase and those who purchased resale prior to the March, 2011 date. The DVC/RCI program is unchanged for resale purchases after March 21, 2011 who will still the limited options previously available to direct and resale buyers.

 

[Kidanifan08]

This modification of the agreement between DVC and RCI does not disadvantage resale owners at all since the RCI options for those purchasers is the same as it has been for some time now. In this case, the new DVC/RCI agreement offers a new benefit for direct purchase and those who purchased resale prior to the March, 2011 date. The DVC/RCI program is unchanged for resale purchases after March 21, 2011 who will still the limited options previously available to direct and resale buyers.

I don't know. It looks like an attempt to further devalue resale points to me. I can certainly see a a potential buyer asking a DVC sales person about resale and the CM proceeding to list all of the disadvantages of resale. That list can now include a long list of highly desirable RCI locations that are not available to resale purchasers.

Again, I don't think it is a good reason to not buy a resale contract, but it may make a new purchaser think twice about resale.

I may be wrong, but wouldn't this be the first "new" option introduced since March 2011 that excludes resale owners who purchased after March 2011? It appears that there is not a plan to grandfather in the folks who bought after that. That makes you think that there is more to come that may exclude post-March 2011 resale purchasers.

 

[chukdotcom]

I don't know. It looks like an attempt to further devalue resale points to me. I can certainly see a a potential buyer asking a DVC sales person about resale and the CM proceeding to list all of the disadvantages of resale. That list can now include a long list of highly desirable RCI locations that are not available to resale purchasers.

Again, I don't think it is a good reason to not buy a resale contract, but it may make a new purchaser think twice about resale.

I may be wrong, but wouldn't this be the first "new" option introduced since March 2011 that excludes resale owners who purchased after March 2011? It appears that there is not a plan to grandfather in the folks who bought after that. That makes you think that there is more to come that may exclude post-March 2011 resale purchasers.

Good. I hope they devalue resale even more. All I want it for is for DVC properties. If not getting RCI perks drives the prices down, even better for me. I will add on more contracts.

 

[smc1107]

Thanks for all the great info and discussion. Helpful.
Here's another question - what is considered a "good" Use Year generally? Is it generally a year that allows you to book 11 months out from the busy/holiday season? Does that apply even if you don't plan to use your points during that time (i.e. do you still want to have a "good" Use Year so that you can book competitive times and then trade or rent points easily)? Or is it completely "to each their own" when it comes to Use Year?

 

[smc1107]

Thanks for all the great info and discussion. Helpful.
Here's another question - what is considered a "good" Use Year generally? Is it generally a year that allows you to book 11 months out from the busy/holiday season? Does that apply even if you don't plan to use your points during that time (i.e. do you still want to have a "good" Use Year so that you can book competitive times and then trade or rent points easily)? Or is it completely "to each their own" when it comes to Use Year?

Also, it seems that most folks here don't regularly use the RCI or Concierge collection and are focused on the DVC resorts. Anyone with a different experience or is it just that bad of a value that it sounds good in theory to have the RCI options but doesn't work that way in reality?