Avatar ground breaking = done deal?

[rteetz]

New aerial view of the CMM area, not much visible going on yet except for what appears to be a staging area that has been setup. http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/avatar-construction-aerial-updates.879366/page-3#post-5942583

looks good. Interesting how long they have left the "ground breaking" sand there. I was reading the comments and a lot of them mentioned how it will pretty much be in the same area camp Minnie Mickey was. A lot of them also believe more than two attractions will be there.

 

[Disney Von Drake]

...has a massive, installed base of hard core fans who hold huge annual meets and run busy, active web forums.

That sums up the problem with Star Wars. It just doesn't have wide appeal any longer and the fan base is far from massive. Disney will attempt to revive the franchise with the new films. They have a challenge because Star Wars has been satirized so much that few people take it seriously as viable space fiction. Darth Tater, Spud Lord of the Sith.

 

[mvk]

That sums up the problem with Star Wars. It just doesn't have wide appeal any longer and the fan base is far from massive. Disney will attempt to revive the franchise with the new films. They have a challenge because Star Wars has been satirized so much that few people take it seriously as viable space fiction. Darth Tater, Spud Lord of the Sith.

How do you explain a franchise that doesn't have wide appeal any longer being #2 in licensed sales (only behind Disney Princesses) the past 3+ years?

2012 licensed sales (released Oct 2013)
1. Disney Princess $1.52B
2. Star Wars $1.47B
3. Hello Kitty $1.08
4. Cars $0.93B
5. Pooh $0.93B
6. Mickey & Friends $0.77B
7. WWE $0.59B
8. Angry Birds $0.59B
9. Peanuts $0.54B
10. Toy Story $0.54B

You keep banging this drum, but you couldn't be more wrong if you tried. Star Wars is bigger than Mickey and Toy Story combined.

As an aside, my son, who is four, has watched Episode 2 twice, Episode 3 once, Episode 5 once, and Episode 6 twice in the past week or two. He's currently watching Episode 4 right now.

It seems to be common (maybe not to this degree) among his pre-school friends too.

 

[mvk]

Blu-Ray.com lists a ranking of current top selling Blu Rays, including pre-orders of movies not out yet.

Episode IV-VI collection ranks #49. (Released 2013)
The Complete Saga collection ranks #50. (Released 2011)

The only Blu Rays released prior to 2013 that are ranked higher than The Complete Saga are -

Inception
The Godfather Trilogy
Saving Private Ryan
Enchanted (Disney movie)

Keep in mind The Complete Saga costs about $90, whereas most of the others cost in the $25-$30 range. I picked up The Godfather Trilogy at Target in December for around $25.

Not sure how anybody can reasonably conclude that Star Wars is a fading franchise.

 

[twebber55]

Blu-Ray.com lists a ranking of current top selling Blu Rays, including pre-orders of movies not out yet. Episode IV-VI collection ranks #49. (Released 2013) The Complete Saga collection ranks #50. (Released 2011) The only Blu Rays released prior to 2013 that are ranked higher than The Complete Saga are - Inception The Godfather Trilogy Saving Private Ryan Enchanted (Disney movie) Keep in mind The Complete Saga costs about $90, whereas most of the others cost in the $25-$30 range. I picked up The Godfather Trilogy at Target in December for around $25. Not sure how anybody can reasonably conclude that Star Wars is a fading franchise.

Obviously im a big fan of this expansion at dak but yeah star wars is not going away any time soon
I do think its big with little kids and not as much with teen agers but still big

 

[Disney Von Drake]

How do you explain a franchise that doesn't have wide appeal any longer being #2 in licensed sales (only behind Disney Princesses) the past 3+ years?

2012 licensed sales (released Oct 2013)
1. Disney Princess $1.52B
2. Star Wars $1.47B
3. Hello Kitty $1.08
4. Cars $0.93B
5. Pooh $0.93B
6. Mickey & Friends $0.77B
7. WWE $0.59B
8. Angry Birds $0.59B
9. Peanuts $0.54B
10. Toy Story $0.54B

That's because the Star Wars licensing deal doesn't stand on its own merits. Star Wars licensing has been bolstered by Marvel for the past several years. As a matter of fact, Hasbro agreed to continue their Star Wars licensing deal only if Disney gave them the Marvel characters until 2020 along with Star Wars.

The Marvel characters are far more valuable now. Of course, if Disney is successful in reviving the Star Wars franchise with the next three sequel films, reinvigorated toy sales will follow. Let's hope J.J. Abrams is not making another "Alcatraz".

 

[Yellowstonetim]

That's because the Star Wars licensing deal doesn't stand on its own merits. Star Wars licensing has been bolstered by Marvel for the past several years. As a matter of fact, Hasbro agreed to continue their Star Wars licensing deal only if Disney gave them the Marvel characters until 2020 along with Star Wars.

The Marvel characters are far more valuable now. Of course, if Disney is successful in reviving the Star Wars franchise with the next three sequel films, reinvigorated toy sales will follow. Let's hope J.J. Abrams is not making another "Alcatraz".

The numbers for Star Wars do not include Marvel. When I go to Toys R Us to shop for the many kids I buy presents for there are some Marvel Toys and a good bit of Star Wars. There are Star Wars everything everywhere. I was in a mall Halmark store today for some post-valentine day stuff and there was a whole section of mugs, a clock, and several other Star War gifts. Nothing Marvel. In a Halmark card store! Star Wars is everywhere!

 

[lockedoutlogic]

That sums up the problem with Star Wars. It just doesn't have wide appeal any longer and the fan base is far from massive. Disney will attempt to revive the franchise with the new films. They have a challenge because Star Wars has been satirized so much that few people take it seriously as viable space fiction. Darth Tater, Spud Lord of the Sith.

With all do respect...I don't know how you are coming up with your assessment.

Granted, the core Star Wars fans are now 35-50 and they have let the merchandising go off the rails a bit...and Lucas pimped it out for any loose change he could get - instead of protecting it...

But...star wars is still a behemoth from really all angles. It was sold for what many analysts believe was a 2-3 billion discount. He just dumped it...really.

As strong as it could/should be? Absolutely not...but still perhaps the biggest worldwide franchise?

Well... Yeah...kinda

 

[lockedoutlogic]

That's because the Star Wars licensing deal doesn't stand on its own merits. Star Wars licensing has been bolstered by Marvel for the past several years. As a matter of fact, Hasbro agreed to continue their Star Wars licensing deal only if Disney gave them the Marvel characters until 2020 along with Star Wars.

Are you inferring that they are only making Star Wars licensed product to get marvel rights and the stuff isn't selling?

That's what it seems like... And if that's the case you really must take a basic economics class. Products are not made to that kind of dollar value and then sold on the clearance rack... It just doesn't work that way and never did/ will. Supply, demand, price are all tied directly together.

You're not a fan of Star Wars and maybe don't "get it"...that's completely fine...
But you're just simply on the shortside of this argument.

You're struggling and we're trying to get you back in the life raft...honestly

 

[mvk]

That's because the Star Wars licensing deal doesn't stand on its own merits. Star Wars licensing has been bolstered by Marvel for the past several years. As a matter of fact, Hasbro agreed to continue their Star Wars licensing deal only if Disney gave them the Marvel characters until 2020 along with Star Wars.

The Marvel characters are far more valuable now. Of course, if Disney is successful in reviving the Star Wars franchise with the next three sequel films, reinvigorated toy sales will follow. Let's hope J.J. Abrams is not making another "Alcatraz".

SpiderMan was #16 in 2012 licensed sales. Avengers and X-Men were not in the top 20. Marvel is nowhere near as valuable as Star Wars when it comes to product sales.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

With all do respect...I don't know how you are coming up with your assessment.

Granted, the core Star Wars fans are now 35-50 and they have let the merchandising go off the rails a bit...and Lucas pimped it out for any loose change he could get - instead of protecting it...

But...star wars is still a behemoth from really all angles. It was sold for what many analysts believe was a 2-3 billion discount. He just dumped it...really.

As strong as it could/should be? Absolutely not...but still perhaps the biggest worldwide franchise?

Well... Yeah...kinda

I agree with everything above except the age range: The core 35-50 group has done a great job of passing on Star Wars to the next generations. Toy's R Us and Wal-Mart don't have a Star Wars toy section for the 35-50 crowd. (Ok, I do buy some, but it is for my home theater not to play with.)

I am 54 and my 27 year old son and 25 year old daughter are both big Star Wars fans. A number of kids I know in the 6 to 16 range are big Star Wars fans. This is because of the replay of the originals and prequels, the books, cartoons, and great toys.

Star Wars is different than any other franchise and is definitely still going gangbusters. I think Lockedoutlogic is spot on to call it the "biggest worldwide franchise." Just talk to kids and visit the toy store! Any idea that it is a "failing franchise" has to come from an alternate universe, it certainly doesn't belong in this reality!

 

[AustinWells]

yes, star wars is still one of the most popular franchises around. Disney got it for a steal and whether or not they do good with it is yet to be seen. Disney is making money on their investment and I personally know people from ages 4-70 who still loved the movies, books, cartoons, video games, toys, etc and buy A LOT of it...

why has everyone turned into an expert theme park guru and all knowing? doesn't everyone think Disney is experienced enough in what they are doing and have a plan of knowing what is going to work, star wars, avatar, or NFL?

C'mon now

 

[Yellowstonetim]

yes, star wars is still one of the most popular franchises around. Disney got it for a steal and whether or not they do good with it is yet to be seen. Disney is making money on their investment and I personally know people from ages 4-70 who still loved the movies, books, cartoons, video games, toys, etc and buy A LOT of it...

why has everyone turned into an expert theme park guru and all knowing? doesn't everyone think Disney is experienced enough in what they are doing and have a plan of knowing what is going to work, star wars, avatar, or NFL?

C'mon now

Exactly!

 

[thorp8]

So, I was going to find a more appropriate thread to ask this question, but I see this thread is now going all over the place, so I figured, why not?

Does anyone know if the large cleared area just north of Asia and to the east of the Wildlife Express Train is used for anything?

Could this area be developed into a future land and connect in near the Flights of Wonder pavilion?

It seems to construction would have to be done to hide some back stage areas, but I'm sure that could be accomplished. Obviously, with the addition of Pandora, I don't see anything happening any time soon. I am just curious because it seems this area was purposely cleared but not developed.

 

[mvk]

So, I was going to find a more appropriate thread to ask this question, but I see this thread is now going all over the place, so I figured, why not?

Does anyone know if the large cleared area just north of Asia and to the east of the Wildlife Express Train is used for anything?

Could this area be developed into a future land and connect in near the Flights of Wonder pavilion?

It seems to construction would have to be done to hide some back stage areas, but I'm sure that could be accomplished. Obviously, with the addition of Pandora, I don't see anything happening any time soon. I am just curious because it seems this area was purposely cleared but not developed.

I believe that was the staging area for previous construction.

 

[DanBoris]

So, I was going to find a more appropriate thread to ask this question, but I see this thread is now going all over the place, so I figured, why not?

Does anyone know if the large cleared area just north of Asia and to the east of the Wildlife Express Train is used for anything?

Could this area be developed into a future land and connect in near the Flights of Wonder pavilion?

It seems to construction would have to be done to hide some back stage areas, but I'm sure that could be accomplished. Obviously, with the addition of Pandora, I don't see anything happening any time soon. I am just curious because it seems this area was purposely cleared but not developed.

That area originally was going to be used for Tiger River Rapids what was going to be an elaborate boat based safari (http://land.allears.net/blogs/jackspence/2012/08/animal_kingdoms_kali_river_rap.html) but eventually this was scaled back and became Kali River Rapids. Since then it has been used for storage and staging.

I think if they ever plan to build a new animal based are of the park (Australia for example) this is where it would go since it's a very large and isolated piece of land and close to where the existing animal care facilities are.

 

[Asuva03]

And Citizen Kane would make a crappy theme park land. What's your point?

Generally speaking, great films don't make great theme park lands. Great, immersive, compelling environments make great theme park lands.

Complex stories make awful theme park attractions (which is why I hope the Lord of the Rings/Disney rumors die - and I love the Tolkein books). Great theme park attractions tell simple stories - ones in which theme park guests can be immersed for a few minutes and walk away having "gotten it." Theme parks tell much of their story with atmosphere, architecture, lighting, music - things other than rides and "CPU cycles." THAT is where Cameron and Disney Imagineering working together will excel, and that is why there's every reason to believe that Pandora will be a great addition to Disney's Animal Kingdom.

I agree completely - While I wasn't a huge fan of the actual story line of Avatar... You need only take a piece of story here and there to make a few decent attractions. That's the easy part...... The hard part is getting that immersion... The world of Pandora that Cameron created was indeed extravagant and breathtaking. The atmosphere and the "magic" of that fantastical setting will sell Avatarland all on it's own for me and a lot of others (particularly children)... And if anyone can bring that magic to life, it's Disney.

 

[Asuva03]

yes, star wars is still one of the most popular franchises around. Disney got it for a steal and whether or not they do good with it is yet to be seen. Disney is making money on their investment and I personally know people from ages 4-70 who still loved the movies, books, cartoons, video games, toys, etc and buy A LOT of it...

why has everyone turned into an expert theme park guru and all knowing? doesn't everyone think Disney is experienced enough in what they are doing and have a plan of knowing what is going to work, star wars, avatar, or NFL?

C'mon now

YEP YEP YEP