Disney in Texas

[Goofcoaster]

I'd love it if Disney did a Disney-themed hotel in Texas, kind of like the Great Wolf Lodge concept or Aulani. Indoor water park, Disney character breakfast, kids' club, etc. I think it would do well.

I'm kind of surprised that Disney has not done that concept yet, Great Wolf Lodge does a great job, but I think Disney could really knock that out of the park.

 

[doconeill]

Disney was rumored years ago to be getting into the GWL-type space, but nothing ever came of it. It was thought that the DC property would be the first, but they sold the land off again.

 

[eadavis]

Curious why they wouldnt take a Lodge type approach to an area like Colorado and make a ski-resort. DVC could do pretty well up there.

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

I'd love it if Disney did a Disney-themed hotel in Texas, kind of like the Great Wolf Lodge concept or Aulani. Indoor water park, Disney character breakfast, kids' club, etc. I think it would do well.

Curious why they wouldnt take a Lodge type approach to an area like Colorado and make a ski-resort. DVC could do pretty well up there.

Disney has considered resort hotel locations away from its parks. Disney even built Aulani in Hawaii.

In 2009, Disney bought a site near Washington, DC, but subsequently decided not to proceed:

Disney Drops National Harbor: http://www.yesterland.com/harbor.html​

At one time, Disney had a project for a DVC ski and mountain resort in Colorado:

Three Disney Vacations Clubs That Might Have Been: http://www.yesterland.com/dvcnever.html​

The problem is that the Disney name means much less away from its parks. Away from the parks, how many people are willing to pay $400-500 per night for a Disney room that's really not much different from a Hyatt room costing half that much? How many people are willing to pay the premium price of DVC if there are no Disney parks nearby?

In any case, the rumored 6,400-acre real estate deal that launched this thread involves far more land than a resort hotel requires. Depending on the amenities, 10 to 100 acres would suffice for resort hotel.

If there really was 6,400-acre real estate deal in the Texas location of the rumor, chances are it did not involve The Walt Disney Company in any way.

 

[Disneyspiderman]

all Texas has is six flags stat fair of Texas & sea world while Florida has 14 theme parks and 32 theme parks in California we need disney and universal studios in texas

 

[Q-man]

Why would the name "Disney" not appear in the title? Longhorn Land doesn't sound like Disney to me.

Disney used multiple shell corporations and layers of them when they bought the WDW land so that no one would know who was really buying.

 

[Q-man]

Anyone know how to research what percent of the Disneyland revenue comes from those w/i 7 hours drive to the park? The Hill Country Hyatt, Lost Pines Hyatt, etc have no issues filling up $450/nt rooms on the weekends. Can't believe anyone is flying in for those.

6,400 acres is more than 1/5 of WDW's 30,080 acres. Seems like more than would be needed for a DL type park, water park, golf courses, and some resorts. Convention space to go after San Antonio's huge convention business maybe?

 

[sweetie1996]

This link has been floating all over Facebook here in Texas. It's from a blogger in Waller, west of Houston. This rumor has been going around forever!

 

[sweetie1996]

Houston Chronicle Proposed Disney-like theme park faces uncertain future By Cindy Horswell | February 15, 2012 | Updated: February 15, 2012 9:11pm In 2005, many area residents shed tears over losing the longtime Houston icon AstroWorld. That same year real estate investor John Marlin of Dallas bought land about 30 minutes north of downtown Houston that he envisioned turning into the area's next Disney-style theme park called EarthQuest. But now the fate of Marlin's 1,564-acre tract in Montgomery County that he planned to use for the 500-acre theme park and 1,064-acre residential development will be decided by a U.S. bankruptcy court in Sherman on March 5. Marlin heads Whitestone Houston Land, LTD., which filed for the Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. He could not be reached for comment. But two groups that had been working closely with Marlin in pursuit of the theme park - East Montgomery County Improvement District and Contour Entertainment - are joining forces to try to buy the land and establish a new developer. The court has set a minimum purchase price of $10 million, which is about half what Marlin originally paid for the land that straddles U.S. 59 near New Caney. Completion of the project is estimated to cost about $500 million.



This is what has been floating around Facebook the past week or so. It's from a blogger in Waller Tx from over a year ago.

 

[Mistydp6492]

Disney would never do a deal with anyone who releases info before Disney does. Remember the land for WDW was bought by fake Disney companies. Only when Disney was ready did they let the word out and they held a big press event with Government honchos on the stage.

Bill

Even though I do realize this is true, stuff does leak out . . . I remember hearing rumors of some kind of "flying experimental ride" and that being linked to a possible Avitar ride at DW, and I know now that DW's next big endeavor is to add Avitar Land to Animal Kingdom. I would never think to see something in the sky and think, Hmm that strange thing must be a new Avitar ride at Disney, so somehow, someone had to have said something for such a rumor to begin.

 

[Mistydp6492]

And I'm no expert at golf courses or how big they are, but I know the courses at WDW are very nice, maybe it would be a Disney golf course - similar to PGA style?

 

[dwelty]

Oh, here we go again the "Disney in Texas" rumor that has gone around every year since I started on the boards in 2005. This rumor is so worn out its not even funny. I have heard Dallas, Houston, and San Antonio as all sites where Disney is "buying up" large tracts of land. These rumors are often started by local real estate interests to increase prices in the area. Why would people go to Texas when Disneyland and Disney World are two hours by plane in either direction?

 

[eadavis]

Oh, here we go again the "Disney in Texas" rumor that has gone around every year since I started on the boards in 2005. This rumor is so worn out its not even funny. I have heard Dallas, Houston, and San Antonio as all sites where Disney is "buying up" large tracts of land. These rumors are often started by local real estate interests to increase prices in the area. Why would people go to Texas when Disneyland and Disney World are two hours by plane in either direction?

Because it may not be a full fledged park. Vero beach isn't even a two hour drive from WDW, yet, there it is...

Also, playing "what-if" is fun...

 

[JoWiJo]

Also, playing "what-if" is fun...

Glad you said that. I want to play "what if." As many know, Disney used dummy names to purchase land for the Florida Project, now known as Walt Disney World. They got land cheap until the rouse was uncovered and the land value went through the roof.

With the Internet at our disposal, it would be much harder to pull off the same stunt (though not impossible). Unknown companies coming together to suddenly buy land in a given area? Something's up. But what if instead of many unknown investors coming together, it's one known company in a hush-hush operation? Or one family?

Not being from Houston, I can't say whether the report that there is a wealthy family named Disney there, having no relation to Walt Disney. But assuming there is, what if... Disney (the company) paid Disney (the family) to buy land for them. News would spread "Disney is building in Texas!" After a little research into the land purchase, everyone discovers, "oh, wrong Disney." At that point the excitement would die and land value would be more stable. Months later, Disney (the family) finishes what land purchases they needed to get and transfers the land to Disney (the company).

A few years later, Disney Texas opens.


Bear in mind, I don't think that's what's actually going on. But what if...

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

And I'm no expert at golf courses or how big they are, but I know the courses at WDW are very nice, maybe it would be a Disney golf course - similar to PGA style?

For an 18-hole golf course, it takes around 150 acres, give or take 50 acres.

Many people -- especially in Texas -- would love to believe that the report (in an obscure blog) of Disney buying 6,400 acres is true. The thought seems to be that if it's not for a major resort along the lines of WDW or DLR, then it's still Disney buying the land for something else.

A more plausible explanation is that report is nothing more than a real estate rumor and that any Disney connection is complete fiction.

 

[Max Rebo]

Has any local or state government ever made an honest attempt to lure Disney to their area?

When it comes to economic development these days, state and local government are now creating huge incentive package to lure companies (usually large industrial projects.) As an example, the state of Arkansas recently approved a $125 million incentive package to lure a new steel mill to the state. (The company is also getting another $14.5 million from the local county, and another $2 million from a nearby city.)

While I have heard no evidence of this happening in relation to this recent rumor (of which I am highly skeptical), it's not hard for me to imagine a state like Texas looking to develop its local tourism industry, that would be willing to spend millions to lure a name-brand like Disney.

Several posters in this thread and elsewhere have made compelling arguments about why it wouldn't make business sense for Disney to expand its theme park empire in the United States. Generally, I have to say I agree with the arguments that have been made in those posts.

But I also wonder ... would it tip the scale any for the Disney company if they had a state or local government willing to kick upwards of $100 million into the project? And is there a state or local government eager enough to develop its tourism industry to be willing to make that kind of investment?

 

[doconeill]

Has any local or state government ever made an honest attempt to lure Disney to their area?

I don't know about local or state, but Dubai certainly made a heavy pitch back when they were building absolutely everything for everyone. Disney said no.

I don't think we will EVER see another "Florida Project/EPCOT/Walt Disney World" scale again. To do that, Disney got the Florida legislature to give them autonomy, setting up its own local government, etc. When there is nothing, it seems like a great deal at the time.

The current FL legislature doesn't seem to think it was a great deal now.

So I expect there is no way any state would allow Disney, or any other company, to get that sort of deal again.

 

[Q-man]

Several posters in this thread and elsewhere have made compelling arguments about why it wouldn't make business sense for Disney to expand its theme park empire in the United States. Generally, I have to say I agree with the arguments that have been made in those posts.

And I'd argue that they open a new US theme park about every 10 years to absorb the increasing population and the ever increasing demand they have created.

'55 Disneyland
'71 Magic Kingdom
'82 Epcot
'89 Hollywood Studios
'98 Animal Kingdom
'01 California Adventure

I grew up in Texas and have heard these rumors since the late 1970s. It was going to be in Austin on Lake Travis, then San Antonio which ended up being Sea World and Six Flags, etc, etc. I get the disbelief after so many years of rumors. But, all the Disney doesn't do business that way naysayers remind me of an Einstein quote that I'll paraphrase, "The thinking that got us here isn't the thinking that's going to get us beyond here."

I still contend a 3rd U.S. Magic Kingdom/Disneyland isn't that far fetched. I completely agree that you never replicate WDW to maintain that special draw to it. Disneyland Toyko(1983), Disneyland Paris(1992), Tokyo DisneySea(2001) and Disneyland Hong Kong(2005) don't seem to have stopped either Asian or European travel to WDW. Disneyland is out of room to expand and I'm pretty sure MK crowds is the number #1 complaint of WDW visitors. 17.1mil passed through the MK gates in 2011 vs 10.8mil at Epcot. Disneyland had 16.1mil visitors in 2011 to 6.3million for California Adventure.

As for cost, land and labor is still comparatively cheap around Houston. If they could afford to build in Tokyo, Paris, and Hong Kong then the cost of building in the Houston area is of little concern.

 

[doconeill]

And I'd argue that they open a new US theme park about every 10 years to absorb the increasing population and the ever increasing demand they have created.

'55 Disneyland
'71 Magic Kingdom
'82 Epcot
'89 Hollywood Studios
'98 Animal Kingdom
'01 California Adventure

Four of those six were on property already owned by the company, and not in a new location.

If increasing population/demand is the concern, then could still easily open a new park at WDW, possibly more, and there has been buzz about a third in CA.

Seems more likely they'd go that route than have to start from scratch somewhere else.

 

[Q-man]

Four of those six were on property already owned by the company, and not in a new location.

If increasing population/demand is the concern, then could still easily open a new park at WDW, possibly more, and there has been buzz about a third in CA.

Seems more likely they'd go that route than have to start from scratch somewhere else.

And I'd argue that only 1 was and they bought the property to build the other 4 up front due to the overwhelming success of Disneyland. At the very least they knew they were going to build Epcot in addition to MK and obviously had visions of more with how much land they bought. But, the property is likely the least of the expense. If they bought the alleged Waller tract in the last down turn it would have been $5-6K an acre. That $38 million on the top end. Implementing MyMagic+ is costing anywhere from $1.5 to 2 BILLION. That is 40 to 50 Waller tracts.

Two MKs at WDW and in Cali? MK's/DL demand is the issue. MK drew ~65% more guest visits than the much bigger Epcot in 2011 and MK was just shy of 90% more guest visits than either of HS and AK. DL drew 165% more guest visits than California Adventure did in 2011.

They'd have to start from scratch for 3rd park in Cali too as they are out of land at DL. I can assure you that doing so in Texas would be much cheaper than in Cali. But you could use my if they could afford to buy and build in Tokyo, Paris, and Hong Kong, or implement MyMagic+, then they can afford build again in Cali too. But that option seems way more competing with yourself than building in the exploding mega regional triangle of Houston, DFW, Austin/SA. that would put well over 20 million w/i a 6-7 hour drive. That is over 50% more people than the entire state of California had when DL opened in 1955.