Winter is coming...

[CaliBear]

Is there enough interest for two threads? I can certainly keep book spoilers out of discussion as I wouldn't want to spoil it for those who haven't read the series, but I wouldn't mind a book-readers thread if others are interested.

 

[cabanafrau]

Is there enough interest for two threads? I can certainly keep book spoilers out of discussion as I wouldn't want to spoil it for those who haven't read the series, but I wouldn't mind a book-readers thread if others are interested.

That's probably the way to go, and what I've seen done elsewhere on the net. There's already been some stuff dropped in here.

I'm in the same boat as a PP, DH has read some, but not all of the books & I've basically been unable to discuss the show with him since early in the first season because of the changes between the show & the books & not wanting to spoil anything for him. Some Sundays I've literally had to bite my tongue.

Note to self, try to make time tonight to check up on the red matter. I thought that referred to another incident I did not find joyous. There is another "matter" I have been in a terrible rush to watch played out.

 

[cybrkitn]

Haven't read the books?

Not yet. Neither has DH. I guess I'm afraid that I would get a lot of spoilers reading it. I know that there are differences between the series and the books (like the character of Arya for example). But I like being on the edge of my seat each week wanting more rather than knowing what's ahead.

 

[Tinkh]

Seriously, so excited that it is back! I am halfway through book 5 and I just haven't been able to muster my attention back into it. I loved the third book, so I am really excited for this one. Tyrion

 

[Jennasis]

Not yet. Neither has DH. I guess I'm afraid that I would get a lot of spoilers reading it. I know that there are differences between the series and the books (like the character of Arya for example). But I like being on the edge of my seat each week wanting more rather than knowing what's ahead.

Arya isn't different in the series than she is in the books (so far). Actually the show hasn't taken much in the way of liberties with the story. Only a little here and there. I have found having read the books has made it easier to keep track of who is who...DH on the other hand, who has not read it, is totally lost.

 

[cybrkitn]

Arya isn't different in the series than she is in the books (so far). Actually the show hasn't taken much in the way of liberties with the story. Only a little here and there. I have found having read the books has made it easier to keep track of who is who...DH on the other hand, who has not read it, is totally lost.

Sounds like my mom with Once Upon a Time (which is one that we need to catch up on).

DH knows the names in GOT b/c he watched season 1 before getting me into it. I'm still learning names, but we both know what's going on. So, we're not lost. Although, I'm still trying to get past the nudity scenes. Not sure if I'll ever get used to seeing that. Of course, that doesn't bother DH . It's the story lines that pull me in.

 

[lightmoonstone]

There aren't a lot of changes from the books to the tv show.

I've read the books and it helps so much! Having said that, I think sometimes it is difficult keeping track of who's who even after having read the book. I imagine it might be tough to spring into the series without some background reading...or someone to explain it to you along the way. I do this with my bf, who has just started Game of Thrones (book 1).

I find it so funny to watch GoT with my him because he tends to rename everyeone. He is only just getting into season 1 now, so he doesn't know the names(the Lannisters are "the blondes", Robert Baratheon is "Fred Flintstone", Joffrey is "the psycho", Renly and Stannis are "the brothers of Fred Flintstone",etc). Also, somewhere along the way he got it in his head that Theon is a Stark-he always forgets Rickon and counts Theon as one of the five Stark kids.

Going back to the show's liberties or lack of, is anyone a little peeved that the Jeyne Westerling character was omitted from the tv series?
The new girl is fine, but it makes me wonder if they are going to take that particular thread and run in a different direction with it.
Thoughts?

 

[CaliBear]

What did everyone think of the episode? I liked it a lot, great to have so many characters join the cast all in one episode: The Reeds, Brotherhood without Banners, Vargo Hoat, the Queen of Thorns. Looks promising so far.

 

[WowLookAtThat]

I thought the last episode was great! The Queen of Thornes was just awesome but I am wondering what they are going to do with the character of Shae. Book Shae and TV Shae are very different from one another. I kind of thought the between Shae and Tyrion was weird...

 

[Iforgetmypassword]

Just watched it (dvr'd it last night). I loved jon snow last season but already I am not a big fan of his just from this episode. He used to be more of a leader than a follower I guess...

I want someone to cut Joffrey's balls off, really I do.

I love all of the "bad" characters because they are the most interesting, esp the women. Cersei is my favorite. She is so darned smart and wants everything her way. Joffrey may just be her undoing.

What is going to happen with Stanis and the crazy lady?? She seems so evil and he seems so dumb to follow her. I have not read-ahead in my books; I want to watch it first!!

I do love Tyrion. Favorite line from last night's episode w/Cersei...she tells him he is not half as smart as he thinks he is, and he tells her "but I am still smarter than you!!" Those 2 have the best quick-witted one-line-zinger conversations.

I have read all the books. I'm astonished at how stupid Cersei is. She's so stupid it's infuriating. She consistently only thinks one step ahead, not 2 or 3, like Tyrion.

 

[Iforgetmypassword]

I thought the last episode was great! The Queen of Thornes was just awesome but I am wondering what they are going to do with the character of Shae. Book Shae and TV Shae are very different from one another. I kind of thought the between Shae and Tyrion was weird...

I think tv Shae is very similar to book Shae. How do you think they are different?

 

[WowLookAtThat]

I think tv Shae is very similar to book Shae. How do you think they are different?

Without spoiling it for others I find tv Shae a little bit more compassionate and caring (in terms of Sansa and Tyrion) while Book Shae just seems greedy and said some pretty mean things (especially about Lollys) From the beginning, Tyrion makes it clear that he is buying her services and and we see her actually care for him (in the show)yet in the book I got the impression she was out for herself and this in the end screwed her up. Now TV Shae may be that way BUT Book Shae's intentions are more transparent.

TV Shae is portrayed as a likeable and mysterious person which is a little confusing as to how the writers will portray her later in the series especially in the end.

 

[MrsPete]

Anyone else excited?

More than I can say! My biggest sorrow at this moment: George R.R. Martin writes as if his hand were propelled by snails. I know, we just had Dragons last summer, but I want more NOW, NOW, NOW.

ahhh yes, Im looking forward to it, although Im still upset way back from season one that Ned is Dead

You know, as many people as we've believed dead . . . who turned out NOT to be dead . . . I wouldn't be overly surprised to see dear old Ned show up again! Okay, not seriously. I mean, beheaded is beheaded, but how many characters have we believed dead who weren't really dead? If you're reading the books (not just watching the movies), I believe we're somewhere around ten -- every one of them a main character.

Spoilers ahead: Bran and Rickon, Theon who turned up as Reek, Catlyn, Brienne (I'm assuming when they hung her we were supposed to assume she was dead), everyone believes Arya to be dead, The Lightning Lord (and several others of his band), Sandor Clegane, The Mountain Who Rides (I don't know whose head they sent to Dorn, but I think we all know who Sir Robert who doesn't speak really is), Cold Hands (though I have doubts about his true identity), Prince Aegeon, and I'm sure Jon Snow isn't dead. I'm sure I left out someone. The point: In Game of Thrones, dead doesn't always mean dead!

I'm excited!! Hard to pick a favorite, but I like Sansa and Brienne of Tarth a lot for females, both in the books and on-screen. I think they are very realistic and sympathetic characters. I like Dany on the show. In the books I think she's spoiled and almost as bad as her brother with that "I am the dragon" stuff.

I've always liked Robb and the actor they chose really exudes the kind of charisma Robb would need to pull off the King in the North.

Theon is um.. not my fave, but he's probably one of the most compelling characters and Alfie Allen is fantastic in that role.

I guess my top favorite would be Tyrion. He is definitely the smartest and the funniest. I also think he has better intentions than many of the characters.

I love ALL the characters, but I have to say that Dani is my least favorite. I agree that she has quite the 'tude about her birthline, BUT she does seem to pull it off pretty well -- and she's growing more mature. Remember, she was only 14 when she married Khal Drogar (spelling?) and became his Khalessi, a title which means as much to her as her dragons. Also, she did sit in a fire all night and give birth to three dragons. One could argue that it's not braggin' if you can back it up.

LOVED Robb -- so his father's son, and the actor who plays him portrays him so well: Too young to do the job he's doing, but trying so hard and succeeding against all odds.

Theon -- I agree that the actor is really bringing life to Theon, who didn't really grab me in the books. I can't wait to see how they handle the things that come for him in the later books. I do not like his sister; I know she's not supposed to be a likeable girl, but I liked her better in the books.

Tyrion -- Oh, yes! I alternated between loving and hating him in the books, but in the movie he absolutely steals the show! The actor Peter _____? is superb. Tyrion is the best and the worst of the Lanisters! He's absolutely the smartest, and he can be so cruel -- but he's also a victim and such a sympathetic character. I loved the scenes between him and Bron.

Must mention Jamie and Jon. Wonderful, both of them!

I have to say, though, I don't love the female actors as much. The one who plays Cersie . . . I liked her -- or, loved to hate her -- more in the book. I do not care for Marjorie either -- 'specially when she wears that dress that makes her shoulders look weird. The female character I like best is Arya. The actress was very well chosen, and it's hard to believe such a young girl is playing this part so well! And I do love Catlyn; she looks exactly as I pictured her, and she is so single-mindedly a mother. Oh, another female actor whom I really like: Osha. I suspect she's going to feature more importantly when the next book comes out; I mean, we have a hint that Lord Manderly knows where Osha and Rickon are hiding.

We haven't read the books yet. I might wait b/c I don't want to have any "spoilers" given away.

So, what takes does everyone have on who they think will sit upon the throne? I personally cannot stand Joffrey and am so looking forward to the day he is dethroned! So I would like to see King Robert's son (the one in hiding with Arya) and Khalisee. For some reason I can see those two as ruling together compared to anyone else.

Joffrey is absolutely a butt-nugget, but look who raised him! How could he be otherwise? The actor who plays him is amazing. It's hard to remember that he's only a child himself!

Who's going to sit on the throne at the end? My opinion, spoilers ahead:

The dragon has three heads -- that's been emphasized over and over and over. Somehow three people will rule together: Dani, her not-really-dead nephew Aegeon (spelling?) and Jon Snow. How does Jon fit in with the Targaryens? He's not really Ned Stark's son; rather, he's the son of Ned's deceased sister Lyanna and Prince Aegeon. Yes, I know this is a big assumption, and I won't ask you to swallot it without evidence: He promised something BIG, something life-altering to his sister /it was connected to a bed of blood and blue winter roses (Prince A. gave winter roses to her when he crowned her queen of love and beauty at the tourney at Harrenhall). We know that Prince A. kidnapped Lyanna for a while, but I don't think she minded being his captive. I'm sure she died giving birth to Jon. It was very difficult for Ned to keep the promise because of Catlyn (who hated Jon because he was a constant reminder that her husband had cheated on her). Robert B. was crazy about Lyanna . . . but we have no evidence that she wanted him in the least. I'm SURE about Jon!

Actually the show hasn't taken much in the way of liberties with the story. Only a little here and there.

I must disagree! So many differences -- characters left out, plot points completely invented or changed. What makes a good book doesn't always make a good movie. It's just a fact.

 

[CaliBear]

Great post, Mrs. Pete. I agree with your spoilered section.

I liked that they softened Caitlin a little last night by having her admit she should have treated Jon better. I remember getting annoyed at her treatment of him in the books. Softening Shae I am not as big a fan of.

 

[Jennasis]

They had to leave many of the minor and inconsequential characters and sub plots out out. The show is only an hour long haha. Honestly, my big complaint with the books (which I've read and enjoyed) is how bloated they are. The man spends countless pages describing banners and sigils, and what the forest or castle looks like. Clearly he and Tolkien were cut from the same cloth. I often found myself scanning over oodles of description and finally stopping when I saw quotation marks!

I certainly don't think the show suffers from the streamlining it's been given.

 

[MrsPete]

Great post, Mrs. Pete. I agree with your spoilered section.

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who has this thought!

They had to leave many of the minor and inconsequential characters and sub plots out out. The show is only an hour long haha. Honestly, my big complaint with the books (which I've read and enjoyed) is how bloated they are. The man spends countless pages describing banners and sigils, and what the forest or castle looks like. Clearly he and Tolkien were cut from the same cloth. I often found myself scanning over oodles of description and finally stopping when I saw quotation marks!

I certainly don't think the show suffers from the streamlining it's been given.

Oh, no, no, no . . . The detailed backstories are what I love about the books! He has such a gift for shaping real people, not just one-dimensional characters. Take the Hound, for instance. You start out disliking him, thinking he's such a cruel man (or I did anyway), wondering why he defends Joffrey so staunchly, hating him for killing the butcher-boy Micah . . . then as you see him trying to hide his attachment to Sansa, and you learn the backstory about his brother /the fire and you see him traveling with Arya, you see him as a person who's not just good or bad, but whose personality contains elements of both. Without the details, it'd be just an adventure story; it'd lose the epic sweep.

I've read the whole series twice, and on the second read I picked up SO MANY details in those pages and pages -- details that are more insightful than I realized on the first go-round.

Of course, I love Tolkein too. And Tolstoy, Victor Hugo, Ken Follett and Diana Galbatron, all writers who don't mind filling page after page after page!

 

[cabanafrau]

Since I saw Martin saying something in the buildup to the season three premiere saying that Benioff and Weiss know upcoming plot details I've been watching the differences between books & show much more carefully because I know that whatever is done fits into where everything is ultimately headed and so I'm looking for some clues well beyond where we are currently on screen.

The wait for book 5 was so long that I forgot about it at a few points, assumed I had missed it & did a search only to find out we were still waiting. The delay, the complexity of the characters and settings combined with the character POV perspectives and the fact the story was told in parallel, not sequential chronology with very few if any landmarks to reference really confused me in book five. I wondered if the endgame I began constructing in book one was way off base. I still don't know, but I'm watching the differences on screen to see if they tell me anything, because I'm not falling for anymore promises about when the next book will arrive.

 

[Jennasis]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who has this thought!
Oh, no, no, no . . . The detailed backstories are what I love about the books! He has such a gift for shaping real people, not just one-dimensional characters. Take the Hound, for instance. You start out disliking him, thinking he's such a cruel man (or I did anyway), wondering why he defends Joffrey so staunchly, hating him for killing the butcher-boy Micah . . . then as you see him trying to hide his attachment to Sansa, and you learn the backstory about his brother /the fire and you see him traveling with Arya, you see him as a person who's not just good or bad, but whose personality contains elements of both. Without the details, it'd be just an adventure story; it'd lose the epic sweep.

I've read the whole series twice, and on the second read I picked up SO MANY details in those pages and pages -- details that are more insightful than I realized on the first go-round.

Of course, I love Tolkein too. And Tolstoy, Victor Hugo, Ken Follett and Diana Galbatron, all writers who don't mind filling page after page after page!

You say tomato....

 

[cybrkitn]

Joffrey is absolutely a butt-nugget, but look who raised him! How could he be otherwise? The actor who plays him is amazing. It's hard to remember that he's only a child himself!

That had me laughing out loud! Yeah, Joffrey is a "butt-nugget". And yet Cersei gets angry with the way he acts . Um, you raised him and you got a monster! What did you expect

I've noticed that the actor who plays Bran has hit puberty. Last season he was still a young kid. Now his voice has gotten deeper and he's starting to look more like a teenager. Makes me realize that DS10 will be hitting that very soon himself (he's already hitting a little bit of puberty at an early age before he's supposed to). I'm not ready for that

 

[CaliBear]

Since I saw Martin saying something in the buildup to the season three premiere saying that Benioff and Weiss know upcoming plot details I've been watching the differences between books & show much more carefully because I know that whatever is done fits into where everything is ultimately headed and so I'm looking for some clues well beyond where we are currently on screen.

The wait for book 5 was so long that I forgot about it at a few points, assumed I had missed it & did a search only to find out we were still waiting. The delay, the complexity of the characters and settings combined with the character POV perspectives and the fact the story was told in parallel, not sequential chronology with very few if any landmarks to reference really confused me in book five. I wondered if the endgame I began constructing in book one was way off base. I still don't know, but I'm watching the differences on screen to see if they tell me anything, because I'm not falling for anymore promises about when the next book will arrive.

I had wondered if they knew upcoming plot points. Thanks for posting this.

I like the detail and the backstories of the books too. I also missed some of the jokes from Clash of Kings in season 2. I know they have to cut so much. They can't help it, but I did notice a lot of the cuts since CoK was my favorite book of the series.