Check my FP+ Logic Regarding the Limit of 3

[Mike2023]

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Some great posts and info here. I agree with some, but not all. Not really in the mood to think out my argument but I might get around to it at some point.

I think there is one thing we can all agree on. This system, like the last, will benefit the guests "in the know". I plan on being a guest in the know so am not worried in the least.

 

[hopemax]

Actually, I think it will benefit those who book the most expensive room*.

Like on the cruise ships, where it used to be any Castaway Club got to book Palo, shore excursions before the rest of the ship. Then they had so many return cruisers, so they split it up into levels, and now only people who have taken 10 cruises get first crack. And resort guests get to book dining 10 days before everyone else.

If you always book concierge at a Deluxe the correct number of days in advance, I'm sure you'll be fine. If you're like me, and stay with your parents at their house (how dare I!) and rarely know I am visiting 180 days in advance, no amount of inside knowledge is going to help, I'm afraid.



* I was going to say "spend the most cash" but realized that's not true either. Because my parents are locals, and because I collect pins and random other Disney stuff, I spend as much on merchandise throughout the year than most people spend on their hotel & tickets. But it doesn't show up as being *my spending*, because it's my parents doing most of the physical buying. So I won't get the benefits, and not even the fancy wrist band will help.

 

[Mike2023]

Actually, I think it will benefit those who book the most expensive room*.

Like on the cruise ships, where it used to be any Castaway Club got to book Palo, shore excursions before the rest of the ship. Then they had so many return cruisers, so they split it up into levels, and now only people who have taken 10 cruises get first crack. And resort guests get to book dining 10 days before everyone else.

If you always book concierge at a Deluxe the correct number of days in advance, I'm sure you'll be fine. If you're like me, and stay with your parents at their house (how dare I!) and rarely know I am visiting 180 days in advance, no amount of inside knowledge is going to help, I'm afraid.



* I was going to say "spend the most cash" but realized that's not true either. Because my parents are locals, and because I collect pins and random other Disney stuff, I spend as much on merchandise throughout the year than most people spend on their hotel & tickets. But it doesn't show up as being *my spending*, because it's my parents doing most of the physical buying. So I won't get the benefits, and not even the fancy wrist band will help.

Well now you're speculating on it being a tiered system. While disney could take that option very easily, I'm not sure its going to go down that way. If they do my opinions change. Oh what an interesting few months its going to be.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

"Availability of a FastPass+ experience, the number of experiences you may select and arrival windows are limited and vary based on factors such as the theme park you are visiting, the attraction or entertainment experience, the time of year and the day of the week, and prior demand. In addition, the number of days for which you can hold FastPass+ selections at any given time is limited."

This feels like an impending disaster, given how horribly Disney implements web services. For many, they still have to call in to reliably get their ADRs scheduled. I have little confidence they will get this right.

I can't help but agree here...

Look, Disney was fantastic from 1925-1990 in inventing, engineering, and building tools and features for the amusement experience, movie and TV production, consumer products, and operational/ management strategies...

But they have been equally horrid in computer technology ever since.

Terribly over budget and slow
To develop...and in some ways completely ineffective.

It's probably assumed they are technology leaders...but that is a paradox in this case.

They can't be trusted here...as anyone who has worked in or around their networked systems can attest to.

I'll watch with eyebrows cocked on this whole "endeavor"

 

[cheer25mom]

I am another who often uses 6+ fastpasses a day and dreads that new system. MY FAMILY will definitely be waiting longer to ride the things we want to ride.

 

[DJthaplanet]

Yesterday i went to the Odyssey center at Epcot to transfer my current Annual pass to a RIFID enabled pass. As i was leaving i was given a "tour" of the new my Disney experience app, as well as given the opportunity to ask any questions i had about the new system. One of the questions i asked was how many fast pass's would be given out per guest per day. the "tour guide" replied and said that the 3 pass's per day was only used for the testing phase of the new system, and their has been no word as to wither or not it will be staying at 3 when the new system rolls out, or if it will go up. He also said their was no official word on how many annual pass holders will get. hope this helped

 

[momof2n2]

I think the new system might be better for lots of people - but selfishly I don't think it will be better for ME. Typically, we use 7-9 sets of FPs on a typical day in MK. We go at slower times of year (October/November usually) and combining FPs and smart touring we will rarely wait in line more than 5 minutes (I think last trip I counted 3 times we waited longer than that in line.)

If Disney now limits me to 3 FP+s per day, even though they are including more options - it means ME and MY FAMILY are going to be waiting in line longer. Sure, the standby lines might be shorter, and that's good for everyone else that doesn't use the old FP system to their advantage, but it's not good for me.

Now, I am not the type to rant and rave about how Disney is "ruining" my experience, that's not the case at all. But I do not see this as a change for the better if they limit my total # of FPs to 3. There's a good chance if that is the case, and I have a choice between the "old" way and the "new" way come November, I may just stick with the "old" way, even though I am looking forward to the MyMagic+ system.

Yup!
This is my take.

And what about those of us without smartphones to see what wait times are around the park.

 

[Novakm]

I'm hoping 3 per day means 3 ADVANCE reservations, and the remainder will be distributed during the day.

I agree there is a huge risk that they can't make the tech work right for a few years, but the possibilities are amazing. I could envision a day when you pick 3 favorite things, and the mouse guides you around the rest of the day in a way that minimizes waiting in line. Get off space mountain and get a fp for something you did not think of to kill the time before your haunted house time.

There are a limited number of ride slots available. Right now, everyone waits. With fp+, theoretically it should be possible to schedule nearly everyone so there is no waiting in line. Ever. Some people might think having it scheduled would take he spontaneity out of it, but lets face it, waiting in line or an hour is not very spontaneous.

 

[bcrook]

I'm hoping 3 per day means 3 ADVANCE reservations, and the remainder will be distributed during the day.

I agree there is a huge risk that they can't make the tech work right for a few years, but the possibilities are amazing. I could envision a day when you pick 3 favorite things, and the mouse guides you around the rest of the day in a way that minimizes waiting in line. Get off space mountain and get a fp for something you did not think of to kill the time before your haunted house time.

There are a limited number of ride slots available. Right now, everyone waits. With fp+, theoretically it should be possible to schedule nearly everyone so there is no waiting in line. Ever. Some people might think having it scheduled would take he spontaneity out of it, but lets face it, waiting in line or an hour is not very spontaneous.

There isn't enough FP slots to accomplish that goal. And with this FP+ system that also means nobody would ever get to ride the popular rides more than once per day.

 

[tjkraz]

I can't help but agree here...

Look, Disney was fantastic from 1925-1990 in inventing, engineering, and building tools and features for the amusement experience, movie and TV production, consumer products, and operational/ management strategies...

But they have been equally horrid in computer technology ever since.

Terribly over budget and slow
To develop...and in some ways completely ineffective.

I am cautiously optimistic because we're talking about entirely new systems. It's much more difficult to patch and enhance 20-30 year old legacy systems, adding web-enabled front ends and getting them to interact with other legacy systems in new ways.

However, it's much a much cleaner process to design something new from the ground up.

I am another who often uses 6+ fastpasses a day and dreads that new system. MY FAMILY will definitely be waiting longer to ride the things we want to ride.

As I said before, the question really shouldn't be whether you're "waiting longer", it should be whether or not you can still enjoy the same number of experiences in a typical park day.

A cap of 3 FPs per day plus the dramatic increase in the number of attractions & experiences offering FPs suggests there will be more people using the standby lines. With less ride capacity being surrendered to FastPass, the Standby lines will move much quicker.

Gone will be the time spent walking all the way to Toy Story Mania at the rear of Hollywood Studios for the sole purpose of collecting FP tickets. No more trudging all the way through The Land pavilion to stand in line for Soarin FPs. If you are currently using 6+ FPs per day, you are wasting a lot of your vacation time to walking from machine-to-machine performing busy work.

 

[tjkraz]

Been away for a few days....catching up now. Some points:

1. For folks that think that Disney would like to have more people in standby lines: have you seen this patent filing (and article on The Dis about it)? While not conclusive, I'd say this points to the idea of having people utilize FP *more* not less.

Your theory of more FP usage doesn't really jive with what we know.

More FP attractions with hard caps on each guest's daily allowance doesn't suggest an uptick in overall FP utilization. And Disney would not be spending millions to enhance attraction Standby queues if their endgame was to reduce traffic through those lines.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I have only been passively following the discussion on the Orwellian Disney rollout...

BUT...nothing will convince me that they have any interests in deploying a system that causes people to spend more time riding rides or waiting for them.

that is exactly opposite of their business goals. The goal is to keep people happier with less time devoted to the ride process. That allows a happier (aka loose with the wallet) clientele that can fill out their time with more retail, food and dining time.

That is the goal...not even a question.

and on another note...

And i have to laugh at some of my fellow heavy travelers who talk about using 5, 7, 9 + fast passes PER DAY?!?!?

Good god, i might use two sets per week. How many times can you ride Splash and Pirates? Which are my two favorite rides in history (with Kennywood's Racer, Thunderbolt, , The Hulk, Montu and Aplengeist getting honorable mention)
WDW is a place to relax, eat, take it in, go to the pool...not a place to run around like a nut from ride to ride. the rides aren't that good...to be honest. they're fun - not repeatable must dos each day.

If you want to run around...go to Cedar Point.

You guys have me laughing - anyway

 

[boreas154]

I have only been passively following the discussion on the Orwellian Disney rollout...

BUT...nothing will convince me that they have any interests in deploying a system that causes people to spend more time riding rides or waiting for them.

that is exactly opposite of their business goals. The goal is to keep people happier with less time devoted to the ride process. That allows a happier (aka loose with the wallet) clientele that can fill out their time with more retail, food and dining time.

That is the goal...not even a question.

and on another note...

And i have to laugh at some of my fellow heavy travelers who talk about using 5, 7, 9 + fast passes PER DAY?!?!?

Good god, i might use two sets per week. How many times can you ride Splash and Pirates? Which are my two favorite rides in history (with Kennywood's Racer, Thunderbolt, , The Hulk, Montu and Aplengeist getting honorable mention)
WDW is a place to relax, eat, take it in, go to the pool...not a place to run around like a nut from ride to ride. the rides aren't that good...to be honest. they're fun - not repeatable must dos each day.

If you want to run around...go to Cedar Point.

You guys have me laughing - anyway

You had me at Thunderbolt...

 

[mcd2745]

nothing will convince me that they have any interests in deploying a system that causes people to spend more time riding rides or waiting for them.

that is exactly opposite of their business goals. The goal is to keep people happier with less time devoted to the ride process. That allows a happier (aka loose with the wallet) clientele that can fill out their time with more retail, food and dining time.

That is the goal...not even a question.

and on another note...

And i have to laugh at some of my fellow heavy travelers who talk about using 5, 7, 9 + fast passes PER DAY?!?!?

Good god, i might use two sets per week. How many times can you ride Splash and Pirates?

Agreed on both points. As to the second point, there are people on the theme parks board that have suggested that if - as a result of FP+ and the supposed limit of only one per attraction per day - they couldn't ride Splash, Space or whatever their favorite is 5x a day, it will ruin their trip entirely. I don't get this at all, but "different strokes" I guess. Myself...I want to do as many different experiences as possible - not do the same ones over and over.

 

[tjkraz]

BUT...nothing will convince me that they have any interests in deploying a system that causes people to spend more time riding rides or waiting for them.

that is exactly opposite of their business goals. The goal is to keep people happier with less time devoted to the ride process. That allows a happier (aka loose with the wallet) clientele that can fill out their time with more retail, food and dining time.

That's a pretty gross oversimplification but even taking this at face value, I think you're vastly underselling the happiness aspect.

Arriving at noon to find that all of the Toy Story Mania Fastpasses are gone doesn't make guests happy. Return times which are 5-6 hours out don't make guests happy. Walking through Epcot just to get a Soarin FP in The Land doesn't make guests happy. Crossing the Magic Kingdom from Frontierland to Tomorrowland just for a Space Mtn FP doesn't make guests happy.

I am certainly not a 9 FP per day guest. But I use far more than two per week. And, with all due respect, I think your perspective puts you out of touch with the typical guest. People don't pay $100 per day for admission and build custom travel plans on sites like TouringPlans and TGM to have a "stop and smell the roses" day at the Magic Kingdom.

IMO, the biggest things NextGen will bring to the table are:

1) Control over ride times. Even now, FP is a take-it-or-leave-it system. You either accept the return time displayed or go elsewhere. This will allow guests to pick their exact time.

2) Less meaningless walking all over the parks. I don't think the heavy FP users realize how much time they spend collecting and using those tickets. They aren't in attraction queues, but they aren't in gift shops either. They are clogging up the theme park pathways.

3) Standby waits will more much more tolerable. Lower FP utilization means Standby lines will move faster and the interactive elements will give guests something to do while they wait.

4) Wait times for fireworks & parade viewing, Fantasmic and character meets will go down. Often dramatically.

Fewer attractions per day isn't going to increase guest spending. That only frustrates and disappoints customers. It reduces the overall value of the product.

They can free-up time in select areas (FP running, wait-times for non-attraction experiences) and increase overall guest satisfaction with the attraction lines which are unavoidable. Then you have a happy clientele which is willing to spend additional dollars.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

what we know.

I'm not sure what you mean as known. Are you referring to the 3 attraction limit that's currently in the terms & Conditions?

Did you see this post:

the 3 pass's per day was only used for the testing phase of the new system, and their has been no word as to wither or not it will be staying at 3 when the new system rolls out, or if it will go up. He also said their was no official word on how many annual pass holders will get. hope this helped

And Disney would not be spending millions to enhance attraction Standby queues if their endgame was to reduce traffic through those lines.

Sure they would, if some people will be spending more time in the stand-by queue, while others will be given better access to the FP queues. They don't want to completely alienate those who are, for lack of a better word, left-behind when on-site/deluxe/premium ticket guests book up all the FPs. If nextgen has a $1 bil. capital commitment, and they spend $10 million enhancing queues, that's a pretty small price to pay (1%) for keeping a segment of guests entertained.

I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but are you working under the premise that FP access will be given to everyone equally?

 

[tjkraz]

I'm not sure what you mean as known. Are you referring to the 3 attraction limit that's currently in the terms & Conditions?

Did you see this post:

Yes I did see the post but my comments are limited to what we know from the published terms and conditions, along with information from reputable Disney news sources.

My opinions may change as new information comes to light, but I'm not going to invest time and energy addressing Cast Member rumor & speculation.

Incidentally, most of the tests provided FOUR FP+ experiences per day so the information quoted is not even accurate in that regard. At least one website is reporting that Cast Members were briefed on the system last week, and told it would launch with a limit of three per day.

I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but are you working under the premise that FP access will be given to everyone equally?

Until proven otherwise, yes I am.

 

[3LittleMouses]

Has there been tany comments that the FP +will only be for resort guests only. To me that would make sense since they want to fill the rooms up.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

At least one website is reporting that Cast Members were briefed on the system last week, and told it would launch with a limit of three per day.

To bring this back around to the first post: did those reports indicate whether or not people who pre-book ride times would be ineligible for in-park FP use (I know about the clause in the T&C that says this)?

In any case, I understand your reasoning, but disagree with several of the premises. I think that if I had a choice between 7 attractions, all in FP with minimal wait, versus 10 total attractions, 3 in FP and the rest in stand-by, I'd take the 7. I don't have any data or research to back this up, but I bet there's lots of people like me.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

You had me at Thunderbolt...

The T-Bolt is an american institution