6 year old suspended for pointing his finger

[punkin]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...acc8d4-54fc-11e2-8b9e-dd8773594efc_story.html

Seriously? This warrants a suspension?

 

[sam_gordon]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...acc8d4-54fc-11e2-8b9e-dd8773594efc_story.html

Seriously? This warrants a suspension?

From the article...

Montgomery schools spokesman Dana Tofig said he could not discuss individual students for privacy reasons. But in a written statement, Tofig said the suspension “was not a kneejerk reaction to a single incident.”

In disciplining young students, Tofig added: “We always make sure there is clear conversation with the student and parents about any behaviors that have to change and what the consequences are if that behavior doesn’t change.”

Sounds like the boy and his parents were told what would happen if he didn't stop certain behavior and he didn't.

Yes, pointing a finger at another child and saying "pow" seems very tame and not worth a suspension. But what's the background? It appears this wasn't an isolated incident. Did the school take other steps previously? Did the child (and parents) willingly ignore suspension threats? Should children not be held accountable?

Honestly, I'm surprised the school released as much information as they did.

 

[DopeyDame]

In seeing the headline, I was about to rail against "no tolerance" policies in schools, but after actually reading the whole article, it sounds like this wasn't at all a one time incident or a "no tolerance" first-offense kind of thing. I don't agree that, in general, little boys pretending to shoot things should be suspended. But the kid does need to follow the school rules, and after parents conferences and meetings with guidance counselor, the kid still didn't follow the rules.

 

[thedonduck]

All I can say is there has to be more behind this story than the little told in the article. It comes down to how many warnings did he get before it got to a One-Day. Sometimes it takes an out-of-school to get your point across unfortunately. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with this particular suspension, but it may have been warranted!

 

[kwelch10377]

I'm a little torn on this one. The article states that he had been spoken to about doing this before by a counselor and the assistance principal and they warned one of the parents about the punishment if it happened and the child choose to do it again. I understand that kids test boundries at that age a lot, but there needs to be consequences at some point.

 

[AndyLL]

I talked to my (now 10) son years ago that at school he couldn't even pretend to have a gun.

It's common sense in todays world that schools don't even want a hint of guns on campus.

It isn't that much of a hardship to talk to your kids about it.

 

[TheIncredibles!]

My son was sent to the principal a few years ago for drawing a picture of a man with a gun. He was 6 or 7. (9 now)

There's a zero tolerance policy when it comes to guns, the hint of violence etc in schools and as silly as it may seem at times, I get the reasons for it.

On one side we think about the shooting at Sandy Hook and say "What are the schools doing to protect our kids?" then when something like this happens we think the school is overreacting.

I don't fault the school at all. They are damned if they do and damned if they don't so they may as well do...

 

[vacationer1954]

Maybe we need to take more positive actions like this to confront a casual attitude toward violence among our children.

 

[Fortuosity]

he should be expelled and his finger confiscated by the government

 

[M5ward]

Ban fingers!

 

[punkin]

The child is 6 years old. He didn't hurt anyone. He was playing. There was a 5 year old boy in DD's class (when she was in Kindergarten) who thought he was Batman. I think this is perfectly age appropriate and everyone involved over-reacted. No one should be suspended for waving a finger. That's just ridiculous.

 

[RunningGirl]

The child is 6 years old. He didn't hurt anyone. He was playing. There was a 5 year old boy in DD's class (when she was in Kindergarten) who thought he was Batman. I think this is perfectly age appropriate and everyone involved over-reacted. No one should be suspended for waving a finger. That's just ridiculous.

Since none of us were there (I assume), it's pretty hard to pass judgement on this one. I hate most zero-tolerance rules, but many times there's a lot more history that goes into a decision than one instance shows.

 

[luvmy3]

From the article...
Sounds like the boy and his parents were told what would happen if he didn't stop certain behavior and he didn't.

Yes, pointing a finger at another child and saying "pow" seems very tame and not worth a suspension. But what's the background? It appears this wasn't an isolated incident. Did the school take other steps previously? Did the child (and parents) willingly ignore suspension threats? Should children not be held accountable?

Honestly, I'm surprised the school released as much information as they did.

In seeing the headline, I was about to rail against "no tolerance" policies in schools, but after actually reading the whole article, it sounds like this wasn't at all a one time incident or a "no tolerance" first-offense kind of thing. I don't agree that, in general, little boys pretending to shoot things should be suspended. But the kid does need to follow the school rules, and after parents conferences and meetings with guidance counselor, the kid still didn't follow the rules.

MTE

I talked to my (now 10) son years ago that at school he couldn't even pretend to have a gun.

It's common sense in todays world that schools don't even want a hint of guns on campus.

It isn't that much of a hardship to talk to your kids about it.

ITA, I have spoken to my dses about what is acceptable play, talk and drawings for school. Anything to do with guns is not, and while they can do that stuff to their hearts content at home, school is not the place for it.

 

[pacrosby]

The child is 6 years old. He didn't hurt anyone. He was playing. There was a 5 year old boy in DD's class (when she was in Kindergarten) who thought he was Batman. I think this is perfectly age appropriate and everyone involved over-reacted. No one should be suspended for waving a finger. That's just ridiculous.

I agree. He's 6, not 10. If you put your little kid (and 6 is still a little kid) in some sort of time out and issued threats of more serious punishment again and again and they didn't change their behavior would you automatically think "bad kid, better really start to teach him a lesson" or would you start to say "gee, why isn't he getting it?".

The age of the kid has to be considered when trying to determine the best way to address the problem. Suspending a 6 yo? Not particularly appropriate, nor effective IMO.

 

[luvmy3]

I agree. He's 6, not 10. If you put your little kid (and 6 is still a little kid) in some sort of time out and issued threats of more serious punishment again and again and they didn't change their behavior would you automatically think "bad kid, better really start to teach him a lesson" or would you start to say "gee, why isn't he getting it?".

The age of the kid has to be considered when trying to determine the best way to address the problem. Suspending a 6 yo? Not particularly appropriate, nor effective IMO.

It would seem that the best way to address the problem is show the 6 year old, and his parents that there are consequences to repeatedly breaking the rules. That is an important lesson since its one that we will need through out our life, and 6 is not too young to learn it.
As far as why his behavior didn't change, maybe the suspension will get the parents to wake up and figure it out instead of letting it continue the way it has.

 

[pacrosby]

It would seem that the best way to address the problem is show the 6 year old, and his parents that there are consequences to repeatedly breaking the rules. That is an important lesson since its one that we will need through out our life, and 6 is not too young to learn it.
As far as why his behavior didn't change, maybe the suspension will get the parents to wake up and figure it out instead of letting it continue the way it has.

I don't necessarily disagree with you I just think that suspension is not the way to go. My kids, at 6, would've been thrilled to stay home from school (actually, that's true at any age )...which is why I think suspension is probably best for kids who are truly disruptive or making the school environment unsafe for themselves or others. Pointing a finger doesn't fall into either category.

ETA: and fwiw the parents have no control over the kid's behavior at school. They can tell him not to until their blue in the face but if he chooses to do it, he chooses to do it. And as nchulka points out below, no matter how many times the school says don't do it, you're talking about a 6 yo little boy and 6 yo little boys have a natural tendency to point their fingers and go 'pow pow' AND, developmentally speaking, are still very immature and impulsive. So I guess what they're really doing is suspending a 6 yo little boy for not having better control over himself eventhough he is not hurting anyone. Really????? IDK.... I just honestly don't see how suspending him necessarily changes anything. I think the school needs to think alittle harder here.

 

[nchulka]

It would seem that the best way to address the problem is show the 6 year old, and his parents that there are consequences to repeatedly breaking the rules. That is an important lesson since its one that we will need through out our life, and 6 is not too young to learn it.
As far as why his behavior didn't change, maybe the suspension will get the parents to wake up and figure it out instead of letting it continue the way it has.

I agree that kids need to learn that there are consequences for breaking rules, however there should be NO rule against using a finger as a gun! That is a totally natural thing for a little boy to do and making a rule against it is as silly as making a rule that little boys shouldn't pick their noses! Drawing a picture of a person holding a gun and pretending your finger or some Legos are a gun are totally natural normal things that should not be banned. There was a story a while back about a little boy that had crazy hat day at his school. He was in elementary and he designed his hat as a tribute to soldiers. His hat had American flags and little soldier men on it. Because some of the little green plastic army men had little green plastic guns his hat was taken by the principle. This countries fear of all things gun related has caused people to loose all common sense!

 

[luvmy3]

I don't necessarily disagree with you I just think that suspension is not the way to go. My kids, at 6, would've been thrilled to stay home from school (actually, that's true at any age )...which is why I think suspension is probably best for kids who are truly disruptive or making the school environment unsafe for themselves or others. Pointing a finger doesn't fall into either category.

ETA: and the parents have no control over the kids behavior at school. They can tell him not to until their blue in the face but if the kid chooses to do it, he chooses to do it.

I don't necessarily disagree with you either In this particular incident I have to wonder just how many times the parents have been contacted about the boys behavior since suspension is pretty extreme. We all know parents who ignore their little angel's behavior until it gets to a point where something extreme has to be done about it. Something tells me that parents who contact a lawyer over a 1 day suspension are that type (of course I admit, I could be totally wrong though).

I agree that kids need to learn that there are consequences for breaking rules, however there should be NO rule against using a finger as a gun! That is a totally natural thing for a little boy to do and making a rule against it is as silly as making a rule that little boys shouldn't pick their noses! Drawing a picture of a person holding a gun and pretending your finger or some Legos are a gun are totally natural normal things that should not be banned. There was a story a while back about a little boy that had crazy hat day at his school. He was in elementary and he designed his hat as a tribute to soldiers. His hat had American flags and little soldier men on it. Because some of the little green plastic army men had little green plastic guns his hat was taken by the principle. This countries fear of all things gun related has caused people to loose all common sense!

Regardless of what any of us think about the rule, it is in place now and if its broken there will be and should be consequences. If its repeatedly broken the consequences should definitely be harsh.

On a personal level I think its silly for such an over reaction because lets face it boys like to pretend to shoot stuff. Having said that, I don't have an issue with acceptable "play" in certain situations, so if a school doesn't want it students to run around pretending to shoot eachother I don't have an issue with it. Do I think a 6 year old should be suspended for it, no. Do I think a 6 year old who cant follow the rules and (presumably) has been in trouble for the same thing prior be suspended, yes.

 

[Agri]

The age of the kid has to be considered when trying to determine the best way to address the problem. Suspending a 6 yo? Not particularly appropriate, nor effective IMO.

A lot of schools suspend if they've gone up the 'ladder' - conduct notices, in school suspension, etc. It's totally possible at that age to understand. I think it's completely selling kids short to think that the average 6 year old can't comprehend "We don't do this at school" if his PARENTS are backing up the school rules at home.

Not to mention at that age suspensions aren't just to send a message to the KID but to the PARENTS as well.

Chances are his parents think "Oh, it's just a boy being a boy" or "it's no big deal" which isn't helping that kid at all (obviously) learn that there are situations where certain behaviors are not tolerated. It doesn't so much matter what the child did so much as he kept doing it despite being told no several times - most schools have rules about insubordination.

 

[punkin]

I don't necessarily disagree with you either In this particular incident I have to wonder just how many times the parents have been contacted about the boys behavior since suspension is pretty extreme. We all know parents who ignore their little angel's behavior until it gets to a point where something extreme has to be done about it. Something tells me that parents who contact a lawyer over a 1 day suspension are that type (of course I admit, I could be totally wrong though).

Why should anything be done about a child pointing his finger and saying "pow"?

Regardless of what any of us think about the rule, it is in place now and if its broken there will be and should be consequences. If its repeatedly broken the consequences should definitely be harsh.

How harsh, though? Suspension, expulsion, death penalty? (hyperbole, I know it's not the same thing)

On a personal level I think its silly for such an over reaction because lets face it boys like to pretend to shoot stuff. Having said that, I don't have an issue with acceptable "play" in certain situations, so if a school doesn't want it students to run around pretending to shoot eachother I don't have an issue with it. Do I think a 6 year old should be suspended for it, no. Do I think a 6 year old who cant follow the rules and (presumably) has been in trouble for the same thing prior be suspended, yes.

Certain rules just seem to be there to set children up for failure. Boys WILL point fingers to pretend to shoot. You cannot make them not do it. My BIL refused to get his son any violent toy. They were very hippy dippy, green, tree hugging vegetarians. The child would pick up sticks or use his finger to point and shoot. That's what they do (at this age, anyway. I would not be saying the same thing if the child was 10).