The Very First Dis Book Club Discussion Thread - The Pirate Latitudes

[mainegal]

Lets just say I was SHOCKED at who the Captain was....

I have listened to 6 of 8 discs. I have scanned the rest of the book in print to the end. I still do not know what is meant above.

If it is a spoiler, please PM me and let me know.


Of the characters - I like Lazue. Even though she moves about as a male, they know she is a female. It is bad luck to have a woman on a ship. She questioned Hunter, did he really want her on the voyage? Hunter wanted her because she has special skills.

 

[Bornteach]

Lyn- I meant the Spaniard Captain when the Cassandra is captured. I expected that fight to come much later when they tried to overtake the fort.

I enjoy Lazue as well! She is feisty. I am fascinated by how easily the people of the time excepted her being a woman but living as a man.....

 

[tammyroo]

Hi All

By this point, everyone should have read Part I and will have read Part II by tomorrow. What is your impression of the first two sections of Pirate Latitudes? Which characters, if any, can you relate to at this point in the novel and why?

I found it a quick read. Not a lot of character development. I have found his characterization of every single woman in the book as a prostitute or as acting like one particularly distasteful. What is that about?
I can't really relate to any of the characters either. I'm relating it more to experiences I've had at museums, travel, etc which enhances the experience of reading the novel from a historical perspective.
FYI....At the Real Pirates exhibit today I saw a lot of the things talked about in the book like the grenades. I also learned what careening is....mentioned in the book in Part V, beginning of Ch 32: it the process of beaching the ship and hauling it over on its side to clean off barnacles, repairing the hull etc and left the ship and crew in a very vulnerable position. Never knew that and wouldn't have had any idea what the author was talking about if I hadn't seen the exhibit today.

 

[jpeka65844]

There were also a lot of sailing words that I had no idea what they were. I should've googled them, but I'm lazy.

I told my hubby this and he said "Try reading Master and Commander sometime; that one's REALLY hard!!"

Just finished it and would agree that it's a great adventure novel. MC sets up his action scenarios so well and they play pretty nail-bitingly. Is that a word??

And yes, I'd agree with the PP's previous comment about the women, BUT the men are no saints either. Everyone is pretty dispicable in their own right.

 

[Applemomma]

By this point, everyone should have read Part I and will have read Part II by tomorrow. What is your impression of the first two sections of Pirate Latitudes? Which characters, if any, can you relate to at this point in the novel and why?

Not sure if I relate to them or not but I think the story behind both Anne and Lazue could be stand alone novels on their own! Love these two characters.

I think I've always tended to romanticize privateers because I'm a direct descendant of a few (rum runners too) and I like to think my relatives could have held their own on the Cassandra!

 

[*NikkiBell*]

I agree about Lazue and Anne. I'm really, really surprised that Lazue is even accepted at all because of her living like a man. During the 1600s, that isn't necessarily that was well received.

Anne's character intrigues me. I'd love to know more about her backstory, i.e. the one that involved her being labeled a "witch." That could definitely be a book onto itself. She's a very mysterious type of character and I think that the potential for depth is strong.

 

[Applemomma]

I kind of got the sense from reading other time period books that being labled a witch was sort of a fall back accusation....especially if you were a strong minded woman. Best part of labling someone a witch (for the accuser!) was that they only way to prove she wasn't was basically to kill her!

The witch reference comes up again and sadly this is one of those areas I wish MC had expanded on but of course that will never happen now.

 

[Applemomma]

It never ceases to amaze me how inventive men can be when it comes to torture.....I hate rats.....

 

[BriarRosie]

Boy, I was so wrong about my first impression of one of the characters, now that I've finished the book. I also found another typical "formula" I've seen in movies by the end of the book.

And I think the only female characters I liked where Anne and Lazue. Both garnered a lot of respect, even when they had to do things a bit unorthodox.

 

[A.Mickey]

I don't know if I am late or not, I didn't want to read through the whole thread and have secrets reveled, but I just picked this book up at the library today! I am a couple weeks behind on the podcast and just heard this mentioned. Thank you Kevin and Nikki!! What a great idea! Gotta go catch up on some reading.

 

[bcvdreamer]

I’m enjoying the book, but like a pp said, there are a lot of sailing terms that I meant to look up, but didn’t yet.

I can’t relate to the characters either, but I enjoy their colorful personalities. I wish MC would have gone deeper with the characters, and like mentioned previously, especially the women. I find myself waiting for more character development, but then realize it’s an adventure story.

I like how Hunter selected each crew member for their special “skills” and how their survival depended on those skills. Even though they’re terrible people, they still had to depend on each other. I wouldn’t have trusted one of those characters, but they didn’t have as hard of a time with trust as I thought that they would.

Does anyone else picture Haiti in their mind whenever Port Royal is described? I guess it’s because of how the odor and lack of order is described in the news and in the book.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

I agree, Lisa! I really enjoyed the section describing each of Hunter's crew. I also think it has an Ocean's 11 feel to it like someone said above. I'm particularly intrigued by the doctor. Something tells me he is bad news.

 

[BriarRosie]

I got to thinking a lot about something that was nagging me about the book in the back of my mind, and I finally figured out what it was. The predictable movie-like plot devices. Just like someone else mentioned in Ocean's 11, and I mentioned in The Magnificent Seven / Seven Samurai. (And another movie plot device I didn't mention because it happens near the end of the book.)

Not only did I find myself bored by the plot devices, it finally dawned on me that I was bothered with the book because it started to read like a screenplay. I hated that.

The only semi-surprise I had was from a character I wrote off as insignificant at the time. But I can't mention that until people have finished the book. Poetic justice was served, but that seemed clichéd to me, more the pity.

 

[tammyroo]

I agree about Lazue and Anne. I'm really, really surprised that Lazue is even accepted at all because of her living like a man. During the 1600s, that isn't necessarily that was well received.

Anne's character intrigues me. I'd love to know more about her backstory, i.e. the one that involved her being labeled a "witch." That could definitely be a book onto itself. She's a very mysterious type of character and I think that the potential for depth is strong.

It appears that MC is very accurate when depicting life, pirates, weaponry etc. I learned that there were 2 female pirates that were very well known and highly respected during the Golden Age of Piracy. I was surprised but it makes sense if society was so restrictive for females that they would want to be part of a more democratic system. Still. Lazue seems to be an accurate representation....the real life ones were so fierce they were put on the landing team (or whatever it was called) and those pirates were known to be the most fierce and ruthless.

Does anyone else wonder why the pirates/stories about pirates from long ago are so much more fascinating/intriguing but modern day pirates are loathsome and frightening?

To you MC fans...does this novel read like his others? I agree with PP that it seems like it was written with a movie in mind, but he never sent it off to publish for a reason...maybe he wasn't done with it or maybe editors made changes??

 

[lttlmc3]

Can I just say how excited about this book club I am. I've finished the book and really enjoyed it. I would never have read it if it wasn't for this book club. I love the idea of going beyond my usual boundries of book picks.

 

[miksilver]

I am so glad that other people are reading this book and thinking Ocean's 11 like I did. When I finished reading Part 1 I looked at my DH and said, "So far this book is Ocean's 11 meets Pirates".

I've read a bunch of other MC novels in the past and I have to say the beginning of this novel is very much in his style. It's fast and descriptive. But when I read halfway into Part II and III I found it dragged a little and the pace just wasn't the same. I found it lost some of the edge it had in the beginning. Now, that's not to say that all of MC's books are great, but this one had the beginning, just not the ending for me. And I've always felt that MC, especially after Jurrasic Park, wrote most of his novels intending them to become movies.

As to the question of why we find pirates fascinating I think it's a mulit-facated answer. Part is because of Disney. The 3 Pirate movies have been absorbed into our popular culture. Captain Jack Sparrow anyone?

Part is because pirates are part of a history that is geographically close to the United States or even part of the US, like Florida. In the travel that I've done to the Caribbean, almost all of the Islands have some sort of history with pirates and most of them capitialise on this history with pirate stores, merchandise, mueseums, pirate cruises, pirate festivals, etc.

And, I think part is because everyone likes to think they have a little pirate in them -- that "take what you want, give nothing back" attitude. Pirates are naughty. You know they are not good people, but sometimes you just want to root for them. Also remember, when it comes to most pirates it's all about what side you were on. One country's pirate is another country's national hero.

Pirates represent adventure, freedom, the high-seas. That sounds like so much fun -- even if the reality of it wasn't.

 

[PinkBudgie]

I've never seen Oceans 11 but I'm wondering if he wrote this with a movie in mind. Or if he purposely put in every pirate stereotype to sort of be funny about it. I'm more than half way through and I'm enjoying it but the characters seem to be a little extreme in their stereotypes.

 

[hmonkeyruns]

I'm finished the book and unfortunately it never really won me over. It had some exciting scenes, and some characters with potential, but I wasn't impressed by the whole package.

My feeling is that he wrote this as a very rough draft of a book and wrote down any idea that popped into his head just to get it all down on paper. I bet he wrote it as the basis for a screenplay but then abandoned the idea when Pirates of the Carribbean took off and never went back to refine anything that he'd written originally.

The things that bugged me the most (spoliers so I'm going to white print): the kraken attack - seriously, a giant squid reaching through the portholes to attack? Are you kidding me? And the whole "she's a witch, mark my words" followed by the candles and pentagram stuff. Just out of left field and then completely abandoned and never mentioned again. What was the point?

I also wish that MC had taken the time to tell us what was going on back at Port Royal instead of just saying "Oh yeah, while you were gone, there was a giant power shift." A couple of interspersed chapters could have set the scene and maybe built up some tension. Similarly, I would have liked some writing from Sanson's perspective on the Cassandra so we would have been more prepared for the end scenes.

I found the whole thing frustrating because I really wanted to like it and I just couldn't.

 

[Bornteach]

I agree about the whole witch a kraken thing, that bugged me too and almost rang of sci fi.

I enjoyed the end and the epilogue. I knew that Sanson was going to be the one in the courtroom. I enjoyed hearing how the interaction at the end went down.

I thought the whole thing about Mrs. Hackeltt being "fat with child" only after 6 weeks was a little far fetched.

I would have liked to have heard more about the overthrow of the government. That would have added to the suspense.

This was so far different than what I normally read I enjoyed it but I don't think I would see it as a movie for fear of the gore.

 

[Applemomma]

I absolutley think MC wrote this with a movie in mind. Some sections, when I reread it , jumped out at me as only being in there for that reason....the scene with Mrs. Hacklett and Hunter for example. And a few others into Parts 3 and 4 which I won't bring up yet but two whole sections made me think "what was the purpose of that!"

It would be interesting to know how much the editor would have struck a red line through if it had been anyone other then MC, especially since this was post death.

However, after saying all that, would I go see the movie if it came out? You betcha!