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View Full Version : MONORAIL AT SSR and/or DD in FUTURE?


dvc-NE
12-27-2005, 06:00 PM
Has anyone heard besides Margouxh that SSR and/or Downtown Disney may get monorail service ? That would be a great asset!!

Rozzie
12-27-2005, 06:15 PM
this is one rumor that I never heard. I would think it would not be cost effective at all. I was floored when I learned what the operation costs (on the history channel show the other night) for the current monorail are....

NJBlackBerry
12-27-2005, 06:17 PM
That would be a hugely expensive to build and operate asset.
Monorail rumors turn up from time to time. There are several on this board...

keishashadow
12-27-2005, 06:26 PM
Bought DH a "gag" gift for Xmas, a remote control monorail. He hasn't put it down, always said he wanted to pilot one...kids.

A few interesting facts on the box:

*They travel up to 47 miles an hour (WDW is approx. 47 sq. miles, give or take a few).

*Can transport in excess of 200, 000 patrons/day.

A bus driver related on our last trip that the rails are giant lightening rods and are "down" quite frequently...indicated that WDW is the lightening strike capital of FL.

Horace Horsecollar
12-27-2005, 06:37 PM
Has anyone heard besides Margouxh that SSR and/or Downtown Disney may get monorail service ? That would be a great asset!!
Somewhere, many years ago, I saw Imagineering artwork showing a monorail beam gracefully curving around what was then Disney Village (now Downtown Disney Marketplace). The monorail was never built, and it's highly unlikely that it ever will be.

All this pre-dates SSR. In fact, it pre-dates The Disney Institute. But the easement is still in place. The paperwork for SSR includes legal language about the monorail easement through SSR. That's undoubtedly the source of the rumor.

There has never been a plan to build a monorail to SSR, and nobody should take the easement as an indication that monorail service is coming to SSR.

The new Las Vegas Monorail cost $654 million for just 4.4 miles. It uses the same Bombardier technology as the WDW Monorail. It wouldn't cost that much to build a monorail extension at WDW, but it would still cost a bundle.

Dean
12-27-2005, 06:48 PM
Much of Disney have written access from years ago for the monorail and this includes both OKW and SSR. I'm sure this is origin of the rumor, we discussed it here 2-3 years ago. I think you can assume no major changes in the monorail setup.

PHILCT
12-27-2005, 08:04 PM
I like the idea of an expanded Monorail System at Disney.

Yet surprisingly, The Monorail System is not cost effective.
A lot of large cities have found it to be more expensive than they could afford to implement light rail/Mass Transportation systems.
This even includes Florida's hopes for a Central I-4 light rail system.

Amazingly Disney saves a lot of money running all those buses over the place instead. Those buses amaze me pouring black thick smoke into the rental car window riding directly behind them. I think Walt would have gasped if he saw that black smoke coming out of those Park to Park/Resort bus exhaust systems. I think about those buses when I am visiting the Universe of Energy Exhibit. Where is the hybrid/hydrogen/bus of the future?

If Walt were with us still, he probably would have gone for this Monorail Expansion idea, but it would probably cost too much in the end to operate and maintain.

Now if we could get the Orlando MCO Airport Terminal Shuttle to go directly to Disney DVC Resort stops, Hmmmm.

Maybe I am just blowing smoke on this idea ?


:moped:


Phil

rugelus
12-27-2005, 08:09 PM
I will not be happy until the Monorail has a stop at my house!

dvc-NE
12-27-2005, 09:51 PM
I will not be happy until the Monorail has a stop at my house!


I take it you are a Florida resident? :rotfl2:
Don't mention Ohio. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

JimC
12-27-2005, 10:27 PM
Here is a link to the 1977 concept model (http://www.disneypix.com/Recreation/DowntownDisney/ConceptLBV.htm) for Downtown Disney that showed what looks like two monorail lines serving that area of the property.

Disney had announced some years ago a master transportation plan that included light rail as an affordable means to achieve the monorail concept and to drastically reduce the need for bus service. That project is probably on the shelf waiting for funding or other conditions to bring it back to life.

JimC
12-27-2005, 10:35 PM
...If Walt were with us still, he probably would have gone for this Monorail Expansion idea, but it would probably cost too much in the end to operate and maintain....Phil

Walt was an innovator and a risk-taker. He would have been on the leading edge and pushing the envelope. Alas those attributes left Disney in December of 1966.

His original concepts for his Florida project envisioned a mix of transit innovations including a mass use people mover system like the ride in WDW.

DVCPAT
12-27-2005, 11:51 PM
this is one rumor that I never heard. I would think it would not be cost effective at all. I was floored when I learned what the operation costs (on the history channel show the other night) for the current monorail are....


I’m curious, what did the history channel say the operational costs are?



I found a few articles that say….

Some interesting statistics on the Mark VI (unless noted otherwise),
currently operating at the Walt Disney World Resort:


Monorails regularly operate at an amazing 99.9% reliability. No other form of transit can touch that number. The rubber tires get little wear running on smooth guideways. Typically, each load tire gets over 100,000 miles of travel before being replaced. Walt Disney World has a total of 12 trains and during peak seasons at least 10 are on the beamway serving passengers 17 hours a day. There are even times when all 12 trains are operating, sometimes carrying over 200,000 passengers a day.

Monorail Cost (Approximately):
Train $7 Million Dollars Each
Beam way $1 Million Dollars Per Mile (1982)

Operating Costs: (Oct 1, 1980-Sept 30, 1981,Mark IV)
$3,347,000,
$7.00 per train mile,
$.08 per passenger mile

Caskbill
12-28-2005, 12:56 AM
I don't think you'll see a monorail going to DD simply for one reason. It would allow direct, easy access to Epcot and MK from DD, making the 'free' parking area at DD very attractive for people to use and save the $$ parking fee at the theme parks.

It's for that very same reason that they don't run busses directly between the theme parks and DD. On a number of occassions we've seen people who have parked at DD and then taken busses to one of the resorts and from there catch a bus to one of the parks, all just to save paying that parking fee. In fact, SSR was (and maybe still is, don't know) a problem with people from DD and the hotels in that area walking to SSR and catching DVC busses to the parks.

Imagine what it would be like if people could catch a monorail at DD. You could forget about ever finding a place to park there anymore. They'd have to start charging parking, or put time limits on it, or something. Trying to get parking for Cirque, or a movie, or just plain shopping, could become a nightmare.

Just IMHO.

Disney Doll
12-28-2005, 08:56 AM
I think the cost of a monorail system will preclude it from ever being built as a means of mass transportation any great distance around the "World", other than where you see it now.

TheRustyScupper
12-28-2005, 10:17 AM
Has anyone heard besides Margouxh that SSR and/or Downtown Disney may get monorail service ? That would be a great asset!!


It is Janaury 1st upcoming, not April 1st.

spiceycat
12-28-2005, 10:52 AM
If WDW decides to expand the monrail it will first do it parks. Studios and AK - before anything else.

since it is so expensive - don't expect the monrail any place else....

we were at Epcot when the monrail broke down. It took them hours and I mean hours to fix it.

then they didn't have a backup plan. Now they do - a bus will come and get you.

DisFlan
12-28-2005, 12:40 PM
We've been hearing the rumor about the "monorail to Disney Village" (waaay before it was DTD and DI) since we first started staying in the Disney Village in 1984.

Don't hold your breath.


DisFlan

DVCPAT
12-28-2005, 02:25 PM
I don't think you'll see a monorail going to DD simply for one reason. It would allow direct, easy access to Epcot and MK from DD, making the 'free' parking area at DD very attractive for people to use and save the $$ parking fee at the theme parks.

It's for that very same reason that they don't run busses directly between the theme parks and DD. On a number of occassions we've seen people who have parked at DD and then taken busses to one of the resorts and from there catch a bus to one of the parks, all just to save paying that parking fee. In fact, SSR was (and maybe still is, don't know) a problem with people from DD and the hotels in that area walking to SSR and catching DVC busses to the parks.

Imagine what it would be like if people could catch a monorail at DD. You could forget about ever finding a place to park there anymore. They'd have to start charging parking, or put time limits on it, or something. Trying to get parking for Cirque, or a movie, or just plain shopping, could become a nightmare.

Just IMHO.


I agree. The only monorail expansion that would make any financial sense is to have an attraction that charge admission (theme parks) at the opposite end. If monorails were inefficient people movers, Disney never would have constructed them back when fossil fuels were dirt-cheap. Today, bus fuel is much more expensive and electric drive trains are much more efficient.

I would guess Disney would need a catalyst other than efficiency for expanding the monorail line. It would probably have to be added as an attraction to a new flagship deluxe resort or fifth theme park. The expansion could then connect MGM and AK

G8RFAN
12-28-2005, 03:28 PM
Not that I even remotely think they would build a monorail extension, but they could easily gate the parking areas at DTD and charge an hourly rate. This way if you park for shopping or food, you don't have to spend the full rate. If you spend a more than say 6 hours you pay for the full day which can be $10 which is more than you would pay at the parks. No benefit for cheaters and problem solved. La Nouba , movie goers and restaurant guests could get a discount stamp on their ticket. DQ patrons could get the entire parking fee waived. Bars at PI could also provide stamps. In any event, DL has a very similar arrangement with parking and no rebates for the hourly parking for DTD guests.

characterbrkfst
12-30-2005, 12:50 AM
Last time we were there a cast member mentioned that there was a plan for a monoral system for all of the Disney locations. But is was a multi-billion dollar effort and who knows when tha would happen.

DizWacko
12-30-2005, 09:08 AM
If Disney were to expand the monorail, why on earth would they even consider SSR/DTD area ? If anything, they would expand it for the non-linked parks such as AK/AKL..

cobbler
12-30-2005, 10:36 AM
I can see how putting a monorail at DTD/SSR would be a problem for parking. I would be highly irritated if I went to go park by my room and couldn't hardly find a spot because people parked there.

I think they would have to allow only those staying at SSR to be able to enter the gates at that point. Or at least those staying on property. Or do like the Contemporary does, limit it to 3 hours or less if you aren't staying there. Probably have to do that because of the spa.

doubletrouble_vb
12-30-2005, 11:08 AM
IMHO if Disney decided to extend the monorail to DTD they would also handle the parking problem. Handling it would be pretty easy to do once you've decided to go to the huge expense of the monorail. All you would need is a gated parking garage. In order to get to the monorail entrance you would either need to enter directly from the garage or by way of the pedestrian entrance/exit. The pedestrian entrance would have an automated entry that accepted hotel keys, annual & season passes and park tickets that had been used at least once that day in one of the four big parks. For people who paid to park but don't have tickets yet the lot attendant/guest services could give them temporary gate passes upon request if they wanted to go into DTD before entering a park.

However the ONLY reason I can see Disney doing this is if they wanted to use the Trans and Ticket center for a new revenue stream. Which isn't a bad idea...its already on a major road and has plenty of acreage with built in monorail access.

PS. I love the idea of the parking garage. This is one of the things I think Universal did better than Disney. The garage gives you and your car shelter from the sun and rain.

cdpa4d
12-30-2005, 11:20 AM
I heard from a pretty reliable souce that if Disney wanted to connect Animal Kingdom and Disney Studios to the monorail system (just the parks) it would cost about 1.5 Billion dollars.

If they decided to connect SSR to Downtown Disney with a monorail you can bet our annual dues will go through the roof. Disney is surely not going to eat the costs.

tmt martins
12-30-2005, 11:33 AM
Just another rumor put out to help sales .I think these things are told to CM's to get things started.I know they bugeted big money for transportation and the monorail is not only an efficent way to move people but also some of the Magic ay Disney.

On the History channel special the other night they said it's UPTIME was 99.98% during reg time and 99.8% during peak hours .They have their act together with it and it's not like a City that has to pay an outside source for upkeep and so forth.When things are done in house the expense is not nearly as great.

Dale-n-Chip
12-30-2005, 12:04 PM
In any event, DL has a very similar arrangement with parking and no rebates for the hourly parking for DTD guests.

Here's the DL DTD parking info, direct from the DL website:
Your first three hours of parking are FREE. An additional two hours can be validated at AMC® Theatres and at table-service dining restaurants. After that, the cost is $6 for each additional hour, charged in 20-minute increments.

The entrance is gated where you have to pick up a ticket. It reminds me of airport parking, if that helps. That said, one night when I was visiting DL's DTD at park closing time they were just waving people out, trying to get traffic flow going. Of course that was the night I had rushed back to my car after eating and shopping to meet the time limit. . . :rolleyes: