DCA to become Disney's America

[Bork]

Al has a very interesting update on Mouseplanet. Could DCA's failure, combined with recent events and Eisner's supposed change finally bring us Disney's America? Could DCA become Disney's America in a few years?

It makes so much sense and would be a fairly easy redo. The timing is right. People would be very supportive of an America theme park. And with attendance being so terrible in the near future, it would be a good time to make the change.

I could see this becoming a huge success. I know this is all rumor and speculation now, but I am really excited about the possibilites.

Time for Disney's America? (http://www.mouseplanet.com/dca/america.htm)

[YoHo]

MR Lutz has obviously been reading my Posts. Lets hope mr. Eisner has as well. :)

[azlaura]

I think this is a super idea!! I was at DCA this summer and didn't stay long. There was very little for my 4year old to do! This would be a great way to support America, give people jobs and make that park truly something special!!
How do we let Disney know????
Laura

[toefungus]

No, this is really and AWFUL, and very stupid idea. It would be the biggest waste of money. It would cost so much money to knock things down, change the theming, and build more attractions. DCA is here to stay (like it or not), and we could see Disney's America as a 3rd park at DL, 5th park at WDW, or a new park somwhere else. No way will they ever "transform" DCA into a new park. It's just funny even at the thought of them doing this because it's so outrageous. :p

[azlaura]

Sorry-didn't know you were being sarcastic!!
I like the idea of an America themed park-though!:confused:

[DisneyFanGuy]

Laura, I don't think anyone was being sarcastic. It's a great "pipedream" idea. Disney would be saying that they wasted hundreds of millions of dollars and then spending hundreds more to re-theme a brand new park. Al says something similar in that article.

Before they do anything like that they need to be completely sure that there is no other way to save that park. I would expect a bunch of changes over the next couple of years before anything like is tried

Let's see what they do.

[MickeyMoose15]

They probly won't go thorugh with it....if you read the chapter on it in Eisner's book "Work in Progress" you'll see why. Too much bad things happened to it to be resurrected no matter how much we want it.

[YoHo]

I disagree Toefungus. As I've indicated before, very little would need to come down. Just a few name changes and additional rides. Get ride of the tortilla makers and such. California history is history too. its doable and relativley cheap change.

[lrodk]

I think the type of conversion needed to turn DCA into a historical park is unrealistic. They'd have to tear down the golden gate bridge outline, hollywood section, boardwalk, etc. Just too much money involved to pull it off. Plus, such a move would be an admission of failure on Disney's part, something they very rarely do. Wallstreet analysts would have a field day with something like that. I'm more for them building the park as originally planned at another location, preferrably on the East Coast, near New England or on another tract somewhere in Virginia. That whole area oozzes of American History.

[hopemax]

They wouldn't need to turn it into a "historic" park though, just change things to be from different parts of the country.

Hollywood could still be Hollywood, no changes needed.

Paradise Pier could be turned into Coney Island, and they could replace Mulholland Madness with a show building and make it something "New Yorkish."

Bountiful Valley Farm could be the farm-belt in the middle of the country

Condor Flats could easily be any Airforce base or it would fit easily with Seattle's aircraft industry (Boeing). The movie would have to be redone, the queue just needs some pictures of people not from California, but that's easily managed.

The Grizzly Peak area could easily be changed into a Rocky Mtn or Cascade Mtn. theme

The Golden Gate bridge could stay since it is a major symbol of America.

A change from a California park to an American park would only take a couple new movies, and some signage. Could it really make the park any worse than it is? (I know some people really like it, but the attendence speaks volumes about the general appeal) But it opens up so many more avenues for expansion.

[Another Voice]

As much as I believe that Mr. Lutz’s source are very reliable, Al may have jumped the gun on this one – but not as much as you might think. Most of California Adventure was developed outside of WDI and a lot of “spare” time in Imagineering has been spent working on fixes even before the park opened. Some of these plans even included the “repurposing” the entire park. Plans for a movie studio and for a mini-America were well developed prior to February, along with concepts for a few other overall themes. Granted, most of these plans were to soothe bruised egos and to out the creative shallowness of DCA, but the plans have existed for a long time.

On the practical side, the park was in serious shape even before the war -- (before the war… I will always feel sad writing that phrase) – and major changes are still under serious discussion. While a dramatic change would mean admitting and error, keeping the park open as it is would be foolish. And besides, Wall Street likes bold decision making; fire the right people, announce new plans and Mr. Eisner could look like a hero to the stockholders.

As people who have been to DCA can admit, the park is not one of Disney’s better examples of imagination and detail. Paradise Pier is nothing but steel rides bolted to a cement foundation, the rest of the park is made up of simple show buildings with very simple facades. The only true themed structure in the park is Grizzy Mountain.

DCA as it is today is nothing more than a collection of bits from other projects. Paradise Pier is exactly the concept that had been planned as the original Boardwalk at WDW and as an area for Port Disney. Condor Flats was lifted from America (although the attraction was downgraded from the concept for Virginia). The Hollywood Pictures Backlot is familiar to anyone who has been to WDW. The raft ride is an off-the-shelf purchase with some additional rockwork. Since these attractions were re-themed to fit “California”, it’s going to be very easy to re-do them to fit another theme.

All but the tortilla making show – that’s an attraction that must forever remain unique to California Adventure.

[mogley]

K this would never ever ever ever ever ever replace california adventure it just wont happen 100% not a chance. They could make it somewhere else and would be great but they will not replace the theme of one park to make another in its place. People would compare the attractions from california adventure to the new themed ones and will just be even more frustrated that it is all baslicly rehash. It would cost a **** load of money which do you honestly think disney would put in? they newest ride they have right now is a rehash DUMBO RIDE! disney is in a dark age ladys and gentelmen they seem to be putting less and less theme and thought into the attractions that it is looking like paramounts great america or another sucky amusment park! *cough*cough*can you say paridise pier? dont get me wrong its great fun.........................but its not disney its boardwalk. well im getting a tiny bit side tracked lol well basicly forget this rumor becuse even though it would be loads of fun but so would if we got mgm and animal kingdom in california but its never EVER going to happen.

[carterman_12]

Toefungus, you are absolutely right. It would a very stupid and expensive thing to do. Think about it...it wouldn't be a thing that they could just do while the park is open...they would have to close the park itself, which i'm sure is the last thing that DLR wants to do.

[MickeyMoose15]

It would be nice to see this park built some time in the future but it won't happen right away though.

[toefungus]

Plus if this does happen, Disney would me admitting that DCA was a failure, and that they messed up. I'm sure they wouldn't want to do that. I would really like to see Disney's American in Virginia, becuse it would be a lot closer to me that wdw. :D

[SPAGo 98]

Acutally, if they make the announcement soon, they could cover all their bases by claming that the recent events have shown them the necessity for more patriotism, and that people have shown great interest in a Disney's America. Then they could slowly rebuild it, and in 2 or so years ... what am I talking about, it's not gonna happen. http://www.wdwinfo.com/sites/family/bluemad.gif

It's wishful thinking. I really would like that to happen, but I doubt it.

[YoHo]

Guys, Read between another voice's lines.
The project's already been worked out. there is almost no themeing to remove. some of the stuff has already been lifted from Disney's America.
Finally, the notion that they wouldn't admit a mistake is so 4 weeks ago. Fortunatly and unfortunatly, the War and everything else has FORCED Disney to change its thinking. Trust me, its as viable a plan as any other and it won't cost them much money. And I personally think that California is the perfect place for an American history park, ESPECIALLY one with lots of colonial history after all, If I'm out east, I can go to the battle sites and the monuments. If I'm out west I CAN NOT!

[toefungus]

I'm sorry, I can't help but laugh. :p This whole idea is just so crazy it's funny. There are other rumors going around that Disney-MGM STudios is going to re-done into a coaster park too! http://www.wdwinfo.com/sites/family/lol.gif I don't know where all these ideas of "re-doing" parks are coming from but they're all false. Once I hear it come from Big Mike himself, I will never belive it. Sorry to burst your bubble. :)

[YoHo]

Well, they are being confirmed (as ideas, not as concrete plans)by a poster(Another Voice) who has proven to have a finger on the pulse of Disney. I have no doubt in my mind that MGM-studios turned coaster park is an idea being floated. Just as I firmly believe that Disney's America is. Why the seemingly sudden disregard for people that seem to have an inside scoop?

Of course nothing is true till the park is built, but I'm dealing in possibilites. currently there is nothing substantive has been announced, yet we KNOW something is happening.

[Cheshire Figment]

If the people from Disney had payed attention to those of us from Northern Virginia we would currently have a Disney Park 22 miles from where I live. The people in Prince William County, where the park was intended, would have voted with about 85% majority to have it. Unfortunately, the VERY RICH people in the next county out (Fauquier) which includes the Publisher of The Washington Post had the theory of "Nowhere near our estates", told terrible lies, and drove Disney out. Of course, Disney was unwilling to take the advise of those of us who had experience in the tactics of the people who wanted to keep Prince William County as a buffer zone from those of us in the developed Fairfax County.

[PrincessAurora]

but I will. I posted to the financial Board back in early 2000 about how this park was going to tank and why. No one would believe me. Any soap or romance writer will tell you what happens when you stray from the "formula". Disney has a formula that works and going off on cheap tangents does not help.

While I don't think that a bit of tweaking for a more "universal American" appeal would be bad I think the best and fastest way to make a go at this park is the $$$$$$$$. Admission is WAY too expensive for what you get. I got in during the preview weekend with friends. I would NEVER pay 45+ dollars for this park. I would never pay 35 dollars. If they cut the gate price to $25 - $28 for adults and $10 - $12 for kids, that would up their gate. They should add this Park to AP's at a premium. Park hopping should be sold cheaper! and not in packages of 3+days. If I was at Disneyland, I would go across the street and spend a few hours in DCA for an additional $10 (as a Park hopper feature) but NOT pay full price at both parks for a one day experience.

I am a HUGE Disney nut but I believe in getting the most bang for your buck. Boosting USA theming is fine but if you want to get people in to spend their hard earned dough, LOWER the price of admission.

[gary]

During our last trip, we spent most of our time in DCA because the kids hadn't experienced it yet. Two 12-year-olds, one boy and one girl. They both loved Soarin' and Screamin', with mixed reviews on the other rides. When planning for our next trip, they both said (nearly) exactly the same thing:

"This time, let's spend most of our time in Disneyland".

If they don't grab these kids (or their parents), they've missed their audience.

DCA quite simply needs more well-themed, unique attractions. It needs to be Disney.

A re-work, as suggested by AV, would go a long way, particularly if Coney Island was limited to the area from Maliboomer to Screamin'. Mulholland Madness, Orange Stinger, California Zephyr, and the other cookie-cutter (and OBVIOUSLY SO!) rides outside this zone should be bulldozed (or moved to the Boardwalk!) and replaced with what we think of as "Imagineered" rides. Rides that are "near off-the-shelf", like coasters (BTRR) and flumes (splash), work well if presented correctly. Lots of the crap that's in DCA right now, like the Stinger and the others I listed, doesn't work. There's no presentation.

As I've said in the past, DCA has it's high points - Soarin', Screamin, Griz. It has some OK food places (the Soap Opera Bistro is cute) and you can get a beer (which I like about Epcot). They shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater, but they need to re-think and re-build around the high points. Those few good points simply aren't enough to support a entire park - not with the competition "across the street" from Disneyland.

Gary

[airlarry!]

Jim Hill said he got a kick out of the (he says) false rumors of DCA to Disney's American Adventure switch. But he discounts the rumors and say they will slowly grow the park instead.

See for yourself over at www.laughingplace.com

[YoHo]

That particular jim Hill article contained very little fact. The truth of the matter is nothing has been decided until its announced.

[Peter Pirate]

DCA will change, but it won't be that kind of change. It just doesn' make sense, IMO, to alter it to something else. Really it's a pretty good concept for a Disney America Theme Park elsewhere...Just think of a MK type layout with different lands like (A) California Adventure; (B) The Deep south (featuring Bourbon St., shrimp docks, Anne Rice themed dark ride,San Antonio type boat/walk promenade); (C) New England (see TDS); (D) The Great Midwest (St. Louis Arch, Chicago nightlife/cuisine, Badlands representation), Heartland/farmland projct; (E) The Rocky Mountains (Pikes Peak coaster, Taos NM Baloon adventure, Colorado River White water raft ride)...

I have no idea what possessed me to write this, but there you go...DCA as a great segue to an all new Disney America located in...Texas!
:cool: :cool: :bounce: :cool: :cool:

[Douglas Dubh]

I like it. And I've posted before about the advantages of a Texas location. But an America park should either be set up like the one they planned for Virginia or with the following lands: Northeast, Mid-Atlantic, Great Lakes, Deep South, Great Plains, Northwest, Southwest. Wouldn't make sense to have a "California" land in a park when they've got a California park already.

[HorizonsFan]

Well then, Texas it is!
:jester: :) :)

[Another Voice]

The joke working its way around the company is that Disney opened up the Universal Studios Berry Farm in Anaheim, and now they want to turn it into Six Flags Over Busch Gardens Williamsburg in Anaheim.

All the major indicators for this park – attendance, repeat business, guest spending, market awareness & penetration, and guest perception of value – continue to head down for this park. Unlike Disney/MGM Studios, the Disneyland Resort does not have two other parks, water parks, a dozen of resort hotels and all the other “resort” infrastructure to support an under performing asset for a decade while it’s “fixed”. The Company knows that incremental changes won’t work in the Southern California market. Whether a certain corporate ego will allow the Company to act on matters is another question.

P.S. – Rumor has it that Knott’s Berry Farm actually posted a 4% attendance increase this year. Doesn’t look like it’s the economy was solely to blame for DCA’s horrible opening.

[DVC95-BW]

What a difference - DCA vs. DisneySea (stopping by during a Tokyo business trip in November!)

DCA
- not enough space
- space very poorly used (why all those restaurants??)
- not enough attractions
- cut and paste design

DisneySea
- same size as Tokyo Disneyland (roughly)
- space very creatively used (as far as I can tell from the extensive photo essays available on the Internet and viewing the preview center in a Tokyo trip last year)
- 80% new attractions - no cut and paste - and lots of attractions
- spectacular theming
- built by the Oriental Land Company - project was under budget and on-time - Japan really knows how to build and run a Disney park (Tokyo Disneyland is my second favorite to WDW)

I think the parking lot of Disneyland simply was not enough space. Changing or tweaking the theme might happen over time (Euro Disney -> Disneyland Paris)... they will definitely have to add at least 5 attractions (kill some of the restaurants) to make DCA a standalone attraction. As a long weekend thing, the two parks plus Downtown Disney work ok.

Soaring Over California is really the only stand out attraction (my 6 year-old absolutely loves the ride). The rollercoaster is the smoothest I've ever ridden. The rest is the same as elsewhere.

Over time Disney will get it right, but their timing was terrible for launching a poor park.

When I went it was absolutely empty - very quite - and you could tell the staff was itchy.

[JeffJewell]

- space very poorly used (why all those restaurants??) No worries, mate, at least two of those restaurants are closing/have recently closed, anyway.

Jeff

[YoHo]

According to Mr. Hill, the Wolfgang Puck resturant will be turned into a Little Mermaid themed resturant, so it isn't going away.
Personally, the mondavi resturant seems dumb from the getgo, if I want Disney atmosphere and California wines I can go to Hooks resturant and Winecellar at the Disneyland Hotel and get both with out paying to enter the park.