Anyone watch Oprah today--her coverage on the Hurricane

[sandramaac]

I was really moved at the start of the show---the interviews with the police chief and the mayor. The segment with the doctor and Nate. I think they did a great job showing some of the things we haven't seen.

However, she lost me after that. Next, she had Jamie Fox, and his comment about how 'black folks' bond together. I hate the racial slant in his comment. This is a human event not racial one. And then what really got me was her comment that our government owes an apology to the Hurricane victims. OK, so would that be the president, congress, the house representative and senate reps of Louisana, FEMA, the governor of Louisana, the mayor. Who actually is suppose to apologize for this.

I want to comment further, but what does everyone else think?

[disykat]

I didn't watch it. I saw who was going to be on and figured it would be all about racism. Maybe it's because I'm not a minority, but I really don't think all screw ups can be blamed on race.

[Chris2597]

I watched bits and pieces of the show....but got turned off totally when the racial comments started....I dont think this happened to maliciously slight AA or to not care for their safety as a group. I have seen all differnt races on tv that have been devastated and in my opinion not cared for initially in an appropriate way. I think there should be some accountability for the lack of response at first....yes....they were all told to get out but some didnt have the means to do so....This scenario was actually sited in a NO newspaper forcasting exactly what would happen if the current policies and plans were not reviewed and changed....I dont think it was the federal gov that let the southern cities down, but the local and state did not do their planning very well for an event that was forcasted many times....My understanding is that the feds can not step in until they are asked....and they were not asked so they went to LA gov and she turned down help.....When help was asked for it was late in the game and difficult to immediately proceed with the type of help needed.....I am sure there will be some major investigations to set new standards.....This can not ever happen again.....

[sandramaac]

Good point that you have made---the local and state government planning was just awful

[nliedel]

The ball was dropped. Was it racial? No, probably not. Was it, in part because the area is so poor? I am starting to wonder. I did not watch the show (sometimes it gets too crazy around here to watch Oprah, the boys come home about 4) I wish I had. I normally try not to miss it and yesterdays show would have been something I would want to see.

[Hillbeans]

I watched and I agree with you on some levels.

Interesting thought here - DH asked me last night who was "in charge" during 9/11 and the first person I said was Rudy Guliani.

In this disaster, there really was no one in "charge" and it really made a mess of things. Granted, this damage was much more wide spread so you can't just have one person running the show, however seeing people dead on the street and left there to rot, someone "should" be held accountable.

[minniepumpernickel]

I watched the show, atleast part of it. Did you ignore the fact that the majority of the folks that suffered the most are black? So couldn't that make this a "racial event?"

Someone should be held accountable for how things got so messed up.

[hemispheredancer]

Figures the race card would come into play.

[chadfromdallas]

Figures the race card would come into play.

Just about all were poor and black... :confused3

[PixieDust32]

Just about all were poor and black... :confused3


Oh boy!!

I didn't watch the show, but I knew it! :rolleyes1

[eeyore45]

THis thread got off topic in a hurry.

I watched the show. I started a thread. I dont understand :confused3 the mean comments.

[minniepumpernickel]

THis thread got off topic in a hurry.

I watched the show. I started a thread. I dont understand :confused3 the mean comments.

What are the mean comments? :)

[minniepumpernickel]

Oh boy!!

I didn't watch the show, but I knew it! :rolleyes1

It was a really heartbreaking show, you should have watched it!

[PixieDust32]

It was a really heartbreaking show, you should have watched it!

I SAID I KNEW IT!!!!!!

HEART BREAKING, SAD AND WITH RACIAL COMMENTS! I'LL WATCH THE ONE TODAY.

BESIDES ALL THE CNN AND FOX REPORTS ARE HEARBREAKING REPORTS TOO AND I WATCH THEM ALL THE TIME.

[LindaR]

I was disgusted by her show. If she wants to "help" these folks, she needs to take her rump over to a food line and serve meals, hand out water, etc WITHOUT those blasted cameras. All this said to me was publicity........for Oprah. What the hell was Nate there for? To decorate someone's non-exsistent home? Whoever that so-called doctor was...........showing closeups of dead people and "explaining" decomposition.........where is the dignity? Shame, shame, shame on those who exploit this tragedy! Help is needed, not exploitation or self-publicity. She may have not had her wig on, but she sure had the makeup and false eyelashes on............and she's gonna show "compassion"..........to those who only have the clothes on their backs, haven't had a bath in over a week, etc.

Shame, shame, shame on Oprah.

[Mickeyistheman]

Good Morning Everyone,

I wanted to comment on this topic. If you did watch the Oprah show and was not touched in some way, something is wrong with you. Every single person that is now without a home or a loved one because they died is an American and a human being. It should not matter what race they are. Now keep in mind that the area that was affected is mostly poor and most people are black. If this had happened in a different area I think it help would have been more available and ready.

Someone is to blame for this traveisty. I don't know who, but the Mayor and Gov. should have been more on the ball to get their people out of harms way! They have at least 3 or 4 days knowing this was coming.

The National Guard should have also been involved but unfortunatly the majority of them are over in Iraq. Now the National Guard is for HOMELAND safety and security. They need to be here for this reason. We have thousands upon thousands of troops over in Iraq helping rebuild their country and why??? Now when WE need help we don't have it and our people have to die and suffer for no reason.

Everyone should have some compassion for these poor people. We are very fortunate that we have jobs and a roof over our heads, four years ago this week my life changed forever I pray for that to never happen again.

I really wish people would just take a step out of the box and look at the big picture here. This affects everyone, think about the diseases now that can begin to spread. They don't even know exactly how many are dead. They are estimating it at 40,000 people!!

After I had watched it last night I just looked around my Apartment and felt very blessed and then began to go through my closets and put together clothing for these people. That is the least that I can do.

Please don't just go in for the racial card here, that is a factor I beleive but these are Americans and humans above all else, they should be treated fairly, if that was you wouldn't you want that?

[maleficent1959]

I was disgusted by her show. If she wants to "help" these folks, she needs to take her rump over to a food line and serve meals, hand out water, etc WITHOUT those blasted cameras. All this said to me was publicity........for Oprah. What the *ell was Nate there for? To decorate someone's non-exsistent home? Whoever that so-called doctor was...........showing closeups of dead people and "explaining" decomposition.........where is the dignity? Shame, shame, shame on those who exploit this tragedy! Help is needed, not exploitation or self-publicity. She may have not had her wig on, but she sure had the makeup and false eyelashes on............and she's gonna show "compassion"..........to those who only have the clothes on their backs, haven't had a bath in over a week, etc.

Shame, shame, shame on Oprah.

Um, is it only self-publicity because she is a celebrity? Is it exploitation because her cameras allowed her viewers to see the devastation and horror? Lots of reporters and politicians were there showing us the same stuff. Was that all posturing and exploitation?

Nate was there because he survived the tsunami and Lisa Ling was there because she has been to war zones. I guess they both felt they would be strong enough to go to New Orleans. And from what I've read, Oprah did help out in food lines and distribution. And she's donated food, water, supplies and money both personally and through her Angel Network. Sounds pretty compassionate to me.

[crusin'minnie]

I work during the day and my MIL taped the show for me yesterday. Unfortunately for some reason it did not record. I have gone to the Oprah website and I can order a transcript but not a tape. Ebay does not have anything listed.

Anyone have an idea of where I can get a copy of this show. I would really like to see it!!!

Thanks

[Goofyzgurl]

I was disgusted by her show. If she wants to "help" these folks, she needs to take her rump over to a food line and serve meals, hand out water, etc WITHOUT those blasted cameras. All this said to me was publicity........for Oprah. What the *ell was Nate there for? To decorate someone's non-exsistent home? Whoever that so-called doctor was...........showing closeups of dead people and "explaining" decomposition.........where is the dignity? Shame, shame, shame on those who exploit this tragedy! Help is needed, not exploitation or self-publicity. She may have not had her wig on, but she sure had the makeup and false eyelashes on............and she's gonna show "compassion"..........to those who only have the clothes on their backs, haven't had a bath in over a week, etc.

Shame, shame, shame on Oprah.

Shame on you for not getting the whole story before you commented. From Oprah's website:

Oprah's Angel Network donated $1 million to America's Second Harvest to purchase and distribute food, water, and household supplies to survivors in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee and Texas.

When she went down there she also took two trailers with her full of food and supplies. If she had come on without her makeup, then people would've all been concentrating on why she doesn't have make up and the wig on. She was showing us what the conditions people had to live in for days, there was no self publicity on her part. There is just no satisfying some folks.

[LindaR]

I DID watch her show. I am entitled to voice my opinion! I think the evening news has "shown America" what the conditions are like. Oprah hosts a talk show.......

I'm not disputing her generosity! Whatever she donates is a major tax write-off for her personally, but at least she is donating. I did not like her show. Period. I don't think that every Tom, Dick, and Harry needs to point a camera to show the conditions of the survivors. IF a person is inclined to donate time, money or other resources, they don't need Oprah to show them what the conditions are like. They've already figured that out a long time ago.

There is a huge difference in respect and discretion and self-promotion. I felt that her show was inappropriate. Still do. I am entitled to my opinion, even if it differs from yours.

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I watched her and man--I do hope it grounds her--how many oprah complaint threads on how she's lost touch has their been on the DIS?

Those evacuees were soooo happy to see her.

I think it is just the show for Oprah. Certainly a car giveaway to guests on her show in Chicago would have been frowned upon if she did such a thing.

[AuntieM03]

I think overall the show did a good job of showing the magnitude of the suffering, and I think that if having the celebrities there helps it is a good thing.
I did also have moments where I found myself feeling annoyed. When Lisa Ling asked if the response would have been so slow in a white/affluent area. I just don't know how these comparisons can be made. If it were a white/affluent area most of the people would have been able to evacuate themselves (the same for a black affluent or any affluent area). I also stopped for a second when Jamie Fox said "black people are resilient". I was thinking that I saw alot of non-black people in Mississippi (and some in NO) that also seemed pretty resilient. The last thing that stood out was Oprah saying "America" owed these people an apology. While I agree there should be apologies from some in the local, state and federal government I think "America" as a whole is doing alot to try and alleviate the suffering of those effected. I think we don't do these things because we "owe" anyone anything. I think we do it because for the most part we are a compassionate people.

I did after the show have to remind myself that this is a time when emotions are running high, and I am trying not to let some comments I feel are ignorant get in the way of the message that there are people that need our help.

[Karibeth19]

I was really moved at the start of the show---the interviews with the police chief and the mayor. The segment with the doctor and Nate. I think they did a great job showing some of the things we haven't seen.

However, she lost me after that. Next, she had Jamie Fox, and his comment about how 'black folks' bond together. I hate the racial slant in his comment. This is a human event not racial one. And then what really got me was her comment that our government owes an apology to the Hurricane victims. OK, so would that be the president, congress, the house representative and senate reps of Louisana, FEMA, the governor of Louisana, the mayor. Who actually is suppose to apologize for this.

I want to comment further, but what does everyone else think?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I watched the show twice yesterday, and I could have sworn she said the people of America owed an apology to the hurricane victims. I'm pretty sure that's what she said, because I remember being shocked, and then when I watched a second time with DH, he turned to me and said, "What are we supposed to apologize for?". Like you, I had been moved and touched by most of the show (I cried when I saw the man who wouldn't leave his dog, and also when Faith Hill sang "Amazing Grace"), but she really confused and upset me when she said that. If an apology (which by definition is an admission of error followed by a statement of regret) is owed, it makes sense that it should come from city, state, and national governments, but not from the American people! We may be full of regret for what happened, but what error are we supposed to admit?! The American people have gone above and beyond to give the victims our sympathy, our support, our donations, and our prayers, but I'm not sure what Oprah thinks we are we supposed to apologize for.

[sleepy1]

I also watched her show yesterday and I was very offended by the comment that "the people of America owe these people an apology". The people of America are the doctors, nurses, coast guard and millions of others taking care of these people. I know many like myself have given money and time at local shelters and will continue to do so. The people of Texas have been outstanding in their humanity and generosity. If she wants apologies she needs to get them from their local govt, state govt. and Fema. I will not watch Oprah any more after that comment.

[ZachnElli]

I watched the show yesterday. I didn't think it was that racially divided. I didn't like Lisa Ling's comment on if this had happened to "white affluent" neighborhoods. It did, it happened to everyone, the ones left were the poor ones, the "affluent" white and black and even the not so affluent got the heck out of dodge.

[BibbidiBobbidiBOO]

I watched some of it. Wanted to turn it off several times. It almost went off when the mayor was complaining about the living conditions those at the superdome endured. He sent them there for crying out loud!
Some of it was "touching" and hard not to cry about, but some was offensive imho.

[WDWBetsy]

I thought it was a touching episode. She kinda lost me during the Jamie Fox segment, but overall - an eye-opening look at what's going on. The Nate segment had me crying my eyes out. My DH and I don't have children yet, and we love our dog like a baby. We both discussed this last night, and we both agreed we wouldn't leave our dog either.

I certainly didn't expect to see patients on stretchers waiting on airport luggage carts to be loaded into a military cargo plane - stacked one on top of each other. I knew the number of injured and dead is high, but this showed a clear picture of what people were going through (and still are).

I don't know about you, but there's something wrong with this nation if it's acceptable for the elderly, poor, and children to be waiting hours for medical attention on the floor of an airport or on an interstate ramp. Or for babies to be near death because they're dehydrated. Or for shelters to not have adequate essentials when people have no other choice.

Things have to change on the local, state and federal level. It's not just about volunteering time, money and supplies. It's about insisting on better emergency plans for our communities. We as citizens need to come together to ensure the system works - and works with urgency - for all the people. Not just the affluent who can evacuate, but also the poor, middle-class, elderly, hospitalized Americans.

[DisneyDotty]

I don't know about you, but there's something wrong with this nation if it's acceptable for the elderly, poor, and children to be waiting hours for medical attention on the floor of an airport or on an interstate ramp. Or for babies to be near death because they're dehydrated. Or for shelters to not have adequate essentials when people have no other choice.

Things have to change on the local, state and federal level. It's not just about volunteering time, money and supplies. It's about insisting on better emergency plans for our communities. We as citizens need to come together to ensure the system works - and works with urgency - for all the people. Not just the affluent who can evacuate, but also the poor, middle-class, elderly, hospitalized Americans.

What she said.

[Bunch24]

I watched the show, atleast part of it. Did you ignore the fact that the majority of the folks that suffered the most are black? So couldn't that make this a "racial event?"

Someone should be held accountable for how things got so messed up.

People really confuse this. The people that we saw in the Superdome and Convention Center were mostly black, but the entire New Orleans area is not mostly black, and last I checked people lost homes, loved ones, pets, etc. all across New Orleans, not just in the inner city.

And that's not taking into consideration the Mississippi Gulf Coast. I don't know those demographics, but I'm pretty sure it's not majority black.

I think people see the images of the Superdome and Convention Center and think New Orleans is just that. New Orleans is a lot more than that. The area that the storm hit is actually 57% white, 37% black, 4% Hispanic. It's just unfortunate that a lot of people are being forgotten about just so this country can make it an issue of race.

Follow this link to information on the New Orleans Metro area:

New Orleans Metro demographics (http://www.jeffersontransit.org/CensusPDFs/NewOrleansMSA.pdf)

[M:SteveO]

I think we quickly forget that this is nature, and nature is not racist. Thousands of white people were effected by this storm too. NO is only one part of the tragedy, thousands of homes and businesses were destroyed, where both white and black people work. I can't stand when people like Oprah and Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson play the race card. If the gov't doesn't care about these people as they say because they are black, why are they helping out now in the biggest mobilization of relief efforts in our nation's history. I lost alot of respect for Oprah because of her comments. I thought she would be better than that.

[Free4Life11]

Did Oprah actually say anything about race? If I remember correctly it was Lisa Ling, but I don't remember.

The ONLY thing I didn't like about the show was how they had all the police and security guards around Oprah and the celebs. I just felt like there was probably a better use for those police, I'm sure they are already stretched thin.

[beattyfamily]

I haven't watched yesterday's show yet, but I am watching todays and I cannot believe they showed a dead body. Even the regular news hasn't done, that I've seen anyway. That bothers me.

I do enjoy Oprah's shows. I think she's a nice, generous person but sometimes it does bother me how she has her cameras everywhere she goes. Everything that happens to her or anything nice she does, she puts it on her show. Sometimes it does bother me a little bit.

[Bunch24]

I haven't watched yesterday's show yet, but I am watching todays and I cannot believe they showed a dead body. Even the regular news hasn't done, that I've seen anyway. That bothers me.

I do enjoy Oprah's shows. I think she's a nice, generous person but sometimes it does bother me how she has her cameras everywhere she goes. Everything that happens to her or anything nice she does, she puts it on her show. Sometimes it does bother me a little bit.

And that's one of the things I have a problem with. When Geraldo does it, he's just looking for ratings. When Oprah does it, she's being compassionate.

Where were all these "saviors" before the storm? Why weren't they getting on TV saying "My friends in New Orleans, now is the time to get out of the city"?

[Chris2597]

I heard several of Oprah's friends/other stars were encouraging her to get involved in the relief effort as most of us know that.....when Oprah speaks, loads of people listen.....If she endorses a product...it sells of the shelf....
I agree the National Guard should be in this country defending it....but the major blame for this lies in the local and state gov....I remember seeing the mayor of NY right by the side of police and firemen from the very start of 911, showing bravery and wisdom, leading his city through a tragedy....I did not see this with the mayor of NO....IMHO he ran like a scared rat, telling the people of NO to go to the dome....on their own, with no food, water or med. attention....The reports of the gov of LA being so hands off is unbelievable....I dont think it was simply a race issue....I cant imagine the gov letting the city of NO....the states biggest draw and revenue area sink into the ocean, just because she didnt care about the AA community there....
I am appalled at the Oprah comment about the people of America owe NO an apology....This is just stupid....Americans have opened their arms and pocketbooks to help and what a slap that comment is....I think Oprah is the one that owes the people of the US an apology....

[Bunch24]

I heard several of Oprah's friends/other stars were encouraging her to get involved in the relief effort as most of us know that.....when Oprah speaks, loads of people listen.....If she endorses a product...it sells of the shelf....
I agree the National Guard should be in this country defending it....but the major blame for this lies in the local and state gov....I remember seeing the mayor of NY right by the side of police and firemen from the very start of 911, showing bravery and wisdom, leading his city through a tragedy....I did not see this with the mayor of NO....IMHO he ran like a scared rat, telling the people of NO to go to the dome....on their own, with no food, water or med. attention....The reports of the gov of LA being so hands off is unbelievable....I dont think it was simply a race issue....I cant imagine the gov letting the city of NO....the states biggest draw and revenue area sink into the ocean, just because she didnt care about the AA community there....
I am appalled at the Oprah comment about the people of America owe NO an apology....This is just stupid....Americans have opened their arms and pocketbooks to help and what a slap that comment is....I think Oprah is the one that owes the people of the US an apology....

If the mayor of New Orleans was white, I could definitely see the racism point of view. After all, he's the one that ordered the ones left behind to head to the Superdome and warned them that there would be NO FOOD, NO WATER, NO MEDICINE, so they needed to bring enough for 4-5 days. And he made that announcement with one foot out the door on his way to safety to ride out the storm.

It all starts locally, and the mayor is black, the New Orleans Police Department Superintendent is black, the New Orleans Police Department is 54% black.

I mean, if it's a race thing, then shouldn't these black people be held accountable for failing their own race?

And like I posted earlier, for anyone that believes this is truly about race, just check out the link I posted. Things aren't always what they seem.

[beattyfamily]

:sad1: I'm now watching Part 1 that was on yesterday. I cannot believe how many dead bodies they are showing. I'm sorry but that's just gross and disrespectful, IMHO.

Regarding her making it racial so far she only asked the mayor if the response was slow because the majority of the people were poor. And then Lisa Ling brought up race.

This show is even more sickening then Part 2 that was on today. :sad2:

As far as the response, I blame the mayor and governor first and foremost. The federal level takes time to be mobilized, especially the military.

It's pretty scary what can happen when thousands and thousands of people have to evacuate a city. They (locally) weren't prepared. Would any city be? I don't think so. It's all so so sad. Mother Nature can be so cruel.

[mum4jenn]

I totally lost it yesterday when Dr. Oz told about the people that were not dead yet(but almost) being put in the make-shift morgue to "die in peace".

I do understand why Nate and Lisa Ling were there.


I knew it was a matter of time before Jesse Jackson put his big mouth in it all. Back in 1994 during our big 500 year flood he came here and really messed things up. Before he came black and white were all working together side by side with no problems but then he came in and said the white man caused the food and from then on race relations here have been horrible. Our flood was caused by Tropical Storm Alberto stalling for days in the area.I used to like the man many many years ago. When it looked like he had the possibility of running for President I more than likely would have voted for him(at the time) but now I just can't stand him. As soon as I saw his face I KNEW he would do it again and he did.

[WDWBetsy]

I have to wonder if they showed the graphic footage of the dead bodies to make a dramatic point that in such a tragic disaster, the dead are put aside to care for the living.

Perhaps they showed it because the rescue teams are still dealing with the rescue/recovery efforts, and in the midst of all the urgency - the dead lost some respect by not being cared for in the traditional way. I did notice they took care in covering most of the bodies. It also reiterated the need for why bodies need to be preserved so they don't spread disease.

Think of how many of the victims had to watch and be near the dead, not to mention the smells - and they could only close their eyes, not change the channel.

I'm not saying they were right in doing so, but maybe this was their reasoning...

[goofie4goofy]

I can recall from watching past hurricanes that the Gov of the state would declare it a disaster area "before" the storm actually hits to speed up the process for fed funding. This was not done by anyone in the state of LA. I am not a meterogolist by any means, but I watched this storm apporach, like many others across the nation. It was called a catastrophic hurricane...Does the Mayor and Gov have a TV? Why did the President do a fly over in AF1 and then wait to do anything? Many questions that need answers. The fish stinks from the head down..I think our gov't failed these poor souls on all levels.

I watched Oprah's 2 shows. No they are not pretty, she puts the information out there and it is for you to come to your own conclusion, whatever that may be. Lisa ling is a correspondant for National Geographic and has reported all kinds of disasters around the world. Nate survived the Tsunami.
Dr. Oz is a world renowned physician (I think he is also one of pres clinton's drs) and donated his time and efforts which was badly needed. The rest are just celebs donating thier money and efforts and do what little they can. Hey if they changed 1 persons fate that is a miracle. Oprah along with the other celebrities donated lots of money...giving to charities is a tax deduction...it is a tax deduction for all of us, not just celebrities.

I don't know exactly what happened and why these people were not evacuated properly or sent to the superdome and convention center without food, water and some kind of security for their personal protection or why the levee system was never updated (besides the fact pres bush took the funding money allocated and used it on the war) or why the cries for help went ignored for 5 days ...I do know that it sickens me. And I can't believe this was allowed to happen in this country. The storm is an act of
God, but what happened before during and afterward is another story yet ot unfold....as the suffering continues

[abacobaby]

I'm sorry, but I think somebody owes these people an apology. Do you realize hundreds of people were rescued by other civilians also struck by the hurricane? These are people who had been in or on their homes waiting for over a week. Pardon me, but wouldn't you want an apology if that was you sitting on your roof top hungry and thirsty with no help in sight? I know I would at least want to know what happened and more importantly WHY it happened. None of that suffering needed to be endured, in my opinion.

I personally am glad Oprah showed what she showed. People need to see and hear about the real tragedy of the aftermath of this hurricane. If it wasn't for regular American (and foreign) citizens, Oprah, other famous/wealthy people donating food/water/diapers/toiletries a lot of these evacuees still would have nothing or not much, in my opinion. (Didn't anyone else watch the segment with the young girl holding her baby in Mississippi saying how she sees the trucks with supplies pass by, but nobody ever stops?)

I really could care less about Oprah's motives to film/air her shows or how why she donated money/food to these people. These people were happy to see her, to know someone at least cares enough about them, to know that they have not been cast aside and forgotten. I don't think any of them care about Oprah's real motives, whatever they may be, so why should we? Does it really matter. Because of her and other famous/wealthy people, these people are getting a little bit more food/water/diapers etc. and a lot of compassion that they deserve.

Okay, that's enough for this morning......

[ThAnswr]

I was really moved at the start of the show---the interviews with the police chief and the mayor. The segment with the doctor and Nate. I think they did a great job showing some of the things we haven't seen.

However, she lost me after that. Next, she had Jamie Fox, and his comment about how 'black folks' bond together. I hate the racial slant in his comment. This is a human event not racial one. And then what really got me was her comment that our government owes an apology to the Hurricane victims. OK, so would that be the president, congress, the house representative and senate reps of Louisana, FEMA, the governor of Louisana, the mayor. Who actually is suppose to apologize for this.

I want to comment further, but what does everyone else think?

I have no problem with what Jamie Fox said because it's the truth. You could say the same about Jews, Italians, Asians, Episcopalians, farmers, etc.

Maybe we're getting a little too sensitive about these things.

[BuckNaked]

The National Guard should have also been involved but unfortunatly the majority of them are over in Iraq.


I'm sorry, but this is simply not true. Neither the majority of LA National Guard troops nor the majority of National Guard troops nationwide are in Iraq.

[minniepumpernickel]

I have to wonder if they showed the graphic footage of the dead bodies to make a dramatic point that in such a tragic disaster, the dead are put aside to care for the living.

Perhaps they showed it because the rescue teams are still dealing with the rescue/recovery efforts, and in the midst of all the urgency - the dead lost some respect by not being cared for in the traditional way. I did notice they took care in covering most of the bodies. It also reiterated the need for why bodies need to be preserved so they don't spread disease.

Think of how many of the victims had to watch and be near the dead, not to mention the smells - and they could only close their eyes, not change the channel.

I'm not saying they were right in doing so, but maybe this was their reasoning...

Time magazine shows a dead body too. They didn't cover it because it was floating afce down in the water! :guilty:

[mickeyfan2]

If this had happened in a different area I think it help would have been more available and ready.
Who is helping Waveland, Mississippi? The Red Cross has not even shown up!!

They are estimating it at 40,000 people!!
Actually this was the estimate if the cat 5 had a direct hit on NOLA. Now it will be a few thousand. Yes this still is to many, but many more did survive than originally expected.

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I can recall from watching past hurricanes that the Gov of the state would declare it a disaster area "before" the storm actually hits to speed up the process for fed funding.

It was declared a disaster area in advance---the governor declared it on Friday (someone posted the declaration on another thread) and the President did so in advance as well (though I forget the day).

[bop28]

I guess I have to say that I am a former Oprah Show fan. Lisa Ling's Rich White People remark was so offensive, since the City of NO is run by a Black Mayor, and the State is run by a Governor from the Democratic Party, that are constantly touted to be the only party that cares for Minorities. Did they care as much as they could?

My favorite remark from Oprah, was when she was telling 'us' about the water she was bringing to give to the dehydrating people/babies. She said, my Angel Network came with truckloads of "Cadburry/Shwepps water". I think the people were thirsty for any water Oprah. Did you really have to 'plug' the company for your reimbursement? You can certainly afford to give any water you can find. Did you waste precious time, firming up the deal with Cadburry/Shwepps? If you had donated the water from your own personal account, you could have simply said "I gave water to the people" and not "I gave Cadburry/Shwepps water to the people", and save your own credibility. It's very easy to give, when it comes from someone else.

Oprah thinks the American People owe the victims an apology. How long does it take for someone to drown? The answer is, a lot less time then it takes for any Federal agency to get to the scene, no matter how fast they get there. That is why we have Evacuation plans. Every American City has one. These plans are practised several times a year to avoid the very tragedy that occured. In case the evacuations plans aren't followed, or don't work, we have what we call First Responders. The first responders must be the Local Officials. They are there.They are responsible for the initial life saving efforts. The Federal Government or FEMA is only secondary to the first responders. We all should know that. Can the Federal Government save any of us, including the Rich White People from Drowning?The only way to save people from drowning, is to get them away from the water, before the storm.

Shame on you Oprah. Do you really believe all that stuff on your show?

[mamaprincess]

We all have the right to voice our concerns and opinions, I'm just greatful to all who tried and are still trying to help the victims. I mean all, no matter their opinions.

[Free4Life11]

Oprah just likes to get companies to donate and then take the credit for it...she's been doing this for years, it's nothing new. Plus the companies don't mind because they get a lot of publicity. I'm sure she donates herself but it's a double edged sword -- too little, she should give more, or too much, she just wants to look good. I'll admit I've criticized celebs for both reasons.

[swilphil]

Shame on you for not getting the whole story before you commented. From Oprah's website:

Oprah's Angel Network donated $1 million to America's Second Harvest to purchase and distribute food, water, and household supplies to survivors in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee and Texas.

When she went down there she also took two trailers with her full of food and supplies. If she had come on without her makeup, then people would've all been concentrating on why she doesn't have make up and the wig on. She was showing us what the conditions people had to live in for days, there was no self publicity on her part. There is just no satisfying some folks.

Thanks for the info. I watched the first show and was very moved by it. Oprah was able to really get to the human side of the situation instead of focusing on the politics and who was to blame.

[goofie4goofy]

I guess I have to say that I am a former Oprah Show fan. Lisa Ling's Rich White People remark was so offensive, since the City of NO is run by a Black Mayor, and the State is run by a Governor from the Democratic Party, that are constantly touted to be the only party that cares for Minorities. Did they care as much as they could?

My favorite remark from Oprah, was when she was telling 'us' about the water she was bringing to give to the dehydrating people/babies. She said, my Angel Network came with truckloads of "Cadburry/Shwepps water". I think the people were thirsty for any water Oprah. Did you really have to 'plug' the company for your reimbursement? You can certainly afford to give any water you can find. Did you waste precious time, firming up the deal with Cadburry/Shwepps? If you had donated the water from your own personal account, you could have simply said "I gave water to the people" and not "I gave Cadburry/Shwepps water to the people", and save your own credibility. It's very easy to give, when it comes from someone else.

Oprah thinks the American People owe the victims an apology. How long does it take for someone to drown? The answer is, a lot less time then it takes for any Federal agency to get to the scene, no matter how fast they get there. That is why we have Evacuation plans. Every American City has one. These plans are practised several times a year to avoid the very tragedy that occured. In case the evacuations plans aren't followed, or don't work, we have what we call First Responders. The first responders must be the Local Officials. They are there.They are responsible for the initial life saving efforts. The Federal Government or FEMA is only secondary to the first responders. We all should know that. Can the Federal Government save any of us, including the Rich White People from Drowning?The only way to save people from drowning, is to get them away from the water, before the storm.

Shame on you Oprah. Do you really believe all that stuff on your show?


What I find offensive is that celebrities, such as Oprah can go down there and make a difference but at the time of taping, many people have not yet been helped by the Gov't. This is a natrual disaster worsened by the lack of federal/gov't response...celebrities had nothing to do with this disaster. The difference in these peoples lives are due to donations, volunteers (of all kinds..celebs are also volunteers) and heroism. If a celebrity can get a company to donate food, water, clothing what ever...well that's more than what I could ever do...and much more than the gov't has done. So if it takes a famous person to get things done and get help, food and comfort to people so be it, but mentions the name of the company...so what? Most of the releif you see is because of volunteers and the American people due to donations to the red cross/salvation army and various charities.

If you donate, you will get a receipt which can be used as a tax deduction. It does not matter how big or litttle, just give.

[mamaprincess]

The red tape issue is major.

[totalia]

Can we please stop the blaming of the city, state and federal gvt? We all know who everyone thinks is to blame. Its been made abundantly clear by everyone, including me.

I agree with Oprah that the gvt (all of them) owe the people an apology. An apology for not having the emergency systems working right. An apology for not responding quickly enough. An apology for not treating this with all the respect that was needed.

I do not, however, think ANY of this was racially motivated. We are all the human race. I think that it has simply shown incompetance in the people we have trusted to keep us all as safe as possible.

But none of that has to do with race. It has to do with stupidity.

[WaltD4Me]

I only saw the beginning of the first Oprah show, but I've read about how Dr. Oz said they were putting the dying in the morgues to "die in peace" and I was just wondering what exactly he said and did they actually show them doing that?

The reason I'm asking is because for ALL the media attention that has been given to Katrina and N.O. and as much as I've been watching the news channels, the only time I've heard this was on Oprah. I'm not saying it isn't true, but it just seems strange that I haven't heard this even mentioned anywhere else, not on CNN, Fox, MSNBC, Larry King, or anywhere. Of course Oprah was really the first to show dead bodies like she did, but still even after Oprah, they are talking about forced evacuations and just about everything else, but nothing at all about putting the dying into morgues. :confused3

[BuckNaked]

I don't know about putting them in morgues to die, but I know that I heard numerous reports on CNN & MSNBC about how as supplies were dwindling at one of the hospitals, the doctors and nurses were forced to ration care to the point that those who they knew were going to die didn't receive all of the care they could have. On the same show, they said that the same thing was happening at the airport, i.e., helping people that could be helped and letting others die.

I'm not criticizing those efforts and decisions, just pointing out that it was mentioned in the media.

[swilphil]

I don't know about putting them in morgues to die, but I know that I heard numerous reports on CNN & MSNBC about how as supplies were dwindling at one of the hospitals, the doctors and nurses were forced to ration care to the point that those who they knew were going to die didn't receive all of the care they could have. On the same show, they said that the same thing was happening at the airport, i.e., helping people that could be helped and letting others die.

I'm not criticizing those efforts and decisions, just pointing out that it was mentioned in the media.

This was the same thing Dr. Oz said on Oprah. As I remember it, he said some people were too sick and nothing could be done to save them. Then he said they were moved to the morgue to die in peace. This was at the airport that was turned into a make shift hospital. The scene was very chaotic in the hospital area with people crammed together and even lying on the baggage claim conveyer belt. Many were very old and were wearing hospital gowns. I don't believe they showed the morgue itself, but they did show some dead bodies that were covered by sheets.

[bop28]

In my State, the officials don't report the names or pictures of the deceased until the proper family notification can be made. Families are still hoping to be reunited with loved ones separated by the hurricane.

Oprah, by showing the world, the oozing flesh of the dead, 30 yr. old girl, very possibly 'notified' this poor girl's family, in the most shockingly, painful way.
Although it made for wonderful ratings, think for a moment, about this girl's poor mother who now knows that her daughter actually isn't safe in a shelter.

You don't get to be the richest, most popular, TV show host, by being anything but an excellent business woman. A really excellent business woman. Nothing more.

[LindaR]

Bop28, I TOTALLY agree with you! There was nothing "charitable" in her actions. This was a well-planned, calculated exploitation of a tragic event made to make Oprah look like SHE has come to "save" these poor folk......out of her own pocket.

When will people "get" that she is a TALK SHOW HOST? Nothing more. She is NOT the second coming of Christ (as her "Angel Network" implies). She is extremely wealthy and everything she does is a tax write-off. If she truly wished to be charitable and generous, these "donations" would be done annonymously, not televised.

[septbride2002]

I'm not a big Oprah fan - but my opinion on these sorts of issues is I don't care what publicity they get off it - AT LEAST THEY ARE DOING SOMETHING! I don't care if they take down their camera crew - at least they brought water. I don't care if they brought their own journalist - at least they brought food. That is all I care about. For as many people complaining about their publicity stunts there are also celebrities who are doing a dang thing sitting on their millions. I would rather them exploit the situation and do something then sit on their rear ends.

I also am for showing the dead bodies. I feel that way about the War in Iraq and also for Hurricaine Katrina. Because that is reality - people died. Maybe for some it takes seeing the pictures for the reality to hit home. Not to mention that I am for the Freedom of the Press. It is their job to report the news - we all complain about how scandulous the news has become - maybe in part that is because we have started restricting how they can report the news. Show the bodies, show reality, tell the whole story, the real story - the press should not be under the control of any administration.

Lisa Ling is one of the most phenomenal journalist - she doesn't cut out what is real. She gives it to you - for that I love her. If you don't like what she is saying maybe it is because she is telling you what you don't want to hear.

~Amanda

[septbride2002]

Bop28, I TOTALLY agree with you! There was nothing "charitable" in her actions. This was a well-planned, calculated exploitation of a tragic event made to make Oprah look like SHE has come to "save" these poor folk......out of her own pocket.

When will people "get" that she is a TALK SHOW HOST? Nothing more. She is NOT the second coming of Christ (as her "Angel Network" implies). She is extremely wealthy and everything she does is a tax write-off. If she truly wished to be charitable and generous, these "donations" would be done annonymously, not televised.

Last time I checked your donations are also tax write-offs. So she isn't doing anything for a greater benefit then you yourself could do.

~Amanda

[AuntieM03]

I'm not a big Oprah fan - but my opinion on these sorts of issues is I don't care what publicity they get off it - AT LEAST THEY ARE DOING SOMETHING! I don't care if they take down their camera crew - at least they brought water. I don't care if they brought their own journalist - at least they brought food. That is all I care about. For as many people complaining about their publicity stunts there are also celebrities who are doing a dang thing sitting on their millions. I would rather them exploit the situation and do something then sit on their rear ends.

I also am for showing the dead bodies. I feel that way about the War in Iraq and also for Hurricaine Katrina. Because that is reality - people died. Maybe for some it takes seeing the pictures for the reality to hit home. Not to mention that I am for the Freedom of the Press. It is their job to report the news - we all complain about how scandulous the news has become - maybe in part that is because we have started restricting how they can report the news. Show the bodies, show reality, tell the whole story, the real story - the press should not be under the control of any administration.

Lisa Ling is one of the most phenomenal journalist - she doesn't cut out what is real. She gives it to you - for that I love her. If you don't like what she is saying maybe it is because she is telling you what you don't want to hear.

~Amanda


Maybe they should inquire with some who have family members missing to see if they would like the bodies shown. I for one would not like my loved ones on the news or in the magazines. Maybe you feel differently.

[septbride2002]

double post.

[septbride2002]

Maybe they should inquire with some who have family members missing to see if they would like the bodies shown. I for one would not like my loved ones on the news or in the magazines. Maybe you feel differently.

I would feel differently. Seeing my family member on the news does not change the fact that he/she is gone. At least, in my opinion, their body is a testament to what mother nature can do - and that we all need to remember life is short. Their picture will show the truth in what was lost - not just material things, but lives. Their life was lost and that is truly precious.

In a nation that continues to numb itself with pills, alcohol, drugs, and other substances maybe seeing something that is real is to jarring for some. I don't know, I don't care. If I lost a loved one - that lost would be real, and so are the circumstances of their death, and so is their picture.

~Amanda

[AuntieM03]

I would feel differently. Seeing my family member on the news does not change the fact that he/she is gone. At least, in my opinion, their body is a testament to what mother nature can do - and that we all need to remember life is short. Their picture will show the truth in what was lost - not just material things, but lives. Their life was lost and that is truly precious.

In a nation that continues to numb itself with pills, alcohol, drugs, and other substances maybe seeing something that is real is to jarring for some. I don't know, I don't care. If I lost a loved one - that lost would be real, and so are the circumstances of their death, and so is their picture.

~Amanda

I understand your opinion, but I think in some ways it has an opposite effect. I think in alot of ways we are becoming desensitized to the horror if we see too much. Most of us do not need to be beaten over the head with images to know how horrific the loss is. I for one know how short life is having lost my mother at 12. I am grateful however that my last image of her is not what it could have been based on the circumstance.

[beattyfamily]

I'm truely curious. For those of you who think it's fine to show the dead bodies in NO on the Oprah show and other places too like in Iraq, did you also feel that way about the 9/11 deaths?

As far as I could see our country avoided showing the dead bodies during 9/11, especially those who jumped to their deaths on purpose. It was shown quite a bit in other countries and in some magazines but not here in the US on TV.

How would you have felt if Oprah or some other reporter showed the dead bodies and people jumping to their deaths during 9/11? Is it the same? Or is it different? If it's different, how? I'm truely just curious. If you feel it's exactly the same then fine, but if it's different to you, I'd really like to know why and how it is.

I know death is reality but I feel we need to take into consideration the feelings of the family members that the reporters are showing, especially if they don't know their fate yet. I find it disrespectful to the dead AND their families. I don't see any good coming from showing newly dead bodies. :( But this is just my opinion. Not saying it's right, it's just mine.

[Mickeyistheman]

LindaR,

If I am not mistaken anyone who makes a donation to any charity can "write it off" so that would pertian to anyone who is donating money no matter what the amount.

Would you rather they not put any of this on TV? So that way we can all go about our normal days and go to work and pick up the kids from school so that way we don't have to deal with it???!!!

This is life and these poor people HAVE NOTHING LEFT, NOTHING No homes, pictures, furniture even birth certificates or identification to prove who they are.

If Oprah or whomever who has enough money to give these people what they desperatly need, so what if she does it on TV. She is a billionaire, she should be donating money and food and supplies. She is not exploiting anything.

She is helping just like everyone other celebrity that she had on her show.

Good for them I applaud them and have a whole lot of respect for them. Because they don't HAVE to do that. They could have just donated to the Red Cross and be done with it but they wanted their fans to know that they do care.

If I had the means I would do the same thing and I would want people to know what is really going on down there. The American people need to see what is happening down there.

We can't sit back and not do anything, what if it was your family??

[septbride2002]

I'm truely curious. For those of you who think it's fine to show the dead bodies in NO on the Oprah show and other places too like in Iraq, did you also feel that way about the 9/11 deaths?

Yes I did. I don't know what news you were watching but I saw footage of the people jumping to their deaths. It was horrific - and if anything made a larger impact on me then anything else. I also watched footage of the firemen bringing out their brothers while they were cleaning up the rubble. Yes I believe in many ways showing the dead is a way saying "Look at what was lost. This man was a father, a son, a husband, a brother - remember this." You can't really concept a number - 40,000 people dead. But the photo of one man, or one woman may be enough to say - "My God, what have we let happen."

~Amanda

[bop28]

Mickeyistheman:

We can't sit back and not do anything, what if it was your family??

If it were my family, I'm sure, I'm really, sure, that I wouldn't praise Oprah, for showing a man pick up the oozing, decomposing, arm of my sweet child, on TV, so that America can "see reality". For those of you who profess to think, hurting a Mother and Father like this is fine, for the sake of "freedom of the press", I say you are not being honest. I simply don't believe that. I have a feeling there might be other underlying reasons a person wouldn't denounce this. I say most Americans would be horrified to know, that the parents of this dead girl, who might have been searching desperately for her, happen to be watching Oprah, on the day that Oprah's Angel Network decided to bring the "truth to America". Oprah could have shown the dead body from a distance, and spared the parents such torture. If that weren't enough, Oprah then said, America owes the victims of the Hurricane an apology. I would rather ask Oprah to apologize to the Mother of this unfortunate soul that was so carelessly messed with for her camera. I have liked Oprah for many many years. Until now.

An interesting side note: It has just been reported in the news, that Oprah's show from the disaster zone has just surpassed all TV ratings ever, in it's time slot. You did it Oprah. Congratulations.

[septbride2002]

For those of you who profess to think, hurting a Mother and Father like this is fine, for the sake of "freedom of the press", I say you are not being honest. I simply don't believe that.

I'm sorry that you don't believe I am not being honest. Or mabye you just don't want to believe it. It is not just about freedom of the press - I'm sorry you took what I said that way. No mother or father should have to bury their child, nor should they have to live with the unknown of what happened to their child. If it was my baby girl then the first thing I would do is contact HARPO productions and ask them where in the hell they are so that I can get my girl's body. It would not be outrage that they showed her - it would be, help me find her so I can bury her with my family.

Everyone is entitle to their opinion - I'm sorry you find the truth so unsettling.

~Amanda

[Nancy]

Maybe they should inquire with some who have family members missing to see if they would like the bodies shown. I for one would not like my loved ones on the news or in the magazines. Maybe you feel differently.


I agree with this one.

I also don't want to see all the dead bodies, my imagination has supplied enough images already. I have now stopped watching the news because it just got to be too much. I don't need to see the reality of what happened to know it exists. And if it was my family member whose body was shown I would be devastated by seeing it plastered for all to see. To me this is just the media trying to be the most sensational and push their ratings higher because they know that some want to see all. I'm all for freedom of speech, but sometimes respect for the dead should come first. Showing the dead person is total lack of respect for the deceased.

[va32h]

Does anyone remember, after the Oklahoma City bombing, the photo of the firefighter carrying the baby girl - with her little socks on? Of course we all do. That photo came to symbolize the horror and despair of the entire tragedy.

That little girl was Baylee Almon - and her mother has said in interviews that she cannot bear to look at that photo. Here is one of her quotes from an interview a year after her daughter's death:

"They mean well, but I wish everyone would lay off Baylee," she says. "I have to see my dead daughter for the rest of my life."

I will tell you that right now, I am full-on crying just from the articles and pictures I saw when Googling for that quote.

There's no question that pictures are powerful. But someone else's heartbreak shouldn't be waved in the world's face, just so we can get a wake up call, or fully understand the situation, or see the reality.

I remember watching Timothy McVeigh's trial. They showed pictures of all the children who died in OKC. They were school pictures, family pictures, pictures of smiling happy children who would never have another birthday or school picture day, never smile at anyone ever again. And I got the point. I felt the loss - without seeing mangled bodies.

I would rather fall on the side of discretion. There are other ways to make a point.

[HappyMommy2]

At least, in my opinion, their body is a testament to what mother nature can do - and that we all need to remember life is short. Their picture will show the truth in what was lost - not just material things, but lives. Their life was lost and that is truly precious.

~Amanda

I can see where you are coming from; however, to me the best testament to the preciousness of what was lost is not a picture of the dead body, but a picture (or description by a living loved one) of the person while they were living. After a plane crash, or other disaster, you will often see an episode of 20/20 or segments on the regular news that will give brief profiles of the lost--pictures from happier times, interviews with loved ones, etc. THAT is what brings home the loss to me. It makes the lost person "real" to me even though I didn't know him/her, and usually brings me to tears as I realize that the person was a living, breathing, LOVED individual who is gone forever.
I don't believe pictures of dead bodies offer that.

[bop28]

Originally from va32h:

But someone else's heartbreak shouldn't be waved in the world's face, just so we can get a wake up call, or fully understand the situation, or see the reality.

I never thought I would say this about Oprah, but she has stepped all over the "heartbreak" of this dead woman's family. You know, she was 30 yrs. old, and very possibly a Mom. Her own children could have been watching Oprah. Can you imagine? I'm afraid that Oprah has gone the way of Jerry Springer. I guess someone else can have my ticket for her Christmas Give-a-Way Show.

[WDWBetsy]

If it were my family, I'm sure, I'm really, sure, that I wouldn't praise Oprah, for showing a man pick up the oozing, decomposing, arm of my sweet child, on TV, so that America can "see reality". For those of you who profess to think, hurting a Mother and Father like this is fine, for the sake of "freedom of the press", I say you are not being honest. I simply don't believe that.

Well I have to disagree with you, and I am being honest. I certainly didn't interpret that doctor lifting that poor victim's arm up as doing it for the ratings. I didn't see him as being disrespectful - and he gave her some dignity by covering her body.

I believe he was proving a point that in the midst of this horrible disaster, people were being left at the side of the road because the normal order and traditions were gone.

In my eyes, he recognized that she was a human being who was not just some debris left on the side of the road in the chaos. How many others just turned their heads and let her lie there? He was also pointing out how a decomposing body becomes a biological hazard - and that's sad, but the truth.

If you'd rather not see the nitty gritty of what actually happened and how the natural disaster turned into a national disgrace, the remote control was hopefully nearby.

I saw things on Oprah's show that I hadn't seen on the news. It certainly showed me that the situation of taking care of all those wounded, dying people was far worse than what most of us imagined. It's really easy to think that once the helicopters picked up the people, they received medical treatment and were all better. Oprah's show emphasized that the people trying to save lives did the best they could do with the supplies and resources they had. I admire those rescuers, doctors, nurses, and ordinary citizens who pitched in to save as many lives as possible.

It's too bad that the USS Bataan, an 844-foot Marine vessel that was already sitting in the Gulf with medical supplies, six operating rooms, 600 beds and the ability to make 100,000 gallons of fresh water per day wasn't authorized by FEMA to save more lives. To me, that's a shame far worse than Oprah filming some bodies.

[swilphil]

It's too bad that the USS Bataan, an 844-foot Marine vessel that was already sitting in the Gulf with medical supplies, six operating rooms, 600 beds and the ability to make 100,000 gallons of fresh water per day wasn't authorized by FEMA to save more lives. To me, that's a shame far worse than Oprah filming some bodies.

Thanks, Betsy, for putting the situation into perspective. The fact that many people could have been saved is the real story.

[PatsGirl]

I have never seen Oprah as particularly compassionate -- a good actress maybe, but compassionate, no. Seems every time I tune in to her show, she's crying or screaming or has those "wide eyes".

As for her contributions, come on people, it's a drop in the hat for her. Yeah, we should commend anyone that helps in any way, but most of us aren't publicizing our efforts to increase our stardom. The ones we should thank most are those that have little and are giving big. I've always thought the ones with the least give the most and this disaster is only confirming that for me.

Brenda

[TeresaNJ]

Anyone ever hear of HIPPA?

[swilphil]

Anyone ever hear of HIPPA?

Oprah and journalists don't fall under HIPPA regulations. They have the 1st Amendment freedoms to air what they want. The dead bodies shown by Dr. Oz weren't of his patients, so I don't think he would be bound by HIPPA in this case. If your own doctor showed your dead body on the news, HIPPA would be violated.