Bush resists immediate probe into Katrina response

[dcentity2000]

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush pledged on Tuesday to review what went wrong in the initial response to Hurricane Katrina but resisted any immediate probe and lawmakers launched an investigation of their own.

Partisan tempers flared, the projected cost of Katrina recovery efforts mushroomed and Pentagon leaders denied there was any delay in the military response to the relief effort last week.

After a Cabinet meeting on the myriad challenges posed by his biggest crisis since the attacks of September 11, 2001, Bush said he would lead an investigation into what went wrong. But he said he first wanted to save lives and solve problems before assessing blame.

"I think one of the things that people want us to do is to play a blame game," Bush said of critics of the initial administration response. "We've got to solve problems. There will be ample time for people to figure out what went right, and what went wrong."

He added: "I'm going to find out over time what went right and what went wrong."

Key senators launched an oversight review to determine how federal, state and local authorities bungled the relief effort in the first days after the hurricane struck.

"It is difficult to understand the lack of preparedness and the ineffective initial response to a disaster that had been predicted for years and for which specific dire warnings had been given for days," said Sen. Susan Collins, the Maine Republican who chairs the Senate homeland security committee.

Tempers flared in the driveway of the White House after congressional leaders emerged from a meeting with Bush to brief reporters.

House of Representatives Speaker Dennis Hastert of Illinois, backing up Bush's position, agreed on the need for an investigation, but only after the recovery is well under way.

"There's going to be a lot of time to point fingers after we get through there," he said.
Source and full story: Reuters (http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2005-09-06T212324Z_01_MCC662050_RTRIDST_0_NEWS-BUSH-DC.XML)



Rich::

[totalia]

*shakes her head* of course he's resisting. He's hoping everyone will forget or dismiss it. Like they have everything he's done in the past.

[Charade]

*shakes her head* of course he's resisting. He's hoping everyone will forget or dismiss it. Like they have everything he's done in the past.

Probably.

[shelby_36]

Now why post it that way?

Not Bush launches a probe.
But Bush launches a probe AFTER saving lives.

What a dirtbag. Geez :confused3

Will the dems ever be happy?

[totalia]

Bush hasn't saved any lives. Thousands of dead. What lives has he saved? He took days to arrive. Yes, the democrats are just horrible because they won't just shrug off the incompetance Bush showed while people were dying.

How horrible for them to demand an accounting of why he was eating birthday cake instead of helping his own countrymen. How deplorable to demand an accounting of why it took so many days to respond when the gvt had days of notice. How horrible to demand to know where all the billions of dollars have been spent if the organization called Homeland Security he created is so incompetant that it takes many days after a disaster that happened directly to his own people in his own country, for them to respond. How disgusting for them to ask why

Yes, thats just horrible isn't it? To hold the President responsible for his own actions and the actions of the men he appointed to positions within the gvt that should have bee able to handle their positions or not been given them.

To demand that the President be responsible. Just... horrible. :rolleyes:

[shelby_36]

He is trying to make sure that the rescue effort continues. There was a delay in help arriving and that is what the probe is for! He does not want to now have to spend these days when there may still be people needing help waiting for help to arrive. The hurricane killed thousands of people BUSH did not. The slow response did cause some additional deaths but we won't know until the probe is complete that blame belongs to George Bush.

But there is no reason to cut down Bush because he wants a probe by sayng he wants the probe later than WE wanted it. Just grasping at straws again.

[totalia]

What exactly do you think he's doing right now? I very seriously doubt he's down among the people handing out water and food.

[shelby_36]

What is it the dems want? Did they want him to stand in the Gulf with his hands in front of him sheilding the coast???? Good grief. I truly think some people wouldn't be happy unless he did that.

[totalia]

First, I'm not Democrat. I'm not American. I'm a Canadian Liberal with an America fiance who lived in Jefferson Parish at the time the hurricane hit.

Second, not at all. I expected that he wouldn't be eating cake and playing guitar while poisoness flood waters swamped the streets of New Orleans and people were dying of hunger, thirst, and disease. I expected that the help wouldn't take 4 days to arrive. I expected that he would appoint competant people to positions within his gvt with the full knowledge that only someone who actually knows how to do what they were hired for could possibly actually do the job (like the head of FEMA). I expected that he would actually be waiting and willing to respond in a timely manner to the formal written requests in advance of the Governor of Louisiana. I expected that he would be the responsible President he is supposed to be.

That is what I expect. What I did expect. He has done none of those things.

[shelby_36]

Just for your info- This is what he did today publicly- I'm sure he did some more stuff..they didn't mention his potty breaks:
From Whitehouse.gov
Met with Secretary of Education Spellings and her team about the -- about the school children who have been displaced because of Hurricane Katrina.

President Meets with Representatives from National Voluntary Organizations

President Meets with Cabinet

He isalso getting prepared to nominate a Supreme Court Judge and also name a Supreme Court Chief Justice.

He is preparing for Reinquists funeral.

He is dealing with the war in Iraq and the fighting in Afghanistan.

Don't forget he visited 3 states yesterday surveying damage.

That more than I've been able to get accomplished in 2 days...what about you?

[shelby_36]

He declared a state of emergency before the storm even hit. He had to wait from there for the Gov to request help. As soon as he did the National guard went in. From what I heard today there were assistance teams in the area but they couldn't go in tilol FEMA told them to. To my untrained eye it looks like there was a huge contol /power issue here between FEMA and the Governor. Where does Bush come in there?

[mickey2000]

He declared a state of emergency before the storm even hit. He had to wait from there for the Gov to request help. As soon as he did the National guard went in. From what I heard today there were assistance teams in the area but they couldn't go in tilol FEMA told them to. To my untrained eye it looks like there was a huge contol /power issue here between FEMA and the Governor. Where does Bush come in there?

Who are you trying to convince ???? Do you really believe all of what you are saying???? The leader of our country with all his help should have pressed the issue during time of an emergency!! I fell off a 60 ft ladder today !!! :earseek: I was on the first step :rotfl2:

[totalia]

Let's see... he had to meet with the national voluntary organizations because he's trying to save his reputation. He had to meet with the education minister because people are very angry with him and if he continues to show the same incompetance as he did in the beginning, there will be an uproar the likes of which he has never seen.

Preparing for the funeral of a dead person for which he has other people to do that.

The crisis of the gulf coast far outweighs some dead persons funeral. Sorry but it does. National crisis... hmm... or a dead persons funeral... national crisis or a dead persons funeral...

National crisis is far more important.

As for Iraq, Iraq is part of the problem. Dealing with it. Dealing with it how? Diverting yet more cash to bringing democracy to a nation of people that don't want it when his own country is in much more dire need of attention?

Seems like his priorities are a little messed up. Your own people first. Screw everything else.

And surveying is not helping. Its a PR stunt.

[WDWBetsy]

What is it the dems want? Did they want him to stand in the Gulf with his hands in front of him sheilding the coast???? Good grief. I truly think some people wouldn't be happy unless he did that.

Well, as a Democrat AND a US citizen, I want:

1) our President to appoint people who know what they're doing,
2) appointed officials (ie Michael Brown) to get the ball rolling immediately when a disaster is declared - not five hours after a hurricane hits,
3) FEMA to not turn down local/regional/national help when offered (ie not turning away truckloads of water or doctors/nurses offering their help), and to ask for help immediately so hospitals are not waiting to send helicopters to bring back patients to empty beds dedicated for such emergencies,
4) a president who holds his staff accountable. That means if they screw up royally (or repeatedly) they are fired - not promoted, and
5) agencies revamped if they're failing (FEMA needs to be its own agency, with a cabinet level offical answering directly to the President)

AND I want local and state officials to have working emergency/evacuation plans that do not forget the poor, elderly, etc.


That's what I want. I don't think that's asking much.

[totalia]

He declared a state of emergency before the storm even hit. He had to wait from there for the Gov to request help. As soon as he did the National guard went in. From what I heard today there were assistance teams in the area but they couldn't go in tilol FEMA told them to. To my untrained eye it looks like there was a huge contol /power issue here between FEMA and the Governor. Where does Bush come in there?
*groans* I don't think you've been reading the boards have you?

There are official gvt documents that are in .pdf format on these boards that shows the Governor requested that help WITH specifics, DAYS before the hurricane hit.

Do you even know what your talking about?

[shelby_36]

Ok so he doesn't go and hes a cad, he does go and he's a photo op. He goes on vacation and he is ignoring his duties, he does his duties and he;s got his priorities wrong. There is a storm nearing Florida. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE take your team and call DC and tell Bush what is the proper thing to do NOW instead of waiting and telling him what is acceptable after the fact.

[shelby_36]

Well, as a Democrat AND a US citizen, I want:

1) our President to appoint people who know what they're doing,
2) appointed officials (ie Michael Brown) to get the ball rolling immediately when a disaster is declared - not five hours after a hurricane hits,
3) FEMA to not turn down local/regional/national help when offered (ie not turning away truckloads of water or doctors/nurses offering their help), and to ask for help immediately so hospitals are not waiting to send helicopters to bring back patients to empty beds dedicated for such emergencies,
4) a president who holds his staff accountable. That means if they screw up royally (or repeatedly) they are fired - not promoted, and
5) agencies revamped if they're failing (FEMA needs to be its own agency, with a cabinet level offical answering directly to the President)


That's what I want. I don't think that's asking much.


UUmmm That';s what the probe is for. OBVIOUSLY someone screwed up. And your are right that person/persons needs to be fired. But lets save lives in NO and worry about blame later.

[shelby_36]

*groans* I don't think you've been reading the boards have you?

There are official gvt documents that are in .pdf format on these boards that shows the Governor requested that help WITH specifics, DAYS before the hurricane hit.

Do you even know what your talking about?
I guess not. I did not see these documents. Do you have a link?

[totalia]

Do you really think the President should be so brainless that he can't figure it out for himself that allowing his own people to die on a rooftop for 4 days is NOT acceptable?

If he can't get that AHEAD OF TIME then he shouldn't be in office.

[totalia]

Do a search for posts by peachgirl . She's the one who found the document on a gvt web site.

[Southern4sure]

Let's see... he had to meet with the national voluntary organizations because he's trying to save his reputation. He had to meet with the education minister because people are very angry with him and if he continues to show the same incompetance as he did in the beginning, there will be an uproar the likes of which he has never seen.

Preparing for the funeral of a dead person for which he has other people to do that.

The crisis of the gulf coast far outweighs some dead persons funeral. Sorry but it does. National crisis... hmm... or a dead persons funeral... national crisis or a dead persons funeral...

National crisis is far more important.

As for Iraq, Iraq is part of the problem. Dealing with it. Dealing with it how? Diverting yet more cash to bringing democracy to a nation of people that don't want it when his own country is in much more dire need of attention?

Seems like his priorities are a little messed up. Your own people first. Screw everything else.

And surveying is not helping. Its a PR stunt.


Every post I have read before and after Hurricane Katrina from Totalia is negative towards the American People and the American Govt. That is fine..it is your opinion. What I dont understand is why are you trying so hard to get into America? I read you have a fiance..thats great and I do wish you well. But how long have you been trying? Two years I think..I might be wrong. Why would you want to come to a country that you hate so much? If your Visa is ever granted, how are you going to live day to day in the US with all this hatred? Can you name a few good things about America (besides your fiance)?

[WDWBetsy]

But lets save lives in NO and worry about blame later.

You asked what we Dems wanted, so I gave you some examples.

But don't forget - hurricane season is not over.

I'm not blaming, and I want as many lives saved as possible. But in honor of those who have died because some idiot(s) didn't know what he was doing (not to mention the local/state issues, I want those who are incompetent out of the picture now and some other EXPERIENCED person(s) in charge. I certainly don't feel like Mike Brown can handle an additional or the next hurricane disaster, not to mention any terrorist attack.

Or I guess we can just let things blow over and hope for the best for the future disasters... :umbrella:

[wvrevy]

Every post I have read before and after Hurricane Katrina from Totalia is negative towards the American People and the American Govt. That is fine..it is your opinion. What I dont understand is why are you trying so hard to get into America? I read you have a fiance..thats great and I do wish you well. But how long have you been trying? Two years I think..I might be wrong. Why would you want to come to a country that you hate so much? If your Visa is ever granted, how are you going to live day to day in the US with all this hatred? Can you name a few good things about America (besides your fiance)?
In other words...America: Love it or Leave It. :rolleyes:

Sorry, but I don't think it's too much to ask that the president not be doing this:
http://talkleft.com/bushplaysguitar.jpg
while Americans are stranded and dying. Do you ?

(Pic was taken as Bush partied on Tuesday)

[WDWBetsy]

Every post I have read before and after Hurricane Katrina from Totalia is negative towards the American People and the American Govt. That is fine..it is your opinion. What I dont understand is why are you trying so hard to get into America? I read you have a fiance..thats great and I do wish you well. But how long have you been trying? Two years I think..I might be wrong. Why would you want to come to a country that you hate so much? If your Visa is ever granted, how are you going to live day to day in the US with all this hatred? Can you name a few good things about America (besides your fiance)?

I don't see her views as negative or full of hate. I think she's seeing it without the blinders that so many have on. :confused3 But that's my opinion.

[totalia]

I don't hate the United States. Far from it. Sometimes the things about it drive me batty. But I don't hate it. Hating an entire country for the actions of a few is just completely idiotic.

Other than that, I refuse to defend myself against anything thrown at me like that because its deliberately intended to be inflamatory.

This conversation is NOT about me. Don't try to make it so. This conversation is about BUSH.

[Southern4sure]

I don't hate the United States. Far from it. Sometimes the things about it drive me batty. But I don't hate it. Hating an entire country for the actions of a few is just completely idiotic.

Other than that, I refuse to defend myself against anything thrown at me like that because its deliberately intended to be inflamatory.

This conversation is NOT about me. Don't try to make it so. This conversation is about BUSH.


That was and is not my intent. I really would like to understand why....is that wrong? If I wanted to flame you I would...but that is not my nature!

[totalia]

I don't see her views as negative or full of hate. I think she's seeing it without the blinders that so many have on. :confused3 But that's my opinion.
Thank you. I don't have blinders on about my own country either. No one has ever bothered to ask me about my own gvt.

Just because someone isn't blind to the things their leaders and people do doesn't mean they hate someone.

I hate only one person in existance. And that is because he was 16 years old, drunk, and ran his car through a pole killing two of my cousins and scarring my sister for life.

I don't hate people. I hate actions.

[shelby_36]

Do you really think the President should be so brainless that he can't figure it out for himself that allowing his own people to die on a rooftop for 4 days is NOT acceptable?

If he can't get that AHEAD OF TIME then he shouldn't be in office.


The hurricane hit Monday and no one could get in or out.
On Wed. FEMA requested ships and helicopters to move in.
on Thurs evacuations began. Doesn't sound like 4 days to me. Now the two it took was two too many..but don't exagerrate to make Bush look bad.

[shelby_36]

Every post I have read before and after Hurricane Katrina from Totalia is negative towards the American People and the American Govt. That is fine..it is your opinion. What I dont understand is why are you trying so hard to get into America? I read you have a fiance..thats great and I do wish you well. But how long have you been trying? Two years I think..I might be wrong. Why would you want to come to a country that you hate so much? If your Visa is ever granted, how are you going to live day to day in the US with all this hatred? Can you name a few good things about America (besides your fiance)?


I was thinking that too. She should be glad she's not here. Maybe her fiance will move to Canada.

[M:SteveO]

I think we've discovered that it's completely useless to debate the issues involved in the situation when many simply won't look at the facts. The fact is that the federal gov't asked Gov. Blanco to order an evacuation on Friday, she resisted. What totalia and peole like him may not understand is that here in America, disaster relief is coordinated initially by the local and state gov'ts and backed up by the federal gov't. This from a military official at USNORTHCOM:
"USNORTHCOM was prepositioned for response to the hurricane, but as per the National Response Plan, we support the lead federal agency in disaster relief — in this case, FEMA. The simple description of the process is the state requests federal assistance from FEMA which in turn may request assistance from the military upon approval by the president or Secretary of Defense. Having worked the hurricanes from last year as well as Dennis this year, we knew that FEMA would make requests of the military — primarily in the areas of transportation, communications, logistics, and medicine. Thus we began staging such assets and waited for the storm to hit.

The biggest hurdles to responding to the storm were the storm itself — couldn't begin really helping until it passed — and damage assessment — figuring out which roads were passable, where communications and power were out, etc. Military helos began damage assessment and SAR on Tuesday. Thus we had permission to operate as soon as it was possible. We even brought in night SAR helos to continue the mission on Tuesday night.

The President and Secretary of Defense did authorize us to act right away and are not to blame on this end. Yes, we have to wait for authorization, but it was given in a timely manner"

Now we all know that the response was not big enough, it was there, just not enough of it was there (this is a fact - see Chertoff, General Honore press conferences over the past few days). What some of you on the left can't acknowledge is that quick response is the responsibility of the local and state gov't. You just want to blame Bush. Remember before the levees broke, you were blaming him for the hurricane, then for the levee break, then for purposely leaving all those people to die. I mean if he really didn't care as many of you suggest, why did he order troops in there now. I mean if he didn't care then, why does he now?

[Charade]

In other words...America: Love it or Leave It. :rolleyes:



Umm.. not really. I don't like Iran or North Korea or France. So why would I want to move there?

[shelby_36]

In other words...America: Love it or Leave It. :rolleyes:

Sorry, but I don't think it's too much to ask that the president not be doing this:
http://talkleft.com/bushplaysguitar.jpg
while Americans are stranded and dying. Do you ?

(Pic was taken as Bush partied on Tuesday)


know isn't it awful! I saw rescue workers...eekk... reading to kids!!!... and some were even playng bowling!!!!! HOW DARE THEY!!!! They should do nothing but cry and moan and grieve...DON"T SMILE IN THE SOUTH! And definately don't play music!

[WDWBetsy]

The hurricane hit Monday and no one could get in or out.
On Wed. FEMA requested ships and helicopters to move in.
on Thurs evacuations began. Doesn't sound like 4 days to me. Now the two it took was two too many..but don't exagerrate to make Bush look bad.

Here's the problem. Bush appointed some individuals (not all - some do know what they're doing) who happen to be his buddies and who are not experienced, and thus - our country is now suffering. And he has previously been stubborn to get rid of those same buddies.

Now if I hired some of my friends to work where I do, and they didn't know what they were doing - and messed a bunch of things up, I would be expected to let them go or give them jobs they are actually qualified to do. Not keep them in the same job or promote them.

[totalia]

Why are you people being so hurtful? Especially right now Just decided to take potshots at me?

I didn't say ANYTHING mean to you to start you in on me. Why now? Can't you see this is wrong?

[shelby_36]

Just wondering why you'd want to come into a country you obviously don't agree with the present govet. Maybe you'd be happier if you waited until Bush is out of office.

[wvrevy]

Gee...I wonder if people defended Nero, too. :rotfl:

Is there anything this clown could do that some people wouldn't defend ? i honestly think the guy could light the original bill of rights on fire, and people would applaud him for providing light that they could read by. :rolleyes:

[M:SteveO]

Here's the problem. Bush appointed some individuals (not all - some do know what they're doing) who happen to be his buddies and who are not experienced, and thus - our country is now suffering. And he has previously been stubborn to get rid of those same buddies.

Let's say the relief efforts had been absolutely perfect (which I'm positive would have happened if a Democrat had been president). Here's something that will shock you - thousands of people still would have died. This notion that the suffering is directly and SOLELY the result of the response is nonsense. People were still stranded in their homes, and in the Superdome. They are still rescuing people from houses today. They've been doing that since Tuesday, contrary to popular belief. People are forgetting that this was the biggest natural disaster in our history. If you have seen the pictures of the complete devastation of the coastline of three states, you'd realize this. It is not easy to get to these people, they are suffering and stranded. The U.S. military and NO police are doing the best they possibly can. If the rescue operation was so bad as the left believes why have we evacuated more than 182,000 people. Pretty remarkable if you ask me.

[shelby_36]

Here's the problem. Bush appointed some individuals (not all - some do know what they're doing) who happen to be his buddies and who are not experienced, and thus - our country is now suffering. And he has previously been stubborn to get rid of those same buddies.

Now if I hired some of my friends to work where I do, and they didn't know what they were doing - and messed a bunch of things up, I would be expected to let them go or give them jobs they are actually qualified to do. Not keep them in the same job or promote them.

And that is what the probe will show. Everyone in every job you choose your own employees what to choose people they know or trust. Its human nature. If Bush made a bad call and these people are inept then fire all their butts. I just think this argument (not just here but all over the net and news) is just being used for Bush hating fodder. I think some repub are getting sick of every negative thing in the US is Bushs fault. It seems unbelieveable to me that for a man so many people think is stupid, inept, uncaring, could hold SO much power as to control events in the World so easily.

[Southern4sure]

Why are you people being so hurtful? Especially right now Just decided to take potshots at me?

I didn't say ANYTHING mean to you to start you in on me. Why now? Can't you see this is wrong?


Totalia I am not taking shots at you. I asked a honest question because I really am interested in knowing. I always hear about foreigners who want to live in American for whatever reason. But I always read you posts about American and it is always negative in some way so why would you want to live in a place that you constantly criticize? I dont think that is taking shots at you...Im just curious...thats it...honestly.

[totalia]

I don't agree with my gvt either. But that doesn't chase me away. Would you leave just because you don't happen to like the current gvt? Gvt is not the be all and end all of all things.

[Southern4sure]

Gee...I wonder if people defended Nero, too. :rotfl:

Is there anything this clown could do that some people wouldn't defend ? i honestly think the guy could light the original bill of rights on fire, and people would applaud him for providing light that they could read by. :rolleyes:


I didnt ask Totalia because Im defending Bush...if you think so your wrong! I have a legit question and I think I am being polite about it. If you want to twist it around...so be it. Im not attacking or flaming, I asked an honest question.

[shelby_36]

There is a difference between leaving your native country because of the govt. (my inlaws did this in the 70's due to communism-very difficult) and choosing to uproot from your country you disagree with to move to a new country that you disagree with.

[totalia]

Totalia I am not taking shots at you. I asked a honest question because I really am interested in knowing. I always hear about foreigners who want to live in American for whatever reason. But I always read you posts about American and it is always negative in some way so why would you want to live in a place that you constantly criticize? I dont think that is taking shots at you...Im just curious...thats it...honestly.
I'm not trying to enter your country to live off you. I'm not trying to enter the country under the deluded notion that I may find my fortune or whatever the hell else others tend to think.

I hate the current gvt. And I hate idiots in leader positions. I don't hate the people.

[WDWBetsy]

[QUOTE=M:SteveO]I think we've discovered that it's completely useless to debate the issues involved in the situation when many simply won't look at the facts. [QUOTE]

Gee, that's funny. I was thinking the same thing, but I guess we're looking at the different facts. :confused3

For those who want to let things remain the same and not get rid of the incompetent people, I sincerely hope that the next disaster doesn't get here before those appointed officials are out of office, because I really fear their response the next time.

I love my country and want the best for it and my fellow citizens. Just because I speak up doesn't make me unpatriotic or someone who hates Bush or anyone else. I expect accountability from my leaders.

I think you'd find me to be a nice person who hates seeing people suffering and sometimes the lack of caring really irks me. I'm not afraid to admit when I'm wrong, but I also stand my ground when I believe in something. That's all. :grouphug:

Dissent is the highest form of patriotism -- Thomas Jefferson

[totalia]

There is a difference between leaving your native country because of the govt. (my inlaws did this in the 70's due to communism-very difficult) and choosing to uproot from your country you disagree with to move to a new country that you disagree with.
See the commonality there?

[totalia]

[QUOTE=M:SteveO]I think we've discovered that it's completely useless to debate the issues involved in the situation when many simply won't look at the facts. [QUOTE]

Gee, that's funny. I was thinking the same thing, but I guess we're looking at the different facts. :confused3

For those who want to let things remain the same and not get rid of the incompetent people, I sincerely hope that the next disaster doesn't get here before those appointed officials are out of office, because I really fear their response the next time.

I love my country and want the best for it and my fellow citizens. Just because I speak up doesn't make me unpatriotic or someone who hates Bush or anyone else. I expect accountability from my leaders.

I think you'd find me to be a nice person who hates seeing people suffering and sometimes the lack of caring really irks me. I'm not afraid to admit when I'm wrong, but I also stand my ground when I believe in something. That's all. :grouphug:

Dissent is the highest form of patriotism -- Thomas Jefferson

Well said.

[WDWBetsy]

The U.S. military and NO police are doing the best they possibly can. If the rescue operation was so bad as the left believes why have we evacuated more than 182,000 people. Pretty remarkable if you ask me.

What happened in the immediate days after the flooding began was not acceptable, and if that's the best they can do - that's a sorry excuse. Our own President said it wasn't acceptable (http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/09/02/bush.katrina.ap/).

[wvrevy]

I didnt ask Totalia because Im defending Bush...if you think so your wrong! I have a legit question and I think I am being polite about it. If you want to twist it around...so be it. Im not attacking or flaming, I asked an honest question.
If you had a legitimate question for totalia about why she chooses to move here, why not PM it to her ? No, you were trying to score a "point", and the other "love it or leave it" person on this thread jumped in with "Maybe her fiance should move to Canada" right after that.

Sorry, if I misread your intentions, I apologize. But I've been in an awful lot of political discussions on this and other boards, and the "tone" of your post is exactly like all the "love it or leave it" posts I've seen from the right.

One doesn't have to love the government of a country to love the country. God knows, I certainly don't.

[WDWBetsy]

Let's say the relief efforts had been absolutely perfect (which I'm positive would have happened if a Democrat had been president). Here's something that will shock you - thousands of people still would have died. This notion that the suffering is directly and SOLELY the result of the response is nonsense. People were still stranded in their homes, and in the Superdome. They are still rescuing people from houses today. They've been doing that since Tuesday, contrary to popular belief. People are forgetting that this was the biggest natural disaster in our history. If you have seen the pictures of the complete devastation of the coastline of three states, you'd realize this. It is not easy to get to these people, they are suffering and stranded. The U.S. military and NO police are doing the best they possibly can. If the rescue operation was so bad as the left believes why have we evacuated more than 182,000 people. Pretty remarkable if you ask me.

Yes, rescue efforts have been doing a magnificent job since the very beginning - and they're still saving people. But they needed more help! And we were repeatedly told that more help was on the way. But if our own leaders are putzing around while people are dying, that's a problem. I don't care if it's a Democrat or Republican in charge. Things didn't go right (as Bush himself indicated), and as an American citizen - I want things to be improved, not stay stagnant. There's nothing wrong with demanding competency - that's all I'm saying.

[totalia]

Exactly. Its something every citizen of every country and form of gvt should demand.

[M:SteveO]

Yes, rescue efforts have been doing a magnificent job since the very beginning - and they're still saving people. But they needed more help! And we were repeatedly told that more help was on the way. But if our own leaders are putzing around while people are dying, that's a problem. I don't care if it's a Democrat or Republican in charge. Things didn't go right (as Bush himself indicated), and as an American citizen - I want things to be improved, not stay stagnant. There's nothing wrong with demanding competency - that's all I'm saying.

I agree with this. I just have a problem with people solely blaming the federal gov't and the president for the response. That's the "facts" I was talking about. If Bush himself indicated that there were problems why do you think that he will resist a probe into what went wrong. He announced today that he will support a probe, just not now. Now is not the time, as any public official will tell you. I just get fed up with all the Bush bashing when it is not called for. Trust me, I'm not a huge fan of the guy. I could give you a long list of things I'm not happy with because of him (i.e. military plans in Iraq, immigration, spending, etc.). But when it is unjustified to bash him, I get a little annoyed. He is the leader, but not always the scapegoat.

[Southern4sure]

If you had a legitimate question for totalia about why she chooses to move here, why not PM it to her ? No, you were trying to score a "point", and the other "love it or leave it" person on this thread jumped in with "Maybe her fiance should move to Canada" right after that.

Sorry, if I misread your intentions, I apologize. But I've been in an awful lot of political discussions on this and other boards, and the "tone" of your post is exactly like all the "love it or leave it" posts I've seen from the right.

One doesn't have to love the government of a country to love the country. God knows, I certainly don't.


Im only held accountable for my own words and I was not trying to score a point.... :confused3. I didnt realize public message board chat had "tones". Please enlightened me what words in black and white have tones? I will not and do not intend to speak for someone I do not know.

Apology accepted... :flower:

[totalia]

Thank you wrevy. You and I have disagreed on alot of things. Rather vehemently too. So I really must say thank you. It is appreciated.

[staci]

Just wondering why you'd want to come into a country you obviously don't agree with the present govet. Maybe you'd be happier if you waited until Bush is out of office.


49% of this country is not a Bush fan.

I dont know totalia at all, but regardless of where we are all from, we can have opinions about this disaster. Personally attacking her considering moving to our country is just wrong. This thread is about Bush, not whether or not totalia would be happy as an american citizen.

Do you suggest that those opposed to Bush that are already HERE just move out too?

[Pete's Mom]

In other words...America: Love it or Leave It. :rolleyes: Nah, more like if you don't love it, why come here? :confused3

[staci]

Nah, more like if you don't love it, why come here? :confused3

Or, if you dont like Bush, we dont want you here? :confused3

[WDWBetsy]

Nah, more like if you don't love it, why come here? :confused3

Um, because she loves her fiance and wants to live here? Because there are many good things about being an American?

I really don't think it's that wrong to criticize our government. There's nothing wrong with having constructive criticism about something. That's how things are improved.

If our country didn't have people speaking up (and fighting) for what they believed in and changes being made, there would still be slavery, women and African-Americans wouldn't be allowed to vote, and the list goes on and on.

"Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it." - Mark Twain

[LandscapePro_318]

Why are you people being so hurtful? Especially right now Just decided to take potshots at me?


Could it be perhaps there are those whom have grown tired of your constant trashing of our country, our president, and our collective response to this natural disaster?

I’ve read your insanity posted on various threads. It’s consistent, that’s the best I can say about it. Blame Bush---FEMA---and the Feds.

You spout rhetoric about things of which you have NO CLUE, only an OPINION and an uninformed one at that.

Read the following link: http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:6CwVGOyL-lYJ:www.cityofno.com/SystemModules/PrintPage.aspx%3Fportal%3D46%26tabid%3D26+City+of+ New+Orleans+Comprehensive+Emergency+Management+Pla n&hl=en

Read down to where it is stated: “Evacuation Time Requirements: Using information developed as part of the Southeast Louisiana Hurricane Task Force and other research, the city of New Orleans has established a maximum acceptable hurricane evacuation time for a category 3 storm of 72 hours. This is based on clearance time or is the time required to clear all vehicles evacuating in response to a hurricane situation from the area roadways. Clearance time begins when the FIRST evacuating vehicle enters the road network and ends when the LAST evacuating vehicle reaches its destination.”

It is also stipulated that “for people that have no transportation, that city municipal transportation, school buses, public buses, will be used to get them out of the city.”

Mayor Nagan of New Orleans did not even issue the “mandatory evacuation order” until 24 hours before Katrina hit. The authority to execute the plan rests with the MAYOR of the city. Period. ( It’s all spelled out in black and white…clear as a bell in the Plan.)

The emergency plan that was in place wasn’t followed AT ALL. Never mind the EXACT scenario of a CAT 5 hurricane hitting New Orleans was practiced a mere 13 months ago in the city itself.


I expected that he would actually be waiting and willing to respond in a timely manner to the formal written requests in advance of the Governor of Louisiana.

NO such "formal written requests" have been produced by Blanco. Only her offical declaration of a "State of Emergency".

Governor Blanco and Mary Landrieu are in a complete state of shock over the fact the voting block that which blindly put them (in the case of Landrieu twice) into office no longer exists. The both of them are in CYA mode. Thankfully to no avail. Their political life is over.

Mike---Louisiana Resident / American

And No, I wasn't posting about Sean Penn "in jest"...

[WebmasterAlex]

this thread is closed for personal attacks.