DVC Resort at Contemporary?

[whithouston]

Any news on the rumor that one of the wings will be torn down and then rebuilt as a DVC resort?

[RichWally]

That would be excellent. I can dream until then.

[ohanafamily]

I've heard that rumor a few times, but if you think about it it doesn't make sense to do; why tear down a wing when you have high occupancy year round? I will say that I would love it, but I sincerely doubt it. What sayeth you WDWHOUND?


:jumping2:

[DebbieB]

I can't see them announcing it before SSR is almost soldout. If they announced it now, they would have a hard time selling the rest of SSR. SSR has just started building phase 2 of 3.

[WDWHound]

Well, the concierge staff at the Contemporary that I talked to beleived this will happen, but resort cast members are not always the most releiable sources. I haven't read or heard and rumors about this in the last 3 months, but I still tend to think it will happen. Probably not until SSR is completed though, which would put it a ways out.

[mitros]

Would it not make more sense to add a new building or two if there is enough room? ohanafamily makes a good point, why take it down if it is always filled? Adding, like they did at BCV and WL, would seem to make more sense. Also, a little off topic, haven't sales slowed a bit since the points have almost doubled from what they were when the DVC was started back in '91?.

[WDWHound]

Would it not make more sense to add a new building or two if there is enough room? ohanafamily makes a good point, why take it down if it is always filled? Adding, like they did at BCV and WL, would seem to make more sense. Also, a little off topic, haven't sales slowed a bit since the points have almost doubled from what they were when the DVC was started back in '91?.
The Garden wings are not an efficient use of space (only 2 or 3 stories tall I believe) and are badly in need of refurb. The rumors are that any new facilty would be much taller, thus making that space more profitable. Also, DVC sales provide a huge burst of short term income, which is what Disney is all about these days.

[ohanafamily]

The Garden wings are not an efficient use of space (only 2 or 3 stories tall I believe) and are badly in need of refurb. The rumors are that any new facilty would be much taller, thus making that space more profitable. Also, DVC sales provide a huge burst of short term income, which is what Disney is all about these days.
There you have it, I just have heard this rumor SO MANY TIMES! Furthermore, if they were to do this, wouldn't the rooms be a lot more points (being on the Monorail)???
:jumping2:

[mitros]

Since most of the Disney resorts are about 4 stories tall or less, would these new DVC portions be as high as the rest of the Contemporary, do you suppose?

[minster22]

I just returned from a quick DVC trip and chatted with one of the sales reps at BWV and she mentioned the Contempory rumor also. She did say it was a rumor but that it has been talked about a lot lately................ ::MinnieMo

[RichWally]

I myself would love the idea of a DVC at the Contemporary.
But for those of you who like to provide reasons why this won't happen, how about the Discovery Island becoming a resort???

For the moment I dream. OK even more far fetched, a resort in
Cinderella's Castle :love:
or Haunted Mansion :earseek: !!!

[mochabean]

This rumor has been heard a lot recently and several posts mention it. Anyone care to hazard a guess as to the point rates for the rooms at a Contemporary DVC (Villas at Disney's Contemporary Resort - VCR or Contemporary Resort Villas - CRV)? I'm thinking probably on the order of 150% of BWV/BCV/VWL rates. To give you an idea of what this looks like, here are my predictions for the Sun-Thurs rates. What does anyone think? Would you be willing to pay these rates? (I didn't include Fri-Sat rates because they just get astronomical at my 150% figures, so I think they would probably be adjusted downward a little.)

Sun-Thurs......BWV/BCV/VWL...........................My guess for CRV

Adventure
Studio .........12 .................................................1 8
1BR .............22................................... ...............33
2BR..............30............................... ...................45

Choice
Studio .........12 .................................................1 8
1BR .............24................................... ...............36
2BR..............32............................... ...................48

Dream
Studio .........13 .................................................1 9
1BR .............28................................... ...............42
2BR..............34............................... ...................51

Magic
Studio .........14 .................................................2 1
1BR .............30................................... ...............45
2BR..............40............................... ...................60

Premiere
Studio .........19 .................................................2 9
1BR .............40................................... ...............60
2BR..............50............................... ...................75

[MarylandPirate]

My sales rep said they may do smaller dvc's like the VWL at CR and Poly :wave: I just got back from Disney and those wings at CR look kind of rough to me! :rolleyes1

[What the Heck]

This rumor has been heard a lot recently and several posts mention it. Anyone care to hazard a guess as to the point rates for the rooms at a Contemporary DVC (Villas at Disney's Contemporary Resort - VCR or Contemporary Resort Villas - CRV)? I'm thinking probably on the order of 150% of BWV/BCV/VWL rates. I'm interested in knowing why you think they would be so high. I would think they would be equivalent, after all the Boardwalk and the Beach Club are considered by many if not better than, then at least equivalent to the Contemporary. And, Wilderness Lodge is also a deluxe resort and no slouch in its own right. Unless of course the DVC was in the Tower. Just my thoughts.

[tjkraz]

I'm interested in knowing why you think they would be so high. I would think they would be equivalent, after all the Boardwalk and the Beach Club are considered by many if not better than, then at least equivalent to the Contemporary. And, Wilderness Lodge is also a deluxe resort and no slouch in its own right. Unless of course the DVC was in the Tower. Just my thoughts.

Why would DVD set the points higher than other resorts? Becuase they can! ;)

I agree mochabean's numbers seem a little high, but I wouldn't be surprised to see numbers 10-20% higher than the other properties. By law, DVC can sell enough points that each room in the resort would be booked 365 days per year (less the approx. 4% holdings they keep for room maintenance.) So, a point table that is 10% higher than, say, BCV means that Disney realizes 10% more revenue than they otherwise would have for sales at the resort.

Assuming they would make appropriate enhancements to the resort pool, and construct first-class rooms as part of the DVC component, I think they could easily justify a higher point schedule given the proximity to the Magic Kingdom and the monorail access. Whether they will or not remains to be seen.

Come to think of it, whether DVC even comes to the Contemporary still remains to be seen. :rotfl2:

[bicker]

Wouldn't it make more sense to leave the points comparable, and just increase the price 10%?

[ohanafamily]

Wouldn't it make more sense to leave the points comparable, and just increase the price 10%?
No, because the resort has an added value of (say) 10%. If the points were that much more for this resort then people with points from other resorts would in effect get a discounted rate. Also, when they booked at another reort (or used II) their price would be effectively more. Additionally, since the maintenance costs will be more it just makes sense to charge a higher number of points for the room...

:jumping2:

[bicker]

Well, I can understand that it has a higher maintenance cost, but BWV has a higher maintenance cost than VWL, doesn't it? And that didn't result in a higher point structure.

I'm not convinced that a CR DVC would have a "higher value" as you assert, and I think that's really the issue. You cannot beat being right on the BoardWalk, with an easy walk to two theme parks IMHO.

[tjkraz]

Wouldn't it make more sense to leave the points comparable, and just increase the price 10%?

Depends on your point of view, I guess. IMO, an across-the-board 10% price increase would garner a whole lot more (negative) attention from potential owners than would a point schedule 10% higher than current resorts.

[bicker]

I disagree with that. I doubt buyers would hold more animosity for a higher price than for having to "pay" so many more points for a week at their home resort than the rest of WDW DVC owners.

[ohanafamily]

Well, I can understand that it has a higher maintenance cost, but BWV has a higher maintenance cost than VWL, doesn't it? And that didn't result in a higher point structure.

I'm not convinced that a CR DVC would have a "higher value" as you assert, and I think that's really the issue. You cannot beat being right on the BoardWalk, with an easy walk to two theme parks IMHO.
Good point, but if it were to happen, being on the monorail is a big (sdvertizable) plus...They could also justify a higher rate by making a slightly bigger room.....

:jumping2:

[ohanafamily]

Depends on your point of view, I guess. IMO, an across-the-board 10% price increase would garner a whole lot more (negative) attention from potential owners than would a point schedule 10% higher than current resorts.
Why? they are constatntly raising the price of NEW points, and it is in our contracts how many points that they can charge for each resort...

Effectivily, the only price increase possible (without lowering the price somewhere else) is on the m aintenance, and the contract mandates the maximum that can be raised.

[ohanafamily]

I disagree with that. I doubt buyers would hold more animosity for a higher price than for having to "pay" so many more points for a week at their home resort than the rest of WDW DVC owners.
Here I disagree with you, People will pay more to stay at the Contemporary, Dollars or points; Supply and demand. I mean, it would be nice if the rooms were less expensive than the BCV, but that ain't gonna happen. Disney Knows that this is a very desirable property, and will price it according to the relative demand; we won't have a say in it.....but, if the points were more expensive at that resort, then they would have a hugher value (because of the reservation window) This would adversly complicate the point system (not in Disney's official view). I seriously think that if this were to happen, it would be a few more points per day...

JMHO,


:jumping2:

[bicker]

Here I disagree with you, People will pay more to stay at the Contemporary, Dollars or pointsSorry, but it just isn't true.

Contemporary Garden Wing $280 - $405 per night
BoardWalk Standard View $294 - $459 per night

And the Contemporary rooms are larger. The BoardWalk simply is a more desireable property.

[doubletrouble_vb]

Sorry, but it just isn't true.

Contemporary Garden Wing $280 - $405 per night
BoardWalk Standard View $294 - $459 per night

And the Contemporary rooms are larger. The BoardWalk simply is a more desireable property.

I think in terms of this discussion this is a bit apples to oranges. The notion is that one of the Garden Wings would be replaced with a DVC structure. I think that that would alter price structure at the Contemporary. As it stands Disney's pricing does indicate that a Garden Wing room is less desirable than a standard view room at Boardwalk but I sincerely doubt the same would apply to a DVC unit at the Contemporary. Plus Disney's pricing sometimes seems a bit mysterious. One could use this particular arguement to say that a BWV standard view DVC unit is less desirable than a VWL dumpster view.

IMHO a 50% increase in points is much too high without an extension of the home resort advantage in reservations. However I could see a 25% increase in the points required to make a reservation while decreasing the difference between a weekend stay and a weekday stay.

I also can see DVC starting sales before SSR is sold out because the appeal would seem to be to two different groups of purchasers. Haven't they had overlapping sales periods before? Leaving out HHI and VB.

[bicker]

As it stands Disney's pricing does indicate that a Garden Wing room is less desirable than a standard view room at Boardwalk but I sincerely doubt the same would apply to a DVC unit at the Contemporary.Oh, I surely agree with that -- that a DVC unit would compare more favorably than the current Garden Wing does, and therefore a DVC at the Contemporary would be considered on par with the DVC at the BoardWalk.

[tjkraz]

I disagree with that. I doubt buyers would hold more animosity for a higher price than for having to "pay" so many more points for a week at their home resort than the rest of WDW DVC owners.

OK, then let's take a look at some sample numbers.

Our proposed family wants to buy enough points to spend a week in a One Bedroom Villa during Dream Season:

Option 1: 252 points @ $108ea = $27K
Option 2: 277 points @ $98ea = $27K

Both of these options would give the CR owner the same ability to stay a week under different point schedules. The difference is that Option 1 has a point schedule identical to BCV, VWL, et al. while Option 2 is 10% higher.

Under Option 2, the CR owner could get MORE nights at a different DVC resort if they choose not to book their Home. Conversely, a current DVC member must use a larger proportion of his/her current points to stay a night at the CR. The detriment is to CURRENT members, not owners at CR.

This could also help manage demand for the CR as SOME existing members would certainly re-think booking at the CR due to the high point requirements.

If I were a potential DVC member given my choice of the above (which obviously wouldn't happen), I'd choose #2.

[tjkraz]

Why? they are constatntly raising the price of NEW points, and it is in our contracts how many points that they can charge for each resort...

Yes, but we're talking about a resort that doesn't even exist yet. DVC / DVD can set the point charts wherever they want for a new property.

I'm not saying that there won't be a price increase, too. But people are so sensitive to the price that I think a 10% increase in the per-point cost would foster more overall negativity than a 10% increase in the point charts.

[ohanafamily]

I think we are all three pretty much on the same page at this point...

1) Disney in it's mysterious and infinite wisdom will do what it deems best without consulting us ;)

2) CR rooms will probably cost more points than the existing properties because they will make it seem more expensive, even though it should be priced similar to Boardwalk

3) the cost of points will go up, but I don't think CR points will cost more; it makes the bookkeeping too difficult.

4) this is all speculation anyhow...

:jumping2:

[mitros]

I beleive this subject came up before on the boards. At the time I had suggested that perhaps they take one of the remaining spots on the monorail where another resort was supposed to go, {I think there is one more spot other then the area where they kept putting in pylons, and they just kept sinking into the swamp- like area} and just build a whole new DVC resort from scratch? How would that fit in with this current discussion folks?

[DVCconvert]

1) Disney in it's mysterious and infinite wisdom will do what it deems best without consulting us

I'd be "shocked"! ;)

2) CR rooms will probably cost more points than the existing properties because they will make it seem more expensive, even though it should be priced similar to Boardwalk

Geee, Ya Think? ;)

3) the cost of points will go up, but I don't think CR points will cost more; it makes the bookkeeping too difficult.

Wrong! ;) The price Will go up! ;)

4) this is all speculation anyhow...

Really?? ;)

[SoCalKDG]

Contemporary room occupancy is the reason DVC's are even being considered. By making a wing DVC, they accomplish two goals. One, less supply for cash guests, thus the premium price being charged is justified and room occupancy goes up. Two, you have a whole wing filled all the time, with money from DVC paying for all the renovations at the whole contemporay.

They might even make all the Contemporary rooms Studios, 16 points weekdays, 34 points weekends, week total of 148 points. Selling cost of $105 per point.

Thats my prediction. Next.

[Princeton Charming1]

Great another timeshare resort. What's the deal? Disney selling out again. Hey...here's an idea..how about fixing some of the attractions FIRST. It's Disney World not DVC World.

[rocketriter]

Princeton Charming1, the rides and the DVC resorts are built and fixed by different budgets operated by different business entities. There's nothing "selling out" about building DVC resorts, and there's no reason why Disney can't do both.

[Princeton Charming1]

Not to offend, but I think you are mistaken. When I look at Disney's annual report, capital is identified by business segment. My guess is that, like in any corporation, the business unit that can show the greatest return on capital gets the money. Since Disney seems to be doing pretty well selling timeshares and since the selling of the timeshare resort is tied to return on investment (essentially it pays back the money invested) it's a no-brainer financially to spend on DVC. DVC resorts are popping up left and right and meanwhile, the theme parks need a good painting and washing.

[What the Heck]

I just got off the phone with DVC (ordered their video) and was told that there are no current plans, although the rumor has been around a long time.

[DVCconvert]

Prince C1:
Not to offend, but I think you are mistaken. When I look at Disney's annual report, capital is identified by business segment. My guess is that, like in any corporation, the business unit that can show the greatest return on capital gets the money. Since Disney seems to be doing pretty well selling timeshares and since the selling of the timeshare resort is tied to return on investment (essentially it pays back the money invested) it's a no-brainer financially to spend on DVC. DVC resorts are popping up left and right and meanwhile, the theme parks need a good painting and washing.

Prince C1:
Great another timeshare resort. What's the deal? Disney selling out again. Hey...here's an idea..how about fixing some of the attractions FIRST. It's Disney World not DVC World.

Not to offend, but I think you are mistaken. Capital investments in DVD are not line items in park Op's or Capital budgets. DVD is profitable -- WDW resorts are drooling over the possibility of becoming in part a DVC location -- that's because once they do, the op's expenses are transfered to DVC (except when inventory allows the resort to book the space). There is no "selling out". In fact, it's the opposite -- it maximized the revenue stream in co-ordination with expense shifting.

Your arguments about Park Op's/maintainece is vaild, but is a separate one. :)

[YoHo]

In the olden days, Disney World was operated as a single entity. With a single master plan.

Now adays, the resorts are operated as wholly seperate groups fighting with each other for bookings. Thus they all fight over wanting DVC.


Now personally, I think WDW would benefit from being run as a single unit, but that's just me.

[Princeton Charming1]

I stand corrected.
Thanks :earsboy: