Unethical Timeshare Companies' Tactics

[Joeblack]

In hopes of helping prospective buyers and also in response to Wislodgers' post, I would like to share my experience with you.

A few years back, I bought a timeshare with Marriott and had the usual presentation in my office, but at no point was I rushed into buying. I took some time before doing so and I am happy with my purchase. MVC is an excelent company. Same with DVC, except in this case I bought based only on advice in the DIS (plus I fell in love with the BWV when I visited). Again, could not be happier with my purchase. I added-on at WLV and will add-on at BCV.

However, I once made the mistake of going to a timeshare presentation in Cancun and had a similar experience to Wislodgers'. I would never ever subject myself to being in another presentation like that and I urge all of you DIsers to stay away from the timeshares that use the pressure tactics mentioned here. $65 Disney dollars (or $500) are not worth the uncomfort, scrutiny and pressure you feel there, let alone insults or threats if you decide not to buy (which is what you must do with such companies).

Believe me. I would pay $65 to recover the 2 hours I wasted in Cancun at that presentation. The only reason they give "free" gifts and money to prospective buyers is because it is a natural tendency of people to feel indebted or obligated to do something in return. The "there is not such thing as a free lunch" motto is rooted in our brain. You wouldn't believe how many people purchase under pressure just because they cannot say NO to somebody who's giving them a gift. Please don't fall for that.

Other tactics these sharks use are:

Having you wait to call their "manager" just to make you even more anxious, and I wouldn't be surprised if they have wires in their table when they leave you just to listen to what you are saying. Again. they are investing time on you and you feel more obligated to give something in return.

Another thing they will always do just to impress you is to write backwards in their notepad as they face you. I don't know why they do this, but they always do. Probably to give an air of proffessionalism or superiority.

And of course, the most infamous tactic of all. Appealing to people's greed. The "if you don't sign in the next 30 minutes, the price will double and your family will be doomed for eternity." I am amazed at how many people still fall for this. Just look at TV infomercials: "The first 100 callers will get an additional gift for free/half price, etc". Come on people. If they still use this BS, it's gotta be working.

Finally. I don't undertand why some people say DVC is expensive. $26000 for a 2 bedroom in Westgate? My goodness!!!! For a timeshare which I am sure you can rent at probably $800/week? I am gladder than ever I have DVC. I think I am gonna call to add on some points today.

You want a timeshare? Stick to Marriott, Hilton or Disney which will probably still be around for many years, rely on the quality and value of their product and don't recur to unethical pressure tactics.

Anybody else can share other pressure tactics they have been subjected to by companies like Westgate? Maybe we will save somebody from making the wrong choice.

[The4OfUs]

We went there in 1991 for our honeymoon, and will never go back because of them, nor go to any place where we hear that the tactics are so bad! We never attended a presentation, but our romantic time there was marred daily by people trying to push us into going to one. We'd walk down the road, and have people jump out of cars and try to sell us on one. We switched to the opposite side of the road, going AGAINST traffic, walking in the dirt, and they'd just swing around and get us that way. We even went to dinner once and at the end they would not give us our bill until we signed up for a tour...my husband walked out of the restaurant, said fine, then we won't pay! (I ended up paying after yelling at them and having all others in the restaurant, who hadn't gotten this pitch yet, watch me....) And that was just to get us to agree to GO to a presentation, I think any of you who went to one and were able to walk out without buying should be given a medal, honestly!

I was shocked when I said to DH that I wanted to tour DVC, after all that, 6 years later, and he agreed. I swear that the major thing that sold us on this was that there was no selling. There's no need for it, DVC sells itself, thank goodness, because of there was even a hint of pressure he'd have been out of there like a shot with me not far behind.

[Wislodgers]

Joeblack-
I am glad to hear we are not the only ones that have had trouble. We figured there must be more out there because we talked to another unhappy couple on our way out of Westgate. I abbreviated the story somewhat; they also wanted us to leave our 3 children in the child care center, and we declined. The salesman was not happy at all and pressured many times to leave the kids and even made a comment to our children about "Tell Dad and Mom you want to stay here" at the center. After the fiasco that happened we were even more relieved that we did not leave them.
DVC was our first experience with a "time share" and I am sure it will be our last, even though I know there are other good ones out there. We toured DVC not planning to buy, but purchased on the spot. We have been thrilled with it, and have not even had a chance to go "home" yet. Next January will be our first stay at VWL!

[Rob_b]

DVC was our first timeshare tour. I guess we were spoiled.

Our second timeshare tour was at a camping resort. They were giving out free grills.

They wanted $5,000 to join. We said that we are already DVC members and $5,000 was too much.

Next, the manager shows up. Real nice. Since we are DVC members he is willing to offer us a 1/2 off deal. $2500. Its the dual timeshare special. Wow.

Even though we are still Dvc only members I thought it was funny how Dvc got us a discount at another timeshare.:)

[PoohBWV]

In March of this year while shopping in Orlando we were accosted by someone from Hilton trying to get us to go to their presentation. The lure - $100 or 2 Disney or Universal tickets. After much consideration, and since my hubby was mildly interested in Hilton we decided to go. The backwards handwriting technique, calling the manager and even a puppy dog look from our salesman while saying pleeeze won't you buy did not convince us. When I asked to take some literature with us so we could think it over, we were told you buy now or never. We couldn't believe it! Got up and left - with our $100.00 (which btw they really didn't want to give us) Never again.

[Joeblack]

Ooops. I guess that takes Hilton out of the "harassment-free" timeshares. Haven't had any experience with them but I assumed they would be like Marriott....guess not. Oh well.... Stick to MVCI or DVC.

[Laurajean1014]

I can write backwards and upside down for people to view. But I never thought of it as superior. I just thought I was wierd......:crazy:

[Caskbill]

I remember the first time share presentation we ever attended, back about 1982. We had just purchased an RV and were interested in the new campground timeshares that were beginning to flourish. (Many have since gone bankrupt).

Based on our then limited knowledge of how we really intended to camp, and the locations of the campgrounds in the program, and the cost, etc etc etc, we decided not to purchase. Then the manager was sent for, etc etc etc. Finally it got to be insults. We'll wind up parking in truck stops, etc. etc. etc.

Even then we loved Disney. The closest campground they had at that time that was in the program was probably 25 miles away. Even with that, they said we were 'stupid' to pay $10.00 a night to camp near Disney, when we could stay at their campground for only $1.00 night. The fact that they wanted about $2500 to join the program they called a bargain. I figured the interest on $2500 alone would probably pay for 15 nights or so in other campgrounds, and I would be closer to the areas I wanted to be. And back then, National and State park campgrounds were only $2 - $3 /night.

I could see nothing of value in what they were selling. As we left, they called us more names.....

I guess times haven't changed.

P.S. besides DVC which we love, we still camp. This fall we'll be at Fort Wilderness (at about $30/night, a special rate). Meanwhile, the 'Disney area' campground that they were pushing is long since gone. (It was on hwy 27 North, and is now a housing addition)

[Dean]

We were in Cancun last summer and the only timeshare pitches we got were at the airport. We did sign up and go to tour the Royals sands, very low key and I would highly recommend it. I wonder if the Cancun was the Royal Sunset, I think it was something else Sunset previously. They are notorious for both the sales and afterwards. I've heard stories of 6.5 hours and locking the door. Westgate is also pretty notorious.

[NFalzon]

No wonder I was suckered into this great Timeshare!!!

:D

Nick

[Peggy Sue]

Now that you mention it, every timeshare presentation we've been too, including DVC, the sales rep wrote upside down. I wonder if there is a test or something they have to pass..lol!!


We also attended a camp ground time share in NH one weekend years ago. They were giving away TV's and a 3 man inflatable raft, complete with a 5 HP motor..what a farce. the so called lodge, with the free buffet every weekend, was a few bowls of terrible looking salds covered with flies! I'm sure this place is long gone too, however their sales pitch was very high pressure, with the price coming down another $500 each time we said no. We finally demanded our release papers and our gifts. We only attended 3-4 presentations before seeing DVC...they all left us with a very negative impression of the entire time share industry. I'm happy to say DVC has been instrumental in changing our impressions about time shares, and a lot of the folks on this board (thanks, Dean) have given us a lot of valuable lessons on how to maximize our time share experiences...we may even consider purchasing something other than DVC for trading purposes..of course, it would be a resale!!

[Blake]

PoohBWV,
:p Your story about Hilton sounds EXACTLY like what we went through. Did the sales rep pull out his wallet and "introduce" you to his family? I swear they were the photos that came with the wallet!

[akghutton]

All of these timeshare sales techniques sound exactly like the act a car dealership pulled on my husband and I a few years ago. When we were so uncomfortable under the constant pressure to buy and said we were leaving, they refused to give us our car keys. I was appauled and my husband became very curt with the salesman. We didn't get our keys until the manager came down, tried some of his own pressure methods,and we still insisted on getting our keys and leaving. When we told my father-in-law about our experience, he said that he had a car salesman actually throw his keys on the roof of the dealership when he asked to leave. UNBELIEVEABLE!!!

We pulled out of that lot and went right to a Saturn dealership, which like DVC uses no pressure, and bought a car that night. The first dealership called the next day and was furious that we bought somewhere else. He didn't understand why we would spend thousands more at Saturn. My husband told him that it was because we didn't appreciate his sales techniques, they made us feel like we were getting scammed. To us feeling confident in ourselves as buyers and in our product is worth the extra money.

When we heard that DVC was no pressure sale, that sealed the deal for us on buying in to the BWVs. Some of these other timeshares and businesses should take notes from the DVC and companies like Saturn on how to treat potential customers.

[Peter Johnson]

Our second on-property stay was at Port Orleans in March 92. There was a DVC flyer on the table, and we'd heard about it also. I spent the entire week resisting DW's urgings to go to the presentation, but gave in on the last day.

No, we didn't buy that day, but mainly because the free pass program had not quite started yet, and we wanted to be extra sure it was a "done deal". Since DVC was not licensed in NH yet, we had to return over Memorial Day weekend to sign the papers and have our first visit home :) (which is another whole story!)

DW still kids me about not wanting to go!

[ducklite]

akghutton-

If I were at a dealership that wouldn't give me back my keys, I'd call the cops using my cell phone, ON THE SPOT, and have them arrested. Even if they gave the keys back before I completed my call, I would still file a complaint against them with the police.

I also drive a Saturn, as does DH. We had another before these as well. Very happy Saturn owners :-)

Anne

[Dean]

One day when I was younger, I was headed to San Diego and had a few hours to kill. I was thinking about a SUV and stopped at the Toyota place to look. They didn't have a 4runner in stock but tried to get me to buy one anyway. I just wanted to see one and see if I liked it. After about 2 hours of back and forth, looking ata truck that "had the same interior" and them saying if I could sell it to you at X price would you buy? I was fed up. I had asked for my keys back several times still no keys. The price was good but I knew they wouldn't sell it at that price. The salesman said he had to go ask the manager if he could sell at that price so I said I'd buy at that price but if he came back and asked me for one more dollar, I was going to punch him in the nose. For some reason, that ended the hunt for my keys. As I said, I was much younger then, LOL.

[cindy_k]

I don't understand? How does the car dealership get your car keys?
Is this something they do in other states? I have never given my car keys to a dealer here on Long Island.

Thanks,
Cindy

[Chuck S]

I am assuming people give the dealer their keys to inspect the car for trade in value? Although, I never release my keys until I've pretty well decided on the car I want to purchase, then I give them my keys and let the negotiations begin, and we don't continue to negotiate until my keys are sitting on the salespersons desk in front of me. Then, if I change my mind, I grab my keys and leave the dealership.

[plain crazy]

there are benefits to the "hard sell" approach. i went on a timeshare tour in cancun and checked my mother-in-law in to the kiddie room during the wait. after i refused to sign up the timeshare sales staff refused to return my mother-in-law. it's been three years this month, and i've been so happy i kind of feel bad the sales guy didn't get a commission.
maybe the u.n. could use a similar approach for incarcerating milosevich, idi amin, or saddam hussein. eventually every war crimes tribunal would be based in greater orlando, and "lock out" units would have a whole new meaning.

[Dean]

Yes, the keys were with the trade in question. Good one with MIL.

[Joeblack]

Hey Plain Crazy:

I forgot to mention that when the timeshare salesman in Cancun saw that we were not going to buy after all the harrassing and insults, he told us we could only leave with the condition that we take a lady with us that had been stored in the kiddie room for a couple of days. After some consideration, we just bashed through the door and escaped. ;-)

[The4OfUs]

LOL! You guys are too funny. I forgot to mention how we FINALLY figured out a good way to avoid those streetside timeshare salesguys...we would walk along the sidewalk hand in hand, and when accosted by one of these folks asking us to come see their timeshare, we either spoke to each other in a made up language, with a questioning look on our faces, or used our limited knowledge of sign language to "speak" to each other. They backed off quickly if we pretended to ask them questions in a language they didn't understand!

[danicaw]

(I didnt mean for my subject line to rhyme:) )

Hubby and I are looking for an additional timeshare. We love our DVC and think we will continue to use it as we have been...to go to WDW! But, we are wanting to travel other places so...we are shopping around for a timeshare. Which is not something the sales people at those presentations like to hear.

We went to a Shell Vacation Club (SVC) presentation a few weeks ago and then the next week a Trendwest presentation...we have more "Free" trips to Vegas than one family could possibly need:D.

Anyway. SVC actually told the group that they had "invented" the points system for timeshares. Wow! What a claim. Seems odd since they have only been using points for a handful of years, but, why would they lie;). They were nice and pleasant until we started to put our foot down. "No, we don't want to buy today." We finally told them that although we were gathering information on timeshares, with hopes to buy in the future, we would not buy tonight. My husband is presently between jobs, and spending that kind of money was not an option. They asked who else we would be looking at and at that point we didnt see the harm in telling them. The guy actually told us not to waste another sales persons time if we weren't going to buy and just look for information on the internet. In the end we gathered more information from the Membership information we borrowed from a work associate who joined SVC, than they shared at the presentation. They told us it costs $300 for them to put together the free trips they give away to get people in the door.
I was shaking my head by the time we escaped and got to our car. I don't respond well to the hard sell.

Our Trendwest experince was not as high pressure and they didn't get as miffed when we said no.

So, I would say although we did learn alot from Trendwest about how they are set up. Unless you are tough skinned and don't mind having people upset with you. I wouldn't go just for more information.
And to be honest we really weren't that intersted in the free trip. Its mid-week and crazy flight times.

Oh, well just thought I would share. I guess if you want to learn about a timeshare join the TUG.

[Geubux]

My wife and I actually like going to timeshare presentations, and some of them have been quite nice. The best deal was I think Fairfield at Williamsburg, VA. I paid $99 to them. When we went, we got 2 nights in a Sleep Inn, which had a breakfast, $30 gift certificate for dinner in one of 5 restaurants, $30 gift cert to an outlet mall( got $15 sandals and 15 cash back), coupon book(we never used), 2 adult passes to Williamsburg ($30 each) and $50 cash when we saw the presentation. My wife jokes that we needed the money so we took the kids on vacation!
The best one my wife pulled was at Virginia Beach. The lady says,"So are you going to spend your vacations in luxury or cooped up?" My dw says," I guess cooped up." End of discussion. Her second best was at Myrtle Beach. The time share is about 3 miles from the beach. Same as before, What do you think? My dw says, If i'm spending all this money, I want to be right on the beach. End of discussion. Of course, the fact that I have broad shoulders and weigh about 290 may have something to do with it, but now we only accept the really good deals and still plan on telling them no. We do, however, want to add points to our DVC.

[KNWVIKING]

Years ago we went thru two "Outdoor World" camp ground resort time shares.Very high pressure,continually dropping the price,bringing out a whole line of managers- each one supposedly higher up then the last- till they finally realized NO MEANS NO !! For the 2nd tour, we were camping in a local state park,came back to our site & found the invitation on our windshield. The gift offer was $75.00- this was back in the early 80's.It was a rainy day so we decided $75.00 was worth the grief. After the whole shpiel they finally our no and offered us a grill- worth about $10.00. When I said NONONO and showed them my offer of $75.00, you should have seen jaws drop & suits flying. It started to get ugly when someone at the top finally said to pay me. I know somebody got fired that day.

The last two presentations we went thru-including the MVC weren't as high pressure. The new tactic is for the salesman to spend the first 45 minutes "getting to know you" with small talk,chit-chat. He's suddenly becoming your new best friend whose feelings you couldn't possibly hurt by saying NO. It's amazing how their attitude towards us- their newest best friend- suddenly turned soar when we got up to leave.

Last new tactic: Your gift is 4 free round trip airline tickets. Catch: You have to book a specific number of rooms at a short lists of resorts at RACK rate. Take a guess what the normal price for the same stay plus the cost of airfare equals: The RACK rate you just paid. Total value of your free gift: $000000$

[Joeblack]

NKWVIKING: You are totally right about the "new best friend" technique and the free airline tickets. The latter, I receive 2 emails daily announcing I am the winner of 2-4 airplane tickets.

With such a tremendous arsenal of weapons to hit on a prospective owner, I amo not surprised at how many people end up coughing up a large amount of money when all they wanted was the free gift. I bet the % of people who fall for all this is outrageous.

In any case. I really hope many people read this and also visit the TUG so that they don't fall victims to these tactics.