Film and x-rays! a warning...

[TSI_Fan]

I work in the film developing business, and normally when I see film that comes out of our processor black, or with various green-ish splotches on it, we can safely assume that it's heat damage (so please, don't leave your film in direct sunlight). I processed a roll of film the other day that not only came out partially black, but all the images that were left on the roll were very fuzzy and to the point of being totally unrecognizable. This was the product of airport x-rays! I was told that if you are travelling out of major airports, or travelling overseas, you stand a considerable risk of having undeveloped film become totally ruined. The extent of the damage, obviously, is dependent on how strong of an x-ray your film is exposed to. I hear Atlanta has very strong x-rays, so I assume major metropolitan airports are similar. Obviosuly international gates would have strong x-rays as well.

What can you do? There is a product (our store sells it..Eckerds) called a film bag that is lined with lead to protect your film from being damaged by these x-rays. The best idea is to carry that with your carryon luggage so when the people scanning your luggage question it, you can pull it out and show them there is nothing but film canisters inside.

Now that I have witnessed this myself, I can say that it can happen, and it does happen, and eventhough I may never meet any of you on this board in person, working in photo developing, I know how important your picture memories are and I wouldn't want this to happen to your film coming to/from Disney. So please, keep this in mind when you're travelling.

[Swan]

Thank you TSI_Fan.
I did not know this. I will get me one of those backs just to be safe.

[rhiannonwales]

Just wanted to add an opinion......


I'm a lab manager for the same company as you TSI, but i disagree with you on this one.

First of all, heat damaged film usually looks pink or red, not black. That sounds more like partially exposed film.

Second, lead lined bags can actually be more dangerous because if your lead lined bag goes through the x ray machine and the attendants cannot see what is inside they will turn up the intensity of the x rays until it can penetrate through the bag. This exposes your film to even more radiation that it would have been exposed to initially.

In my opinion to insure that your film stay intact you really have only one or two options.
The first is to get your film developed before you leave Disney.

The second, and this is what i do, is to wear pants with big pockets in them. I puit all the rolls of film in the pockets. When i have to go through the metal detector, i remove the film and put it in the basket. Then after i go through, i take my film back.The attendant usually hand examine it but otherwise leave it alone.

But you must be adamant about this because sometimes they will try to tell you that it is okay for film to go through the machine. Once when this was said to me i replied, that i was in the film developing buisness and i knew that hand checking was acceptable according to the FAA and then they let it drop.

Now don't be insulted i don't mean to offend but i wanted to add my own years of experiance to the discussion.

[rhw]

I had been very lucky with film and airport x-rays, but decided to get the lead bag just to be safe. That was a big mistake. Every one of my 16 rolls came back blank when using the lead bag. I still worry every time, but will never use that bag again.

[pbhunt]

Put your film, exposed or not in a plastic bag and give it the security attendant and ask them to hand inspect it. They will do this for you without any problem, even if they are busy. It takes a few moments but your film will be fine. I only do this if I'm really concerned about once in a lifetime photos. The unexposed film we shoot has been carried all around the country and overseas , it has been scanned repeatedly, and we have never lost a roll to airport x-rays. :)

[doodlebug]

Do you think they would be so nice when I came thru the line and asked them to hand check 10 rolls of film? :o) I'm going for 10 days and love to take pictures so plan on taking at leat that many rolls. I don't want to start off my trip with a sour puss gate attendant

[ducklite]

I have never had film ruined by an x-ray machine. The only time this is an issue is when you are using high speed film. Anything that "normal" folks use is up to about 400, and that won't be hurt by the x-rays.

If you are that concerned, have it hand checked.

I just came back from an international trip with 12 rolls of film and three disposable cameras, and all developed perfectly...except the picture of the car dashboard and the one with my finger half over the lens :-)

It went through the x-ray machine in both directions.

Anne

[FergieTCat]

Here's my trick:

Put all of your film (including video cartridges) in a ziplock bag and hand it to the security agent before you go through x-ray. Ask them to hand check it. If you really want to make them happy, take all of the film out of the canisters and leave the lids off, so they don't have to open every single canister to make sure there's nothing in it.

I've had security agents at the New York City airports thank me for taking the film out of the canisters.

Donna

[Beverly Lynn]

I have to argue about the film being ruined by the xrays at the airport. I have gone thru 4 different security classes at the airport and they always have time devoted to this one subject. the xray machines do not ruin the film. (and some other fyi your bags do not go thru an xray machine when they go thru the belt loaders to the bag make upr oom to go to the waiting aircraft!) only international flights will have an xray machine for the bags. not domestic. and yes ATLANTA does have the most sophisticated xray machine out there as it is now the busiest airport in the US. MCO is ont he list to get the updated equipment....as well as LAX and the NY area aiports. I wish I had the papers from this class so I could post it here word for word. of all the times I have flown I have always put my cameras and film thru the machines and have never had any problems. this has been 35 mm cameras and film and my APX and that film as well as my digital camera and its disks. if you are that worried about your film you may seperate it from your bag and hand it to the person at security and they can check the film by hand.

[rhiannonwales]

i actually was not referring to the checked baggage only that which goes through carryon detectors .


I do believe you Beverly but i think that is rather scary that they DON"T x-ray checked baggage waiting to be loaded onto the plane!

[pbhunt]

On our last trip we had thirteen rolls with pictures and 2 underwater disposable cameras from Discovery Cove. The security attendants couldn't have been nicer about hand inspecting it. We had left all the rolls in the canisters and they peeked in about half of them. I think the suggestion about removing the rolls from canisters, but leaving the canisters in the ziplock bag with their lids off, is a really good idea. it would probably go even faster.:)

[AllanJ]

(copied from another post)

Before getting to the X-ray security gates -- Take everything out of pockets except for your wallet and put it all in a suitcase. Take all the film cartridges out of their canisters and put the bare cartridges in your pockets. Hang your camera (should have strap) around your neck.

At the security gate -- "Empty your pockets" putting the stuff (film cartridges) ini the little basket they have. KEEP YOUR WALLET IN YOUR POCKET OR HANDS

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[laurenk]

I always keep all of my undeveloped film in a big ziplock. Then I put it into my backpack(carry-on). I have them hand check it. They don't like to do it, but I insist. My biggest fear, is all of my wonderful memories being destroyed. I have read so many conflicting reports on this topic. I also leave it out of the canister, to make it easier for them.

[Disnydad]

I'd like to go along with Beverly on this. I've never had film in my carry on effected at all. Even on trips out of the country. I only carry it in my carry on.

[Desnik]

How about this: Can't I just have my film developed before I get home? Does anyone know how much it is to have film developed on site? What about the super market at DTD, I think it's called Goodings? Does anyone know if they have 1 hour photo developing? Do I still have to worry about my unused film on my way to WDW? Is it better to just buy film when you get there, and have it developed there?

[JillU-DVC]

I read this tip on these very boards about a year ago....

Before you leave for Disney, call York Photography (or go to their website) and have them send you a bunch of their film developing envelopes; the postage on the envelopes is already paid, so you don't even have to carry stamps!

When you finish a roll of pictures, put the roll in the envelope and send it off for developing! Put your home address on it, and your pictures will either be waiting for you when you get home, or will arrive a few days after you get back.

How many of us run out to the drug store to get our film developed as soon as we get home? Mine hangs around for weeks before I get it to the store, so this is definitely faster for me.

The only drawback is that York wants a check to pay for the processing - I don't carry checks, but I did bring a few with me on our last trip to Disney.

Very easy and you can mail it and forget it!

To get my film to Disney, I agree with several previous posters - I take ALL of my unexposed film, and put it into a plastic ziplock bag, and have the security people hand check it. They always say to just put it on the belt, but I always tell them I want them to check it by hand anyway. They always will if you are firm about it (after all, the FAA definitely allows is). They usually roll their eyes, but I can deal with that.

Also, I have heard that the higher the film speed the more possibility there will be problems with the film and the xray machine (1000 speed film would have more problems than 100 speed film). Don't know if this is true or not, but thought I'd mention it.

Hope this helps!!!

[CityKid]

While I have always used and suggested the lead bag and carry-on solution because:
- it prevents having your vacation pix ruined
- the bag is re-usable
- it avoids the airport hassle,

why not see what the folks at Kodak have to say at:http://www.kodak.com/cluster/global/en/service/faqs/faq0014.shtml

Now, the folks at Fuji answer many questions at:
http://www.fujifilm.com/tcm.html?x-tempest-op=generic&CategoryId=10244&ParentCategory=Service+%26+Support&pagetype=CategoryContent&ContentType=FAQ&CurrentTopCategory=10243

[briane]

If for some reason you plan to use 1000 speed film, have it hand checked.

Otherwise your film will be fine.

Always use 100 speed film unless you are taking pictures without a flash (nights shots on a tripod) or plan to take some fast action shots. I prefer Fuji Reala but Kodak Royal Gold is not bad.

If you can invest in a 35mm camera do it. Disposables are aweful. If you want lasting memories (1) get a good camera, (2) don't buy cheap film, (3) don't buy Max or 400 speed film unless you are taking action shots or using a tripod at night, (4) use the flash for portraits even when outside (5) DON'T GET IT DEVELOPED AT A DISCOUNT STORE!

I have a Nikon N70 but only use it on selected days since it is bulky. We have an Olympus point and shoot which is water resistent. Fits nicely in a fanny pack.

Just my two cents.

[GAIL HAYDEN]

I do take definite offense to the suggestion of not having your film developed at a discount store. I work at Wal*Mart and process a lot of film everyday. We have the most sophisticated equipment available and our film processing is top notch. Why, then, would I pay a huge amount of money to go to say "ritz" and have the film developed on the same equipment? Makes no sense to me.
As to developing while in FL. there are many places to have the film developed there.
Walgreens (ugh), Publix (another ugh), Wal*Mart (very good with good prices), onsite at Disney (expensive and conveyor belt processing, no attention to detail).
If you are ever in doubt as to what speed film to use, just read the package, it will tell you what the best film for your situation is. I use 400 speed film (fuji supera) most of the time.
If I have still shots, I use 100 (fuji). For fast action and zoom I use 800 (fuji). There is a film for every occassion, just read the package or the bins at the store.
Dark negs. can also be caused by N1 contamination from N2, among other things. Fuzzy images are usually from camera shake.
There is no way I would send my film to an outlab. I will spend the extra money and have it done right on site. You all have spend a LOT of money on vacation, what, in the scheme of things, is a couple of dollars more a roll? These pictures are memories and do get lost in the outlab procedure.
We don't loose many, but, I sure would not one of my customers to be one of the "not many".
Both my fuji and kodak rep assure me that airport xrays are of no danger to film. When they warn you to not expose them to xrays they are 1. covering their butts, and 2. warning you not to take a camera with you to have an xray.
I would definitely worry more about extreams in temp.

[Lewisc]

Gail--I agree with your statements. Where I live COSTCO 1 hour does a good job. The technicians take the necessary time and they are very willing to redo. For overnight processing virtually all the places by me send out to Kodak. The only difference is the mark up.
briane
I agree that for the most part people are better off not using disposable cameras (underwater camera for a water park is the one exception) but YOU'RE DEAD WRONG ON FILM SELECTION The vast majority of people use P/S zoom cameras. These cameras have very slow lenses. Only use 100 speed film if you're going to shoot the entire roll at noon at a beach. For normal use get 400 or 800 speed film. Try a test roll of Kodak and Fuji (most people prefer Fuji).
Your points makes sense for those few using SLR cameras with faster lenses or non zoom P/S (or a zoom with a good lens) but that isn't what most people are using.

[Beverly Lynn]

with my APX camera I found that 400 speed is great for taking pictures at disney.

I would be more in fear of York losing my photos or the mail than of it being destroyed by the xray at the airport.

[StilesMom]

I agree with those who have warned about having film developed at an "outlab"...
I worked in one many years ago and wouldn't trust them with valuable photos. If you would see how easy it is to lose film and negatives, you would agree. Now, granted, all places may not be the same and things may have changed, but are your Disney pics worth the risk??

As for York, I once sent them a roll of film for developing and they completely ruined my negatives. And when you use a "by mail" company, it is harder to complain when things go wrong!! When this happened, I couldn't find a phone number to call and complain and writing letters got me NOWHERE!

I agree that the safest place to have photos developed is anywhere that your film, negatives, and photos will stay "in house". I now use Ritz for important photos and for me, it is worth the extra $.

As for the x-ray machines at the airport, I have never had anything happen to mine either and I just put my whole camera bag (incl film) in the belt.

[AllanJ]

Only for the paranoid...

For film developing in a department or drug store, if there is a power failure the machine operator must crank the machine according to a set procedure otherwise film partially processed would be ruined. In a store, that person will likely be called away to other duties.

In a photo lab at least the chances are better that the machine operator will tend the machine until all the film inside has reached a safe area where sitting still won't overdevelop it.

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Allan,
Wal*Mart is a fully staffed photo lab, our associates DO NOT leave for other duties.
Anyone can have a power failure and if that situation arose you can bet we would not leave to attend to other things if we had film in the processor. I would be more worried about the outlabs where they are doing hundreds of rolls per hour.
Ritz, while an excellent place, has their employees selling cameras as well as processing film.
I would expect that your very far fetched scenario would be more correct in a situation like that.

[displanner]

Do I need to open up the boxes of UNUSED film and take the unused roll out of the canister for inspection? Or is the potential for problems only with used film?

[GAIL HAYDEN]

The slight potential for problems is with all film. I have my film(exposed and unexposed) in my carryon bag (big purse) and have never had a problem, even going out of the country.
If you are worried, then yes, you will have to take the film out of the package and out of the containers. I take mine out of the package anyway, easier to pack.

[msr709]

Just my 2 cents worth, how about joining a photo club like snapfish.com. They send you prepaid self addressed envelopes and you just drop them in the mail from your location and you will have your film by the time you get home and have them online to share with others as well! When you first enroll in the club (no fee) but you have to leave a credit card that will be charged when you develop film so you don' t have to worry about payment either. I've done it several times and it works well. I have not had any film ruined by airport x-rays yet but I will follow the advice here and carry my unused film in a plastic bag so it can be hand inspected. Thanks for the tips!

[briane]

I guess it all comes down to personal opinion. If you feel safe giving your film to a teenager making minimum wage at Wal-Mart, do it.

[The Hunt]

A few comments:

1. I notice that nobody has reported having film fogged after going through the carry-on X-Ray, and Kodak says it is OK. Therefore I have resolved to not worry about it.

2. I have to disagree with the comment not to use disposables. I have found that that they can take excellent pictures, as long as you do not try to photograph anything that is too far away. They are also easy to carry, and if you lose one, it's not like losing your Canon.

3. As far as where to have it developed, my suggestion would be not to do it anywhere where you just drop it into a slot. If they can't find your pictures or film later, you're out of luck. I've had pretty good luck with both Ritz and MotoPhoto--both have a membership card that gets you discounts.

[piglet33]

I have gotten my pictures developed at Sam's Club, Costco and Wal-Mart and never had any problems. I think they look just as good as the ones from MotoFoto, but not as expensive. When I'm packing, I put my rolls of film in ziplock bags and just hand them to the person doing the checking at the airport. They haven't given me any problems in doing this, yet.

[GAIL HAYDEN]

briane,
I am NOT a teenager and I make far more than minimum wage at Wal*Mart. I also take incredible pride in processing film and printing the best pictures possible, as do all the associates I work with, who buy the way make far more than minimum wage.
I truly resent your statements. If you are going to slice and dice, please be sure of your facts.
In this case they are totally wrong. FYI, no one can work in the photo lab at Wal*Mart until they are 18 years old.

[Lewisc]

Gail--briane is not only rude but he is wrong on most of what he posted.THAT SAID I'd avoid any 1 hour lab that doesn't do volume. Almost every chain store where I live has a mini-lab. Some of them don't do much business and the employees seem to switch from register to technician. COSTCO by me (and I suspect your Wal-Mart) does enough volume to have trained employees who do nothing but process film. The places that send the film out all go to the same labs (just different markups). I don't think Briane is a troll just ignorant.

[rhiannonwales]

Hi Gail,

Don't let it worry you Gail, some people have no class. There is nothing worse than a camera snob.

By the way briane, I work for Eckerd and we dont have a mini lab, we have the same machinery as Moto Foto.I am the manager and my employees don't make mininum wage, they are all certified by Kodak ( our chemical supplier) and they have to pass many tests before they can become a photo technician.

We may be a discount store but we are not cheap on photos! Neither is Wal-Mart! They use VERY EXPENSIVE Fuji frontier machines, some of the best in the buisness! WE use Noritsu machines and they are not cheap either!

Perhaps you should do a little research before you open your mouth.


By the way i have a professional photographer as one of my customers.......
He says that he can get the same quality from my service as he does from Moto Foto so why pay more? He uses us to develop his proofs and we even place the copyright mark on the back for him. He is the number one wedding photographer in this area, so i feel confident that i am just as good, if not better than that other place.

[Andrew Bichard]

Many years ago, I visited Malta.

On my return trip, I was hesitant about putting my camera through the x-ray machine. The operater, obviously an amateur photographer himself, winked and told me to put the camera through the machine. Don't worry, he whispered, this machine doesn't work - I am looking at a blank screen!!

Andrew

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Thanks Lewis and rhiannonwales.
I also do processing for professionals. One of my favorite photos is Tiger Woods. I made a duplicate 8x10 and it is now hanging on the wall as an advertisement of what we "can do in an hour" (along with some AK pictures of lions in all the sizes we can do). We asked the photographer if we could duplicate and display and we had him sign the back.

[cmac0531]

Last year was my very 1st trip to WDW and with my brand new camera I shot 12 rolls of film. I bought a 10 roll pack from Costco for $25 (which came with a $10 mail-in rebate) and had the unopened pack hand checked along w/ my camera @ Logan Airport in Boston. When I came back I wanted the security people @ Orlando Intl Airport to hand check my plastic baggie of film, but they made me put it through the machine. After worrying for days while it was processed @ WalMart (great prices) all was well and my pictures were fabulous. But I think people should press the issue about hand checking, at the very least it makes others around you feel you have less to hide. Also, no one has seemed to mention APS film/cameras. With a lot of models you can change rolls (even if you've taken 1 shot) for different speeds and use them later. Mine lets me change the ISO or film speed of the film, so I don't even have to change unless I'm playing w/ color or black & white. And at the end your negatives stay in the catridge and for copies you just pick the photo off of the sheet showing all of the frames. You turn in the cartidge and no mess, no squinting @ negatives, etc.... Good luck to all you shutterbugs!!! C-Ya in about 80 days Mickey!!

[CarolA]

I had to add my two cents. I never have my film hand checked and I have traveled extensively in lots of places. However, I would NEVER put my film in my luggage. While Beverly Lynn is right that they don't x-ray all baggage they can decide to xray it if something makes them nervous. Lots of international flights are x-rayed.

I rotate on my film developing. I had it done at Costco once, but was not real happy. (The pictures felt cheap if that makes sense!) I have done it just about everyplace with no issues, but it is not like I am Ansel Adams so...

[Beverly Lynn]

having just flown back from MCO this weekend I sent both my sony Mavica digital and disks thru the xray and my Nikon APX camera and film nothing happened to any of it.

they will xray bags if they are going international not domestic. if they are suspicious about a bag then it gets a certain kind of tag on it that alerts the ramp people that this bag does not go on the aircraft unless the passenger does.

[CarolA]

Beverly Lynn,


I had a friend who swore they told her that they xrayed her bag. Now I wonder what they really did with it! She had a calculator in it that got turned on. It was one of those calculators with the tapes and it kept making a click clack noise that seemed to upset the bag people. The paged her when she got off the plane and took her someplace to claim her bag and made her unlock it so they could search it. (Now since we had landed, I am not sure what they thought this was going to accomplish, but...) This was several years ago before they were as careful as they are now about matching luggage to travelers so who knows?

[Beverly Lynn]

Carol they probably thought it was a bomb! hahaha thats too funny! they call the people I was referring to a "selectee". its a royal pain when they come up too. they like the public to think that the bags are xrayed when they go down the bagshoot!

[CarolA]

Beverly,
I know they thought it was a bomb. It was actually pretty funny since they scared this poor girl to death! Airport security officers are not known for their sense of humor! That is why I never joke with them or do anything that might upset them. I know they would just lock me away under the airport! I hope they don't confiscate my pins Friday!