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View Full Version : DL and WDW parks slipping slowly


lucky_bunni
09-08-2003, 12:57 AM
Ok, many of you know me already for arguing about the whole BTMRR accident. However, I do agree with those of you who are saying that the quality at the parks is slipping. I posted this to another thread, and something said to me that I really needed to make this a thread:

You know I took a trip in 1986, then my great return trip was in 1995.. the year you first went. I was a little younger then, but I swear, that 1995 trip was the golden trip of a lifetime. I have never been "disappointed" either... but things, little things, do seem to slip a little on each subsequent visit... the paint peeling here, the bathroom there looking a little outdated/worn, etc. I don't know, but I do agree that things are slipping. There could be many answers. My answer, quit spending hundreds of millions on new attractions until you can properly maintain the resort as it is. Hey, if Disney World stay exactly as it is today, but was maintained to perfect, I'd be happy. I know that wasn't Walt's vision, he envisioned a park that would constantly be changing. But he was also maticulous and a perfectionist. I can't say that the parks are still being held up to what would have been Walt's standard of perfection. By letting that standard slip, they are losing guests, and letting the gap get narrower between them and the competition

wtg2000
09-08-2003, 08:04 AM
Years ago WDW was a smaller operation and Disney a smaller company. Now Disney is a conglomerate and WDW is massive. I just don't think it's possible to have the same quality control. Disney used to be a boutique. Now it's a strip mall. I'm actually impressed with the level of quality they still have considering how widely the talent pool must be spread concerning CMs and management.

crusader
09-08-2003, 08:20 AM
The decision shouldn't be one or the other.

Obviously, maintenance is priority one. There was an inherent risk the minute cutbacks occurred in that department and the cost was our own safety and potential lives. There is no argument that could ever warrant such a decision on the part of this organization, and they are now faced with a grave situation.

But to say that the funding should be reallocated from the attraction expansion budget is not where the company should focus the solution to this problem.

Pull the money from the executive compensation plan and revisit the costing structure of the legal department. Two fat cats feeding off the budget who should substantially bear the financial responsibility for this.

C.Ann
09-08-2003, 05:50 PM
My last trip to WDW was in Sept. 2001 - the same week of the horrific 9/11 events.. :(

In the days leading up to 9/11 I remember thinking to myself that Disney World was really beginning to slip in several areas.. On my very first trip to Disney World ever, I was simply astounded by the cleanliness and attention to detail no matter where I looked.. During my trip in 2001, I was dismayed to see that the same standards were no longer being upheld.. Restrooms were not clean; garbage cans were overflowing with garbage - thus creating large gatherings of flies in outdoor eating areas; litter was visible on walkways and paths - as well as in water areas; paint was peeling on the buildings on Main Street; shrubbery was unattended; rides had torn and/or dirty seats; and so much more.. One incident that really annoyed me was when a supervisor loudly scolded a CM for sweeping up some litter that was "not in her assigned area"..

Of course in the days following 9/11 I pretty much walked around in a state of shock so I didn't notice much of anything - except how absolutely MARVELOUS the CM's were in their attempts to put everyone at ease and insure that they still had the best time possible under the horrifying circumstances..

I have not been back to WDW since 2001, but I currently have a trip planned within the next few months.. Quite frankly, I have a sinking feeling that I will once again find that the parks have slipped yet another notch - bringing them precariously close to the traveling carnival..

Long ago Disney "set the bar" themselves - with standards for cleanliness and maintainence that were far above any other amusement park in the world.. Over the years they have slowly but surely been lowering that bar and it's sad to see that happening.. Unfortunately, I don't think things will change for the better under the current management.. The parks can not - and should not - be neglected in favor of other Disney ventures..

DemoBri1
09-10-2003, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by C.Ann
During my trip in 2001, ... litter was visible on walkways and paths - as well as in water areas; paint was peeling on the buildings on Main Street; shrubbery was unattended; rides had torn and/or dirty seats; and so much more.. One incident that really annoyed me was when a supervisor loudly scolded a CM for sweeping up some litter that was "not in her assigned area"..

I have not been back to WDW since 2001, but I currently have a trip planned within the next few months.. Quite frankly, I have a sinking feeling that I will once again find that the parks have slipped yet another notch - bringing them precariously close to the traveling carnival..



Come on!!! A travelling carnival?

Maybe with regards to the trash on pathways and in the water areas, people should be a little more respectful and actually throw the garbage in a receptacle made for such things. If one is overflowing in the area, then seek out a CM and alert them.

Legends of Horizons
09-10-2003, 12:10 PM
Originally posted by DemoBri1
Come on!!! A travelling carnival?

Take a look at Dinorama.

C.Ann
09-10-2003, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by Legends of Horizons
Take a look at Dinorama.
------------------------

My thoughts exactly.. What a huge disappointment to see something like that in WDW...

ChemAnimator
09-10-2003, 10:55 PM
My wife and I have noticed the quality slipping as well. We remember reading about the great lengths that Disney would go to to maintain the property. Things such as painting scuffed metal fixtures on Main Street every night and keeping duplicates of all park plants in greenhouses for any that may start to look "tired". We appreciated the quality and it helped make Disney the wonderful escape that it is. The focus on profits has not only caused maintenance to slip, but park "cast members" are not as helpful, friendly, or well trained as they used to be (in general, of course. There are still many gems who love Disney as much as the guests, but that used to be the norm.)
We also hate to see the focus of the parks switching so heavily in favor of thrill rides. I love most of the thrill rides, but I also loved the old Horizons and World of Motion Pavillions. EPCOT has always been inspirational as well as fun, but it is becoming less so. With the changed park focus and Downtown Disney (at least the part that used to be called Pleasure Island), it seems that Disney is spending most of their efforts trying to attract teens and very young adults, but it seems to me that more established adults and their children are the backbone of Disney's success, and Disney should be careful to not alienate them.
With all of that said, I have to say that we do not plan to stop going anytime soon. We first went to Disney in 1986 and have returned almost every year. I just wish the powers at Disney would read the opinions in this forum and re-evaluate the course they are charting.

C.Ann
09-11-2003, 12:29 AM
Originally posted by ChemAnimator
My wife and I have noticed the quality slipping as well. We remember reading about the great lengths that Disney would go to to maintain the property. Things such as painting scuffed metal fixtures on Main Street every night and keeping duplicates of all park plants in greenhouses for any that may start to look "tired". We appreciated the quality and it helped make Disney the wonderful escape that it is. The focus on profits has not only caused maintenance to slip, but park "cast members" are not as helpful, friendly, or well trained as they used to be (in general, of course. There are still many gems who love Disney as much as the guests, but that used to be the norm.)
We also hate to see the focus of the parks switching so heavily in favor of thrill rides. I love most of the thrill rides, but I also loved the old Horizons and World of Motion Pavillions. EPCOT has always been inspirational as well as fun, but it is becoming less so. With the changed park focus and Downtown Disney (at least the part that used to be called Pleasure Island), it seems that Disney is spending most of their efforts trying to attract teens and very young adults, but it seems to me that more established adults and their children are the backbone of Disney's success, and Disney should be careful to not alienate them.
With all of that said, I have to say that we do not plan to stop going anytime soon. We first went to Disney in 1986 and have returned almost every year. I just wish the powers at Disney would read the opinions in this forum and re-evaluate the course they are charting.
----------------------

That is an EXCELLENT post and pretty much sums up the way I feel (well - except I DON'T enjoy "thrill rides" - LOL).. Disney should never, ever make the mistake of forgetting about the children because to do so would be equivalent to committing financial suicide...

ohanafamily
09-11-2003, 12:03 PM
I notice a little too, the biggest turning point for me was when they started doing the general maintenance during the day.

I still walk around the parks with my Rose Colored Pixie Dusted Glasses on.

I am a little concerned because I am taking DW to DL over Halloween, and I have been reading a lot over the last year (not just the last week) about how the quality of the maintenance has degraded. I heard that the castle is in serious need of painting ad repair. Some of the wood has rotted out. I even heard that a tree fell on a guest because it had rotted and was not maintained.

With the incedent on BTMRR, I am starting to feel a little nervous...

But we will still go, still ride the rides, and if I am killed my father will get my DW the meanest, nastiest lawer you can imagine....

Maintenance should not fall by the wayside for $$$$$$$$$

:bounce:

Sarangel
09-11-2003, 07:47 PM
I heard that the castle is in serious need of painting ad repair. Some of the wood has rotted out. I even heard that a tree fell on a guest because it had rotted and was not maintained.

Disneyland *is* in need of fairly serious repair. The tree incident is true (and about a year old) it fell on a Friday in Frontierland. The Castle has been undergoing refurbishment for the last 2 years, but it seems to be almost the lowest priority, since it's still ongoing.

The good news is that the carousel has re-opened and is beautiful, and that there's a lot of stuff to do, even with all the closures.

Sarangel

ohanafamily
09-11-2003, 09:03 PM
Sarangel,

I know DW and I will have a great time there, but you mentioned "All of the closures" Should we expect half the park to be closed while we are there over Halloween?

I really want to go see the modified Haunted Mansion.
I doubt if you could get DW on BTMRR right now, but I am sure it will be fixed in a month.

What we both really want to try is Soaring.....

I will say this, the package I got came with a nice perk and a few Bogus perks. The Nicest perk is the unlimited FastPass. We won't have to wait to get lots of tickets... The most Bogus is the preferred seating... it is only for muppetvision3d, or other shows that seem to run constantly. we will probably use it for Aladdin.

Also, Mickey is only in the parks and doesn't go to any of the breakfasts. I doubt if we will use the CNN gift card, but my DW is in to pin collecting (not trading)

So I guess I will be brave and consider the park safe...

:bounce:

Sarangel
09-11-2003, 09:36 PM
Ohanafamily -

By October the HM should be open (I think they're having another event this year in mid-October). I was thinking of Splash, the Matterhorn, Space Mountain, and Big Thunder being closed, all of which are out of circulation at the moment.

Definitely use your priority seeting for Aladdin, which is a cool show. You can fast pass Soarin', or you can use the single rider line which is almost as good if you don't mind splitting your party. The one ride I worry about in DCA is California Screamin', which I've heard has some maintenance issues.

Sarangel

ohanafamily
09-11-2003, 10:33 PM
Thanks for the advice...

:bounce:

MickeyCrazed
09-12-2003, 06:00 AM
The company I work for focuses on the same attention to quaility that the Disney Company prides its self on.
In these economic times, their quality (maintenance) has also slipped a bit. It's unavoidable, with budget cuts etc.
Let's face it folks, no one is spending money the way they used to in the 90's.
I compare the 2 companies, and have no worries. I have faith in both and know things will eventually change for the better.
Yes, little things have slipped. The most noticeable for me was all the bird doo that was on the railings etc at the Boardwalk.
If that's all I have to worry about in life is a little poo, then I consider myself lucky! :D

chamonix
09-12-2003, 03:27 PM
ohanafamily? How/where do you get package that includes unlimited fastpass? :eek:

ohanafamily
09-12-2003, 03:42 PM
It is ONLY available at Disney Land, and it ISN'T a walk on (like at US). but you can run to all of the fastpass machines and not have to wait the 2 hours (or after the time on the FastPass) before you get the next one. It is ONLY available in packages purchased through DTA (or a traval agent that books through them) You cannot get it through DVC Member Services.

Since I have to pay cash for this trip and have to buy passes for DL, it was worth it.

If you want more details on any of this stuff, PM me and I will PM you back...
(Like US UFP, or how any of the systems work...)

:bounce:

Wilma Flintstone
09-14-2003, 10:58 AM
Maybe we should all take a trip to Tokyo's DisneySea.

I understand the quality of that park is outstanding.

My bags are packed!;)
--Wilma (wishful thinking)

meowthew2
09-15-2003, 12:09 AM
Not so fast.

I just read a post on another board from a person who visits Tokyo Disneyland on a frequent basis, and they were bemoaning the fact that recent cost cutting (yes, cost cutting) at TDL was affecting the maintenance and appearance of the parks there.

maggie767
09-16-2003, 08:28 PM
we are going in october. getting ready for our vacation is exciting , can't wait to get there. this will be my 4th trip and i love disney. my no.2 daughter has never been there nor my 1 granddaughter and i can't wait to see their faces. they will just love it. now talking about cutbacks i really hate to see that at dw because it is so beautiful there. its a real shame that they are cutting back everywhere. i work at a hospital and believe me it sure is a shame for patients and cleaniness. in one of the bathrooms i killed a bug in JUNE and it is now SEPTEMBER. it is still on the wall behind the bathroom door now whats wrong here. i tell everyone how clean disney is and now you're telling me it is getting run down. is this disney world also? i sure hope not.

ohanafamily
09-16-2003, 10:11 PM
maggie767, it isn't quite that bad (yet?)!!!!!

There have been cutbacks, and it shows in a lot of ways to people who look to see. They still do a pretty good job keeping the bathrooms clean;).

Actually, if you read through this thread there are a lot of services that have been discontinued as a cost saving measure. Many have not been cut (a whole lot). when the economy gets a little better, and crowds continue to return, hopefully most of those services will come back. I just hope that when they start looking at bottom line numbers that they don't decide that the parks need the maintenance is overrated. It has been argued that the parks carry a good portion of the financial collection effort for the company; that being said, if they let the maintenance slip and continue to have problems, then WDW may have an unclear future path.

I am actually unsure of what a big cash cow the parks are for the company; anybody out there have facts for me? I recall reading in another thread that there were lots of bad Disney investments, but revenue from the parks have made up the shortcomings.


:bounce: