So can Pirates even appraoch this????? [Archive] - The DIS Discussion Forums

HB2K

05-19-2003, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by MelissathePooh
I think it will be difficult for ANY film to approach the numbers of Matrix Reloaded. I'm not sure anyone would have predicted those figures in the first place for the film let alone an R rated film. Any film at all will have a tough time.

I'm sure Pirates won't do those numbers, but I still believe it will be successful.

What will be interesting to see is whether or not Reloaded has any staying power. I've heard from some Matrix fans who disliked the movie so much they have no intentions of seeing the second part this fall.

That was one of the funniest posts I've read in a long time.

A) The Matrix box office wasn't in question. The movie studios were looking at $100 to $150 mil from the opening extended weekend according to every artice I read on MSNBC, NEWSWEEK, etc.

B) There is NOTHING big opening up next weekend for Memorial day. Matrix will dominate again.

C) If we're talking personal experince, every Matrix fan I've talked to said they liked the second better than the first, and can't wait for November. I think that's the reason most of your Matrix friends are mad....but what did they want? A 5 hr movie?

There was an article in Newsweek which asked the Wachoski bros about the wisdom of having both movies released in the same year. Their answer (paraphrased)?

"Our fans would kill us if we made them wait any longer".

Trust me, the box office for this one alone will pay for both movie's production costs.....

As for Pirates, the trailers are growing on me, but I'm still worried about the apparent lack of a story line and how well that genre will perform in the middle of summer.

Another note about the Matrix....they used a formula similar to a certain old guy who's got a company named after him...

Tell a great story, use cutting edge technology to tell your story, and don't skimp on the quality.

Sounds like a formula for success. It's worked for Walt, it's worked for Pixar, now it's working for the Wachowski Bros. Too bad the originator's company can't figure it out.

KNWVIKING

05-19-2003, 12:31 PM

"No -- I seriously doubt anything will beat Matrix this summer. I would say X2 and T3 are the only ones that will come close. "

Keep an eye on "The Hulk".

MelissathePooh

05-19-2003, 01:03 PM

I guess I didn't pay as much attention to the predictions about opening weekend as I disliked the first Matrix greatly and don't care anything about the second, but I also read some articles last night about how the concern over the "r" rating caused some early questions as to its opening power. I was going by eveyone I have been around being astonished at the numbers.

Its (Reloaded) got a 75% rating on rottentomatoes right now. The rotten reviews were the exact arguments our friends had - while obviously in the minority of viewers.

Kaelyn

05-19-2003, 02:18 PM

Liked the first Matrix but didn't like the second. To quote from an TCM commercial: "Visually stunning but ultimately pointless sequel." Agreed with this review: http://slate.msn.com/default.aspx?id=2082928 (http://) .

I've never read a comic book in my life and had to be forced to watch the first XMen which I really liked. LOVED X:2. Will see it again and am hoping they make a third.

But people, take my word for it and just wait for December. Right now I am simply marking time until Return of the King.

d-r

05-19-2003, 03:02 PM

Originally posted by KNWVIKING
"No -- I seriously doubt anything will beat Matrix this summer. I would say X2 and T3 are the only ones that will come close. "

Keep an eye on "The Hulk".

I have to agree - for some reason our society really loves retold tales of comic book super heros - T3, Hulk, Matrix, plus several other big movies out there for Pirates to get lost in the crowd of.

And fwiw, I am astonished that an R rated movie did that well-
DR

d-r

05-19-2003, 03:15 PM

I think that's the reason most of your Matrix friends are mad....but what did they want? A 5 hr movie?

actually...that was the funniest thing I've read in a while, but just because you didn't hear all the negative comments they had about how much time was wasted on things that didn't seem relevant to the story (I heard something like "there was like *forever* in some dance club where they just show people dancing, what was the point in that?") Anyway, they sure didn't want any more of it!

I think they may be from a different demographic - I think that the matrix has been most successful with young men.

DR

PS for what its worth, from boxofficemojo.com:

Prior to the opening, concerns were raised in the media and the industry over how the R rating would affect business -- Hannibal's $58,003,121 was the previous top opener that carried the label, and Beverly Hills Cop the top overall grosser at $234,760,478.

EUROPA

05-19-2003, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by Bob O
I think the new potter will be worse than the 2 prior potterr films.

Why? "Azkaban" is considered by many the best book (or tied with Goblet) The Fan forums for Potter are drooling over the third movie.

BRERALEX

05-19-2003, 03:38 PM

Azkaban looks to be way to complicated to be put into 3 hours. How can they incorporate everything without sacrificing alot? Sirius black the azkaban gaurds, wormtail, hagrids new class, Hermoine and the clock. the ending to Azkaban alone could be an hour.

BRERALEX

05-19-2003, 03:45 PM

What will be interesting to see is whether or not Reloaded has any staying power. I've heard from some Matrix fans who disliked the movie so much they have no intentions of seeing the second part this fall.

Every person ive spoken to said they didnt like it. My gf almost fell alseep in those slow parts and i just saw it for a second time, they got real sloppy with the cgi. the george lucas- syndrome all cgi less story.

the 100 Smiths vs. Neo was horrible it looked like the animatrix. the chase was good but i didnt like it overall. THE MUSIC SUCKED LIKE BAD. they should look at the nightcrawler opening scene for x2 to know you dont need techno music in every scene to make it cool.

katerkat

05-19-2003, 04:41 PM

Originally posted by BRERALEX
they should look at the nightcrawler opening scene for x2 to know you dont need techno music in every scene to make it cool.

oooh, that was SOOOO COOL!!! :eek: Loved that scene!! BAMF! And the plane scene! BAMF!

Ahem.

Er, KWVIKING -- you're right, I forgot about The Hulk. But I did say the POTC wouldn't crack the top five, and named only three movies, so... ;)

And I've read mixed reviews for Matrix 2, too. I think the problem is part over-anticipation. I'm not looking forward to seeing it this weekend, so maybe I'll be surprised. :)

TheSecondCook

05-19-2003, 05:16 PM

Well, as far as the original subject matter of this post (will Pirates do the kind of numbers Matrix did), I believe it will do decent numbers and at least make back its budget. Summer films are notoriously expensive to make (usually epic action films with lots of sfx and name stars), yet bring in the people in droves looking for mindless excitement and entertainment. As long as it is at least entertaining and watchable, it's got 100 mil domestic pegged. I think it all really dpends on what the critics say...if they say that Pirates isn't any good, people will remember Cutthroat ISland as well as recent Disney flops (ie Country Bears) and not come to the theater. If it gets at least average reviews, that will be enough incentive for everyoen to see it and see their childhood Disney memories projected on the big screen. I also think it will be somewhat familyfriendly, which the Matrix certainly is not.

As far as the debate on what other movies this summer can get close to Matrix, well T3 and the Hulk might. Like I said everyone likes a rollercoaster action film, so T3 will rule its weekend regardless. Arnold + hot naked girl + explosions usually equates to box office success. IT doesn't have the hype surrounding it that the Matrix had, though. Hulk on the other hand...well, Marvel's riding high right now. With the success of Spiderman, X2 (which I saw three times openign weekend and probably is now my favorite movie) and even Daredevil, people expect quality from Marvel films and for the most part receive it. The Hulk is probably the most beloved and famous Marvel hero next to Spidey, so I imagine if anyone's getting close to the MAtrix it's the Green Meanie.

As far as the Matrix Reloaded, I disliked it. Tremendously. I'm not such a huge fan of the original that I was psyched beyond belief for this one and let down by this one like many people suggest. Simply put, the Matrix Reloaded was a movie with a shell of a story to showcase sub-par special effects, numerous fight scenes with no edge and little originality, forced attraction between Trinity and Neo (for the ladies) and muddled, psychological and philosdphical nonsence (unlike the first which was an interesting take on Plato's "Shadow on the Wall" parable). Not to mention the worst screenplay and dialogue this side of George Lucas (ie-"You can't no a man until you fight him" and the whole Neo/Architect spiel).

OH well, bring on Spidey 2 and X3 and I'll be happy.

KNWVIKING

05-19-2003, 05:26 PM

Bottom line is that this weekend will tell the tale. With all the surrounding hype it was almost a certainly that the opening weekend would be monster. The quality of the movie and all the positive or negative buzz it creates will determine it's future. Matrix seems almost like a Star Wars or even Star Trek type movie: Some people have an almost cult like fasination with them and regardless of quality will flock to it,( Gee kinda remind you of anyone, ie Dis fanatics). And I also believe the R-Rating will hurt it in the long run, at least until the video is released.

EUROPA

05-19-2003, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by BRERALEX
Azkaban looks to be way to complicated to be put into 3 hours. How can they incorporate everything without sacrificing alot? Sirius black the azkaban gaurds, wormtail, hagrids new class, Hermoine and the clock. the ending to Azkaban alone could be an hour.

That is the beauty of the screen. What takes a chapter to playout in the book can sometimes be just as well done with 5 minutes of screen time. Azkaban is really not introduced in detail until Goblet anway.

PatriciaH

05-19-2003, 07:22 PM

LOVED The Matrix-did not love Reloaded. I wanted to but really could not. The CGI was awful in parts of the Smith fight scene. It dragged at points. Too bad. Nightcrawler (X2) on the other hand-WOW!

Bob O

05-19-2003, 11:38 PM

I would agree with hb2k!!!
From the coming attractions for Hulk it seemed IMHO to be very fake and inferoir cgi ala The scorpion King cgi in Mummy Returns.
As for the Matirx Reloaded i thought it was an excellant movie and from the people i have spoken too i have heard no negative complaints overall about the movie and most are looking forward to seeing it again as i am!!!
I dont think the new LOTR movie will have any effect on the 3rd Matrix as they are beling released about 6 weeks away from each other.
T3 looks excellant from the previews but i hope it doesnt suffer because Cameron isnt involved.
Now i am looking forward to Pirates but wasnt the coast of this movie also over 100 million ??? So with marketing etc if wont be much cheaper overalll than the Matix Reloaded and wilkl be released with more competition in front of the movie than the Matrix has had.
As for potter, the second made less than the first and little reason to believe the third will out do or equal the other movies.

Another Voice

05-19-2003, 11:50 PM

Actually the rumors are that Warner Brothers is disappointed in the opening weekend of The Matrix Reloaded. They thought they had a real chance to beat Spider-man but that too many theaters were too strict about enforcing the movie’s “R” rating (slightly off topic – how did Matrix get an “R” for a rave party scene but seventy minutes of people being disemboweled only got X-Men 2 a PG-13?). Given the less than favorable critical reception there are going to be a lot of focus groups spending a lot of time looking at The Matrix Revolutions to “fix” that movie in time.

Disney’s Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Red Ink has absolutely no hope of being that big of a blockbuster. There are only two ways of getting a megahit: you get a bunch of fourteen year olds to see the movie a dozen times each (as in Titanic) or you get the people who only go out to the movies once a year to all go together (as in My Big Fat Greek Wedding).

Given the immediate competition from The Hulk, Terminator 3 and others the number of fourteen year boys wanting to see Johnny Depp swish it up as a pirate may be very limited. And girls/women do not go to a movie en mass to see the lead star. No one was bigger than Leo diWhathisname after Titanic – and not a single one of his fans showed up a few months later to watch him in The Beach. The rule of thumb is men go to a movie for the actress, women go to the movie for the character. Think about – men have their magazines, women tend toward romance novels. Orlando Bloom may have his following, but if the movie doesn’t work than he won’t save it (but every guy is going to see Tomb Raider 2 even though the first one was awful because the movie has two very strong points working in its favor).*

There are subtle rumors that Disney is trying to downplay the expectations for Pirates. Because of the production and marketing costs, this movie will need to gross over $250+ million in just the U.S. to hope to break even (and that number is low because it counts in international and home video sales). The very last thing Eisner wants now is more bad press about another Treasure Planet sized failure; he’s still trying to get through all the rubble caused by Reign of Fire, The Recruit, Bad Company, Atlantis, and other blunders.

Eisner got caught in his usually trap. In awe of the gobs of money to be made he spent foolishly trying for the big prize. But then he spent so much that he had to spend even more to protect his investment. And then that caused him to spend even more because the stakes are so high that a failure could be disastrous. It’s the same trap he fell into with Pearl Harbor and stretching all the way back to Dick Tracy. He just never learns.

P.S. – You think that was an impressive opening weekend, just wait until year’s end when The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King opens. You thought the other two were good…get in line now.

P.S.S. There are whispers around that if Pirates does well enough not to embarrass the concept of ride movies that someone has already been assigned to write [I]Mission:

Planogirl

05-20-2003, 01:24 AM

Has anyone ever seen the actual demographic of those who saw Titanic? The only persons I know who saw it a dozen times were female but far older than 14. But I don't know how typical that is.

I really believe that the female appeal of Pirates will depend a lot on how the film was made. There is something very romantic about the so-called good swashbuckler but who knows if Disney used that to their advantage? I think of Errol Flynn and to a lesser degree Robert Shaw and I can see that a character could be developed that would appeal to several demographics, IF it was done right. But then it always seems to come down to that. :(

Oh well, I'm waiting VERY eagerly for LOTR. The Hulk looks a bit too odd to me in the trailers so I'm not that enthusiastic.

d-r

05-20-2003, 06:41 AM

I think that rotk will have huge numbers, but it will be harder for it to have weekend numbers because it opens during the holidays when people spread out going to the movies through the week, not just on the weekend. Matrix weekend benefited from opening when school is still in and people go to movies on the weekend.

DR

year2late

05-20-2003, 07:25 AM

Matrix 2 left me high and dry. The action was good. Pseudoending sucked wind.

I have seen the Pirates trailer and I am intrigued...I will definitly see it.

*Robin*

05-20-2003, 10:24 AM

Originally posted by Another Voice

Think about – men have their magazines, women tend toward romance novels.

OT I know, but this is a really harsh generalization of women...LOL...

YOUCH!

Truly, not all of us sit around reading (heck, what was that guys name with the long hair and butter commercials?) airbrush covered books and eat bonbons. I do think most women go for more meat in a movie than action, but that's a generalization too...

:eek: Robin ;)
(hehehe, this from a person that has "hopeless romatic" in her tag line...ohhh the irony!)

BRERALEX

05-20-2003, 11:18 AM

it's matrixes own fault it got an R rating. In the rave scene which i dont like calling it a rave scene they didnt have to show womens &!**l* they could have avoided that. Keanu's butt didnt have to be shown if they were gonna show a butt it should have been Moss' and they didnt have to throw around F bombs for no reason then to just throw them. like at the meeting in the beginning when they hear the sentinels are drilling down, a guys says the MF bomb and it felt like for no reason then to be cool and say it.

X2 threw around the S word and probably the most fitting by wolverine discovering Lady Deathstrike had adimantium as well as he. Matrix didnt just have the 'rave' scene for the R rating the also had the 'piece' of cake!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wooooooooooo

darla

05-20-2003, 02:50 PM

i havn't posted here in a while for one reason. I am tired of people dogging movies or anything else just because it isn't disney. For example, on this page people are saying this movie is getting mixed reviews. Go to rottentomatoe.com 75 percent of the critics in the country enjoyed matrix 2 and that's tough to do. Everyone knows how picky critics are.

2nd issue i am a big fan of matrix and there is a very big story going on although @ times a bit confusing, but more detail than the first flick.

3rd issue. be original. I am tired of reading peoples opinions on topics just to find out these opinions are coming from other reviewers or are just other peoples opinions.

this movie rocked...Maybe not as good as the first. but how could it be. the first film brought up an original topic and this film just carried out with the ideas.

Still better thanany other piece of garbage you will see this summer or last. (spiderman-please-horrible,mummy-medicre but entertaining,t-3(so good james cammeron wanted nothing to do with this project)

great movie. great franchise in a long time.

katerkat

05-20-2003, 03:00 PM

I agree with BRERALEX -- language and violence got Matrix its R rating. Honestly, I only remember ONE curse in all of X2. And the violence wasn't really that bad, other than Wolverine's fight with Deathstrike, and even then there was no blood. The battle scene at Helm's Deep in TTT was worse! There was no sex, no nudity -- even all the important parts of Rebecca Rojimin-Stamos was covered, much to my DH's chagrin.
I have yet to see Matrix 2, but if it's anything like the original... It deserves an R rating.

BTW, Entertainment Weekly gave X2 a B+ and Matrix 2 a B. :teeth:

EUROPA

05-20-2003, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by darla

this movie rocked...Maybe not as good as the first. but how could it be. the first film brought up an original topic and this film just carried out with the ideas.

So in your view no sequel can be as good or better then the first?

Many people consider Empire Strikes Back, Star Trek II to be the best movies in those franchises ever made. Both are sequels.

i havn't posted here in a while for one reason. I am tired of people dogging movies or anything else just because it isn't disney.

Thats not the News and Rumors board that I know and love. Stick around things have changed.

EUROPA

05-20-2003, 03:25 PM

..just for refrence...

Critics Report Card Overall Grade: B

SOURCE BRIEF REVIEW GRADE*
Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Steve Murray "Plug in. Again. But be prepared for some glitches in the software." more... B-

Chicago Sun-Times
Roger Ebert "It is an immensely skillful sci-fi adventure..." more... A-

Chicago Tribune
Mark Caro "The new movie is bloated and sprawling where its predecessor was sleek and lean..." more... C

Cincinnati Enquirer
Margaret A. McGurk "Even though the Wachowskis don't hit every target they set for themselves, their unmatched commitment yields grand, memorable entertainment." more... B

E! Online "...the second Matrix movie is one of those rare sequels that's bigger and better than the first." more... A-

filmcritic.com
Christopher Null "...Reloaded kicks ***..." more... B+

Hollywood Reporter
Kirk Honeycutt "...storytelling stumbles frequently this outing as the movie stops cold for philosophical digressions about fate and destiny and reality." more... C

Los Angeles Times
Kenneth Turan "...lacks emotional power and doesn't live up to its predecessor." more... C+

New York Post
Lou Lumenick "...while it's exhilarating fun, as an overall piece of storytelling, this reboot never really hits the heights of the ultra-cool The Matrix..." more... B

New York Times
Elvis Mitchell "...there is a dispiriting more-of-the-same aspect to the picture." more... C+

ReelViews
James Berardinelli "...does an admirable job of filling the niche it's supposed to – that of an action-oriented science fiction adventure." more... B

Rolling Stone
Peter Travers "Loved the idea of a sequel to The Matrix, hated the hit-and-miss execution." more... B

San Francisco Chronicle
Carla Meyer "Turns out the first Matrix was the One, but the second is still loads of fun." more... B+

Seattle Post-Intelligencer
William Arnold "Above all, Reloaded does what few sequels ever manage to do: expand its premise in an exciting and unexpected way." more... B+

USA Today
Mike Clark "...Reloaded seems less tired than X2, its current sequel rival." more... B

wdwguide

05-20-2003, 04:20 PM

My personal opinion is that Reloaded was a great movie that was terribly edited. Naturally, things may make more sense after the third movie comes out; but it may take a director's cut or a fan edit to improve on the timing. My main issue is that the first part of the movie served pretty much nothing but to set up a series of fight sequences that were all spectacle and no substance.

BRERALEX

05-20-2003, 04:42 PM

SPOILER WARNING SPOILERS X2 AND MATRIX

My personal opinion is that Reloaded was a great movie that was terribly edited. Naturally, things may make more sense after the third movie comes out; but it may take a director's cut or a fan edit to improve on the timing. My main issue is that the first part of the movie served pretty much nothing but to set up a series of fight sequences that were all spectacle and no substance.

I didnt think of it that way which it might have been cause of the editing. I usually dont dog out a film till i see it three times. X2 i saw at a midnight showing the day it came out. I was so thrilled i saw it the next day. I havent seen a film two days in a row in a long time. technically it was the same day midnight of that day and then like 11pm the same day. Then two days later i took my son. Matrix i saw it 10pm wednesday and it left me so wanting more that i waited like 5 days which is alot for me. both times i waited the credits out for the revolutions preview and i cant bring myslef to watch it a third time. The pacing is horrible.

The fact that you have to buy the video game to 'get' niobe more sux. the fact you have to watch the animatrix to get other little things sux. the car chase scene was only cool with the 'semi's' head on and the motorcycle being followed by the camera under the trucks. Lawrence fishburn somehow gained alot alot of weight eating nothing but that corn like junk they eat.

the Burly brawl neo vs the 100 Smiths totally sucked cause they got lazy and relied on cgi then on good old fashioned hard work of really using the actors. Neo 'doing his superman thing' was corny along with the corny techno they used to show it off aside from not expalining why he does it. At the end of matrix 1 it seems he can manipulate code by seemingly destroying mr smith...he doesnt even do it once in reloaded nor talk about it or try it or show others how to manipulate the matrix(if they can or cant). Im tired of people wanting me to assume everything when i shouldnt have to.

If at the end of matrix 1 he can manipulate code why cant he now? why doesnt he now? I think the 'brothers, the directors didnt plan on making sequals and just saw the cash cow it was becomming and went for it. If the two guys working for the french dude the Mar$$%%% whatever they call him are vampires what are the twins? most people and reviewrs that give it a positive review on rottentomatoes say almost the same thing...if your looking for good action its a good film but the story suffers this time around. The crowd i went to see it with are heavily geeks. usually only geeks see the midnight showing or have advance tickets like a week in advance. there was alomost silence the whole film. Why? because what new thing was done. Trinity beating up security gaurds was amazing? or her getting beat up by an agent was so new? we already new these things. the architect was amazing the keymaker was cool. The oracle was delightful as usual. Where did all the 100 smiths go after the fight they kinda just look at each other and.....walk away. uhuh brilliant. i know i know .................................................. ..........................disney is a business.

Now X2 wow! people cheering at beast on tv. i saw gambits name, omega reds name, muir island. pure geek stuff. Colossus getting out of bed got more cheers then anything in matrix. not saying that makes a movie better but it seemd the director knows that hey this is cool we dont need extra music to make it look cool. Bryan singer made an old man Magneto cooler then a man alot younger in leather with sunglasses that dont move even though he's fighting a hundred ex agents. X2 had it moments it was lacking especially with killing styker it took way to many scenes of him getting beat up by magento wolverine and wolverine again. It dragged at the end, and i leave as soon as jean grey does i cant handle the president scene it bored me. But overall the movie rocked.

Matrix i dont know how people can stand up for the 48 minutes its soooooooooooo slow. but anyways different strokes different fokes its just opinions anyhoo

BRERALEX

05-20-2003, 05:06 PM

Many people consider Empire Strikes Back, Star Trek II to be the best movies in those franchises ever made. Both are sequels.

im not a big star trek fan but fans that i see on other sights don't even talk about the first movie its all wrath of kahn they consider it on another level all together. Ive herad heard star trek one the motion picture refered to as star trek one hard to sit through loll

i havn't posted here in a while for one reason. I am tired of people dogging movies or anything else just because it isn't disney.

I'll dog out disney in a second too the way reign of fire had people groaning in the seats.

Still better thanany other piece of garbage you will see this summer or last. (spiderman-please-horrible,mummy-medicre but entertaining,t-3(so good james cammeron wanted nothing to do with this project)

already saw a better movie X2. James cameron was way to busy doing the titanic documentary with Bill pullman and other projects and if he was free im sure he wouldnt have done it anyways, but directors usually dont do two sequals in a row no matter what the time span ala spielberg and jurassic park 3 but after those big numbers stevie got reinterested. I'll agree with spiderman 100% mediocre as it gets. It's harder to watch everytime, with lazy action and editing that just butchered the story i read from the script and Raimi has butchered the spidey sense. Being a fan of the comic spidey would bever have gotten hit by half those pucnhes he got hit by or any most likely. It's nitpicking but thats what the comic book shows of spidey.

As far as sequals go i thought TTT was an excellent film great music pacing excitement, love story and made you care for these characters that were evolving. i liked it better then FOTR. X2 was better since X1 had to be alittle boring to setup characters which im hoping reloaded was doing for revolutions but it still lacked on many levels like character development, pacing and especially music blaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh

3rd issue. be original. I am tired of reading peoples opinions on topics just to find out these opinions are coming from other reviewers or are just other peoples opinions.

my opinions are my own. someone on the first page said everone he knew loved and it like so amazed me everyone i know didnt like it...........ok ok ok my brother liked it but i didnt speak to him till yesterday afternoon.

i didnt read one review before seeing it. NOT ONE AND IM A BIG AINTITCOOL WEBSITE FAN. After the movies i read the reviews i
could find. I read alot of antigay things about X2 and alot of mix things about matrix. If you go to the talkbacks you can see how people are reacting to it. mostly negative. My negative review of it is my own and is copywrited:jester:

I gave it another chance yesterday by seeing it again at 1250 a matinee alot less people to feel it out. I caught alot i didnt catch the first time. mostly with mr smith. but that first 45 minutes is still unbearable, Morpheous' speech is still hard to listen to. the Ducati is still cool as it is in real life. the music still sucked. Keanu doing a backflip fighting the 100 smiths still looked fake, not even a little fake but video game fake. fake like it would be hard to watch a third time.

i'm kinda of tired of people who just say its a movie enjoy it. well dont raise the bar so high and then not reach it again. And how can someone really like a franchise when the franshise isnt over espcially when the franchise is clinging to another movie with big unanswered questions. It seems the franshise was loved no matter what came out or will come out. Revolutions can reveal the matrix to be 2000 yrs old then 1000 yrs old and 12 reboots then say just 6. im hoping the third will blow away the second or at least reinforce it enough to make it wachable....like episode 3 im still havent bought AOTC. AND I LOVE STAR WARS but wont love everything just cause its lucas and wont love POP CENTURY just cause its disney.

oh yeah Pirates of the Carribean wont even get close to these numbers being put up this summer. lol

katerkat

05-20-2003, 05:12 PM

I'll dog out disney in a second too the way reign of fire had people groaning in the seats.

I'm starting to fear that DH and I are the only ones in the world who loved Reign of Fire... Anyone? Bueller? No? C'mon, Matthew McConaughey!! Even when bald he was pretty hot!

BRERALEX

05-20-2003, 07:35 PM

I'm starting to fear that DH and I are the only ones in the world who loved Reign of Fire... Anyone? Bueller? No? C'mon, Matthew McConaughey!! Even when bald he was pretty hot!

I think Matthew has a beautiful beautiful body and i think he's a good actor. but the movie was just eeehhhhhh i dunnno. just wanted to chime in he has a nice body lololol and christian bale has been awesome since empire of the sun and he also has an incredible body bu tthe story wasnt there the later half of the film it lost steam towards the end, IMO no one else's!. but i only saw it twice i gotta see it some more

GenePA

05-20-2003, 07:57 PM

HB2K, I don't know who you have been speaking to, but in no way whatsoever, was Matrix Reloaded as good as the original! I enjoyed it but there were many scenes that dragged on too long or were not necessary. I think you need to go back to the original and appreciate the story and not get caught up in the special effects. The ending also stunk......but I will go to see the next one.

I am looking forward to 'Pirates' but it won't come close to the money that Matrix Reloaded will make. It may even be a better movie but it won't come close to the money made. The marketing and hype for Matrix Reloaded was incredible. No other movie this summer will approach it for money made.

KNWVIKING

05-20-2003, 08:05 PM

"i havn't posted here in a while for one reason. I am tired of people dogging movies or anything else just because it isn't disney."

Funny, I thought this board dogged everything that was Disney.

Another Voice

05-21-2003, 12:46 AM

The Matrix Reloaded
This movie has an incredibly long and desperate history behind it that can be easily summed up: two brothers in way over their heads.

At least it’s nice to know that when humanity is reduced to a handful cowering deep underground, when all knowledge is lost and the distinction between reality and myth are blurred, at the very moment when all is about to be lost – that we can still throw a really kEwL party.

Reign of Fire
It’s even nicer to know that when the apocalypse comes and the last few scraps of humanity claw at the ashes that we once called Earth, when terrifying beasts fill the skies and all hope is lost…that Bowflex machines will survive it all.

Trends in Film Going
Matthew McConaughey is a good example of what I was writing about people’s movie going habits. I know not all women sit at home all day reading romance novels, but when you try to market a movie to 250 million people there are some trends that do stand out. One of which is women do not go to a movie just because of the star.

Think about all those movies that Matt “Heartthrob” McConaughey was in like EdTV and The Wedding Planner and How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days. These were movies specifically designed around him and to get thousands of women to plop down seven bucks so they could watch him take his shirt off. Did any of those work? Nope, because those movies were nothing but him taking his shirt off. In general, women want to see more character and more of a story. Again “even bald he’s hot” couldn’t get people to the theaters, but hairy, scrawny little Leo did; the difference is the character*.

Pirates of the Caribbean
Which is why no one should expect Pirates to become a big hit just because it has Orlando Bloom. Every action movie that gets made makes the claim that they will be different because women will go to see Mr. X. It never works; McConaughey didn’t pull anyone into U-571 just like he didn’t pull anyone into Reign.

The story in Pirates is just too weak and too interested in explosions for it to work like Titanic did. It’s a guy’s movie, made by guy’s, for the guy’s – it’s no more a romantic swashbuckling adventure than Pearl Harbor was a sweeping epic of wartime love and loss. If Pirates work it will be because it turned out to be a good action movie. Rumors are that they should begin testing it very soon. We should begin to hear more about how well it turned out.

* - by the way, McConaughey was the first actor offered the lead role in Titanic. He turned it down.

katerkat

05-21-2003, 10:03 AM

Think about all those movies that Matt “Heartthrob” McConaughey was in like EdTV and The Wedding Planner and How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days.

Gosh, I must not be a woman then! ;) I saw all of those for him. AND, I saw the first XMen with the hopes that Hugh Jackman would take his shirt off. (And he did! Eeeee!) One of my main criticisms of X2 is not enough shirtless Wolverine. :p

EUROPA

05-21-2003, 10:46 AM

Originally posted by katerkat
Gosh, I must not be a woman then! ;) I saw all of those for him. AND, I saw the first XMen with the hopes that Hugh Jackman would take his shirt off. (And he did! Eeeee!) One of my main criticisms of X2 is not enough shirtless Wolverine. :p

My wife is a big Wolverine(shirtless) fan too....so it was no surprise to me when she wanted to see the movie again the next day...the surprise was that she wanted to see NightCrawler again!!! I love it my wife is now a mutant lover. She can't wait for the next movie.

katerkat

05-21-2003, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by EUROPA
My wife is a big Wolverine(shirtless) fan too....so it was no surprise to me when she wanted to see the movie again the next day...the surprise was that she wanted to see NightCrawler again!!! I love it my wife is now a mutant lover. She can't wait for the next movie.

:o I (sheepishly) admit to loving Nightcrawler now, too. And (sssh, don't tell DH!) I've started watching the XMen: Evolution on Cartoon Network. :teeth:

d-r

05-25-2003, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by HB2K
That was one of the funniest posts I've read in a long time.

(snip)

B) There is NOTHING big opening up next weekend for Memorial day. Matrix will dominate again.

(snip)

http://movies.yahoo.com/news/va/20030525/105389163000.html

The new Jim Carrey movie "Bruce Almighty" bounced "The Matrix Reloaded" from the top spot at the North American holiday box office, setting a new record for a non-sequel comedy.

According to studio estimates issued on Sunday, "Bruce Almighty" earned $70.5 million for the first three days of the U.S. Memorial Day holiday weekend. The Keanu Reeves sci-fi thriller "The Matrix Reloaded" slipped to a distant No. 2 with $37.2 million.

BRERALEX

05-25-2003, 09:34 PM

wow

i wasnt expecting that much of a drop off and or BRuce to do that well wow. Im sure people for and against matrix 2 are surprised.

wow

a small poll on aintitcool asked fans which movie they liked better and 8439 liked part 1 better vs. 3243.

Bob O

05-26-2003, 12:02 AM

I was also surprised by how much matrix dropped off.
And Bruce Almighty is a very funny movie!!!!!!! But alas it is aUniversal movie and not disney.

jlambrig

05-27-2003, 04:30 PM

Quote------------
Can I just drop my my two cents?

Think about this - when was the last time Johnny Depp was in a movie that did well?

exactly
case closed.
--------------------

What does that have to do with it? I consider Al Pacino to be a great actor. He hasn't been in a movie that has grossed over $100 million in the USA for about 10 years now. Most of DeNiro's movies don't gross well either. Actors sometimes take jobs because they have an interest in the role, not because it might be a blockbuster.

I am hoping Pirates does gangbusters but pirate-themed movies aren't often embraced by the movie-going public. I look for it to do about $125 million.

katerkat

05-27-2003, 05:36 PM

Originally posted by Planogirl
I really believe that the female appeal of Pirates will depend a lot on how the film was made.

Hmmm, I don't think that was the quote I was going for, but... Female appeal -- POTC opens 5 days after Legally Blonde 2. I'd bet on LB2, but five days can make a bit of a difference...

As for pirates, it also opens 5 days after Sinbad -- which, granted, it's a kid's movie, but it's still 'sailing the seven seas'. And the summer can only have so many boats.

As for the Matrix2, I'm reserving judgment until the 3rd one comes out. I was not that impressed, but I'll wait and see if it all comes together. At this point, though, I could care less if Zion is destroyed. I can see why fans rushed out to see it in the first place -- then didn't return the next weekend.

Another Voice

05-29-2003, 10:07 PM

Okay ladies - someone has sent me a link just for you.

For all of those waiting to see Orlando Bloom in Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of All The Good Ideas Were Taken, Mr. Bloom is currently filming Troy in Europe. You know Troy - Helen, 1000 ships and a really big wooden horse. I've read the script for this one and it honestly is an amazing work. It brings real characters and a real story to life in a way that Gladiator tried but couldn't accomplish.

But you don't care. Click on this: http://orlandomultimedia.net/troy/troyimages.html and see for yourself.

P.S. The movie also stars Brad Pitt and Eric Bana. If any action movie can have "female appeal", it's going to be this one.

*Robin*

05-29-2003, 10:09 PM

Maybe I'm just too old, but I never got the whole Brad Pitt thing...

Bob O

05-30-2003, 01:17 PM

So AV, are you predicating numerous Oscars nominations,oscar awards for Troy??????? That it will be bigger commerical success than Gladiator?? Will be more highly thought of as a cinematic movie also?? So i guess we should line up the Oscars for best picture, best actor, huh???
Gladiator was a major success in every sense of the word be it money/movie quality etc and it brought its story together in a excellant manner with Ruseel Crowe and Joaquin playing their roles in the movie very well.
None of the actors you mentioned in Troy have shown much acting ability so we will see if it comers close at all to being the success that Gladiator was.

RustManFan

06-02-2003, 11:42 AM

Recently returned from Scotland where our inn in Glencoe was practically ON the set for the next Harry Potter movie. The outdoor settings are going to be amazing..... can't wait!!

I definitely will see Pirates and will be there on opening day for Return of the King.

Other than that I will most likely NOT be visiting my local movie theater anytime soon.....

Planogirl

06-02-2003, 01:50 PM

I enjoyed the "Troy" link. I started thinking about what a cool attraction could be made using this theming if this movie is a success. As far as Brad Pitt goes, he's actually a decent actor in my opinion. And no, I've never been smitten with him! He's just a little too pretty.

I agree that Johnny Depp being in a movie does not dictate the success or failure of a movie. There's plenty of actors out there that take their craft seriously and don't strive to be in blockbusters. Viggo Mortensen was supposedly one but was talked into being in the LOTR series by his son according to a story I read. Personally, I'm glad that he decided in our favor.

lrodk

06-07-2003, 02:29 PM

Posted by AV
P.S. – You think that was an impressive opening weekend, just wait until year’s end when The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King opens. You thought the other two were good…get in line now.

AV, do you have inside information you can share on ROTK? I haven't been able to find info anywhere regarding the expectations of this film in relation to the first two.

I've been hearing that ROTK may be released sooner that expected, possibly in November rather than December, due to changes in the Academy's criteria for Oscar consideration. I've heard that the cut-off date for eligibility of Live Action films has been pushed up , which would rule out ROTK for 2004 if it were to be released in December.

Regarding Pirates, I think that the recent AICN review has me somewhat optimistic. I had heard a similar report from Jim Hill ,I think it was a couple of months back, where he basically said that this production has the potential to be a very fun and enjoyable summer film. We'll see how that translates in box office numbers. My gut feeling however tells me that they spent too much $$ on this film in the face of so much competition. The timing issue seems to be the biggest obstacle at this point.

For all of you west coast Disney enthusiasts, I'm hearing rumors that the Pirates of the Caribbean Red Carpet Premier will be held at Disneyland on the evening of June 28th with most of the cast present. Also the park will close at 6:30 to make way for the event. This would mark the biggest event held within Disneyland since the park's grand opening.

Another Voice

06-07-2003, 10:06 PM

"AV, do you have inside information you can share on ROTK?"

Expect significant departures from the book. Movies are a vastly different art form than literature. Certain events had to be excluded, changed or emphasized to make the film the rousing climax to the trilogy. In my ever humble opinion, I think the ending of the movie is better than the ending of the books all around, but I'm sure different people will have different opinions.

They are currently doing some reshoots to fine tune the film and, I've heard, some additional material for the super DVD "mini-series" version due out next year. Like Fellowship and Towers there will be a theatrical version of King released and then a longer DVD version. As you can probably tell from my other postings, I'm rather "jagged" when it comes to overhyped Hollywood movies (I prefer to think that I just have strong standards). The entire Ring series has impressed me like few films ever have and I seriously consider them the first great work of the 21st century. One hundred years from now when someone teaches the history of media, Rings is going to be marked as an important turning point.

As for the release date, I thought it was supposed to be late November but it gets juggled around. Warner Brothers is releasing both King and The Matrix Revolutions and they've been trying to keep the two films from bumping into each other. Now that Matrix looks less impressive than they thought it was going to be they will start changing the release dates again. And yes, Miramax has already started the whisper campaign to knock The Return of the King out of the Oscar race.

Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Bruckheimer Pearl

Would you believe the latest rumors floating around town are that the release of Pirates may be pushed back? I seriously doubt that happening, but both of the planted – er – I mean early reviews on 'Ain't It Cool' mentioned that they were shown a rough cut. This is waaaay too late for that. Either the film is in major trouble or the reveiws are even more...

The buzz about the movie is that the people who show up will like it, the problem is getting people to show up. The movie's not strong enough generate the word of mouth to draw people in for the second weekend. The competition for its audience is going to be really strong as well. All of the glowing optimism from early this year has disappeared. Once again, too much money spent for the money they are going to bring in.

The premiere at Disneyland will be an invite only affair (somehow mine must have been lost in the mail). The park will open at six in the morning and early close so it can be completely cleared of guests that the Hollywood elite need not breathe the same air as the common types. Major sections of Disneyland will be closed off or restricted several days before the event and 'Fantasmic!' will stop running a week or so before that as well. It promises to be a major mess. If you're traveling to D/L around that time I suggest you contact the park for specific information.

BRERALEX

06-07-2003, 10:13 PM

but both of the planted – er – I mean early reviews on 'Ain't It Cool' mentioned that they were shown a rough cut.

lololololololol dude that had me crackin up. i never know what to know is a plant or not on aintitcool cause the 'talkbackers' say everything is a plant. lolollolol but man that was funny to read.

lrodk

06-07-2003, 10:44 PM

AV. I too am extremely impressed with the LOTRs trilogy. I don't think we'll see in our lifetimes the likes of what Peter Jackson & Co. have been able to accomplish in Rings. Whether most people realzie it or not, these films have etched an indelible mark in film-making history, effectively raising the bar for everyone else, while helping to solidify, or justify, the resurgance of these grand epic films that used to be more commonplace in the glory days of cinema . I too have never been so captivated as I have been with Rings. I hope you're right about the ending being a fitting conclusion to the series. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Regarding Pirates, I'm inclined to agree with your assesment of it falling short of expectations. I expect to see a Pearl Harbor type of return at the box office, where it did very well(and for all practical purposes was a good movie), but fell short on the ROI relative to most films that cost a lot less.