Will the real LandBaron please stand up!

[DVC-Landbaron]

The following was written just after I got back, but I decided not to post it. Why? Simply because I couldn’t muster the enthusiasm it would have taken to defend the “simply Eisner bashing” posts that were sure to follow. And I also felt a little sad as the full weight of every little cryptic post that my liege lord AV came into clear focus. And I realized that… Well, we’ll save that for the discussion part. For now, on with the post!!

_______________________________


Hi all!! I'm back! And I've got a lot of catching up to do. But before I delve in too much, and just for fun (but comments welcome of course), I thought I'd relate a little tidbit that took me by surprise.

A certain pretty, blond cast member was talking to me the other day while she was showing me around her room. It is a fairly nice, 3 bedroom apartment that would be quite suitable for a very small family. Into these rooms they cram in 6 college students (2 to a bedroom) and charge them a pretty penny for the privilege. But that is not what took your friendly LandBaron by surprise. No, indeed!! There were two real shockers and the price wasn't one of them.

First we have the location the complex. I could have sworn that it was on Disney property, but I was informed that it was not. It is a privately owned company that developed the student housing. The story goes that the land was sold to her for a very cheap price - - - From Disney!!

Anyway, the land deal was a bit of a surprise, but the real shocker was yet to come. The owner of the company. Her name, it seems, is … (drum roll please) … Mrs. Eisner!!!

Do you think it may be a relative? Or perhaps the strangest coincidence that has ever occurred in Disney history!!! (Humph!! And I thought I was a land baron!!)

The man behind the curtain really knows what strings are the important ones to pull, doesn’t he? :(

[BRERALEX]

i heard evil music in the background and a drumroll and then came MRS. Ei$nerrrrrrrr like whoah. very very sad but mostly pathetic.


(PSSSSST) i miss the baron state of the parks though.

[DVC-Landbaron]

Mr. Alex:

Just check out this:

I'm sick of waiting... (http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?threadid=365863)

While it isn’t the “State of the Parks” it is a heartfelt dissertation, just like old times (anyone seen a Duck in a tux??)!!

[OnWithTheShow]

LandBaron,

The rumor that Mrs Eisner owns VistaWay has been around the block so many times. There is actually no evidence that it is true (at least none I have seen). Its just one of those endless urban legends concocted by the wonderful CPs.

[Demosthenes]

Yeah, well, did you now that if you eat pop rocks and drink a soda, that you'll die? It's true! My cousin's best friend's girlfriend's dad knew a kid in his high school who's little brother died from this.

[YoHo]

Originally posted by OnWithTheShow
LandBaron,

The rumor that Mrs Eisner owns VistaWay has been around the block so many times. There is actually no evidence that it is true (at least none I have seen). Its just one of those endless urban legends concocted by the wonderful CPs.

Perhaps you need to look west and find Another....... Source for confirmation on the various ...business Jane Eisner is in charge of.

[DisneyKidds]

....................big deal :confused:. So what. Even IF the evil Ei$ner's better half happened to be somehow involved...........what's the big deal? Nepotism is alive and well, my friend - and it ain't a new thing ;). Are you gonna tell me Walt didn't have a lot of family involved in the biz in a variety of ways? Did he never give a friend, or a friends relative, a job or a leg up? Times have changed and business is bigger, but many of the concepts remain the same, and date back to Walt's time. Me thinks it just bugs the heck out of you that the Ei$ners might be getting even richer than you thought they were off of Disney :earseek:.

So tell me, what in particular about this situation completely pushes you over the edge? Please clarify because I just don't see it.

[Mr D]

Is this gonna turn into a Hilary type of thing?:p

[DVC-Landbaron]

The rumor that Mrs Eisner owns VistaWay has been around the block so many times. There is actually no evidence that it is true (at least none I have seen). Its just one of those endless urban legends concocted by the wonderful CPs.So does this mean it is NOT true? Or that it just hasn't been proven to your satisfaction yet?

[Bstanley]

Well I suppose The Mrs Big Me could be a silent partner at Epoch Properties of Winter Garden (her name isn't public anyway), but I'm pretty sure she isn't the owner of the Disney Development Company and these are the two developers of record for Vista Way.

[DVC-Landbaron]

Me thinks it just bugs the heck out of you that the Ei$ners might be getting even richer than you thought they were off of Disney No. Not at all! It is the single-minded focus of the goal which... ah... disappoints me. If they (or more to the point he) would put as much effort into guest satisfaction and creativity, we wouldn't be having this conversation at all. As it is this is "just another brick in the wall" that points to their dedication, at PERSONALLY becoming very, very, very wealthy. Not in concert with the core concept of the company but at its expense!!

So tell me, what in particular about this situation completely pushes you over the edge? Please clarify because I just don't see it.It doesn't push me over any edge. Again, just another fine example of Ei$ner at work. At work for himself - not the guest. And not even at work for the company!! Nothing more and nothing less. He (and his personal greed) just never ceases to amaze me.

[OnWithTheShow]

I never had any complaints about Vista Way, so I dont see how this is a bad thing.

[DVC-Landbaron]

Mr. Show.

That sentence didn't answer my question at all!!

Let me restate it.

Do you KNOW that this rumor is false, or is it just your best 'guess' (and/or hope) that it isn't?

Anything you can bring to the table would be appreciated.

Thanks!!!

[wdw4us2]

As long as we're discussing rumors about what Mrs Ei$ner may own -- a Cast Member friend of mine said that Mrs. E owns the company that runs the employee cafeteria in the Team Disney building.

So many of them are upset about this that they refuse to buy anything to eat or drink there!

Any confirmation or denial?

[DVC-Landbaron]

a Cast Member friend of mine said that Mrs. E owns the company that runs the employee cafeteria in the Team Disney building.I heard this one at the same time I heard the Vista Way rumor. But I didn't publish it because I couldn't get any corroboration (as opposed to the one I did post, which I feel fairly confidant about. Unless Mr. Show has something he’s not saying!!).

[DVC Nut]

The same company (Aramark) that runs the cast cafeteria at Team Disney runs most of the cast cafeterias on Disney Property. I also (as a cast member) heard that Mrs. Eisner had something to do with this. I can confirm that the cast cafeteria at OKW was not always Aramark. It was previously run by the resort. (This amy have been about 10 years ago, maybe a bit less)

[YoHo]

Eh, Aramark runs food service at sports arenas all across the country. which isn't to suggest that they aren't in some form of smarmy dealings here, just that they are an otherwise well known well respected food service company.

[OnWithTheShow]

No Baron, I do not know for certain that these things are false. Yet I have never seen ANY evidence to even remotely suggest that they are true. Aramark is headquartered less than a mile from where I sit right now and I know many people who work there and have no knowledge of Jane Eisner being involved with the company. As for Vista Way, I am not sure why your daughter dislikes it. I was quite pleased with the complex. What are her specific complaints?

If ANYONE as any solid evidence other than "I heard from so and so that.." please post it here.

[DVC-Landbaron]

I am not sure why your daughter dislikes it. I was quite pleased with the complex. What are her specific complaints?What led you to believe that she didn't like it? In fact she LOVED it!!! I don't think she'd be anywhere else if it were up to her. I'm sorry if I gave you that impression.

Anyway...

If ANYONE as any solid evidence other than "I heard from so and so that.." please post it here.I quite agree!!! Please... Anyone?

[OnWithTheShow]

That what are your specific complaints?

[DVC-Landbaron]

I thought I was quite clear! It goes to philosophy and what is utmost in the minds of the current administration.

When Walt was in charge (heck even Walker/Miller) the SHOW, creativity and the guest was the ultimate aim!! Did they make money? You bet!!

But it is quite clear from this example (and THOUSANDS of others we've talked about on this board) that the ultimate goal of this CEO is NOT the guest, creativity, the SHOW or even the company itself!!! His only concern is his own personal wealth! Period! Plain and simple!! Something AV and others have alluded to many, many times before. It’s just that this example hit home with me. I guess it didn’t for you.

Was I not clear enough in the first post?

[DisneyKidds]

Was I not clear enough in the first post?
Given that I still need some clarification, I guess I'd say yes ;).
Let's look at your initial comments, and try to discerne exactly what in this situation gives you such displeasure. First you have...............
Into these rooms they cram in 6 college students (2 to a bedroom) and charge them a pretty penny for the privilege.
As you say, this isn't a big problem for you, but it must have left a bad taste in your mouth or else you probably wouldn't have mentioned it. I will take the opportunity to point out that this has absolutely no bearing on SHOW.

Then you have............
the location the complex. I could have sworn that it was on Disney property, but I was informed that it was not. It is a privately owned company that developed the student housing. The story goes that the land was sold to her for a very cheap price - - - From Disney!!
And this does appear to be a problem for you, but I really have to ask why? What impact does this have on SHOW or Philosophy? As you point out, the Philosophy is based around giving the people everything you can give them. I'll go out an a pretty sturdy limb here and say thet "people" in this instance would be the Disney guest. How does the location of CM housing have any impact on what WDW gives the guest?

Lastly you have...............
the real shocker................... The owner of the company. Her name, it seems, is … (drum roll please) … Mrs. Eisner!!!
OK, putting your distaste for the Ei$ners aside, the bearing on the SHOW here is......................:confused:. I guess your implication with subsequent statements like this..............
that the ultimate goal of this CEO is..............his own personal wealth! Period! Plain and simple!!
..............is that ME is taking money that could be used to enhance the guest experience and lining his own pockets with it. That may or may not be true in a number of examples, and no one disputes he is getting rich beyond what he should be given how the company has been performing, but I don't see how the (unconfirmed) possibility that Mrs. ME might be involved with the Company in some capacity could be some epiphany that finally ties it all together and pushes you over the edge.................ooops, sorry you said it didn't do that, I guess it just made you go off the deep end :crazy: ;). Even if she is involved, do you know the structure of the arrangement? Do you know anything about Mrs. ME and her business background? Is it your blanket position that no contract should be let to a relative of any individual who works for Disney? IF Mrs. ME is involved, and IF she is getting paid $1,000,000 to do what another company would have done for $100,00, and IF Mr. and Mrs. were the only parties to the deal, I'll call the Times and we'll expose ME for it..............but do you know any of that to be the case? So, IF Mrs. ME is involved and the contract fees are for the going rate and the contract was negotiated like every other Disney contract, would you have a problem?

I have to say that the one thing you have done for me is answer a question that I have always had. I love Disney (as do you). As many who love Disney might do, I get thoughts every once in a while about how great it might be to work for Disney. But then I always wonder............"if I were a part of the Disney Company as an employee, outside of the nirvana of vacation land, would the place be somewhat less Magical?". Well, you have someone behind the curtain now. You have seen the other side. After seeing that side it does appear that all is not what it seemed before you actually stood behind the curtain. The thing is, what is behind the curtain today is probably not much different than what was behind the curtain 30 years ago. Think about that for a few..................... It has always been rumored that Walt wasn't the easiest guy to work for. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that even back in the day, back on those Magical days when DL or WDW opened their doors, there were behind the scenes examples not all that unlike the one you bring up now......it's just that you could never see them.

You have known for a long time that there was a man behind the curtain. You have seen that man for some time now. Now you have stood with the man behind the curtain..............and it appears to be too much for you :(. That is too bad.......................but don't you think it might have been a little idealistic or naive to believe there was anything else back there?

[Bstanley]

Oh No ... now you've done it Mr. Kidds.

You've impugned the honor of Herr Baron's guru.

I recommend doning your Nomex apparel now...

[DisneyKidds]

You've impugned the honor of Herr Baron's guru.
Hey, I just state the facts ;)..................................I'll leave that open for others to determine what is implied or impunged :jester:.

[YoHo]

TO the best of my recolection, Roy O Disney was the ONLY relative to have a position higher then park employee when Walt was alive. AND, if they did hold a higher position, you can bet they were there, because of thier skills, not their name.

As to this



the location the complex. I could have sworn that it was on Disney property, but I was informed that it was not. It is a privately owned company that developed the student housing. The story goes that the land was sold to her for a very cheap price - - - From Disney!!

And this does appear to be a problem for you, but I really have to ask why?




This is a problem, because the sole purpose of buying all that land was to allow Disney to maintain control and keep Disney World well Disney World. Why didn't they simply lease the property out? why sell it? Wouldn't leasing it out generate revenue?
Further, they sold it to a company headed by the CEO's wife.
What kind of special deals did either company make in that sale? What kind of bonus might Mrs. Eisner have gotten?

There's a lot of rotten smell coming from that. The mere sale of the property should be cause for concern.



that the ultimate goal of this CEO is..............his own personal wealth! Period! Plain and simple!!


I suspect, that the issue at hand is slightly complex.

To understand, perhaps you need to look back over Landbarons posts over the years and see what he in the past has said about Eisner.

In general, in the past, he has said that Eisner is inept, stupid, dumb, couldn't bring about magic if it was a natural body process. Incompitent.

There are certain other contributors who talked about Eisner's greed and personal wealth goals which Landbaron acknowledged, but stuck to his guns about his ineptitude.

This is a shift. This isn't Eisner being inept, this is Eisner making a decision NOT in the company's best intrests for the sole purpose of making money. It's a revelation for Landbarorn, because he realizes that it isn't about ineptitude, it's about greed. And quite frankly, Pure greed is a lot less tolerable.

Every hour cut, every virtual smack in the face, every carnival ride is designed for the sole purpose of lining isner's already goldlined Pockets. IT's disgusting and runs counter to everything Walt Disney EVER stood for.

Walt ate in the comissary with the rest of the peons, because executive DIningrooms didn't make good movies, Walt short changed amenities backstage so that more money could be spent onstage, Walt slumed around in the company Machineshop building steam engines.

Walt made sure the every endevour he was involved in, HE had creative control regardless of how much less money he was making.

Eisner buys a T.V. studio, not because its a good investment, but because he's always wanted to be head of a T.V. Studio and screw whether that's what DIsney should do. Eisner thinks traditional animation is stupid, so we get none. Eisner doesn't care about his image or the success of this company one little bit. All he wants is money.

[Bstanley]

Well, boys and girls, I really didn't want to waste this much energy on so obviously a bogus "I hate The Big ME" rumor, but I just couldn't inhale Mr YoHo's rancorous rantings without spewing forth some truth and accuracy myself to help keep a balance in the universe...

This isn't rocket science - most all public records on on the web nowadays.

Vista Way (and Chatham Square and The Commons) are all owned by "The Walt Disney World Hospitality and Recreation Corp" and have always been owned by them - at least as far back as 1988 when the first structure ws built on the land. At least according to the Orange County Property Appraisers office!

BZZZT - So... sorry, wrong answer.. Thanks for playing.

You may all get back to your regularly scheduled "I hate the Big ME" rant now.

Cheers!

[DisneyKidds]

Mr. B - thanks for clearing up this little matter and we can stop getting so upset at the possibility that the (wo)man behind this particular portion of the curtain might be Mrs. ME.

Now, I wonder if the Baron still has a problem with what he's seen behind the curtain if it isn't an Eisner with a gun holding up the joint?.

[Bstanley]

*&^%&^% - As much as I hate to admit it - I have a thread of information that indicates Mrs Big ME may manage to make money on the Vista Way apartments in some fashion after all.

If I find out more I'll let you know.

[crusader]

I'm not convinced were done yet.

"The Walt Disney World Hospitality and Recreation Corp"

First, Is this a 100% wholly-owned subsidiary of Disney?

Second, is there a building lease and if so, to whom?

Third,

Well I suppose The Mrs Big Me could be a silent partner at Epoch Properties of Winter Garden

which no one has confirmed or denied.

There are many ways to siphon: sell; lease; leaseback; sublease; sublet; manage; contract; subcontract; consult and invoice (to name a few)

[caseymaureen]

LandBaron~ I also heard as a cast member that the Eisners were involved in the company which runs the Disney bus services (no proof, just something I heard :) )

BStanley~ According to my managers, RCA's, and anyone of authority while I was in the CP (Fall 02) Chatham Square and the Commons are not owned by Disney. This was the reason given as to why buses go in and out of Vista but can only park outside of Chatham. Now, this could just be an excuse made up to satisfy inquiries or it could be true, but I did hear it from several different sources. In addition, the rent paid by CPs goes to a company called Price Management which is not part of Disney. PM employs the security guards, desk workers, maintenance people, etc, at tge complexes. I am not sure if the same is true of Vista.

[DVC-Landbaron]

*&^%&^% - As much as I hate to admit it - I have a thread of information that indicates Mrs Big ME may manage to make money on the Vista Way apartments in some fashion after all.

If I find out more I'll let you know.



Well?

Anyone?.... Anyone?... Bueller?...

[Bstanley]

Sorry Herr Baron, I cannot produce a smoking gun one way or the other, other than that Mrs. The Big ME doesn't actually 'own' them.

But there is money being made by parties outside of Disney Corp with various contracts on operating the apartments and it will take more than the internet to untangle who's who with them.

If someone were of a mind to try to have The Big ME removed, exposing such things might help.

Of course it might also taint the name Disney, and lose a lot of investors even more money on their (already depressed) stock.

"Life's full of tough choices, idn't it?"

[YoHo]

At this point, I'd have to say the investors are very well aware of the difference between Disney and Eisner.