DEBATE: Treasure Planet - a potential Classic?

[Bstanley]

Well I bought my Treasure Planet DVD yesterday, watched it last night and thought - you know...this is pretty good.

It's not The Lion King, but it's certainly not The Black Cauldron either!

[WDSearcher]

I really liked Treasure Planet when I saw it in theaters, and I think Disney was way too quick to label it a failure. Of course, they could have chosen a better time to release it than against Harry Potter and LOTR, but still ...

I thought the visuals were stunning, the story not too bad of a re-write of the original, and the voice talet quite good.

Will it be a "classic" ... probably not. But I think it's got a lot to offer as a story and as an artful piece of animation.

:earsboy:

[wdwguide]

The Black Cauldron is one of my favorites! I also liked Atlantis. As for Treasure Planet... I thought it plain sucked. Tastes differ, and I am not a mainstream kind of guy when it comes to movies, but it seems that most people agree with me on TP, judging by its IMDB score and box office receipts.

[Mouse Ears]

I liked Treasure Planet a lot and picked up my DVD last night. I think it merits the 'Classic' moniker and is better than many recent efforts (Groove, Atlantis, Dinosaur, Hercules). It certainly is better in story and animation quality than any single sequel or DTV release that Disney has put out (and there are a lot of them).

It is a visually stunning film with great style and a unique look. The story offers some sympathetic characters and a lot of adventure. It may not be a Disney Princess Magic (tm) movie, but that's OK by me. I enjoyed the father-son redemption story line and the search for treasure. The only area seriously lacking is the music. There simply isn't a memorable song, though the soundtrack is top-notch.

I admit that I love Sci-Fi, so it is hard for me to accept that many others don't appreciate that type of tale. Still, both of my daughters liked it better than Lilo and Stitch which surprised me greatly. I guess only time will truly tell...

[YoHo]

Hmm, I think I'll rent it.


For the record, I LOVED the Black Cauldron, but then, I loved the Book of 3 novels, so its not that surprising.

[airlarry!]

I liked TP, but I found a lot not to like about it. The writing, IMHO, just wasn't up to par with the outright hilarious Groove, and pales in comparison to Musker/Clements earlier hits. Songs were basically forgettable (in that I can't even recall one right now..having to wait for the DVD to remind me is not a good sign.)

I told my wife that Treasure Planet was *almost* a great movie. I saw the potential for setting the story in outerspace. I loved some of the artwork, especially the dolphins. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the story just seemed to lack heart for lack of a better term.

Yoho! I loved the Book of Three too, and that's precisely why I didn't like The Black Cauldron...hmm...maybe that's a topic for another day.

[Bstanley]

Curious airlarry, I would have written the first line almost completely inversely of the way you wrote it, but my conclusion is about the same...

I liked TP and I didn't find a lot that I didn't like - BUT I also felt it was *almost* a great movie.

I did notice the lack of 'hum-able' music and I understand your 'lack of heart' comment.

Much of the animation was fantastic, and the interaction between Jim and Silver was good, but all in all it just didn't quite make it.

I still don't understand why it did so abysmally at the box office.

[Peter Pirate]

I loved TP a well. I think the characters were likeable, the story a pre-known classic updated well.

To me a big mistake was not having more songs by Mr. GooGoo Reznik. The one song was memorable in my book. Also, the BEN character was just wasted, I thought. It could have been funnier (ala Genie) IMO...

I also do not understand why his movie failed at the Box Office, but I do think it proves Disney can still do great animated work...

[Wade Shrader]

I've posted here about TP before...I really liked this movie. The animation was stunning. I, too, liked the prodigal son/redemption storyline. And, I liked the music, especially the lead song by Jon Reznik of the GooGoo dolls; I liked the aspect of having a "new pop" singer do the songs. I agree that they could have had more "Disney-like" songs, but that really wasn't the theme of the movie.

My children all loved it, too. But I think most kids and families like the trademark Disney movies with talking animals or fairy princesses. I think that's why it did poorly at the box office.

I'm off to get my pre-bought DVD right now!

Wade Shrader

[Dznefreek]

In a word........NO!

[raidermatt]

Wade, this is off-topic, but every time I see your name I get a bit of a chill because your screen name reminds me of Jay Schroeder. Flashbacks of overthrown receivers and key interceptions come roaring back... Oh well, time to let it go I guess!

[KNWVIKING]

Rick Cannon ?

[RustManFan]

I had plenty of vacation time left over last autumn so I took half days so I could see Harry Potter, LOTR and Treasure Planet on their opening days. I loved all of them. Got my DVD of TP and watched it right away.

Now I wish Disney would do a musical animation again on a pare with Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King!

[MICOL]

We found it to be a very good movie. Fun, nice story. I am sure the release with HP and LOTR caused is failure. Bad timing.

[raidermatt]

Does anyone post under the name.. Rick Cannon ?
I don't think so, but if I see Park Dilson I'm going to need therapy.

Bought Treasure Planet and watched it a few nights ago.

I agree with most, it deserved a better fate than it received at the box office. Personally, based on the merits of the films, I think Atlantis actually over-acheived, and Treasure Planet under acheived.

I found just about every supporting character in Atlantis to be annoying in some way, but thought a much better job was done with the characters in TP.

I did find the turning of Silver to a "pirate with a heart" to be rushed, and I get AV's point about the story being weak (as opposed to plot), but while TP's story was shallow, Atlantis's story was virtually non-existent.

I know, Atlantis is hardly a benchmark to shoot for, but since they are in the same genre, I thought it appropriate.

Technically, I thought it was very good, with excellent animation, and I agree with others that the music was strong and appropriate.

A classic? Nah. But it should find a following that exceeds what one would expect from a film that failed to gross $40 million.


I take the extremely poor showing of TP to be another piece of evidence in support of the problems Disney creates when it devalues its name. Had Treasure Planet come before Atlantis, I am pretty confident it would have surpassed Atlantis's numbers. (competition at release aside) But Atlantis so disappointed so many fans that they saw another Disney animated film in the exact same animated-adventure genre and said "heck no."

I also think L&S suffered at the box office because of this problem, even though it was in some ways a different type of film. The sequels in the theaters are part of the problem as well. (Note, this is not to say anyone should or shouldn't go... just my comments on the impact of the business practice).

Disney has put its future films behind the 8-ball, and its going to take a pretty good shot to get them out. We'll see if Brother Bear has what it takes.

[airlarry!]

Do I have this right?

Four Disney animated features with PG ratings:
Black Cauldron
Atlantis
Lilo & Stitch
Treasure Planet

Three box office disappointments. The only one that isn't, is a fun filled movie about a loveable alien and an adorable little girl.

The other three are harder edged sci-fi/fantasy films.

Hmm....see a pattern here? Number one, Disney has released three straight teen movies, right? (I can't remember if Groove was PG or G). And all three had aliens in them (well, the Atlanteans could be considered as such).

Couldn't they have planned it better and mixed it one Broadway style animated musical?

[Bob O]

No classic in the least. A medicore movie that performed bad at the box office which shows that the people spoke with what they feel is most important, their wallet!!

[PatriciaH]

We bought it (TP) yesterday and I have to say I liked it a LOT better than I thought I would. I wish I had seen it at the theater now because I thought the animation was really well done. I loved Morph/Morphy and B.E.N.

We are really looking forward to Brother Bear.

[mommabear01]

I saw TP in the theatre twice and I loved it. I pre-order my copy picked it up the day it came out and watched it with my toddler. He sat through the whole movie smiling and enjoying it from beginning to end.:D

[airlarry!]

All right, I watched it again. It's hard to say now that the story has no heart, and the transfer to DVD was a lot brighter than I remembered in my cruddy little theater. It might have been darker then because of the quality of the theater projection that I viewed.

I liked it a lot better the second time. The two things that irritate me about the movie is that Martin Short is grating as BEN and the songs by Johnny R seem like end of the movie songs instead of songs during the movie. I guess this shows my bias, but I like the fact that Disney had the market cornered on Broadway style animated features. When you have a niche, and you're successful at it, why go away from it?

[Bstanley]

OK, based on the comments so far, here's the way I've scored it:

Classic? : 0

Good? : 7

Ok? : 3

Bad? : 3


So it looks like it won't ever sneak up and become a Classic, but it also looks like it will make people wonder why they didn't go see it in the theatres after they rent the DVD - should have done better at the box-office...unless we are such googly-eyed Disney fans that we just can't see straight.

[crainbow]

I did not see this movie in the initial run, I did purchase it. I did not find it to be as bad as some of the reviews had made it out to be, although I could not put my finger on what I disliked until I watched some of the bonus material. I think the original opening that the directors conceived was much better than the one that made the final cut. After watching that footage, it got me to wonder what else lost out to the focus groups and other elements that have a veto voice over the directors and writers.

It also appears that the element that is ruling the Disney Studios is reminiscent of the late 60's-70's Studio executives.

My $0.02.

Chuck

[primax]

Treasure Planet rules, this is a great movie. The animation and music was awesome. Disney released at a horrible time - that simple.

The one thing about the movie that hurts it a little is that the movie is based on the book Treasure Island (TI). I don't like the book, the TI movies, or the muppets version of TI.


I did like Disney's version much better in TP

[d-r]

It may not be a Disney Princess Magic (tm) movie, but that's OK by me.


I know, Atlantis is hardly a benchmark to shoot for, but since they are in the same genre, I thought it appropriate.


But Atlantis DID have a princess in it, she WAS magic, and she didn't even have a mother - frankly, I don't see how you can get more Disney Princess than that.

OK, I'm being smart-elicky here, but there is an honest part of me that still doesn't get this "genre" thing about why Atlantis/TP are "action/adventure/sci-fi/fantasy" and other Disney "classics" like Alladin or Lion King aren't. Is it ALIENS? Then what about Toy Story or Lilo and Stitch? I know I must be really dense on this because scoop tried and tried to explain it to me, I just don't buy it.

No, I don't get it.

I've said on here before that I liked TP just fine, I thought it was visually stunning, I liked the I'm still here song, and I thought that they did a good job with staying loyal to the story but picking up the pace (as compared to the live action treasure island).

Oh, and another thing. I don't buy AV's stuff that "action" doesn't work for animation, because people know it isn't "real" and so they don't get committed to it. Again, I would point out that almost every single non-disney cartoon on saturday morning is action, and I would point out things like the stampede in the lion king or the fight with malificant the dragon in sleeping beauty. Third, I would offer that most of the public is savy enough to know that the matrix, spiderman, or XXX isn't very real either.

Nope. I think what hurt TP and Atlantis is that most of the public wants bubble gum disney movies for preschoolers and they really don't care at all about the quality of it. That is why atrocities like Piglet and Jungle Book 2 (I can't tell you how sick that makes me) make more money than TP. So the animation geeks say "give us something original, get off the same old re-tread" but the public says "I'll take my kid to anything that is syrupy sweet." And when the word of mouth perception is that this isn't a "kiddie" movie, they stay away. I think it really is that simple. The truth is, there aren't a lot of animation geeks out there; most people think that Disney movies are just for kids and that is what they expect and want. The teens and tweens think that disney movies are for little squirts and they want to see something cool instead.

DR

[kitnrose]

I actually have yet to see TP, so my two cents are along the line of why I didn't even consider spending $7 to see it in the theater... I think a LOT of it was timing, both with the other movies it came out next to (LOTR got plenty of my dollars because it's just so incomparibly incredible) and the disney movies it was closest to, specifically L&S, Atlantis, and Country Bears. I love love love L&S but it's always had the 'feel' of a sequal to me, comparible to Rescuers Down Under (which, by the way is one of my all time favorites despite it's many problems, so actually that's a major compliment for L&S). Pair all that with horrible advertising for TP and you have me and many others walking away from the preview saying "wow, disney's finally run out of scrips." Plus just that it's the third remaking of that book... what is making me find a time this next week to go out and rent is is what I keep hearing... "It's sooo much better than I expected." Sounds like Disney shot themselves in the big yellow foot (to modify the expression) all the way to the actual opening of this film. Hopefully they'll learn and I'm looking forwards to Nemo! :)