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View Full Version : Enlighten me re service dogs


Simba's Mom
04-26-2012, 09:25 PM
What would a very small Pomeranian be used as a service dog for? I was at AKL and saw a woman carrying a dog wearing a "Service Dog" vest. I asked her, and she said that the dog was indeed a service dog. I didn't say anything, but I was suspicious. She was carrying the dog, she didn't appear to be deaf or hard of hearing. But before I got suspicious, I realize I may be ignorant-maybe there IS some legitimate use for a Pomeranian. So if so, please tell me some of the possible uses.

seashoreCM
04-26-2012, 09:39 PM
Dogs have been trained to identify odors or changes in odors of perspiration or breath that in turn indicate low blood sugar or certain other internal conditions requiring quick corrective action.

Dogs might be trained to identify odors in rooms or buildings that suggest or indicate substances such as peanuts that a person may be allergic to.

The dog might have been needed for guidance only in certain areas such as dimly lit areas and might be carried at any time when not needed.

utterrandomness
04-26-2012, 09:51 PM
Dogs can also be used as emotional support animals, which I believe are given some of the same access as other service dogs though they are covered under a different set of laws.

elleherself
04-26-2012, 09:58 PM
I know this was probably not your intention, but it seems somewhat uncouth to me to demand people with disabilities "enlighten" you, as if it is their responsibility to correct your uneducated assumptions. Surely a quick google search on "pomeranian service dog" would have done the trick and seemed much less like you are demanding the disabled somehow justify themselves to you. :confused3

In short, is it really your business why she needed the dog?

Cheshire Figment
04-26-2012, 10:33 PM
1. Under ADA a person with a service dog may be asked (a) if they have a disability, and (b) what is the animal trained to do to alleviate the disability.

2. Under ADA an emotional support animal is not a service animal as it does not have specific training.

LWallace2012
04-26-2012, 10:43 PM
Service animals come in all shapes and sizes now a days. We have a lab whom is trained in 3 different areas. Every time we have taken him to Disney you Always have people ask questions and it takes a long time to talk and educate people. This is due to people being misinformed of service animals being trained for the blind. I know many days you hear people make the following comment, " That dog sees for that lady", I just nod and laugh cause I was looking right at them, and secondly I heard them, that gets people every time. Funniest part is, the service dog is not for me, he is for my daughter I just have the leash!
If people are curious of the dog's ability I am more than happy to educate, however if someone demanded to know what the service dog was used for and not someone needing to know, I would not answer because that is personal, I would not go up and ask what your attitude problem was, or so forth.

utterrandomness
04-26-2012, 11:00 PM
1. Under ADA a person with a service dog may be asked (a) if they have a disability, and (b) what is the animal trained to do to alleviate the disability.

2. Under ADA an emotional support animal is not a service animal as it does not have specific training.

As I stated in my earlier comment, emotional support animals are covered under different laws, by which I meant not the ADA. These cover mostly housing and travel, but my answer was a valid one to the question of what kind of service a Pomeranian might provide.

While it may be true that, under the law,someone may be asked if they have a disability and what the animal is trained to do, it is my belief that those caveats were put in place for businesses and not the general public. Also, just because the law says you can do it, it does not mean that asking is not incredibly rude. Particularly when someone asks with the connotation of "I don't see how this person is disabled and thus I have decided that they aren't". It is rude to ask someone to justify themselves because you don't think they're disabled.

Mama Who
04-26-2012, 11:48 PM
What would a very small Pomeranian be used as a service dog for? I was at AKL and saw a woman carrying a dog wearing a "Service Dog" vest. I asked her, and she said that the dog was indeed a service dog. I didn't say anything, but I was suspicious. She was carrying the dog, she didn't appear to be deaf or hard of hearing. But before I got suspicious, I realize I may be ignorant-maybe there IS some legitimate use for a Pomeranian. So if so, please tell me some of the possible uses.

Why would you ask a stranger that? Are you a CM? Was the dog bothering you?

I'm not being rude, I simply don't understand why you were questioning her about something so personal.

SueM in MN
04-27-2012, 12:05 AM
Dogs can also be used as emotional support animals, which I believe are given some of the same access as other service dogs though they are covered under a different set of laws.
People with emotional support dogs do have rights in certain areas ( Specifically housing laws and the Air Carrier Access Act).
People with emotional support animals do not have rights to bring their emotional support animal into businesses or other public places like theme parks.
As was mentioned, a Service Dog must be individualy trained to perform something the person needs to assist with their disability.
Ser vice animals come in all shapes and sizes now a days. We have a lab whom is trained in 3 different areas. Every time we have taken him to Disney you Always have people ask questions and it takes a long time to talk and educate people. This is due to people being misinformed of service animals being trained for the blind. I know many days you hear people make the following comment, " That dog sees for that lady", I just nod and laugh cause I was looking right at them, and secondly I heard them, that gets people every time. Funniest part is, the service dog is not for me, he is for my daughter I just have the leash!
If people are curious of the dog's ability I am more than happy to educate, however if someone demanded to know what the service dog was used for and not someone needing to know, I would not answer because that is personal, I would not go up and ask what your attitude problem was, or so forth.::yes::

aubriee
04-27-2012, 03:12 AM
I've posted on here before about a lady I saw at one of the park guest services. I had gone in to get a new Annual Pass and she just happened to be right in front of me. She was yelling at a couple of the CMs because she was told her dog couldn't stay in the park. It was a cute little Yorkie that she was trying to hold. He was on a leash, but was yapping loudly and wriggling so much she could barely hold him. He was definitely not well behaved.:rotfl: It was funny watching her fighting to hold onto him while arguing with the CMs. I didn't hear the whole conversation, but the dog was apparently being kicked out because she couldn't control him. Which I thought was funny as the little thing couldn't have weighed more than 1 or 2 lbs.:rotfl: She was yelling that he was a service dog and she knew her rights. The two CMs she was yelling at, kept calmly telling her that service animals were more than welcome in the parks, but they had to be kept under control and could not lunge at other people and continously bark.:rotfl: They never asked what the dog did for her and didn't even argue if it was a service animal or not. Their only comments had to do with her having to keep control of the animal and since she couldn't make him behave he couldn't stay in the park. It was pretty obvious by the dog's out of control behavior that he was not really a service dog, so I was impressed with the way the CMs were handling it.

WheeledTraveler
04-27-2012, 07:11 AM
Certainly a Pomeranian could be used as an alert dog, hearing dog, or several other things I can think of. Also, while Emotional Support Animals do not have to be allowed into places other than housing (possibly including hotels?) and airports/airplanes, some businesses do allow them. I don't think WDW does, but I've never seen an ESA with a vest that said "service dog" or even "assistance dog" on it. Most ESAs I've seen have just had a normal collar and leash, with a very occasional few that wear something that states they're an ESA.

I do agree with the PPs who say that you quite honestly had no right to ask unless 1) you were a CM and 2) the dog was misbehaving. If you aren't a CM and the dog was misbehaving, the correct procedure would be to alert a CM. Service dogs can be removed from places if they misbehave so even then whether in your eyes the woman was "legitimate", it wouldn't matter at that point. The woman doesn't need to prove anything to you and she probably gets questioned constantly. It's really boring (to be polite about what it's like) to have to constantly justify yourself and your rights. An equivalent would be going up to someone in a wheelchair and asking if that was a wheelchair, implying that you didn't think they needed one. Yes, that's happened to me with random strangers on the street. Even when it's not someone doubting that I need a wheelchair, there's no reason why anyone who has never seen me before needs to ask why I use a wheelchair. I don't ask them about their medical issues! It's just plain rude.

Tonka's Skipper
04-27-2012, 07:31 AM
I know this was probably not your intention, but it seems somewhat uncouth to me to demand people with disabilities "enlighten" you, as if it is their responsibility to correct your uneducated assumptions. Surely a quick google search on "pomeranian service dog" would have done the trick and seemed much less like you are demanding the disabled somehow justify themselves to you. :confused3

In short, is it really your business why she needed the dog?

That was a very rude post..the op did nothing more then ask a question.........she did not demand anything and the question was answered and she came here to ask and learn..............seems ellen your more interested in hiding something?.....geee........do you use a pet as the alleged service or support daog...afriad you maybe asked a polite simple question?Shame on you ellen!

seem the more people who understand what servise dogs are and the wonderful services they can provide the better EVERYONE is!

AKK

Piper
04-27-2012, 10:58 AM
My Lucy is a very small dog (her parents were a chihuahua and toy poodle.) She is a trained diabetes alert dog (and performs a few other jobs for me.) She is very well-behaved--doesn't bark at people or other animals--totally ignores birds, squirrels, cats, other dogs, etc. when she is in "uniform." When we go to the dog park, she romps and plays like every other dog (she still doesn't bark at them, but did let the neighborhood bully dog know to leave her alone!) I carry a copy of a note from my doctor listing my multiple disabilities and her certificate of training.

I have a neighbor who claims her dog is a service dog--NOT. He barks at everyone and everything, chases every animal he sees and I think he gives service dogs a bad name! P.S. He is the above mentioned "bully" and continues his misbehavior both in and out of vest.

Betty Rohrer
04-27-2012, 11:12 AM
at the small park i work at had a small dog who was trained to alert on child's medical issues. looked just like a pet until the day child had an issue in the park. had been a number of complaints but we were shown that day, glad everything turned out okay.

hsmamato2
04-27-2012, 11:22 AM
An equivalent would be going up to someone in a wheelchair and asking if that was a wheelchair, implying that you didn't think they needed one. Yes, that's happened to me with random strangers on the street. Even when it's not someone doubting that I need a wheelchair, there's no reason why anyone who has never seen me before needs to ask why I use a wheelchair. I don't ask them about their medical issues! It's just plain rude.

Well....I can see your point, that would be offensive indeed.....
But, in defense of OP,(and I really don't know true intentions) I do see some people using any excuse they can to drag Fido along everywhere as a 'service dog' when he clearly is a family pet.
I think some of us may see this,and wonder why it isn't ok to label our own pets as service dogs (for any reason)n and take them with us,rather than hire a dogsitter.
Like, I love my itty bitty dog,so I would love to carry her around WDW with me too..... or in one strange looking case I saw, wheeling the 'service dog' in a stroller.....I guess I wouldn't 'ask',but I would wonder why we can't all just make our own assessment of what a service dog really is.
...And,I do get it about different sized dogs being service dogs ,for epiliepsy,etc. so it's not just that reason.
Again, not meaning to insult anyone at all,and I guess the reason I don't 'ask' is b/c usually someones elses dog in the parks doesn't impact my own experience.

Mama Who
04-27-2012, 11:52 AM
My Lucy is a very small dog (her parents were a chihuahua and toy poodle.) She is a trained diabetes alert dog (and performs a few other jobs for me.)


I am told that chis are also a good choice for seizure dogs. I guess they have a tendency to be hyper alert to subtle changes in their partner?

PAcpl
04-27-2012, 01:00 PM
Not to hijack this thread, but being there are a number of people here with service dogs I have a question. DW and I are serious dog lovers. We often see service dogs at the park and really want to go up and pet and mush them up! But we are always nervous that the owner will get upset and tell us to get lost.

Do you mind being approached when you are with your friend or would you rather be left alone?

utterrandomness
04-27-2012, 01:06 PM
Not to hijack this thread, but being there are a number of people here with service dogs I have a question. DW and I are serious dog lovers. We often see service dogs at the park and really want to go up and pet and mush them up! But we are always nervous that the owner will get upset and tell us to get lost.

Do you mind being approached when you are with your friend or would you rather be left alone?

It is commonly the case that petting a dog when it's working can distract the dog.

Tonka's Skipper
04-27-2012, 01:52 PM
It is commonly the case that petting a dog when it's working can distract the dog.

Totally correct and


If you wish to pet the dog..*ALWAYS* ask first.....if the dog is working the owner will most likely say no and explain...but if the dog in off duty.....like in a dog park.........it maybe ok!

Each owner is different and each dog performs different tasks.

AKK

bedogged
04-27-2012, 02:12 PM
Small dogs are often used as "hearing dogs." A person does not have to be totally deaf to benefit from this type of dog. A dog that will alert to a phone ringing or a doorbell can be a great deal of assistance. Small dogs can also be trained to pick up dropped objects from the floor. It doesn't take a 100 pound dog to pick up a set of keys.

One of my Yorkies, not a trained service dog, has reacted naturally to the latest member of our household. He is a two month old infant and his mother is a very hard sleeper. If the baby cries and the mother sleeps through it, my Lucy goes to the mother and scratches on the bed until she wakes up. No one could convince me that she could not be successfully trained as a some type of service dog!

SueM in MN
04-27-2012, 04:35 PM
Totally correct and


If you wish to pet the dog..*ALWAYS* ask first.....if the dog is working the owner will most likely say no and explain...but if the dog in off duty.....like in a dog park.........it maybe ok!

Each owner is different and each dog performs different tasks.

AKK
::yes::

Simba's Mom
04-27-2012, 05:25 PM
I know this was probably not your intention, but it seems somewhat uncouth to me to demand people with disabilities "enlighten" you, as if it is their responsibility to correct your uneducated assumptions. Surely a quick google search on "pomeranian service dog" would have done the trick and seemed much less like you are demanding the disabled somehow justify themselves to you. :confused3

In short, is it really your business why she needed the dog?

Sorry, I thought people wouldn't mind taking the opportunity to teach and explain (probably because I used to be a teacher). Guess I was wrong. I had no idea it would come off as "demanding".

lost*in*cyberspace
04-27-2012, 05:49 PM
Sorry, I thought people wouldn't mind taking the opportunity to teach and explain (probably because I used to be a teacher). Guess I was wrong. I had no idea it would come off as "demanding".

Maybe, but can you imagine what a job that would be if you were expected to "educate" people all day long? At least you were getting paid!

Personally, I think people should generally mind their own business. You should have left that woman alone.

Tonka's Skipper
04-27-2012, 06:57 PM
Sorry, I thought people wouldn't mind taking the opportunity to teach and explain (probably because I used to be a teacher). Guess I was wrong. I had no idea it would come off as "demanding".



You did not come off demanding, you did nothing more then ask a question. It does seem ther PC folks have now decided even asking a question in public is now wrong...just becuase they have appionted themselves the PC police.doesnt not in any way mean they are correct!

In Addition Quite honestly....why anyone would be on the blog that is expected to answer people questions and then say you are to important to be bothered to answer them and then add a final insult of saying its your *demanding* even to ask..........well thats show how rude elleherself and lost in cyberspace and Mama who are!

Seems they should be looking at themselves and wondering why they are even here!:confused3


AKK

SueM in MN
04-27-2012, 07:32 PM
The only way to find out is to ask.
I think a forum is a better place to ask than an individual person that someone might encounter.

We do get asked frequently what DDs Service Dog does and we are fine with answering. They are just curious and are very nice about it. That is different than someone coming up in an accusing tone wanting to know it is a service dog and what it does.

I think the OP was asking in a curious way and it is not necessarily easy to find out information like that by googling.

WheeledTraveler
04-27-2012, 09:36 PM
Sorry, I thought people wouldn't mind taking the opportunity to teach and explain (probably because I used to be a teacher). Guess I was wrong. I had no idea it would come off as "demanding".

I know I'm not the person you quoted, but I want to make clear that I wasn't objecting to you asking here. That part I understand. I, personally, objected to the fact that you went up to the woman and asked if it was a service dog. I may be extra sensitive because I've had years of people questioning both my disability and my need for aids (both mobility aids and other sorts of aids). I tend to assume people are following the "rules" unless I have definite proof they aren't because it's so horrible to feel like you're constantly being doubted based on people's visual judgments. And, as I said before, even service animals can be forced to leave places if they are misbehaving so that's really the only level I even care about generally.

SueM in MN
04-27-2012, 09:59 PM
I think this thread has run its course and is a good time to end.