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DaniB
07-18-2011, 12:37 PM
From what I've been reading, it looks like people are able to use their DVC points to book cruises.

Now, can others rent DVC points toward a cruise like those who rent them to use at WDW?

And if so, were people able to do so for the Hawaiian cruise?

And, if so again - what am I doing wrong when I try and figure out about how many points it would cost our family versus cash?

I went through 3 different threads and saw what people were paying for categories 11 through 6. But when I add up the points for our family of 4 (2 adults, 1 disney adult, 1 child age 8), it costs more than what people paid cash... I must be doing something wrong..

I was curious to see the price differents (cash versus points) for a Cat 7 or 6.

I came across this 2012 DCL points chart and went by it:

http://www.thedibb.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=4484656

jel0511
07-18-2011, 12:42 PM
Using DVC points for a DCL cruise isn't a good use of points if you're a DVC owner, renting points to pay for a DVC cruise is a even worse idea. Most DVC owners will rent their points out to pay for their DCL cruises since they can rent less points than use actual points to book a reservation. Paying cash and booking as far out as possible is usually the cheapest method of booking DCL. I'm an owner and have used my points in the past for DCL, yes, my point value was probably lower than renting the points, but hey they're my points and I didn't want the hassle of renting them out. So, you're not crazy it is cheaper to pay cash than use DVC points for a cruise.

eva
07-18-2011, 12:50 PM
Rarely will you find it cheaper to use DVC points outside the DVC resorts. Almost always it is more money. It is nice that you can occasionally trade outside the DVC resorts for other things like cruises and ABD, but it isn't wise to buy DVC for that purpose. Renting for that purpose will cost you more than just paying for the cruise. Renting points is only a good deal when you are staying at WDW in a DVC resort.

CarolAnnC
07-18-2011, 12:58 PM
Besides costing more than via cash direct, there is also far less availability these days. Nothing before end of 2012 is available on DVC points at this time.

DaniB
07-18-2011, 01:04 PM
Well, that explains that then. :) Thanks everyone.

I thought points would be cheaper as it's cheaper to rent points than pay cash for a deluxe at WDW.

That shoots that idea down. :rotfl:

papamouse1
07-18-2011, 01:05 PM
NO, you were probably accurate in your figures.

Alot of people think that using points to book cruises is a waste, because the number of points is high for cruising. And many other owners use their points and have no problem doing it.
I ran a couple examples to give you an idea. I ran this as a family of 4 with 1 teen and 1 younger "tween"
3/1/2012 3-day cruise with 5A cat room $$= $2815 and points=310. This means you are getting $9 point value

4/29 4-day with 8A cat room $$= $3085 and points=373 for an $8/point value.
There have been times I done the comparison and it was lower than this, but I personally have never seen a comparison lower than $7 point value... doesn't mean it doesn't happen I just haven't seen it.... and I do check because we personally like to use our points to cruise if we can, just more convenient for us.

Make sense? Keep in mind, quite often when you book with $$ and you use a quality Disney TA there are incentives as well (on board credits, etc)

So here's the deal, I just booked my next cruise on points. The way we view it is my yearly MF for the points I used is $4.50 per point. We paid cash for our points so we have no mortgage costs. Our room value we got on our cruise was $8.50/point, so to us it was worth it.
Many folks encourage DVC owners to rent their points and use the cash which often is more beneficial, but in the end I don't want to mess with all that when I am getting the value we wanted anyway.

Now to your main question... If you are trying to rent points to book a cruise, that will probably NEVER be a better deal than paying cash, simply because the cost of renting points will be higher than the point value you will get to use the points for a cruise.

If you won your own points, maybe you use them to cruise (just do your homework), but if you don't own points, there would no value to renting points for a cruise IMHO. :)

schwenksvillemouse
07-18-2011, 02:17 PM
Besides costing more than via cash direct, there is also far less availability these days. Nothing before end of 2012 is available on DVC points at this time.

This is a true statement for booking on the Dream. I just booked a seven night Eastern on the Magic using points for March, 2012

Calfan
07-18-2011, 03:23 PM
And just a couple of weeks ago I was able to use points to book a 7-nt Alaska cruise on the Wonder for Aug. 2012.

papamouse1
07-18-2011, 03:42 PM
And just a couple of weeks ago I was able to use points to book a 7-nt Alaska cruise on the Wonder for Aug. 2012.

So, what was the comparison to paying cash? What would your cruise choice (room, etc.) have cost in cash and how many points did it take? I am interested in Alaska down the way :)

jmjousley
07-18-2011, 05:04 PM
Besides costing more than via cash direct, there is also far less availability these days. Nothing before end of 2012 is available on DVC points at this time.

I guess we were lucky. We just booked about a month ago for an Oct 2011 cruise using DVC points.

I probably wouldn't go this route again, but didn't want to go through the hassle of renting.

lark
07-18-2011, 06:04 PM
So here's the deal, I just booked my next cruise on points. The way we view it is my yearly MF for the points I used is $4.50 per point. We paid cash for our points so we have no mortgage costs. Our room value we got on our cruise was $8.50/point, so to us it was worth it. Many folks encourage DVC owners to rent their points and use the cash which often is more beneficial, but in the end I don't want to mess with all that when I am getting the value we wanted anyway.

I think this is the right point. As others have mentioned, it makes very little economic sense to rent points for cruising. It would be pretty tough to find a rental that makes sense. You can theoretically construct some cruises where you'd get a lot of value -- for example, an 11B on the Fantasy in July for 4 people is like $7000, because the 3d and 4th guest fees are so high. On points, it's less than 600 points, so there's lots of value. But as I said, those are "theoretical" only, because you probably won't get availability. I think it's also possible to construct some comparisons where the ratio truly stinks -- particularly in discount months.

But if one is talking about using their own points, then it might make sense. The decision about the hassle value of renting out points is personal and differs from person to person. If you get $8 of value out of 300 points for a cruise, but could rent them for $11, is the non-hassle of renting worth $900? Everyone has a different answer, and nobody is right and nobody is wrong. For me, this isn't close the other way -- I'd rent my points -- but part of that is that I've rented points several times both as a renter and rentee, and it's been easy so I've been lucky to have had good experiences. If you don't pay interest for your points purchase, have a good maintenance fee at your resort, and would prefer to use them for cruising than dvc stays, they are your points! Do what feels right.

I think there are a couple of minor points to mention, though -- first, isn't there a $95 nonrefundable fee for booking a cruise with points? That needs to be added into the math. Second, if you are borrowing or banking points to do the cruise, that comes with a cost in the event you need to cancel since banking and borrowing are final, whereas a cash reservation has much more liberal cancelation policy; at least until final payment date. Third, if like many people you are a prior cruiser and book "dummy" reservations while on board, or at least have that opportunity, it saves 10 percent plus extra OBC, so it might not be appropriate when comparing points costs to cash costs to use the full rack rate of the cruise.

Mom2PrincessesLinSy
07-18-2011, 09:14 PM
I just rented our 400 points to people so we could have the $$ to pay for our Alaskan cruise in 2 weeks. It was the first time we had tried to rent, but it really wasn't hard, but it has made me nervous, since you don't know who you are renting to, figuring out if the person is really going to pay, etc. But, this experience (so far) has been good and worth it.

We booked our Alaskan cruise on-board, so we had gotten 10% off the price, and also a $200 OBC. We also then transferred our reservation to a TA, and got an extra $400 OBC. So we were ahead by $600 in credit plus $800 in the discount for the 4 of us to go, so we are $1400 ahead.

To pay for the cruise in points was going to require we use our points allotment for 2 years just for DH and I, and then have to pay for the kids with cash. It made more sense for us to do the cash option and rent out our points to pay that off.

That said, we are planning on going on the NYC cruise to the Bahamas in June 2012, and booking that on-board when we are in Alaska. We will use our 2 years worth of points, and have to pay cash for the kids. But supposedly DVC is offering an OBC of $500 if we book the cruise on-board, so its definitely an incentive.

Is your brain spinning yet? DVC can be quite confusing, but very rewarding for owners !;)

CarolAnnC
07-18-2011, 10:49 PM
This is a true statement for booking on the Dream. I just booked a seven night Eastern on the Magic using points for March, 2012

I guess we were lucky. We just booked about a month ago for an Oct 2011 cruise using DVC points.

I probably wouldn't go this route again, but didn't want to go through the hassle of renting.

Yes, you were both very lucky. Around September of 2009 DVC put what some called a "moratorium" at the time on DCL bookings using DVC points. At that point, there was no availability to cruise on either the Magic or Wonder (there was no Dream) prior to October 2011.

The same happened again this calendar year. So while you may find sporadic openings for points availability, it is still very limited on all of the DCL sailings.

Congratulations on your upcoming cruises! We are off to Alaska very soon ourselves. :)

QuiltTeddy
07-19-2011, 08:24 AM
We have taken three Disney cruises (Eastern, Western Carribean and Mexican Riviera) and used our DVC points each time. We've had a veranda each time. We also used our DVC points to do a week's cruise to Alaska on Holland America (Disney wasn't available in 2006) and also had a verandah. The only thing we had to pay was the $95 booking fee.

We are also booked on the 5 night Dream to the Bahamas for March, 2012 and used our DVC points. Another room with a verandah.

We've never been unable to use our points for a cruise.

tomspixie
07-19-2011, 08:58 AM
We usually cruise DCL 2 or 3 times a year...usually 7 day...if we have to, we do back to back 5day and 4day due to school schedules! We usually do at least one cruise a year on points, getting two cabins. We have done this since 2001.
Using our points this way, makes sense to US. If it works for you, then it is right. Others doing it differently is right for them!
I do have to say, we did the Med cruise in 2007. We had 2 cabins and used points. We paid cash for our 3rd child..our 11 night cruise cost us $1,700.00.
Using points for that cruise was much more cost effective than cash...I booked same cabin,verandah for 4, that we had 2 in...they spent $14,000.00 and all shared one cabin. My points and $1,700.00 had us with a verandah and TWO bathrooms!!! WOOHOO!
We set sail next week on points! Love DVC and DCL!!!:)

papamouse1
07-19-2011, 01:36 PM
I think this is the right point. As others have mentioned, it makes very little economic sense to rent points for cruising. It would be pretty tough to find a rental that makes sense. You can theoretically construct some cruises where you'd get a lot of value -- for example, an 11B on the Fantasy in July for 4 people is like $7000, because the 3d and 4th guest fees are so high. On points, it's less than 600 points, so there's lots of value. But as I said, those are "theoretical" only, because you probably won't get availability. I think it's also possible to construct some comparisons where the ratio truly stinks -- particularly in discount months.

But if one is talking about using their own points, then it might make sense. The decision about the hassle value of renting out points is personal and differs from person to person. If you get $8 of value out of 300 points for a cruise, but could rent them for $11, is the non-hassle of renting worth $900? Everyone has a different answer, and nobody is right and nobody is wrong. For me, this isn't close the other way -- I'd rent my points -- but part of that is that I've rented points several times both as a renter and rentee, and it's been easy so I've been lucky to have had good experiences. If you don't pay interest for your points purchase, have a good maintenance fee at your resort, and would prefer to use them for cruising than dvc stays, they are your points! Do what feels right.

I think there are a couple of minor points to mention, though -- first, isn't there a $95 nonrefundable fee for booking a cruise with points? That needs to be added into the math. Second, if you are borrowing or banking points to do the cruise, that comes with a cost in the event you need to cancel since banking and borrowing are final, whereas a cash reservation has much more liberal cancelation policy; at least until final payment date. Third, if like many people you are a prior cruiser and book "dummy" reservations while on board, or at least have that opportunity, it saves 10 percent plus extra OBC, so it might not be appropriate when comparing points costs to cash costs to use the full rack rate of the cruise.

Well said...

It can definitely be advantageous to rent vs. use points, but people viewing these threads need to remember the other side as well. Yes, there is a $95 fee.. I forgot to mention that :)
But keep in mind in order to get 10% cruise discount and an online OBC from DCL, you MUST book online (doesn't work for us since we only get to cruise every 3-4 years). Also, the OBC is wonderful if you are booking a long cruise and a nicer room, but is pretty small if only booking shorter cruise in cat 9-11 rooms. But hey, free money is still free money :)

Just like so many other things about Disney, if you educate yourself and do the research, you can find some pretty creative ways to make your trips more enjoyable! I hope to do our first ever onboard rebook in Nov. and pay cash for a cruise with my wife for our 25th! Probably won't be renting points, because we are storing up for a 2013 trip to Aulani, but definitely think I will try renting in the years to come as our oldest goes to college :)

italiamom
07-29-2011, 10:31 PM
I just rented our 400 points to people so we could have the $$ to pay for our Alaskan cruise in 2 weeks. It was the first time we had tried to rent, but it really wasn't hard, but it has made me nervous, since you don't know who you are renting to, figuring out if the person is really going to pay, etc. But, this experience (so far) has been good and worth it.

We booked our Alaskan cruise on-board, so we had gotten 10% off the price, and also a $200 OBC. We also then transferred our reservation to a TA, and got an extra $400 OBC. So we were ahead by $600 in credit plus $800 in the discount for the 4 of us to go, so we are $1400 ahead.

To pay for the cruise in points was going to require we use our points allotment for 2 years just for DH and I, and then have to pay for the kids with cash. It made more sense for us to do the cash option and rent out our points to pay that off.

That said, we are planning on going on the NYC cruise to the Bahamas in June 2012, and booking that on-board when we are in Alaska. We will use our 2 years worth of points, and have to pay cash for the kids. But supposedly DVC is offering an OBC of $500 if we book the cruise on-board, so its definitely an incentive.

Is your brain spinning yet? DVC can be quite confusing, but very rewarding for owners !;)

I'm not sure if i am responding correctly, but i would like to ask you what the details of renting our DVC points are. i want to rent mine to help pay for my Caribbean cruise in 2012. can i email you so i can be more detailed? Thank you, Italiamom:flower3:

Jathanis
07-30-2011, 05:38 PM
FWIW, we are taking our second cruise in October, and we are doing it using our DVC points. Another aspect all the DVC nay-sayers here are missing is all the extra money the same week at WDW or DLR would cost above and beyond just the DVC points of the resort... We really couldn't afford this year (or next summer, lol) to fly anywhere to use any of our SSR points in FL, and going to DLR (8 hour drive) would cost us a LOT of cash for the park tickets, food, spending money, etc. The cruise, being all inclusive, means not having to spend that money beyond gratuity and maybe an excursion, a few hundred bucks max. So for our family this year, using DVC points to book our DCL cruise was the cheapest vacation we could do until a few loans get paid off...

quentina
07-30-2011, 06:20 PM
Here's my theory. I bought the points to use. If I want to cruise, I am doing that. I don't sit back and worry about the economic value....I bought the points to enjoy vacation. Nor do I want the hassle of renting etc.

Sometimes, I pay cash (if I am point poor that year), sometimes I use points. I will also consider trading elsewhere in a few years!

sorul82?
07-30-2011, 11:00 PM
FWIW, we are taking our second cruise in October, and we are doing it using our DVC points. Another aspect all the DVC nay-sayers here are missing is all the extra money the same week at WDW or DLR would cost above and beyond just the DVC points of the resort... We really couldn't afford this year (or next summer, lol) to fly anywhere to use any of our SSR points in FL, and going to DLR (8 hour drive) would cost us a LOT of cash for the park tickets, food, spending money, etc. The cruise, being all inclusive, means not having to spend that money beyond gratuity and maybe an excursion, a few hundred bucks max. So for our family this year, using DVC points to book our DCL cruise was the cheapest vacation we could do until a few loans get paid off...

Yep, yep, yep!



Here's my theory. I bought the points to use. If I want to cruise, I am doing that. I don't sit back and worry about the economic value....I bought the points to enjoy vacation. Nor do I want the hassle of renting etc.



:thumbsup2

joeabate
07-31-2011, 09:08 AM
We bought into DVC in 1992 and paid in full at the time and are taking our 2nd cruise on the Magic using points. We usually take 2-3 5 night stays at WDW but now that the kids are adults they don't always come with us. We have the points and decided a free cruise is better than losing the points. I would never consider renting the points. I bought them to enjoy everything Disney has to offer.

Sailing on the Magic 1/7/12 in a navigators verandah. Son and daughter in law to be are joining us in the adjoining cabin.

QuiltTeddy
07-31-2011, 09:30 AM
We bought into DVC in 1992 and paid in full at the time and are taking our 2nd cruise on the Magic using points. We usually take 2-3 5 night stays at WDW but now that the kids are adults they don't always come with us. We have the points and decided a free cruise is better than losing the points. I would never consider renting the points. I bought them to enjoy everything Disney has to offer.

Sailing on the Magic 1/7/12 in a navigators verandah. Son and daughter in law to be are jointing us in the adjoining cabin.


I totally agree with you. We have taken a total of 4 cruises and have our 5th booked and have used DVC points for every cruise (including using them to do Alaska on Holland America (when Disney wasn't up there yet). We feel points are for using, not renting, but that's our opinion.

bbn1122
07-31-2011, 09:52 AM
Here's my theory. I bought the points to use. If I want to cruise, I am doing that. I don't sit back and worry about the economic value....I bought the points to enjoy vacation. Nor do I want the hassle of renting etc.

Sometimes, I pay cash (if I am point poor that year), sometimes I use points. I will also consider trading elsewhere in a few years!

I agree with you totally....

We have to travel during high season everywhere. If I can get a 2 bedroom condo for 270 points as opposed to paying $600 a night, its a good deal.

As for the cruise, it can help me bring down the cost of my cruise for a family of 5 by using points to pay for 1 or 2 guests...I welcome it.

If you can cruise in the offseason, it probably a great deal, especially when you factor in you are getting meals and entertainment!!!

A cruise doing it anyway you can or want to is always a GREAT thing!!
:thumbsup2:thumbsup2

dawne98
07-31-2011, 12:40 PM
we are going in May 2012 two rooms 5 us all together and it was 303 points......as others have said it is your points and have fun and enjoy them anyway you want:)