DEBATE: Has the day of the calm dark ride past?

[WDWHound]

My favorite rides are the calm, slow moving darkrides that tell a story. Spaceship Earth, Haunted Mansion, Pirates, Horizons, Innerspace, World of Motion, Imagination (the original and mayby the most recent rehab), all of these were rides that took you past scenes that used atmosphere and animatronics to tell a story. Thrills were not required.

Think, about it. When was the last time a thrill free dark ride was built by Disney? If you you look for a true Disney dark ride not based on thrills, I think the Great Movie Ride is the last one. (I don't count the 3d movies or simulators, I put them in a different category. )

Has Society's rapidly shortening attention span and insatiable appitite for thrills killed the calmer, more theatrical dark rides, or do you think these rides will make a comeback.

[Lewisc]

What about Pooh in MK? I agree there is more interest in a thrill rides.

[WDWHound]

I will grant you Pooh, though its not nearly as elarorate as the other examples I cited.

What I would love to see is a new ride on the scale of HM, Priates or the others, but I'm not sure the general public wants this.

[mrtoadslastride]

I am not sure if you would count the Winnie the Pooh ride in WDW (or TDL), but they are more recent than the Great Movie Ride. Did TDS get any dark rides?

My guess is that for the near future we will see more 3d movies than dark rides because 3d rides are probably cheaper, take up less park space (at least less than Pirates, SE), and are easier to update (where is the new movie for Body Wars and Star Tours???).

[BRERALEX]

AFTER SEEING xXx LAST NIGHT IM GOING WITH THE THEORY OF PEOPLES ATTENTION PSAN AFFECTING RIDES.

i WAS WATCHING THE MOVIE THINKING THIS IS LIKE THEME PARKS LOTS OG BANG AND BOOM BUT NO STORY SO YOU LEAVE WITH NO REAL MEMORIES. THEY DONT TAKE TIME TO DEVELOP A REAL QUALITY PRODUCT AND THATS WHATS HAPPENING NOW TO DISNEY PARKS I THINK.

THEY DONT TAKE TIME TO DEVELOP A TRULY GOOD PRODUCT.

TDS WOULD QUALIFY IF THEY BUILT IT HERE :p

:p :p :p :p :p :p :p :bounce: :p :p :p :p :p :p :p

[el_tigre]

Wouldn't Buzz Lightyear sort of qualify as a dark ride too? I think it's closer to qualifying as a dark ride than a thrill ride.

[All Aboard]

Perhaps we should rephrase it then (to eliminate Pooh & Buzz). Has Disney built any immersive, slow moving, non-thrill, dark attractions (that don't simply use existing tracks) since The Great Movie Ride?

Or better yet, do they plan to do so?

[BRERALEX]

I highly doubt that there is any rides in the works to be slow moving in the dark with no thrills. That would take alot of thought imagination, creativity and the belief that that is what people want to see. Right now I think Disney is going to be going in the direction of thrill and thrill only.

Horizons is gone, Carousel of Progress is gone and werent there rumors of getting rid of Great Movie ride for something like Indiana Jones in Cali?

I bet they would have gotten rid of Spaceship Earth if it didn't symbolize Epcot. Universe of Energy i believe is still around because of underlying politics. IMO.

The focus seems to be thrills and won't change till the perception that we all have small attention spans changes.

I am suprised that JIYI wasn't revamped to a more thrill like ride. And I am surprised that Mission Space is going to be a simulator and not a more thrill roller coaster type ride.

[Tik Tok]

Originally posted by BRERALEX
The focus seems to be thrills and won't change till the perception that we all have small attention spans changes.

I think this talk of small attention spans is just an excuse that Disney uses to justify not creating this type of attraction. Slow moving dark rides can be just as exciting as thrill rides, but it takes a lot more work and money. It's a lot harder to excite people when you're moving slowly, but it can be done.

In order for these rides to be really great they have to "WOW" people, like Pirates and Mansion did in the 60s. The problem is, in the 60s it was enough that these rides had Audio-Animatronics and great settings - they were new and different then. Now it's going to take something more than just a room full of Animatronics -- Disney needs to take the dark ride to the next level, but they have been unwilling to do that lately because of cost and a percieved lack of interest from the public.

I believe that we will eventually see a return of the dark ride, but it's going to take a change in management so that the people in charge actually "get" just what Disney is all about. Until then, I would imagine we're in for a lot more spinners and 3D movies.

[Horace Horsecollar]

Originally posted by gcurling
Perhaps we should rephrase it then (to eliminate Pooh & Buzz). Has Disney built any immersive, slow moving, non-thrill, dark attractions (that don't simply use existing tracks) since The Great Movie Ride?
Phantom Manor, it's a small world, Pirates of the Caribbean, and various Fantasyland attractions at Disneyland Paris were built after The Great Movie Ride.
Originally posted by gcurling
Or better yet, do they plan to do so?
I sure hope so.

Imagine if Flik's Fun Fair ar DCA had been a big, immersive, indoor, "E" ticket ride for the whole family instead of some themed off-the-shelf carnival rides.

[Lewisc]

A slow dark ride isn't really what the public is looking for. The current state of the art dark rides are Indian Jones in DL and Spiderman in IOA. Dark rides with a thrill element.

[WDWHound]

Originally posted by Horace Horsecollar

Phantom Manor, it's a small world, Pirates of the Caribbean, and various Fantasyland attractions at Disneyland Paris were built after The Great Movie Ride.


And all of these were remakes of existing rides. Now TDS does have a new slow dark ride (Sinbad). Perhaps Disney beleives only Americans don't want this sort of ride. More likely, Disney is no longer willing to spend the money.

I sure hope so.

Imagine if Flik's Fun Fair ar DCA had been a big, immersive, indoor, "E" ticket ride for the whole family instead of some themed off-the-shelf carnival rides.

I agree, that would be great.

[BRERALEX]

Phantom Manor, it's a small world, Pirates of the Caribbean, and various Fantasyland attractions at Disneyland Paris were built after The Great Movie Ride.

that shouldnt count those are just cookie cutter attractions and didnt tak emuch more imaginaion or magic to make them happen they already knew they would work.

I think they are afraid to try a new totally reinvented dark ride and take it to the next level like Tik Tok said. And thats one of the problems. It feels like they only go with sure fire winners instead of taking some chances. Some real chances, to make something really great. To take the whole bank and say f it lets do it. Like a Beastly kingdom or like what were talking about a totally new dark ride that doesnt have to go 0-80 in 3 seconds but can be just as magical and interesting and informative going 3 miles an hour and slower on turns lol.

[PKS44]

Superstar Limo? Was it not a slow dark ride? It was apparently scaled way back due to budget and the death of Princess Diana, but it would have qualified and since it was a failure, won't the "say no" types use its failure as a reason to not build any more slow dark rides?

[Tik Tok]

Originally posted by PKS44
but it would have qualified and since it was a failure, won't the "say no" types use its failure as a reason to not build any more slow dark rides?

They probably will, but it's really comparing apples to oranges. SuperStar Limo was really just a glorified Fantasyland dark ride -- it certainly wasn't a Pirates, and I don't think it was ever supposed to be. They just didn't even try to make it something special.

But you're probably right, knowing current Disney management, they'll probably look at that and say, "See, people just don't like dark rides anymore..."

[hopemax]

I think they could make a comeback, depending on...gosh, I hate to say it but...LAWYERS. Every month it seems there's some news about theme park legislation, or a ride under rehab because the lawyers want X changed, Y installed, etc. If this trend continues, will it no longer make financial sense to build the next hyper-coaster, not because it's construction costs or maintence costs but insurance costs, potential lawsuits. Parks may have to start being inventive again, to keep those bodies coming through the gates without those type of rides. The logical place to go, IMO, would be the Pirates or HM type rides.

I have to disagree with you though about these types of rides not being thrill rides. In many ways they are "thrill" rides. But the thrills seem to generate from the same place as the ones when men see their brides, or parents hold their baby for the first time, rather than from the place when you throw yourself out of an airplane.

Visual thrills, that boggle your mind, tug at your heart, not just a chemical reaction from your body being thrown around. Thank goodness for Steve Davison, who's shown at DL what a renovation can do for a ride. Not only the Haunted Mansion Christmas overlay but the It's a Small World one as well. DL has Fastpass machines just for the Christmas IASW!

And a question for those or you that have ridden DL's Indy...don't you ever wish the ride would go slower in places (like the bridge room) so you can see everything?

[meowthew2]

Sinbad's Seven Voyages at TDS is an elaborate Pirates-esque slow-moving dark ride, and it reportedly is rather unpopular.

[PatriciaH]

Just lurking. Yes, I wish that Indy at DL would go a bit slower in spots so you can see the details. I felt really whipped around on this ride and I love exciting rides and coasters. My husband and I actualy prefer Dinousaur/CTX because you can't really tell what the heck is going on on Indy. I would also love to see more dark rides with some new technology!

[Planogirl]

I personally like Indy just the way it is because its speed and action suit the story so well. But that's not to say that the slow, dark ride wouldn't be suitable for other types of stories. Virtually every Disney film could be made into a great dark ride IMO. The Alice in Wonderland ride in DL is cute but just think of what Disney could do with such a movie!

Of course, I also like 3-d movies but I want good versions of everything and maybe some things that haven't even been invented yet.

[raidermatt]

Just as an action movie, like Raiders of the Lost Ark, gives the audience time to look around once in awhile, a thrill ride probably should too.

That's not to say the Indy would be better without the thrills, but perhaps a slower, more prolonged start to the ride would have made it even better than it already is.

Yes, that would make the ride longer, and more expensive. However, a case could be made that it would draw even more guests into the park and would have a longer lifespan.

[theflintstones]

"I think this talk of small attention spans is just an excuse that Disney uses to justify not creating this type of attraction. "

Exactly.

Another point, a core of Disney's visitors are children.. Many of whom are not large enough to even go on a roller coaster. Rides like World of Motion, Horizons, etc. all take a lot of money to keep well kept. That's why many are gone, $. It's no coincidence that Imagination reopened with 0 animatronics, and then still, only 3 after the redo.

[Demosthenes]

Originally posted by raidermatt
Just as an action movie, like Raiders of the Lost Ark, gives the audience time to look around once in awhile, a thrill ride probably should too.

That's not to say the Indy would be better without the thrills, but perhaps a slower, more prolonged start to the ride would have made it even better than it already is.

Yes, that would make the ride longer, and more expensive. However, a case could be made that it would draw even more guests into the park and would have a longer lifespan.

Look at Splash Mountain. It's a log flume with three drops, and lots to see. Of course, this ride represents Disney at its best, IMHO.

[PatriciaH]

Originally posted by Demosthenes


Look at Splash Mountain. It's a log flume with three drops, and lots to see. Of course, this ride represents Disney at its best, IMHO.

Yes, even Tower of Terror and Big Thunder Mountain pause for a few moments to see some details. I have only been on Indy a few times but I don't remember it pausing much. I guess I have to go back and ride it some more:)

[WDWHound]

If I recal correctly, Indy pauses in the main room only twice, once on the bridge and once in front of the snake (and I'm not sure about the snake). The other pauses take place in the tunnels off the main room (the dark room, the boulder room and a couple of others).

[indigo]

I don't think the calm dark ride's days are over. In fact, I think the themed environment of the future will place a large demand for them. As technology increases entertainment will become more and more 360, more real (although using virtual reality technology). Guests will need a 'transition space' to help them leave the everyday world behind. Dark rides and omnimover like vehicles provide the perfect transition.

Additionally, dark rides will also be needed as entertainment for the whole family. 3 year olds won't wear 3-D glasses, so the ride has to be built 3-D.

[aalan]

isnt ak a long, slow, dark ride? heh-heh, just kidding.....

[daannzzz]

20,000 Leagues Under the Sead at Disney Sea is a new dark ride. It seems to be on a large scale though it isn't as long. Maybe it is to be considered inbetween. I personally get more excited riding a slower moving vehical into a well and extensively themed environment filled with characters, sets, and effects than speeding through a well themed environment with not alot going on because you can't catch it all at that speed. Splash Mountian is a great comprimise between the two genres and I hope Disney can continue more in that vein without giving up on the dark ride completely.

[YoHo]

I wouldn't expect a new slow moving E-Ticket Dark ride in the Near future, because as Scoop hints in another thread, the numbers dictate otherwise, but you know statistics can be used to prove anything 97% of people know that. What is really needed is some imagineers who really believe in the concept and a company willing to install it. I suspect that right now today we have niether. The Disney of today seems content to let spinners and Mouse coasters be their more tame rides. a sad state of affairs in my opinion.

As I've said before, Perhaps AK could creat boat or ride based animal interactions that would "thrill" in that way.

[Captain Crook]

And Yoho, that would really be a better concept at AK than BK as it would draw on the type of folks most likely to appreciate the AK philosophy whilst one big new coaster would draw people to AK to ride that one big new coaster and then leave...

But doesn't Indy & Dinosaur present hope for more variations on the modern dark ride (which I consider them to be)?
:smooth: :smooth: :bounce: :smooth: :smooth:

[YoHo]

Quite true that Indy and Dinosaur present a healthy new take on an old Favorite, but ultimatly, they still have height restrictions and the like. and when Dinosaur was tamed down to reduce those restrictions, it's popularity fell as well.

There has to be a happy medium. something more family friendly.

[Captain Crook]

Agreed. But it's just getting to that next step...I guess that has most of us bugged a little (and some a lot!)...
:smooth: :smooth: :bounce: :smooth: :smooth:

[King Triton]

Disney needs more dark rides. Epcot hasn't been the same since Horizons and World of Motion were taken out.

Disney is famous for the dark rides - I say build MORE!

King Triton