Which would be better proof of time to submit?

[lenshanem]

I'm thinking about signing up for the full for 2011. Should I submit a 10K I have with a 10:38 pace or my last half (at Disney in 2009) which was 11:13? I'm assuming the 10K, but I don't know if they take into account that was a shorter distance. I just want to be up as far as I can so I can have that extra time buffer given this will be my first full. Thanks for any advise! :goodvibes

[syko]

I would send in the fastest time you have now.
You can always send them an updated time later on.

[lenshanem]

I would send in the fastest time you have now.
You can always send them an updated time later on.

So fastest time regardless of race length? Thanks!

[syko]

I do, if I have a 1/2 that works out faster pace than a full then I send that one.

When I get a faster one during the year, I send that in hoping to get a lower bib number.

[cewait]

What time are you projecting?

from the website

PROOF OF TIME

If you believe you will finish the Half Marathon in less than 2:45 hours or the Marathon in less than 5:00 hours, proof of time is required for start corral placement.


I would just put 5:00 on the entry and have fun with your first marathon. You do not need a proof for a projected 5 hour marathon. Here's what you have

10k - 1:05 projects a 5:09 marathon
Half - 2:56 projects a 6:11 marathon

Your time proofs don't put you into the times requiring proof, yet. Work on speed and hill work to improve your times and run a really hard 10k later in the spring or early fall. If your 10k hits a sub hour race, then amend you time with Disney.

This is probably not what you want to hear but Disney is using the same or similar formula to project times as I am. Hope this helps

[lenshanem]

Thanks Charles. Is there a projected calculator link somewhere?

My Disney half was actually 2:26:57. And my 10K 1:06:02.

When I did the Disney half in 2009 I submitted a 10K time of 1:08:08 and they put me in Corral B Wave 1. I assumed this was because of the time I submitted? Doesn't it help some?

[syko]

http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/4/4_1/96.shtml


http://www.runnersworld.com/cda/finishtimecalculator/0,7160,s6-239-283-316-0-0-0-0-0,00.html

[lenshanem]

OK, I just found http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/mcmillanrunningcalculator.htm

Weird! I put in my 10K time and for a half it projects 2:26:57. I did the Disney half in 2:26:56!!! You're correct, it has me projected at 5:09:53 for a full.

[cewait]

Here is a link to the easiest one to use. It also provides workout paces that may be helpful as you train. (turn you speakers down if at work)

http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/mcmillanrunningcalculator.htm

There are several out there some bias better for low mileage runners than high and vica versa.

My bad on the half time... sometimes my math is bad. I am actually glad to see the better time as it confirms the 10k time. Both produce similar results. in the 5:05-5:10 range

You really have nothing to fear with your current pace. Though as a coach I would have you focus more on finishing that finish times. It's not always easy to do but the added 13 miles is a lot tougher than it seems on the surface.

[timmac]

You really have nothing to fear with your current pace. Though as a coach I would have you focus more on finishing that finish times. It's not always easy to do but the added 13 miles is a lot tougher than it seems on the surface.

I agree on both points, for what it's worth. Your pace is plenty fast enough that you don't need to worry about the extra few minutes you'll get from the earlier placement. Your current abilities, assuming you train on the longer distances... you will have no trouble staying well ahead of the 7 hour limit.

I believe it's actually a 5:30 finish, though, that doesn't need the proof of time.

[cewait]

I believe it's actually a 5:30 finish, though, that doesn't need the proof of time.

That's incorrect....

I cut and pasted in my earlier post from the website. I just verified at Active based on this post. The full time has remained constant since I have been coming in 1999. The half time of 2:45 has changed over the years (was 2:30 or shorter in the early days) to a longer period based on the evolving popularity of the half and the new tighter start of the half.

[timmac]

That's incorrect....

I cut and pasted in my earlier post from the website. I just verified at Active based on this post. The full time has remained constant since I have been coming in 1999. The half time of 2:45 has changed over the years (was 2:30 or shorter in the early days) to a longer period based on the evolving popularity of the half and the new tighter start of the half.

I shouldn't have doubted you. Your original suggestion is probably as good as it gets then. Put down a 5 hour projected finish and be done with it.

[lenshanem]

The Runner's World prediction is way faster. Wow, so different!

I find it very weird that the McMillan is so dead on in my 10K and half times. I put in either race time and they match exactly to what I did in the other race almost to the second!

So that is a bummer McMillan estimates me over 5:00. I'm positive I'll go over 5:00, I just really wanted to be a little farther up in the corrals. I know I shouldn't be worried about being further back, but since I've never run a full I still worry something might happen and I like the feeling of having that time buffer!

I see in the Disney half I ran in 2009 even with my slower 10K time I submitted back then I was still under their time of 2:45. So maybe that is why I got placed a little further up.

Are you fairly certain they use something similar to McMillan? If I went with Runner's World prediction it would be 4:39:03! :lmao:

I'm still a tad bummed!

I will have DH running with me to help pace me. He just ran a 40 mile trail race so I have faith in him. :hug:

Thanks for the advise.

[cewait]

The Runner's World prediction is way faster. Wow, so different!

I find it very weird that the McMillan is so dead on in my 10K and half times. I put in either race time and they match exactly to what I did in the other race almost to the second!

So that is a bummer McMillan estimates me over 5:00. I'm positive I'll go over 5:00, I just really wanted to be a little farther up in the corrals. I know I shouldn't be worried about being further back, but since I've never run a full I still worry something might happen and I like the feeling of having that time buffer!

I see in the Disney half I ran in 2009 even with my slower 10K time I submitted back then I was still under their time of 2:45. So maybe that is why I got placed a little further up.

Are you fairly certain they use something similar to McMillan? If I went with Runner's World prediction it would be 4:39:03! :lmao:

I'm still a tad bummed!

I will have DH running with me to help pace me. He just ran a 40 mile trail race so I have faith in him. :hug:

Thanks for the advise.

Seriously you are talking about the differnce of 10 minute buffer versus a 12 minute buffer from the last person to start. You are only looking at a one corral move. If you have an issue that will chew up 10 minutes you will more than likely chew up the 12 minutes.

Your TRUE buffer is in pace. You could be the last starter and run into an issue at mile 20 and still have plenty of time (2+hours) to make the end.

The real reason to get obsessed about corrals is if you are 3-5 too far back. Then you are expending a lot of energy to work around slower folks. As a first timer I would have you slide to the back of the corral you are in anyway to force you to slow up the first mile or two. The number one rookie mistake on course for a marathon is posting a fast mile 1 interval.

As a coach I will remind you of your three goals in a first marathon...finish, finish upright and finish with a smile

Back to the calculators, I think you saw yesterday the validity of the McMillan calculator in comparing your 10k and half times.

[Duanerice]

Another point to consider. If I am not mistaken, for the entries that do not supply proof or are over the proof cut off of 5:00 they start putting you into corrals based on when you sign up.

My old boss is a 4 hour marathoner and last year he was in the last corral because he didn't sign up until the very last minute and didn't send proof.

So, the sooner you sign up the better your corral if over a 5:00 pace.

enjoy,
Duane

[cewait]

Another point to consider. If I am not mistaken, for the entries that do not supply proof or are over the proof cut off of 5:00 they start putting you into corrals based on when you sign up.

My old boss is a 4 hour marathoner and last year he was in the last corral because he didn't sign up until the very last minute and didn't send proof.

So, the sooner you sign up the better your corral if over a 5:00 pace.

enjoy,
Duane

Duane, great point. I have avoided saying this on forums but if you sign up as a 5 hour marathoner even expecting a 7 hour event you will be placed better than a person who says 7 hours on the form. I hate to say this too loudly as the folks who are really 5 hour folks will get penalized. Since the 5 hour estimates are a large percentage of runners it then goes by entry date.

The tail of a start are thsoe who predicted a 4:59 or less and did not furnish supporting proof.

[lenshanem]

That makes sense Charles.
I usually try to place myself further back than my DH. Course, last race I placed myself too far back and spent the first mile or so trying to go around people. I see what you mean.

Thanks for the tip Duane. I'll sign up soon then.

I'll just plan on putting 5:00 down, send in my 10K time and if I run a faster race before then I'll email it in.

Honestly, I'm just hoping to finish. My time goal is pretty vast. :lmao:
Just worrying about those sweepers... Ya know, this is the unknown for me!

[JoanneNC]

Thanks Charles. Is there a projected calculator link somewhere?

My Disney half was actually 2:26:57. And my 10K 1:06:02.

When I did the Disney half in 2009 I submitted a 10K time of 1:08:08 and they put me in Corral B Wave 1. I assumed this was because of the time I submitted? Doesn't it help some?

I really don't get their Coral assignments

I had a 1:02 10k that I submitted and my bib was assigned to Coral E
I went to runner relations questioning this and they said that put me in Coral C. I asked if I submitted my last hm time of 2:16 would change that and they said nope, still Coral C.. So interesting how you were assigned to B...

[lenshanem]

I really don't get their Coral assignments

I had a 1:02 10k that I submitted and my bib was assigned to Coral E
I went to runner relations questioning this and they said that put me in Coral C. I asked if I submitted my last hm time of 2:16 would change that and they said nope, still Coral C.. So interesting how you were assigned to B...

I signed up the first week. Maybe that is why???

[JoanneNC]

I signed up the first week. Maybe that is why???

ahh could be for sure

[cewait]

Thanks Charles. Is there a projected calculator link somewhere?

My Disney half was actually 2:26:57. And my 10K 1:06:02.

When I did the Disney half in 2009 I submitted a 10K time of 1:08:08 and they put me in Corral B Wave 1. I assumed this was because of the time I submitted? Doesn't it help some?



I really don't get their Coral assignments

I had a 1:02 10k that I submitted and my bib was assigned to Coral E
I went to runner relations questioning this and they said that put me in Coral C. I asked if I submitted my last hm time of 2:16 would change that and they said nope, still Coral C.. So interesting how you were assigned to B...

Joanne, you really cannot compare year after year corral assignments in the half, especially after the split of the half from the full in 2006. They are toying around with the corrals and waves each and every start in an effort to give everyone the best start they can. It also depends on the mix of runners in any given year. WIth the influx of 5000 extra half runners and 5000 extra goofy registrants I believe there were more speedier folks registering for the half this year. Your 2:16 was a C corral this year but would have been a B in 2009.

For the record your 1:02 10k and 2:16 half are essentially the same race pace.

[lenshanem]

Just to clarify, you can still drop down and run in a later corral, correct? I was getting ready to sign us up, but hesitated when I started to put in DH's predicted finishing time. It is quite a bit faster than mine. :lmao:

[cewait]

Just to clarify, you can still drop down and run in a later corral, correct? I was getting ready to sign us up, but hesitated when I started to put in DH's predicted finishing time. It is quite a bit faster than mine. :lmao:

Yes you can always start in a slower corral.

[lenshanem]

Thanks guys. I'm all set and registered! :thumbsup2

[cewait]

sweeet - now all you got to do is train!