Stop! Just Back. Have cutbacks affected the Magic, too?

[nebo]

Hi, this is not your usual trip report, at least it's sure not mine.

This brief thread is not meant to discourage you in any way concerning an upcoming trip you have, it is just here to share some observations that I have made on a recent trip, that's all. If you are like many people, and don't wish to read any in the slightest bit disparaging concerning DisneyWorld, read no further, I will understand.

SO, have the cutbacks had any effect on the magic and pixie dust?

In a word, absolutely.

and, a little.

Let me explain;
If you have never been to the World before, have no fear, you more than likely will not notice anything missing.

However, if you are like us, true Disney veterans, you will either do as I ended up doing, making notes of all the changes, or, on your return back home, think that "Gee, something just didn't seem right, it just wasn't as magical this time."

We are true Disney Fanatics, taken 12 trips from northern Illinois in the last 7 years, driven down most of the times. When we aren't in the World, I am reading any new guide book that comes to press so there isn't too much that we haven't read about and seen.

I have made a list of ten things that came to mind after the trip, and many of them you will scoff at and say, "Big deal". But with Disney it is the small things that make the place so special, and even though crowds are much smaller now, I hope the situation gets turned around soon and goes back to normal.

This is based on a 3 night stay at Caribbean Beach, and an 8 night stay at Pop Century, with free dining.

So, the list.

1. Slower buses. I don't care if the parks aren't near as crowded, the resorts are pretty much booked solid thanks to all the incentives offered, and those are the folks that nead the service.
You won't notice it in the morning, and not too much at park closing, but God help you if you want to leave Epcot at noon and go back for a swim, if you have a car you will learn quickly enough to use it instead of the bus service, that right there takes some pixie dust away from my trip.

Food issues:
2. One of the reasons we booked Pop, over All Star Music was the frozen cokes and frozen raspberry pop you get at Pop for your re-fillable mug. I couldn't believe that somehow I have missed any mention on any site that they have been removed. The cast member told me they have been gone a few months now.

3. Aside from the greasy bag of fries I used to get when I was a kid in Chicago, the very best fries I have ever had in my life were found at the Siesta snack and pool bar at Coronado Springs. They were huge steak fries, just a llittle greasy, lotsa salty and we made a point to take some time and stop at one of our favorite resorts, if just for the fries.
Well, they weren't a snack credit, which I didn't care, the problem is, like the frozen Coke, they don't exist anymore. Now you get the same kind of fries that you get at any of the food courts.

4. I think in the last 6 trips, we have failed to eat at Flame Tree BBQ in Animal Kingdom only once, we like it there so much. It still has the best seating at any counter service stand, many hidden gazebos and tables down by the river.
Here's the rub;
If you ordered the half slab of ribs, it used to come with a cup of baked beans and a small chunk of corn on the cob. The last couple of times there the corn/cob was replaced with a corn muffin, a step down. Now, even the muffin is gone, you get a small cup of cole slaw instead.

In the parks;

5. Man-made waits. We had a fastpass for Jungle Cruise, used it around 4 P.M. The entire courtyard in front was empty, yet the sign said ten minutes for standby. Up near the boarding area, the fastpass line was much longer then I ever thought possible, and one guy next to me in standby said he's arlready waited for 20 minutes. We soon found the reason why, they were only running 3 boats!

I know this is probably embarrasing to Disney to have "walk on" attractions, but if you are fortunate enough, or have worked hard enough to pull the right strings that can get you on a Disney trip in a Value season, you shouldn't have to wait for rides like it's in the middle of July.
This was also noticable on Big Thunder, and in some of the "continuous' shows, like Laugh Floor. With the latter, that holding area wasn't going to be let into the theater until it was full.
By restricting the amount of boats/train/ride vehicles/showtimes, they can then infuse a false sense of popularity for the attraction by building lines.

6. This next point sounds ridiculous, even as I write it, but if it's not true then my feelings must be contagious because my wife was in total agreement.

Lighting.
Specifically, attraction lighting, especially in the dark rides.

I have always had a hard time seeing in the dark rides. From Dinosaur to Peter Pan and all in between, I always save them for last, when it becomes dark out, much easier to see if you're not sun-blind.

We rode Pirates well after sunset and it was a major chore to even find Jack Sparrow inside. I remember a time when you could actually see the hairs on the pirates leg hanging down from the bridge your boat passes under. Now, you're lucky if you can even see the leg!
I don't know if most of the lighting is on a rheostat/dimmer switch or if they have to go around and change the bulbs to a smaller wattage, but I'm sure with the way Disney watches the budget it could be a sizeable savings after a while in the electric bill.

Pirates of the Caribbean wasn't the only culprit, in Splash Mountain the Laughing Place seemed almost non-existent, if the jumping fountains were still there you couldn't tell because you couldn't see them, it was so dark there.

7. Here, was almost a deal breaker for me, the most disappointing observation.

The fireworks!
I have been a huge fan of both Wishes and Illuminations, if you have never seen them before, or maybe only once, you won't notice a thing.

While most of the shows are choreagraphed to music, there isn't much they can change to save money, the shells have to go off at a designated time. The finale is another story!
Instead of hundreds of shells going off at once filling the sky during Wishes, it seemed to be cut in half. The timing was still there matching Jiminy and the music, just nowhere near as impressive as it was.

During Illuminations the same thing has happened. Plus in the beginning of the show, the barge that ignites the propane that creates the effect of rolling flames across the lagoon has severly been cut back, now it seems like a grill that has been knocked over.

In the resorts;

8. The big check-in day at Disney is Sunday, we checked into Pop on a Wednsday. No Magical Express bus had pulled up, only four people in line ahead of us. All four of those people checked in using the same teller, as she was the only one manning a window. A twenty minute wait to check in with these few people in front of us is ridiculous.

9. Cleanliness.
While the parks all still seemed totally **** and span to me, not so at the resorts, in particular Pop Century. Tables in the food court took forever to be cleaned, the designated smoking areas were disasters, overflowing garbage cans,,,,,,,,,,, part of the reason for some of this uncleanliness is going to lead to the final observation I made.

10. The guests

I truly hesitate to bring this last issue up, I think no matter how I try it's going to sound snooty, some may be offended, or I just may come across as a real jerk. Trust me please, from my 3 years as a dis member and a year lurking before I joined, this doesn't apply to any of you.

In all walks of life, from inner city neighborhoods, to Pleasant Valley suburbia, to overseas foreigners to folks from real rural areas, (say those last words three times fast), there are different classes of people. Race, nationality, or even religeon have little to do with it. And it's not just education, but that and how you were brought up.

And let's face it, some folks just don't get it, while others are just jerks.

Have you ever spent time in an All Star Resort during Pop Warner week?

We have, and believe me, it's not a good time to be there.

This is what I believe has happened, as convoluted as it's going to sound.

Many of the true Disney followers spend great deals of their time on the Dis, All Ears, Mousesavers, Mouseplanet and so forth watching out for special codes and deals. And when they are released, we jump on them.

And over the last year and a half, there have been almost continuous deals available, not to mention special PIN codes many of us have received, and we book until our budget just can't afford another trip.

Well, this main, "secret code fan base" is just about all spent out, and now the "secret" codes are shown on TV five times every night.

Remember when if you didn't know the code, the Central Office Ressy taker wouldn't help you? Not anymore, they want to fill the rooms.

On our first night at Pop, two families with adjoing rooms about 4 doors down from us on the second floor decided the room wasn't big enough, so moved all the chairs and the kids out onto the shared walkway.
At 11 at night.

Then the kids were told if they wanted to play hide and seek or tag, just to stay on the second floor, this went on until 12:30, the entire time all the adults were smoking just outside their room.
I'm not sure if someone complained eventually, but soon all the kids were gone, no, not to bed, they were down in the bowling pin pool, screaming and hollering. At two in the morning they were finally shooed away.

This is not the kind of thing that bothers me, when I sleep it takes a lot to wake me, but not so my wife.
It gets better.

This may have been their last night, don't recall seeing them again but it does show the lack of respect these folks had for others. Did I mention I counted ten of them in two rooms that sleep four each?

On the morning after our second night, we were awaken by 4 cast members outside our door. It was barely six in the morning, still pitch black out but there they were, in full uniforms and all talking on walky talkies.

A half hour later when I left to go have a smoke they were still there, they appeared to be fixated on the room 3 doors down from us. (hmm, good name for a band), I tried to overhear what they were saying but they all clammed up when I stood there leaning over the railing, so I went down to the smoking area.

When I came back they were still there, another hour later, they were gone.

My wife then went out and called me to join her.
Apparently, there had been a terrible fight in that room that night, surprised we didn't hear it, but they had pilons set up in front of the window with a bucket in between.

The bucket was filled with the broken glass made from the huge hole in the picture window. Not sure if it came from a fist, a thrown bottle, or what, never did find out but believe me, it was a first for us at Disney.

What I am getting at, is all the fans have used the specials, and are basically spent out, the hidden codes that we used to use are still there, not booked up like before and folks that never dreamed of being able to go to DisneyWorld are now going after seeing the ads on tv every night.

I'm sorry, these are not the people that worship the ground Mickey walks on, just those that are there cuz it's "cheap."

For the next 2 nights we had a cast member actually patrolling our floor on a Segway.

From people smoking wherever they wanted, to families filling up half gallon containers in the food court fountains it was obvious that something had changed.

One last observation on the people;
In our total of 15 trips down to Disney, it wasn't until our last trip in February that we came across a "code brown."
A code brown is when they have to close the pool because someone, to put it bluntly, had taken a dump in it.

In an hour and a half sitting by the Hippy Dippy Pool, we had TWO code browns. They closed the pool, removed the offending "snickers bar", 45 minutes later they re-opened the pool, then, 20 minutes later had to do it all again.

I left and went swimming in my bathtub.

Ok, I guess I am done. I'm sorry if this information casts a palor on an upcoming trip, please, don't let it, you will still have a great time. Those of you who know me and have read my trip reports know that almost all of my focus is on making people laugh, and praising the virtues of DisneyWorld. Much of what happened at Pop could have been isolated incidences, but maybe, if enough of us complain and talk about it, they will right the ship.


nebo

[nebo]

By the way, your comments and your own observations are appreciated.

[ashleykinkade]

we are leaving for our 1st trip ever in 12 days! and i REALLY hope that we don't encounter any fighting or floating snickers in the pool (that's just nasty!). I am especially shocked @ the fighting!!!! we are going to wdw for some magical family time not to bash each others heads in!!!! :rotfl:

[Dizzymrslizzy]

As someone who has worked as a lifeguard for many many years. My only comment is that "Code Browns" happen wherever you go. 95% of the time it's caused by a toddler or young child. It happens at every pool you go to, and some places are better about it than others.

As for the rest of your post. I'm going in 2 weeks so I have no observations. We'll see I guess 8:o)

[Sandy321]

OH ITA!! and its hard to say this on this board - better put on your flame proof suit!!

1. The "ever" changing of the Menus - where is it written that all the food in Disney now must be the "same"? Go to the buffets - same desserts! Prime Rib - now admittedly the "prime rib" that restuarants use for the all u can eat specials arent the same bone in prime rib high quality - but its now GONE - replaced by a tough cut of roast beef...

there are a lot of the food examples - but like Nebo said, if you didnt know, you wont miss it!

A nice person on the restaurant board did a review of her last time at Boma - she went several times a month - then she noticed the dumbing down of their menus... and posted about it...

2. Pinnochio Haus menu - the figaro fries.... etc

3. Main Street Bakery - French Toast Loaf...

4. creme brulee is EVERYWHERE!! and one poster wanted it at DTD Wolf Gang Express, and they were told that the 'shipment hadnt come in yet' :scared1:

5 The chairs at Pecos Bills - they have no backs!

6. Le Cellier - now that used to be heavenly - the steak was out of this world, now it just depends... and there are so many reviews that dont understand why everyone wants to go here - :confused3

7. Goofy Candy DTD - you used to be able to get 3 pretzels dipped, drizzeld and coated - on the snack plan (under $4) now its 1 pretzel, 1 dip. Why even bother to go there now?

8 Key Lime Pie - I dont know what it is on the buffets from Cape May to Crystal Palace - and other places in between, but it is made with sweetened condensed milk

9. Birthday Cakes - read that thread. After last years fiasco of ordering a cake last year for DD birthday I decided maybe we should skip it - but I've been reading the cake thread- I cant believe that people are willing to throw away over $100 for a special cake, and some can get it, for less, and special fondants etc... but most others are turned down - the whole process is odd - esp in "what will you celebrate" year!

10. DDP - the prices are going up - and the quality of food is coming down

[mmeb144]

Wow! Nebo, I'm glad you're not afraid to tell it like it is! I appreciate your honesty. I'm in the middle of planning our trip to WDW in December during Christmas week. Oh boy, I can hardly wait to see what the cutbacks will impact during the busiest week of the year. Fortunately, it's not our first visit to the parks.

[Backstage_Gal]

It's called "productivity" and its a sad state of affairs

[OhMari]

Hey,
I used to be that person that "had" to stay on property
"eat" in only Disney resturants and never leave the property.
I found out how easy it is to "staying off property" now.
10 years ago, it was a nitemare driving around outside of the grounds, with small roads, and all the road construction.
The highway and roads in Orlando and the surrounding area are nuts, but easy to navigate and drive.
(If you can do downtown Chicago & Atlanta, these roads are a breeze.)
Plus there are great resturants for 1/2 the price.
I think many of us faithful, if we still want to keep going to WDW, have to venture back out of the grounds and take our cars, money and even stay off site. It's not bad out there anymore and me and my dh were impressed with some of the resturants and the place we stayed off site.

[happymommy]

Wow - I am surprised to hear about Goofy's candy company - one pretzel now instead of 3. I have honestly never been there, but would love to take my kids now (DS used to be allergic to milk but can have some now, so would have loved the pretzels in chocolate).

I do think when the dining plan came out, within a few years some things did go downhill. We've only used it once, and did love it, but previously would prefer to pay as we go, and get what we want. The prices now are quite high - especially buffets, and we aren't big eaters. Especially in Yakitori House in Japan, the quality is poorer but the price higher than before. (They don't even serve Yakitori there - haven't for years! Need a name change.).

I agree though - if you are going, don't let this dampen your spirit. It's still a wonderful place to visit, and I love the family atmosphere. Just definitely plan ahead! With the dining plan, and the free dining, you really will have to plan on sit down meals ahead of time more than ever! We used to call from my cell phone midday and see what was available, and always got dinner somewhere. Now we still can get dinner somewhere, just it may not be where we want. So do plan!

At AKL we had a code brown also. It can happen anywhere, but as a rule, we don't go back in the pool that day, or at least for a few hours. It just sounds too icky to me. And we are total resort snobs, so always stay deluxe or the Swan. That a resort is less expensive really doesn't excuse such horrible behavior, though! Yikes, a fight.

Anyway, thanks for the observations. I do hope the small things improve, like more fireworks, when the economy does. Don't thing they'll up the pretzels for snacks, though, as once something is taken away, it's usually gone for good.

[Tessarakt]

Report this stuff! Report report report ... Tell everyone at Disney about the problems ... there's a couple I need to report myself.

All restaurants change their menus, it just happens. It sucks, but that's just life.

I totally feel you on the idiots you had to deal with at your resort though ... we used to live on a street filled with those idiots. Hated it. Couldn't move fast enough and thank God we finally did. I hope you complained to whoever's in charge at the resort ... and a lot. I can't stand people that think the world revolves around them and/or they're the only people in the place.

Unfortunately things have to be cut back, but I think Disney has done a pretty good job at not ruining it in the process. So far anyway ...
Everyone is having to cut back, and I just thank heavens we still were able to go this year because my kids LOVED it, and we can't wait to get back.

[PrincessV]

Hey Nebo?

:worship::worship::worship:

You've summed it up so well. I live within 2 hours of WDW and have frequented it for nearly 20 years. I'm talking some years in which we were there every single weekend. It's been a relatively slow, gradual change, but when I compare WDW today to WDW when I first moved to FL... well, it's a very, very different place.

I agree; to the first-time visitor, the changes are invisible. Probably, too, for the 2, 3, 4 time visitor. It's still a fun place - I wouldn't keep going back if it wasn't. But a lot of my habits have changed: I drive almost exclusively to avoid the bus system; I'm eating at fewer and fewer TS restaurants because I can't stomach paying exorbitant prices for mediocre food; I do everything in my own power to mitigate any possibility of a screw-up on WDW's part... because chances are very slim that they'll fix it. :sad2:

[iuki]

[QUOTE=nebo;33552015]Hi, this is not your usual trip report, at least it's sure not mine.

This brief thread is not meant to discourage you in any way concerning an upcoming trip you have, it is just here to share some observations that I have made on a recent trip, that's all. If you are like many people, and don't wish to read any in the slightest bit disparaging concerning DisneyWorld, read no further, I will understand.

SO, have the cutbacks had any effect on the magic and pixie dust?

In a word, absolutely.

Thanks for the honest report. We just got back last Friday.

We also noticed the "subliminal" changes you mentioned, i.e., the bus service, menu changes, and difficulty seeing in the dark areas of theme rides.

The one thing that has been consistent at Disney Resorts is their mousekeeping service. It has always been bad. We always found something from the previous occupants that the mousekeeping staff never seemed to find. This time it was a dirty sock on the floor and two hair ties.

Although we do not expect our sheets to be changed every day, with the poor mousekeeping, I wonder if our sheets were changed upon the checkout of previous occupants.

On one occasion, our bathtub wasn't even cleaned while we were there (POFQ).

However, like you, overall, we enjoy staying on Disney property and have booked our next vacation on the bounceback program.

If anyone wonders why we would still stay at POFQ despite the poor housekeeping, it's because I used to travel a lot when I was working, and over 90% of all lodging establishments have poor housekeeping. No matter where someone goes on vacation, there is no "perfect" vacation.

But yes, Disney has had major cutbacks. During the early part of the year, Disney laid off 1400 employees. Two of those employees were entertainers, one for 12 years and one for 6 years. Because they had been at Disney for so long, they made more money than new employees; therefore, they were let go and Disney hired "new" employees at lower wages. People forget that Disney is a "business."

Anyway, we still enjoy Disney as they do provide family fun and do try to please customers. The few rude CMs that do exist, won't last long at Disney. There are too many great CMs that overshadow some of the complaints that we have.

Nebo - I thought your honest trip report was done with great consideration for all Disney patrons.

Have a magical day.

iuki
:surfweb:

[MICKEY4EVER!]

I, too, appreciate your honesty. Your observations and opinions are your own and frankly, I believe, this is information that we needed to hear.

You are not being snobby by talking about the newest visitors at Disney. I've also noticed all of the deals being advertised on TV every other commercial break. It is being made more affordable for everyone to go, so a higher class vacation, cannot be expected. I guess that sounds snobby, but many of you on here know what I mean and how I meant that. :goodvibes

Yeah, the broken glass b/c someone had a fight - that doesn't sound very Disney at all. Totally not anyone at Disney's fault, but still, not what you expect to see at the happiest place on earth! :laughing:

[inkedupmomma]

Nebo, I have to agree with you 100% especially on the people thing. Again, also not to sound like a snob, BUT there seemed to be a whole lot of trashy people on our past trip (Just got back Tuesday night). Even my husband asked me what was going on. Our trip was magnificent, but I agree, there were so many changes. Little things, but the little things are what seem to count the most!

I appreciate your honesty!:thumbsup2

[happymommy]

Come to think of it, the first year (1993) that my DH and I stayed at the GF, the housekeeping set out a huge basket outside the room daily filled with our fresh sheets and such. It was so nice - they always turned our bed down also, without asking. They didn't even use maid carts there - everyone got a basket. It was those little touches that set the GF apart back then.

In about 2002 or 2003 (I forget) but I think it was 2003, we stayed in the north garden wing of the CR. Only reason was we got the $120 a night deal with the SOG. I literally had to use all our towels (wet them, then used them to clean) to clean up the dried up pee from behind the toilet - the whole bathroom stunk when we checked in so bad like a nasty truckstop bathroom. Now, granted, that whole wing was slated to be torn down, and it was only occupied with military - the whole clientele was very icky (and my husband is/was miliatary, I don't get it though, at other military R&R places they weren't so icky rude) but they should have cleaned the toilet from about 6 months!

This past December we stayed at the BWI, and I had originally requested the VIP clean (DS has asthma), but then called back to take away that request (in case they could upgrade us, even for a fee, not looking for a free upgrade). When we checked in, they said we had to wait for our room, as they were doing the VIP clean. I told them I had taken off that request. They were very difficult, and said there was nothing they could do (but they also said they could have upgraded us to CL but we had the VIP request). I was so annoyed, but oh well, the room (when we finally got in) was spotless and my son didn't need his nebulizer once.

[metime]

Back on track...

Nebo,

I enjoyed your report and thought that you were genuine in your observations and feelings . Thanks for taking the time to communicate all the things you noticed. I really found it informative especially coming from someone who has been enough to draw a very good comparison of "then" vs. "now".

So are you planning to return soon or are you going to wait until the economy leads to a more magical experience?

[appleorchard]

Also just back, and agree with many of your observations. Among the few that really bothered me:

2. Lack of pertinent info from CMs. We got off a bus at PI and walked over to the Marketplace. At no time did the bus driver mention that the bus stop at the Marketplace was closed and we could only get back on a bus at the PI stop. I felt REALLY sorry for the poor CM who had to tell all the irate people at 11pm that they had to walk back to PI to catch a bus.
3.This sounds petty, but the attitude of some CMs handing out candy at MNSSHP. We were 3 adults with one child, and we all felt we were getting a real attitude from the CMs about standing there with our bags out. Hey, we paid our money--we wanted our candy too!
4. The inability of some CMs to efficiently handle check ins, mostly at restaurants. Why on earth does it take 5 minutes per person to sign in at Chef Mickeys? Is it a lack of training?

We love Disney, are DVC members and are unhappy and a little nervous with the slip in services, the decline in restaurant offerings, and the subtle and not so subtle cuts over the last year. We still love Disney, but if this continues, the Disney magic will be less compelling for us.

[OhMari]

Every stop! No more discussion, debating, opinions about ECV!
This isn't a debate board.
Nor, name calling board.
If you have a problem with me deleting this subject,
please e-mail admin@wdwinfo.com

[MICKEY4EVER!]

Every stop! No more discussion, debating, opinions about ECV!
This isn't a debate board.
Name calling board.
If you have a problem with me deleting this subject,
please e-mail admin@wdwinfo.com

Thanks, Marissa! Totally got off topic!

[ejud]

Hi!



As to the main topic of this thread, I recently noticed a huge downgrade in what used to be one of the very few treats I could enjoy in the parks (food allergies), the Minnie Bar. This was a companion to the Mickey Bar, and was a frozen strawberry bar, with Minnie label. It was unbelievable! It was virtually solid crushed and frozen strawberries!

This has now been replaced by a standard name-brand bar that is about 50% strawberry and the rest water and sugar- or so it seems.

Price is the same.

:)

Jud
http://youtube.com/ejud2001

[heaven2dc]

Come to think of it, the first year (1993) that my DH and I stayed at the GF, the housekeeping set out a huge basket outside the room daily filled with our fresh sheets and such. It was so nice - they always turned our bed down also, without asking. They didn't even use maid carts there - everyone got a basket. It was those little touches that set the GF apart back then.

Did that mean you had to change your own sheets or just that if you needed extra sheets, they provided them every day? Sorry if I'm asking a stupid queston!

This past December we stayed at the BWI, and I had originally requested the VIP clean (DS has asthma), but then called back to take away that request (in case they could upgrade us, even for a fee, not looking for a free upgrade). When we checked in, they said we had to wait for our room, as they were doing the VIP clean. I told them I had taken off that request. They were very difficult, and said there was nothing they could do (but they also said they could have upgraded us to CL but we had the VIP request). I was so annoyed, but oh well, the room (when we finally got in) was spotless and my son didn't need his nebulizer once.

That was great that they gave the VIP cleaning but not so great you had to wait for your room. btw what dates were you there? We were staying at BWV w/boardwalk view 12/13-20/08.

[scrap4u]

Hey Nebo! Thanks so much for hitting the nail on the head! We got back on 9/12 and friends have asked me how the trip was. I say it was good. We had a lot of fun. They say good? Not great? Well it didn't feel great and I couldn't think of why.

Now I know! For exactly the reasons you said!

Both DH and I agreed that our food was fine but there wasn't one outstanding meal the whole time. And we ate dinner at Cali Grill, Le Cellier (they burned my steak), Boma, Jiko, 1900 Park Faire and 'Ohana. Really 1900 Park Faire and 'Ohana were probably the best dinners we had.

We spent 2 nights at AKL and 7 nights at the Contemporary. We used online check-in for both and that was quick and painless. Our rooms were ready both times and we didn't have any problems with mousekeeping.

Our last few nights at the Contemporary--a large group of maybe high school kids--maybe college freshman were checking in about 11p with some adults. They just happened to end up on the 10th floor with us and for a short while kept yelling up and down the halls to each other.

Another night a family checked into the room next to us and they came into their room about midnight and started yelling at their child and talking very loudly to each other. We had an adjoining room and could hear everything they said.

We were reading and watching the tv turned down low so I guess they couldn't hear us and had no idea we could hear them. But come on--yelling at the kid that late at night? Someone is going to hear it. Just plain rudeness.

We were at MNSSHP on 9/4 waiting in line to see Snow White and her 7 little friends. Been in line 20 minutes or so. If you've ever had this picture taken you know--1 picture only--no autographs--no photopass photog--hurry hurry!

It was our turn to get pic with Snow et all. I was handing my camera to the CM to take our pic and all of a sudden a girl about 10 walks up to Snow White and her dad jumps in to take a picture of her. These were not the people waiting in line behind us. They were just some random people walking around that thought waiting in line wasn't required of them. The poor CMs looked befuddled and we all just let the rude family get their picture and get out of the way. At least the CMs apologized to us for the problem but the dad never said anything. Just grabbed his kid and walked away.

Again, these things could happen anywhere in any park. I've had the late night noises happen on cruise ships and all kind of places. But it's those things on top of things not being quite so "magical" that was the let down I think.

We'll still go back. In fact have our bounce back package booked for 2010 even though neither deluxe hotel had a flyer in the room with the info. Luckily I had the info from the Dis before I left. But it's sad to things changing and not for the better.

[Tiggerismynameo]

As I read the posts, I wondered if we were a small group of folks who had just noticed the negative aspects of Disney, because we had been going there as much as we had. Now, I think it is true, that some aspects of the crowds at Disney are somewhat subpar...

My wife and I became DVC members in 2007 and have done either a stay at WDW, or a cruise seven times in the past two years. (We are due to go back on Oct 29th, which I severely need.) In that time, I have seen almost all of what you all have listed about services being cut and people getting a bit ruder. Perhaps my favorite story revolved around a 17 year old kid and his stepfather pushing my 6 month old son's stroller off the curb so they could get better seats for the 9pm Spectralmagic parade, but I digress.

In short, there does seem to be a lower "quality" group of people that are coming to Disney who don't seem to respect how family oriented it is. At first, I thought it was just Florida residents that were coming to Disney like Universal Studios, but I think now I realize that it is probably folks that are taking advantage of the discounts, which frankly I don't begrudge. I just wish that they would treat all things Mickey with as much care as we do, instead of thinking that is a big "Six Flags" park.

In the end, I think Disney needs to be careful about expanding market share through these discount programs, because in the end, it is going to draw down the experience to a cheaper one, and that is not what it is about. While I don't want the experience to seem like an elitist one, in the end, it should be something special, that one either plans as a special vacation, or invests in it like DVC and other frequent visitors.

[MICKEY4EVER!]

As I read the posts, I wondered if we were a small group of folks who had just noticed the negative aspects of Disney, because we had been going there as much as we had. Now, I think it is true, that some aspects of the crowds at Disney are somewhat subpar...

My wife and I became DVC members in 2007 and have done either a stay at WDW, or a cruise seven times in the past two years. (We are due to go back on Oct 29th, which I severely need.) In that time, I have seen almost all of what you all have listed about services being cut and people getting a bit ruder. Perhaps my favorite story revolved around a 17 year old kid and his stepfather pushing my 6 month old son's stroller off the curb so they could get better seats for the 9pm Spectralmagic parade, but I digress.

In short, there does seem to be a lower "quality" group of people that are coming to Disney who don't seem to respect how family oriented it is. At first, I thought it was just Florida residents that were coming to Disney like Universal Studios, but I think now I realize that it is probably folks that are taking advantage of the discounts, which frankly I don't begrudge. I just wish that they would treat all things Mickey with as much care as we do, instead of thinking that is a big "Six Flags" park.

In the end, I think Disney needs to be careful about expanding market share through these discount programs, because in the end, it is going to draw down the experience to a cheaper one, and that is not what it is about. While I don't want the experience to seem like an elitist one, in the end, it should be something special, that one either plans as a special vacation, or invests in it like DVC and other frequent visitors.

Well said! :thumbsup2

[nebo]

Crap, I was afraid this would happen. I started this thread and the computer puked on me, went to buy a new one but the new operating system doesn't come out for another month, and I don't care if there's a free upgrade to it, not gonna worry about changing the OS on a new computer.

Allright, this part is an edit. I started doing comments on the posts like I've been doing on all my trip reports and it took a while before the nickel dropped in, Steve, this isn't that kinda report! This was just to share thoughts and observations and it's NOT. ALWAYS. ABOUT. YOU! heh

I guess old habits die hard, just doing what I always did.
Anyway, feel free to skip my dumb comments if you'd like and see what else we all have to share. end edit

I've only read about half the replies so far and I'm glad to see I haven't ticked anyone off too much yet. May I comment?


we are leaving for our 1st trip ever in 12 days! and i REALLY hope that we don't encounter any fighting or floating snickers in the pool (that's just nasty!). I am especially shocked @ the fighting!!!! we are going to wdw for some magical family time not to bash each others heads in!!!! :rotfl:

Ashley, you're probably back by now and I hope things went well for you, I'd be really surprised if you ran into the same jerks we did.

As someone who has worked as a lifeguard for many many years. My only comment is that "Code Browns" happen wherever you go. 95% of the time it's caused by a toddler or young child. It happens at every pool you go to, and some places are better about it than others.

As for the rest of your post. I'm going in 2 weeks so I have no observations. We'll see I guess 8:o)

Again, Dizzy hope things work out for you. I realize code browns can happen anywhere, and I know they are almost always from kids, but it's still the parents that can prevent it with the right kind of diapers. Evidently this last trip we had included a lot more of the kind of parents that don't bother to take those precautions.

And I think that's crappy.

sorry

OH ITA!! and its hard to say this on this board - better put on your flame proof suit!!

1. The "ever" changing of the Menus - where is it written that all the food in Disney now must be the "same"? Go to the buffets - same desserts! Prime Rib - now admittedly the "prime rib" that restuarants use for the all u can eat specials arent the same bone in prime rib high quality - but its now GONE - replaced by a tough cut of roast beef...

there are a lot of the food examples - but like Nebo said, if you didnt know, you wont miss it!

A nice person on the restaurant board did a review of her last time at Boma - she went several times a month - then she noticed the dumbing down of their menus... and posted about it...

2. Pinnochio Haus menu - the figaro fries.... etc

3. Main Street Bakery - French Toast Loaf...

4. creme brulee is EVERYWHERE!! and one poster wanted it at DTD Wolf Gang Express, and they were told that the 'shipment hadnt come in yet' :scared1:

5 The chairs at Pecos Bills - they have no backs!

6. Le Cellier - now that used to be heavenly - the steak was out of this world, now it just depends... and there are so many reviews that dont understand why everyone wants to go here - :confused3

7. Goofy Candy DTD - you used to be able to get 3 pretzels dipped, drizzeld and coated - on the snack plan (under $4) now its 1 pretzel, 1 dip. Why even bother to go there now?

8 Key Lime Pie - I dont know what it is on the buffets from Cape May to Crystal Palace - and other places in between, but it is made with sweetened condensed milk

9. Birthday Cakes - read that thread. After last years fiasco of ordering a cake last year for DD birthday I decided maybe we should skip it - but I've been reading the cake thread- I cant believe that people are willing to throw away over $100 for a special cake, and some can get it, for less, and special fondants etc... but most others are turned down - the whole process is odd - esp in "what will you celebrate" year!

10. DDP - the prices are going up - and the quality of food is coming down

Thanks Sandy, great input. Man, I miss those old type figaro fries and you're right, creme brulee is everywhere, along with pistachio brulee, orange brulee, and burrito brulee. Ok, made the last one up.
I think.



Wow! Nebo, I'm glad you're not afraid to tell it like it is! I appreciate your honesty. I'm in the middle of planning our trip to WDW in December during Christmas week. Oh boy, I can hardly wait to see what the cutbacks will impact during the busiest week of the year. Fortunately, it's not our first visit to the parks.

Marie, I don't think you will see too much at that time of the year. The fireworks are expanded then too, no free dining to bring in all the outsiders, you should have a great, albeit crowded, trip.

It's called "productivity" and its a sad state of affairs

I know that over the years companies sometimes end up with a payroll of more people then they really need, and once in a while they need to trim the fat, but I believe in this case they went to far.

Hey,
I used to be that person that "had" to stay on property
"eat" in only Disney resturants and never leave the property.
I found out how easy it is to "staying off property" now.
10 years ago, it was a nitemare driving around outside of the grounds, with small roads, and all the road construction.
The highway and roads in Orlando and the surrounding area are nuts, but easy to navigate and drive.
(If you can do downtown Chicago & Atlanta, these roads are a breeze.)
Plus there are great resturants for 1/2 the price.
I think many of us faithful, if we still want to keep going to WDW, have to venture back out of the grounds and take our cars, money and even stay off site. It's not bad out there anymore and me and my dh were impressed with some of the resturants and the place we stayed off site.

Mari, I'm not sure how much I agree with you. I know that there are other nice places to stay, and cheaper, better places to eat that arent' hard to get to, but I guess I'm still like you used to be, if you are going to Disney you need to stay on sight.

I have noticed something in our normal behavior that has changed recently on our trips; when we go for pool time now I always go and get an Orlando newspaper for us to read at the pool. Now, I'm thinking this isn't a good idea, I used to let myself get totally immersed in the Disney magic, from the parks to the resorts from check in to check out.
And there's nothing like reading about the Iran missile crisis or health care reform to suck that magic out of you. And after driving down from Chicago, the last thing I want to do is get back in the car to go eat somewhere cheaper. I think next trip I'm going to stick to a novel by the pool and try to keep the real world away from me, at least while I'm on vacation.

Wow - I am surprised to hear about Goofy's candy company - one pretzel now instead of 3. I have honestly never been there, but would love to take my kids now (DS used to be allergic to milk but can have some now, so would have loved the pretzels in chocolate).

I do think when the dining plan came out, within a few years some things did go downhill. We've only used it once, and did love it, but previously would prefer to pay as we go, and get what we want. The prices now are quite high - especially buffets, and we aren't big eaters. Especially in Yakitori House in Japan, the quality is poorer but the price higher than before. (They don't even serve Yakitori there - haven't for years! Need a name change.).

I agree though - if you are going, don't let this dampen your spirit. It's still a wonderful place to visit, and I love the family atmosphere. Just definitely plan ahead! With the dining plan, and the free dining, you really will have to plan on sit down meals ahead of time more than ever! We used to call from my cell phone midday and see what was available, and always got dinner somewhere. Now we still can get dinner somewhere, just it may not be where we want. So do plan!

At AKL we had a code brown also. It can happen anywhere, but as a rule, we don't go back in the pool that day, or at least for a few hours. It just sounds too icky to me. And we are total resort snobs, so always stay deluxe or the Swan. That a resort is less expensive really doesn't excuse such horrible behavior, though! Yikes, a fight.

Anyway, thanks for the observations. I do hope the small things improve, like more fireworks, when the economy does. Don't thing they'll up the pretzels for snacks, though, as once something is taken away, it's usually gone for good.

That's funny, we just tried the Yakitori House for the first time and weren't impressed at all either. By the way, we're moderate resorts snobs, love all of them but will stay at a value if there's no choice. Thanks Hppmmy.

[nebo]

Report this stuff! Report report report ... Tell everyone at Disney about the problems ... there's a couple I need to report myself.



I totally feel you on the idiots you had to deal with at your resort though ... we used to live on a street filled with those idiots. Hated it. Couldn't move fast enough and thank God we finally did. I hope you complained to whoever's in charge at the resort ... and a lot. I can't stand people that think the world revolves around them and/or they're the only people in the place.

Unfortunately things have to be cut back, but I think Disney has done a pretty good job at not ruining it in the process. So far anyway ...
Everyone is having to cut back, and I just thank heavens we still were able to go this year because my kids LOVED it, and we can't wait to get back.

Jennifer, we still love it and can't wait to go back either, but, probably sadly so, I didn't really complain much this time, mostly just in passing to a couple of cms' is all. By the way, you will want to stay clear of the All Star Resorts for sure in early December, many of the Pop Warner crowd will re-define your version of idiots.

Hey Nebo?

:worship::worship::worship:

You've summed it up so well. I live within 2 hours of WDW and have frequented it for nearly 20 years. I'm talking some years in which we were there every single weekend. It's been a relatively slow, gradual change, but when I compare WDW today to WDW when I first moved to FL... well, it's a very, very different place.

I agree; to the first-time visitor, the changes are invisible. Probably, too, for the 2, 3, 4 time visitor. It's still a fun place - I wouldn't keep going back if it wasn't. But a lot of my habits have changed: I drive almost exclusively to avoid the bus system; I'm eating at fewer and fewer TS restaurants because I can't stomach paying exorbitant prices for mediocre food; I do everything in my own power to mitigate any possibility of a screw-up on WDW's part... because chances are very slim that they'll fix it. :sad2:

Hi Princess V, what's funny is that a couple of years ago I told my wife I wished they had a counter service only plan cuz I hate to have to make and keep all the dining ressies you have to make, to me it get's to be a chore, especially if I'm not hungry yet.
Then they came out with that exact plan. Sort of. But it still costs 30 bucks a person a day, for two cs meals, two snacks and a refillable mug. That's still too much money and too much food, at least for me.






Thanks for the honest report. We just got back last Friday.

We also noticed the "subliminal" changes you mentioned, i.e., the bus service, menu changes, and difficulty seeing in the dark areas of theme rides.

The one thing that has been consistent at Disney Resorts is their mousekeeping service. It has always been bad. We always found something from the previous occupants that the mousekeeping staff never seemed to find. This time it was a dirty sock on the floor and two hair ties.

Although we do not expect our sheets to be changed every day, with the poor mousekeeping, I wonder if our sheets were changed upon the checkout of previous occupants.

However, like you, overall, we enjoy staying on Disney property and have booked our next vacation on the bounceback program.

Anyway, we still enjoy Disney as they do provide family fun and do try to please customers. The few rude CMs that do exist, won't last long at Disney. There are too many great CMs that overshadow some of the complaints that we have.

Nebo - I thought your honest trip report was done with great consideration for all Disney patrons.

Have a magical day.

iuki
:surfweb:

Thanks iuki, we too have found a few items along the way, but I can't think of a worse job in the world then having to go clean a room and make the beds, and then do it again, and again, and again. The best thing we found once, at a Motel 6, was a bag of pot under the bed. I kept waiting for a knock on the door at 3 in the morning when the original owner found out it was missing.

Oh, and thanks a LOT iuki, I really needed the idea in my head that maybe the sheets weren't changed from the last guests!



You are not being snobby by talking about the newest visitors at Disney. I've also noticed all of the deals being advertised on TV every other commercial break. It is being made more affordable for everyone to go, so a higher class vacation, cannot be expected. I guess that sounds snobby, but many of you on here know what I mean and how I meant that. :goodvibes

Yeah, the broken glass b/c someone had a fight - that doesn't sound very Disney at all. Totally not anyone at Disney's fault, but still, not what you expect to see at the happiest place on earth! :laughing:

That's good, sometimes too much happiness can bring out the worst in people.:lmao:

I will be perfectly honest with you all. I believe there is a little "trailer park trash" in all of us, sometimes you just want to let your hair down if you know what I mean. We are far from the ideal visitors that Disney would like to habitate their parks and resorts. I have smoked in places that aren't dedicated smoking areas at the resorts, although never in a room. Believe me, I spent a lot of time last February hiding on the fourth floor in the red Duncan yo yo at Pop Century. I've also stooped so low as to bring in a couple of those small airplane bottles of vodka or whiskey in my pocket when we go to the Magic Kingdom. Pre made Sunny D bottles with screwdrivers work great in all the parks too, you can even replenish the ice at a lot of the stands.

And yes, even stooped so low as to pool hop, sorry, there is only two of us now and if we're staying at a Disney resort, I don't think our square footage that we take up at the Luna pool made a whit of difference.

I guess I'm trying to keep the record straight, not perfect, no, just know enough to not ruin anyone else's vacations.



Nebo, I have to agree with you 100% especially on the people thing. Again, also not to sound like a snob, BUT there seemed to be a whole lot of trashy people on our past trip (Just got back Tuesday night). Even my husband asked me what was going on. Our trip was magnificent, but I agree, there were so many changes. Little things, but the little things are what seem to count the most!

I appreciate your honesty!:thumbsup2

Thanks mom, I guess I should have posted the last thought here.

Come to think of it, the first year (1993) that my DH and I stayed at the GF, the housekeeping set out a huge basket outside the room daily filled with our fresh sheets and such. It was so nice - they always turned our bed down also, without asking. They didn't even use maid carts there - everyone got a basket. It was those little touches that set the GF apart back then.

In about 2002 or 2003 (I forget) but I think it was 2003, we stayed in the north garden wing of the CR. Only reason was we got the $120 a night deal with the SOG. I literally had to use all our towels (wet them, then used them to clean) to clean up the dried up pee from behind the toilet - the whole bathroom stunk when we checked in so bad like a nasty truckstop bathroom. Now, granted, that whole wing was slated to be torn down, and it was only occupied with military - the whole clientele was very icky (and my husband is/was miliatary, I don't get it though, at other military R&R places they weren't so icky rude) but they should have cleaned the toilet from about 6 months!

This past December we stayed at the BWI, and I had originally requested the VIP clean (DS has asthma), but then called back to take away that request (in case they could upgrade us, even for a fee, not looking for a free upgrade). When we checked in, they said we had to wait for our room, as they were doing the VIP clean. I told them I had taken off that request. They were very difficult, and said there was nothing they could do (but they also said they could have upgraded us to CL but we had the VIP request). I was so annoyed, but oh well, the room (when we finally got in) was spotless and my son didn't need his nebulizer once.

Thanks for your thoughts, Happymommy. Can I just share something for a sec? Before we went to Disney this last trip we spent 3 nights at Royal Pacific at Universal Orlando. Even though I wasn't eligible, we were upgraded to a King Suite, 650 square feet, two rooms, with a 44 inch plasma tv in one and a 36 inch plasma tv in the other. At no extra cost, just by asking if an upgrade is available. Go figure, must be my smile.:happytv:

[smidgy]

this is Mrs. Nebo.

when hubby said talked about the pot under the bed, he failed to mention that we turned it in. just wanted to set the record staight..sheesh!

ok... resume....:laughing:

[Underdog369]

We have gone on several trips to WDW and have enjoyed every one. One thing that has changed over the years is the food that is offered to the kids on the DDP. Their "healthy" meals have greatly reduced the children's menu to a hotdog, hamburger, or sandwich. In a previous trip we had 2 kids on the children's DDP and last trip we had one on the children's DDP. In order to accomodate the younger ones, and not have them feel left out for choices, my DW, older 2 kids and I would allow the younger kids to help order what we were going to eat as well as order their meal. We would then share our meal with the younger children so they could still feel the pixydust. What was a CM going to do, take our food away? It made for a better dining experience for our party and added to the magic.

I realize WDW and company has to cut back on it's budgets, etc., but if done right, you can still have the experience of a lifetime EVERY time you go. It just depends on your outlook, attitude, and planning for the unexpected.

[lizandjason]

Nebo, you are my hero. Your observations are spot-on and I wish I had been as candid with my own TR (maybe I should give it another shot?)

I witnessed a woman changing her toddler's diaper on a park bench right OUTSIDE the bathroom in the MK. When I came out of the bathroom she was shoving popcorn into her mouth and obviously hadn't bothered to wash her hands. It's no wonder that I came home sick. Now, that has no bearing on Disney, but it's worth mentioning. SANITIZE, EVERYONE!

We found ourselves so annoyed with people that we were being snobbish under our breath when we heard people wonder stupid things out loud (heard outside the HM, 'is this a ride?' and 'does that big boat go all the way around the park?') These folks had no clue.

As for Disney's downturn...here is my question: How does Disney afford to shell out billions for Marvel comics after laying off 1,400 employees?

[topdog]

I was at the world this past Feb and notice significant cut back. Menu not quite like it used to be but was still very good. How tips no long part of the dining plan instead out of pocket expense separately.

Having said that, I kinda knew from the beginning when Disney force Michael Eisner off the board, this is going to happen eventually. Compound with the economic down turn, it only accelerate the whole downward process. Some might know or not know how OCD Michael Eisner can be. He literally measure exactly how many feet between each garbage can. As much as how egotistic and controlling kind of person he is, but some time that's what it takes to bring out the quality service that Disney once had.

To make matter worse, even Roy Disney can no longer control how the company run any more. It's truly ashamed.

Disney has always been known for their service standard. Now after the layoff, buying Marvel comic, expansion of MK and firing the Disney studio chief Dick Cook after 38 years of service. This is going to be a new chapter for Disney. Good or bad? Who knows? Only time can tell what's going to happen to Disney. Hopefully, all the true Disney fan like you and I will keep hanging on to see the company turn around like it once was.