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patsal
06-05-2009, 06:46 AM
and it was the worse experience of my life!
I went in to just test drive after a few friends from work said they had purchased new cars and traded in the old ones while keeping the payment at or near what the old one was. My thought was help the economy, help an American car dealer--although nearly everything on it was foreign--the Japanese tires really ticked me off! Any way they took my car to check for trade in value, told me to take the other home for the night, etc (this is pretty standard for me when I am looking so now alarms went off for me). When I returned they were really pushing the paperwork at me, I told them to put on the brakes, I was looking for a clean clear cost figure and I would accept or decline in good faith.
Well, I was there for almost four hours and when I finally got in the costs they originally quoted me were so far off--get this $400 for 84 months--dude it is a Dodge Caravan--it will be a tiny piece of rust by month 72! This was not a high end model, it was pretty much basic and very stripped down. I asked for my car keys and wanted to leave. No lie it took them an hour to get me my keys! In this hour I asked about every five minutes and nearly had a full blown fit--this dealership is int he school district I work in so I had to keep saying to myself rememebr it will be in the headlines of the little local paper if you flip!
As I am getting in my car the sales guy is standing there and saying no we got it all set now, come back in you cn have ti for $400 for 60 months interest free. I jsut drove off. He says as I am am leaving , go home and cool off then we'll talk about it tomorrow! *** not talking to him ever, plus I was way nice and never even yelled once. I wasn't angry that the deal wouldn't work, I was ticked they wasted my time and it was almost 8pm and I really needed to get home by 5! Never again!

gracie1
06-05-2009, 07:15 AM
Gotta love car shopping :lmao: I always refuse to leave my car at the dealers and use the car I am thinking of purchasing. Only because they can take parts from your car and replace with older ones. I know it sounds crazy but it does happen! They are crazy to think $400 a month for 84 months. Especially with them going bankrupt! But I do love my chrysler and dodge. They definately last a lifetime

squirrlygirl
06-05-2009, 07:22 AM
We went through 5 dealerships before we got our last vehicle. You would THINK that they would be nicer and more straight-forward with what's going on, but it seems to have gone the other way :confused3 (except the last place, where the guy was thrilled to work with us and make us happy :goodvibes)

jakenjess
06-05-2009, 07:25 AM
That reminds me of how much I HATE car shopping!! Sorry you had to go through that. We're driving the cars we have now into the ground. Just the thought of shopping for a new one, and another car payment, is enough for me to be more than satisfied with what we have! We have a 2000 Grand Caravan, with 96,000 miles on it, and I just keep repairing it. I can't imagine having payments on a Caravan for 72 months, but 84? They're out of their minds!! And I thought there were supposed to be some great deals on American cars right now??!

Niagara2
06-05-2009, 07:26 AM
We have brought many cars over the years, and it was only at the local Chysler dealer that they took our keys and we waited an hour to get them back! We even knew the salesman. The dealership changed hands a few years ago and went down from there.
It turned me off on the Chrylser brand if that is their sales techniques.
We need another car this summer and hate the thought of looking for cars.
Hoping that we can get a great deal but will go in with my homework done. The first salesperson who tries to talk around the issues will be surprised when I walk out. Come on salespeople - offer the best deal and we will probably sign. Try to add on odd charges, or change the story and you lose the sale.

rbork
06-05-2009, 07:36 AM
I'm pretty blunt when it come to car shopping. And don't EVEN try to treat me different than my DH. I just look them in the eye and say, "Sorry, you just lost your sale" and walk away. 4 hrs...can't imagine being around that long. I don't even like the final meeting where you go to sign papers and actually buy the vehicle because of all the crap they try and sell prior...
My poor DH sits there through it all and I tell him to just call me when it's time to sign. I love him for that.:love:
btw- our Ford just turned 200k miles!

Kickapoo Joie Juice
06-05-2009, 07:38 AM
and it was the worse experience of my life!
I went in to just test drive after a few friends from work said they had purchased new cars and traded in the old ones while keeping the payment at or near what the old one was. My thought was help the economy, help an American car dealer--although nearly everything on it was foreign--the Japanese tires really ticked me off! Any way they took my car to check for trade in value, told me to take the other home for the night, etc (this is pretty standard for me when I am looking so now alarms went off for me). When I returned they were really pushing the paperwork at me, I told them to put on the brakes, I was looking for a clean clear cost figure and I would accept or decline in good faith.
Well, I was there for almost four hours and when I finally got in the costs they originally quoted me were so far off--get this $400 for 84 months--dude it is a Dodge Caravan--it will be a tiny piece of rust by month 72! This was not a high end model, it was pretty much basic and very stripped down. I asked for my car keys and wanted to leave. No lie it took them an hour to get me my keys! In this hour I asked about every five minutes and nearly had a full blown fit--this dealership is int he school district I work in so I had to keep saying to myself rememebr it will be in the headlines of the little local paper if you flip!
As I am getting in my car the sales guy is standing there and saying no we got it all set now, come back in you cn have ti for $400 for 60 months interest free. I jsut drove off. He says as I am am leaving , go home and cool off then we'll talk about it tomorrow! *** not talking to him ever, plus I was way nice and never even yelled once. I wasn't angry that the deal wouldn't work, I was ticked they wasted my time and it was almost 8pm and I really needed to get home by 5! Never again!

That's God telling you not to buy a Caravan.

Some very wise person once said that God throws pebbles at you to get you to pay attention, then he starts throwing bricks.

Think of that as a pebble incident, then go buy a car that isn't a piece of crap the minute you drive it off the lot (I owned a Lemon Caravan).

okeydokey
06-05-2009, 07:42 AM
This may be a blessing in disguise. The last Caravan we bought will be the LAST Caravan we ever buy and the last Dodge too. It was a problem ridden nightmare.

squirrlygirl
06-05-2009, 07:49 AM
Or it may just be a sign that maybe there is a reason to cut your dealer network and hold the remaining ones to higher standards ;)

Green Tea
06-05-2009, 07:50 AM
Same here as above. Be glad you didn't get the caravan.

goofy5
06-05-2009, 07:51 AM
WOW! what a bad experience. we normally go in tell them what we wanna pay and what we want for trade if they try and whodoo us we walk out

robinb
06-05-2009, 07:51 AM
Before you go car shopping again, you need to know the dealer invoice price (including ALL incentives to both the dealer and buyer) and the fair market trade-in value for your car. NEVER negotiate from a monthly payment standpoint. That is simply playing into their hands. Have your own financing set up ahead of time through your bank or local credit union, negotiate the price, negotiate the trade-in (it can be done) and then negotiate the payments. Payments always come LAST not first. Of course, you do have to know how much of a car you can afford before you shop but most banks have rates online along with loan calculators.

You can get new car pricing from places like Edmund's Car Guide (www.edmunds.com) and trade-in information from Kelly Blue Book (www.kbb.com).

EthansMom
06-05-2009, 08:01 AM
When I went to purchase my last car, we weren't trading in a car (so no keys to take and "lose"). The guy wanted a credit card to take in with my offer "to show I was serious". I said, "Listen, I have my checkbook right here and can write a check for this vehicle right now. You don't need my credit card."

They only take your keys or credit card or the like to keep you there negotiating.

As a PP said, NEVER negotiate based on the payments. Arrange financing ahead of time with your local credit union or bank and then negotiate the PRICE of the car (only after you've done some research on Kellybluebook.com).

I have a 2007 Sienna and LOVE it! I got it last Sept. as a year-end closeout... paid about $23k (baseline model). Many of the Toyotas and Hondas are more "made in America" than Chryslers, Fords, etc...

hentob
06-05-2009, 08:49 AM
No lie it took them an hour to get me my keys!

After 15 minutes, I would have informed them that I was calling the local police and reporting my keys stolen. One hour:scared1:

uk_wildcat
06-05-2009, 08:58 AM
We had a good experience at our Chrysler/Dodge dealer, but my parents recently purchased a Pontiac and went through several dealers before finding one that they liked. They had the same exact thing happen to them with the keys and the length of time it took to get them back and get the heck out of the dealership. The salesman was trying to sell them a brand new car that had something wrong with it when they test drove it. He was pushing it on them and telling them they could just get it fixed before it was purchased! He was not offering anything off either. They were so mad and just ready to get of there and felt like they were being held hostage.
I think some of these dealers are so desperate that they are not providing good customer service and are just trying to push cars on people. I would definitely shop around, even at another Dodge dealer.

xiola
06-05-2009, 09:03 AM
The hang onto their keys for 2 hours thing is the oldest trick in the book. They'll make it even worse if you bring a kid with you. The idea is that you'll be so flustered by the end that you'll just sign the papers to get out of there. It sounds ridiculous, but it really is a sales trick.

The closest big dealership to me lost my business for life because of stuff like this.

patsal
06-05-2009, 09:09 AM
Thanks for making me feel like I did the right thing. Really, I don't even need a new car. I finally said to DH last night it is like the I want a HE Front loading washer and when the old regular washer breaks down beyond repair then I'll go look for one. It isn't broke and I dont' need one, so I guess I'll stop looking for one.
Funny thing though was the painless experience I had when purchasing the Saturn my DH now drives. I did the research, I figured out the base price and the incentives within a few dollars and procurred the financing from my credit union. It was an easy purchase, walked in, told them what we wanted, they sat down with what they had in stock and the prices, we took the model we wanted on a test drive and we picked it up about 48 hours later with very minimal paperwork. When I am ready to buy because of need then I will do that again, and I am pretty sure with the same slaes team since I know she can sell me any brand since the owner of the Saturn dealership also owns every other kind of dealership around here!
Funny you mention the toyota being more American than the Dodge--my sister said the same thing when I talked to her and she was metnioning the price on the Toyota mini van as less expensive than my Caravan and in need of far less maintainence. She also asked what dealership I went to and when I told her she was like OMG and told me about when she was in college and went to get her car fixed there they strong armed her into buying a new one and wouldn't give her back her old car something like beyond repair so you should just get a new one! She was 19 and by herself but said she never went there again and was sorry that she didn't share that experieince with me prior.

hercamore
06-05-2009, 09:17 AM
OMG. What an experience.

We bought my minivan new and it is now 18 years old (GMC). That is the only new car I've ever had, and it still runs great. However, . We are going to be new car shopping later this year, and I am dreading it.

so much $$, so much hassle, I'm not sure it's worth it.


herc.

tar heel
06-05-2009, 09:23 AM
Since we drive cars until it's more expensive to repair them than replace them -- and that takes a long time --we don't car shop much. Last time we did I went to our local Chrysler/Dodge dealer and found exactly what I wanted - a loaded Grand Caravan that was two years old with low mileage. It had no price listed on it. I asked the salesperson for a starting price and he started his bs of what was I willing to pay, how much of a payment, etc. I told him I wasn't playing that game and needed a price on the van. He declined to give one and I left. The next morning the very van we wanted (all of the above plus an entertanment system) was listed in the morning paper at a price about $1,500 less than our top price range. We went down there, negotiated it down another $1,000 and came home with a new van.

We were not trading in a car that time, but one thing we do when we're considering it is to always go to the dealership in our OTHER CAR. That ensures that trade in doesn't become an issue until we want it to.

robinb
06-05-2009, 09:26 AM
Funny thing though was the painless experience I had when purchasing the Saturn my DH now drives. I did the research, I figured out the base price and the incentives within a few dollars and procurred the financing from my credit union. It was an easy purchase, walked in, told them what we wanted, they sat down with what they had in stock and the prices, we took the model we wanted on a test drive and we picked it up about 48 hours later with very minimal paperwork. When I am ready to buy because of need then I will do that again, and I am pretty sure with the same slaes team since I know she can sell me any brand since the owner of the Saturn dealership also owns every other kind of dealership around here!I would not expect the same painless buying experience from another company as you had with Saturn. Saturn was really known for their no-haggle easy buying policy. They asked a certain price for a car and virtually everyone paid the same price. Every other dealership works from a negotiation standpoint. They negotiate down from the MSRP and you negotiate up from the dealer's cost.

HunnyPots
06-05-2009, 11:27 AM
Just wanted to chime in and say, not all Caravans are "lemons" or maintenence nightmares. I bought mine new in '99 and only this year have I had any siginifigant repairs. The a/c went out and cost me $1000, but this is Texas and I refuse to drive around without it. So I spent the money and got it fixed and now it's in great shape again. It has 135k miles on it and I plan to keep it at least another four years.

mjkacmom
06-05-2009, 12:03 PM
Before you go car shopping again, you need to know the dealer invoice price (including ALL incentives to both the dealer and buyer) and the fair market trade-in value for your car. NEVER negotiate from a monthly payment standpoint. That is simply playing into their hands. Have your own financing set up ahead of time through your bank or local credit union, negotiate the price, negotiate the trade-in (it can be done) and then negotiate the payments. Payments always come LAST not first. Of course, you do have to know how much of a car you can afford before you shop but most banks have rates online along with loan calculators.

You can get new car pricing from places like Edmund's Car Guide (www.edmunds.com) and trade-in information from Kelly Blue Book (www.kbb.com).

This is exactly what I do, and I go to at least 3 different dealerships, to get the best deal.

Becky2005
06-05-2009, 12:31 PM
The hang onto their keys for 2 hours thing is the oldest trick in the book. They'll make it even worse if you bring a kid with you. The idea is that you'll be so flustered by the end that you'll just sign the papers to get out of there. It sounds ridiculous, but it really is a sales trick.

The closest big dealership to me lost my business for life because of stuff like this.

I was just thinking, if you had a 2nd set of keys on you. You could just drive off the lot & deal with the 2nd key issue later. ;) My car came with a valet key, so I have that on a seperate key ring that if I have to give strangers key to my car, that is the one they get.

I also agree with Hunnypots -- we have a '99 basic Caravan & it has never given us any problems. We just had some standard maintenance done on it (and also had to have the A/C recharged) but other than that, it runs just fine. Ours only has about 75K on it though.

runwad
06-05-2009, 12:34 PM
Well although my experience is a little different then yours we still had the outcome....not buying now. We were looking for a used mini van..my DH went to 5 dealers after talking to them on the internet. None of them would budge from their listing price. Tell me does anyone here pay sticker for a used car? Well we don't so instead of gaining a sale they can just go bankrupt.:rotfl:

corndog
06-05-2009, 12:49 PM
I would not expect the same painless buying experience from another company as you had with Saturn. Saturn was really known for their no-haggle easy buying policy. They asked a certain price for a car and virtually everyone paid the same price. Every other dealership works from a negotiation standpoint. They negotiate down from the MSRP and you negotiate up from the dealer's cost.

If you are negotiating up from the dealer's cost, you are paying too much. The single most important advice I give people when buying a new car is to educate yourself about holdback, and then share it with the dealer.

JerseyMamaBear
06-05-2009, 02:36 PM
We never had luck at the big name dealerships. Same stories of the same ol' BS. Last May we went to Autolenders in TOms River near where we live and for the same price I was paying on my chevy I got an suv. We did the same last week and turned in my hubbies truck and walked out ahead of the deal. The were straight up, up front honest and worked with us like I have never seen. We send all of our friends there and they report recieving the same respect. PM me for our dealers name and number. He is amazing! They have 4 dealerships in NJ.

hppy2bhome
06-05-2009, 02:45 PM
negotiate over the phone! much easier.

just tell them the kind of car you drive and what's wrong with it. They can get a ball park figure on trade with out seeing it.

hppy2bhome

swilshire
06-05-2009, 03:14 PM
We went to four nearby Honda dealers one day in March. Three of them I would be happy to do business with at any time. The fourth made me so mad that I stormed out of the dealership and even tried to find a contact for the owner to complain.

Choose a dealer with a good reputation and you will have a much easier time of it.

Sheila

mitchwebb
06-05-2009, 03:15 PM
We just bought a new car and Edmunds website was a great help. You can find out what the True Market Value of the car you are looking at. You can find any rebate, dealer incentives or specail financing. You put in your zip and it will give you dealerships in your area that you can email and get a quote from their internet sales manager. Then you can email back and forth with the internet managers to get the best cost. Edmunds also has a great dis board that people report the cost they have bought their cars at across the US. This helps you know if you are paying more than you should.

I have overcome my fear and my I say Loathing of car buying.

Oh yea decline the $2000 extra they try to sell you once you have agreed on the car. The extended Warenties they sell at the dealers are marked up a long with all the other extras.

robinb
06-05-2009, 03:27 PM
If you are negotiating up from the dealer's cost, you are paying too much. The single most important advice I give people when buying a new car is to educate yourself about holdback, and then share it with the dealer.You're right ... that's why I said "dealer's cost" not "dealer's invoice" :). IMO "cost" includes the holdback.

corndog
06-05-2009, 04:01 PM
You're right ... that's why I said "dealer's cost" not "dealer's invoice" :). IMO "cost" includes the holdback.

A fair point, but one with which the masses are not familiar.

01spirit750
06-05-2009, 04:09 PM
Interesting reading.

Our last new car was a 2003 Ford Explorer. I requested quotes over the internet. Only one dealer actually responded with a price. The others responded with "come in an we will talk", no thanks.

I went to the one dealer who quoted a price and test drove a model they had (they didn't have the exact model we wanted but they could get it).

The salesmen handed us the keys and said leave them in his office when we were done. Talk about no pressure.

We decided yes, and he had the vehicle brought over from another dealer the next day.

The only funny part was that we opted for the 0% interest for 72 months and the finance guy tried selling us a bunch of add ons with a "low" add on cost to our monthly payments. Like the extended waranty was "only" $50 per month. Dude that is $3,600? I had found an internet warranty company that quoted $850 for 7 years.

Oh, I normally don't buy warranties but I knew the transmissions and rearends on the new Explorers had problems. Yup the rear end went out this year and cost $2900 to fix. I was out $100 to pay the deductible.

The Iron Giant
06-05-2009, 05:10 PM
Interesting reading.

Our last new car was a 2003 Ford Explorer. I requested quotes over the internet. Only one dealer actually responded with a price. The others responded with "come in an we will talk", no thanks.

I went to the one dealer who quoted a price and test drove a model they had (they didn't have the exact model we wanted but they could get it).

The salesmen handed us the keys and said leave them in his office when we were done. Talk about no pressure.

We decided yes, and he had the vehicle brought over from another dealer the next day.

The only funny part was that we opted for the 0% interest for 72 months and the finance guy tried selling us a bunch of add ons with a "low" add on cost to our monthly payments. Like the extended waranty was "only" $50 per month. Dude that is $3,600? I had found an internet warranty company that quoted $850 for 7 years.

Oh, I normally don't buy warranties but I knew the transmissions and rearends on the new Explorers had problems. Yup the rear end went out this year and cost $2900 to fix. I was out $100 to pay the deductible.

Do you mind sharing the name of the warranty site?

Thanks :)

tiggertabi
06-05-2009, 05:41 PM
Oh man, do I have a story for this. We put a deposit to hold a car for teh next day since we had to transfer car seats and such, and the dealer was closing. We went home, came back the n ext day, and they bring "the" car out to us. I'm looking at it, and it's not the same car. it didn't have AWD and the one we signed/negotiated for did. It didn't have all the upgraded stuff we were paying for. We said "you brought the same car" thinking (naive) that they didn't realize it, as it was the same color. He said "Nope, here is the information right here - your name is in there." So we argued about it for a while, and then he finally admitted that they sold "our" car to someone else that morning and this was the only one they had left. I demanded my deposit back, and the contract we had signed so we could rip it up. I was so furious, we had negotiated for HOURS and gotten a great deal. We're pretty sure they realized we were getting the WAY better end of that deal and tried to pawn off this other car, worth about 3,000 less, on us. I wrote to Honda corporate but they never wrote back. I filed a claim with the BBB too...

disneymomofmyca
06-05-2009, 10:18 PM
That reminds me of how much I HATE car shopping!! Sorry you had to go through that. We're driving the cars we have now into the ground. Just the thought of shopping for a new one, and another car payment, is enough for me to be more than satisfied with what we have! We have a 2000 Grand Caravan, with 96,000 miles on it, and I just keep repairing it. I can't imagine having payments on a Caravan for 72 months, but 84? They're out of their minds!! And I thought there were supposed to be some great deals on American cars right now??!

I drive a 2000 Grand caravan sport and it runs like brand new! Not a problem yet...knock on wood...and guess how many miles it just turned over to today?...167,000!!!!!!!! Holy crap! Guess I got a good one! :)

princesslily
06-05-2009, 11:06 PM
Sorry to hear about your experience! My husband has been selling Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep for the last 15 years and I've maybe heard about 3-4 customers being upset with him. He believes in straight up honest selling. You have to remember sometimes it's the manager that's snakey. He's been the top sales for the last 14 years and now just tells his managers no way if he doesn't agree with it. He believes strong customer service equals repeat business. Too many greedy sales people out there.

patsal
06-06-2009, 10:14 AM
Sorry to hear about your experience! My husband has been selling Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep for the last 15 years and I've maybe heard about 3-4 customers being upset with him. He believes in straight up honest selling. You have to remember sometimes it's the manager that's snakey. He's been the top sales for the last 14 years and now just tells his managers no way if he doesn't agree with it. He believes strong customer service equals repeat business. Too many greedy sales people out there.

So true, I will never return to that dealership or any owned by the same parent co. I will make a phone call to my usual dealer for a clean deal with trade in (over the phone) plus a few others so I can wiggle a little. As I said though, I have a grand caravan now that is in great shape and is still under extended warranty with just under 70.000 miles on it. I know my last basic carvan got to 95,000 before I traded it and I only traded it because I wanted the space in the Grand as the kids and their stuff outgrew the regular caravan. If I hold out long enough I won't need a mini van anymore anyway!

PrincessKitty1
06-06-2009, 11:31 AM
For the last car we bought (2003), we did ALL negotiating by email. We decided on the car we wanted, then emailed all the Honda dealerships within a 2 hour drive of our house and asked for an out-the-door price including tax, tag, and all fees.

It was relatively painless. I did all the emailing and then DH did a couple of follow-up calls once we found the best price. Once we got to the dealership (70 miles away) they tried to pressure us into financing through them (we had already gotten financing from our credit union) and tried to pressure us inot gap insurance (we made a hefty downpayment so we didn't need it), but we held our ground and got the car for the price we expected.

You can look up new car prices on Edmunds, Blue Book, etc. to see what the dealership pays and what the average retail price is of any car you want with whatever options you want.

For the first car I bought (1986 Mazda truck), I had to wait a few days for them to put on the options I wanted. When they called me to pick up the truck, my financing wasn't quite ready through my credit union and the dealership told me I HAD to finance through them. They said if I didn't, I would have to GIVE THEM CASH on the spot for the options they had put on the truck and leave without the truck.

I walked out (but I was was scared and trembling because they were very threatening and I wasn't sure what they were going to do), and they called me back within the hour and told me it was "All a big misunderstanding" and to come get the truck.:rolleyes1

RitaZ.
06-06-2009, 08:51 PM
Today, we went to our local Dodge/Chrysler dealership that is going out of business. DH test-drove a Jeep and didn't like it. Then, he test-drove a minivan (4.0 engine), which he really liked. We found a Dodge Caravan that we liked, the price is almost $29K. I've been doing some research and found that people have paid less for the same van with more options. Anyway, there was no harassment from the salesman. I'm sure we'll get a call tomorrow, but I doubt they will be able to give us the price we are looking for. This isn't a "have to" purchase, so there is no urgency. We are looking for a good deal.

This is our 3rd attempt at buying a Dodge product. Maybe someone is sending us a sign. ;) Anyway, our first experience with a Dodge dealership was in 2000. The salesman wouldn't give us our keys. From reading some of these posts, I guess this is standard practice. After we test-drove the van that we liked, we went in the showroom to talk "numbers". The salesman started with some ridiculously high numbers and DH wasn't having any of it. DH, normally a calm and collected person, kept asking the salesman for our keys. The salesman wouldn't comply. So, DH walked out of the office, stood in the middle of the showroom and loudly yelled, "Will someone get me my keys?" :eek: Everyone stopped and began staring at DH. Managers came running to help him. :lmao: I grabbed DS's hand and walked outside.:scared: The keys were given to DH right away. Then, the idiot salesman ran after us in the parking lot.:scared: As we were walking away, he kept asking us to come back in and said that he would take us to the 2nd floor where they had "good food". :confused3 I guess we must have looked hungry. :laughing: It was insane! I've never ever been subjected to anything like that when purchasing a car. :scared1::scared1: The sales manager kept calling our house offering us a much lower price for the van. We wanted nothing to do with them.

We'll see what happens this time. Monday is their last day of business. The prices on the vehicles have been reduced twice so far. I asked the salesman if they will be reduced any further and he said that he doubts it. He said that the price on the window is the best we can get, but we can always make an offer. :confused3:confused3

arobeen
06-06-2009, 10:00 PM
We had a horrible experience yesterday at another dealer, not Dodge, and I really did not want to go through it again today. But we worked with an amazing staff that did not discredit my research and knowledge of the process, as what happened yesterday. For those of you interested in a Dodge Grand Caravan, I highly recommend you visit edmunds.com and print out the information you find, like TMV price, invoice price, etc. Also, print out the incentives page. I threw my salesman off when I mentioned the manufacturer marketing support of $1,000 to $2000 off Green and Red Dot inventory. We also got $2000 cash back, $500 bonus cash, $1000 loyalty, and dealer cash of $500. We also knew our FICO score going in. The first monthly payment offered was so high and I asked about the interest rate. I was told 7.5% for 72 months. I told him I could secure financing through my bank at 5.44% for 60 months due to our excellent credit score. After talking to his manager and finance guy, we ended up financing through them because we received 5.0% for 60 months plus received another $500 cash from the creditor to apply towards the van. We had a large down payment and our trade-in, which wasn't much. At the end of it all, we paid close to $4,000 below dealer invoice. This was not a dealer going out of business either. Now, did they lose on this - no, because most of that cash back came from the manufacturer and not the dealer. Plus, they do have their hold back. I'm trying to help an American company, not rob them. I'm happy with my end of the deal, they are happy with theirs - it was a good day! :yay:

Where'sPiglet?
06-06-2009, 10:37 PM
Ohhh...this thread is making me nervous!

I am moving at the end of this month and need to buy a car once I move. Living in NYC I have not needed one and do not have one at this time. My previous two cars were hand-me-downs from my parents when they bought new-to-them cars, so this is my first time buying a car. :scared:

I am bookmarking this thread to re-read it and educate myself. :thumbsup2

P.I. Squirrel
06-07-2009, 02:42 AM
I ran across a site last year that is a good read. Some of the things on this site have happened to me (and others by reading these posts) over the years.

InsiderCarSecrets.com (http://www.insidercarsecrets.com/financing.html)

I am not recommending anything this guy is selling, but there is a lot of useful info there.


Given that Chrysler is in Chapter 11 right now, when the Chrysler dealer asks "Have you ever filed for bankruptcy?", we now can say "No, have you?" :goodvibes

Tina
06-07-2009, 08:14 AM
I've bought a few cars in my time, but I've never negotiated the sales price by payment. Is this something new? I normally take in my printout from Kelly Blue Book and start from there.

I once accompanied a friend to car shop for her minivan and caught the salesman trying to scam her. He tried to trick her with the rebate, telling her he had to add it back in for taxes and then take it off - which in essence, negates the rebate. He got extremely angry with me when I pointed it out because she didn't understand what I was saying at first. We started to argue (myself and the salesman) and the manager came over and told me to lower my voice (probably because he heard me say loudly "You're ripping her off!"). I told the manager what had happened and he asked US to leave. No problem there! We did leave, but not without exclaiming loudly to everyone in the very busy sales room what had happened. As we walked out the door, I heard one other guy at a table near the door begin yelling at his salesman for doing the same thing. I was happy to have ruined a couple of shady deals that day. :)

Kickapoo Joie Juice
06-07-2009, 08:23 AM
Now, did they lose on this - no, because most of that cash back came from the manufacturer and not the dealer. Plus, they do have their hold back. I'm trying to help an American company, not rob them. I'm happy with my end of the deal, they are happy with theirs - it was a good day! :yay:

I never worry about robbing a dealer...:rotfl2: They won't sell you a car they don't make a profit on.

clh2
06-07-2009, 10:55 AM
The hang onto their keys for 2 hours thing is the oldest trick in the book. They'll make it even worse if you bring a kid with you. The idea is that you'll be so flustered by the end that you'll just sign the papers to get out of there. It sounds ridiculous, but it really is a sales trick.

The closest big dealership to me lost my business for life because of stuff like this.

Seriously - man - if they want my kid in their dealership wreaking havoc...fine with me. (Although D is now 15...) If I had DD with us at the dealership when she was little, and the dealer messed with me...I would have let my kid loose in the showroom.:rotfl: They would have begged me to wrap the deal up at MY terms.

Really...always do your homework. Always keep the purchase price of the car separate form the trade-in value of the old car. Never allow them to "hold on to your license", always give them a spare key for the vehicle. That way, if you need to get up and walk...you can.

My DH and I purchase a new vehicle about every 4 to 5 years. The last vehicle, a Ford, we did most of the negotiating on it on-line, and then came in and test drove it. That particular day, we had a very specific timeline, since DD needed to be picked up at practice. dealer knew the time line, and at 1:30, the sales rep was pretty surprised that 90% into the deal, I put on my coat and stood up. Clearly, I needed to go. The deal was wrapped up in 5 minutes. Dealer did not know that DH and I arrived in separate vehicles. dH stayed and finished up the paperwork.

Always do your homework on the vehicle. There is SO much info online right now. Know what you want to spend. Trade-in's are a bit of a wildcard here, but play the " If the trade-in won't get at least $3500, we will sell it ourselves first, and then come in for the car" card.

As our DD is getting to a "drivable" age, when we purchased a new car in March, we did not have a trade, we are keeping it for DD. We knew down too the penny exactly what we wanted to spend on the car. Our estimate was off by about $35, since we incorrectly figured state licensing fee.

The dealer had some stupid pinstripes painted on the car, and wanted to add $300 for those...UMM - NO. Not paying for pinstripes that add nothing to the functionality of the car. Our other option was to go to a different dealer, and they had a car for the same price, but instead of the pinstripes, the car had the back-up beepers, which I would have paid the $300 for. We weren't shy about asking for the pinstripe cost to be deducted. Once they realized how serious we were about buying the car, and if it wasn't this car, the next car on our list was at a different dealer, they made it work.

To the OP - Good luck with this!

florep1
06-07-2009, 11:11 AM
Sorryto hear about your experience. We got a new Honda for the kids the other day, got it at dealer invoice (Honda never gives any rebates), and we were out the door in less than 30 minutes(had to wait for them to clean it, and fill it with gas). Yes, this one was assembled in USA with 60% American parts, 30% Japanese. Go figure.....

D&DDisney
06-07-2009, 01:47 PM
Just bought a 09 Grand Caravan 2 weeks ago.
Went in to the dealer with the price we were going to pay per an ad we saw in paper. Also brought the printout of what our trade was worth. Told them we would only pay X and wanted X for our trade.
The sale did take a long time, but in the end we walked out with a new car paying $7,500 less then the posted price and getting exactly what we wanted in trade. :)

Doodlebug939
06-07-2009, 06:20 PM
We are in the mist of buying a house in less then two weeks so I am not buying a car in the next few months. :lovestruc

My husband is going to be apart from us for several months in New Orleans while we are in Fort Worth. I am concerned about a hurricane and our older vehicle not making the trip. So once we are settled I figure that we will buy a new little car. Something that interested me was this bill that they are trying to pass. It is called "Cash for Clunkers" Here is a link that gives the details.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/02/senate-poised-pass-cash-clunkers/

If it is passed it gets people who own an older vehicle the opportunity to trade in for a better vehicle with a voucher of 3,500-4,500. That is on top of the tax write off that you get for buying a vehicle this year (return of state tax I believe)

So this leaves me to wait and see if this bill gets past. My vehicle is valued at about 2,000 right now. Any one else heard of this? If you can wait and meet the criteria it could help you.

runwad
06-08-2009, 11:55 AM
We are in the mist of buying a house in less then two weeks so I am not buying a car in the next few months. :lovestruc

My husband is going to be apart from us for several months in New Orleans while we are in Fort Worth. I am concerned about a hurricane and our older vehicle not making the trip. So once we are settled I figure that we will buy a new little car. Something that interested me was this bill that they are trying to pass. It is called "Cash for Clunkers" Here is a link that gives the details.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/02/senate-poised-pass-cash-clunkers/

If it is passed it gets people who own an older vehicle the opportunity to trade in for a better vehicle with a voucher of 3,500-4,500. That is on top of the tax write off that you get for buying a vehicle this year (return of state tax I believe)

So this leaves me to wait and see if this bill gets past. My vehicle is valued at about 2,000 right now. Any one else heard of this? If you can wait and meet the criteria it could help you.

Yes Doodlebug, I've heard of this and am hoping it passes as we have a 3rd recreation vehicle, '85 conversion van, that we'd like to turn in to buy a new work car for my DH. It won't be hard to get something that gets 10 mpg more then our 85 Conversion van.ha

SaraJayne
06-08-2009, 12:17 PM
Before you go car shopping again, you need to know the dealer invoice price (including ALL incentives to both the dealer and buyer) and the fair market trade-in value for your car. NEVER negotiate from a monthly payment standpoint. That is simply playing into their hands. Have your own financing set up ahead of time through your bank or local credit union, negotiate the price, negotiate the trade-in (it can be done) and then negotiate the payments. Payments always come LAST not first. Of course, you do have to know how much of a car you can afford before you shop but most banks have rates online along with loan calculators.

You can get new car pricing from places like Edmund's Car Guide (www.edmunds.com) and trade-in information from Kelly Blue Book (www.kbb.com).

We just (in Jan) bought a new (09) vehicle and I did all these things. :goodvibes I did all my homework, got all the financing in order before I even went to any dealerships and did all the legwork on my own. I emailed/called five or six dealers to see if they had what I was looking for. If they didn't email me back within 24 hours, they were out of the running.

I basically told them, this is the car I want and this is how much I'm willing to pay. The salesmen I eventually ended up buying from was wonderful and bent over backwards to help us. I was very impressed (and told him and his boss what a great experience it was). :)

We ended up getting the vehicle for $10,000 below dealer cost. :woohoo:

DawnM
06-08-2009, 03:02 PM
We have 2 Saturns....in fact, I married my Saturn dealer! :rotfl2: He is now an accountant, but when I met him he was selling Saturns.

I think any time you buy a car you need to do just what you said here, research, etc....the moment you say, "I want my car payments be X," they think they HAVE you......of course they can get you $400 payments and if you dont' look at the bottom line (number of months times the payments) you might just drive off with a really bad deal. I have a friend who does this. It drives me crazy. She trades in cars every 3-5 years and just worries about payments, not bottom line.....and she has NEVER gone without a payment. Then she complains that she is broke all the time. :confused3

Our cars are paid for and we plan to drive them into the ground! 2 Saturns and a Toyota.

Dawn

Thanks for making me feel like I did the right thing. Really, I don't even need a new car. I finally said to DH last night it is like the I want a HE Front loading washer and when the old regular washer breaks down beyond repair then I'll go look for one. It isn't broke and I dont' need one, so I guess I'll stop looking for one.
Funny thing though was the painless experience I had when purchasing the Saturn my DH now drives. I did the research, I figured out the base price and the incentives within a few dollars and procurred the financing from my credit union. It was an easy purchase, walked in, told them what we wanted, they sat down with what they had in stock and the prices, we took the model we wanted on a test drive and we picked it up about 48 hours later with very minimal paperwork. When I am ready to buy because of need then I will do that again, and I am pretty sure with the same slaes team since I know she can sell me any brand since the owner of the Saturn dealership also owns every other kind of dealership around here!
Funny you mention the toyota being more American than the Dodge--my sister said the same thing when I talked to her and she was metnioning the price on the Toyota mini van as less expensive than my Caravan and in need of far less maintainence. She also asked what dealership I went to and when I told her she was like OMG and told me about when she was in college and went to get her car fixed there they strong armed her into buying a new one and wouldn't give her back her old car something like beyond repair so you should just get a new one! She was 19 and by herself but said she never went there again and was sorry that she didn't share that experieince with me prior.

Where'sPiglet?
06-08-2009, 03:47 PM
You're right ... that's why I said "dealer's cost" not "dealer's invoice" :). IMO "cost" includes the holdback.

I do not understand these terms. :confused:

I went and looked at a few cars yesterday. I know exactly what I want and the MSRP for it. Now I just have to figure out exactly how to GET it. :headache:

SaraJayne
06-08-2009, 04:48 PM
I do not understand these terms. :confused:

I went and looked at a few cars yesterday. I know exactly what I want and the MSRP for it. Now I just have to figure out exactly how to GET it. :headache:

Dealers cost is what the dealer paid for the vehicle.

Dealers invoice is what they are selling it for. :)

Princess April
06-08-2009, 05:12 PM
:lmao: I swear it was easier for us to buy the house then it was our cars.... I have had some really disrespectful dealers over the last few years and we just get up and walk out... One man even told my DH to "control his wife" when I told him I was taking the baby (she was 3 then) and leaving and he could stay if he wanted to... I swear my DH (the calmest man on the planet) almost reached across the desk and punched the guy!!! :rotfl2: (and he's 6'3" 250+ lbs. not a force to be messed with! :laughing:)

amjg
06-08-2009, 05:27 PM
I never worry about robbing a dealer...:rotfl2: They won't sell you a car they don't make a profit on.

This is not necessarily true. We own a car dealership and my husband came home the other night and said they had sold 10 cars that day. But they sold three cars for less than he had in them just to move them. If they sit on the lot too long they end up costing money.

rcraw45425
06-08-2009, 06:05 PM
I bought a new Mercedes last month, very painless transaction. I went by the dealer ship on Wednesday, just to look, then had to leave my carpool week), the salesman called me that night offering 1.9% for up to 66 months. DH and I talked and I went back the next day and drove one, of course they wanted me to take it home, no dice. I also found out that my lease was actually coming up one month sooner than I thought (it was actually up June 1 instead of July 1 like I thought). I went back the next morning (Friday) and decided on a different one of the same model, sat from 10ish till around 12 when DH came by to pick me up for lunch, we went by after lunch, signed the papers and I was on my way by 2:30 that afternoon. We have always had pleasant experiences with our local Mercedes dealership, very unlike all of the other domestic dealerships here in town. We live in a city that houses a huge army base and the dealerships tend to treat everyone badly (can I say that Bill Heard Chevrolet originated here?), so dealing with people that tend to bend over backward for you is a nice change of pace. They called me a week later to tell me that they had one of the hard cargo mats and a set of high end rubber floor mats for me, as a thank you. All we ever received from Ford was a folding chair!