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IluvKingLouis
06-04-2009, 07:47 PM
Every time I've made an appointment for a cleaning it's been pretty cut and dry. You show up, get a few (like 8-10) x-rays, and get your teeth cleaned.

Now due to being uninsured for a few years, and having to fight with our current insurance to refer us to a local spot, DH and I tried to book an appointment for a cleaning.

Well, they wouldn't take us for a cleaning, but wanted to appraise us first. I had over 20 xrays taken, and the Dentist did some poking around and determined that DH and I both needed a "deep" cleaning.

Our deductables will be about $38.00 each, but the insurance company will be billed $1400 for my cleaning and $2400 for DH. We will both need some numbing because this will be painful and will be carried out over two visits.

I'm just wondering if we are really in such bad shape or if this is a way to milk money out of insurance companies (I'm no fan of insurance companies). I've just never heard of going through some sort of an assessment prior to getting a cleaning.

Am I wrong to be suspect?

MichelleinMaine
06-04-2009, 07:56 PM
Unless you and your husband have some serious dental problems, that sounds nuts to me.

NikiM20
06-04-2009, 07:56 PM
I went to a dentist once and they tried the same thing. I switched to a new dentist. Now over 5 years later I am still ok, and still have all of my teeth ;) Our new dentist is someone I trust, I grew up with his kids so I have known him forever. Good Luck!!

kadesha
06-04-2009, 07:57 PM
sounds crazy to me!

lindsmom
06-04-2009, 08:03 PM
Wow... I can see why you'd be suspicious. I had missed a few (ahem - five ish) years of cleanings and I thought I'd be in trouble because my last dentist had said I had two cavities I needed to fill. When I finally went (after five ish years), they said my teeth looked great and couldn't believe it had been that long. I asked if there were any cavities and they said no. Hm. So I have a tendency to be suspicious of medical professionals...

It sounds like a lot of work they want to do to you, and unless you've only been eating chocolate and not brushing since your last visit (which if you're like me, you probably were taking better care because you knew you weren't going to the dentist soon), then I find it hard to believe that you need all that work.

I would warn you to check your coverage - I had a dentist (well, the hygienist) who wanted to spread my cleaning ("debridement") over two appointments because she didn't want to traumatize my gums too much, although I personally felt fine. Turns out my insurance only covered one visit per six months and I would have been on the hook for that second visit. Needless to say, it's now been a few years again since I've gone :rolleyes1

I'm sorry I don't know what more to say - I know there are often some dental professionals on this board, so maybe they can provide some more insight... just wanted to say I see where you're coming from, and I can understand your hesitation.

Joan S.
06-04-2009, 08:05 PM
Hi, A DENTIST tried this on my DH a few years ago,same thing evaluation,x-rays and come back for the DEEP CLEANING. I told my DH to go to my dentist and see what they said. They JUST cleaned his teeth and it was covered by our insurance. My dentist never said he needed anything more and years later he just gets his yearly cleaning and has NO dental problems. So this sounds like a SCAM to me!! Joan

penjen
06-04-2009, 08:05 PM
When I was in my early 20's I didn't go to the dentist since I didn't have insurance. Once I did I found one close and they looked at my teeth and did x-rays and told me I needed 4 fillings.:scared1:
I decided to get a second opinion since I rarely would get cavities as a kid. Went to the next dentist and they didn't find anything and were complimenting me on my teeth.
To think the first dentist was going to basically ruin my teeth for insurance money gets me so mad!

So no, I wouldn't get your work done!

robinb
06-04-2009, 08:11 PM
20 x-rays? You must be glowing! Even your "normal" 8-10 x-rays every 6 months is over the top. $1200+ for a cleaning? This sounds like a total scam to me. I would make sure you get those x-rays to bring to your next dentist. You paid a fortune for them already.

blondietink
06-04-2009, 08:12 PM
I have no dental insurance and only go for a cleaning at my local dentist once per year and they give me a discount because I have no insurance. Costs me less than $100.00 and I am good to go, although they would like me to go twice a year for cleanings but I said no. Sounds like you are getting scammed. :cool2:

eyeheartgoofy
06-04-2009, 08:13 PM
What??!! Are you sure it wasn't $140 and $240?

$1400 and $2400 sounds like the dentist needs a new boat ... not like you need a cleaning!

Diana Lyn
06-04-2009, 08:16 PM
The same EXACT thing recently happened to me. I went in after about 4-5 years. They took like 20 xrays, said they couldn't clean my teeth because I needed the deep cleaning, made it out like my teeth were about to fall out of my mouth. I'm in no pain, I have no problems.

They gave me a "treatment plan" that showed $4500 with minimal insurance coverage. So I asked them to verify the amount paid by my insurance, they said it was right. I contacted my insurance company and they said no way could the dentist tell what they would/would not pay without the insurance company seeing my xrays, treatment plan etc. I've gone back and forth over a month with this dentist now and they will not submit this info to the insurance company. That's enough of a red flag to me to run in the opposite direction. You should probably do the same.

blkhwks55
06-04-2009, 08:24 PM
This happened to my wife. She switched dentists to make it easier for my DD3 to go and get her teeth cleaned. My wife never had any problems and just had her teeth cleaned 6 mos earlier w/o any issues. The dental hygentist said they had to do a deep cleaning and never explained what she meant by it. The dentist came by and ok'd it. Well my insurance didn't cover it at all. We were liable for the bill, and to top it off when she switched back to my dentist, they said the other guy had to be a crook because the only way you'd have that done, is if it your teeth are in disgusting shape. That should never be done on a person who brushes regularly.

Tony

Poohbear5
06-04-2009, 08:27 PM
Don't go back there!!! Listen to your instincts!

We also had cavities disappear when we went to a new dentist. Our previous dentist appeared to have his staff on commission or profiting sharing. It was like going to a used car salesman.

My biggest regret is not changing sooner when my gut was telling me to do so. My son had inappropriate treatment that I will never forgive myself for authorizing to these sheisters.

Ask friends for a recommendation, call the state licensing dental board to check for complaints before starting with a new guy.

If your teeth are truly in such poor shape, they will still be lousy in 3-6 months so don't rush into something you may regret.

IluvKingLouis
06-04-2009, 08:34 PM
OP here! Please keep the comments coming. Trying to get DH agreeable to a second opinion even if it's on our own dime.

I have never had a cavity (nor did they find any), I'm a regular brusher and rarely eat sweets (don't like them). Now I am an on again off again flosser...I know bad.

Please keep your stories coming!

zgirl
06-04-2009, 08:35 PM
I had a dentist tell me my daughter had 5 cavities. I felt suspicious and got a second opinion from a friend's husband who is a dentist but didn't take our insurance. Sure enough - NO cavities! My daughter was 4 at the time. I hate to think about her getting 5 unnecessary fillings. I was LIVID!!! My daughter still has no fillings/cavities to date! Trust your instinct!!

LIFERBABE
06-04-2009, 08:36 PM
Yes, I think we were scammed for years from our dentist. I loved the office staff so we kept going back. Then we started comparing notes with others and it was as we suspected. We have good insurance and pay for supplemental dental. Everytime we went in, there was something expensive and wrong. Our insurance pays 80% but we were still on the hook for the 20% and that's alot when its the same thing over and over. Especially with DH. He needed a new crown every 6 months. They would crack, break etc. and i thought he was just eating incorrectly. But then my fillings started to break down in less than a year and I am a chondriac about my teeth!! I have Orthodontics so I was cleaning every 3 months and my fillings were still falling out!

Then, last month DH took my son for his eye exam. Our Co-pay is $5. We took him to an in-network Dr. and they charged him an additional Co-Pay of $20 even though we specifically requested a basic exam.
Well this Dr. is an Opthamologist that specializes in the "Health of the Eyes" and they checked my son without our consent or knowledge and billed our medical insurance for a medical procedure that cost about $200 bucks. I told her we did not ask for that, my son has no problems with his eyes except he broke his glasses! She said she would refund our co-pay but still bill the visit as an exam and a Dr. visit. I reported them to my insurance company. I pay enough already without these doctors padding the bills.

The clincher was my Physical last year. I get a call that I need to come back for my blood work results. I panic and rush over. They bill me another co pay and my insurance another dr. visit to tell me Im anemic, which i clearly was not due to other factors that were fully divulged and treated during my physical. I felt really ripped off, when I found out what they called me back for, even though I was only out $10 bucks.


So if you have good insurance and it pays quickly, watch out. All the Dr. offices will try to make you their best patient.:eek:

SandrA9810
06-04-2009, 08:37 PM
I had to get quite a few fillings when I went for the first time after like 6 years. Of course I did believe them, because even after the x-rays, they used a tiny camera and took pictures of every cavity. And showed them to me on the screen.

I'm mad because Kari had to have lots of work done and one tooth was pretty bad that they had to do a build up on the tooth and crown. But because she didn't need a root canal, the insurance wouldn't cover the cost of it. So on top of like the 1,000 out of pocket we had to pay (she went nee-noz), there's still a balance of like 500$.

But they still allow us to go get our teeth cleaned and stuff with the balance still there.

RobinFabulous
06-04-2009, 08:41 PM
I'm going to be the voice of dissention here.... Do you have any problems with your gums? Do they ever bleed? Do you smoke? Drink a lot of sugary things. Often deep cleanings are the precessor to dealing with gum disease. If you've gone for years without cleaning you could possibly have deposits under your gums. Deep cleaning is supposed to pull away the gums and clean under there. I had it done a few years ago, I had deposits under my gums. It was very expensive and I had a specialist do it. DH just had one done, in December, he's a smoker. Get a second opinion if you need to, but some of the extra x-rays could have been looking for bone loss.

My teeth are much better after mine, mine was very deep and I was lucky not to lose teeth or have any bone loss. I had partially impacted wisdom teeth and they allowed germs and plaque to get under my gum line. I had the dleaning, removed the wisdom teeth, and haven't had a problem since.

IluvKingLouis
06-04-2009, 08:47 PM
Robin,

I'm certain I have some bone loss. I do brush 3-4 times a day (I'm at home and brush after every meal/snack), and I'm an on again off again flosser.

I don't drink soft drinks (ice tea brewed at home and water), and I don't care for sweets.

I have no doubt that at 45 I have some problems as a result of aging. DH has cavities from way back when and it doesn't surprise me that his prognosis was so much worse then mine.

I will gladly have a deep cleaning done if that's what I need. Something about the whole visit didn't feel right.

There weren't even private rooms. There were half walls seperating each section so I could here everything that was being told to the other patients. It felt like an assembly line operation.

mommybrown
06-04-2009, 08:53 PM
I am a dental hygienist and understand all the confusion. I can only speak personally from the offices that I have worked at. HTH When we diagnose a deep cleaning (or perio scaling) it is based on the amount of bone loss, pocket depths, and tarter/calculus buildup. This is done by taking probing depths, x-rays, and a visual exam. Hopefully someone explained to you what they were doing and what the results were. As a professional I have no idea what insurance covers, I make my initial diagnosis based on exam. Technically a hygienist cannot make the diagnosis, only the dentist.
I do not guarantee a cleaning on the first visit as patients have varying levels of build up and stain. I have no way of knowing how much time to schedule. I feel that a rush cleaning does not promote good health. I have been in dentistry 16 years and have had patients who have been away from the dentist for many years and had very easy cleanings. I have also had those who have been absent for a year or two, and needed the deeper(perio) cleanings.
My advice to you is have the hygienist and/or dr. explain the results of your exam. Make sure that they can show you on your x-rays the bone loss or buildup. If you still are uncomfortable, by all means, get a second opinion. I have had patients in my chair, who after the exam, asked if they needed a deep cleaning. I have had to say no according to my exam. Hope that this helps a little, just like anything else opinions vary. I have seen dentists be very pro active and dentists be very lax. Personally, I prefer to have problems fixed when small, rather than "watch" them and they get bigger.
Sorry to hear that some of you have had bad experiences at the dentist.

RobinFabulous
06-04-2009, 08:54 PM
Robin,

I'm certain I have some bone loss. I do brush 3-4 times a day (I'm at home and brush after every meal/snack), and I'm an on again off again flosser.

I don't drink soft drinks (ice tea brewed at home and water), and I don't care for sweets.

I have no doubt that at 45 I have some problems as a result of aging. DH has cavities from way back when and it doesn't surprise me that his prognosis was so much worse then mine.

I will gladly have a deep cleaning done if that's what I need. Something about the whole visit didn't feel right.

There weren't even private rooms. There were half walls seperating each section so I could here everything that was being told to the other patients. It felt like an assembly line operation.


I'd try to find someone else. My deep cleaning was more than at a normal dentist, and so painful they normally do it in quadrants, mine was done by a Peridontist. DH's was much easier, and I do believe his dentist tried to scam him... They did the deep cleaning then had him come back for a regular cleaning a few weeks later. They also managed to sell him a waterpik, and charge more than his co-pay should have been. There are dishonest ones out there.
If you'd rather most Peridontists will see you without a referral, as they're able to do cleanings as well.

jameybano
06-04-2009, 09:00 PM
Something very similiar happened to me in December. When I arrived the dental office, the entire staff was new, including the dentist. She told me I had 8 cavities! ( I am 38 and had had only 2 my whole life). Something did not feel right, so I called my insurance company for a referral. Guess what? No cavities! And six months later...no cavities.
I can only guess the new dentist knew that I had good dental coverage and had a quota to make.

RobinFabulous
06-04-2009, 09:01 PM
This happened to my wife. She switched dentists to make it easier for my DD3 to go and get her teeth cleaned. My wife never had any problems and just had her teeth cleaned 6 mos earlier w/o any issues. The dental hygentist said they had to do a deep cleaning and never explained what she meant by it. The dentist came by and ok'd it. Well my insurance didn't cover it at all. We were liable for the bill, and to top it off when she switched back to my dentist, they said the other guy had to be a crook because the only way you'd have that done, is if it your teeth are in disgusting shape. That should never be done on a person who brushes regularly.

Tony

ABSOLUTELY INCORRECT. Plenty of people can have decent looking teeth with stuff below the gumline. Pockets are common in smokers and tabacco users as well.

surfergirl602
06-04-2009, 09:07 PM
All of these horror stories about dentists are freaking me out!!!

IluvKingLouis
06-04-2009, 09:07 PM
Wow....well the thing now bothering my Dh and I the most is the lack of Dr/Patient confidentiality (now that we're discussing this visit).

As I mentioned the initial consultation was done in rooms with half walls so while I was waiting to be seen I overheard the Dentist's visit with DH. This is bothering us as we are both believers in the Dr/Patient confidentiality.

Is this the new norm?

Stacerita
06-04-2009, 09:12 PM
OP here! Please keep the comments coming. Trying to get DH agreeable to a second opinion even if it's on our own dime.

I have never had a cavity (nor did they find any), I'm a regular brusher and rarely eat sweets (don't like them). Now I am an on again off again flosser...I know bad.

Please keep your stories coming!

You need to get a second opinion. If you are worried about the cost, see if you can find a dental school or a college/university with a dental program. See if you can get a visit with one of the students. Their work is monitored and will be checked. They are wanting to get it right, and aren't there to be paid.

pianoronni37
06-04-2009, 09:12 PM
This is a bit scary, as I've been away from the dentist for (yikes) 8 years. After I graduated high school I didn't think about it - then of course at 21 I lost insurance under my parents, and finally after getting my 2nd bachelor's degree I have a full time job with insurance. I'm now 26 years old... and I know that I have problems as my gums and teeth are always bothering me... but the cost!

$1400 for a deep cleaning??

Please let me know if this is right, or if this is a scam... because I'm pretty sure I"ll need one, but I'm VERY sure I can't afford that!!

Happy Smiling, and good luck with your dental woes!

eyeheartgoofy
06-04-2009, 09:24 PM
Wow....well the thing now bothering my Dh and I the most is the lack of Dr/Patient confidentiality (now that we're discussing this visit).

As I mentioned the initial consultation was done in rooms with half walls so while I was waiting to be seen I overheard the Dentist's visit with DH. This is bothering us as we are both believers in the Dr/Patient confidentiality.

Is this the new norm?

Honestly, I think it is the new norm. I haven't been to a dentist in years that has had actual doors on the treatment rooms (and I've had 3 dentists in the past 5 years due to various moves). Our dentist has small rooms, but there are archways as entrances, not real doors ... you can hear snippets of conversation from other rooms carrying down the hall. I guess it doesn't bother me b/c I don't tend to think of my dental history as top secret - but I can see how questions about the types of meds you are on or any changes in medical history might be sensitive.

My orthodontist didn't even have 1/2 doors ... it was like a beauty shop with 3 chairs on either side of a central island and each chair staffed with a hygienist.

* I just did a google search trying to figure out why dentists seem to lack doors these days ... I found a thread with someone searching for a "closed door dentist" b/c all the new offices have no doors. So, other people share your discomfort. I'd call around and/or ask co-workers or friends who they see. DH had an awfully rude dentist before we moved (I went to a different one). I asked one of my neighbors who they see afer we moved here ... it took us a good 6 months to get everyone appointments for cleanings b/c the recommended dentist was booked solid, but it was worth it! The guy is wonderful and his staff is so good with everyone. I now understand why we had to wait for so long to get appointments.

Good luck! :)

mommybrown
06-04-2009, 09:27 PM
This is just my opinion.
I have always preferred a private dental practice as opposed to those that are corporate owned. In a corporate owned practice, the providers change often. You may not have knowledge of the change until you are at the appointment. Most corporate providers are also able to provide a discount with your insurance, due to working out fees with them. I have been told, like previous poster stated, that patients felt like an assembly line. The privacy issues would also bother me as well. I have always believed in my gut instinct, if it didn't feel right leave. Your friends and family are the best referrals.
There are some great dentists out there so please do not be scared- do your research!!

StephMK
06-04-2009, 10:11 PM
Ugh, I feel your frustration of trying to find a decent dentist! I'd gone to the same dentist since I was 9! His son entered the practice & my whole family saw them (my parents still do) until we moved out of state.

I would like to think the dentist I first took my kids to was well meaning but over-zealous. She told me DD needed a tooth pulled, small mouth, but no prob, there would be any root, pop right out. There were no issues thankfully but a big root and not easy to pull. I felt horrible for DD though she was a trooper.

Then she tried to tell me DS had 4 cavities on his back teeth. And because each was between the back teeth, it billed as 8, plus she recommended gas and would not do them all at once, one "set" at a time, gas $68 each time. Grand total over $1k with us paying $600+ as the gas wouldn't be covered by ins but recommended for comfort.

I took them for a second opinion a few months later and was told no cavities. I questioned & explained his last appt, they looked again & saw some small spots but nothing they felt needed treatment or concern. I'm not happy with them either because there is no friendly feel to the office, we wait forever & have not had a decent talk with a dentist. It's convenient as they offer late hours. Also we somehow pay a good bit even though preventative is supposed to be covered. We're still on the hunt for a true family dentist.

I'd definitely get a second opinion. That is a lot of money to shell out and I'm sadly starting to learn that you just can't trust someone simply because they are a dr. If you wouldn't take the first estimate on a home repair, why do that for yourself if you're not certain?

skhermsmeyer
06-04-2009, 10:21 PM
Same thing happened to me in 2005. They said I needed a deep cleaning and an injection of something to bring my gums back up since they had "gone down". I only went in because I chipped my front tooth (had chipped it years before and it finally gave, a different dds did the original repair). They said they had to clean my teeth and do an eval. I was okay with a regular cleaning b/c I was due, but to hold off on the "deep cleaning" and the injection of stuff they wanted to put in 4 pockets (I forget the name). My sister was in dental school at the time in KS and I live in GA, and I told them I wanted to talk to her first. Well, they did it without my permission, so $1400 later out of pocket,:scared1: my teeth were in exactly the same shape and I didn't need any of it done. They did repair my chipped tooth and 2 days later, what they replaced came undone. They didn't call to verify my dental insurance and just made an assumption on what they "thought" the insurance would pay. :mad:
You're entitled to ALL of your x-rays. I'd pick them up and take them to a new dentist.

Piecey
06-04-2009, 10:24 PM
Wow, I was told I had cavaties awhile back by the Dentist I'd been seeing for years through elementary/high school (and had several cavaties filled with)..

On my last visit to get a cavity filled, he told me I had another cavity (that I magically hadn't had before, which I think is their way to get me in the door twice and bill insurance twice)
I was having surgery so never made it back to have that cavity filled and when I decided it was time, I switched dentists.

She found no cavity. I've been to three different dentists since then and they've never found this supposed cavity.

Shady, shady dentists!!

hopemax
06-04-2009, 10:36 PM
The cost has me going :scared1: I wondered if you were in NYC or something, but you are in CO like me. My dentist is in Arvada.

I was a very bad dental patient. My childhood dentist was arrested for assaulting a couple of his female patient . I was in 8th grade when that happened and I didn't go back to the dentist, except for one emergency, until last year, so 20 years between visits.

When the dentist did my evaluation, he gave me a list of exactly what I needed done, with the codes so I could check with other dentists, and what his fees were. First they did a full mouth debridement, and then I had the "deep" perio cleaning for the center teeth, both upper and lower. I just looked up the charges, and it was $139 for the lower, and same for the upper.

FYI, I went back and reread your concern about the openess. My dentist office has the partial walls too. There are about 7 spaces although it seems like only 2 are in use at a time. One for the dentist, and one for the hygienist. You can hear people talking as they are getting ready to leave or coming in. It seems like people are talking louder, more animated. But then it quiets down so you might hear a murmur, but not make out any words.

ZPT1022
06-04-2009, 10:54 PM
I didn't read any of the replies so here's my take. DH and I recently got new dental insurance and had to switch dentists. DH had a few cavities, I had 12. Now, that sounds like a lot for someone who has been regularly going and regularly brushing but I am losing the enamel from my teeth due to severe GERD (gastroesophageal reflux disease), so I knew this day was coming. The dentist was awesome. She kept suggesting we go for a second opinion because she knows how bad it must sound to switch dentists and all of a sudden need all this work done. She was all about letting us verify it so we knew she wasn't scamming us- which just made us trust her more than the already good vibe we had from her and the staff. She also suggested that DD needed sealants before braces went on, which was fine. DD needed a tooth pulled before having molds made for braces and she did it at no charge. We really won the dentist lottery with her, she's just great. Trust your gut on this one

bumbershoot
06-04-2009, 11:36 PM
This deep cleaning thing seems to be the new thing. It hasn't been offered to me yet, but I'm sure it's coming. With me, I've been complaining about something for a year, and the dude keeps telling me it's not a problem...but when my hubby went in, they never did a cleaning and said he had something like 8 cavities, he needed the deep cleaning.

Well he just had that done a few years ago. NO cavities a few years ago, when it had been upwards of 14 years since his last appt. Now it's been only a few years, a whole bunch of cavities, and he has to have this done again? Yeah, no. It doesn't seem right.

But it's the same dentist that I see, and he's the longtime dentist of a good friend, and he hasn't said these things to US... Then again hubby didn't like him, and the dude is charming beyond charming...so something's weird.


He did have one filling done, but he hasnt' gone back for the others, because of money. Also b/c when he went in for that filling, they handed him the sheet with the other cavities...and the number had multiplied. It's WEIRD.

And we know they have another patient with the same name, b/c they asked if his middle initial was something else, when I made the appointment for him. I cannot help but wonder if they've gotten files mixed up.


We know from experience with DS that what one DDS sees as a cavity, another doesn't. It would be interesting to see how various dental schools teach, b/c there's such a difference. First DDS son saw found only the obvious problems, but was nervous to work with him b/c he was only 1 and she isn't a ped DDS. Found another, and he was a piece of work. Found the obvious problems and wanted to pull those two teeth, saw a big cavity that would probably require those teeth pulled (so that meant the top front FOUR teeth, all gone), then multiple "spots" that were cavities and they needed to be filled. Under General. In office. We'd have to coordinate benefits and get the anesthesiologist and his nurse from the hospital...yeah whatever.

Found another guy...he filled the cavity with NO drugs or gas, pulled the two obvious teeth with just a hint of lidocaine, and has been watching the spots for the last 2+ years, and they haven't changed at all.

Second opinions are good.



There weren't even private rooms. There were half walls seperating each section so I could here everything that was being told to the other patients. It felt like an assembly line operation.

As to that, I have NEVER been to a dentist with a full wall and door. Well, DS's dentist has a private room for the littlest kids who are going to cry. The rest of his office is totally open, once you're out of the waiting room. My dentist just has cabinet/partial walls between each station, the first dentist we took son to had cabinets as well.

I would never ever EVER feel safe in a room that's totally closed, since dentists don't always have someone with them while they are looking at your teeth. Scary scary. IMO.

Floridagal23
06-04-2009, 11:45 PM
I'd get a second opinion. You can go to a periodontist and pay OOP for a better cleaning by their hygenist for way less.

On a different note, I go to the dentist very regularly and developed 11 cavities over the course of a year. I was studying for the bar exam and drinking really sugary coffee drinks and vitamin water and didn't floss. The cavities were all photographed by my dentist, who owns an office in the same medical building as my dad's and we really trust him. I don't have dental insurance but get a discount through his office bc of my dad. So..maybe he's not scamming you, but for peace of mind, get a 2nd opinion, and for a deep cleaning, I'd see a periodontist.

RobinFabulous
06-05-2009, 06:19 AM
Wow....well the thing now bothering my Dh and I the most is the lack of Dr/Patient confidentiality (now that we're discussing this visit).

As I mentioned the initial consultation was done in rooms with half walls so while I was waiting to be seen I overheard the Dentist's visit with DH. This is bothering us as we are both believers in the Dr/Patient confidentiality.

Is this the new norm?

It's the new norm. We started seeing it in children's practices about 5 years ago here. Also the new children's practices want you to stay in the waiting room & have a "gallery" so you can walk by and check. They're trying to maxamize space I think. Usually offices that are designed like this do have a couple rooms for procedures, or people who aren't comfortable. When you find someone else if thier office is open, just tell them it makes you uncomfortable and can they put you in a room.

And FWIW we live in a pretty poor area... My peridontal cleaning was almost $5k, my pockets were 6's, 7's, and some 8's. I was given a flouride rinse and came back in a month (because the flouride can stain your teeth) where they cleaned them and the pockets were down to 4's 5's and one 6. Three years later I don't have anything beyond a 3.

DH's were all 6's and 7's I believe (I didn't go with him) and his after his six month check were down to 4's and 5's

happygirl
06-05-2009, 06:40 AM
Has the dentist seen your X rays??

rottiemom
06-05-2009, 06:48 AM
Wow....well the thing now bothering my Dh and I the most is the lack of Dr/Patient confidentiality (now that we're discussing this visit).

As I mentioned the initial consultation was done in rooms with half walls so while I was waiting to be seen I overheard the Dentist's visit with DH. This is bothering us as we are both believers in the Dr/Patient confidentiality.

Is this the new norm?

I suspect that it's the new norm. I'm all for it! I've got to tell you that I have big issues when it comes to going to the dentist...BIG issues. I finally forced myself to go 2 years ago when I thought that I had broken a tooth. My husband had to practically put me in a carrying crate to get me into the office to see his dentist. The first thing that I noticed was that everything was out in the open, nothing was hidden. For me, this is what made it possible for me to get into the chair. And honestly, I've never noticed the conversations that might be going on in the other areas so I think that if you make it a point to keep your voice down you should be OK.

I suggest that you get a second opinion on the deep cleaning. It may very well need to be done (many factors, including pregnancy, can wreak havoc on teeth) but a second opinion with a periodontist will help you know for sure.

After not having gone to the dentist for years (seriously...years) I needed a deep cleaning and it was just as Robinfabulous described. They did it in quadrants. I opted not to have novicane, rather the hygenist used numbing gel. I have to tell you that the numbing gel is a miracle & I hardly felt anything. No needles & no novicane charge, either. My hygenist is also wonderful (I describe my visits as similar to taking my dog to obedience school...lots of praise & positive reinforcement :)) and that's a huge part of it. 4 separate visits, my x rays are right on the screen in front of us so that the hygeinist can see what she needed to go after & show me what she was going to do. I now go for regular cleanings & do not have to be brought into the office in restraints :rotfl:.

Good luck with this!

MermaidsMom
06-05-2009, 07:00 AM
I had a dentist start to CRY 20 years ago because he said I needed 5 crowns immediately or my teeth would splinter apart!!!! CRY! Well guess what, the teeth are still here......and working.

polineedyan
06-05-2009, 07:04 AM
At the risk of exposing myself, I will tell you this. At one point in my life, I had gone well over 10 years without a dental visit. Even THEN, my dentist just did the usual cleaning (when I finally decided to go.) So this 'deep cleaning' Im not so sure about. I would agree with the other posters. Get another dentist. Even if you have to go outside the plan, i would see that it would still probably less out of pocket. Either way, is this the person you would trust to do OTHER work on your choppers? I dunno...:rolleyes1

goofy5
06-05-2009, 07:56 AM
wow! that does seem pretty high. when I have a standard checkup and cleaning they do take xrays. normally a complete set. then cleaning and exam. deep cleaning may mean alot of plauqe or something. but 1400 and 2400 for cleaning checkup, xray seems way too high

starwood
06-05-2009, 08:14 AM
Another thing being pushed by dentists is some new oral cancer screening procedure. Supposedly it can detect oral cancer before it shows any symptoms. They couldn't tell me if it was covered under insurance. I don't think so.

Psychodisney
06-05-2009, 08:27 AM
I was recommended for scaling and laser treatments a couple of weeks ago. I get my teeth cleaned every four months and was an occassional flosser. The qoute was $1400.

I have a couple of thoughts. One, with the economy my dentist is hurting. People are putting things off. If they get a customer in the chair, the want to keep them coming back for more.
This scaling thing must be the new trend. They eplaced everyone's fillings over the past few years, now they need something new.

Lewisc
06-05-2009, 08:51 AM
Deep cleaning=scaling=root planing=periodontal treatment. It's certainly possibly a person who hasn't seen a dentist in years requires this kind of treatment. You can get a second opinion, none of us are dentists (or if there is a dentist in this thread they haven't examined you). I'll agree with the PP, at least some dentists may be suggesting "deep cleaning" even it it's not absolutely needed.

Does your dentist participate with your plan? The insurance company may require pre-approval and will probably be paying a lower "negotiated fee". Check your plan, you may have lower periodontal limits.

Not covered by insurance? Second opionion confims the treatment plan? You can probably find a lower price if you check around.

caribear
06-05-2009, 09:12 AM
I had the same thing happen to me. I went to a new dentist on my dental plan. On the 1st visit they took a zillion extrays and then the dentist comes in and takes a look. Then the hygenist comes back in and says I need a deep scaling which is NOT covered by my insurance. I told her I would just like a regular cleaning like what is covered under my insurance. She refuses....saying they do not do regular cleanings when there is so much that needs to be done. She comes up with this payment plan where I come back 4seperate times to do each quadrant of my mouth. I was so upset. She did do a debridement and charged me $89...then I was supposed to set up the 4 appts. for the deep cleaning/scaling. I never went back to that dentist. When I found another dentist I told her about what had happened and she named the dentist right off the bat. Turns out many of her other clients had the same story! She said my teeth looked great and I had a regular cleaning.

A couple of years before this I had a deep cleaning in one quadrant that required numbing the area. My insurance at the time paid for it so I didn't really question it at the time. I think the deep cleaning/scaling is a new thing that most dentist will try to convince you to do. More money for them as far as I am concerned......and they try to tell you it is needed. My current dentist is a one-person office and she has been around forever....a very homey feeling and she does not charge inflated prices....just takes care of your teeth.

BeckyScott
06-05-2009, 09:20 AM
Around here, there seems to be two "types" of dentists.

The first is more of an old-school variety. They want your teeth to be mostly there, not rotten, and functional.

The second pushes for a magazine-worthy smile and doesn't understand why anyone wouldn't want to fork over thousands of dollars.

We tried the second. Ended up very dissatisfied with the work that they did do, and in fact with my DH they caused more harm than good. Got tired of them pushing stuff on us that we didn't want and couldn't afford. And when they did mess up, instead of fixing the mistake (which is what you would expect from a business) they wanted him to make an appointment several months out, pay for it, and acted like it couldn't have possibly had anything to do with his previous treatment.

Nope. Not going back.

The "old school" dentist took a look at him, fixed what was wrong on the spot, got him the meds that he now needed, and scooted him right thru without a mention of thousands of dollars worth of additional work that was optional.

I also just love how dentists (and several other doctors like that) now offer some sort of credit card sign-up if you want expensive work done. Part of the sales pitch. Sure it will cost $500 for whitening that you didn't ask for anyway and that insurance won't cover, but they also won't take payments for it, you can apply for this magical credit card. Then you can have white teeth and owe for it for 2 years. Do what? I didn't go there wanting my teeth whitened, I know they could use it but I think maybe we should pay our electric bill instead. :rolleyes1

The other thing was... DS has autism and has major problems with dentists. If he needs *real* work done we have to take him to the children's hospital and have him sedated and do it as an outpatient surgery. Now, he is on Medicaid, so we didn't pay for this, but you know the taxpayers did. Because DS wouldn't let a dentist do a good exam, we knew he had at least one cavity but we didn't know what else was going on. The dentist had to put him out to do the exam, and then there was no consultation as he was in surgery, he just did what he wanted as he found things. DS came out with a mouthfull of caps, I believe six total. Including one, I was told, on a molar that was due to fall out within a month. (and indeed it did) Why why why would you cap a tooth that was about ready to fall out?

perriwinkleblue
06-05-2009, 10:03 AM
I will go with the majority here that says to trust your instincts. Because of a similar situation we went back to our old dentist even though he's now about an hour away. He is a great dentist and is honest and reasonable. There are lots of good dentists out there and those are the ones that deserve our $$. I truly believe that some of these practices have turned into profit-factories preying on the fact that we sometimes feel a little guilty and knowing that we have little understanding of what they're recommending. :sad2:

As far as the office not having private rooms - that may be the new "norm" but, to me, it's totally unacceptable. :scared1: That alone would turn me away.

etoiles
06-05-2009, 10:13 AM
We also had the same experience. We moved 4 hrs away from our home town and went to a new dentist there because it was too much of a pain to drive 4hrs to see our old, very honest, family dentist. We had not gone to a dentist in three years.

Bad mistake!! This new dentist had the attitude of "daddy needs a new pair of shoes" and did a 'pre-exam' first and told me that I needed $1200 worth of dental work and that DH needed $1400 worth of dental work. I know my teeth are not great and constantly have problems but there is NO WAY they needed THAt much work!!

Drove back 4 hrs to our old dentist. Was about $400 total between DH and I.

Told the honest dentist about the dishonest one and he said there are some out there that see any little spot and like to call it a cavity even when it is not. Now we live closer but we still drive 2 hrs to go back to our old dentist because I know he is completely honest and is not going to drill into our teeth for something unnecessary. The 2 hr drive is 100% worth it.

jimaok
06-05-2009, 10:19 AM
Sounds like the dentist needs some money for his upcoming WDW trip.

IluvKingLouis
06-05-2009, 12:35 PM
Well I've come to the realization that the open floor plan must be the new norm. Could be because there have been some sleazebag dentists who've taken advantage of female patients (under gas) and this protects both the dentists and the patients.

Our out of pocket will only be $38.00 each. So I'm certainly not complaining about that. I was just floored to hear about how extensive the work would need to be. My pockets were mostly 3's, some 4's, a couple of 5's and one 6. This whole number thing was completely new to me.

We checked with our insurance and he is the only one in our area. The one in the town 15 miles away is also one of these chain places. It does not appear that there are any "traditional" dentists participating in this plan.

TheBigBadWolf
06-05-2009, 01:30 PM
I so appreciate you posting this, OP. It has really opened my eyes. I have fallen for the deep scale cleaning procedure not once, but TWICE!!! The first time was when I first started going to my dentist, she insisted I needed it and so I had it done. I believe it cost $1200. The second time being after I went one year without a cleaning, and she was guilting me so bady about having my teeth cleaned twice or four times a year. I've always known my dentist is the most expensive one in this area, but going to her is so pleasurable, it's almost like a spa atmosphere at her clinic. She's very gentle and I've never experienced any pain with any procedure, unlike with the dentists I have used in the past. But after reading this thread I am now realizing she's probablyy done dental work on me that I didn't need, just to use up my yearly quota of insurance money. I've always accepted what she told me as fact, thinking she was the professional and knew what was best for my teeth. :rotfl: Thanks so much for the heads up on crooked dentists, out to make a killing off their patients. I will most definitely be a more savvy dental patient in the future!

IluvKingLouis
06-05-2009, 01:37 PM
I so appreciate you posting this, OP. It has really opened my eyes. I have fallen for the deep scale cleaning procedure not once, but TWICE!!! The first time was when I first started going to my dentist, she insisted I needed it and so I had it done. I believe it cost $1200. The second time being after I went one year without a cleaning, and she was guilting me so bady about having my teeth cleaned twice or four times a year. I've always known my dentist is the most expensive one in this area, but going to her is so pleasurable, it's almost like a spa atmosphere at her clinic. She's very gentle and I've never experienced any pain with any procedure, unlike with the dentists I have used in the past. But after reading this thread I am now realizing she's probablyy done dental work on me that I didn't need, just to use up my yearly quota of insurance money. I've always accepted what she told me as fact, thinking she was the professional and knew what was best for my teeth. :rotfl: Thanks so much for the heads up on crooked dentists, out to make a killing off their patients. I will most definitely be a more savvy dental patient in the future!


BadWolf,

I really don't know if my Dentist is dishonest....it just didn't sit right with me. After reading over all these posts I've come to the conclusion that an open office floor plan is normal and that some folks do require a deep cleaning.

I'm sure deep cleaning is recommended as folks get older, and I am 46. I might call up an old dentist who I thought was great (but he's not on the plan) and see if I can get a quick OOP evaluation from him.

RobinFabulous
06-05-2009, 01:46 PM
I so appreciate you posting this, OP. It has really opened my eyes. I have fallen for the deep scale cleaning procedure not once, but TWICE!!! The first time was when I first started going to my dentist, she insisted I needed it and so I had it done. I believe it cost $1200. The second time being after I went one year without a cleaning, and she was guilting me so bady about having my teeth cleaned twice or four times a year. I've always known my dentist is the most expensive one in this area, but going to her is so pleasurable, it's almost like a spa atmosphere at her clinic. She's very gentle and I've never experienced any pain with any procedure, unlike with the dentists I have used in the past. But after reading this thread I am now realizing she's probablyy done dental work on me that I didn't need, just to use up my yearly quota of insurance money. I've always accepted what she told me as fact, thinking she was the professional and knew what was best for my teeth. :rotfl: Thanks so much for the heads up on crooked dentists, out to make a killing off their patients. I will most definitely be a more savvy dental patient in the future!

Some people are more predisposed to dental problems. My oldest has never had a cavity. My middle child had 4 before 4. I have a heart problem and I seem to have weaker teeth.

There are things you can do to make your teeth better. cessation of smoking or smokless tabacco, daily flossing, good mouthwash, good toothbrushing.

It's just the difference between some people catching a cold every few months, and some never getting them. Don't assume the dentist is crooked. Get a second opinion if you aren't positive.

TheBigBadWolf
06-05-2009, 01:59 PM
Oh, it isn't just the two deep scale cleanings that lead me to believe my dentist is a little "money hungry". I've been going to her for 5-6 years now and I know her much better than before. :laughing: She has since recommended procedures that I didn't agree with. I think I probably needed the first deep scale cleaning, as I had been without dental insurance for a couple of years prior and hadn't gone to the dentist regularly. Since then I have quit smoking, bought a Sonicare toothbrush and a waterpik, floss regularly and generally take very good care of my teeth and gums. I haven't had a cavity in over 20 years. I have my teeth cleaned every three months now and they're in good shape. I just meant this thread has opened my eyes that all dentists aren't completely honest in what their patients need, and will often go the route that will earn them the most money. I just never dreamed it was so widespread until reading this thread!

RobinFabulous
06-05-2009, 02:04 PM
Oh, it isn't just the two deep scale cleanings that lead me to believe my dentist is a little "money hungry". I've been going to her for 5-6 years now and I know her much better than before. :laughing: She has since recommended procedures that I didn't agree with. I think I probably needed the first deep scale cleaning, as I had been without dental insurance for a couple of years prior and hadn't gone to the dentist regularly. Since then I have quit smoking, bought a Sonicare toothbrush and a waterpik, floss regularly and generally take very good care of my teeth and gums. I haven't had a cavity in over 20 years. I have my teeth cleaned every three months now and they're in good shape. I just meant this thread has opened my eyes that all dentists aren't completely honest in what their patients need, and will often go the route that will earn them the most money. I just never dreamed it was so widespread until reading this thread!


We have a few dishonest ones here. It's like any medical care, you have to go with your gut and be willing to get another opinion

look1angel
06-05-2009, 02:15 PM
I worked in the dental feild for over 8 years. A FMX (Full Mouth Series can be as many as 16 - 18 film) is not uncommen for adults who have gone a few years with no dental check-ups & who may have periodontal disease.

This can get to be expensive once you begin adding in the deep cleaning & if you need to be anesthetized. We've had patients come in & with no problem get it all done in one visit. I myself needed a deep cleaning on just one of my quadrants (upper left side) I got a local & was done in 20 mins.

I can't tell you how many people have sat in our chair & have really poor oral hygeine due to lack of proper dental care & then begin to complain about the cost in what it'll take to clean them up.

I am in no way saying this is your case, but I would & encourage you to get a second opinion & we do tell our patients to do this as well.

I worked with the best & the worst but over all I've worked with the best.

Good luck

JerseyMamaBear
06-05-2009, 02:18 PM
wow good to know that dentists are trying this stunt. I will keep that in mind for my next cleaning.

pilesoflaundry
06-05-2009, 02:41 PM
Get a second opinion. I just went through the same thing. Something seemed iffy to me so I got a second opinion. New dentist said I did not need the periodontal scaling the other dentist said I did. It was going to be $400 per quad out of pocket for me. I'm glad I got the second opinion!

fac
06-05-2009, 05:18 PM
What??!! Are you sure it wasn't $140 and $240?

$1400 and $2400 sounds like the dentist needs a new boat ... not like you need a cleaning!

That's sometimes how I thought about some dental professionals.:)

GOOFY4DONALD
06-05-2009, 05:42 PM
2400 for a cleaning???? I heard a radio commercial for a full set of dentures for 2500. :lmao:

JLKennedy
06-05-2009, 05:45 PM
Some people are more predisposed to dental problems. My oldest has never had a cavity. My middle child had 4 before 4. I have a heart problem and I seem to have weaker teeth.

There are things you can do to make your teeth better. cessation of smoking or smokless tabacco, daily flossing, good mouthwash, good toothbrushing.

It's just the difference between some people catching a cold every few months, and some never getting them. Don't assume the dentist is crooked. Get a second opinion if you aren't positive.

You are so right. My oldest has the ideal "perfect" teeth, or as perfect as you can get with a very slight (paper width) gap in her front teeth. Our pediatric dentist (who is a new solo practice out of dental school), is great. I love Dr. Andy! He basically said if she were his kid, he wouldn't pay for braces....our son on the other hand....whoa nelly! What a bad set of teeth. He is 4 and is going on Tuesday for 3 pulpotomies and 5 caps. He has 1 or 2 caries but has a lot of decay from "baby bottle syndrome."

DH teeth same way...my teeth, like DD. I think proper dental hygiene is a must. And FWIW, I too had a deep cleaning, after I had my braces removed. I wanted to ensure all cement was gone and my pockets were at about 3's. I do have one that is about a 5, but that is also the tooth that my bracket was on and bothered me the most. My dentist may laser some gum off to prevent any periodontal/gingivital issue later in life b/c flossing (seriously, after each meal) isn't improving it.

As for your x-rays, were they standard filmed radio's or on the computer? And to take that many, is sorry, a bit retarded...why not just take a pan and get all the images in one including any bone loss?

I don't think it is a scam, especially if you haven't been to the dentist in years. If you go every 6 months as recommended, and he pitched a "deep cleaning", I'd be suspicious.

Also, the deep cleaning is NOT very painful at all. Your gums will be red, swollen and sensitive, but it's not like "drilling without novacaine". It really, IMO is not any worse than a normal scaling.

DwarfMaster
06-05-2009, 06:22 PM
Do you have any problems with your gums? ......Deep cleaning is supposed to pull away the gums and clean under there. I had it done a few years ago, I had deposits under my gums. It was very expensive and I had a specialist do it.

Deep cleaning=scaling=root planing=periodontal treatment.

Yep ~ I recently had this done. My teeth are in great shape - no cavities :thumbsup2 But my gums are a mess :sad2:

I did get a second opinion & both dentists agreed that I really needed to have this done. It cost me OOP about $200, the "cleaning" itself was around $2000 plus XRays. Your estimates don't seem too far out there to me ~ Great CoPay.
It was done in 2 trips. Not too too painful, just very sore afterwards.

figment52
06-05-2009, 07:01 PM
I've never had an insurance policy that covered more than $1000/year for dental. PLEASE check your policy before you agree on anything else.

sk!mom
06-05-2009, 07:31 PM
Hi, A DENTIST tried this on my DH a few years ago,same thing evaluation,x-rays and come back for the DEEP CLEANING. I told my DH to go to my dentist and see what they said. They JUST cleaned his teeth and it was covered by our insurance. My dentist never said he needed anything more and years later he just gets his yearly cleaning and has NO dental problems. So this sounds like a SCAM to me!! Joan

Same thing happened to my DH. It had only been six months since his last cleaning. Our dentist had retired and instead of going to the dentist I found he went to a new one nearer his office. They made similar recommendations as those above. He made an appointment with mine- they cleaned his teeth, said he looked great, and sent him on his way. Ten years later he still has never had that deep cleaning or any cavities. BTW- he's only had 2 cavaties in his life.

daisyyy
06-05-2009, 07:33 PM
I think it's suspicious.... Several years ago, my husband went to a dentist, who was recommended by a friend after we moved and needed a new dentist. We went to him for a few visits, and realized he was billing our insurance for things he didn't do. (I can't remember the exact proceedures, but, we remember calling him about it, and of course he said it was probably just a mistake, and they would straighten it out... (of course they didn't since he was already paid by the insurance company).. but the next time it happened, we called the insurance company, and told them they shouldn't pay the dentist for the proceedures he didn't do. Once again he said it must be a mistake. (It was a small place, family business, never more than one patient at a time, and the dentist did the cleanings himself.).. I never saw it busy that there should always be a mistake.. We always caught it because we looked at the bill that we got in the mail that showed us what the insurance company paid vs what our portion was. . in anycase, we decided to switch dentists, since we just didn't trust him. We were afraid he would do unnecessary work. So... end of story... trust yourself, if you think it doesn't sound right, there's other dentists out there. Not all of them are bad.

brooklynheights
06-05-2009, 09:11 PM
I had not gone to the dentist in over 5 years having had a great dentist who retired I was afraid to go again my old denist was great I found a new dentist he let me have a interview with him 45 minutes talking to him seeing and hearing what he does he even looked in my mouth told me i had no cavites:thumbsup2 just needed a routine cleaning I chose him as my dentist so 18 months later when he said I had a "nice cavity" :scared1:I let him fill it (I was scared to death)and he made sure I was comfortable and made it thur it I would not trust this it does sound like insurance jackpot for the dentist some dentists like to take advantage of them

disneymom3
06-05-2009, 10:24 PM
OP here! Please keep the comments coming. Trying to get DH agreeable to a second opinion even if it's on our own dime.

I have never had a cavity (nor did they find any), I'm a regular brusher and rarely eat sweets (don't like them). Now I am an on again off again flosser...I know bad.

Please keep your stories coming!

You know, a lot of dentists around here will do a first consult for free. Look around for one of those and make sure you get those x-rays! If your insurance is anything like mine they won't pay for the full set of x-rays except every three years.

mom2brina
06-05-2009, 11:05 PM
Just curious, is this dentist part of a national chain or franchise? Affordable Dentistry, or Heartland Dentistry??? On my last visit, my dentist and I were talking about the changes that dentistry has seen recently, and she mentioned that there are some companies that are trying to create a sort of national 'store', or brand for dentistry. She likened it to Lenscrafters. Instead of going to see an eye Dr. in their own office like most other Dr.'s, you go to that national brand name store. Anyway, she went on to say that she has had a few new patients come to her with these "treatment plans" and they are totally bogus. I asked her, what about the insurance companies ... isn't this fraud? She said that they are very carefull about the way that it is worded in the plans. I would definitely be getting a second opinion if I were you!!

MK2thcleaner
06-06-2009, 12:42 AM
As for your x-rays, were they standard filmed radio's or on the computer? And to take that many, is sorry, a bit retarded...why not just take a pan and get all the images in one including any bone loss?

A "pan" or panoramic xray, while filled with certain details actually does a poor job of showing bone loss and cavities.

OP, since you had an uneasy feeling about the treatment plan, I would echo previous sentiments and get a second opinion. Having said that, with the further information about your perio readings, I do think it's quite possible that the diagnosis is accurate. Some dentists, like some people, are bad apples.

Yes, open treatment areas are more common in newer offices, kind of like open floor plans in new homes.

If there is a dental or dental hygiene school near you, as a PP suggested, I would suggest a visit. Schools will take more time, but much less money. You can be assured that you will receive thorough care, as a student and an instructor will exam and treat you. At our school, appointments are 3 1/2 hours long, and a patient can require mulitiple visits to get totally completed, but the cost makes it worth it if you have the time. My private practice office charges around $1000 for full mouth scaling and root planing(deep cleaning) including exam and xrays, but the school charges $100 for the same treatment. 10% makes it worth it!!!

Periodontal disease is on the rise. 2-3 of every 4 patients has some form of it. Don't ignore it just because you think the dentist wants a new boat or to make the car payment. Find out the signs and symptoms and see where you fit in. Do your gums bleed when you brush or floss, do you have bad breath or a bad taste in your mouth, do your teeth look longer-the gums pulled away, do you have red gums rather than pink, do your teeth wiggle in their sockets, does gum disease run in the family or does a family member have dentures that they got because of teeth "falling out"? All of these are questions to ask yourself.

Cavities: chew xylitol gum or suck mints. it will help. read up on it. Cavities are a disease that is spread. We can give it to our children. Kill the bacteria, stop the cavities. xylitol will help with that!

Finally I will share one last story. I had a patient a few weeks ago that needed full mouth scaling and root planing. She had been having regular cleanings back east, but just moved to my area. She walked in thinking she'd be getting the same, but had no idea that her gums were in bad shape. She had large amounts of tartar build up throughout her mouth-EVERY TOOTH-under the gums and above the gums. It was black and hard to remove. She was a difficult patient to deal with for many reasons including her need to spit into a kleenex and/or cup rather than swallow her own spit as I worked, even though I was rinsing and suctioning her thoroughly every minute or so. All this takes lots of extra time. I truly believe that her last dental hygienist didn't want to take the time to give her the treatment she needed. She is high maintenance, so why not just polish her up and get her out of there? It's very sad because she'd been treated regularly, but never FULLY treated. I said all that to prove that there are times when the new office is being truthful in their treatment plan.

My job is to present the information, your job is to decide what to do with it.

Good luck with your decision!

RobinFabulous
06-06-2009, 07:20 AM
A "pan" or panoramic xray, while filled with certain details actually does a poor job of showing bone loss and cavities.

OP, since you had an uneasy feeling about the treatment plan, I would echo previous sentiments and get a second opinion. Having said that, with the further information about your perio readings, I do think it's quite possible that the diagnosis is accurate. Some dentists, like some people, are bad apples.

Yes, open treatment areas are more common in newer offices, kind of like open floor plans in new homes.

If there is a dental or dental hygiene school near you, as a PP suggested, I would suggest a visit. Schools will take more time, but much less money. You can be assured that you will receive thorough care, as a student and an instructor will exam and treat you. At our school, appointments are 3 1/2 hours long, and a patient can require mulitiple visits to get totally completed, but the cost makes it worth it if you have the time. My private practice office charges around $1000 for full mouth scaling and root planing(deep cleaning) including exam and xrays, but the school charges $100 for the same treatment. 10% makes it worth it!!!

Periodontal disease is on the rise. 2-3 of every 4 patients has some form of it. Don't ignore it just because you think the dentist wants a new boat or to make the car payment. Find out the signs and symptoms and see where you fit in. Do your gums bleed when you brush or floss, do you have bad breath or a bad taste in your mouth, do your teeth look longer-the gums pulled away, do you have red gums rather than pink, do your teeth wiggle in their sockets, does gum disease run in the family or does a family member have dentures that they got because of teeth "falling out"? All of these are questions to ask yourself.

Cavities: chew xylitol gum or suck mints. it will help. read up on it. Cavities are a disease that is spread. We can give it to our children. Kill the bacteria, stop the cavities. xylitol will help with that!

Finally I will share one last story. I had a patient a few weeks ago that needed full mouth scaling and root planing. She had been having regular cleanings back east, but just moved to my area. She walked in thinking she'd be getting the same, but had no idea that her gums were in bad shape. She had large amounts of tartar build up throughout her mouth-EVERY TOOTH-under the gums and above the gums. It was black and hard to remove. She was a difficult patient to deal with for many reasons including her need to spit into a kleenex and/or cup rather than swallow her own spit as I worked, even though I was rinsing and suctioning her thoroughly every minute or so. All this takes lots of extra time. I truly believe that her last dental hygienist didn't want to take the time to give her the treatment she needed. She is high maintenance, so why not just polish her up and get her out of there? It's very sad because she'd been treated regularly, but never FULLY treated. I said all that to prove that there are times when the new office is being truthful in their treatment plan.

My job is to present the information, your job is to decide what to do with it.

Good luck with your decision!


Thanks for that, very informative

tiggertabi
06-06-2009, 07:25 AM
I went to a new dentist last year because my tooth was bothering me, i was sure that I had a cavity. I talk to them, they told me that I needed a $500 not covered by insurance guard for sleeping. I walked out of there angry but also hopeful that i would not have the pain anymore. I switched dentists, however, because I did feel like I was at a car sales office, pressured to do whatever they said. My new dentist said I didn't need anything, and even if I did they should have had me try one of the cheap ones from teh store first to see if it helped the problem at all... Needless to say I was pretty angry.

LKHomemail
06-06-2009, 11:36 AM
my mum had a dentist that would constactly scale / pick at her caps with the tool thing. she ended up having at least two crowns per year . she finally caught on. she is way too trusting. she would max out 2K in dental insurance a year and have at least 1K out of pocket.

i once went to a new dentist and was told i had six cavaties. i went for a second opinion and they said none. i think some dentists can be like auto mechanics and find or invent things wrong. there should be some sort of undercover sting to bust these bad dentists. i'd love to see a MSNBC special invenstigation.

tpclady
06-06-2009, 12:15 PM
I came online looking for new mouse info and saw this post and HAD to reply! I have no idea if your new dentist is good or bad but I thought you needed a little dental info from somebody who knows a little about what they are talking about.... 1st - deep cleanings have nothing to do with cavities, it is gum disease, 2nd- a good dentist wants to see you for a consult/eval/ appraisal whatever you want to call it before they jump into a routine cleaning. If you do need a deep cleaning and they do a routine cleaning you will have wasted your money and your insurance is likely to pay nothing for the needed treatment stating they just paid for a cleaning. 3rd- a 'FMX' is needed every 3-5 years which consists of 18 individual xrays and "bwx' are needed 1-2x a year which consists of 2-4 individual xrays. If a particular tooth is being looked at they might need a 'pa' of it which would be in addition to the standard 'bwx'. 4th- dental ins now a days is really dental assistance not ins. Most only pay $1000-1500 a year in benefits and that amount has not changed since the 70's even though fees have changed. In 1970 $1000 would get you 4-5 new crowns and now it will barely get you 1! 5th- $1400 sounds right for a full mouth deep cleaning, they are $300-400 per quad (UR,LR,UL,LL) depending on where you live. 6th- as with everything, there are agressive and conservative dentists. 1-3mm pockets are normal and some dentists will rec. more treatment when you go above that, but some dentists won't rec treatment until you have 6-8mm pockets. A happy med is somewhere between those, when you have 5-6mm pockets you need to get treatment, if you wait longer it won't get better and you will have bone loss that can't be repaired.
Remember this- Your mouth is a major part of your body, bacteria gets into your bloodstream everytime you brush your teeth when your gums bleed, healthy gums don't bleed during brushing. Gum disease is directly linked to heart disease, premature birth, uncontrolled diabetes and lots of other ailments. Dentures are miserable! They make it very hard to eat healthy foods like fruits and vegetables. When you can't eat healthy, your body won't be healthy. The condition of your mouth affects the quality of your life!popcorn::

RobinFabulous
06-06-2009, 12:52 PM
2400 for a cleaning???? I heard a radio commercial for a full set of dentures for 2500. :lmao:

They also advertise Lasix for $299 per eye on the radio.