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View Full Version : What did you think of Podcast Cruise PCC 1.0 ????


SFBayDon
06-04-2009, 07:30 PM
Yes I am a Project Manager in real life (code for planner) and as part of every trip and project we do a Post Mortem or review of the project. So for Podcast Cruise 1.0 here are some of my thoughts, what are yours?

Highlights
Meeting all the great people
Lanyards were perfect to identify DIS’ers after the first day when we all took off our DIS shirts and mixed into the crowd.
Booking the Dolphin before and after the trip was really helpful and what a GREAT rate
Bus transfers to and from the ship (Except I can’t seem to count , Sorry Tracy)
Lee Cockerell talk and book signing
Disney Institute talk
Podcast recording – what a hoot
ASK Tracy and any interaction with Tracy
Already having a separate Podcast Cruise board on the DIS Boards.

(What could be improved)
If you did not happen to hear the crowd was going to Wavebands in the evenings then you would have missed out. For Podcast Cruise 2.0 we should select a few times throughout the day for an unofficial “Regroup”. Similar to being separated from your friends in the park it would be a chance to meet up with other DIS’ers. This is helpful for solo travelers.

Some of the announcements were made on the huge message threads and I missed some of them. Would it be possible to make a group e-mail or PM blast for important announcements?

Lessons Learned
Provide some type of project plan or key dates for the cruisers. This could be modified as the specifics develop and also let people know to hold on until the dates. This might reduce the ASK Tracy questions. This would look something like below.
100 days before departure – Reservations open for XXXXX
60 days before departure XXXXXX will arrive
30 days before departure DIS itinerary will be published.
10 days before bus schedules will be released
X days before final confirmations of DIS official events will be released.
Official VS Unofficial events – A list of the unofficial events linked to the official events was really helpful.




What are your
Highlights
Improvements / Suggestions
Lessons Learned

L.E. Ott
06-04-2009, 07:47 PM
There are too many positives for me to put into words right now, althou I'll try later, just need time to compose them into something besides an incoherent mass.

Things I'd like to see different:

Posibly make it a seven day? It seemed like we were just getting started.

Charter an entire deck with nothing but DISers, or two decks if we could fill em. Just think it would add to the complete feel of it.

An entire evening of Kevin covers ABBA? It would certainly be better than a few of the acts I've seen in Cadillac.

Hpyhiker
06-04-2009, 11:13 PM
It's good to hear from our dinner companion from PCC 1.0. This is Darrel (Hpyhiker) and Jo from Birmingham, AL. Now if we could hear from Greg and Lois we could plan a mini-meet. Of course we would need to invite JoJo and Sheldon. What a hoot those two were....:lmao:

We'll give some thought to your question. One thing that immediately comes to mind is the need for a DISer Daily Planner very similar to the Navigator furnished by the Wonder. The DDP would show all planned activities, times, and locations. Jo and I missed a number of evening activities just because we didn't know about them ahead of time. As I recall, you didn't miss too many.:rotfl2:

BillM99999
06-04-2009, 11:31 PM
We tend to be a fairly introverted couple. That, along with our need for some relaxation after some stressful times at work (to which I have returned with a vengeance...:crazy2::crazy2::crazy2:), led us to miss almost all of the "unofficial events." I only realized upon returning how much more social activity in which we could have been involved (although, in reality, 50% of it would be plenty).

I have to give a "negative" because so many of the positives have already been taken!

Launchpad11B
06-05-2009, 04:45 AM
Wow. An after action review. Nice job Don. I would put the DIS name in bold type on the lanyard as opposed to the persons real name. I was doing a lot of belly staring on the ship! :lmao:

Mouse Skywalker
06-05-2009, 05:09 AM
Morning Don. I agree the best thing for me on the cruise was meeting everyone, reconnecting with friends, and making new friends.

Good idea about the Wavebands/karaoke - we're not really night owls. We're more morning people, and I never heard about the karaoke. I'm so bummed I missed it because it looks like it was so much fun. I would have loved to give it a try. Next time...

DVCsince02
06-05-2009, 08:03 AM
My only suggestion would have to be the on the first day when we gathered for the welcome reception. I would have liked to have seen the crew go around to all the tables and introduce themselves with just a quick hello and thanks for coming.

The gathering at Wavebands just sort of happened without a lot of planning. We just looked at the navigator and thought the activity sounded fun. So they told 2 friends, and they told 2 friends, and they told 2 friends.

LMO429
06-05-2009, 08:11 AM
Highlights
Putting Faces to Screen Names and Meeting New Disers
Love the Lanyards and was shocked my non diser husband actually wanted to wear his.
The Bus Transfers to and from the ship were excellent and it went incredibly smooth.
Watching the Podcast recording was amazing
Meeting the Podcast Team
All the sleeping and relaxing I did on the cruise.
That the adult only areas of the ship were truly "adult only!"
Castaway Cay really is well deserving of all the hype it gets
The podcast party at the heads up bar.


(What could be improved)
On my end I felt like I was way to shy on the cruise I def met a lot of great people but at times I was really shy and regret now not introducing myself to more Disers.

Dolphin Hotel. the lobby, grounds and cast members were wonderful but our room was downright filthy and in major need of a renovation. I talked to people on the shuttle going to the wonder and it seemed like everyone enjoyed their stay at the dolphin but our 1st room and the one we switched too went from horrific to terrible. we would never stay there again unless I heard of a major room renovation happened.


Overall we had a FABULOUS TIME ON THE CRUISE thank you podcast team for WONDERFUL TIME!!!!!!! we appreciate it sooooo much

cocowum
06-05-2009, 08:21 AM
As a first time cruisers the whole experience was phenomenal! Completely surpassed our expectations! We cannot wait to do it again!
Our favorite podcast event was the live taping. That was really awesome!:happytv:

It was so wonderful walking around and seeing friends (wearing their lanyards) all over the ship. :goodvibes

Castaway Cay was definitely the highlight of the cruise. :love: I'm not a beach person but it was AMAZING!

The only thing I would do different is to make Jen (DD not DW ;)) wear sunblock. That poor child burned to a crisp. :eek:


Overall all I give this cruise a 9.8 out of 10. :thumbsup2:thumbsup2:thumbsup2

ADP
06-05-2009, 08:38 AM
As a first time cruisers the whole experience was phenomenal! Completely surpassed our expectations! We cannot wait to do it again!
Our favorite podcast event was the live taping. That was really awesome!:happytv:

It was so wonderful walking around and seeing friends (wearing their lanyards) all over the ship. :goodvibes

Castaway Cay was definitely the highlight of the cruise. :love: I'm not a beach person but it was AMAZING!

The only thing I would do different is to make Jen (DD not DW ;)) wear sunblock. That poor child burned to a crisp. :eek:

Overall all I give this cruise a 9.8 out of 10. :thumbsup2:thumbsup2:thumbsup2
Much of what Alicia said is how we felt. I'm not much of a beach person either, but I loved Castaway Cay too. It was really beautiful.

I must admit there were a couple times when I thought things got a bit hectic. Some activities flowed one after another. But, because they were with all our friends we didn't mind. :)

tickledtink33
06-05-2009, 08:52 AM
Highlights
Putting Faces to Screen Names and Meeting New Disers
Love the Lanyards and was shocked my non diser husband actually wanted to wear his.
The Bus Transfers to and from the ship were excellent and it went incredibly smooth.
Watching the Podcast recording was amazing
Meeting the Podcast Team
All the sleeping and relaxing I did on the cruise.
That the adult only areas of the ship were truly "adult only!"
Castaway Cay really is well deserving of all the hype it gets
The podcast party at the heads up bar.


(What could be improved)
On my end I felt like I was way to shy on the cruise I def met a lot of great people but at times I was really shy and regret now not introducing myself to more Disers.

Dolphin Hotel. the lobby, grounds and cast members were wonderful but our room was downright filthy and in major need of a renovation. I talked to people on the shuttle going to the wonder and it seemed like everyone enjoyed their stay at the dolphin but our 1st room and the one we switched too went from horrific to terrible. we would never stay there again unless I heard of a major room renovation happened.


Overall we had a FABULOUS TIME ON THE CRUISE thank you podcast team for WONDERFUL TIME!!!!!!! we appreciate it sooooo much

WE WERE ALLOWED TO SLEEP? Darn, I wish someone would have told me abut this. I was lucky if I got 4 hours a night. :laughing:

experiment_627
06-05-2009, 09:14 AM
Highlights
Meeting everyone
Putting faces with screen names
The ASK Tracy session outside the theatre between the martini and wine tastings - probably my favorite
Live podcast taping
Twilight meet

Lowlights (pretty much all my fault or couldn't be helped)
I wish I hadn't been so shy at times
Getting sick and missing all of the group events the last day and a half

Madi100
06-05-2009, 11:45 AM
First of all, for anyone who reads this thread that helped plan the cruise - we all had an amazing time. If we didn't, then we wouldn't have rebooked. Anytime I have a big event at school with PTO the first thing I ask at the following meeting are suggestions on what we can do to make the next event better.

I LOVED the cruise. Pete would talk about it on the podcast about how great it was, and I simply didn't get how it could be that great. It was.

My FAVORITE part of the cruise was no matter where I went I saw someone I could say hi to.

My suggestions for the next cruise: less activities. I loved the Wavebands meet and greet. It was a little dark, but still fun. The Podcastaway Cay meet was also lots of fun. The farewell party cut into our dinner, and we left without dessert to get there on time. My suggestion would be to save the money of free drinks (Please no one hit me). They were great, but none of us struggled to purchase our own alcohol :) Also, while I absolutely LOVED Lee Cockerell and the DI, I would rather sit out by the pool than in an auditorium. Suppose Mr. Cockerell could pack his swimming trunks for the next cruise and do his talk from the pool?

As far as Wavebands at night, it just happened, and that was fun. I loved all the little activities that we did as small groups.

tiggerbell
06-05-2009, 02:10 PM
Wow. An after action review. Nice job Don. I would put the DIS name in bold type on the lanyard as opposed to the persons real name. I was doing a lot of belly staring on the ship! :lmao:

So you want to stare at their chests???

Highlights

The ASK Tracy session outside the theatre between the martini and wine tastings - probably my favorite


That was when Walt was giving us disapproving looks for getting tipsy on a Disney ship!!!

My suggestion would be to save the money of free drinks (Please no one hit me).

I'll hold Todd back for you, Nicole!

Suppose Mr. Cockerell could pack his swimming trunks for the next cruise and do his talk from the pool?


Great idea! I'd be willing to buy a book from him for that!

Disneybridein2k3
06-05-2009, 07:45 PM
That was when Walt was giving us disapproving looks for getting tipsy on a Disney ship!!!
No, this was when Todd was getting ready to pee on the floors. :rolleyes1

I won't go into too many of the highlights because everyone already covered all of mine except no one (I don't think) mentioned Palo brunch which I really appreciated. The cruise was fabulous, the people were even more so. I love that all of us pc cruisers were all seated in the same dining room so even though we weren't at the same table, it seemed like one big party. I LOVED hearing Mark (aka Corey) from the Disney Institute talk - I could've heard him talk for hours. The best times, like Candy said, were those unplanned times that we got together. It felt like that was when we were able to really get to know each other.

-- I agree with Don and Dave about missing out on Karaoke night. I was so bummed to hear we missed out on the party.
-- I agree with Paul about the lanyards and our Disboard names vs real names.
-- I'm with Jen about the welcome reception. It was a great opportunity to meet and mingle but it seemed very forced. Maybe if we had
done something to encourage everyone to get up and walk around to meet everyone?
-- The party on the last night was great but it was scheduled during the end of the late dinner which made us late. And it was also scheduled during the Till We Meet Again in the Atrium. I was torn - I really wanted DD3 to see all of the characters at the Till We Meet Again but I also wanted to say goodbye to everyone and Thank You to everyone on the team for all of their hard work. In the end, DD3 missed out on Till We Meet Again and I'm still feeling very guilty about this. Unfortunately, I can't make up for it on 2.0 because I'm not bringing DD3 or DH. Bad for them, good for me.

Launchpad11B
06-05-2009, 08:38 PM
So you want to stare at their chests???


Hmmmmm..............:scratchin

Mary Jo
06-08-2009, 12:52 PM
Yes I am a Project Manager in real life (code for planner) and as part of every trip and project we do a Post Mortem or review of the project. So for Podcast Cruise 1.0 here are some of my thoughts, what are yours?



Highlights

Meeting all the great people

Lanyards were perfect to identify DIS’ers after the first day when we all took off our DIS shirts and mixed into the crowd.

Booking the Dolphin before and after the trip was really helpful and what a GREAT rate

Bus transfers to and from the ship (Except I can’t seem to count , Sorry Tracy)

Lee Cockerell talk and book signing

Disney Institute talk

Podcast recording – what a hoot

ASK Tracy and any interaction with Tracy

Already having a separate Podcast Cruise board on the DIS Boards.


(What could be improved)

If you did not happen to hear the crowd was going to Wavebands in the evenings then you would have missed out. For Podcast Cruise 2.0 we should select a few times throughout the day for an unofficial “Regroup”. Similar to being separated from your friends in the park it would be a chance to meet up with other DIS’ers. This is helpful for solo travelers.



Some of the announcements were made on the huge message threads and I missed some of them. Would it be possible to make a group e-mail or PM blast for important announcements?



Lessons Learned

Provide some type of project plan or key dates for the cruisers. This could be modified as the specifics develop and also let people know to hold on until the dates. This might reduce the ASK Tracy questions. This would look something like below.

100 days before departure – Reservations open for XXXXX

60 days before departure XXXXXX will arrive

30 days before departure DIS itinerary will be published.

10 days before bus schedules will be released

X days before final confirmations of DIS official events will be released.

Official VS Unofficial events – A list of the unofficial events linked to the official events was really helpful.









What are your

Highlights

Improvements / Suggestions

Lessons Learned



I bolded the ones I agree with that Don said. Additional ones for me

Highlights

* Sitting at a table with people I knew and some new ones, and having a wonderful time at our meals. Also seeing fellow DISers in the dining room was so much fun.

* Playing games with the entertainment staff during the day. We played a lot of trivia games (that's how we met Gibson & his mom, Mary Jo, & had such a fun time with them during the cruise in the afternoons).

* Loved how the lanyards had an itinerary on the back of them. I used that a lot

* Hanging out at Wavebands, having more fun with fellow DISers and the entertainment staff. It was great being with people who like to have fun, and we laughed so much.

* Castaway Cay party was fantastic (okay, already said, but I really enjoyed it)

* The goody bag that the Podcast Team gave us topped by a rose for the moms. That was such a nice touch, and I used everything in the bag.

* DATW after the cruise gave me an opportunity to actually mingle with people and get to know them a bit more. I had such a good time there.

* During the Live Podcast session, when the team mentioned different podcasters & things that happened on the ship. I loved hearing about Anna & Stitch, Gibson becoming a mod (when is that happening, btw?), Alicia's shoes, Teresa having to adjust to the moving landscape outside the boat, and other anecdotes - it was great.

* Fish-Extender Exchange was so much fun, and the gifts were so creative.


Improvements/Suggestions

* Refer to a Navigator before we cruise to get an idea of activities that we might want to enjoy as a group - like Wavebands, Bingo, etc. - and organize unofficial opportunities for fellow Podcasters to join.

* Maybe have a calling system or notes in the FEs where if something comes up - like the Kareoke night @ Wavebands, or a post-cruise event - have people call other staterooms to let them know that there is something happening if they want to join. (just a thought)

* I like the idea of the DIS name on the lanyards being more prominant.

* I think the ASKTracy session was something that happened spontaneously? But, it was fun in an intimate setting, and it was nice to talk. If this happens again, I'd love it if everyone kind of went around the circle & introduced themselves. I had no idea who many people were until after we got back & I put names to pictures.

* Small settings like the ASK Tracy with other Podcast team members for just a half hour or so, and on a small, individual basis - like Pete/Walter, John/Kevin, Kathy, Teresa. I bet the chance that they would be bombarded would be great, but it would be nice to have those type of sessions.



Lessons Learned

* Get involved in the discussions on the boards beforehand and try to get to know other podcasters

* Stay onsite before, and join the pre-cruise meets. I could see that so many people had bonded, and didn't know quite how to approach different groups without feeling like I was barging in. I was able to meet a few people, but I want to do a better job next time. I feel like I missed out on getting to know some really cool people.

* Get up, even if I have a headache, and participate in the activities. The pain will go away, and I won't have missed out on so much.

* Join in more unofficial events and meet more people, and don't be afraid to ask who they are on the boards.

* Particpate in the next Palo brunch, even if it isn't an "official" DIS get-together

guynwdm
06-08-2009, 02:18 PM
Rob's Highlights
**Meeting so many great people. :grouphug: (believe it or not that is totally not what I would do usually. I went to mousefest December 2007 and other than the meet the Dis set up, I thought it was a total bust. I just felt like a lurker and did not meet anyone and have no memories of the event and really have never planned to go back) I have never had so much fun hanging out and chatting with people. I know that I will try to plan trips to coordinate with the great new friends I made on this trip.
**Having opportunities to meet people in smaller groups before the official cruise and having some names and faces before getting on the ship.
**Name lanyards were so helpful. I am so bad with names and it was very appreciated.
**Palo breakfast was amazing. That is something I have never gotten to do and it just made the trip so special. The staff there were so much fun and made it just that much more special. Thanks crew for all the pain and suffering with organizing it.
** I loved the DI stuff. It just appealed to the Disney nerd in me. It was like getting a free tour of the parks with all the information that come out in the talks. I have priced out the DI trainings and know how expensive they are. Thanks again to the pcc for organizing it.
** Meeting people who when you shake the family tree really hard you find out your connections. It was nice to have opportunities just to really get to know people rather than a "hi, how are you" interactions.

Improvements / Suggestions
**It would be nice to have something to connect with people in the welcome party (its just the staff developer in me that has to have a warm up activity :teacher:) The large group of people can be overwhelming (and from the sounds of it, there will be an even bigger group on 2.0)
**Maybe having some way to know who people would like to dine with, I know Tracy (Who deserves sainthood) asked if people had names they wanted to sit with but someway to make sure that groups with kids get placed together and those without kids are put together. (The family I was with was great but would have been nice to not feel like I was just filling up a spare seat (Disney's problem not DUT problem)

There are a ton of great suggestions already, sorry if I repeated...

Lessons Learned
** Don't be shy. I could always find someone to talk to if I wanted. In my job teaching adults I have found that in any group there is always someone being the turd in the punchbowl (hopefully it was not me), I didn't find that with this group. With so many people on the trip it was easy to find people to hang out with if I just drop the shell. This was an incredibly fun and friendly group. We all have something in common to start with so makes conversation easy. I have never enjoyed talking to so many different people until this trip.
** Enjoy the ship. I stayed on during the stop in Nassau. I am totally glad I did. I have been there and done that and got the t-shirt and it was way more fun staying on the ship in port. This was my 4th disney cruise (15 total) and love being on the ship.
** Plan out the things are the do or die kinds of things you want to do. You can't do it all and so you have to really prioritize and decide what is most important to do. That said also be flexible you never know when you will run into a group of people doing something fun that you want to join.
** Don't worry about bringing someone along who is a non-disser. There were a bunch of people along for the ride and they had a great time. Don't let the "they won't know what is going on" thinking stop you from bringing friends/spouses/partners along.
** No fish extender gift hanging from strings. What a pain to deliver. I had a deck full of deliveries all tangled up. It took me forever to get them all separated out. :idea: LOL

I can't wait for the next trip. It's so far away right now.

Madi100
06-08-2009, 02:34 PM
I just want to chime in on the unofficial gatherings. Anything that was planned before the cruise was announced many, many times on these boards. The things that happened on the cruise that weren't announced were just kind of spur of the moment happenings. I don't think we can plan out every second of every day because we'll feel like it's a very planned trip. However, if a group decides to do Wavebands, it's great if more people just show up. They aren't really planned things. People just joined in. I was only invited to Wavebands once. The other nights, we just showed up.

jeanigor
06-08-2009, 03:13 PM
Regarding Spur of the moment gatherings/events...I wrote on the wipe board and posted post-it notes on my door to give folks the 4-1-1 on where I (and therefore by default the party) was at.:goodvibes:goodvibesYes, I am fully aware that my head is almost as inflated as Don's.

katscradle
06-08-2009, 03:15 PM
I had a great time. :yay::yay:
I loved everything that was planned by the Dis, including the Palo brunch which I enjoyed very much. Thank you DU. :love::love::love:
Things I learned:
Try to do FE gifts the first day, so you don't spend half your next day doing them. :eek:
Don't take the children back to your room to put to bed right after dinner.
Put them in the kid's clubs for awhile. :woohoo::woohoo:
Go hang out with other Diser's for awhile before you do have to pick the children up and put them to bed. :banana::banana:
Also leave a note for DH that say's if I fall asleep and some friends come by
wake me up! :dance3::dance3::dance3:

Mary Jo
06-08-2009, 03:46 PM
Regarding Spur of the moment gatherings/events...I wrote on the wipe board and posted post-it notes on my door to give folks the 4-1-1 on where I (and therefore by default the party) was at.:goodvibes:goodvibesYes, I am fully aware that my head is almost as inflated as Don's.

I think that's a great idea - I never would have thought to look at your door, but since you had all the cabin changes - kind of makes sense that you would keep people posted on some of the fun stuff going on. :)


And Nicole -- lesson learned -- read all the threads that have stuff going on! lol

Madi100
06-08-2009, 05:28 PM
I think that's a great idea - I never would have thought to look at your door, but since you had all the cabin changes - kind of makes sense that you would keep people posted on some of the fun stuff going on. :)


And Nicole -- lesson learned -- read all the threads that have stuff going on! lol

Um, Mary Jo, I'm not sure if you noticed on the first cruise, but Todd was quite the social butterfly. He's pretty much the same way here. If there is a plan, Todd knows about it. So, just stick close to him. He'll have a spreadsheet to email you before the end of the year :)

MenashaCorp
06-08-2009, 05:33 PM
;)Um, Mary Jo, I'm not sure if you noticed on the first cruise, but Todd was quite the social butterfly. He's pretty much the same way here. If there is a plan, Todd knows about it. So, just stick close to him. He'll have a spreadsheet to email you before the end of the year :)


...Then come find me so I don't miss out either and you'll drink for free... ;)

winotracy
06-08-2009, 05:38 PM
;)


...Then come find me so I don't miss out either and you'll drink for free... ;)

You would do that? ;)

MenashaCorp
06-08-2009, 05:42 PM
You would do that? ;)


Would and will again, Sweetie!!:love:;)

Mary Jo
06-08-2009, 06:12 PM
Um, Mary Jo, I'm not sure if you noticed on the first cruise, but Todd was quite the social butterfly. He's pretty much the same way here. If there is a plan, Todd knows about it. So, just stick close to him. He'll have a spreadsheet to email you before the end of the year :)

I noticed. This time I'll pay attention. :flower:

;)


...Then come find me so I don't miss out either and you'll drink for free... ;)

I might find this important information in small bits and pieces, so I may have to make many trips to keep you informed. ;)

Madi100
06-08-2009, 08:11 PM
;)


...Then come find me so I don't miss out either and you'll drink for free... ;)

Free drinks if I'm Jason's little lost puppy dog. I can do that.

shellyminnie
06-08-2009, 08:17 PM
;)


...Then come find me so I don't miss out either and you'll drink for free... ;)

Now does this apply to everyone?? I can a real quiet shadow . . .;)

DUHgreg
06-09-2009, 09:11 PM
Without repeating some of the great comments and planned moments on the cruise, I also appreciated the unplanned moments, such as when we found out that someone had 'stolen' our dinner seats and we wound laughing and completely enjoying our way through the dinners and breakfast with Don, Darrell and Jo as our replacement table. (Kudos to the CMs who handled the 'issue' so discreetly and so well.) Not planned but great fun.
We also hijacked Walter before the group photo. Several of us were retreating to have a beer in our stateroom when we ran into him in the elevator. He joined us and we quickly found out what a good guy he is (especially when he found out that Lois is aka Pickle Lady).

It was truly a wonderful vacation. Hope to see you all next year.

Has DCL ever had to deal with customers asking to be seated with particular servers in the dining room. We want JoJo and Sheldon!

DUHgreg
06-09-2009, 09:15 PM
Regarding Spur of the moment gatherings/events...I wrote on the wipe board and posted post-it notes on my door to give folks the 4-1-1 on where I (and therefore by default the party) was at.:goodvibes:goodvibesYes, I am fully aware that my head is almost as inflated as Don's.

Now we know the secret.:woohoo: Hope you don't have one of those secret hidden staterooms next time around (meaning the ones we kept missing for the FE gifts).

winotracy
06-10-2009, 04:39 AM
Has DCL ever had to deal with customers asking to be seated with particular servers in the dining room. We want JoJo and Sheldon!

Yes you can request particular servers, but if you do you can't expect to be seated with the group. They would have to assign a dining room staff rotation to us otherwise and that's not likely going to happen.