504 Plans?

[SereneOne]

Meg is transistioning from a K4 only child development center to kindergarten in an elementary school.

Her special needs coordinator is working on her 504 plan and it is her first time doing one. I had not heard of one before, I thought Meghan would have an IEP. Meghan has VACTERLS Association (acroynm for mulitple physical defects, hers are internal), RAD (like asthma) and Hirschprung's Disease. She is incredibly smart (her teachers and sp needs coordinator's words) and popular, the only issues are that she is tube fed several times a day (two to three times at school) and she is not potty trained as far as number two. She had surgery for an imperforate anus with fistula this past summer and had emergency surgery, they found Hirschprung's Disease in addition when they went in). She has only had an anus for nine months and the H. disease is an issue with normal regular bowel movements (she is on Miralax, but she is either constipated or has diarhea, we are working on this), so she wears pullups. She also gets sick easily and it becomes something worse. If other kids have colds and she gets it, it becomes pneumonia or bronchitis for her, so she could become absent quite a bit, maybe even be in the hospital on oxygen, which has not happened in almost three years.

I did google 504 plans, but I would prefer to hear from people with actual experience and any advice. Thank you in advance!

[bookwormde]

I have a little experience with 504s but most of my experience is with IEPs.
504 are commonly used for physical conditions, which in unto themselves (if well managed) do not have a major impact on the educational experience and progress. They are easier to get “classified” for but lack much of the “power, flexibility and protections that an IEP has. If you invasion that a significant portions of your child’s current challenges will “dissipate” over time and the expected school environment accommodations and supports will not be to complicated then a 504 may be ok, otherwise an IEP may be needed. If a paraprofessional is going to be needed typically this is done through and IEP.

bookwormde

[SereneOne]

Hmmm...thanks for the information. Other than going over Meghan's medical issues with me, I have not been told anything. I see I need to have a talk with the sn coordinator.

[Eeyores Butterfly]

Basically, an IEP is for kids who need a different curriculum or modifications to the curriculum. A 504 is for kids with physical problems that need to be taken care of tallow them access to a Free and Appropriate Public Education (FAPE). It sounds like that is exactly what your daughter needs as you state she is very intelligent and none of the issues you listed would affect her intellectual funcitoning. (You can think of IEPs as intellectual and 504s as physical).

The 504 will state exactly what she needs to access education. Most likely a para will be assigned to her. It is true that more often than not paras are assigned to kids with IEPs, but it is not uncommon to have kids with 504s need paras. Growing up I went to school with several kids with physical challenges who had paras to help them with things like navigating the hallways and carrying stuff. I had a student with diabetes and part of the 504 included allowing the student to havee a water bottle in class and to use the bathroom whenever he asked. Things for your daughter might include things like going to the nurse for her tube feedings, a para to help with toileting needs, anything she might need to for her breathing condition, etc. There might also be provisions in there for her in case she is absent due to illness such as the teacher has to send work home or allow her to make up assignments. It will all depend on what she needs.

I hope this helps!

[SereneOne]

This helps a lot, thank you!

That is perfect, exactly what she needs. She is at a K4 only CDC and she goes with the nurse for feedings, breathing treatments, and help with the bathroom issues. (When it is naptime, she goes with the nurse for her second feeding and her breathing treatments and the nurse reads to her and plays games with her until naptime is over. She hates naptime, lol.) Other than that, she is in class and does really well. Despite her absences, her teachers states that when she comes back she grasps the subject matter quickly, there are no problems cognitively. Her SN counselor also mentioned an aide, so I think that is the route they are going pertaining to her physical needs.

I also think possibly a homebound teacher if she gets ill enough that she has to stay home or in the hospital of a period of time? I know when my youngest son contracted Henoch-Scholien Purpura, he had a homebound teacher for a time.

[SueM in MN]

I don't have anything to offer other than the information you already got.
I am going to move this to the disABILITIES Community Board, which is better suited for general disability related subjects.

[SereneOne]

I don't have anything to offer other than the information you already got.
I am going to move this to the disABILITIES Community Board, which is better suited for general disability related subjects.


I am so sorry, I just clicked on disabilities and did not think to check to see where to post it correctly once I did.

[Eeyores Butterfly]

This helps a lot, thank you!

That is perfect, exactly what she needs. She is at a K4 only CDC and she goes with the nurse for feedings, breathing treatments, and help with the bathroom issues. (When it is naptime, she goes with the nurse for her second feeding and her breathing treatments and the nurse reads to her and plays games with her until naptime is over. She hates naptime, lol.) Other than that, she is in class and does really well. Despite her absences, her teachers states that when she comes back she grasps the subject matter quickly, there are no problems cognitively. Her SN counselor also mentioned an aide, so I think that is the route they are going pertaining to her physical needs.

I also think possibly a homebound teacher if she gets ill enough that she has to stay home or in the hospital of a period of time? I know when my youngest son contracted Henoch-Scholien Purpura, he had a homebound teacher for a time.

Homebound is certainly something to ask about it. It may not be needed at her age if they feel she can properly access the curriculum. I forget the name of the case but the ruling basically stated that metaphorically speaking the schools don't need to provide a Cadillac if a Buick will work. So if she can access the curriculum without homebound she might not be able to get it- at least at the younger grades. It doesn't hurt to ask though! And if she doesn't get it you can always try again later on as the curriculum gets harder. I believe like IEPs 504s have to be redone every year.

[Mskanga]

My daughter has a 504 plan in place along with a modified homebound, the reason is she was diagnosed with bone cancer and she was out for all her 9th grade because of chemo and surgery treatment , and then in 10th grade we did the 504 with the necessary medical accomodations. We were planning on allowing her to return to school as her stamina would allow but what we didn't expect was the problems with the prosthesis and the cold climate would have such a great impact on her so the school district allowed what they call " modified homebound " she goes to school whenever she can for however long she can and she also gets a home tutor.
We were considering doing an IEP but we found that it is really not necessary , that as long as she has the accomodations that she has in place now we're fine.
I made a list of all the things she would need before I went in to school and they never gave me a problem , in fact they kept the list so they could use it as reference in the future for other kids that may need a 504.

[clori]

My dd has alopecia areat which is an autoimmune disease which essentially means at any point in time she may experience varies levels of hairloss. She currently has all the hair on her head but is missing a big portion of her eyebrows and just about all her eyelashes. In her case she isn't sick or have any physical/learning disabilities so there isn't a need for an iep.

However depending on her hairloss (at one point she was missing over 50% of her hair on her head) the 504 plan can offer some accomodations. Many schools do not allow hats/head coverings to be worn inside at school. A 504 plan would allow dd to wear something on her head inside at school that isn't typically allowed. It wouldn't require any time/effort on teachers I have yet to go this route because thus far dd's school has been very accomodating. Basically the currently principal's belief is that dd can do what she wants to do to feel comfortable.

I have a basic 504 question. Once a 504 plan is in place how long is it good for? DD is currently in third grade in a k-8 school so if we need one would be good thru 8th grade?

[WendyisDarling]

A 504 plan can be for all disabilities.

A 504 recognizes the disability and provides accomodations making the "playing field" even. These students don't need IEP goals. They need the environment or school work modified.

I know of students with 504 plans that allow them to take their tests in a separate room, sit at the front of the classroom, sit at a peanut free area in the cafeteria (and be in a peanut free classroom), leave class early to navigate the hallways, have extra time for tests, get copies of the notes from their teachers, have an additional set of text books at home, physical school building modifications, I could go on and on.
If your child NEEDS a special accomodation to have the same opportunity to learn as other students, but does not require an IEP --the 504 is the document you use.

[Selket]

I am well versed with 504's as both of my children have them - but for different reasons: one child has type 1 diabetes and severe food allergies (like peanuts) and the other child is ADD (not hyper). One child had an IEP for awhile for a speech issue (which was resolved - the IEP basically gave access to speech therapy).

I agree with the info you've gotten that a 504 will likely work for your child's needs. If at any point you find it isn't working you can request another meeting. Usually we have a meeting once a year to review the 504 and make any changes. Public schools (and private schools that take federal money) are obligated to hold a meeting to evaluate your child for a 504 (or IEP) if the parent requests the meeting. They can't just tell you in the hallway "oh your child doesn't need it - the health plan will take care of everything."

Many times parents are told the "health plan" will take care of everything (especially parents of kids with type 1) - and parents will walk away thinking they have a 504! It is also VERY important to note that learning does NOT have to be affected to get a 504. Schools often confuse an IEP and 504.

A 504 can allow for a child to have unrestricted bathroom access, unrestricted water fountain access (or to carry water), allow the child to carry testing supplies and be able to test and treat anytime, anywhere if they are type 1 diabetics, be allowed to use a computer or scribe rather than writing test answers, allowed more time to complete a test, modified homework assignments, etc.

If the school violates the 504, there are options to make them comply. Schools systems are required to have a resolution dispute process. You can also contact the Office for Civil Rights (each area of the USA has their own branch office) and they will assist you in filing a discrimination complaint which they will investigate. Often if OCR steps in and starts to investigate and the complaint has merit, the school will see a resolution. In other words....the 504 does have teeth if you ever need them.:thumbsup2

[RN4Babies]

Regarding schooling while your dd is hospitalized, if she's at a Children's Hospital, the majority of them have a "schoolroom" in the hospital itself, in addition to teachers who can visit your child if she's unable to leave her room.

I see quite a few babies with a diagnosis over VACTERL and/or hirschsprungs. Hugs to you; it's not an easy road, no matter at what age the diagnosis is made.

[SereneOne]

Regarding schooling while your dd is hospitalized, if she's at a Children's Hospital, the majority of them have a "schoolroom" in the hospital itself, in addition to teachers who can visit your child if she's unable to leave her room.

I see quite a few babies with a diagnosis over VACTERL and/or hirschsprungs. Hugs to you; it's not an easy road, no matter at what age the diagnosis is made.

Yes, we have a Children's Hospital. They are GREAT! I live in Greenville, SC. We are hoping they will not close the Shriner's here. The child specialists at the hospitals are wonderful. :)

[Eeyores Butterfly]

I would like to make one clarification: Certain things may have to be handled in the nurse's office. Selket brought up testing of blood sugar. Not all schools will allow it anywhere. Often times the child must go to the nurse's office to do this. This is because of a huge liability issue.

One of the cases we studied in the class I TA'd dealt with a young man who had asthma. He kept his inhaler in his locker, went to use it, and died. The school was found negligent because the inhaler was not in the nurse's office. Because of this case schools are loathe to allow students to do things like use inhalers or test glucose outside of the nurse's office. TThis was they nurse is aware if there is a problem such as being too high or too low and can make sure the child takes steps to fix it.

The other issue is biohazard waste. I have diabetes but cannot test in my classroom because only the nurse's office has a trashcan approved for biohazard waste (not that I throw anything out in my classroom, but that's a different story). This means whenever I have to test I have to go to the nurse's office. Unlike a student I cannot leave whenever, so there are times I have had to blindly treat lows because I could not leave my students alone.

I wish that students could test wherever and whenever, but be aware this may not always be possible depending on the school and legally they are not required to provide this accommodation. Testing in the nurse's office would be considered a reasonable accommodation. It's not something I agree with, but it is what it is.

[Selket]

I wish that students could test wherever and whenever, but be aware this may not always be possible depending on the school and legally they are not required to provide this accommodation. Testing in the nurse's office would be considered a reasonable accommodation. It's not something I agree with, but it is what it is.

I don't want to hijack the OP's thread but the information you have that glucose testing the classroom is not permitted generally (for older students especially) is not true. The biohazard waste issue is usually easily countered and a school cannot use that as the reason for someone not to test in the classroom. Picking a scab, nosebleeds, papercuts...all of these spread more blood around in the classroom than a controlled finger prick.

Even the Missouri guide for students with diabetes in the school says:

To maximize instructional time, a student
should be allowed to check his or her blood
glucose level and take appropriate action to
treat hypoglycemia. This applies to the
classroom or anywhere the student is in
conjunction with a school activity, if
preferred by the student and indicated in the
student’s Individualized Health Plan.
However, some students prefer to test their
blood glucose in private and their privacy
should be respected.*

http://www.dhss.mo.gov/diabetes/DMGlucoseControl.pdf

I'm happy to discuss this more with you if you want to PM me. I am trained by the ADA as a volunteer school advocate to help parents of kids with type 1 get 504's. If a student is allowed to test - I assume as a TA you are older? An adult? I cannot see how they could not allow you to test and treat in the classroom. If you pass out you will certainly be leaving your students unattended - it is discrimination to not allow you to handle your medical condition.

[Eeyores Butterfly]

Thanks for the info! In our classes we were always told that things like that are typically handled in the nurse's office because of the aforementioned case. I didn't want people to expect something unrealistic, but if it's in the law then it must be done.

[Selket]

Thanks for the info! In our classes we were always told that things like that are typically handled in the nurse's office because of the aforementioned case. I didn't want people to expect something unrealistic, but if it's in the law then it must be done.

It is not exactly the law - but it IS in their own guidebook for diabetes in the schools. It is absolutely discrimination to not allow YOU to test and treat your diabetes if you are old enough. My son is 7 so he is not able to completely self-care but I'm guessing you are.;) I don't know if your situation is as a student or as an employee - either way it is discrimination - really unbelievable discrimination!

[buffettgirl]

I'm glad Carol jumped in and gave her assistance because I almost fell off my chair with the "has to test in the nurses office". lol. My son is 9 and can test in the classroom. :) And as for the biohazard...a tissue is more dangerous and those get thrown in the garbage, right?? Good luck if you decide to fight this.

(sorry OP for hijacking)

[SereneOne]

No apologies necessary!

As long as we are getting the info we need to assist our children in the best way that we can, I am happy! :goodvibes

[buffettgirl]

there's a lot of good 504 info out there on the web too. My son (like Carol's) has a 504 just for his accomodations needed for diabetes. He has absolutely no learning needs so he doesn't need an IEP and 90% of his 504 relates to what he needs (visit the nurse whenever needed, drinks when needed, bathroom breaks, etc etc etc) However, we do have accomodations related to school work in the 504 - for instance, we have things like accomodations needed for state testing (breaks if needed) and requiremtns that say he must test blood sugar before taking a test and then the ability to postpone his testing without penalty until his blood sugar is in range. So you can have some educational type items in a 504. :)

[bookwormde]

One thing to remember for future reference is that IEPs are not just for academic needs but also may be used for non-academic needs that promote an “appropriate education” which goes well beyond just what is formally taught in the classroom out of books.

bookwormde

[SueM in MN]

I am so sorry, I just clicked on disabilities and did not think to check to see where to post it correctly once I did.
Not a problem.
That's why I moved it for you - you will get more answers here.

[Eeyores Butterfly]

One thing to remember for future reference is that IEPs are not just for academic needs but also may be used for non-academic needs that promote an “appropriate education” which goes well beyond just what is formally taught in the classroom out of books.

bookwormde

Very true. I was trying to think of the simplest terms possible to explain. Maybe a better way to say it would be to say that an IEP tends to be related to the actual curriculum. For instance, a student may have the academic ability to keep up with the curriculum, but may qualify under a behavioral diagnosis because their behavior is such that they are disrupting their learning or that of others.

[bookwormde]

Yes even “playground” time and all extracurricular activates are covered by IDEA since they are integral to socialization and “team building”

bookwormde

[Leajess99]

One of the cases we studied in the class I TA'd dealt with a young man who had asthma. He kept his inhaler in his locker, went to use it, and died. The school was found negligent because the inhaler was not in the nurse's office. Because of this case schools are loathe to allow students to do things like use inhalers or test glucose outside of the nurse's office. TThis was they nurse is aware if there is a problem such as being too high or too low and can make sure the child takes steps to fix it.



First off I wanted to thank everyone for their information as I am getting ready to have a 504 done for my youngest DD for her asthma and severe mold allergy. The amount of school she missed last year along with the battle we had for her inhaler being given to her were just more than I will allow to happen to her again.

In the above post, it mentions the nurse's office for use of inhalers. In the last 3 school districts my kids have attended the policy has changed to allow the student to carry their inhalers on them or have it kept by the classroom teacher as it can be very dangerous keeping the inhaler in the office or the nurse's office (we only get a nurse for maybe one day a week now). My youngest is supposed to be in 1st grade right now but is currently hanging out at home being taught by me until we actually get a school that will meet her needs. This is a fight that has been going on since school got out the end of May. My youngest was having a lot of asthma issues and really needed her inhaler so I had already filled out the paperwork and gave her teacher the inhaler as at 5/6 she is not old enough IMO to handle the inhaler herself plus she had a classmate already taking things and sticking them down in her underware so not willing to risk the inhaler going "missing". Anyway, I notified her teachers of what time she needed her inhaler and they would constantly "forget" to give it to her. One day I had gone by the school on my way to class and was there 2 hours before my DD was to get her inhaler. I reminded her assistant teacher of the inhaler need and time and they still "forgot" to give it to her. Funny thing was the assistant teacher never forgot her smoke break. I was livid.

When I filed the complaint with the assistant superintendent and superintendent the assistant asked why my dd did not just carry her own inhaler. I reminded him that she was 5/6 and they don't have anywhere other than their backpacks to keep the inhalers which lead to a dangerous situation if she had a severe attack or if another child decided to use it. I hate this school district but refuse to give up fighting.

Again, thank you all for the information.

[kimsuenew]

I have a little experience with 504s but most of my experience is with IEPs.
504 are commonly used for physical conditions, which in unto themselves (if well managed) do not have a major impact on the educational experience and progress. They are easier to get “classified” for but lack much of the “power, flexibility and protections that an IEP has. If you invasion that a significant portions of your child’s current challenges will “dissipate” over time and the expected school environment accommodations and supports will not be to complicated then a 504 may be ok, otherwise an IEP may be needed. If a paraprofessional is going to be needed typically this is done through and IEP.

bookwormde

Basically, an IEP is for kids who need a different curriculum or modifications to the curriculum. A 504 is for kids with physical problems that need to be taken care of tallow them access to a Free and Appropriate Public Education (FAPE). It sounds like that is exactly what your daughter needs as you state she is very intelligent and none of the issues you listed would affect her intellectual funcitoning. (You can think of IEPs as intellectual and 504s as physical).

The 504 will state exactly what she needs to access education. Most likely a para will be assigned to her. It is true that more often than not paras are assigned to kids with IEPs, but it is not uncommon to have kids with 504s need paras. Growing up I went to school with several kids with physical challenges who had paras to help them with things like navigating the hallways and carrying stuff. I had a student with diabetes and part of the 504 included allowing the student to havee a water bottle in class and to use the bathroom whenever he asked. Things for your daughter might include things like going to the nurse for her tube feedings, a para to help with toileting needs, anything she might need to for her breathing condition, etc. There might also be provisions in there for her in case she is absent due to illness such as the teacher has to send work home or allow her to make up assignments. It will all depend on what she needs.

I hope this helps!

A 504 plan can be for all disabilities.:thumbsup2
A 504 recognizes the disability and provides accomodations making the "playing field" even. These students don't need IEP goals. They need the environment or school work modified.

I know of students with 504 plans that allow them to take their tests in a separate room, sit at the front of the classroom, sit at a peanut free area in the cafeteria (and be in a peanut free classroom), leave class early to navigate the hallways, have extra time for tests, get copies of the notes from their teachers, have an additional set of text books at home, physical school building modifications, I could go on and on.
If your child NEEDS a special accomodation to have the same opportunity to learn as other students, but does not require an IEP --the 504 is the document you use.

I just wanted to say that 504 Plans can absolutely be used for academic challenges and not simply physical conditions. Our DS had one from 4th grade through this year (12th) for those very reasons and we are to take it to his college where they will use it as a foundation on what he needs to make it through there. I also have a family member and friends with 504 Plans for similar reasons. DS does have asthma and has carried a rescue inhaler with him (required a doctors note) but this was never mentioned on, or included in, his 504 Plan!

Some examples of DS modifications made via the 504 throughout his school years would be:

~Extended time on tests.
~Extended time for projects/assignments.
~Written directions for assignments.
~A proctor for tests, and tests taken outside of the classroom.
~Use of a Franklin Spellchecker for in-class assignments.
~Where applicable, audio books used (such as a required novel).
~Not to be counted off for spelling or punctuation errors on tests and assignment (with the exception of English and Foreign Language).
~Allowed to send projects back and forth to school via email.
~Allowed to use computer to type up all papers, essays, etcetera (ecspecially applicable when he was younger and most were to be hand-written).
~When he was younger (not in high school but before) we also had these: reduction of one answer choice on multiple choice tests, parental notification of upcoming tests and quizzes (due to the amount of study time required for him to even have a chance of retention), and allowing him to correct incorrect math answers from tests for 1/2 credit back.

I was always told that the supports/modifications were what was needed to "level the playing field". Some worked, others eh! What I noticed was that while written beautifully, the 504 Plans were ignored at times (often I had to contact the guidence counsellor and special ed supervisor after repeated reminders to his teachers (not all, some) were ignored... generally their intervention would help for awhile).

Good luck with your daughter transition :goodvibes I hope it is a positive and wonderful year!

[metime]

If you have an IEP the 504 laws already apply to your child while they are at school. You can have a 504 and not have an IEP.

The school may very well want to evaluate your child for an IEP so that they can get funds to help provide for her needs while at school. There are lots of bright children who would still qualify for and IEP. Schools get extra funding for IEP and not for 504. They still have to comply even if your child only qualifies for a 504, it just may mean more effort on your part to advocate for what she needs because cost may cause reluctance on the part of the school.

If she does get and IEP for school it would only cover her while in the public school system. It will not work if you need after school care for her. You would need to get a 504 for after care even if she is on an IEP at school. A 504 plan alone follows your child (Daycare, college, work... ) because it is part of the americans with disabilities act.

[metime]

I thought I would share what my DD 504 has in place for ADHD and epilepsy.

1. Teachers will check in student on a regular bassis during class to ensure she understands directions and expectations and to monitor her progress.

2. Teachers will seat student preferentially, close to the soruce of instruction, to minimize distracions and facilitate teacher access.

3.Teachers will break down complex or long-term assignments for student into more managable parts, and monitor her progress through such assignments.

4.Teachers will encourage student to ask questions and self advocate and praise her for her efforts to do so.

5.Teachers will check her agenda book for completeness and accuracy upon her bringing it to them.

6. teachers will allow extended time limits for certain assignments, as needed.

7.Teachers will allow student to ask for clarification if she does not understand a concept, an assignment, or directions.

[huckster]

My son was covered underthe section 504 plan , he was not physically handicapped , he did not qualify for IEP he tested well above their normal. He had ADD, we had a very poor experince with this as teachers ,used it against him they were supposed to give him a lighter work load give him areas where it was easier less comotion to test .none of this happened , teachers just did not want to be bothered. work close with your school and be on top of it,i am sure it works in most schools

[pipersmom]

No apologies necessary!

As long as we are getting the info we need to assist our children in the best way that we can, I am happy! :goodvibes

In my daughter's plan we have it worded that after 10 cumulative days missed, she will be provided with homebound instruction. In our district, it would normally be 10 consecutive days. Piper is in 3rd grade now, and we have had it in the plan since kindergarten. When a child is younger (in our state, anyway) all they do is lower the hrs of homebound required, they are STILL required to do homebound. Sometimes it isn't as issue, but often she'll come home on IV's, and then we do use the homebound. We also keep an extra set of books at home, water bottle in the classroom, unlimited bathroom access, no playing outdoors over 84 or under 45 degrees. Notification when any other child in her classroom is displaying any respiratory symptom so I can go pick Piper up. Piper has CF, but it sounds like some of the issues are similar. You can pretty much build in whatever you need to :) Hope that helps, feel free to pm me if you have questions...