"Change" we can believe in

[big kahuna1]

Here is that "Change" we can believe in in the One's StimuLIE or StimulAss bill he is pushing.

900 Billion...of which:



1 billion for Amtrak
2 billion for shild care subisidies
50 million for the NEA
400 million for Global Warming Research (I thought this was already settled?)
2.4 billion for Carbon-Capture Demonstration projects
650 million more for the Digital TV Box
600 million to buy new gubbament cars
252 billion for income transfer payments(what that is I have no idea)
81 billion for medicaid
36 billion foir unemployment
20 billion for food stamps
83 billion for earned income credits
66 billion for education
54 billion for crap to nowhwere

and so on and on and on.

Oh wait! there actually is some stimulus in the bill although not what is needed but there is some.

70 billion for infrastucture
20 billion for tax cuts

This amounts to about 12 cents of every so called stimulus dollar will go to actual stimulus means.


HOPE AND CHANGE WE CAN BELEIVE IN!


The Republicans need to let the Dems own this one all on their own. But as usual, they do not have the spines to say NO!

[TheFlame]

:furious: :furious: :furious:

[3gr8kids]

WTH?
:confused: :mad: :sad2: :furious:

[ftwildernessguy]

I think it is change - I bet no other president spent so much money so soon after his inauguration.

[auntie]

While watching a morning news program, people had e-mailed in wanting to know how this package will directly effect them. If making under $75,000.00 it would mean there would be all of $12.00 more in your pay check. Less with holding. Yep...a WHOLE $12.00. (folks are just gonna break the bank with that:rolleyes2 )

As far as money set aside for repairing the roads/bridges/rails... All this takes time, and it's likely that only ONE third of the money set aside for this purpose will actually be used over the first two years. :rolleyes2 While everyone seems to think it's a great idea to get working on the roads(lord knows we need it around here)...they have to deal with state and local governments to get it done. Oh yeah..that's gonna be quick..:sad2:

They will extend unemployment benefits. I don't think it's gonna be for nearly as long as it's gonna take this stimulus package to kick in though. :sad1:

[RvUsa]

Don't forget, he wants to give everyone a tax break as well!!! It sure is nice of China to loan us all that money!!! :lmao::lmao:

Everyone repeat after me....


谢谢Obama先生，但我祝愿您有半新一些润滑油或指定我们的Al最少伸手可及的距离。

[PolynesianPixie]

Don't forget, he wants to give everyone a tax break as well!!! It sure is nice of China to loan us all that money!!! :lmao::lmao:

Everyone repeat after me....


谢谢Obama先生，但我祝愿您有半新一些润滑油或指定我们的Al最少伸手可及的距离。

What were you trying to say about lubricating oil???? :rotfl2:

[ntsammy5]

This really bums me out! Not a SINGLE cent for beer! :badpc:

[big kahuna1]

Since this bill is all "PORK" we should call our legislators and demand they subsidize the rates at Fort Wilderness Campground...at least for a few years. Let's get them back down to around $25.00 a night. This would help us out more than anything they want to spend it on right now.:thumbsup2

[ram101]

What were you trying to say about lubricating oil???? :rotfl2:



:rotfl2: :rotfl2: :rotfl2:

[Rhonda]

Don't forget, he wants to give everyone a tax break as well!!! It sure is nice of China to loan us all that money!!! :lmao::lmao:

Everyone repeat after me....


谢谢Obama先生，但我祝愿您有半新一些润滑油或指定我们的Al最少伸手可及的距离。

"But I wish you to have the almost new some lubricating oil or to assign our Al to be least the distance at arm's length"

[BRDof3]

As far as "ownership" of this goes, I understood the news to say that this passed the House w/o any Republicans voting Yes. The all-knowing US public not only annointed The One, they also gave him undefeatable majorities in Congress. So much for the concept of checks and balances. Anything he wants will go through because there are not enough dissenting voices in Congress to force debate and cooperation. (They didn't learn their lesson from Bush's first term, they just changed from Democrat to Republican).

[2goofycampers]

I still don't see Deb's name on the bailout list. :sad2:

[AuburnJen92]

I would love to know what the NEA is going to do with that money when our school district is contemplating cutting salaries by 2% next year.:faint:

[kc5grw]

The only change that is taking place is the change that used to be in my pocket is now going to be in somebody else's pocket.

[ntsammy5]

The only change that is taking place is the change that used to be in my pocket is now going to be in somebody else's pocket.

Mine, mine, mine.......

[big kahuna1]

Since the Messiah is having a problem selling his "Stimulus" package to us minions out here (It's really a "StimuLIE" package) he is now ordering that it be called a "Recovery" Package.

Apparently, the word stimulus may give too much of an impression that the bill spends a gigantic load of tax dollars.

The word “recovery,” however, has a lot more hope in it. And “hope,” if you’ll remember from the campaign, was a major theme of the new president.

HOPE and CHANGE WE CAN ALL BELIEVE IN NOW!:rolleyes2

[BigDaddyRog]

"It may take longer than the first year...it MAY take more than ONE term..."

[RvUsa]

I read this on another thread, this stimulus or "recovery" package is like rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic!

Hey, lets spend $200 million to fix up the national mall, maybe we can even put up some walls around it so you can't see the homeless veterans sleeping in the cold!

[Brer Bear]

Now none of us are politicians so we obviously can't comprehend the issues here.:scratchin


We are just to work hard, be taxed as our patriotic duty, and those smarter than us will take any excess earnings for redistribution purposes.:guilty:

Haven't civil wars been started over this kind of lunacy?

[AuburnJen92]

Haven't civil wars been started over this kind of lunacy?

Yep!

[LuckyinGa]

We need to recognize the immense appeal that Obama has. Regardless whether you like the man or not you have to be impressed by the fact that two million people showed up for his inauguration. About fifty of them even had to take a day off work to be there. :lmao:

[ftwildernessguy]

The circumstances are actually better now than they were when we fought a revolution and overthrew the government. Not that I am advocating overthrowing the goverrnment, mind you. Just pointing out that we did it once for less.

[Brer Bear]

Not advocating any action other than to exercise my freedom of speech...;)

But isn't the military oath something about "any enemy, foreign OR domestic?"

[big kahuna1]

About fifty of them even had to take a day off work to be there.

Funny, but probably somewhat true.:lmao:


Her's some more Hope and Change:

400 million for STD education. (I was wrong on the figure above)
150 million for Honey Bee Insurance
25 million for ATV Trails (Umm, we can make our own trails, Thank You)
20 million for Fish Barriers

:rolleyes2 :rolleyes2

[DisneyBishops]

And a couple of billion for all those people that didn't have to take off work.

Nobama the chosen one. Don't think so

[Gatordad]

We need to recognize the immense appeal that Obama has. Regardless whether you like the man or not you have to be impressed by the fact that two million people showed up for his inauguration. About fifty of them even had to take a day off work to be there. :lmao:

NOW THAT IS FUNNY

[ftwildernessguy]

Funny, but probably somewhat true.:lmao:


Her's some more Hope and Change:

400 million for STD education. (I was wrong on the figure above)
:rolleyes2 :rolleyes2

Since we have started spending millions on STD education, has there been a decline in STD's? Nope. It's on the rise, and from the youth I have been talking to, the education has been a dismal failure. They are as clueless about STD's and their transmission as people were in the 50's. But in typical liberal fashion, if a program is failing, it's because there wasn't enough money spent on it, so spend some more!

[big kahuna1]

Spending is their answer to everything! It never works but it makes them feel good.

[ntsammy5]

Since we have started spending millions on STD education, has there been a decline in STD's?

It's on the rise because of all the advertising!

[ntsammy5]

Spending is their answer to everything! It never works but it makes them feel good.

Just like the Republicans with tax cuts and less government - it's always the answer no matter what the question just ike spending and bigger government is the answer from the democrats. We need fresh, new ideas to solve this mess and no one is coming up with any - no one at all! Just a lot of rhetoric from all sides. :guilty: :confused3

[Jlampley]

I'm so happy I found this thread. It helps me realize that I'm not the only one who looks past the words to see the actions. I've already done this, but please email or call your senators and let them know how you feel about the "pork" in this bill. I heard someone today say that the bill was being treated as a pinata. It was being hit around and everytime it was hit some pork fell out. We need our Senators to get the biggest bat they can find an hit and hit and hit.

I also heard Nancy Pelosi say that most Republicans want this stimulus package. I don't think most Americans want this bill as she wrote it or as it was sent to the Senate. Let's let them know what we think!!

Thanks for the time to vent.

[stacktester]

Until average Joe's and not lawyers run this country it will never change. I think in order for it to get better, America is going to have to go broke and start all over. I think it's getting there.

[Brer Bear]

TERM LIMITS - no more career politicians or family dynasties!

[Brer Bear]

http://nicedoggie.net/2009/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/al_gore_mr_freeze.jpg

[WhereOWhere]

We need to recognize the immense appeal that Obama has. Regardless whether you like the man or not you have to be impressed by the fact that two million people showed up for his inauguration. About fifty of them even had to take a day off work to be there. :lmao:

Yea, cause only conservatives work. Almost as lame as the saying that we all view him as the Messiah.

Generalizations are a great argument :thumbsup2

[3gr8kids]

popcorn::

[2goofycampers]

I took it as alot of people are out of work. :confused3

[WhereOWhere]

Well I guess he was laughing at people being out of work then (notice the laugh face after what he said). Come on, that's obviously not what he meant. Take it as you will.

[LuckyinGa]

Yea, cause only conservatives work. Almost as lame as the saying that we all view him as the Messiah.

Generalizations are a great argument :thumbsup2


I think the saying is "He who walks on water!"

Perhaps you should try something other than "The Kool-Aid".:stir:

[WhereOWhere]

Even more generalizations, keep it up! Nothing makes your argument sound more valid!

[RvUsa]

Uh-oh, the community board will be here in force in no time! Time to go into the bunker and watch!!!

[BRDof3]

Yea, cause only conservatives work. Almost as lame as the saying that we all view him as the Messiah.

Generalizations are a great argument :thumbsup2

Aren't you due back on the Community Board? They miss you.

[RvUsa]

Even more generalizations, keep it up! Nothing makes your argument sound more valid!


“The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry”

http://thinkexist.com/i/sq/as4.gif Richard Dawkins (http://thinkexist.com/quotes/richard_dawkins/)

[WhereOWhere]

I guess when you really have nothing to respond with, you can always resort to saying "you don't belong here". It really makes a great point.

[WhereOWhere]

“The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry”

http://thinkexist.com/i/sq/as4.gif Richard Dawkins (http://thinkexist.com/quotes/richard_dawkins/)

If you're claiming that a generalization is rational inquiry, you should really go back and read exactly what Dawkins was saying.

[BRDof3]

I guess when you really have nothing to respond with, you can always resort to saying "you don't belong here". It really makes a great point.

They still miss you over there.

I don't see that hiring the same people that have been in charge for the last 16 years is evidence of "change." If you do, then you need to stay on the CB.

[WhereOWhere]

Since you basically said the same thing, I will quote for emphasis.

I guess when you really have nothing to respond with, you can always resort to saying "you don't belong here". It really makes a great point.

[BRDof3]

Actually, the true indication that one doesn't have anything to say is when you just repeat yourself.

[WhereOWhere]

Thanks for proving my point.

[RvUsa]

If you're claiming that a generalization is rational inquiry, you should really go back and read exactly what Dawkins was saying.


No, I am saying that anyone who is so attached to "hope" and "change" merely for the act of going with the crowd, is perpetuating the fallacy that there may actually be a change. Blind faith only perpetuates the original message and does not encourage dissenting opinions, it only feeds itself, and entrenches it followers deeper in their own beliefs.

[BRDof3]

Thanks for proving my point.

Don't worry. Oprah will be on again tomorrow and you will have a new sentence to repeat all night.

[WhereOWhere]

No, I am saying that anyone who is so attached to "hope" and "change" merely for the act of going with the crowd, is perpetuating the fallacy that there may actually be a change. Blind faith only perpetuates the original message and does not encourage dissenting opinions, it only feeds itself, and entrenches it followers deeper in their own beliefs.

Agreed. Anyone that voted for Obama on the simple premise of hope and change is a fool.

However, to generalize all those that voted for him as being that way is foolish as well.

Don't worry. Oprah will be on again tomorrow and you will have a new sentence to repeat all night.

Ahh, more generalizations. That's right, only liberals watch Oprah. She hasn't built up a humungous base amongst conservatives for almost a decade now or anything. I guess I could generalize and say that Fox News told you to say that with their talking points, but I prefer to think beyond those.

[BRDof3]

I don't confuse entertainment with enlightenment.

When you decide to use your regular screen name and let go of the Edit button you might begin to sound legit.

[WhereOWhere]

Ok, now I'm lost. Is this how you typically debate?

By the way, assuming is about as bad as generalizing. I would choose a different route.

[RvUsa]

The liberals mantra of "what can the country do for me" is the problem. They want to pay less taxes and get more for free. You can not have both! I heard so much about less "pork" and directed spending, and less than 2 weeks into the new administration, we are setting records.

Mr. Obama used people's desperation as a tool to achieve his own ends and it is already apparent that he is no different than any other politician. I wonder how long it will take for the indoctrinated to see the new administration for what it really is?

[BRDof3]

Ok, now I'm lost. Is this how you typically debate?

By the way, assuming is about as bad as generalizing. I would choose a different route.

We weren't debating, you were interrupting. The Community Board called, they need your in-depth analysis over there.

[WhereOWhere]

We weren't debating, you were interrupting. The Community Board called, they need your in-depth analysis over there.


So now your argument is that this is "your" forum? You really shouldn't give up so easy.

The liberals mantra of "what can the country do for me" is the problem. They want to pay less taxes and get more for free. You can not have both! I heard so much about less "pork" and directed spending, and less than 2 weeks into the new administration, we are setting records.

Mr. Obama used people's desperation as a tool to achieve his own ends and it is already apparent that he is no different than any other politician. I wonder how long it will take for the indoctrinated to see the new administration for what it really is?


Actually, I think the liberal mantra is "How can the country change to make it better for all of us". I agree that there is too much pork in the stimulus bill, and it annoys liberals as much as it does conservatives. Most liberals aren't naive enough to think that politics would just be thrown out the window with Obama.

[WhereOWhere]

Let me rephrase that and say "most liberals that didn't vote solely on the hope and change argument" aren't naive enough.

[LuckyinGa]

Let me rephrase that and say "most liberals that didn't vote solely on the hope and change argument" aren't naive enough.

I know what you are doing over here at the camping boards, you've been craving stimulating conversation! :rotfl2:

[Gatordad]

I thought Obama was going to bring about change? The only change he's brought is increase in spending. $50 million for the arts, c'mon.

[Disney Campers]

::cop: ::cop:

[WhereOWhere]

I know what you are doing over here at the camping boards, you've been craving stimulating conversation! :rotfl2:

Unfortunately I'm not getting much stimulating conversation from you.

I have however enjoyed the discourse with RvUSA, he seems to have a head on his shoulders. Since it appears that most people in this thread choose to simply make sarcastic comments instead of having intelligent debate, I'll leave you to it.

[Gatordad]

a billion dollars for amtrak, almost a billion for new cars for the govt', you'd think they would just hand out money. I don't see how this stimulus is good for me, no one has told me how I will benefit, other than pork being spread about.

[VACAMPER]

popcorn::

[LuckyinGa]

Unfortunately I'm not getting much stimulating conversation from you.

I have however enjoyed the discourse with RvUSA, he seems to have a head on his shoulders. Since it appears that most people in this thread choose to simply make sarcastic comments instead of having intelligent debate, I'll leave you to it.

:wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2: :wave2:

[Brer Bear]

Sorry Scott! :grouphug:

[LarryJ]

So now your argument is that this is "your" forum? You really shouldn't give up so easy.


Actually in a way it is OUR (i.e. campers) FORUM since it was created as a sub forum under the Camping forum to reduce the amount of "chit chat" in the main forum. Please look at the poll started by the Camping Board Mod HERE (http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1820825) and look at what the poll question was .... Yes - I'd love a community board just for campers .

So if you're not a regular camping forum poster this is probably not the place to be posting IMO and coming here just to .:stir: and encouraging others to do the same with posts in other forums is again probably not going to get you a favorable reception.

Larry

[des1954]

I guess when you really have nothing to respond with, you can always resort to saying "you don't belong here". It really makes a great point.
It's not that you don't belong here-we welcome anyone to join us. Just put your claws back in their sheathes. Offer something constructive in a nice way & we will accept what you have to say. Your constant verbal barbs intended just to stir the pot irritates us. You don't have to agree, but we do expect respectful disagreement. Unfortunately, you seem unable to do that.

[ntsammy5]

GREAT post Larry!

[RvUsa]

Way to go Larry!!!

[LarryJ]

Way to go Larry!!!

THANK YOU:goodvibes ... see even tho I that don't participate much in this sub forum, I've still got you guy and gals backs covered so to speak. :cool1: :thumbsup2

I'm with holding judgement in all this for awhile, but at least both our sons are in non deployable jobs and thus mainly out of harm's way for the next couple of years and maybe longer.

Larry

[vick]

::cop: ::cop:

I had a feeling I'd see you watching this post. :rotfl:

[BRDof3]

When someone posts on the CB that they are going to go to the camping board and stir some controversy it says more about the interloper than it does about anyone else.

Now we return you to your previously enjoyed campfire. ::yes::

[2goofycampers]

I had a feeling I'd see you watching this post. :rotfl:

One is Scott, who is the other guy, he's cute. :rotfl:

[vick]

One is Scott, who is the other guy, he's cute. :rotfl:

Isn't the cute one Scott? :rotfl:

[BRDof3]

Isn't the cute one Scott? :rotfl:

I thought I was the cute one!:lmao:

[2goofycampers]

Isn't the cute one Scott? :rotfl:
Scott is on the left. ;)

I thought I was the cute one!:lmao:

:groom: Since you are married to a woman named Denise I am unable to comment on your physical appearance due to our kinship. ;)

[BigDaddyRog]

I LIKE WhereOWhere.......he, she, it is a character that comes pre-equipped with judgement for us racist redneck Mexicans. Somebody pass the guacamole...its right there...next to the fried chicken. Diversity = Unity! And my unit is international!!!

Hey..Im allowed to stir the pot in my kitchen!!!

[AuburnJen92]

Wow, I am disappointed. They only brought one over this time.:upsidedow

I guess we are just not worthy and can't be assimilated.

[RvUsa]

Rog, ummmm remember, you are on double secret probation...

[AuburnJen92]

Rog, ummmm remember, you are on double secret probation...

psst-I don't think he cares John....::yes::

[RvUsa]

Hey, I am just trying LOL. He may not get to come back this time :lmao::lmao:

[BigDaddyRog]

Heeey...I SAID I LIKE the guy!!!

[Gatordad]

wow, Obama's change is working, I agreed with Jugman last week, and I agreed with LarryJ this week. I gotta stop drinking.

[AuburnJen92]

wow, Obama's change is working, I agreed with Jugman last week, and I agreed with LarryJ this week. I gotta stop drinking.

Pete needs to start going to AA.

[ram101]

Pete needs to start going to AA.

No it's OO or Obama Overload!!

[des1954]

GREAT post Larry!

Way to go Larry!!!

What about MY post. Wasn't it good, too?:sad:

[Brer Bear]

I liked it!:thumbsup2

Larry's too!

We gots some powufully good folks on dis board rhat heh!:cheer2:

[AuburnJen92]

What about MY post. Wasn't it good, too?:sad:

Yes Deb, you are as wonderful as always. :thumbsup2

[RvUsa]

Deb, I thought you knew we love you! I haven't always seen eye to eye with Larry, and thought I should tell him that I appreciated his reply.


So to make amends to you.... :flower3::flower3::grouphug:

[AuburnJen92]

See, we always know that Deb has our back. We were just pleasantly surprised others had ours as well.::yes::