January Occupancy WAAAY Down

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I just heard a rumour that the projected occupancy for the month of January at WDW is only 35%. :scared1: I'm not sure if I buy it but, since we're going in January, we wouldn't be too sad if it were true. So, I guess I'm wondering if anyone has some reliable information about this.

[miprender]

We went in Jan 2001 and there was no one there the whole week. We went from the 7-14 and we would just walk on the rides. We also went to Universal and no one there either. So if it is way down enjoy.:cool1:

Have you heard any rumors about April? We are going during Easter.

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I think it's probably much too early to know what they are projecting for April. However, Easter will be very busy - one of the busiest times of the year to visit WDW.

[Peter Pirate 2]

I believe it. I heard from a reliable source that the Universal hotels ran at as low as 15% during the fall...
pirate:

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I know that it's not exactly good news for Disney but it would be very good news for the Smiths. I sure hope it is true. How selfish am I? :)

[Andrea]

We were there last january and it was not busy at all. The only really line we stood in was test track and that was like 10 mins the most. Almost everything we walked right on ...

[dexim54]

I know that it's not exactly good news for Disney but it would be very good news for the Smiths. I sure hope it is true. How selfish am I? :)

Not even actually good news for you. When slow the parks and resorts may be cutting back, causing a loss in service for you. Think of this, only twice a week fantasmic shows, cut backs already.

[yitbos96bb]

I just heard a rumour that the projected occupancy for the month of January at WDW is only 35%. :scared1: I'm not sure if I buy it but, since we're going in January, we wouldn't be too sad if it were true. So, I guess I'm wondering if anyone has some reliable information about this.

I don't have hard numbers, but anecdotally from a friend who lives down there and works at HOB, I can believe it. He said October and November and most of December were dead...

Given Disney is offering buy 4 nights get 3 free on DDP, ROOM, and TIcket combos... I'd tend to believe this one.

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Not even actually good news for you. When slow the parks and resorts may be cutting back, causing a loss in service for you. Think of this, only twice a week fantasmic shows, cut backs already.

I would take limited services any day of the week for lower crowds. Most of the cutbacks that people are complaining about really don't bother me at all.

[mitros]

I don't have hard numbers, but anecdotally from a friend who lives down there and works at HOB, I can believe it. He said October and November and most of December were dead...

Given Disney is offering buy 4 nights get 3 free on DDP, ROOM, and TIcket combos... I'd tend to believe this one.

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.

[Peter Pirate 2]

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.
Well.:confused3

We were there Dec. 12, 13 & 14th and it WAS NOT packed in the least. We walked on to Tot!!! The restaurants were not full and the rides were not even operating at full potential. In the 15 years or so that we've visited this exact same weekend, the crowds this year simply do not compare.

Plus I can tell you the crowds at "snowing nightly" in Celebration were way down and the weekend before Universal was nearly dead.

I have no doubts that they have had busy periods but on a whole I beleive it has been slow and January will see crowds so low you'll feel you're at a private party of your own, on occasion.
pirate:

[mitros]

Well.:confused3

We were there Dec. 12, 13 & 14th and it WAS NOT packed in the least. We walked on to Tot!!! The restaurants were not full and the rides were not even operating at full potential. In the 15 years or so that we've visited this exact same weekend, the crowds this year simply do not compare.

Plus I can tell you the crowds at "snowing nightly" in Celebration were way down and the weekend before Universal was nearly dead.

I have no doubts that they have had busy periods but on a whole I beleive it has been slow and January will see crowds so low you'll feel you're at a private party of your own, on occasion.
pirate:

Just reporting what we experienced that week. I am really curious to see what January will actually be like. Could not get a room reservation so far, and we are now on the wait list at DVC.

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Just reporting what we experienced that week. I am really curious to see what January will actually be like. Could not get a room reservation so far, and we are now on the wait list at DVC.

You can't get a room? What do you mean? There are plenty of rooms available still for January in every category.

[mitros]

You can't get a room? What do you mean? There are plenty of rooms available still for January in every category.

Not at the DVC resorts....

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Not at the DVC resorts....

Oh, you're talking about DVC. My bad.

[mitros]

Oh, you're talking about DVC. My bad.

Sorry, I should have made that clear...;)

[momofbcs]

Well, I am leaving Tuesday and will get to the World on Thursday (stop off in Tampa first) and I had a terrible time getting ADRs several months ago and when I tried to change to the 4/3 discount, they said that there were certain numbers of rooms at certain hotels available with that. Im at POP, but could have switched to a Mod resort.

I am planning on bouncing back though.

[marsrunner]

Not at the DVC resorts....

Guess it depends when exactly you are going. I made this list last night and posted in a thread in the Theme Park board (though it has changed since, I noticed that the Polynesian now has a room type available on the 4/3 deal):

Animal Kingdom Lodge: Standard View
Beach Club Resort: Water or Pool View
BoardWalk Inn: Standard View, Water View, Standard Room - Club Level
Contemporary Resort: Nothing
Grand Floridian Resort And Spa: Nothing
Polynesian Resort: Nothing
Wilderness Lodge: Nothing
Yacht Club Resort: Garden View - Club Level, Lagoon View - Club Level
Caribbean Beach Resort: Standard View, Preferred Room, Water View
Coronado Springs Resort: Nothing
Port Orleans Resort Riverside: Standard View
Port Orleans Resort French Quarter: Standard View, Water View
All-Star Movies Resort: Preferred Room
All-Star Music Resort: Nothing
All-Star Sports Resort: Nothing
Pop Century Resort: Nothing
BoardWalk Villas: Standard View Studio, Standard View 1 Bedroom
Old Key West Resort: Studio, 1 Bedroom Villa, 2 Bedroom Villa
The Villas At Wilderness Lodge: Nothing
Beach Club Villas: Nothing
Saratoga Springs Resort And Spa: Studio, 1 Bedroom Villa, 2 Bedroom Villa
The Cabins At Ford Wilderness Resort: Wilderness Cabin

Now, without the deal, just rack rate, EVERYWHERE had availability except for the Grand Floridian, Coronado Springs, All-Star Music, The Villas At Wilderness Lodge and Beach Club Villas, including the Animal Kingdom Lodge Villas which aren't available on the deal.

So with or without the 4/3 deal, BoardWalk Villas, Old Key West Resort, Saratoga Springs Resort And Spa and Animal Kingdom Lodge Villas had availability.

[Tink rules]

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.

That week was when they did Pop Warner football/cheerleading... they moved it out a week... that's where the extra people came from.

[knewton64]

Disney Marathon is being held Jan 10th & 11th so I expect crowds to be moderate (not light) during approx 01-09 thru 01-12-09 time frame.

"TouringPlans.com" has the crowd level during that whole week at about a 45 minute wait for rides......(listed under crowd calenar)...

But on a different note, it is common for the hospitality industry to have occupancy levels WELL below the 50% mark during late Dec / early January. So to sum up....IF your stay at WDW isn't during ANY UNUSUAL events happening at the parks /hotels (like cheerleading contests, MLK DAY or Marathon week), then sure .....expect a crowd average at a level 4 (30-45 min wait for rides).
If you go during an unusual event (see above), then yes...I agree with TP.com & state also that the crowd levels will be about a 5 or a 6 average (45 minute approx wait time for the more popular attractions).

Hope this helps. Also, the way I look at it, I don't like crowds either but...hey this is Disney. :cloud9: SO what helps me is to think a "Level 7 or 8" crowd and anything less than that is just :cloud9: .

[Peter Pirate 2]

While it may be common for many hotels to acvhieve less than 50% occupancy during these times, it is NOT common for WDW hotels to operate below 50% at anytime.

[mitros]

While it may be common for many hotels to acvhieve less than 50% occupancy during these times, it is NOT common for WDW hotels to operate below 50% at anytime.

Right! And I really doubt that it ever happens. They will give away nights, food, whatever, to keep the place mobbed....

[CanadianGuy]

Right! And I really doubt that it ever happens. They will give away nights, food, whatever, to keep the place mobbed....

Mitros:

I can assure you that several 'premiere' level resorts were below 60% occupancy this past week.

And in January.. it's not looking pretty for some resorts.

Knox

[Peter Pirate 2]

Mitros:

I can assure you that several 'premiere' level resorts were below 60% occupancy this past week.

And in January.. it's not looking pretty for some resorts.

Knox

I agree and Disney will not stand for this. They are used to 80+% occupancy rates.
pirate:

[mitros]

I agree and Disney will not stand for this. They are used to 80+% occupancy rates.
pirate:

Exactly, and as I said, they will do whatever it takes to fill those rooms. Just wait and see.......

[acm563]

...and I might add that when I decided December 23rd to book a last minute visit to the world for Jan1-5th there were NO, I repeat NO vacancies available at ANY of the Value resorts for regular rooms, only suites were left.

[doconeill]

Not at the DVC resorts....

So with or without the 4/3 deal, BoardWalk Villas, Old Key West Resort, Saratoga Springs Resort And Spa and Animal Kingdom Lodge Villas had availability.

Don't forget...DVC would be affected very differently than CRO (regular) resorts. DVC members have essentially pre-paid their lodging, and have to "use it or lose it" (within certain parameters). DVC will likely maintain a higher occupancy rate than non-DVC.

DVC will likely be hit with being unable to rent rooms via CRO, however, due to member trades or breakage. Those rooms are unavailable to members once they hit CRO inventory (again, within certain parameters), so you will likely see them available online when a DVC member says they can't get a room.

[Peter Pirate 2]

...and I might add that when I decided December 23rd to book a last minute visit to the world for Jan1-5th there were NO, I repeat NO vacancies available at ANY of the Value resorts for regular rooms, only suites were left.

Means nothing as Jan 1st - 3rd are still the PEAK of the Holiday. Try Jan. 10th.
pirate:

[Tink rules]

But you could have gotten the 4/3 deal for the 4th... I had a friend who INSISTED on going this week - even though he could have waited a week... and is now complaining about the crowds I told him about... even if it's not as much as it may be for holiday time.

They reported last week that they only got a 4% fill in for reservations for the 4/3 deal... and that's through June. I wish I could go next month - it won't necessarily be warm, but if I could enjoy the place without lines... :thumbsup2

[BigGoofy44]

my wife and I arrived the day of the marathon and stayed through Friday. Sunday was pretty packed, but we didn't do anything. However, Monday through Thursday were very empty. Many of the lines were so fast we chose not to use the FastPass or got a FastPass and just rode the ride right then instead. The only drawback is this is when many of the rides are closed. We didn't get to go on Big Thunder Mountain Railroad or Splash Mountain. Yeah, I know Splash Mountain in 55 degree weather, but still.

Enjoy the parks.

[ntsammy5]

We went in Jan 2001 and there was no one there the whole week. .

We went mid December 2001 and I've never seen the parks so empty - go figure!

[cmash95]

Well.:confused3

We were there Dec. 12, 13 & 14th and it WAS NOT packed in the least. We walked on to Tot!!! The restaurants were not full and the rides were not even operating at full potential. In the 15 years or so that we've visited this exact same weekend, the crowds this year simply do not compare.

Plus I can tell you the crowds at "snowing nightly" in Celebration were way down and the weekend before Universal was nearly dead.

I have no doubts that they have had busy periods but on a whole I beleive it has been slow and January will see crowds so low you'll feel you're at a private party of your own, on occasion.
pirate:

donlt know what parks you were at because my family was there that same weekend and the studios in the morning was ok but by noon it was wall to wall people. we were also at MK in the beginning of december and the crowds were alot bigger than normal. the american ecomony may be in the dumps but the park was full of middle eastern vacationers and asians and i was also surprised at the number of euopean visistors since the dollar is fairly strong against the pound. while I don't think it's totally recession proof, WDW can sustain itself with foreign visitors unlike disneyland that is very dependent on california attendance.

[Peter Pirate 2]

donlt know what parks you were at because my family was there that same weekend and the studios in the morning was ok but by noon it was wall to wall people. we were also at MK in the beginning of december and the crowds were alot bigger than normal. the american ecomony may be in the dumps but the park was full of middle eastern vacationers and asians and i was also surprised at the number of euopean visistors since the dollar is fairly strong against the pound. while I don't think it's totally recession proof, WDW can sustain itself with foreign visitors unlike disneyland that is very dependent on california attendance.

Well I don't know what parks you were at either but it sounds like I made better choices than you did, LOL. And the point remains that even though you experienced large crowds during the same period, I did not, meaning there was some lull which has never been the case in years gone by.
pirate:

[Tink's Tormentor]

2009 is going to be a down year anway, so, January's bookingss being low does not shock me one bit. Actually, my understanding is, tourism as a whole will suffer greatly in 2009....

With that said, I wouldn't mind lower attendance in Disney in October LOL...

[michelleiada]

Given Disney is offering buy 4 nights get 3 free on DDP, ROOM, and TIcket combos... I'd tend to believe this one.


I didn't think that the 4/3 deal was for the dining plan too???:confused3 Is this true? Ok, so I am staying at the Beach Club Villas in May, rented points from an owner. We are doing the dining plan and will purchase park hopper tickets. Will we be able to get the 4/3 deal on the ddp and tickets? That would be AWESOME!:banana:

[Tink rules]

There are separate specials that were offered at different times. Expect more if things don't improve.

[sweetiee]

Given Disney is offering buy 4 nights get 3 free on DDP, ROOM, and TIcket combos... I'd tend to believe this one.

We went last year the end of January and it was pretty packed considering it was down time (the weekend AFTER MLK day).
WE are going again this Jan for an entire week-taking advantage of the buy 4 get 3 nights free. I wanted to ask about the 4/3 DDP. I didn't see that offered. I've told DH to opt out of DDP since we have a hard time using them all up. Plus DD4 is so picky about food on trips she barely eats. Are they offering the DDP for the same deal? It might be worth it then.I was just going to see how cheap we could make this trip and go DDPless!
Thanks!

[sweetiee]

Are there any special things going on the last week of January? Meaning are there any camps where there will be a ton of people? I sure hope not.

[Luv2Roam]

I didn't think that the 4/3 deal was for the dining plan too???
The 4/3 is a WDTC package and the specific 4/3 portion covers room and tickets -- not dining. Dining and other components are part of a MYW dining package. From your quote the pp had called it a "combo". What they meant was package.
There has always been travel discount specials. And there always will be, along with new marketing strategies and offerings.

[Guzzi]

But you could have gotten the 4/3 deal for the 4th... I had a friend who INSISTED on going this week - even though he could have waited a week... and is now complaining about the crowds I told him about... even if it's not as much as it may be for holiday time.

They reported last week that they only got a 4% fill in for reservations for the 4/3 deal... and that's through June. I wish I could go next month - it won't necessarily be warm, but if I could enjoy the place without lines... :thumbsup2

:surfweb: I know nothing about the hospitality industry so bear with me, what dose 4% fill in mean?

thanks

[MJMcBride]

Not even actually good news for you. When slow the parks and resorts may be cutting back, causing a loss in service for you. Think of this, only twice a week fantasmic shows, cut backs already.

true but reduced crowds do offset that. and I have the fantasmic dinner package for one night

the real problem may be waits for buses that might not come for awhile

[Tink rules]

:surfweb: I know nothing about the hospitality industry so bear with me, what dose 4% fill in mean?

thanks

they were down 10% from this time last year and with the specials they were only able to fill in 4% of those rooms - they are still down 6% from last year.

[Tink rules]

And that's resort wide... the Deluxes are down even more. People who may have stayed at a deluxe in the past have gone to the Mods, etc. to save money.

[Steffiesunshine]

We went mid December 2001 and I've never seen the parks so empty - go figure!

We went down on October 11, 2001 . I really wanted to cancel, but my BF at the time didn't want to, and I didn't want to upset my then 11 yr old son. We stayed off property, I think Travelodge? There was NO ONE in the parks and no one at the motel we were in. It was walk on every ride. I can't imagine how empty the Disney resort hotels could have been at that time.

I don't know if 35% is still correct though. It must have increased. I can tell you I was unable to get many of the ADRs I was looking for.

[LVSWL]

So, I have a question. We are going in April, the week before Easter. I know, I know. Peak season and all. Given the economy and everything, what would your best guess be as to how much effect there will be on the crowds during that time. It really seems like Disney is still struggling to pull people in, even offering discounts for those weeks around the holiday. Thanks for any thoughts on the subject.:)

[mitros]

So, I have a question. We are going in April, the week before Easter. I know, I know. Peak season and all. Given the economy and everything, what would your best guess be as to how much effect there will be on the crowds during that time. It really seems like Disney is still struggling to pull people in, even offering discounts for those weeks around the holiday. Thanks for any thoughts on the subject.:)

I would say that by that time, with all of these offers Disney is putting out there, it will be business as usual for that time of the year, re: busy, busy, busy!

[LVSWL]

I would say that by that time, with all of these offers Disney is putting out there, it will be business as usual for that time of the year, re: busy, busy, busy!
:sad1:

[Tink rules]

Around any of the holidays it will be crowded - always is... but when kids are off from school is when Disney will be lower than usual.

[mitros]

Around any of the holidays it will be crowded - always is... but when kids are off from school is when Disney will be lower than usual.

I believe you are mistaken. When kids are off from school for whatever reason, holidays, weekends, spring breaks, this always impacts Disney crowds in a bad way.

[Tink rules]

typo... sorry...

When the kids ARE off from school... :goodvibes

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

We are checking in on Saturday. I was wondering if anyone is/was touring the parks this week. What were your observations of the crowds?

[14disney]

We were also there in Jan 2001 and it wasn't crowded, we were there in Dec 2005 the week before Christmas and it wasn't crowded and just this past November (9-15th) and we didn't have many waits. Our first park day was the only crowded day, Nov 10th at MGM. Toy Story Mania and Soarin were the most crowded rides. But with fast pass, we never waited anywhere. All great times to go, Dec was my favorite due to the holiday decorations.

[Ana~n~Joseph]

I was there from January 4-7th and the crowds were just too much for me. I'm not used to large crowds anymore - I've been spoiled during the past few trips. Waits were usually from 40-80 minutes long (Soarin was 70 minutes at one point on Tuesday and even Spaceship Earth and It's a Small World had a long line!!) Fastpass was really the only way to get the big stuff done. I'll stick to my September trips from now on.

[mitros]

I was there from January 4-7th and the crowds were just too much for me. I'm not used to large crowds anymore - I've been spoiled during the past few trips. Waits were usually from 40-80 minutes long (Soarin was 70 minutes at one point on Tuesday and even Spaceship Earth and It's a Small World had a long line!!) Fastpass was really the only way to get the big stuff done. I'll stick to my September trips from now on.

So, would you say the economy has had no effect on Disney at all?

[Ana~n~Joseph]

So, would you say the economy has had no effect on Disney at all?

I would have to say that the economy has had little impact on the crowds in Disney. Maybe with people in the states it has but it definately has not slowed down the international tourist.

[doconeill]

I still believe there will be a delayed effect. People who already had vacations booked and paid for and may be spooked by and not directly affected (i.e. lost jobs, etc.) are likely to still do so, but as has been mentioned advanced bookings going forward are down since people are less likely to book for the future.

DVC members at the parks are also likely to remain somewhat constant - their lodging is already paid for, and to a certain extent they need to use their points or lose them. They can push it off for a bit (which actually could create a booking crunch when things get better).

You need to wait longer than the week after the holidays to start picking up on a perceivable difference. This Spring should be interesting, depending how "successful" the 4/3 program is, plus any other discounts they may offer (AP discounts still haven't opened up yet).

Now, once the direct impact hits, Disney could if it so chooses concentrate guests in ways to give the appearance that it is still busy. I'm not sure of the advantage of doing so myself...

And don't forget that crowd levels are a subjective measure...

[mitros]

I still believe there will be a delayed effect. People who already had vacations booked and paid for and may be spooked by and not directly affected (i.e. lost jobs, etc.) are likely to still do so, but as has been mentioned advanced bookings going forward are down since people are less likely to book for the future.

DVC members at the parks are also likely to remain somewhat constant - their lodging is already paid for, and to a certain extent they need to use their points or lose them. They can push it off for a bit (which actually could create a booking crunch when things get better).

You need to wait longer than the week after the holidays to start picking up on a perceivable difference. This Spring should be interesting, depending how "successful" the 4/3 program is, plus any other discounts they may offer (AP discounts still haven't opened up yet).

Now, once the direct impact hits, Disney could if it so chooses concentrate guests in ways to give the appearance that it is still busy. I'm not sure of the advantage of doing so myself...

And don't forget that crowd levels are a subjective measure...

Sorry, I'm still saying you will see NO change in the crowds at Disney, other than up, either this year or next. We will see more and more people going. The DVC is selling SO many ownerships, that any former slow months are being filled up by new DVC members. {January, September and December} December has already proven that, and it looks like January will do the same. We plan on a few day trips, and I will assure you that we WILL see record crowds. I will post as we visit.

[ntsammy5]

I'm afraid you're right about that...... November was much more crowded than I expected

[tripplanner2]

Anyone have a clue if some type of discount will be offered for after June 27th? I am guessing we have to wait until the current offer period ends.:goodvibes

[Tink rules]

They were mentioning on the Podcast that if things don't improve - look for them to offer something.

They have already posted info about the Food and Wine fest and it is WAY early for that... they're trying to get the regulars to book early...

Wonder if they will have free dining for any of it... :confused3

[Tigger22]

We make our annual trip in March (last year early April), and it's always busy (we do avoid Easter week(s), though). I am very curious to see what this trip brings in terms of crowds. Since we know what we're in for this time of year, anything lighter would just make it nicer. We choose to go this time of the year because it helps get us (well, lets face it - ME :lmao: ) thru the snowy & icy CT winter, and it is what it is. We could all debate this back and forth, but only time will tell if people will still travel in this economy.

Disney is obviously concerned enough to put these great deals out there that include spring break/peak time. The best and ONLY discount we ever got this time of year is the AAA (10%?) off the room - and I think that was only one year. We would still be going anyway, but we are very fortunate because it is only DH & I, with no kids, and I have always been careful with our finances (no CC debt, etc). So what we are able to do is not really any indication of what many, many families are going thru right now. But soon enough we'll find out.

Still, thanks to the bad economy, I can't even begin to describe the JOY I felt when I saw the 4/3 deal, with the $200 gift card for March! I started my happy dance :cool1: :cool1: :cool1: before we even booked the trip!

[marsrunner]

I think it has to say something about how low the crowds can be that ten days out from our visit (1/20-1/27) they haven't sold out of the 4/3 rooms, nevermind the rack rate rooms. All but a handfull of onsite hotels have rooms available in most categories. I think probably the only thing this deal has done for Disney is mitigated the decline in bookings from the same period last year. I imagine the occupancy rate is lower than last year, but not as low as it would have been without the deal. I also thing there's alot of cannibalism going on...people upgrading to a higher category resort or staying onsite rather than offsite. I really don't think it will be busy except on holiday/holiday weekends.
Just my opinion of course.
Now that I've opened my big mouth, just watch...it'll be packed! :(

[yitbos96bb]

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.

Wasn't that Mousefest weekend?

[yitbos96bb]

Sorry, I'm still saying you will see NO change in the crowds at Disney, other than up, either this year or next. We will see more and more people going. The DVC is selling SO many ownerships, that any former slow months are being filled up by new DVC members. {January, September and December} December has already proven that, and it looks like January will do the same. We plan on a few day trips, and I will assure you that we WILL see record crowds. I will post as we visit.

You are mistaken... however, Disney is doing what it can to make the damage as small as possible.

The aggressive deals they are offering (7 for 4) is helping. According to the podcast, they were down 15% on their bookings for 2009, after the promotion was put into place, they are only down 6%.

So the economy has had an impact, but aggressive pricing discounts has helped to dull the brunt.

[Sorahana]

It was quiet. We're actually heading back now. Some waits got to 45 mins, but not many rides. I know TSMM got to 90 mins, but I was able to fastpass it at 11:30 in the morning for later on!

It got crowded the the marathon folks came in, so many of them at Pop =).

[LVSWL]

Everyone keep us filled in...:) Thanks!

[PatriciaH]

They have already posted info about the Food and Wine fest and it is WAY early for that... they're trying to get the regulars to book early...



Good. Maybe they will post the event offerings more than 3 weeks out this year:)

[mitros]

You are mistaken... however, Disney is doing what it can to make the damage as small as possible.

The aggressive deals they are offering (7 for 4) is helping. According to the podcast, they were down 15% on their bookings for 2009, after the promotion was put into place, they are only down 6%.

So the economy has had an impact, but aggressive pricing discounts has helped to dull the brunt.

The main point of all of my posts on this subject was mainly to state that it is not going to be a slow time at Disney anytime soon. Whether the crowds are due to the normal amount of business being done there or because of some sort of promotion. There are not going to be any slow periods at Disney because there is always some sort of promotion going on, or some group {little league,as an example, along with these marathons they have} being there.
I had originally complained about the belly-to-back crowds that always seem to be around, and a person can no longer enjoy a quiet, slow paced vacation at WDW, which we were actually able to do for many years back in the 90's.
Just look at the faces of the guests roaming around like zombies, their faces frozen in a "I can't believe the amount of people here" look. You don't see alot of people happy at the parks, and how can they be when they have to fight the hoards trying to get a dining reservation or getting on a ride or into a show. Sorry, that is NOT a vacation.

[Big Jase]

We are going for a week Feb 21-28 and that is Mardi Gras week in New Orleans. Does anyone know if we will be inundated with our fellow N.O. Residents that week or will we be able to enjoy ourselves without being belly to back?

[jfinke]

I think that there will be a lot of LA people there.

We were there last year for the weekend before Mardi Gras. I have never seen so many Saints and LSU jerseys in my life.

[halld6479]

Originally Posted by Tink rules View Post
They have already posted info about the Food and Wine fest and it is WAY early for that... they're trying to get the regulars to book early...

where is the info posted? the only thing I found so far was the dates for 09 I would love to know more.

[Tink rules]

They just announced the dates... which is the earliest that they've announced them.

& they said that holiday crowds were also down... not sure by what percentage, but they were offering sales on merchandise Xmas week and that is almost never done...

They're just doing what they can to bring money in which is expected in this economy...

[musclemouse]

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.

We were there from the 7-14 and it was moderate as far as crowds. I'm assuming moderate because I have only heard rumors comparing to summer crowds. MOST rides had a waiting time of 30 minutes or less. Then the more popular rides (damn Toy Story, Soarin, etc) were 80 mins or longer. The restaurants were full, always a waiting line, waiting for the buses at least 20 minutes each time, sometimes longer. I wouldn't suggest going to Downtown Disney in the evening on the weekends. It's horrid, just packed. Other than that it wasn't bad. The only irritating thing was Pop Warner :eek: . I no longer like the color yellow. lol (jk)

Regardless we will still plan our vacation for Dec 2010. :yay:

[Tink rules]

The reasons for your extra crowds was it was Pop Warner week...

[mitros]

Originally Posted by Tink rules View Post
They have already posted info about the Food and Wine fest and it is WAY early for that... they're trying to get the regulars to book early...

where is the info posted? the only thing I found so far was the dates for 09 I would love to know more.

..........we used to be regulars, USED to be! :sad2: :guilty:
We have been buying Florida residents seasonal passes for the last 10 years. This year we are seriously considering not bothering. The crowds are just making it less fun and more work. Who the heck needs that.................

[RFrank9504]

we went last January-and it was no more than 10 minsutes onto anything-and the longest was 20 mins waiting for hte next muppets 3d show-its slow in Jan., except MLK weekend. we're going in 2 weeks and we're hoping its just like last year! :wizard:

[mitros]

we went last January-and it was no more than 10 minsutes onto anything-and the longest was 20 mins waiting for hte next muppets 3d show-its slow in Jan., except MLK weekend. we're going in 2 weeks and we're hoping its just like last year! :wizard:

I wouldn't count on it. We are also going to see for ourselves week of the 25th.

[LVSWL]

we went last January-and it was no more than 10 minsutes onto anything-and the longest was 20 mins waiting for hte next muppets 3d show-its slow in Jan., except MLK weekend. we're going in 2 weeks and we're hoping its just like last year! :wizard:
I'm hoping you are right!:)

[Tissa]

Just got back on Wednesday and it didn't seem dead to me. I know I couldn't add a day at CSR because it was booked solid. Wait times were were on average 20-30 minutes with of course TSM and Soarin at 60. Of course this was over marathon weekend too.

[Peter Pirate 2]

I always admit when I am wrong so here goes...My family (except me-had to work) went to MGM today and it was PACKED. Now I know this is a holiday weekend and all but my wife said that no one appeared too worried about the economy today.

So my prediction that Jan would be dead, dead, dead was wrong, wrong, wrong. Maybe it'll come later, maybe not until things get worse or maybe, hopefully the economy will hang on to the point that not everybody is affected.

Anyway, for today at least MGM was crowded.
pirate:

[mitros]

I always admit when I am wrong so here goes...My family (except me-had to work) went to MGM today and it was PACKED. Now I know this is a holiday weekend and all but my wife said that no one appeared too worried about the economy today.

So my prediction that Jan would be dead, dead, dead was wrong, wrong, wrong. Maybe it'll come later, maybe not until things get worse or maybe, hopefully the economy will hang on to the point that not everybody is affected.

Anyway, for today at least MGM was crowded.
pirate:

Yea, Peter, I am convinced from all I have been reading {not just on Disboards} that there will be no slow downs at WDW. Either now, in January, when it USED to be slow, or as the year goes on. Just watch and see.........As I have mentioned in several threads, Disney is agressively packing the parks any way they can. It's belly-to-back unless another catastrophy involving airplanes happens again as on 9/11. It was the only time things were really slow because people were afraid of terrorist activity.

[DisneyDadof3]

I always admit when I am wrong so here goes...My family (except me-had to work) went to MGM today and it was PACKED. Now I know this is a holiday weekend and all but my wife said that no one appeared too worried about the economy today.

So my prediction that Jan would be dead, dead, dead was wrong, wrong, wrong. Maybe it'll come later, maybe not until things get worse or maybe, hopefully the economy will hang on to the point that not everybody is affected.

Anyway, for today at least MGM was crowded.
pirate:

Today was an Early Morning Hour for DHS so it should be more crowded. Also, it is picked as the park to avoid today by one professional touring plan. Either bad luck or bad planning.

[CanadianGuy]

It is 17 days into the New Year... Last weekend was marathon.. this weekend is a holiday.. A bit early to be prognosticating about how the economy isn't affecting Disney. (* Jim Hill did exactly that this week btw )

As a close friend with several CM's who rely on tips and crowds to make a living... I can assure you that despite what you feel on visits to the parks.. EVERYTHING including the number of bookings, the number of guests and the hours that CM's get.. are WAY down.

Next week will start seeing the SuperBowl crowds roll in .. but what is next Wednesday going to be like?

[dvc at last !]

Just got back on Wednesday and it didn't seem dead to me. I know I couldn't add a day at CSR because it was booked solid. Wait times were were on average 20-30 minutes with of course TSM and Soarin at 60. Of course this was over marathon weekend too.

My DH, DD and DS returned on Wednesday, too. They were there for the Marathon last Sunday. They arrived Friday returned Wednesday.
They said the parks had great crowds.

:cool1:

[Peter Pirate 2]

My gut still has me hanging with Canadian Guy as I simply can't believe WDW will not be severly impacted. I was speaking of one park, on one day and not the resorts also.

My point for posting was that the Saturday crowd at MGM was unusually heavy and this report is coming from local AP holders who are quite good at reading the signs and I had stated here that the crowds would be way down - At this snapshot in time I was NOT correct. BUT (and this is a BIG but) I will add that RnR was down most of the day, Indy is closed, Sounds Dangerous closed and the Backlot tour was closed ... The crowds did have to go someplace (the other attractions).
pirate:

[ntsammy5]

Anecdotal references are purely based on observation and opinion of what a large/small crowd is not on statistics - it's like the weather's feels like temperatures. The only one who knows what's happening is Disney and they're talking indirectly through all the deals they're offering and the cutbacks they're making. They wouldn't do that if they weren't feeling the affects.

When we were there in November with a couple of other families (we've all been before then) one family thought the crowds were down, another thought they were up and the third thought they were about the same as previous year's crowds. Take your pick. :lmao:

[LVSWL]

My gut still has me hanging with Canadian Guy as I simply can't believe WDW will not be severly impacted. I was speaking of one park, on one day and not the resorts also.

My point for posting was that the Saturday crowd at MGM was unusually heavy and this report is coming from local AP holders who are quite good at reading the signs and I had stated here that the crowds would be way down - At this snapshot in time I was NOT correct. BUT (and this is a BIG but) I will add that RnR was down most of the day, Indy is closed, Sounds Dangerous closed and the Backlot tour was closed ... The crowds did have to go someplace (the other attractions).
pirate:
Thanks for the info! Do you happen to know why Indy and Sounds Dangerous and Backlot were closed?

[doconeill]

Thanks for the info! Do you happen to know why Indy and Sounds Dangerous and Backlot were closed?

Sounds Dangerous I believe has been placed into the "seasonal" category, which means it is generally open only when they feel it necessary.

Studio Backlot is closed for refurb - report is they are adding a new pre-recorded speaker system to the trams.

No idea why Indy would be closed.

[Peter Pirate 2]

Anecdotal references are purely based on observation and opinion of what a large/small crowd is not on statistics - it's like the weather's feels like temperatures. The only one who knows what's happening is Disney and they're talking indirectly through all the deals they're offering and the cutbacks they're making. They wouldn't do that if they weren't feeling the affects.

When we were there in November with a couple of other families (we've all been before then) one family thought the crowds were down, another thought they were up and the third thought they were about the same as previous year's crowds. Take your pick. :lmao:

My update was meant as NOTHING more than 'anecdotal evidence' ... I thought I made it clear that this was just an update on the crowd of one park on one day issued because I had swore up and down that after the Marathon week the Parks would be very, very slow and this was not the case yesterday.

It is true that many factors go into making a park busy and that things can be done to make a park 'look busy', like closing attractions (as I stated) or only opening a ride partially (two elevators instead of three at ToT).

It seems obvious to me that tough times are coming as at last report the 'buy 4 get three deal' hasn't even sold out! This seems very telling, but still at this point in time the Parks (or at least some of them) are appearing to be very crowded with extremely long wait lines (Toy Story was 80 minutes). When will it actually slow down? I'm not sure but I think it will have to eventually.
pirate:

[ntsammy5]

My update was meant as NOTHING more than 'anecdotal evidence' ...


Sorry I didn't mean to sound like I was being critical of anyone here. I know this is all meant to give people the benefite of individual experiences.

[LVSWL]

Sounds Dangerous I believe has been placed into the "seasonal" category, which means it is generally open only when they feel it necessary.

Studio Backlot is closed for refurb - report is they are adding a new pre-recorded speaker system to the trams.

No idea why Indy would be closed.
Thanks!!:)

[CanadianGuy]

It seems obvious to me that tough times are coming as at last report the 'buy 4 get three deal' hasn't even sold out! This seems very telling, but still at this point in time the Parks (or at least some of them) are appearing to be very crowded with extremely long wait lines (Toy Story was 80 minutes). When will it actually slow down? I'm not sure but I think it will have to eventually.
pirate:

The 4/3 offer has NOT sold out for a great many dates and I half expect the booking window to be extended past January 24th or whatever the current 'closing date' is.

If that doesn't happen, perhaps yet another offer will be foisted out there.

My sources indicate that there have been some dreadfully slow days and stretches already this year.. And February ain't lookin so hot.\

I hate to be "that guy" but when Jim Hill says "The economy hasn't affected Disney nearly as much as they expected.." -- I already start siding with the other side of the argument because he has been so dramatically and spectacularly wrong over and over in the past 24 to 36 months that at some point, presuming he's wrong again is just smart thinking.

[MJMcBride]

I just got back. It was real quiet until yesterday when it was crazy crowded

[asianway]

Indy was closed for a HS dance competition. There were groups of them everywhere, hence the large crowd at MGM

[doconeill]

Indy was closed for a HS dance competition. There were groups of them everywhere, hence the large crowd at MGM

Ironically, DW today put on a Showtime docu on the U.S. Jump Rope Championships from 2007 called "JUMP!", which took place at WDW. The main competition took place at the Milk House, but the exhibition of the winners was at (then) Disney/MGM Studios. I couldn't quite figure out if it was at the Indy theater (with an enclosure set up), or more likely at the Theater Of The Stars (or whatever it is - behind the faux San Francisco hill), which I have never seen so can't be sure.

[collcass]

The 4/3 offer has NOT sold out for a great many dates and I half expect the booking window to be extended past January 24th or whatever the current 'closing date' is.

If that doesn't happen, perhaps yet another offer will be foisted out there.

My sources indicate that there have been some dreadfully slow days and stretches already this year.. And February ain't lookin so hot.\

I hate to be "that guy" but when Jim Hill says "The economy hasn't affected Disney nearly as much as they expected.." -- I already start siding with the other side of the argument because he has been so dramatically and spectacularly wrong over and over in the past 24 to 36 months that at some point, presuming he's wrong again is just smart thinking.


This sounds spot on. The trickle down will come to Disney, though it is obviously slower to hit them than many other coroprations. Disney has been adjusting to the failing economy for quite some time now and I'm sure many of the adjustments they make are not seen by any of us visitors. ALso, as stated by previous posters, people book these vacation so far out that they have oodles of time to pay them off. The coming months are when it will be very evident just how hard hit they are.

We went in July 2008. While it was extremely packed at times, I had no problem switching my reservation. We were going to move to Wl for our last 4 nights but the kids enjoyed POR so much they wanted to stay. The CM at the front desk switched our ressie right over and even gave me an awesome AP rate. Thus was July 4th weekend. Actually it was the end of our trip so it would have been the w/e of the 12th.

Anyhow, it will be interesting to see what this year brings. Our trip is scheduled for Nov 20 -Dec 5. I know I probably won't get any good rates Thabksgiving wek but hopefully the following week!

[mitros]

Thanks!!:)

Yea, we were told that a while back by a CM that was leaving for further education. He said they were going to do that ride what they did with the Living with the Land boat ride. {No CM giving a spiel on that one any more either} Just another instance of cutting back on staff. I'm sure Disney is working on other ways to eliminate CMs from other rides as well.

Sorry, this was in reference to a post by doconeill regarding the sound system on the trams .

[DisneyLifer87]

I was just there 1/11 - 1/18 and can tell you the crowds were pretty low. Wait times were 30-40 min maximum at only the popular rides [toy story mania, soarin'] from 1/12-1/15 and that was only in mid-afternoon. We never had to wait longer than 15 min until the weekend hit. Then the crowds were usual.

It was fun to actually look at my watch at 10:30am after being in the park an hour and a half and having done practically all of the big rides. :thumbsup2

[Guzzi]

:coffee: Candian Guy,
I read your post including;
"I hate to be "that guy" but when Jim Hill says "The economy hasn't
affected Disney nearly as much as they expected.." -- I already start
siding with the other side of the argument because he has been so
dramatically and spectacularly wrong over and over in the past 24 to 36
months that at some point, presuming he's wrong again is just smart
thinking."
and was just wondering (just found Jim Hill's website a couple of weeks ago)what Jim H. has been wrong about over the last couple of years? Im not doubting you, just curious, thanks

[knewton64]

I was just there 1/11 - 1/18 and can tell you the crowds were pretty low. Wait times were 30-40 min maximum at only the popular rides [toy story mania, soarin'] from 1/12-1/15 and that was only in mid-afternoon. We never had to wait longer than 15 min until the weekend hit. Then the crowds were usual.

It was fun to actually look at my watch at 10:30am after being in the park an hour and a half and having done practically all of the big rides. :thumbsup2

-----
The above posting as I was there too 01-07-09 to 01-11-09 and the crowds were very low.

[CanadianGuy]

:coffee: Candian Guy,
I read your post including;
"I hate to be "that guy" but when Jim Hill says "The economy hasn't
affected Disney nearly as much as they expected.." -- I already start
siding with the other side of the argument because he has been so
dramatically and spectacularly wrong over and over in the past 24 to 36
months that at some point, presuming he's wrong again is just smart
thinking."
and was just wondering (just found Jim Hill's website a couple of weeks ago)what Jim H. has been wrong about over the last couple of years? Im not doubting you, just curious, thanks

Well.. this for starters.. "Recession worries starting to recede?" title of this article and not a week later Disney is offering buyouts to ThemePark and Resort execs? Obviously that headline is an assumption.. and wrong.

Jim was on the right track however - It would make sense for them to do this work now, construction in an economic downturn costs a lot less mainly cause there's more people sitting around idle.. but there is no easing of the economic downturn for Disney right now. But spending capital smartly NOW to save 18 to 25 % on construction costs for a hotel that WILL be occupied as the economy eases about the time the construction is complete ... makes sense. It'll create some jobs NOW and create even more jobs later when it opens.

As for Jim H. Just go to page 29 of the articles on his website and read your way forward. I gave up reading him in December of 2006 cause I purposely felt someone "inside the gated walls of the Mouse House in Burbank" was intentionally feeding him a bunch of hooey to make him look bad.

I still seriously wonder that.

I'm sure Jim's a nice guy .. and he's definitely on the mark sometimes.. but all too frequently he seems to make leaps of faith and assumptions that just aren't valid. It undermines his credibility.

Knox

[Keyser]

-----
The above posting as I was there too 01-07-09 to 01-11-09 and the crowds were very low.

Keep in mind that this is always one of the lowest crowd times of the year. I went in 2006 and 2007 right around these dates, and both times the parks were not at all crowded (for example, no wait for Tower of Terror even in the middle of the afternoon)- only a few, like Soarin, were even getting over 30 minutes. That's not to say this year isn't worse, but I wouldn't go on the crowds in January to judge that well.

[CanadianGuy]

Keep in mind that this is always one of the lowest crowd times of the year. I went in 2006 and 2007 right around these dates, and both times the parks were not at all crowded (for example, no wait for Tower of Terror even in the middle of the afternoon)- only a few, like Soarin, were even getting over 30 minutes. That's not to say this year isn't worse, but I wouldn't go on the crowds in January to judge that well.

Earlier in the this thread (and others on this board) people were stating that it was 'super crowded' at this traditionally slow time.. (they attended one day, a Saturday) as an indicator that the economy hasn't affected Disney one whit.

These responses were to say "Not quite" so super crowded.

[Guzzi]

:goodvibes thanks for the reply canadian guy

[Mouseaholic!!!]

DH is a castmember at ABC - 30 year veteran.

The word around the school yard is 4th quarter attendance was down 8%. That is not the worry, however. Anaheim likes to have "butts in the beds" because they have always worked on the "get them here and they will spend" theory.

4th quarter problem was....people were spending less....at WDW and DL.

Our December trip I traveled in a scooter for the first time.....I was at "gift bag" height. We were heading over to the Christmas Party one evening as the ferry was bringing a LARGE load of guests back to the T & TC. The one thing we ALL noticed were......hardly anybody had any Disney shopping bags. We noticed again in the stores.....they were PACKED, but purchases we watched were small.

They can get the people there with the current specials....but they cannot make budget minded guests buy.

2009 will have more challenges for WDW with the strength of the US dollar agains the British Pound.....not to mention they are now in deeper into the mortgage crisis that WE are.

International guests are not going to be rushing here this year.

There is no way Disney is going to avoid these challenges.

[My2Angels]

Anyhow, it will be interesting to see what this year brings. Our trip is scheduled for Nov 20 -Dec 5. I know I probably won't get any good rates Thabksgiving wek but hopefully the following week![/QUOTE]

You might be surprised! We got free dining last year (2008) Thanksgiving week! :)

[RescueRanger]

I just called and made a couple of our ADRs for our March 7-15 trip. We are only 40 days out and I was making ressies for a group of 12. I was worried with such a large group and short notice that I was going to be at the mercy of what time slots were left. Wrong, the group dining agent said I pretty much had a choice of any time I wanted for both of my ADRs. Wow, I couldn't believe it. I sure hope this means lighter crowds.

[Guzzi]

:cool1: Any Disr's returning from a stay a the end of the month after the holiday and marathon, how were the crowds at the parks?, how were the crowds at your hotel?

[peanutandbella]

I just returned from a trip 1/21-1/28. I thought the crowds in the parks were pretty good. With good timing, I manged to not wait more than 25 minutes for anything (by using fast pass for the more popular rides of course). Even the stand by lines for things like Soarin and Space Mountain, were never above 50 minutes that I saw. As others have posted, there were tons of Brazilian tour groups though. I also was very surprised when I tried to check into Movies and was told I was being transferred to Sports because they didn't have a room for my length of stay. After expressing my disappointment and that I had already paid a change fee to be moved OUT of Sports into Movies about 3 weeks before, they suddenly found a room for me. So I'm not sure if they were really full or not.

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Anybody who thinks the resorts and parks are full right now.....rewind to last Thursday when Disney announced, because of the downturn in the economy they were forced to layoff staff company wide. 5% of ABC said bye-bye...and 1,000 in Disney cost centers overall.

It's not the end, there continues to be consumate changes and it's NOT because hotels are full.

Disney is offering discounts everywhere to get "heads in the beds". The sad news now is ...... they ARE getting a few more people to come....but in the last 3 months they have spent 40% less while there.


We should all be cheering when the parks are FULL and hands are filled with Disney shopping bags at the end of the night...that is unless you LIKE to see layoffs of staff and the diminished services offered.

Oh by the way, the 1,000 did NOT include the 600 buy-outs to executives. These people were fired and positions eliminated.

[Tink rules]

Walt Disney Co. profits dropped 32 percent at close of 2008

Jason Garcia

Sentinel Staff Writer

4:38 PM EST, February 3, 2009


Profits at the Walt Disney Co. fell 32 percent during the final three months of 2008, dragged down by falling DVD sales, weakened advertising revenue, and lower attendance at its theme parks.

Disney said it this afternoon it earned $845 million, or 45 cents a share, during its fiscal first quarter, down from almost $1.3 billion, or 63 cents a share, for the same period a year ago.

The results, which include a gain of 4 cents a share from the sale of investments in two Latin American pay-television services, missed Wall Street's expectations. Analysts had predicted average earnings of 52 cents a share, based on a survey by Thomson Reuters.

Total revenue fell 8 percent to $9.6 billion.

The company's parks-and-resorts division reported both lower revenue and operating income for the three months that ended Dec. 27. Revenue was down 4 percent to $2.7 billion, while operating profit fell 24 percent to $382 million.

Disney blamed the division's performance on sagging results at its U.S. resorts and at Disneyland Resort Paris. Both attendance and occupied-room nights fell at Walt Disney World and at Disneyland in Anaheim, Calif.

The company said it only partially offset the losses with cost cuts.

"We faced a challenging first quarter with many of our businesses impacted to various degrees by the economic downturn," Disney President and Chief Executive Officer Bob Iger said in a written statement. "We are forcefully confronting current circumstances while investing in the great creativity, brands and assets that are Disney's strengths and keys to its long-term success."

Copyright © 2009, Orlando Sentinel

[Guzzi]

:cool1: according to a couple of threads, the buy 4 get 3 free deal will be extended for dates through 8/15.

I guess the recent earning news coupled with what I assume must be lower than hoped for reservations for the summer, has caused disney to extend the deal to bring in folks to the resorts.

Im not surprised, things are so bad everywhere, I work in local govt, and the admin is looking at ways to furlough workers or go to 4 day work week to save $, which takes me right out of the vacation planning for this year.

Oh well, maybe next year

[Tjkane28]

:cool1: according to a couple of threads, the buy 4 get 3 free deal will be extended for dates through 8/15.



Iger announced this during the earnings conference call on Tuesday. The booking window is scheduled to open Monday, Feb. 9

[tink713]

We were in the world from Jan.24-Feb.1, and I was expecting it to be quiet like it was in September. Boy was I wrong, it was crazy crowded. We waited in line for Magical Express for an hour. At one point during the week, the line for Soarin was 100 minutes, Test Track was 60 minutes, and Spaceship Earth was 25 minutes! I really couldn't believe how crowded it got considering it was January.

[ufgator]

We were in the world from Jan.24-Feb.1, and I was expecting it to be quiet like it was in September. Boy was I wrong, it was crazy crowded. We waited in line for Magical Express for an hour. At one point during the week, the line for Soarin was 100 minutes, Test Track was 60 minutes, and Spaceship Earth was 25 minutes! I really couldn't believe how crowded it got considering it was January.

I was there Jan 28-Feb 1 and was surprised how crowded it was. We were expecting it to be slow and it wasn't.

[cmac609]

Most of December was dead????
We were there from Dec. 6-12, and everything was mobbed! Restaurants rides, resorts. Never saw so many people. This has to be the busiest Christmas since 2001!
Fortunatley, we made dining reservations in April, because we could not get any reservations anywhere for meals once we got there.And the counter service eateries in Epcot {as an example} were beyond crowded. Took us forever to get a meal, and we did not even go during the lunch hours!
We go to WDW every December, {for the last 11 years} and have never seen the crowds that we saw this year.

Okay, we were there for the first time at Christmas Season from 12/12-12/17. The 12th was dead--so empty. However the weekend 13-14 were crazy especially at the Magic Kingdom...it was much worse than 4th of July weekend...it was crazy....I think alot had to do that those days were the weekend...come Monday it was less crowded but not as empty as that Friday the 12th.

[PaulaSB12]

This is the offer current in the UK

Simply book a 14 night Orlando package with tickets and get 14 nights for the price of 10 plus 7 free days in the Disney Parks.

There's never been a larger selection of Orlando hotels on offer - it's the perfect time to take-off to the magic.
Offer ends 31 March 2009.


Terms and conditions apply. Offer is valid for a 14 night stay only. Not applicable on other holiday durations. Valid on selected hotels and room categories, subject to availability. Requires purchase of Disney's 14-Day Ultimate Ticket for every member of the party. 14 day ticket for the price of 7 is only available with a 14 night stay and ticket purchase. Valid for arrivals from 19 April – 01 October 09. Must book by 31 March 09. Offer available for new bookings only and is not combinable with other offers. Check with your travel provider for full terms and conditions. © Disney

Cancelled my free dining holiday and used that deposit to pay for this one with just a £25 amendment fee saving £287 but I think this will be my last year for a while, I am only going because I paid for my flight and it would cost to much to cancel it.

[rantnnravin]

We were in the world from Jan.24-Feb.1, and I was expecting it to be quiet like it was in September. Boy was I wrong, it was crazy crowded. We waited in line for Magical Express for an hour. At one point during the week, the line for Soarin was 100 minutes, Test Track was 60 minutes, and Spaceship Earth was 25 minutes! I really couldn't believe how crowded it got considering it was January.

I was there Jan 28-Feb 1 and was surprised how crowded it was. We were expecting it to be slow and it wasn't.

What needs to be taken into consideration is that many CM hours have been cut, so lines WILL be longer. Here's why:

a) Using the test track reference: there are 3 briefing rooms. There is also a FP entrance and a single-rider entrance - each requiring a CM to direct guests. Let's cut out the FP CM and the single-rider CM and have one CM and one (maybe 2) briefing rooms open. You have just cut capacity and effectively increased the wait time for the attraction - making the park seem busy. Same thing goes for Soarin. If they close one theater, it cuts capacity in half (thousands of guests per hour) while also eliminating the need for the 4-5 CMs to run that side.
b) Crowd patterns and park choices also affect how busy a park is. So, combine observation "a" with having no fantasmic at the studios, and no spectro at MK and you have more guests going to Epcot. This may also cause affect "c":
c) Disney knows "b" will occur so they cut staffing at the other parks - thereby making them appear busier as well.

To put it into real-world context: Let's say the MTA (public transportation) wants to cut fuel consumption. So, instead of running four M34 buses each hour, they only run two. What is the result? The buses are more full (making it appear that ridership is up) and the masses at the bus stops are larger (making it appear that ridership is up).

:teacher:

[Steffiesunshine]

We just returned from a trip Jan 27 to Feb 3, and we were pleasantly suprised at how LOW the crowds were. Most attractions were walk on, although I did see a 25 minute wait on Expedition Everest, but later that day, it was 5 and 10 minutes. On Friday night, Soarin was only a 40 minute wait and that was the longest wait we saw for that ride all week. (Went there 3 days)

I took photos of stand-by times at prime time afternoon hours and Buzz, HM, SM, BTMRR was never more than 10 minutes. Buzz was actually 5 minutes. The busiest day I saw was actually Saturday. I was at DHS and the stand-by line for Toy Story Mania at 2pm was 45 minutes. Fast Passes were gone. We waited and the wait was actually 37 minutes. We returned later that night around 7:30pm after the 7pm American Idol Show and the wait was 25 minutes, but we wanted to leave.

We never stood on a bus, and the boats were always empty to our resort. I purposely noticed all the darkened rooms at our hotel. We had an inner courtyard and you could tell how many rooms were empty. The drapes were never opened and lights on in very few rooms. We checked in at 11am and had a room ready immediately, as did the other 7 families who came in on the bus with us that day. Our ME bus was waiting for us at the airport at 10:30am, and we left right for the resort with about 9 other families/couples. We made 1 drop at the Poly and everyone else went to WL. On the way home, we were picked up actually by a Disney Cruise Line bus at exactly 6:05pm as scheduled and there was only 1 other person on the bus with us.

I know many people doubt that there is a good time to visit Disney anymore, but I would go back this time next year in a second. Unfortunately I am going back already 11/29-12/6 on the 40% code. If it was good for January, I would be there.

I don't know if the days we were at the park mattered. I am shocked to see that some people there at the same time felt the parks were crowded. I did do exactly what you aren't supposed to do. We went to parks on every EMH and once on MMH. We didn't follow any touring plan or recommendation for what day to go to which park. I guess maybe we just got lucky, but again, I do have lots of photos of very empty parks.


And on another note: I saw a few Brazilian tour groups, but they weren't making any trouble and we saw a lot of cheerleaders on Saturday at DHS, but they weren't really an issue. We saw them walking by as we were eating lunch, and did run into a group on TOT.

[mitros]

Okay, we were there for the first time at Christmas Season from 12/12-12/17. The 12th was dead--so empty. However the weekend 13-14 were crazy especially at the Magic Kingdom...it was much worse than 4th of July weekend...it was crazy....I think alot had to do that those days were the weekend...come Monday it was less crowded but not as empty as that Friday the 12th.

OK, we have made 9 day trips since the first week of January, and each and every trip was met with mobs in the parks, at the restaurants and at the resorts. Still waiting for things to "slow-down".

[Mouseaholic!!!]

OK, we have made 9 day trips since the first week of January, and each and every trip was met with mobs in the parks, at the restaurants and at the resorts. Still waiting for things to "slow-down".


If we are lucky, they will NOT slow down!!! Disney needs all the people it can capture now.

If you look at the last quarter results....Disney is now earning only 53% of each $1.00 collected for the same quarter a year before. (because of all the discounts offered now).

We now need 189% of the traffic for Disney to earn the same $$$.

Crowds - WOO HOO ---- YEA! Crowds are a good thing!

[mitros]

If we are lucky, they will NOT slow down!!! Disney needs all the people it can capture now.

If you look at the last quarter results....Disney is now earning only 53% of each $1.00 collected for the same quarter a year before. (because of all the discounts offered now).

We now need 189% of the traffic for Disney to earn the same $$$.

Crowds - WOO HOO ---- YEA! Crowds are a good thing!

Your kidding me, right?

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Your kidding me, right?



Nope - that's the actual math.

In order for Disney to recoup their income for 2008 (an OK year...but not one of the best), they will have to entertain 189% of 2008's gate.

This is why Disney is looking at every division for layoffs. Payroll is an immediate reduction in their costs though brutal to the groups targeted.

The economy has not been kind to Disney but it will eventually turn around. Until then....they need more "heads in the beds" which is why they have offered so many BIG discounts. Each time they offer a 40% discount.....they have to increase the gate over the year before.....just to break even.

189% means there will not be a reduction in the quality of the experience because they will have the $$$ to continue!

Sadly, with the current conditions, the Disney "grownups" are doing their jobs....offering great discounts to bring us back....but also cutting everywhere possible......dumbing down the menus, laying off staff, extending maintenance periods (next time you are in the monorail riding over the MK parking lot.....look at the paint. I have a photo of my DH in a very goofy halloween costume kneeling near the "Doopy 106" row...seemed appropriate. Now when you look down, you can barely read the print the paint is so worn. Oh sure, it's just a parking lot...but where else are they cutting back on maintenance?).....ok, back on track.....cutting back on Fantasmic, shows, fireworks.

Maybe with all this work, later this year they will need only 150% gate. I guess the next quarter report will give us more insight.

[CanadianGuy]

Well to be blunt.. getting greater than 100% of last years gate attendance is very very very highly unlikely.. pretty much impossible in this economic climate.

And to stroll over to mitros's side of the fence for JUST a moment.. even if they DID get that kind of crowd - what would they do with them? Park attendance and crowd levels are limited by the number of open attractions and so forth.

So for example.. it's literally impossible (fire codes) for Disney to do 189% of last year's numbers for the two weeks around Easter, on July 4th, or December 25th to January 1st.. ... so that means on other days, they'd have to do greater than 200% to make up for it.

Well.. when you start looking at the calendar - there are a whole bunch of days where the parks could not accommodate 200% of last year's numbers.. so then you start looking at days where Disney needs to do 250~300% of last years same day numbers to keep up with this incredible number.

It simply won't happen... not in the current economic climate I'd bet the farm. Sorry.

I don't know where everyone else works - but my employer stopped replacing workers who quit last summer.. and we're all working WAY more to just keep the lights on with less revenue coming in the door.

My trip to Disney this year is off the table until at least January of 2010.. maybe later. :(

Knox

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Well to be blunt.. getting greater than 100% of last years gate attendance is very very very highly unlikely.. pretty much impossible in this economic climate.

And to stroll over to mitros's side of the fence for JUST a moment.. even if they DID get that kind of crowd - what would they do with them? Park attendance and crowd levels are limited by the number of open attractions and so forth.

So for example.. it's literally impossible (fire codes) for Disney to do 189% of last year's numbers for the two weeks around Easter, on July 4th, or December 25th to January 1st.. ... so that means on other days, they'd have to do greater than 200% to make up for it.

Well.. when you start looking at the calendar - there are a whole bunch of days where the parks could not accommodate 200% of last year's numbers.. so then you start looking at days where Disney needs to do 250~300% of last years same day numbers to keep up with this incredible number.

It simply won't happen... not in the current economic climate I'd bet the farm. Sorry.

I don't know where everyone else works - but my employer stopped replacing workers who quit last summer.. and we're all working WAY more to just keep the lights on with less revenue coming in the door.

My trip to Disney this year is off the table until at least January of 2010.. maybe later. :(

Knox



NOW you are finally seeing Disney's dilema! Because of all the discounts and the cost-savings each guest searches for now to afford one more trip to the magic place, Disney is not making the same amount of $$$ per guest as in the past.

It would be HORRIBLE to be in the park with a 189% gate!!!

But Disney MUST continue to make $$$$. They can cutback only so much before the experience by guests is compromised. The economy is putting Disney in a very difficult place.

My DH and I are actually one of the worst offenders. Our next Disney trip will be to our beloved DL.....with a gift of DVC points from a friend, we will stay at the Grand Cali, free castmember tickets, free Southwest Airlines flights with reward points, food delivery from Albertsons so our dining is only one meal out a day.... and a tighter spending budget when we ARE there....we are Disney's worst nightmare! .....but this is how we can afford to squeeze in a Disney holiday. I have already taken a 25% pay cut and our little company is facing a second shortly.


Bob Iger has already said the economy is forcing them to make very difficult decisions. It's impacting all of us in some way.....even if it's only going to Disney with all the cutbacks.

I will be the FIRST to celebrate when Disney begins to make their budget numbers again. That means eventually things will return to normal in our happy place.

[mitros]

Nope - that's the actual math.

In order for Disney to recoup their income for 2008 (an OK year...but not one of the best), they will have to entertain 189% of 2008's gate.

This is why Disney is looking at every division for layoffs. Payroll is an immediate reduction in their costs though brutal to the groups targeted.

The economy has not been kind to Disney but it will eventually turn around. Until then....they need more "heads in the beds" which is why they have offered so many BIG discounts. Each time they offer a 40% discount.....they have to increase the gate over the year before.....just to break even.

189% means there will not be a reduction in the quality of the experience because they will have the $$$ to continue!

Sadly, with the current conditions, the Disney "grownups" are doing their jobs....offering great discounts to bring us back....but also cutting everywhere possible......dumbing down the menus, laying off staff, extending maintenance periods (next time you are in the monorail riding over the MK parking lot.....look at the paint. I have a photo of my DH in a very goofy halloween costume kneeling near the "Doopy 106" row...seemed appropriate. Now when you look down, you can barely read the print the paint is so worn. Oh sure, it's just a parking lot...but where else are they cutting back on maintenance?).....ok, back on track.....cutting back on Fantasmic, shows, fireworks.

Maybe with all this work, later this year they will need only 150% gate. I guess the next quarter report will give us more insight.

No, I mean your kidding me saying that quote: "WOO HOO-----Yea! Crowds are a good thing". Huge crowds make it impossible to enjoy ones self.

[Backstage_Gal]

Sorry, I'm still saying you will see NO change in the crowds at Disney, other than up, either this year or next. We will see more and more people going. The DVC is selling SO many ownerships, that any former slow months are being filled up by new DVC members. {January, September and December} December has already proven that, and it looks like January will do the same. We plan on a few day trips, and I will assure you that we WILL see record crowds. I will post as we visit.



Yeah, that's why we are having layoffs, record crowds :rotfl:

[mitros]

Yeah, that's why we are having layoffs, record crowds :rotfl:

There are NO layoffs at the park/resort level at this time. Only management types.

[Backstage_Gal]

There are NO layoffs at the park/resort level at this time. Only management types.
Like exectutives? I beg to differ! Execs wre given a package option, for the thre rest of us, its straight layoffs.

Both DH and I are in middle management, and were flat out told there will be layoffs. We expect to hear by the end of the week. We both have worked there for over 30 years and might be out of work next week,

[LVSWL]

Like exectutives? I beg to differ! Execs wre given a package option, for the thre rest of us, its straight layoffs.

Both DH and I are in middle management, and were flat out told there will be layoffs. We expect to hear by the end of the week. We both have worked there for over 30 years and might be out of work next week,
BG- I hope that the news for you and your DH is good not bad. Thinking good thoughts for you.:wizard:

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Like exectutives? I beg to differ! Execs wre given a package option, for the thre rest of us, its straight layoffs.

Both DH and I are in middle management, and were flat out told there will be layoffs. We expect to hear by the end of the week. We both have worked there for over 30 years and might be out of work next week,


Having gone through this when it was my DH's turn in New York....my sincere sympathy and best wishes for good news to both of you. DH was lucky - he got a buyout letter but was not chosen.

For those left behind, you will now discover how tough it is to maintain the quality of what was the norm last week.


Let's all remember to say THANK YOU to as many castmembers as we see. No one can promise they will be there the next time we visit....let's make them smile RIGHT NOW.

[Saxsoon]

The All Stars (where I work in Merchandise) are almost always at 95-100% capacity. There are many cheerleading competitions going on right now.

[mitros]

Like exectutives? I beg to differ! Execs wre given a package option, for the thre rest of us, its straight layoffs.

Both DH and I are in middle management, and were flat out told there will be layoffs. We expect to hear by the end of the week. We both have worked there for over 30 years and might be out of work next week,

Anything happen yet?

[tjkraz]

If you look at the last quarter results....Disney is now earning only 53% of each $1.00 collected for the same quarter a year before. (because of all the discounts offered now).

We now need 189% of the traffic for Disney to earn the same $$$.


Not sure where those numbers come from. :confused3

According to the data Disney released in February the Parks & Resorts division saw a 4% decline in revenue and a 24% decline in profit for the 1st quarter of FY 2009 (which ended in December.) That's compared to 1Q 2008.

The primary culprits are reduced guest spending and the discount travel packages Disney is offering.

When discussing profitability, you can't make simple calculations to guess at traffic increases necessary to match prior years. The amount of revenue which contributes to profit will certainly fluctuate at different guest levels. And, as stated here, Disney is also making adjustments to reduce overhead expenses.

There is definitely some belt-tightening happening but right now things are far from dire. Disney still earned nearly $400 million in PROFIT from its theme park operations in that quarter alone. We can certainly debate the appropriateness of some of the cost saving moves made in recent months, but it would be unfair to conclude that cuts and service reductions will be entirely driven by a desire to reach a certain profitability level no matter the cost.

[Peter Pirate 2]

We can certainly debate the appropriateness of some of the cost saving moves made in recent months, but it would be unfair to conclude that cuts and service reductions will be entirely driven by a desire to reach a certain profitability level no matter the cost.

Empirical evidence, much of what has been discussed here, based on what and how Disney has reacted to challenges lead me to strongly disagree with you on this matter.

Iger is purely a bottom line kind of slug. He. like Eisner before him, are more concerned with QUARTERLY numbers than anything else.
pirate:

[redrosesix]

Got a call from my mortgage co the other day asking if I wanted to lock in at a lower rate (I had been doing 6 mo terms for the past 2 years, since those were the cheapest rates)

For the 1st time in a long time, the yield curve is no longer inverted -- longer term rates are again lower than short term rates. That's a good thing -- lenders don't like the inverted yield curve and loan less money under those circumstances.

I also watched an interview with a top Canadian market analyst on Tuesday, the day the Bank of Canada cut rates -- their spin on things? As soon as Canadian businesses can shake the dust out of the system, especially where our economy is tied to the US, we're set for a great rebound, likely a turn-around by the end of the year (although it's not time to jump back in the stock market yet)

Yes, we're in a recession now too, but hopefully the Canadians will be in a position to help out the US with our tourist dollars by 2010 -- keep the deals coming. Not sure about the cheerleaders and other teams, though -- 2009 still looks like a rough year for planning big trips. Our baton twirling team has to make a decision on Twirlmania (every Feb.) within the next month, and it's not looking good. Mothers will have to know they're going to have a paycheque to make the commitment.

[tjkraz]

Empirical evidence, much of what has been discussed here, based on what and how Disney has reacted to challenges lead me to strongly disagree with you on this matter.

Iger is purely a bottom line kind of slug. He. like Eisner before him, are more concerned with QUARTERLY numbers than anything else.
pirate:

If that were true we would have seen much deeper cuts already. The $100 mill decline in profitability didn't catch anyone at Dis by surprise. They could have easily taken more drastic action to combat the loss...things like eliminating daily parades, eliminating nightly fireworks shows, reducing park hours further, canceling EMH, cutting staff across the board (housekeeping, ticket takers, front desk, bus drivers, attraction operators, maintenance, etc.), reducing meal portions, and so on.

Feel free to question decisions Dis management has made but (IMO) they simply had to find a way to adjust to a declining economy.

Management may be slaves to Wall Street but that's the sad reality of the system we live in. Investor expectations are much different today than they were 40+ years ago during Walt's lifetime. Our economy--and our 401Ks--aren't going to get any better until corporations start performing better.

[Peter Pirate 2]

If that were true we would have seen much deeper cuts already. The $100 mill decline in profitability didn't catch anyone at Dis by surprise. They could have easily taken more drastic action to combat the loss...things like eliminating daily parades, eliminating nightly fireworks shows, reducing park hours further, canceling EMH, cutting staff across the board (housekeeping, ticket takers, front desk, bus drivers, attraction operators, maintenance, etc.), reducing meal portions, and so on.

Feel free to question decisions Dis management has made but (IMO) they simply had to find a way to adjust to a declining economy.

Management may be slaves to Wall Street but that's the sad reality of the system we live in. Investor expectations are much different today than they were 40+ years ago during Walt's lifetime. Our economy--and our 401Ks--aren't going to get any better until corporations start performing better.

But Disney faces the double edged sword here. If they continue to behave like 'just another wall st. company' then they will forfit the goodwill, good name and reputation that their entire company was and still, to a large degree today, is built upon.

If Disney continues to follow the wall st. quarterlies and listens to the whims of wall st. for their strategic policy then in a very short time there will be nothing salvagable in the legacy that was once Disney ... meaning aside from the face of Mickey Mouse Disney will hold nothing more 'magical' in it's hallowed walls than the corporate walls at Universal/NBC, home depot or walmart.

Now it's true that fiduciary responsibility goes with running a public company but who was watching the store when wall st. suddenly decided that annual double digit growth was not only expected but could somehow go on for infinity.:confused3

A part of sound fiduciary responsibility is to ensure that the company is on solid ground going forward and only watching quarterly financials will not ensure that goal for a company like Disney which is based on something more than making money at its very core.
pirate:

[tjkraz]

But Disney faces the double edged sword here. If they continue to behave like 'just another wall st. company' then they will forfit the goodwill, good name and reputation that their entire company was and still, to a large degree today, is built upon.


Thus the give-and-take I alluded to in my post.

If all Disney was worried about was profitability, they would have done all of the things I described. We would have even shorter park hours, fewer nighttime shows and parades, more attractions closed for questionable refurbishments, fewer staff throughout the parks, and so on.

Disney lost over $100k in profits in the first quarter compared to last year and we're nearly through the second quarter which probably isn't much better (if not worse.) Despite that the only job losses we've heard about are the 600 execs offered buyouts (only a portion of which are from Parks & Resorts) and some talk of future restructuring to streamline DL and WDW operations.

Every single day I wake up to find that there is no WalMart or Super Target going up on Buena Vista Drive is a reminder that Disney is still not "just another Wall Street company." If it were, the resorts and theme parks would have been sold off years ago...attractions would be Six Flags quality (see Universal Studios' ugly steel coasters.)

How would Walt have responded? Heck, I don't know. What I DO know is that 2009 is a lot different than the early-60s.

But knowing human nature, I have to say that continuing to pump dollars into the parks under the assumption that "if we build it, they will come" is not going to play out. As much as I'd like to see Fantasmic running 10 times per week instead of 3, I know that the extra revenue generated isn't going to cover the expenses for 7 additional shows.

Does that cost Disney some goodwill? Yeah, among some folks it will. But others are not so critical and still others realize that they, like so many other companies, are just trying to prosper in tough times. The challenge is finding the balance between lost goodwill and temporary service reductions.

Wall St. may be a joke but it's the only game in town. One of Disney's challenges is to restore investor confidence in the company and begin the recovery process.

[redrosesix]

Thus the give-and-take I alluded to in my post.

If all Disney was worried about was profitability, they would have done all of the things I described. We would have even shorter park hours, fewer nighttime shows and parades, more attractions closed for questionable refurbishments, fewer staff throughout the parks, and so on.

Disney lost over $100k in profits in the first quarter compared to last year and we're nearly through the second quarter which probably isn't much better (if not worse.) Despite that the only job losses we've heard about are the 600 execs offered buyouts (only a portion of which are from Parks & Resorts) and some talk of future restructuring to streamline DL and WDW operations.

Every single day I wake up to find that there is no WalMart or Super Target going up on Buena Vista Drive is a reminder that Disney is still not "just another Wall Street company." If it were, the resorts and theme parks would have been sold off years ago...attractions would be Six Flags quality (see Universal Studios' ugly steel coasters.)

How would Walt have responded? Heck, I don't know. What I DO know is that 2009 is a lot different than the early-60s.

But knowing human nature, I have to say that continuing to pump dollars into the parks under the assumption that "if we build it, they will come" is not going to play out. As much as I'd like to see Fantasmic running 10 times per week instead of 3, I know that the extra revenue generated isn't going to cover the expenses for 7 additional shows.

Does that cost Disney some goodwill? Yeah, among some folks it will. But others are not so critical and still others realize that they, like so many other companies, are just trying to prosper in tough times. The challenge is finding the balance between lost goodwill and temporary service reductions.

Wall St. may be a joke but it's the only game in town. One of Disney's challenges is to restore investor confidence in the company and begin the recovery process.

As a potential investor, I'm not seeing anything other than reactionary thinking at WDC -- as far as I'm concerned, they are providing opportunities for day trading, not a long term hold. They would really have to show that they will be more profitable long term -- I can't be concerned with how they increase quarterly profits if they're not reinvesting them properly. So goodwill, CapX, etc. are much more important to me than how they cut costs through cut-backs. A financially responsible co. should find cheaper ways to do the same or more, not just save money by doing less eg. cut production costs, reduce duplication of resources.

Not much confidence coming from this investor. I'll put my money elsewhere.

[DisFlan]

Here's an Iger blurb from the 3/3 Orlando Sentinel. Bookings are slowing. His follow up is "but we're opening American Idol". (Which gets a big yawn from me - but tastes vary.)


Walt Disney Co. CEO Bob Iger said this evening that theme-park bookings have slowed, despite the company's heavy discounting efforts.

"We're on par with where we were a year ago. But we're discounting in the marketplace," Iger told analysts at the Deutsche Bank Securities media and telecom conference. "So the bottom line will be affected somewhat by that."

Disney had said in early February that bookings between January and June were running slightly ahead of last year's pace, thanks largely to its seven nights for the price of four hotel-and-ticket promotion.

Still, the Disney chief pointed to the recent opening of the new American Idol Experience at Disney's Hollywood Studios as evidence that the company will keep making long-term investments in its parks despite the deep recession.

"We'll continue to look at opportunities like that," Iger said. "We'll continue to invest carefully and selectively and strategically."



DisFlan

[Peter Pirate 2]

Here's an Iger blurb from the 3/3 Orlando Sentinel. Bookings are slowing. His follow up is "but we're opening American Idol". (Which gets a big yawn from me - but tastes vary.)


Walt Disney Co. CEO Bob Iger said this evening that theme-park bookings have slowed, despite the company's heavy discounting efforts.

"We're on par with where we were a year ago. But we're discounting in the marketplace," Iger told analysts at the Deutsche Bank Securities media and telecom conference. "So the bottom line will be affected somewhat by that."

Disney had said in early February that bookings between January and June were running slightly ahead of last year's pace, thanks largely to its seven nights for the price of four hotel-and-ticket promotion.

Still, the Disney chief pointed to the recent opening of the new American Idol Experience at Disney's Hollywood Studios as evidence that the company will keep making long-term investments in its parks despite the deep recession.

"We'll continue to look at opportunities like that," Iger said. "We'll continue to invest carefully and selectively and strategically."



DisFlan

For those of you who think Disney is on the right track or that Iger "get's it" even a little bit, this blub should be very telling for you.

Universal is putting in a big new coaster AND Harry Potter with more rumors still outstanding and Iger thinks American Idol is a "long term investment"???
pirate:

[DisFlan]

For those of you who think Disney is on the right track or that Iger "get's it" even a little bit, this blub should be very telling for you.

Universal is putting in a big new coaster AND Harry Potter with more rumors still outstanding and Iger thinks American Idol is a "long term investment"???
pirate:

It probably sounded pretty lame to the Deutsche Bank audience, too. Not exactly the crowd you'd want to un-impress. And I'd have to guess that his admission about bookings "slowing" means that they're probably down more than just a little.


DisFlan

[redrosesix]

Here's an Iger blurb from the 3/3 Orlando Sentinel. Bookings are slowing. His follow up is "but we're opening American Idol". (Which gets a big yawn from me - but tastes vary.)


Walt Disney Co. CEO Bob Iger said this evening that theme-park bookings have slowed, despite the company's heavy discounting efforts.

"We're on par with where we were a year ago. But we're discounting in the marketplace," Iger told analysts at the Deutsche Bank Securities media and telecom conference. "So the bottom line will be affected somewhat by that."

Disney had said in early February that bookings between January and June were running slightly ahead of last year's pace, thanks largely to its seven nights for the price of four hotel-and-ticket promotion.

Still, the Disney chief pointed to the recent opening of the new American Idol Experience at Disney's Hollywood Studios as evidence that the company will keep making long-term investments in its parks despite the deep recession.

"We'll continue to look at opportunities like that," Iger said. "We'll continue to invest carefully and selectively and strategically."



DisFlan

Good evidence that the person at the helm determines the direction of the company. So we can pretty much feel guilt-free for laying the blame at his feet.

[tjkraz]

For those of you who think Disney is on the right track or that Iger "get's it" even a little bit, this blub should be very telling for you.

Universal is putting in a big new coaster AND Harry Potter with more rumors still outstanding and Iger thinks American Idol is a "long term investment"???
pirate:

I agree with you to a point. It's disappointing that Disney doesn't have any new attractions under construction. But I do believe they will make announcements before the economy shows any major improvement. It's mostly a question of timing right now.

Disney is making multi-million dollar investments in Space Mountain and Hall of Presidents this year. When was the last time Universal spent any money on their tired old attractions like ET, Terminator or Twister? To repeat guests, keeping the old favorites fresh is just as important as introducing a latest-and-greatest every couple of years.

Harry Potter was announced nearly 2 years ago so its far too late for the economy to have any impact on that.

Rock It will be a nice addition to USF but let's be honest about that one--if Disney had announced the same concept for DHS we'd be having a different conversation about how Disney standards had fallen. US has some nice recent attractions in The Simpsons and Mummy, but RockIt is a cheapo, Six Flags quality attraction that has no place in a Disney park.

[DisFlan]

I didn't post Iger's statements so much in light of Universal as that he may need a speech writer. We don't know everything he said, but the take away quote could have been a lot better than "bookings are slowing, but we're opening a 2nd-tier attraction based on an over-the-hill TV show".

Every person in that conference audience was more than likely already aware that times are tough in the hotel and theme park industry. Iger could have stressed something like "we're using this difficult economic period as an opportunity to reinvest in and enhance our guest experience for the future". And maybe have mentioned inventive ideas or attractions that are on the table - these would have certainly been noted.

I don't know if Iger "gets it" or not, but what he ended up with here pretty much leaves the impression that Disney is behind the curve on innovation and ideas. Oh...and that ressies are dropping off. (DIS stock dropped, again, that day.)

DisFlan

[mitros]

Well, we made 9 more day trips since my last post, and the parks are STILL crowded, the restaurants are STILL busy....in other words, business as usual at WDW, just as I have been saying all along. And with the flower and garden show coming up, the crowds WILL be through the roof.

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Well, we made 9 more day trips since my last post, and the parks are STILL crowded, the restaurants are STILL busy....in other words, business as usual at WDW, just as I have been saying all along. And with the flower and garden show coming up, the crowds WILL be through the roof.


That's GREAT news for Disney! I'm happy they are busy. Disney is spending a TON of advertising $$$ to beg people to come down.

Now we just have to get the guests to spend $$$ while they are there like the did in 2007 and early 2008.

I believe the second quarter will end this month. Let's hope it's better news than the last quarter. Maybe they will then be able to toss some $$$ back into the maintenance departments!

[mitros]

That's GREAT news for Disney! I'm happy they are busy. Disney is spending a TON of advertising $$$ to beg people to come down.

Now we just have to get the guests to spend $$$ while they are there like the did in 2007 and early 2008.

I believe the second quarter will end this month. Let's hope it's better news than the last quarter. Maybe they will then be able to toss some $$$ back into the maintenance departments!

Living close by, we have, as always, made many trips to WDW. We have NOT seen any sort of "down time" at WDW this quarter, nor last, or the one before that. There were a lot of statements made by folks that things were "down" at Disney. From personal experience, that has not happened. Whether they are spending money on toys, clothing and trinkets, or not, they are still going on the rides {long lines}and filling the restaurants {cannot get reservations}
So, once again, my point is simply, Disney has not suffered any downturn in the amount of guests on property. If they are not making money is not what I have been talking about. lo these many months.

[Peter Pirate 2]

Living close by, we have, as always, made many trips to WDW. We have NOT seen any sort of "down time" at WDW this quarter, nor last, or the one before that. There were a lot of statements made by folks that things were "down" at Disney. From personal experience, that has not happened. Whether they are spending money on toys, clothing and trinkets, or not, they are still going on the rides {long lines}and filling the restaurants {cannot get reservations}
So, once again, my point is simply, Disney has not suffered any downturn in the amount of guests on property. If they are not making money is not what I have been talking about. lo these many months.

Your perspective notwithstanding, this is not all exactly true to my experience. Also being relatively local I have lots of anecdotal evidence too.

We have called and received reservations at 'Ohana with LESS than a weeks notice TWICE in the past 2 months (one Fri, one Sun). When at MGM the lines for ToT were walk on one recent visit and 10 minutes the other (RnR was 10 & 20 minutes the same days).

We experienced a mere 20 minute wait for Soarin' one Saturday in 2009.

My daughters rode Space Mountain 4 times in a row (walk on) on another Friday night this year.

Is my experience definitive? Absolutely not but it shows that on a given day anyone can experience different things.
pirate:

[Mouseaholic!!!]

Living close by, we have, as always, made many trips to WDW. We have NOT seen any sort of "down time" at WDW this quarter, nor last, or the one before that. There were a lot of statements made by folks that things were "down" at Disney. From personal experience, that has not happened. Whether they are spending money on toys, clothing and trinkets, or not, they are still going on the rides {long lines}and filling the restaurants {cannot get reservations}
So, once again, my point is simply, Disney has not suffered any downturn in the amount of guests on property. If they are not making money is not what I have been talking about. lo these many months.



Downturn of guests, obviously in your personal observations....no downturn.

Downturn of income, no question after the last quarter company statements - Disney is not colledting nearly as much $$$ p/guest as in the past.

Yea, the parks are busy and people are enjoying themselves....but Disney still has to make more $$$ p/guest than they are now.

Feeling the $$$ pinch of the economy (and Disney is now a bottom-line kind of company)- no question. Read Bob Igers words.

[MemoToMe]

I had an interesting observation the other day. I went to Downtown Disney the other day (I wanted to find a CD at Virgin Megastore before it closed). I walked from Westside through PI and into Marketplace. Of the hundreds of people I saw, I could barely count on two hands the amount of people with shopping bags in their hands. Also, T-Rex, the new restaurant, had no line to get in. I'd say right now that if things are on track for attendance, then spending (the "per caps" in theme park speak) must be way down.

And, of course, we all know that "what people want is more shopping and dining options".:rolleyes1

[Jynohn]

I just got back from Disney yesterday. The parks were the most crowded we've ever seen (60+ minute waits for most rides and extremely congested walkways). Yet we were able to get reservations less than 30 days out at Le Cellier, Teppan Edo, 'Ohana, and Whispering Canyon for the exact times that we wanted. In fact, both 'Ohana and Whispering Canyon were over half empty when we were there.

We also noticed little to no lines to buy merchandise, or at the bakery and ice cream shop on Main Street which are usually mobbed at the end of the night. So to us, it looked like all the promotions were working to get bodies in the parks, but people definitely don't seem to be spending money like they used to...

[mitros]

:confused3 I just got back from Disney yesterday. The parks were the most crowded we've ever seen (60+ minute waits for most rides and extremely congested walkways). Yet we were able to get reservations less than 30 days out at Le Cellier, Teppan Edo, 'Ohana, and Whispering Canyon for the exact times that we wanted. In fact, both 'Ohana and Whispering Canyon were over half empty when we were there.

We also noticed little to no lines to buy merchandise, or at the bakery and ice cream shop on Main Street which are usually mobbed at the end of the night. So to us, it looked like all the promotions were working to get bodies in the parks, but people definitely don't seem to be spending money like they used to...

I think Disneys giving away these 3 days with purchase of 4 is going to come back and bite them on the back side if no one is spending any money. Oh well, sucks to be them.........Disney, that is.