Disney's Animation Inn and Suites

[rodkenrich]

Now that the economy is in downward spiral, it looks as though we will never get to see Disney complete the second half of the Pop Century resort. Fortunately, there is some talk of rebranding and reconfiguring the rooms into suites. Apparently, Disney has filed for a permit (http://or.occompt.com/recorder/eagleweb/viewDoc.jsp?node=DOC338S11051) for testing of a model room. Does any one know more?

[Kristineamb]

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2006779

[CanadianGuy]

Construction work is much cheaper to get done during a recession .. when nobody else wants to do it.. than after when the economy strikes up again.

I just bet that Disney will be watching to get the timing just about right.

Knox

[rodkenrich]

Construction work is much cheaper to get done during a recession .. when nobody else wants to do it.. than after when the economy strikes up again.

I just bet that Disney will be watching to get the timing just about right.

Knox I agree. I just hope the instability of the economy doesn't interfere with the Flamingo Crossings project.

[KYMickey]

I agree. I just hope the instability of the economy doesn't interfere with the Flamingo Crossings project.

What's the big deal? Flamingo Crossings is nothing special and will just create more traffic problems on that side of Disney. This certainly hasn't been anything announced to be built there that's new or different. The only possible exception would be if a new PI was going to be there but I don't believe that rumor has much validity!

[deej696]

Yea I wouldn't be heartbroke if they spared us the Holiday inn expresses of the world for a while. Although I won't stay there, I would like to see them finish pop if for no other reason than to please everyone here on the boards that want it so bad.

[FireDancer]

I would love to see the other half of POP finished in some guise. I don’t want them to totally abandon the decade by decade theme but could see them altering the themeing to add animation. The other half of POP could be updated so that the decade building show less about the POP culture and more about what the animation trends were during those decades. Just like the Lady and the Tramp buildings do now the other buildings could lose their Rubik’s cubes and 8-tracks and be changed to animated features or technology of the day.

[crazy4wdw]

I read a rumor on another Disney fan site that said that Disney has told employees at Pop Century that they plan to close down the entire resort in the very near future. Whether this has anything to do with the conversion to Animation Inn or is a reuslt of the slowling ecomony, I have no idea. Supposedly the story aired on one of the local Orlando TV stations a few days ago but I have not been able to locate it on the different websites.

[doconeill]

I read a rumor on another Disney fan site that said that Disney has told employees at Pop Century that they plan to close down the entire resort in the very near future. Whether this has anything to do with the conversion to Animation Inn or is a reuslt of the slowling ecomony, I have no idea. Supposedly the story aired on one of the local Orlando TV stations a few days ago but I have not been able to locate it on the different websites.

Mayyyyyyybe...if "very near future" is sometime after June or whenever the 4/3 offer expires. I would expect that POP is pretty well booked at this point.

[jfinke]

Why would they close Pop vs. the Allstars?

[Condorman]

Disney is not closing down Pop Century. Don't believe any of the rumors. Nor would Disney tell its everyday CMs this, as if in a memo posted in the employee cafeteria. Pop is booked well into next year and has far too many rooms to simply be "relocated" to another value or moderate resort. Any interest Disney has in the Animation Inn & Suites is strictly in completing the Legendary Years on the other side of Houseglass Lake, and even that would not happen for a long time. They are merely in the testing phase.

In this economy, and the recession that will last well into the middle of 2010, the upkeep costs of Pop and the All Stars is much less than what it takes to manage the Deluxe resorts -- never-mind the size. You can be sure visitors are more likely to scratch their stays at GF and BWI and do POR instead. Disney is preparing for that, which is why it's considering a new Value resort.

If you still don't believe me, answer this: Why would Disney shut down Pop, lose that much revenue on a quantity of rooms they couldn't possibly hope to relocate, and in the meantime spend 75-150 million+ on revamping the whole resort? The answer is they wouldn't. But they would take advantage of a weak economy to get new construction going on the Legendary Years.

[deej696]

You can be sure visitors are more likely to scratch their stays at GF and BWI and do POR instead. Disney is preparing for that, which is why it's considering a new Value resort.

.

While I agree many people will downgrade their resort in order to make the trip more affordable in this economy, Disney building another value is not a response to make room for these people. It will take quite a while to build another value, and by the time it is completed the economy will be back on track, and those guests who may have skipped GF in 2009 will be back there in 2010. The reason Disney is perhaps considering this is not to make room for people who downgrade, its to take advantage of cheaper construction costs during a weak economy as Knox stated above...

[WDWFan4Life]

I haven't read all the posts, but whether they are changing the theme of POP or creating a new value resort I think the name Disney's Animation Inn and Suites is horrible. It sounds so cheap and unimaginative and they really need to stop putting "Disney's" in front of anything. We are already in WDW do we need to be reminded whose park or hotel it is.

[jeanylaser]

me too! I don't like the name of this hotel!

[DC7800]

While I agree many people will downgrade their resort in order to make the trip more affordable in this economy, Disney building another value is not a response to make room for these people.

The problem is that people have long been downgrading their resort choices even in a prosperous economy. We've at least mentioned here before how current All-Star/Pop guests used to stay at a moderate or deluxe before a cheaper (Disney) option came along. Much better to have you in a $200 room than the $99 property, which is not considered profitable enough (to Disney's perspective) anyway. The thing I have never been able to understand is why Disney would have trouble filling value-resort rooms at all, particularly at discounted prices which are about the same - and occasionally even lower - than competing off-site properties (excluding resorts such as Grand Cypress and other 'deluxe' properties, of course) like Hampton or Fairfield Inn.

But Disney is continuing to have (apparently worsening) trouble filling its resorts, and they have closed entire resorts in the past when bookings were soft. Depending on how long and how deep they expect the current economic trends to continue, I would not be at all surprised to find a plan exists to shutter Pop Century should circumstances ever warrant. Plenty of capacity to relocate guests if reservations at the All-Stars and moderates ever get soft enough to justify a closure. No, they wouldn't just announce it to cast members unless closure was imminent, but it's not impossible either. Back in late 2001 and 2002, I remember arguing that Disney greatly overreacted in making draconian cutbacks to cut costs, so I can easily see them doing so again.

What I have trouble believing is that Disney - especially Disney of all companies - would possibly spend money now, at a time when they are trying to contain costs even at the expense of quality and the guest experience, on a project which won't produce returns for some time. I'll agree such a strategy makes perfect sense; I just have trouble believing that Disney senior management is capable anymore of such a strategy. Indeed, if you really wanted to boost attendance at Walt Disney World during slow periods - specifically next spring and summer - opening multiple and/or major new attractions might well accomplish that (and literally produce returns for decades). Disney, however, has essentially nothing planned for 2009 except, perhaps, more and deeper discounts which cut into the bottom line, and of course further cost-cutting which cheapens the experience for which guests were once willing to pay big bucks.

[mitros]

What's the big deal? Flamingo Crossings is nothing special and will just create more traffic problems on that side of Disney. This certainly hasn't been anything announced to be built there that's new or different. The only possible exception would be if a new PI was going to be there but I don't believe that rumor has much validity!

EXACTLY!

[Michael623]

I love the term re-theming? What is the theme now, Michael623 in giant cell phone land?

[Tink rules]

After 9/11 Disney closed down POFQ and used that time to do the refurb to the resort...

&&&&& they just lost $92 Million when Lehman Bros. went under...

They'll weather the storm... they learned after 9/11 that the Disney brand alone won't bring people in if times are tough.

[goalie5hole]

Disney is not closing down Pop Century. Don't believe any of the rumors. Nor would Disney tell its everyday CMs this, as if in a memo posted in the employee cafeteria. Pop is booked well into next year and has far too many rooms to simply be "relocated" to another value or moderate resort. Any interest Disney has in the Animation Inn & Suites is strictly in completing the Legendary Years on the other side of Houseglass Lake, and even that would not happen for a long time. They are merely in the testing phase.

In this economy, and the recession that will last well into the middle of 2010, the upkeep costs of Pop and the All Stars is much less than what it takes to manage the Deluxe resorts -- never-mind the size. You can be sure visitors are more likely to scratch their stays at GF and BWI and do POR instead. Disney is preparing for that, which is why it's considering a new Value resort.

If you still don't believe me, answer this: Why would Disney shut down Pop, lose that much revenue on a quantity of rooms they couldn't possibly hope to relocate, and in the meantime spend 75-150 million+ on revamping the whole resort? The answer is they wouldn't. But they would take advantage of a weak economy to get new construction going on the Legendary Years.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Disney close down French Quarter or Riverside recently. I can't remember if it was after 9/11 or if it was for refurb. Sorry-didn't see last post.

[crazy4wdw]

Somebody correct if I'm wrong but didn't Disney close down French Quarter or Riverside recently. I can't remember if it was after 9/11 or if it was for refurb. Sorry-skipped over last post.

Yes, Disney did close down POFQ after 9/11. People who had ressies at POFQ during its closure received great deals on upgrades to other resorts. Disney did use the time that POFQ was closed to refurbish the rooms. Pop Century was scheduled to open in November 2001 but its opening was delayed until 2003 (I think!).

[Tink rules]

My brother got an upgrade to AKL... It was his honeymoon... he asked me why I couldn't get him upgraded to the GF (I was doing his travel plans for him...) and I told him that if he got upgraded to the GF WE were going on his honeymoon with him!!!

[crazy4wdw]

Jim Hill is reporting (some folks don't put much faith in his facts) that Disney has recently signed contracts to start the conversion of the unfinished builidngs at Pop Century into family suites. Link: http://jimhillmedia.com/blogs/jim_hill/archive/2009/01/13/are-disney-world-s-recession-worries-starting-to-recede.aspx

[Condorman]

"And as the economy gets stronger & stronger, more & more blocks of rooms at Disney's Pop Century will be transformed into family suites. Until this entire WDW hotel can then be rebranded as Disney's Animation Inn and Suites."

"And how exactly did Disney Parks & Resorts execs determine that it would now be okay to go forward with the Legendary Years project? By mid-2010 (i.e. when the first of these family suites buildings will actually be ready for Guests to occupy)"

I'm quoting this from the article. I don't doubt something is in the works, but the contradictory nature of JHM's story doesn't jive with the ambitious expections of Disney. So are they finishing The Legendary Years into the AI&S, or are they rebranding "the entire WDW hotel" -- even he can make up his mind. If this is the goal of Disney, they would have to complete TLY first and shut down TCY for at least 18 months to rebrand those. They could also do it on a rotating basis, but other than taking advantage of the economy and getting cheap labor to finish the project, they will be losing money on bookings once the economy turns around. In addition, JHM claims that Disney expects TLY to be ready for occupancy by mid-2010. I don't think so. I saw their condition last month -- that's a two-year project, easy. Nothing less.

[mitros]

"And as the economy gets stronger & stronger, more & more blocks of rooms at Disney's Pop Century will be transformed into family suites. Until this entire WDW hotel can then be rebranded as Disney's Animation Inn and Suites."

"And how exactly did Disney Parks & Resorts execs determine that it would now be okay to go forward with the Legendary Years project? By mid-2010 (i.e. when the first of these family suites buildings will actually be ready for Guests to occupy)"

I'm quoting this from the article. I don't doubt something is in the works, but the contradictory nature of JHM's story doesn't jive with the ambitious expections of Disney. So are they finishing The Legendary Years into the AI&S, or are they rebranding "the entire WDW hotel" -- even he can make up his mind. If this is the goal of Disney, they would have to complete TLY first and shut down TCY for at least 18 months to rebrand those. They could also do it on a rotating basis, but other than taking advantage of the economy and getting cheap labor to finish the project, they will be losing money on bookings once the economy turns around. In addition, JHM claims that Disney expects TLY to be ready for occupancy by mid-2010. I don't think so. I saw their condition last month -- that's a two-year project, easy. Nothing less.

Yea, way to go Disney, add more and more rooms, more and more DVC resorts, but don't bother expanding the parks, even though there are a quadrillion more bodies on property. I wanna scream...............:scared:

[CanadianGuy]

"And as the economy gets stronger & stronger, more & more blocks of rooms at Disney's Pop Century will be transformed into family suites. Until this entire WDW hotel can then be rebranded as Disney's Animation Inn and Suites."

"And how exactly did Disney Parks & Resorts execs determine that it would now be okay to go forward with the Legendary Years project? By mid-2010 (i.e. when the first of these family suites buildings will actually be ready for Guests to occupy)"

I'm quoting this from the article. I don't doubt something is in the works, but the contradictory nature of JHM's story doesn't jive with the ambitious expections of Disney. So are they finishing The Legendary Years into the AI&S, or are they rebranding "the entire WDW hotel" -- even he can make up his mind. If this is the goal of Disney, they would have to complete TLY first and shut down TCY for at least 18 months to rebrand those. They could also do it on a rotating basis, but other than taking advantage of the economy and getting cheap labor to finish the project, they will be losing money on bookings once the economy turns around. In addition, JHM claims that Disney expects TLY to be ready for occupancy by mid-2010. I don't think so. I saw their condition last month -- that's a two-year project, easy. Nothing less.

Several friends in the construction industry say that with the right construction team and ample bodies, the first of these buildings could easily be ready by mid-2010 .. *IF* work starts promptly before spring of 2009. Now they did caution that if either of the existing pads of three wings had to be torn down for structural concerns OR if the Legendary Hall had to be torn down for structural reasons - that would delay the whole thing six months to a year.

In their estimation from reviewing the pictures I had posted on the Resorts Board over the last two years, they believed the concrete structures would be just fine despite some exposure to the elements. The biggest concerns they noted were around 'mold' in some areas that might not be 'sandblastable'... or might not be reachable. They couldn't say for sure without actually examining each building up close and personal.

On a side note, a recent (about 10 days ago) visitor to Pop PM'd me to indicate there were approximately 10 semi trucks & trailers on the Legendary Years side of the property. I inititally wrote that off as "mattress replacement" on the Classic Years side, but I might have got that wrong.. ?

Now there are *some* problems with Jim's story. For starts, Disney was busy from Jan 1 to 6 with Christmas 'spillover' and from the 7th to the 12th or so with Marathon guests. The real test is coming up in the next month or so..

Regardless, Jim's story does jive with at least three different sources that I had... who indicated the same basic thing. Work on the other side of the lake would begin in early 2009 and be 'opening' complete by mid 2010 with the rest of the buildings opening in staggered fashion thru the end of that year.

Once the bulk of the heavy-construction is done, the landscaping and pools are complete and the external walls and facades are complete, the remainder of the interior work can be done on each successive building without bother to the guests in completed, adjacent buildings.

Yea, way to go Disney, add more and more rooms, more and more DVC resorts, but don't bother expanding the parks, even though there are a quadrillion more bodies on property. I wanna scream....

And I do not see this work evolving into a DVC resort of any stripe - rumors on this and other boards aside. Ultimately, whether you agree with it or not, these are planned rooms that were to have originally been built almost 8 years ago now.

Add to that, both DHS and Animal Kingdom are still underperforming their long-term goals. Yes, I agree both of those parks still need some work. Apparently the rumor boards say that *something* is coming for AK and we've already see several large additions to DHS this year. I believe you will see at least one more major announcement for DHS this year (2009).

And are you cursing as loudly, the massive number of off-site developers continuing to build resorts and vacation villas that will also feed Disney parks? ;)

Knox

[RustManFan]

I think Disney could pick up reservations for parties of 5 or more by completing the suites. There are very limited places onsite for such families or groups now. 5 can stay at POR but that is about it unless you are talking about a DVC suite or multiple rooms. (some suites at All Stars, I know too)

Get the rest of the resort finished and then those of us that have less than 5 people in our group can get back our rooms at POR Alligator Bayou!

[Condorman]

Two points:

1.) It still doesn't clear up whether they have nixed the idea of The Legendary Years and instead will make this into the Animation Inn & Suites, or, once they are done, will The Classic Years also be turned into the AI&S? I have no issue with them completing TLY and changing the original theme into this new venture. Fine, whatever. But I don't see the financial gain in shutting down the existing Pop for 8-18 months to refurb it with a new theme.
Why not have both? Maybe they will and it's too soon to know.

2.) Just because WDW has been packed for the past two weeks, and even if it remains packed for the next two months, does not mean Disney is turning a profit. They have cut way too many deals, i.e. 4+3, free dining and the gift card nonsense in so that anyone visiting WDW is actually getting the better end of the deal. I test-booked a vacation for the end of January and it came to half the price as the exact same vacation booked for the beginning of December, 2008. Oh, there may be 2-3x the number of guests at WDW but I think it's just enough to keep the regular operating hours and CMs on the payroll. Nothing more. Disney is coasting, nor soarin'.

[mitros]

Two points:

1.) It still doesn't clear up whether they have nixed the idea of The Legendary Years and instead will make this into the Animation Inn & Suites, or, once they are done, will The Classic Years also be turned into the AI&S? I have no issue with them completing TLY and changing the original theme into this new venture. Fine, whatever. But I don't see the financial gain in shutting down the existing Pop for 8-18 months to refurb it with a new theme.
Why not have both? Maybe they will and it's too soon to know.

2.) Just because WDW has been packed for the past two weeks, and even if it remains packed for the next two months, does not mean Disney is turning a profit. They have cut way too many deals, i.e. 4+3, free dining and the gift card nonsense in so that anyone visiting WDW is actually getting the better end of the deal. I test-booked a vacation for the end of January and it came to half the price as the exact same vacation booked for the beginning of December, 2008. Oh, there may be 2-3x the number of guests at WDW but I think it's just enough to keep the regular operating hours and CMs on the payroll. Nothing more. Disney is coasting, nor soarin'.

Whether they sre making enough money or not, they are craming too many people into to small a space. It reminds me of an old Honeymooners episode. Where Alice tells Ralph that he was doing an impression of putting 5 pounds of baloney into a 2 pound bag. {something about him trying to get into clothing that no longer fits.}
Same thing at WDW. Too many people on sight, not enough stuff in the parks, not enough restaurants to feed the masses.:sad2:

[Jason71]

But I don't see the financial gain in shutting down the existing Pop for 8-18 months to refurb it with a new theme.
Why not have both? Maybe they will and it's too soon to know.


I thought the gist of the original Jim Hill story (and going just on memory here) was that "The Disney Animation Inn" would be a "moderate" resort, perhaps a nicer moderate at that. So the financial gain would be higher room rates, at least when the economy picks back up.

Also, didn't Hill say some of the existing rooms would be refurbed into suites? I guess the assumption being that even converting all of the LY will not create enough. The All-Stars did a number on the cheap hotels on 192, maybe WDW has decided to take a bite out of the "vacation home/condo" market around Kissimmee next.

[Condorman]

Whether they sre making enough money or not, they are craming too many people into to small a space. It reminds me of an old Honeymooners episode. Where Alice tells Ralph that he was doing an impression of putting 5 pounds of baloney into a 2 pound bag. {something about him trying to get into clothing that no longer fits.}
Same thing at WDW. Too many people on sight, not enough stuff in the parks, not enough restaurants to feed the masses.:sad2:

No argument here. What does Disney care if we're shoulder-to-shoulder? The problem they fail to recognize is just because they let 67,000 into the MK, doesn't mean those people are all buying souvenirs, eating or spending. If they lowered capacity at MK and forced their "captive" (i.e. people who use Magical Express, don't rent cars, don't leave WDW property) into DHS and AK, then everyone would have a better experience and likely spend more. But Disney doesn't think that way. They believe 60k @ MK is good business. Well, if I didn't buy a plush animal the sixth time I saw it, why would I buy it the 22nd time I saw it? Build more restaurants, and provide new shops with new merchandise, geniuses.

I don't see them building a 5th gate anytime soon, so let's hope the rumored expansions of AK and Fantasyland come about sooner rather than later.