How would you improve the DDP?

[lazydoxy66]

Let's bat around some ideas on how to make the DDP better and easier to use.

I have never used the DDP. I will be using it this fall. All the information I have is from all you intelligent veterans. Based on what I've read, I think it would be worth designing a system that is based on points rather than meals.

For example; $0-$2.99 = 1 pt., $3.00-$5.99 = 2 pts, etc.
Points, in my mind, would cost you $2.50 to purchase ahead of time. You could spend them the way you want. It wouldn't matter if they were used for CS, TS or snacks. All menus would have the point values of the item listed next to the actual price.
You would still have to do some figuring for your unique situation. You'd still want to buy pricier items to stay ahead of the money game. However, versatility and value seem to be common interest points on this theme. That's what you'd get here.

[Tricia1972]

I think that you'd lose some of the convenience of the DDP on a point system. I like the idea, but some would hate to figure out how many points they would need before going on vacation. It's a big enough headache to look at menus, figure out what you think you might eat and compare the prices of those items compared to the DDP cost for the day.

I think that the majority of the DDP users prefer it for it's convenience as much as the cost savings. You pay $XX.XX and order whatever you want. With points you'd buy the points and buy what you planned on eating 6+ months ago (when you made your ADR's)

Now I'd kind of like it because it'd fit better with my personal plans. I know that I'm going to spend at least $800 in March. I could buy $800 worth of points and pay OOP for the rest.

(Actually for me the points would have to cost less than $2.39 - which is 20% less than $2.99 and what I get off for the DDE already)

[bicker]

Well, the DDE is a discount program so it makes sense that you'd pay more if you went with a points-based Dining Plan instead of using your DDE discount.

Indeed, I'm not even sure that a $3 "point" would only cost $2.50... that is still, ostensibly, a 20% discount, and the Dining Plan is not a discount program any more. The only way that that pricing would make sense is if Disney could rely on people (1) not expecting "change" and (2) end up losing half a point's value, on average, on each purchase. Unfortunately, I suspect a lot of folks would push the system and find purchases that "maximize the value" for each point, getting as close to a multiple of $3 as possible, and thereby invalidate the pricing model.

It simply isn't workable, not to mention being a loss of convenience as Tricia mentioned.

[DCLLVR]

Choice of either appetizer or dessert.

[teachingmykids]

I would like conversion of TS to CS. We used DDP once, but really didn't need a TS everyday, it's just not our style.
We ate more than we normally would.
Separating dessert would be great ~ we would have liked to eat dessert later or as a snack.

[leahjade]

Include The Tip!!!

[TDC Nala]

Remove the desserts, add an extra snack, and either (a) reduce the price or (b) include the 18% tip for table service.

(For the basic plan only. For the deluxe plan, remove 1 meal credit, don't include a dessert for CS, and make the plan 2 meal credits per night of stay rather than 3. Then include the tip.)

[bicker]

Oh, is this one of those, "If I was God..." threads? Sorry, I didn't realize.

:rotfl:

[Blisskitty]

I think adding a third option, not just the basic or the deluxe. Maybe a Basic Plus plan that you get the option of choosing an appetizer or a dessert, an extra snack credit, and maybe an extra TS or two for your stay so you can go to a Signature Dining without sacrificing a day of Top Service. Or an adult plan that you have the option of using your drink credit for a beer or a glass fo wine for a couple bucks more a day.

[patsal]

I liked the all inclusive nature of it before. So I'd raise the price, eliminate the dessert with CS, add a snack and keep all three courses with the TS.

So, my plan would be like $45-50 per person per day, have 1 TS that has appy, entree, dessert and beverage and tip included. 1CS that is combo meal or entree and beverage (no dessert) and 2 snack credits.
I would allow more flexibility with change out as well. It is in WDW's financial best interest to let participants switch a TS for 1 CS and a snack. I would not allow anything else to be switched.

[byoung]

Choice of either appetizer or dessert.

I agree here CHOICE.

[jade1]

Choice of either appetizer or dessert.

Same here. That way we could share an app and a dessert.

[Tricia1972]

Same here. That way we could share an app and a dessert.

This is the reason that I doubt that they'll ever go to choice of the two. Not just because of you, but because I believe that this is what most will do.

Splitting the appetizer and dessert (which is exactly how we order as a family when we pay OOP) means that our table isn't turning over as fast as it could, and Disney isn't making money on us paying for appetizers and desserts for all of us and Disney is turning the table over much slower because we've added an extra course for very little money. More lost revenue for Disney.

[MomNeedsVacay]

Everyone has just about summed it up... Only a couple of things would need to happen to motivate me to get the dining plan. The way it stands now, I will not purchase the dining plan.

[clkelley]

For us it would be bring the tip back. Make it appetizer and entree instead of desert and entree.

Even though they now allow AP holders to book the dining plan with AP discount on the room without purchasing a ticket, I'd still only do the dining plan during free dining IF they offered those changes above.

[cindermomma]

Bring the tip back!!! I liked the all-inclusive feel.

[TDC Nala]

As long as this is just a speculation, it's OK. Realistically you will not see three TS courses plus included tip on the basic plan for that price again. So you'd have to choose. Do you want the appetizer or the tip?

You will also not see a choice of appetizer or dessert. The plans are so popular they now need to turn those tables over for more profit.

If they up the price $20 for three TS courses plus tip, many will be happy. Many will be upset that the basic plan is no longer affordable.

[starbox]

You will also not see a choice of appetizer or dessert. The plans are so popular they now need to turn those tables over for more profit.

I'd remove the dessert from CS (what % of those desserts do you bet end up simply thrown away?)

I also think if you offered a choice between an appetizer, dessert, OR a glass of beer or wine that large enough percentage of folks would opt for the alcohol to make up for the folks that would do appetizer and dessert combo in terms of table turnover. There are so many folks that are not dessert people.

Bring back the tip.

[TDC Nala]

Sorry, on the basic plan you are not going to get the tip AND the appetizer. And the alcohol won't make up for the table turning. The drinks don't cost them all that much, it's the markup that makes money on alcohol.

If Disney did everything we on the board want, they'd now have a Basic Dining Plan, a Deluxe Dining Plan, a One Table Service Only Dining Plan, a Counter Service Only Dining Plan, a Snack Only Plan, an Adult Dining Plan Including Alcohol, a Kids Eating Adult Food Dining Plan, an Adults Who Don't Want to Eat All That Much Dining Plan, a People Who Won't or Can't Eat Dessert Dining Plan, and all of them would include the tip where required. Imagine trying to administer all that.

[Pumbaa_]

Oh, is this one of those, "If I was God..." threads? Sorry, I didn't realize.

:rotfl:

:lmao: it is bicker! Up to each person to think about what would make them happy. May not happen, but what the heck, fun to play

I would love to be able to get the DxDP for 4 days out of a 7 day stay. I would love to just splurge, but I can't do it a whole week.

Who else?

[TDC Nala]

I want Disney to pay for all my food and booze. Heck, I'm there enough.

[aksunshine]

I like the tip, b/c of the ease of not having to carry extra cash or putting my cc on my room.

[MomofCKJ]

I want the tip back and a choice of appy and dessert, much like a lot of other folks. I am using the plan next month and am still going to enjoy it. I love the idea of having most of our food already paid in advance. For me it is a convenience thing more than anything.

Allyson

[bicker]

I want Disney to pay for all my food and booze. Heck, I'm there enough.Now you're talking... I mean if we aren't constrained by reality, why wish for these niggling little nuances like choosing between appetizer or dessert?????? Go for the gold!!!! I'd want the Dining Plan to be like a cruise ship: (1) Included in the price of the hotel room; (2) Includes all meals, as many of each item on the menu as I want; (3) They charge an extra $3.50 that fully covers gratuities for the restaurant servers for all three meals; (4) If I'm still hungry after dinner in the dining room, then I can go up to the buffet for a second dinner!

[Tricia1972]

Now you're talking... I mean if we aren't constrained by reality, why wish for these niggling little nuances like choosing between appetizer or dessert?????? Go for the gold!!!! I'd want the Dining Plan to be like a cruise ship: (1) Included in the price of the hotel room; (2) Includes all meals, as many of each item on the menu as I want; (3) They charge an extra $3.50 that fully covers gratuities for the restaurant servers for all three meals; (4) If I'm still hungry after dinner in the dining room, then I can go up to the buffet for a second dinner!

NOW you're talking Bicker! Why be bothered with reality or reasonableness? If we aren't going to be bothered, then let's go all the way!!

Hey can we add unlimited snacks to your plan? My group would really get into that!

[bicker]

Serenade of the Seas has serve-yourself soft-serve 24/7. Oh by the way, unlimited room service is included as well -- anything you want. All you pay for is beverages.

[TDC Nala]

All this says to me that there's a market for WDW to do a completely all-inclusive package. Which in fact I think they do...but it's priced way out of the range of most. Maybe they ought to be thinking about how to do that on a smaller scale. They were going that way with the DDP until they decided they didn't want to pay the tip anymore. Of course, tips are not included on cruise ships either, you have to pay those separately.

Hey, on the Disney ships I get unlimited Diet Coke, but I have to climb up to Deck 9 to get it. That's how I keep from gaining a lot of weight on the cruises.

[bicker]

All this says to me that there's a market for WDW to do a completely all-inclusive package.How do you figure? A few of us playing "wishful thinking" on a website? :confused3

I think the opposite is true: Even the cruise lines are beginning to decompose the cruise fare, adding additional charges and such: $2 for soda, $30 extra for fine dining, $10 per night for gratuities, etc. Count on seeing more of that going forward, not less.

Which in fact I think they do...but it's priced way out of the range of most. Maybe they ought to be thinking about how to do that on a smaller scale.I'm not sure I follow; a smaller scale would necessarily not be "all"-inclusive. :confused:

They were going that way with the DDP until they decided they didn't want to pay the tip anymore.Which I take as an indication that they've realized that their customers are really focusing on the base price, and want to see a very low number up-front.

[TDC Nala]

Because of all the posts that say "I like the all-inclusiveness."

The problem on the boards seems to be that different folks want different things included.

I bet the cruise ships are going that way because the costs of food and fuel have gone up and they can't afford to be all-inclusive at prices that people will actually pay, so they start "nickel and diming." Maybe WDW is doing the same thing.

[bicker]

Because of all the posts that say "I like the all-inclusiveness."I don't see that many people saying that they want to pay for the all-inclusiveness. Most are just saying that want everything included at the current low price. Only a few people (compared to the total number of WDW guests) are extolling the virtues of the Deluxe Dining Plan.

I bet the cruise ships are going that way because the costs of food and fuel have gone up and they can't afford to be all-inclusive at prices that people will actually pay, so they start "nickel and diming." Maybe WDW is doing the same thing.Abso-friggen-lutely, and the impending recession is going to push things in that direction even faster.

[krissyh]

I loved the plan as it was and would be willing to pay more for the convenience. My problem with the 2008 plan is not the food being taken away, (it was too much food before and I can pack it away) but with the convenience of singing and going being taken away. I know someone will say that means we should pay OOP and charge it to the room but I did like knowing it was all paid for before we even arrived at WDW.

If I cannot have the old plan:
1. Include the tip, it simply makes life easier and on vacation, I want easy.
2A. Give the choice or appetizer or dessert. I agree that Disney probably would not like this because it does slow the turn over of tables.
2B. If I cannot have a choice, make it appetizer rather than dessert.

I have no need for dessert with CS meals. We generally do not eat them because lunch is large enough and frankly, they are not very good. I would rather have a second snack to get something really good in the parks.

[MakiraMarlena]

Desserts are cheaper to produce than appetizers. If Disney needed to cut costs, that's why the appetizer went away instead of dessert.

A second snack might be more likely than the return of the appetizer.

[bicker]

I'm surprised I haven't seen contributions to this thread from that significant contingent who have been upset about the Dining Plan's impact on the restaurants in the first place. I suppose they're no longer reading these kinds of threads, but I suspect that they'd improve the Dining Plan by doing away with it. Disney's got to factor their desires into the mix too.

[caroline1851]

Eliminate dessert with CS
Choice of appetizer or dessert with TS
Add a snack
Include tip

Raising the price a few bucks would make sense because of these changes. Maybe $45/day for adults and $15/day for kids.

[bicker]

Hmmm... That's only a $7 per day increase. That would barely cover adding the tip and adding a snack. I think you're underestimating the cost associated with providing a choice between appetizer and dessert. By the same token, I think you're overestimating how much they'd have to increase the child price...

[Pumbaa_]

bicker, did you forget the game? There is no reality check for what you WANT, lol, this is for fun:thumbsup2

[bicker]

Ah, I keep forgetting...

[stellablue]

I would like conversion of TS to CS. We used DDP once, but really didn't need a TS everyday, it's just not our style.
We ate more than we normally would.



Choice of either appetizer or dessert.

I agree with both of these:thumbsup2

[Pumbaa_]

:rotfl2: bicker

i have to say, we went in January, during a resort sold out weekend and had no trouble walking into Tokyo Dining and getting a table. Had a few more ressies that week including Kona, Boma and Garden Grill.

It was nice going without any ADRs and playing it by ear

[Tricia1972]

i have to say, we went in January, during a resort sold out weekend and had no trouble walking into Tokyo Dining and getting a table. Had a few more ressies that week including Kona, Boma and Garden Grill.

It was nice going without any ADRs and playing it by ear

I have a question, that plays into other threads about the DDP. Were there empty tables at the restaurants you walked into, or were walk ups able to fill up the tables?

[caroline1851]

Hmmm... That's only a $7 per day increase. That would barely cover adding the tip and adding a snack. I think you're underestimating the cost associated with providing a choice between appetizer and dessert. By the same token, I think you're overestimating how much they'd have to increase the child price...

blah blah blah

I'm just having fun with it! This is MY idea of what would be the perfect dining plan for ME. I'm not that concerened with overestimating/underestimating, etc. IT'S JUST FOR FUN!

[caroline1851]

I have a question, that plays into other threads about the DDP. Were there empty tables at the restaurants you walked into, or were walk ups able to fill up the tables?

A family of 4 that i know just came back. They hadn't made any ADR's and were able to get into most of the restaurants they wanted to without a problem. They tended to eat dinner around 4:45-5pm or so-maybe that's why? They weren't able to do any character meals though. (which was fine with them).

[bicker]

blah blah blahYeah, I think what keeps confusing me is the thread title... "improve" -- what we're really doing is replacing the Dining Plan with wishes and dreams. Pumbaa_ pointed that out earlier.

[robsmom]

Sorry, on the basic plan you are not going to get the tip AND the appetizer. And the alcohol won't make up for the table turning. The drinks don't cost them all that much, it's the markup that makes money on alcohol.

If Disney did everything we on the board want, they'd now have a Basic Dining Plan, a Deluxe Dining Plan, a One Table Service Only Dining Plan, a Counter Service Only Dining Plan, a Snack Only Plan, an Adult Dining Plan Including Alcohol, a Kids Eating Adult Food Dining Plan, an Adults Who Don't Want to Eat All That Much Dining Plan, a People Who Won't or Can't Eat Dessert Dining Plan, and all of them would include the tip where required. Imagine trying to administer all that.

I would say that they have had this plan for thiry years. It is called a menu. Want an app, order an app. want dessert get one. Want to only eat CS or only eat TS or have drinks - its ok. I 100% agree with you that they can nto have a separate plan for each scenario!!

[caroline1851]

Yeah, I think what keeps confusing me is the thread title... "improve" -- what we're really doing is replacing the Dining Plan with wishes and dreams. Pumbaa_ pointed that out earlier.

what i stated above WOULD be an improvement in my opinion. That's what it's about....opinions.

[TDC Nala]

I know when I posted I was taking "improvement" literally. Most folks posting here seem to want the tip included. They'd have to give up something already on the plan for that to take place.

Sure, it'd also be an improvement for WDW to offer a dining plan that conforms exactly to what every guest wants in a dining plan. I'd like them to include the booze personally.

I have no idea what Disney was hearing, but on the boards there were a number of complaints about a set tip amount being included - plenty of posters thought they would get or were getting bad service because of that.

[Praying Colonel]

There are many who are dissatisfied with the current version of the DDP and think a return to the old DDP would be an improvement. IMHO that's as valid a position as that of folks who posted in the past that they would improve that version of the DDP by removing the tip.

I'd be willing to pay an increased cost for a return to the pre-08 version of the DDP. Alternatively, I'd like to see a DDP that removed the CS dessert, but included the tip and either the app or dessert, and I'd be willing to pay an increased cost for that, too.

(And yes, I've read the 23 different reasons why that wouldn't work or is a bad idea or whatever. I'm just saying what I'd like to see.)

[bicker]

There are many who are dissatisfied with the current version of the DDP and think a return to the old DDP would be an improvement. IMHO that's as valid a position as that of folks who posted in the past that they would improve that version of the DDP by removing the tip. I'd be willing to pay an increased cost for a return to the pre-08 version of the DDP. Alternatively, I'd like to see a DDP that removed the CS dessert, but included the tip and either the app or dessert, and I'd be willing to pay an increased cost for that, too. (And yes, I've read the 23 different reasons why that wouldn't work or is a bad idea or whatever. I'm just saying what I'd like to see.)Okay, so now we're back to reality? Okay...

Valid? Yes, but incomplete. A return to the 2007 Dining Plan rules would necessarily result in a price increase to about $47 per day. That was the point.

I think it is a disservice to casual readers to post only half of a story, so even though you might realize that that price increase would be associated with the change you'd like to see, it is important to make sure that it gets mentioned in the thread.

what i stated above WOULD be an improvement in my opinion. That's what it's about....opinions.
I agree; it would just cost more. That was my point.

[Praying Colonel]

^Right on cue... :sad2:

[KNovacovschi]

Okay, so now we're back to reality? Okay...

Valid? Yes, but incomplete. A return to the 2007 Dining Plan rules would necessarily result in a price increase to about $47 per day. That was the point.


I wouldn't mind it going up a whole $2 if it means going back to the way it was in '07.

[bicker]

Well, it was $39 in 2007, so the increase would be about $8 per day.

[disney queen]

play nice:tongue:

[KNovacovschi]

Well, it was $39 in 2007, so the increase would be about $8 per day.

I am in Canada and the package I had was $45 a day thats why I said an increase of $2...I just don't like to have to worry about the tip as I am not good at calculating just how much to give...

[bicker]

Interesting. I didn't realize that Canadians were paying so much more for the Dining Plan than we were (though perhaps it wasn't as much the case a few years ago, when the exchange rate was quite different). So essentially, the Dining Plan has never been a discount plan for Canadians. I did not know that.

[KNovacovschi]

It just may have been who we booked the package through...we booked with a company called Nolitours...

[fakereadhed]

After doing the math, I think the current DDP can still be cost effective. What I'd like improved is the convenience- but not sure how that would work. Just saying that it has sucked all of the spontaneity out of a trip for me and I'm not using it on my next trip for that reason. I will have to try really hard to keep my costs the same as DDP(even with more CS), but I think it will be worth it because I won't have to stop what I'm doing to be somewhere for dinner at a certain time. I do think if they goal of the DDP was to get guests used to dining a certain way- it worked! I am now wanting more TS- just don't want to have to pre-plan and make time for it while I'm there.

[lazydoxy66]

If you want to be real, the bottom line is, Disney wants to make a profit, even on the DDP. You are never going to get what you want for free. Lets remember this is not a boardroom. Just a forum for discussion. :hippie:
I love all the ideas and comments, no matter how crazy. There have been some great ones. The only bad idea is the one that never gets expressed.
The biggest improvement, would also be the hardest and most expensive to accomplish - CHOICE. I guess if you want to be in total control of your dining you would have to do OOP. Otherwise, you make the best of what Disney has to offer and try to come out of it on top in the money game.
Thanks to all of you for making this an interesting thread. :thumbsup2

[bicker]

Lets remember this is not a boardroom. Just a forum for discussion. :hippie: Yes, but let's be careful. This is not the Community Board. This is a Trip Planning forum, ostensibly primarily intended to provide members with factual information they can use to better enjoy their visits to the theme parks. That's my real concern, as I mentioned before: Being sure to clarify when we're "just having fun" versus providing information that casual readers can use to help foster their expectations, in this case, with regard to what they might encounter with regard to the Dining Plan when visiting WDW in 2009. :hippie:

[Lewisc]

This is a thread discussing suggested improvements to the DDP. The moderators are free to move it to another forum, if appropriate. It's clear, at least to me, that this thread is a "wish list" and shouldn't be interpreted as changes that are likely.

Posters that are suggesting going back to the 2007 plan are basically asking for a price reduction in the 2009 plan. I don't think that's likely but posters don't have to suggest improvements that are revenue neutral. Suggesting that a product is overpriced and he price should be reduced is an improvement.

I think going back to including the tip would be very popular but is very unlikely. The tip represented an expense that Disney can't control. Disney can control the cost of ingredients by adjusting the menu.

The DDP was originally designed to promote rack rate room reservations. As such Disney may have been willing to take a loss on the DDP. DVC members and AP holders can now buy the plan. Disney continues to offer free dining. My guess is the plan must now stand on it's own. I don't think Disney anticipated the number of guests that would "work" the plan. Kids credits buying adult meals. Snacks serving as meal substitutes. Ordering entree sized appetizers to feed extra guests.

I might prefer a straight discount. Previously it didn't matter if I skipped elements of the plan, desserts for example. The plan is much less attractive if I skip desserts but pay for appetizers.

An improvement, that we'll never see, might be to run the plan like a buffet. Everyone eating uses a credit, guests who share still pay.






Yes, but let's be careful. This is not the Community Board. This is a Trip Planning forum, ostensibly primarily intended to provide members with factual information they can use to better enjoy their visits to the theme parks. That's my real concern, as I mentioned before: Being sure to clarify when we're "just having fun" versus providing information that casual readers can use to help foster their expectations, in this case, with regard to what they might encounter with regard to the Dining Plan when visiting WDW in 2009. :hippie:

[jensen]

Bring the old (basic) plan back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We loved it just the way it was... even if we have to pay a little more.

[Tinkerdreams]

When they came out with the 2008 DDP, I did write to Disney to express my concern about the changes. Many of my family are diabetics and having the only choice of only being able to get dessert means that we're paying for something that they cannot have. My request was for a choice of appetizer OR dessert.

I firmly believe people do not linger in the TS restaurants as they want to get back out into the parks, pools, etc. to have fun. Plus people with children tend not to linger because the kids don't want to be in the sitting for a long time.

I don't mind paying OOP for the tip. If you think about it, the tax is included with the dining plan, whereas, if you pay OOP, you have both the tax and tip. If the dining plan were to increase in cost $8 - $10/person, it would still be a good deal.

[weHEARTmickey]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned (I didn't read through every post.) I certainly think we should get the appy BACK (not just a choice b/w it & the dessert, but both!!) Yes, I definitely agree that the tip should be included again. :confused3

But, something we'll be dealing w/ in a few years is: my DD will be considered an ADULT & will have to pay as an ADULT. That is completely ridiculous!! She will never eat as much as an adult....& probably won't until she IS one! There should be DDP for the "in-betweeners", like 10-14??? (Forgive me, I do believe 10 year olds are considered adults, are they not?) And, not only should the price be "in-between", but the menu options should be also---not just chicken nuggets & hot dogs....maybe smaller portions of adult-type food. This is just my opinion...hopefully someone high up considers all of our concerns!

[KNovacovschi]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned (I didn't read through every post.) I certainly think we should get the appy BACK (not just a choice b/w it & the dessert, but both!!) Yes, I definitely agree that the tip should be included again. :confused3

But, something we'll be dealing w/ in a few years is: my DD will be considered an ADULT & will have to pay as an ADULT. That is completely ridiculous!! She will never eat as much as an adult....& probably won't until she IS one! There should be DDP for the "in-betweeners", like 10-14??? (Forgive me, I do believe 10 year olds are considered adults, are they not?) And, not only should the price be "in-between", but the menu options should be also---not just chicken nuggets & hot dogs....maybe smaller portions of adult-type food. This is just my opinion...hopefully someone high up considers all of our concerns!

Yes 10 year olds are classified as adults and that to makes me upset...my daughter is like the skinniest 10 year old ever literally and does not like to eat so for us to have to pay adult price for her it is just not fair...I just wonder why disney thinks 10-14 year olds are adults...the last time I checked they were still kids and yet they get to stay for free in the hotel rooms as they are classified as kids until 17...thinking about it just gives me a migraine...

[bicker]

This is a very common misconception. To be clear, the Disney Dining Plan doesn't talk about "adults" and "children". They are very explicit:


Guests
ages 10
and over:


Guests
ages 3-9:
(must order
from the
child’s menu
where available)
Disney offers a substantial incentive discount for the Dining Plan as offered to guests under 10 years old, with the proviso they order from the child's menu. Ostensibly, guests older than 10 years old aren't allowed to order from the child's menu, even when paying OOP, and although often nice CMs will allow it, they cannot formally accept that as part of the Dining Plan without being forced to allow everyone to order from the child's menu, as a matter of formal policy, something which would likely hurt Disney's revenues, as many guests would seek to keep their own costs down. Disney very strategically chose the age, 10, to best serve the interests of its owners.

So, again, Disney does not consider anyone "adults". They don't make that value judgment. They traffic only in ages: Ages 0-2, Ages 3-9, and Ages 10+. They see no benefit in separating pre-teens, teens, young adults, adults, and senior citizens apart into separate pricing groups.

[weHEARTmickey]

This is a very common misconception. To be clear, the Disney Dining Plan doesn't talk about "adults" and "children". They are very explicit:


Disney offers a substantial incentive discount for the Dining Plan as offered to guests under 10 years old, with the proviso they order from the child's menu. Ostensibly, guests older than 10 years old aren't allowed to order from the child's menu, even when paying OOP, and although often nice CMs will allow it, they cannot formally accept that as part of the Dining Plan without being forced to allow everyone to order from the child's menu, as a matter of formal policy, something which would likely hurt Disney's revenues, as many guests would seek to keep their own costs down. Disney very strategically chose the age, 10, to best serve the interests of its owners.

So, again, Disney does not consider anyone "adults". They don't make that value judgment. They traffic only in ages: Ages 0-2, Ages 3-9, and Ages 10+. They see no benefit in separating pre-teens, teens, young adults, adults, and senior citizens apart into separate pricing groups.


Thanks, Bicker. That explains HOW it works, but I still don't understand WHY?? This is just a way for Disney to stick it to those families who really want the DDP. :mad: I'm sure there are 10-14 yr olds out there who can eat quite a bit, but come on! You can't tell me that the average 10, or even 12 yr old can "put away" as much food as your average 25-30 year old!!! :confused3

I mean, they already keep up with the 0-2, 3-9, then 10+. What's ONE more category (10-14)???????? Or, it would be nice to be able to only buy DDP for certain guests in room, instead of having to purchase it for all. Of course you're going to have some who manipulate the system, but that's going to happen anywhere, with everything.

After our DD turns 10, the DDP is completely out of the question for our family, unless there are some MAJOR changes in the next couple of years. That really saddens me, because DH & I SOOOoooo like to splurge when we're at the World! popcorn::


Ahhh, just reminiscing over the 2007 DDP.....<sigh> :surfweb:

[Tricia1972]

Personally I see the DDP age classification as a unification between Disney in for pricing. Not that I agree with it, but it's what I think they're trying to do.

Imagine that they create another pricing category for the 10-14 crowd. Now for Dining it's

0-2 - Free 3-9 - $9.99 10-14 - $25.99 15+ - $37.99

The park tickets, that go with these packages are currently priced (1-Day Hoppers)

0-2 - Free 3-9 - $105.00 10+ - $116.00


I am not saying that everyone here would do this, but I would bet that if Disney were to distinguish juniors for eating, there would be many complaints that they do not distinguish juniors for park admissions.



I also believe that this is why, when Victoria & Albert's decided to limit children, that they chose 10 as the magic age to dine at V&A's.


I could be totally off, but I am just making an observation on my perceptions of what I think Disney may be doing.

[Mom2PixiePrincess]

Sorry, on the basic plan you are not going to get the tip AND the appetizer. And the alcohol won't make up for the table turning. The drinks don't cost them all that much, it's the markup that makes money on alcohol.

If Disney did everything we on the board want, they'd now have a Basic Dining Plan, a Deluxe Dining Plan, a One Table Service Only Dining Plan, a Counter Service Only Dining Plan, a Snack Only Plan, an Adult Dining Plan Including Alcohol, a Kids Eating Adult Food Dining Plan, an Adults Who Don't Want to Eat All That Much Dining Plan, a People Who Won't or Can't Eat Dessert Dining Plan, and all of them would include the tip where required. Imagine trying to administer all that.

Too funny!:rotfl2:

So personally I'd like them to go back to the 2007 DDP with two changes: an option between TS or CS meals. And drop the dessert. They could even up the price by $20-30 per day for this. The 2007 plan was darn near perfect! There is always someone that wants to fix something that wasn't broken and therefore mucking up the works!

To sum it up:
@$50 per adult
@$12 per child
Two meal credits (TS or CS patrons choice)
Meal to include: appy, entree, non-alcoholic drink and tip at TS
combo meal plus drink or entree, side and drink at CS
One or Two snack credits (either would suffice)


This should be the only DDP offered. With the only add on being a wine package, maybe!

[Mom2PixiePrincess]

Personally I see the DDP age classification as a unification between Disney in for pricing. Not that I agree with it, but it's what I think they're trying to do.

Imagine that they create another pricing category for the 10-14 crowd. Now for Dining it's

0-2 - Free 3-9 - $9.99 10-14 - $25.99 15+ - $37.99

The park tickets, that go with these packages are currently priced (1-Day Hoppers)

0-2 - Free 3-9 - $105.00 10+ - $116.00


I am not saying that everyone here would do this, but I would bet that if Disney were to distinguish juniors for eating, there would be many complaints that they do not distinguish juniors for park admissions.



I also believe that this is why, when Victoria & Albert's decided to limit children, that they chose 10 as the magic age to dine at V&A's.


I could be totally off, but I am just making an observation on my perceptions of what I think Disney may be doing.

Making a "junior" dining plan/price would requie a "junior" menu. Just wouldn't be logical for Disney to do this. Although, my DD5 likes to eat off the adult menu more often than not. She likes seafood, I'm thankful that more restaurants are adding baked/broiled fish to the kids menus! Everything is a trade off. :confused3

[Tricia1972]

Making a "junior" dining plan/price would requie a "junior" menu. Just wouldn't be logical for Disney to do this. Although, my DD5 likes to eat off the adult menu more often than not. She likes seafood, I'm thankful that more restaurants are adding baked/broiled fish to the kids menus! Everything is a trade off. :confused3

Oh I so totally agree with you! I mentioned the need for a junior menu on some prior threads about this and was attacked (so didn't mention it here), but I think that you're 100% right.

That'd be a lot of work and a lot of maintenance (junior menus).

[weHEARTmickey]

Making a "junior" dining plan/price would requie a "junior" menu. Just wouldn't be logical for Disney to do this.

Why not? ;) Look at McDonald's (I know, hardly the good analogy.) But they offer a Happy Meal, Big Kid's Meal, and reg menu, right?

I agree w/ Tricia1972, 10 is the magic number because it coincides with the park tickets. But, this is a dream thread, so I'm just doin' a little dreamin'.......:wizard:

[kermer]

I have no idea what Disney was hearing, but on the boards there were a number of complaints about a set tip amount being included - plenty of posters thought they would get or were getting bad service because of that.

I personally want my server to know that the tip depends on MY satisfaction with their service, I do not ever want my server to get the tip no matter their performance.

Now a quick question:

Do you HAVE to make ADR's on the DDP. Can I be a walk up and still use my plan? I have made ADR's for Character Breakfasts but figured we will "wing" it the rest of the meals.

[weHEARTmickey]

Do you HAVE to make ADR's on the DDP. Can I be a walk up and still use my plan? I have made ADR's for Character Breakfasts but figured we will "wing" it the rest of the meals.

You don't HAVE to make ADR's on the DDP. But, with the 2008 changes to the DDP, you'll need to eat a TS meal each night-or day- to get the best bang for your buck. (If you're not able to use all TS meals you paid for, then I believe you'd be throwing $$ away.)

Are you traveling during peak times? If so, I'd certainly recommend it.

Our first family vacation to WDW (2006), we stayed off site & only had ADR to Cinderella's Royal Table and Crystal Palace. I knew nothing about how hard it was to "get in." The week we were there, we were able to call (the very morning we needed the ADRs) and get ADR for Garden Grill, and even California Grill. But, if I recall correctly, Garden Grill was like our 3rd or 4th choice, and we just had to "settle." (even though it was a great experience!)

Nowadays I'm SUCH a planner, and I have each day planned out to the "t". If you somewhat have an idea of what park you're going to be visiting each day, I would definitely recommend getting ADR's. Hope this helps! pixiedust:

[CandleontheWater]

I would like to see a frequent guest card added. That way dining can be like it is at my local subway, I eat 9 meals and get the 10th for free! :laughing:

This would also be a great idea for drinks around world showcase! :drinking1

[kermer]

Thank you weHeartmickey.

I don't know if our vacation is Peak time or not.

March 20-29, 2008

My family does not want each step of the day planned (i would if they'd let me).

[Tricia1972]

Thank you weHeartmickey.

I don't know if our vacation is Peak time or not.

March 20-29, 2008

My family does not want each step of the day planned (i would if they'd let me).

Yes you are traveling at a peak time. I believe it's the second busiest week next to Christmas in fact. (I could be wrong, it may be the third busiest week - but it's busy. I know because we're going March 21-28, and last year we were there the same week - after Easter)

[kermer]

We will be there at the same time. We could be eating at the same places and not even know it....hehe

[Tricia1972]

You're right, we could be. I'll share, so you can keep an eye out for me. I'll be about two years pregnant with two sons, my husband, my mom, my dad and my sister, we'll be hard to miss :rotfl::

March 22 - LeCellier Supper (5:40)
March 23 - Vero Beach with Friends
March 24 - Tony's 5:30
March 25 - Beaches & Cream 11 am
March 26 - Nothing planned
March 27 - Jiko 5:30
March 28 - Crystal Palace 11:30 am

[kermer]

I have Crystal Palace 3/28 at 10:30:rotfl:

I just noticed you are staying at Saratoga.......So are we.....

[Chellymouse]

Here's a novel idea....include the tax and gratuity once again and allow people to decide if they want an appetizer or a dessert if they are only going to allow one!

[Mom2PixiePrincess]

Edit to my earlier post: While I don't think Disney would ever add a "junior" menu, I'd be ecstatic to see one! I can't even imagine having to pay $70 a day for a TEN YEAR OLD. I think I'd just skip adding her to our room reservation, sneak her in! hehe;)

[KNovacovschi]

Here's a novel idea....include the tax and gratuity once again and allow people to decide if they want an appetizer or a dessert if they are only going to allow one!

This I agree with...in response to the 10+ thing my daughter would gladly eat off the childs menu as that is pretty much all she likes...I don't think that the park tickets and the DDP should be joined togethor...when it comes to park tickets most kids go on more than one thing but when they are eating they are only chosing one thing(if that makes sense)...also I don't think there should be a junior menu as your right it would be to much work but really how many 10 year olds can eat an appetizer, main entree, and desert...

[bicker]

Thanks, Bicker. That explains HOW it works, but I still don't understand WHY??Well, yes it does: "They see no benefit in separating pre-teens, teens, young adults, adults, and senior citizens apart into separate pricing groups." Remember, just like everyone else, they're looking to structure things to best serve their objectives, derive the most benefit for their owners. They're obligated to do that.

This is just a way for Disney to stick it to those families who really want the DDP. :mad: Rest assured that Disney has absolutely no interest in sticking to families. You're just wrong about that.

[TDC Nala]

You're right, we could be. I'll share, so you can keep an eye out for me. I'll be about two years pregnant with two sons, my husband, my mom, my dad and my sister, we'll be hard to miss :rotfl::

March 22 - LeCellier Supper (5:40)
March 23 - Vero Beach with Friends
March 24 - Tony's 5:30
March 25 - Beaches & Cream 11 am
March 26 - Nothing planned
March 27 - Jiko 5:30
March 28 - Crystal Palace 11:30 am

I'll be there Easter weekend but I am just doing the Epcot Easter brunch and Jiko.

[TDC Nala]

Here's a novel idea....include the tax and gratuity once again and allow people to decide if they want an appetizer or a dessert if they are only going to allow one!

Not gonna work. Some at the table will want appetizers, some will want desserts, they'll probably share, and they're back where they started timewise.

The deluxe plan includes both appetizers and desserts but at a price increase.