Orlando Sentinel Story: Disney turns on '100 years' blitz

[DVC-Landbaron]

Here’s a little tidbit Re: Hundred years of magic/9-11/Tourism in general/ and other such meaty topics for discussion.

Orlando Sentinel Story (http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/tourism/orl-subiz100years03030302mar03.story?coll=orl%2Dbusine ss%2Dheadlines%2Dtourism)

Enjoy!

[Testtrack321]

I still can't beleave that the Millennium Celebration wasn't as sucessful as this puny 100 Years...
It boggles the imagination and all physics of distorting numbers to make stock holders rejoice.

[Bob O]

I like it that the "regulars" arent impressed with another promotion and also the comments about the lack of major new rides and Warrens telling comment" I dont know where we would be if we didnt have 100 years". Apparently they want to run promotions on made up campaigns than new attractions, but its cheaper that way apparently.

[All Aboard]

321, it depends on how you measure "success". More total visitors may have come during the Millennium Celebration, but WDW is judging the responses to surveys that say "if not for 100 years, we would not have made this trip." There's a spin to everything. By saying that this is our "most successful celebration ever" folks who read that will say "we have to check this out, honey let's go to WDW."

[Testtrack321]

Good point gcurling....
My idea of "sucess" is when your guests leave happy, and wanting to come back to see it again before it dissappears, and the ploy to suck as much money out of them as possible while their happy (ToN pins, for example, or the Leave a Leg(acy))

[larworth]

It will be interesting to see what they do in 2003/2004.

You would think they might want to give these celebrations a little rest so people don't become immune to them. They will actually have a portfolio of new things to trumpet in 2003 for someone that hasn't been in a couple years: Space, Philarmagic, JIYI rehab, Dino-rama(cough), maybe a HM make-over for the Holidays.

Should they go ahead and extend 100 years through early 2003 and than give it a rest for awhile. Or will they be tempted to go to the well again, especially with Mickey's 75th hanging there?

[raidermatt]

Since they are pushing 100 years into March 2003, it doesn't sound like there will be any big celebration at WDW in 2003. If there were, 100 years would be eating into it. As long as the celebrations are working, i.e. bringing guests in, we'll still see them, probably with a year in between. The Millineum Celebration ended 1/1/01, with 100 years scheduled for October.

This is just a guess, but I think Disney will probably try to alternate celebrations/events between WDW and DLResort.
2000 - Millineum Celebration at WDW
2001 - Opening of DCA/DD at DLResort.
2002 - 100 years at WDW.
2003 - Mickey's 75th at DLResort (Just a guess on my part, but I can't believe Disney would ignore this event, and frankly I would be disappointed if they did)
2004 - Something at WDW?
2005 - DL's 50th anniversary at DLResort.

Again, I have no inside info on this, its just my thoughts on what I think would work best.

[Bob O]

I think they WILL ALWAYS have some type of promo either going on or just about to start. Its a good way for them to get PR without having to always spend their own money.

[raidermatt]

Another interesting piece was the targeting of "tweeners", kids 9-14 (or something like that). We all know that's an issue, but I don't think changing the toys in Happy Meals is really going to make a difference.

I'm not saying Disney SHOULD do this, but if they want to target this group, they will need more "thrill" oriented rides. Things that are "cool", inside the parks. I think there are drawbacks to this strategy, namely that it works against keeping the rest of the families together.

I guess changing the toys is an inexpensive thing to do, so if it gets a few more tweeners in the parks, great. If it doesn't, nothing was lost (as long as the wee ones still like the toys).

[DVC-Landbaron]

Let me direct your attention to the following passage: Although Disney World's economizing has been credited with boosting the bottom line of its parent, it has contributed to a temporary dearth of major new rides.

Disney World's most recent new ones, Magic Carpets of Aladdin and TriceraTop Spin, are of the off-the-shelf variety that can be found at carnivals or amusement parks rather than unique trendsetters such as the $92 million Splash Mountain that has become a Magic Kingdom landmark.

"I don't know where we would be if we didn't have 100 Years," Warren said.
Does that mean that the parks, in their current condition just won't pack 'em in anymore? You know, now that I think about it, I kind of agree with her!! How sad!

And wouldn’t it be nice if they aspired to that “Magic Kingdom landmark” status once again!

[antnee]

but doesnt Mickey Mouse have a birthday coming up next year (75th) whic wuld be cause for another celebration????

[raidermatt]

Baron- I don't think the passage, in and of itself, is indicitive of future developments. It merely points out the obvious current situation. Space must certainly be considered a major attraction. Whether it will please everyone can't be determined yet, but it certainly has the potential to be in the same league as Splash.

Disney has been using the economy as a reason/excuse for a lot of things recently, and I think MOST of it is justified. Their actions as we come out of the recession will have a lot to do with my overall opinion of their direction.

[Bob O]

I think the passage quoted by dvc is telling. Disney is trying to get by on smoke/mirros/reputation/past good will without investing their own money into the park for any major type attraction!! They are content to put in cheap carny rides with a little theme or have other companies pay for attractions(space) and then siphon off money from the parks to pay for other misguided ventures. The 9-14yr olds crowd wont be thrilled by just putting in a few parades and cheap rides IMHO. And i would also bet a large portion of them are watching nick/cartoon channel more than the disney channel and to get their business as they grow older they will need to be wowed and disney isnt willing to do that now.

[raidermatt]

I'm not all that concerned with who pays for the attraction. If Disney can find a sponser, great. Wouldn't they be foolish to foot the bill for something they didn't have to? I don't want sponsers' signs popping up on the face of the castles at DL or MK, but if a sponser is willing to pay for a new attraction like Space at Epcot, I say go for it.

By most accounts, Test Track is a hit. Does it really matter who paid for it?

[DVC-Landbaron]

raidermatt I agree. I don't care who pays for it. But…I'm not all that concerned with who pays for the attraction. If Disney can find a sponsor, great.And therein lies the problem. It doesn't seem as though the sponsors are breaking down the door. So if a concept or an existing pavilion goes begging, what should Disney do? Let it go to seed? Never add anything?

[Another Voice]

Since when did yet another movie suddenly become an “E-Ticket” attraction?

Are we so desperate for something new that our standards have sunk this low?

[Bob O]

I would agree with AV some apparently are letting their standards slip. I would never consider Its tought to be a bug/honey i shrunk the audience to be e tickets. Isnt that title held for only your best attractions like TOT or POC etc. Or are we going to water down what a e-ticket attraction is??? Ive seen both numerous times and have had more than enough of honey i shrunk the audience but i cant say the same about TOT/POC. As for 3d shows both IMHO pale in comparsion to T23D!!!!!

[Peter Pirate]

ITTBAB certainly IS one of the BEST attractions at WDW. Just because it doesn't spin, loop or make you puke doesn't eliminate the amazing aspects of the SHOW.
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[DVC-Landbaron]

But is it an "E" ticket? A true "E" ticket attraction?

[Peter Pirate]

Refresh my memory, before they did away with the tickets, which rides at WDW were E-tickets?
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[All Aboard]

Just to aid in this discussion, I'll add this list for review:

WDW E-Tickets:

Jungle Cruise
Pirate of the Carribbean
Haunted Mansion
It's a Small World
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
Space Mountain
Country Bear Jamboree
Big Thunder Mountain Railroad

Hall of Presidents was initially an E, later changed to a free attraction.

[Peter Pirate]

In that case, IMO, ITTBAB is for sure an Eticket attraction...
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[DVC-Landbaron]

That's funny. I was just about to post that:

In that case, IMO, ITTBAB is for sure a "D" ticket attraction...


;)

[hopemax]

What were the "D" tickets at WDW? I know at Disneyland, Rocket to the Moon was a "D" and the Mine Train thru Nature's Wonderland was a "D."

I would definetely put the 3-D movies in the "D" category

[DVC-Landbaron]

Peter Pan and Tiki Birds come to mind right away.

Any others?

[All Aboard]

Cut and Paste from "My Great Big WDW Excel File of Everything"


Walt Disney World Magic Kingdom
Ticket System

Free Attractions
If You had Wings (Became Dreamflight then Take Flight) (Later, Replaced by Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin)
Hall of Presidents (initially an E ticket)
Carousel of Progress
CircleVision 360 (Replaced by the Timekeeper)
The Walt Disney Story (Closed)

A-Ticket
Main Street Cinema
All Main Street Transportation
Cinderella's Golden Carousel

B-Ticket
Swiss Family Tree House
Frontierland Shootin' Gallery
Mike Fink Keelboats
Dumbo
Mad Tea Party

C-Ticket
Walt Disney World Railroad
Peter Pan's Flight
Snow White's Adventures
Mr. Toad's Wild Ride (Replaced by the Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh)
Grand Prix Raceway (Renamed Tommorowland Indy Speedway)

D-Ticket
The Enchanted Tiki Birds [Tropical Seranade] (New show, renamed The Enchanted Tiki Birds, Under New Management)
Tom Sawyer Island
Liberty Square Riverboat
Skyway (Closed)
Mickey Mouse Revue (Replaced by Legend of the Lion King)
Star Jets (Rethemed and renamed Astro Orbiter)
WEDway People Mover (Renamed Tommorowland Transit Authority)
Flight to the Moon (Became Mission to Mars) (Later, Replaced by Alien Encounter)

E-Ticket
Jungle Cruise
Pirate of the Carribbean
Haunted Mansion
It's a Small World
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea (Closed)
Space Mountain
Country Bear Jamboree
Big Thunder Mountain Railroad

[DVC-Landbaron]

...even taking a Car #3 perspective...we have a new D and a new E in the same year (and who knows what else the 2003 holds)Well. I have purposely not participated in threads concerning Space because I really don't know what to believe. I've heard everything from a "C" type ultra spinner to a true EPCOT style "F" ticket!! I think that's one of the major differences in car philosophies. We tend to 'give' and 'take away' the benefit of the doubt according to our personal perspective. You already have it chalked up as a grade "A", Number One, "E" Ticket. They will have to prove it to me. On the other side of the coin (just to be equal) I tend to think, when I here about a Dinorama, that Disney has gone cheap once again. Until they prove me wrong. Lately, they haven't proven me wrong very often, but we will see. I hope I'm pleasantly surprised by Space! And I further hope that after seeing Philarmagic, I can upgrade a "D" for an "E"!

[raidermatt]

It doesn't seem as though the sponsors are breaking down the door. So if a concept or an existing pavilion goes begging, what should Disney do? Let it go to seed? Never add anything?

AV- I agree with you based on my interpretation of your rhetorical questions. If sponsers can't be found, then Disney will have to pony up more on their own. But the question is, is the dearth of sponsers a cyclical thing or a permanent issue? I tend to think its at least somewhat cyclical, so I wouldn't want Disney to "panic" because it took them 6 months or a year longer than they had planned to find a sponser.

A lot is going to depend on the economy. As it improves, advertising spending will increase, and I suspect finding a sponsor for a major new attraction every year or two won't be as difficult.


For what its worth, I'd put ITTBAB in the E category, but I can't see it staying there for more than 2-3 more years. There's too many others like it. Just like I suspect the Tiki Birds and/or CBJ would have had to have been re-classified by now. Its not that I don't like them personally, but I think they have lost some of their WOW value with many guests.

[DVC-Landbaron]

For what its worth, I'd put ITTBAB in the E category, but I can't see it staying there for more than 2-3 more years. There's too many others like it. I think that's part of the problem I have with the whole 3-D movie concept. When I first saw Muppets I loved it!!! Same with Honey and Bugs. With their interaction with the guests, it really WOWed me. They were fun. No, they were FUN! But…

And I think if they make the new one 'more-of-the-same', I'll be a little disappointed. That isn't to say that I won't like it. Or that I won't have fun. It's just a "D" ticket instead of an "E".

[larworth]

The original list leaves plenty of room for interpretation. I sure wouldn’t have put the Skyway and Star Jets above Peter Pan, Snow White etc. COP is obviously above an A.

It is clear Big Budget and Groundbreaking quickly come to mind. ITTAB doesn’t qualify, and on the surface neither would Philarmagic.

However, I remember Marty Sklar going so far as to say that Philarmagic would rate in the Top 5, for fun, of any Disney attraction. If tickets were being used today you would think the most popular attractions would command the highest ratings, regardless of investment. Does popularity figure into the equation at all?

[Peter Pirate]

Larworth suggests "plenty of room for interpretation" and I suggest larworth is a smart man! Certainly time changes all and again we argue the subjective...But PLEASE...Do you guys (generic term) really think ITTBAB doesn't capture the same thrill or wow that CBJ, 20,000 Leagues or even JC did? (Remember, I love JC, but ITTBAB is so awesome. Even seeing it as often as I do I relish being seated next to people who are seeing it for the first time. The laughter, sense of surprise & joy to such extremes could never have been generated by the aforementioned attractions, IMO).
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[DVC-Landbaron]

Even seeing it as often as I do I relish being seated next to people who are seeing it for the first time.Yes!! So do I!! But without that 'first-timer' thrill, it's only a "D"!! Still fun, but no "E"!

[Peter Pirate]

Someone can't find magic at AKL??? I must of missed that blasphemy...Ouch, oh, oooo, I twisted my back...I have fallen and I can't get up!... Well, the keyboard is here on the floor with me sooo...I'll continue.

But seriously, has it been said the AKL is not magic? Oh, I pitty the po fool who say dat! Yeow, my knee just tripped out...Oh the humanity! ba-da-bing...

The AKL is the coolest...Oh man, please Scoop don't tell me who said that I could never look them in the monitor again...Ahhhh my neck, my neck...Oh, I gotta go...
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[DVC-Landbaron]

Someone can't find magic at AKL???Well, I always give Scoop the benefit of the doubt. He easily falls into hyperbole. I don't think I ever remember reading a post on these boards that says AK hold no magic at all!! Or that someone couldn't find any magic. My take is AK contains wonderful magic!! Beautiful theming!! And a GREAT tree!! Really a WOW!! place!!

But Considering it's Disney, compared to the other parks and at fifty buck a copy, there ain't nearly enough of it!!!

Now do you get it? ;)

[Peter Pirate]

Doh............................................... .........................................
:cool: :cool: (mia):cool: :cool:

[raidermatt]

And I think if they make the new one (Philarmagic) 'more-of-the-same', I'll be a little disappointed. That isn't to say that I won't like it. Or that I won't have fun. It's just a "D" ticket instead of an "E".

I feel the same way, except that I still rate ITTBAB, Muppets and HISTA as E's, but I see them soon going to D level. But that's probably only because I haven't seen them as many times as you have.

[Another Voice]

The level of tickets way back in the Evil Dark Walt Days was meant to reflect the cost of attraction. They were the way Disney recouped the cost of the show. Sometimes the ticket was tweaked to encourage people to go to one ride or another. An “E-ticket” was a big, expensive, all out attraction. The tickets didn’t reflect how much you were supposed to like the show. The original ‘Carousel of Progress’, a huge and very popular attraction out here at Disneyland, was even free because it was sponsored by General Electric.

As for ‘PhilaMagic’, it’s hardly a no-expenses sparred, brand new, exciting attraction. Frankly, whether Mickey is in it or not, I have a limit to the number of times I want to wear silly glasses, have air sprayed into my face and be sprinkled with water in one vacation. The gimmicks wear thin very fast.

The best solution would have been to either replace or rotate ‘Honey, The Audience Is Bored’ with ‘PhilaMagic’. Have a 3-D Theater with different shows.

[raidermatt]

The best solution would have been to either replace or rotate ‘Honey, The Audience Is Bored’ with ‘PhilaMagic’. Have a 3-D Theater with different shows.

I'm not sure what the "pre-show" plan is for Phil, but wouldn't combining them require a generic pre-show? Or at least two separate queueing areas... It's been awhild since I saw Honey, but I know Bug and Muppets have pretty elaborate lobbies, and they are intended to make you feel like you are in the show before you ever go in the theater. I wouldn't want to lose that, cause I think its a big part of the show...

[Bob O]

Again i would agree with Av that a e-ticket meant part "great ride/attraction" and part trying to take as much money as possible. Bit i dont think a e-ticket ride/attraction is one that has a limited shelf like like some think HISTA has. Now compare what i believe a true e-ticket is like POC/TOT and they will stand the test of time unlike a 3d show which is more gimmicky but well waer out its welcome alot sooner. I would be alot more impressed if they tried a live action 3d show like T23D based on a movie like armaggedon as a example. Disneys kids shows are OK but i would much perfer one with more of a adult type theme.