Questions on New Disney Dining Plan 2008

[TLSnell1981]

:tink:


Just a couple of questions on changes in '08. First, is tax included in the $38? If so, what is the rate? How is the gratuity added? Is it a percentage added to the dining plan or do you leave your gratuity at each place of service? I have used the DDP in the past. The value and convience made it well worth the money. Just not sure anymore until I have all the "new" facts!



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[Telcogirl]

I just added DDP to my February reservation. The CM told me that tax is still included. I am not sure what the rate is. Gratuity is now out of pocket, you pay that seperate.

I also asked if an appetizer can be substituted for a dessert and was told that is at the discretion of each indvidual restaurant.

I still like the idea of the DDP. We will jsut see how it all works this time around with these recent changes.

[pilferk]

:tink:


Just a couple of questions on changes in '08. First, is tax included in the $38? If so, what is the rate? How is the gratuity added? Is it a percentage added to the dining plan or do you leave your gratuity at each place of service? I have used the DDP in the past. The value and convience made it well worth the money. Just not sure anymore until I have all the "new" facts!



[http://members.cox.net/disneyvacationclub/images/dvc_sigs/bwv2.jpg

Prices are 37.99 (adult) and 9.99 (children) per day, and that INCLUDES the tax. Tax rates at Disney are around 6%....but you won't need to worry about it.

Gratuity is at your discretion and will be done at each restaurant. It will NOT be auto added to the bill.

[JimMIA]

I also asked if an appetizer can be substituted for a dessert and was told that is at the discretion of each indvidual restaurant.I don't doubt that you were told that, but I'd bet the farm the answer will be NO! across the board. They're not just trying to cut costs, they're also trying to increase turnover by cutting out an entire course of the meal. Another aspect of this change is they are also trying to stop people from sharing items.Prices are 37.99 (adult) and 9.99 (children) per day, and that INCLUDES the tax. Tax rates at Disney are around 6%....but you won't need to worry about it.

Gratuity is at your discretion and will be done at each restaurant. It will NOT be auto added to the bill.The gratuity WILL be added to your bill in a couple of situations.

One is if you have six or more people in your party, no matter how the various people are paying for their meal. That's an automatic 18% service charge that is a part of your bill.

The other situation is if you order anything not covered by DDP -- like an appetizer, alcoholic beverage, etc. They will add 18% to that check as well.

There is nothing really new about either of these automatic service charges. They've always been in effect. The only difference is that, in 2008, the threshhold for automatically adding dropped from parties of 8 to parties of 6 or more.

[pilferk]

I don't doubt that you were told that, but I'd bet the farm the answer will be NO! across the board. They're not just trying to cut costs, they're also trying to increase turnover by cutting out an entire course of the meal. Another aspect of this change is they are also trying to stop people from sharing items.The gratuity WILL be added to your bill in a couple of situations.

One is if you have six or more people in your party, no matter how the various people are paying for their meal. That's an automatic 18% service charge that is a part of your bill.

The other situation is if you order anything not covered by DDP -- like an appetizer, alcoholic beverage, etc. They will add 18% to that check as well.

There is nothing really new about either of these automatic service charges. They've always been in effect. The only difference is that, in 2008, the threshhold for automatically adding dropped from parties of 8 to parties of 6 or more.

I know that was the case when tip was included with the DDP....I'm not so sure now. Are you SURE that will continue to be the case? Seems weird to not include tip with the DDP, but then auto charge a tip on anything you order outside the DDP.

[JimMIA]

I know that was the case when tip was included with the DDP....I'm not so sure now. Are you SURE that will continue to be the case? Seems weird to not include tip with the DDP, but then auto charge a tip on anything you order outside the DDP.
Yes, I'm sure.

The change in party size does not apply only to DDP. It applies to ALL parties.

Previously, 18% was added to all checks for parties of 8 or more, regardless of how they were paying. Lowering that threshhold to 6 or more, and adding 18% to ALL DDE checks was the concession Disney made to the union when they stopped including the gratuity in the price of DDP.

The automatic 18% to checks for purchases outside DDP has always been there. I probably didn't word that very clearly, though. What I mean is, if you are on DDP and you order something not covered by DDP, they add 18% automatically.

However, the important thing for people considering DDP to remember is NOT the circumstances were a gratuity will automatically be added. The important thing to remember is that YOU are paying the gratuity in 2008, not Disney as they have in previous years.

[pilferk]

Yes, I'm sure.

The change in party size does not apply only to DDP. It applies to ALL parties.

Previously, 18% was added to all checks for parties of 8 or more, regardless of how they were paying. Lowering that threshhold to 6 or more, and adding 18% to ALL DDE checks was the concession Disney made to the union when they stopped including the gratuity in the price of DDP.


The automatic 18% to checks for purchases outside DDP has always been there. I probably didn't word that very clearly, though. What I mean is, if you are on DDP and you order something not covered by DDP, they add 18% automatically.

However, the important thing for people considering DDP to remember is NOT the circumstances were a gratuity will automatically be added. The important thing to remember is that YOU are paying the gratuity in 2008, not Disney as they have in previous years.

No, no....not the auto gratuity for party sizes. I KNOW that's true for everyone.

This part:


"The other situation is if you order anything not covered by DDP -- like an appetizer, alcoholic beverage, etc. They will add 18% to that check as well. "


I know that, when tip was included on the DDP, if you ordered ANYTHING "extra" (like an adult beverage, an add-on item, additional app or meal) they'd charge you the same 18% tip on that item that they charged on the DDP for the rest of the dinner.

My question is are you SURE that 2nd "situation" is still going to be in place...because my thought is that if there is no longer an 18% included with the DDP, there won't be an "auto tip" included on the "extra" items. That make more sense?

As you mention, I know that's the way they've done it in the past...it just doesn't make much sense to continue to do it, going forward, with the new rules. Maybe they will, but I've just not seen confirmation that they will. It's an interesting question.....

[Telcogirl]

I don't doubt that you were told that, but I'd bet the farm the answer will be NO! across the board. They're not just trying to cut costs, they're also trying to increase turnover by cutting out an entire course of the meal.


If the individual restaurant allows me to have an appetizer instead of dessert, how is that cutting out an entire course? It's seems to be just substituting one for another.

[JimMIA]

I see what you mean. I think the 18% will still be added, but your question makes perfect sense -- more sense than auto-adding the tip, actually. I'll go post that on the DDP board and see if anyone knows.

[CarolAnnC]

Here is the LINK (http://adisneyworld.disney.go.com/media/wdw/images2003/languagespecific/eng/nontheme/tickets/08Dining.pdf) to the Official 2008 Disney Dining Plan Brochure.

In it is stated the following:

"An 18% gratuity will be added automatically for parties of 6 or more. A gratuity may also be added automatically for ordered items that are not included in the Disney Dining Plan (e.g. alcoholic beverages)."

[salmoneous]

If the individual restaurant allows me to have an appetizer instead of dessert, how is that cutting out an entire course? It's seems to be just substituting one for another. Appetizers and desserts are often shared. If allowed a choice, a couple might get one appetizer, two entrees and a desserts for instance.

[JimMIA]

Yep...and maybe next time I'll remember to read the manual first!:rotfl2:

Naw, not much chance of me doing that!

[JimMIA]

Appetizers and desserts are often shared. If allowed a choice, a couple might get one appetizer, two entrees and a desserts for instance.
Or...one appetizer, one entree, and buy a dessert OOP. Or just one appetizer and one entree and split both for 1 TS. That's the sharing part of the equation.

[TLSnell1981]

According to another website, 6.5% is added to the $37.99 for adults and to $9.99 for children. So, that is $40.46 for adults and $10.64 for children.

[christianweecare]

According to another website, 6.5% is added to the $37.99 for adults and to $9.99 for children. So, that is $40.46 for adults and $10.64 for children.

I don't believe that to be correct. $37.99 & $9.99 include the tax. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

[javamom]

Ok, so here's my dumb question... and there may be no way to know the answer.

When the tip used to be included, was the tip calculated based upon the regular menu prices for the items ordered?

:confused3

I guess my point is that I assume that is what we will have to pay now.

For example:

The menu price is 2.50 for a soda.
The price that I paid for the dining plan that day, really makes that soda less than 2.50.
But, I will be tipping for the soda as if I really paid 2.50 for it.

Am I making any sense?? Someone hit me with a hockey puck, maybe it'll help?
:headache:

[JimMIA]

According to another website, 6.5% is added to the $37.99 for adults and to $9.99 for children. So, that is $40.46 for adults and $10.64 for children.
The other site is wrong. The tax is already included in the DDP. If you click on the link in Post 10 above, you'll see the official Disney brochure and that will answer most of your questions.

[MomofKatie]

Ok, so here's my dumb question... and there may be no way to know the answer.

When the tip used to be included, was the tip calculated based upon the regular menu prices for the items ordered?

:confused3

I guess my point is that I assume that is what we will have to pay now.

For example:

The menu price is 2.50 for a soda.
The price that I paid for the dining plan that day, really makes that soda less than 2.50.
But, I will be tipping for the soda as if I really paid 2.50 for it.

Am I making any sense?? Someone hit me with a hockey puck, maybe it'll help?
:headache:

The amount you tip is now totally up to you. I'm sure the servers would like you to tip based on the actual total of the menu amts- they will give you a bill with the amount of the total on it, so you can tip (they hope) based on that.

BUT, if you want to tip based on the amount you are paying on the DDP (I guess you'd figure that it is around 75% of the daily total- around $28 or so- so the tip would be around $6), you can. It is at your discretion.

Personally, I would tip based on the total price of the menu items if I was paying OOP, but that is just me. You do what you feel is right for you.

[JimMIA]

When the tip used to be included, was the tip calculated based upon the regular menu prices for the items ordered? :confused3 That's not a dumb question, but it's not a simple answer either. Here's how they used to compute the tip, from what we've heard from folks who should know.

Disney Dining assigned a value for the TS portion of DDP of approximately $25, and they paid the restaurants 18% of that -- or about $4.50. The Disney restaurants calculated the menu price of each meal, and made up the difference to the staff. So if a meal's price was $50, the server would get the full $9.00 -- $4.50 paid by Disney Dining and $4.50 paid by the restaurant. You can see from that math that the elimination of the gratuity from DDP gave the Disney family an extra $9.00 in bottom line, for every adult TS, for each day someone was on DDP. (Obviously, if the meals were a little less, they save a little less; or, if the meals are more, Disney's bottom line is improved more.)

The non-Disney restaurants did not necessarily make up the difference in tips, which led to some awkward and unbecoming exchanges between servers and guests. Some of the servers let the guests know they felt they were being cheated...and that it was the guest's responsibility to fix it. That's despite the fact that the guest PAID for the tip -- the server just didn't get it from their employer.

The basic question, though, is what price we should use to compute the tip, now that we have to pay it. My opinion is that we should use the menu price of what we order, just as we would in any other restaurant.

[blackmonmama]

The other site is wrong. The tax is already included in the DDP. If you click on the link in Post 10 above, you'll see the official Disney brochure and that will answer most of your questions.

I interpreted the Disney brochure to mean you don't have to pay for tax at the restaurant, not tax on the price of the plan. I think the OP was asking if the package price is taxed. If it is, then we're not getting any financial benefit from not paying tax at the restaurant; we're just paying the tax in advance. (if anything we'd be losing $ b/c some of us are paying interest on that package price before our trip :headache:).

ETA:
from Passporter's site: "The 2008 add-on price for the basic dining plan is $37.99 (plus 6.5% tax) for guests ages 10 and up, $9.99 plus tax for ages 3-9.
Either pp or passporter is right it seems.

[TLSnell1981]

I interpreted the Disney brochure to mean you don't have to pay for tax at the restaurant, not tax on the price of the plan. I think the OP was asking if the package price is taxed. If it is, then we're not getting any financial benefit from not paying tax at the restaurant; we're just paying the tax in advance. (if anything we'd be losing $ b/c some of us are paying interest on that package price before our trip :headache:).

ETA:
from Passporter's site: "The 2008 add-on price for the basic dining plan is $37.99 (plus 6.5% tax) for guests ages 10 and up, $9.99 plus tax for ages 3-9.
Either pp or passporter is right it seems.

You and I are on the same page. That is exactly the way I understand it.

PS
I just called Disney dining and the above info is correct. Tax is charged on the dining plan, but no tax is added to your bill at the restaurant.

[Lewisc]

Any "automatic tip" and any suggested tip information will be based on the menu price of the food ordered. I suspect that's the way most of us will tip.

That said many non-Disney restaurants have price fixed dinner specials, sometimes "early bird", sometimes called a "tasting menu and sometimes a way to provide a discount to guets that order a "full course meal". Many of us base our tip on the cost of the meal and we don't add up the menu prices of the food we order.




The basic question, though, is what price we should use to compute the tip, now that we have to pay it. My opinion is that we should use the menu price of what we order, just as we would in any other restaurant.

[jamesphilipdean]

No! Tax is included in the $37.99 and $9.99. That is how it is this year (I just got back and Tax was included when I paid for it) and remains next year (the quote I was told I would have to pay at check-in).

Jim

You and I are on the same page. That is exactly the way I understand it.

PS
I just called Disney dining and the above info is correct. Tax is charged on the dining plan, but no tax is added to your bill at the restaurant.

[jamesphilipdean]

More confirmation: I called Disney Dining Reservations and asked. The Disney Rep did not know and went to check with guest services. (While I was on hold, I tried booking a room with Disney online both this year and next with and without DDP and discovered both this year and next TAX is included). The Disney rep returned and confirmed TAX is included this year and next and that guest services did exactly what I did to confirm it (actually making reservations). As a result Disney is sending out emails to their personnel, letting them know 2008 DDP rates includes TAX.

Jim

No! Tax is included in the $37.99 and $9.99. That is how it is this year (I just got back and Tax was included when I paid for it) and remains next year (the quote I was told I would have to pay at check-in).

Jim

[pilferk]

Here is the LINK (http://adisneyworld.disney.go.com/media/wdw/images2003/languagespecific/eng/nontheme/tickets/08Dining.pdf) to the Official 2008 Disney Dining Plan Brochure.

In it is stated the following:

"An 18% gratuity will be added automatically for parties of 6 or more. A gratuity may also be added automatically for ordered items that are not included in the Disney Dining Plan (e.g. alcoholic beverages)."

Thanks CarolAnn! Sounds like it's not changing....which, IMHO, is odd.

It's going to make ordering those "extra" items OOP (like Apps, at TS, if you want them) a bit more difficult...because now you're going to have to figure out what you're paying a tip on automatically, and what you're not. I would have thought the rule was added precisely to avoid that issue in the first place...now you have it, just "in reverse".

[n2mm]

Right now the tip is calculated on the TS dining bill -- we always peak when they bring us both bills (one with prices and one with zeros). So the tip would be calculated on the price of your TS meal, so if your meal comes to $100 for 2 adults, then the tip would be $18 (if you choose the 18% tip). So if a family of four's bill is $200, then the tip would be $36. The higher the bill, the higher the tip. I recently read a thread where someone was calculating the tip on the price of the plan, not the price of the meal. My January 08 trip should prove interesting while dining out. We don't plan to purchase the DDP that trip, but will be eating at the restraurants using our DDE discount instead. While parties of less than 6 will tip at their discretion, a party of 6 or more will have the 18% automatically added to their bill. We are using our DDE card and believe the new policy of that discount will have the 18% automatically added, which is not a big deal for us. Hubby was a CM for 8 years and the 18% tip has been automatically added to the CM bill for a long time. (so this is not a new thing, only new to the guest.)

[boettj]

Wow tons of confusion. Here is my take on the old plan:

When I go out to dinner at home, I tip on price and performance. My baseline is 20%. If they are bad, it can go below 15% which use to be considered the norm.

When at Disney, I would often leave the waiter/waitress more money. This was based on two beliefs. For the price I paid per day per person, I was making a killing. The other reason for me to leave an additional tip was performance. Most of the waiters and waitresses at Disney are top notch. You are not getting some run of the mill college student at the local Applebee's. Nor are you getting the snot nose high school student at Ihop. You are mainly getting professionals, and they provide that level of service.

I am not knocking people that do not give extra. I am merely explaining that the waiters and waitresses often earn a 25% tip. Yet people do not reward them for their effort.

Over a nine day period I must have heard it 4 or 5 times from different waiters and waitresses that I did not have to leave extra. They explained to me that the tip was included. I simply informed them that I appreciated their service.

The bad part of the old system was that if they were really bad, they were rewarded by 18% no matter what according to JimMIA.

Now fast forward to the new DDP. Essentially you are getting less for you money, than you did last year. Last year, there was an appetizer, dinner and a desert. This year they removed a course and removed the tip. The result is that you get less food, and you have to pay the tip out of pocket. So Disney is recouping the price of the tip $9 and the cost of one app (don't recall how much.)

Three questions come out of this:

1. Was the above paragraph correct in the comparison of the 2 different DDP?

2. Do you feel that with the new DDP you are not getting your money's worth?

3. If you don't think you are getting your moneys worth, is that because of the amount of food you get for the 37.99 or is it simply the difference between what you received under the old plan?

Not trying to make any enemies here. I am just trying to make the decision for us when we go Next spring whether to get the DPP or not.


Thanks

[auntie]

I'm really glad we went in May and we did have the Dining plan for the very first time. We've been going to Disney since '91, and it was the first time we decided on adding dining. It was a GREAT deal. Especially since we were 5 adults now. You can't feed at 6'2 teenage boy for less than $40.00 a day anywhere. We had a blast. A big part of our enjoyment of the plan was that
we had appetizers and that it included the gratuity. I'm not so sure we'd add it again, if we are paying the gratuity..for a party of 5 that was a pretty good savings right there...and then they are cutting out a course. I'd sooner pay for a desert..than have to pay for the appetizer. We usually share dessert anyway. We would all order one when on the plan..but if we were to be paying ..we usually split a couple of things. That's just my take on it. I'd really have to do some serious figuring(looking at the menu's and their prices) to see if the Dining Plan would work for us again. I've heard there are a couple of other dining plan options that are more expensive..but honestly I'm not sure what they include, and if they'd be worth the extra expense.
I'm glad we got to try it in May..because it's not looking like we'd do it again.

[tink621]

I'm really glad we went in May and we did have the Dining plan for the very first time. We've been going to Disney since '91, and it was the first time we decided on adding dining. It was a GREAT deal. Especially since we were 5 adults now. You can't feed at 6'2 teenage boy for less than $40.00 a day anywhere. We had a blast. A big part of our enjoyment of the plan was that
we had appetizers and that it included the gratuity. I'm not so sure we'd add it again, if we are paying the gratuity..for a party of 5 that was a pretty good savings right there...and then they are cutting out a course. I'd sooner pay for a desert..than have to pay for the appetizer. We usually share dessert anyway. We would all order one when on the plan..but if we were to be paying ..we usually split a couple of things. That's just my take on it. I'd really have to do some serious figuring(looking at the menu's and their prices) to see if the Dining Plan would work for us again. I've heard there are a couple of other dining plan options that are more expensive..but honestly I'm not sure what they include, and if they'd be worth the extra expense.
I'm glad we got to try it in May..because it's not looking like we'd do it again.

I was just getting ready to reply to this thread and you said exactly what I was going to say. We also went in May with DDP for the first time in the ten years we've been visiting WDW. With two teenage boys! IT was wonderful. I also just don't see how it would be of benefit to use it in 2008. We were also a party of 5 and sometimes our bill was $300 (coral reef). That's almost a $60 tip that we would be paying now with less food. Unless I'm completely confused. Maybe someone could correct me if I'm wrong.

[javamom]

Well I haven't decided this question for myself yet. I think that I will have to sit down and decide
A) do I want to do a TS ever day?
B) If so, go to allears and check menu prices of what I "think" we would order
C) add it all up, and add tip to that
D) compare whether it is cheaper to do DDP or use the DDE (including the 65 to buy it).
E) factor in the fact that the DDP includes CS and snack.

I am going to "guess" that the DDP is still going to be cheaper... if and only if, I decide that we WANT to do CS and TS and snack every day of the trip.

I have not come to that decision, as yet.