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View Full Version : DDP substitutions-dessert for app?


MJRmom
09-01-2007, 04:29 PM
Hi
we are heading to the wonderful WDW in Feb/08 and are using the DDP
I'm not much of a dessert person (gasp!) and wondered if they would allow me to sub a appetizer for my dessert? :confused3

kaytieeldr
09-01-2007, 06:06 PM
No. Period.

MJRmom
09-02-2007, 06:39 AM
ah well, thanks
I will do dessert!

kaytieeldr
09-02-2007, 07:22 AM
You know, not many - but a couple/few places have cheese plates for dessert. Yes, I know you want it before the meal, but... I mean, you could ask. If you really want an appetizer, and your meal comes with an accompaniment, again, you could ask to have that brought out separately/first... they'll probably say no, but it's like the (only) time my office closed for a snowstorm and I was - where else - in Disney World. When I found out they all got paid for the day, I asked if I could get a comp day. The CEO said no, which I expected - but he might have said yes, and I'd never have known if I didn't ask :)

Forevryoung
09-03-2007, 02:32 AM
Truthfully, the biggest kicker to us is the lack of the appetizer for the 2008 Dining Plan- I can live on mickey bars for dessert or skip dessert entirely but DBF and I love choosing an appetizer or 2 to share.

So, since we usually won't order dessert but we will have to pay OOP for an appetizer, it's approx. $12 less to get the DDP. Forget it, not worth the additional stress!

And unless we eat 3 TS meals a day, I can't figure out how to get ahead in the deluxe DDP and I don't have the time for that!

bicker
09-03-2007, 04:36 AM
it's approx. $12 less to get the DDP. I suspect that this will end up being the most important metric for an overwhelming number of people.

Lewisc
09-03-2007, 06:40 AM
I suspect many, if not most, of the deluxe DDP guests plan on having a two credit meal most days.



And unless we eat 3 TS meals a day, I can't figure out how to get ahead in the deluxe DDP and I don't have the time for that!

bicker
09-03-2007, 11:46 AM
Yes, and this would probably be the context within which we'd do the Deluxe Dining Plan on our next visit. I'm just not sure about our ability to derive a sufficiently good value from that third TS, given our specific preferences. We never would do TS for breakfast, and timing is tight for a 1TS for lunch and a 2TS for dinner, given that we're early-risers and therefore end up eating dinner early as well.

kaytieeldr
09-03-2007, 12:44 PM
Two separate issues: First, exactly on-topic. With the appetizer no longer included, it's likely that Guests who do want an app will be more likely to share one between or among the table, than to each order their own (not that this will be the same Fantasmic! Dining Package Guests who complained in 2006 about having to share an appetizer ;)), which, while costing more, will likely lower the additional cost per-person.

And the side-topic: I agree, unless DxDDP Guests are visiting pretty much JUST for the food, the best usage would be one 1-TS meal and one Signature meal or show per day.

familyS
09-03-2007, 04:19 PM
I am hoping so many people complain in January that some restaurants will decide to give the option of appetizer or dessert. Well, I can dream, can't I :rotfl2:

Pumbaa_
09-03-2007, 05:14 PM
it is this change that (IMO) will either drive people to the DxDDP or not go with a dining plan at all.

(ok, so it is my hope anyway:wizard: )

Ilovestitch
09-03-2007, 05:59 PM
Even with the change, people are booking the DDP for '08 just like they have been for '07. I've explained that appetizer and gratuity isn't included and most people are like "whatever" and book it with the DDP.

Pumbaa_
09-03-2007, 06:16 PM
Next year should be interesting as people experience the new plan. I know we here on the boards are speculating like mad about how the changes will impact us

bicker
09-04-2007, 06:18 AM
Even with the change, people are booking the DDP for '08 just like they have been for '07. I've explained that appetizer and gratuity isn't included and most people are like "whatever" and book it with the DDP.This is a very interesting (though, to me, perhaps not surprising) bit of insight. Anytime you can remove cost and customer in general react little to it, you've had a win.

n2mm
09-04-2007, 06:55 AM
Even with the change, people are booking the DDP for '08 just like they have been for '07. I've explained that appetizer and gratuity isn't included and most people are like "whatever" and book it with the DDP.


I agree, it doesn't seem to be affecting some folks. We will be there the last week of January and WILL NOT be buying the DDP this trip. We have used it on our last 8 trips and really think it's a good value, but with losing the tip in 2008, it is no longer a value for us. We will be using our DDE card. We will still be dining at some of our favorite places, but won't feel compelled to stuff ourselves. I will be keeping track of our expensives to compare whether we made the right decision or not.

It will be interesting to see other diners first hand reaction to the new rules. I'm sure the servers will have alot to say about it too. It should be an interesting trip.

kaytieeldr
09-04-2007, 08:43 AM
We will be using our DDE card. We will still be dining at some of our favorite places, but won't feel compelled to stuff ourselves That makes sense… but two things (NOT at all in dispute of what you say; one response, and one thought that just popped into my head, and that happens SO rarely I just have to share it :teeth: ) First, while yes, there are a lot of repeat visitors, many of whom have used the DDP in the past and will not purchase it again due to the changes, there are also a LOT of first-time Guests, or even repeat Guests, who will just go with “the package” because it’s easy and it includes ‘everything’. The first-timers, especially, won’t know they’re missing out on anything (at least until they overhear a table of DISers lamenting the way things used to be ;))
And, my thought – it just occurred to me, by removing the appetizer and keeping the dessert, Disney aligned the Counter Service and Table Service ‘courses’ to, ideally, reduce confusion. Now, your CS credit includes one entrée or combo meal, one dessert, and one non-alcoholic beverage; your TS credit includes one entrée, one dessert, and one non-alcoholic beverage! By George, I think I’ve got it! :teeth: I’ve solved the mystery of the 2008 DDP!!!!

n2mm
09-04-2007, 09:07 AM
I agree, the new folks won't know any other way. I would've gladly give up the desert at CS too. That is something we never buy. I just can't wait to be the fly on the wall during my January trip to hear responses about the new ddp in 2008, from the guest and the servers. It should be interesting.

Forevryoung
09-04-2007, 09:12 AM
We are going in Jan and I've called Disney Dining a few (ok more than a few :rotfl2: ) times to adjust ADRs.

They always ask if we are on the DDP and I quickly respond "no". And there have been a few CM's who have started to go into why we should or that by making two TS ADRs in the same day has already proven it's value during our trip.

I actually started getting tired of emphasizing that I had priced it out and that the 2008 was NOT a good deal for our trip- that we enjoy appetizers more than dessert and since what we normally eat would not be included, there was little reason to purchase the DDP. It is not "all inclusive" if you are excluding what the customer is going to purchase anyway!

There have been a few CMs who I have found to be very pushy for the DDP.

lilyv
09-04-2007, 09:23 AM
We are going in Jan and I've called Disney Dining a few (ok more than a few :rotfl2: ) times to adjust ADRs.

They always ask if we are on the DDP and I quickly respond "no". And there have been a few CM's who have started to go into why we should or that by making two TS ADRs in the same day has already proven it's value during our trip.

I actually started getting tired of emphasizing that I had priced it out and that the 2008 was NOT a good deal for our trip- that we enjoy appetizers more than dessert and since what we normally eat would not be included, there was little reason to purchase the DDP. It is not "all inclusive" if you are excluding what the customer is going to purchase anyway!

There have been a few CMs who I have found to be very pushy for the DDP.

I'd much rather carefully shop for a fantastic deal on a rental car, and skip DDP. We still eat TS at Disney here and there, but you can't beat going to the grocery store for good wines at a great price, as well as breakfast items. We even eat a dinner or two off site. (Sometimes it's nice to have TS without the concern about ressies...) We have much more flexibility this way, and it suits our style of eating.

kaytieeldr
09-04-2007, 09:30 AM
I agree, the new folks won't know any other way. I would've gladly give up the desert at CS too. That is something we never buy. I just can't wait to be the fly on the wall during my January trip to hear responses about the new ddp in 2008, from the guest and the servers. It should be interesting.
I agree. I can REALLY do fine without dessert. That's where the snack credit comes in handy.

I mean, I'd rather have oh, the heirloom tomato at Artist Point than any one of their excellent desserts. I love the 'real' taste of heirlooms, and without searching hard I can't find them around here. Dessert? Phff. Anywhere. Not to disparage AP - their food is excellent. But dessert in general.

You know, I wonder how many people will pass on dessert even though it's included, because they'll be paying the tip? I mean, if you get a $28 steak at Le Cellier, and the average $12.75 (I think) counter service meal, and figure $3 for a snack, you're already ahead - you only need to tip on the steak and the drink. And a penny saved...

Oh, and if it's not busy? You won't need to be a fly on the wall to hear servers' experiences. Just ask :)

lilyv
09-04-2007, 09:42 AM
I agree. I can REALLY do fine without dessert. That's where the snack credit comes in handy.

I mean, I'd rather have oh, the heirloom tomato at Artist Point than any one of their excellent desserts. I love the 'real' taste of heirlooms, and without searching hard I can't find them around here. Dessert? Phff. Anywhere. Not to disparage AP - their food is excellent. But dessert in general.

You know, I wonder how many people will pass on dessert even though it's included, because they'll be paying the tip? I mean, if you get a $28 steak at Le Cellier, and the average $12.75 (I think) counter service meal, and figure $3 for a snack, you're already ahead - you only need to tip on the steak and the drink. And a penny saved...

Oh, and if it's not busy? You won't need to be a fly on the wall to hear servers' experiences. Just ask :)

Skip dessert??? I would be amazed if patrons did that-after all dessert is part of their "free food" menu plan.
I really hope I'm wrong, but I think unfortunately, that a considerable number of folks who are on DDP will "forget" to tip. Don't know why Disney made this change, because it sure leaves the servers in an awkward position.
Will be interesting to see what happens come Jan 08.

--I love heirloom tomatoes too! I need to look at Artists Point menu!! Sounds like a must do.

kaytieeldr
09-04-2007, 09:49 AM
We are going in Jan and I've called Disney Dining a few (ok more than a few :rotfl2: ) times to adjust ADRs.

They always ask if we are on the DDP and I quickly respond "no". And there have been a few CM's who have started to go into why we should or that by making two TS ADRs in the same day has already proven it's value during our trip.

I actually started getting tired of emphasizing that I had priced it out and that the 2008 was NOT a good deal for our trip- that we enjoy appetizers more than dessert and since what we normally eat would not be included, there was little reason to purchase the DDP. It is not "all inclusive" if you are excluding what the customer is going to purchase anyway!

There have been a few CMs who I have found to be very pushy for the DDP.
I actually started getting tired of emphasizing that I had priced it out and that Repeat after me:
"No, thank you"
or
"Thank you, it does not fit with our plans".
That's it. No reason, no explanation.

kaytieeldr
09-04-2007, 09:56 AM
I'd much rather carefully shop for a fantastic deal on a rental car, and skip DDP. Well! It's too late now, but after reading this I went to Hotwire, went back and forth a couple of times, and now find I could get a compact car (more car than I actually need for one person and two pieces of luggage) for a GRAND total of $119.20. Now, granted, the DDP is included in my package, but if I were paying for it - and I'm planning to book the DxDDP on BounceBack later this month - lilyv is right. That would cost me $224; the rental car would cost me (in a dream world, I know, prices change all the time, this car dropped from $11.95 a day to $9.95 a day in a couple of minutes) a tad over half that. Yes, food would cost me more but I'd have a MUCH wider range of choices, and could finally make it back to Cafe Tu Tu Tango.

lilyv
09-04-2007, 10:12 AM
Well! It's too late now, but after reading this I went to Hotwire, went back and forth a couple of times, and now find I could get a compact car (more car than I actually need for one person and two pieces of luggage) for a GRAND total of $119.20. Now, granted, the DDP is included in my package, but if I were paying for it - and I'm planning to book the DxDDP on BounceBack later this month - lilyv is right. That would cost me $224; the rental car would cost me (in a dream world, I know, prices change all the time, this car dropped from $11.95 a day to $9.95 a day in a couple of minutes) a tad over half that. Yes, food would cost me more but I'd have a MUCH wider range of choices, and could finally make it back to Cafe Tu Tu Tango.

There are some great rental car deals. I try to choose the vendors that are onsite at MCO-quicker to pick up. I googled Cafe Tu Tu Tango-looks like a fantastic place. I've added it to my list of restaurants to try!

kaytieeldr
09-04-2007, 11:38 AM
Oh, PLEASE do! I go alone, so I only order a couple of things, but I try to get something different every time. It's a great place to go with a group - everybody order a dish or two, and you share! OT - there are a couple of tapas places in Las Vegas; my brother's out there, and friends of his will be there the same time I will. I'm hoping we can all coordinate and hit one or the other!

english rose 47
09-04-2007, 07:30 PM
I think the servers are going to bevery sorry abour the change. I think they will loose big time! I also wouldprefer the choice of appie or dessert.At some restaurants I would love the appies as no dessert really appeals and at others the dessert wins. I really hope some restaurants do let you choose.I will pay oop at LeCellier to try the cheese soup!!

bicker
09-05-2007, 04:47 AM
First, while yes, there are a lot of repeat visitors, many of whom have used the DDP in the past and will not purchase it again due to the changes, there are also a LOT of first-time Guests, or even repeat Guests, who will just go with “the package” because it’s easy and it includes ‘everything’.Also, what matters is not whether or not folks patronize the Dining Plan or not, but rather what would they do otherwise. Many of the folks who won't patronize the Dining Plan will instead patronize the restaurants paying OOP and/or using DDE. That's no loss whatsoever for Disney. Even for those who will eat at Disney restaurants less because of the changes to the Dining Plan, their negative impact would have to be greater than the positive impact the changes will have on Disney's bottom-line, and that seems likely. This was really the same scenario as occurred with the Magic Kingdom Club: Disney was basically offering discounts to the people who would visit anyway rather than targeting discounts at those for whom the discounts would make the difference between visiting and not visiting. The MKC is gone, and in its place, for many years now, Disney targets many of its best discounts, not always precisely, but often very adroitly, towards those for whom the discounts will be the factor that seals the purchasing decision.