Hotel Express pass is not what it used to be...

[lookingforward]

We are here at US/IOA for memorial day weekend. I realize that it is a holiday weekend BUT...there seems to be more people WITH the express pass than without. They must be selling more of the passes than I remember. Today, the express line for MUMMY was 45 minutes. Kind of defeats the purpose, in my opinion. I know that the express pass only allows one go around for each ride. Some of the ride personnel were advising hotel guests to come back later in the day after most of the bought passes were used up. EVerything is still much fun but the express option is not what it used to be.:scared1:

[Fan2CSkr]

We are here at US/IOA for memorial day weekend. I realize that it is a holiday weekend BUT...there seems to be more people WITH the express pass than without. They must be selling more of the passes than I remember. Today, the express line for MUMMY was 45 minutes. Kind of defeats the purpose, in my opinion. I know that the express pass only allows one go around for each ride. Some of the ride personnel were advising hotel guests to come back later in the day after most of the bought passes were used up. EVerything is still much fun but the express option is not what it used to be.:scared1:

We just returned Wednesday and I totally agree. I already wrote a letter. More than a few times the express line was longer than the regular line. We actually left the parks to swim at Portofino a couple of times in hopes that the crowds would thin out. Very frustrating.

[tarheelmjfan]

Writing a letter is a good idea. People really need to be giving them feedback. I've noticed a few people saying they had the same experience. I really hope they remedy this ASAP.

[damo]

Maybe they need to start making sure that these express passes are only used once per ride. When we were there, the attendants were not doing this. We only encountered the problem once.

They can probably bump the express pass price if it is getting too popular.

[G8r4evr]

We are here at US/IOA for memorial day weekend. I realize that it is a holiday weekend BUT...there seems to be more people WITH the express pass than without. They must be selling more of the passes than I remember. Today, the express line for MUMMY was 45 minutes. Kind of defeats the purpose, in my opinion. I know that the express pass only allows one go around for each ride. Some of the ride personnel were advising hotel guests to come back later in the day after most of the bought passes were used up. EVerything is still much fun but the express option is not what it used to be.:scared1:

Wow! Definitely sounds like they are overselling them. When we were there for Mothers Day weekend, our longest wait in the Express Line was for The Mummy...and that was like 2 mins. LOL

[Cass]

Wow, this is very disappointing news :(

[t-and-a]

So if the EP lines were that long, I wonder how long the stand-by lines were!

[GemmaPixie]

It must have been disapointing for the people that paid for the express pass aswell. They paid for their hotel and extra to be able to go in the fastpass lane and ended up having to wait a long time..just like you. At least your express pass was free- and you can use it as much as you want. The park must have been chocker-blocked!

[damo]

Or maybe there was a malfunction at Mummy that caused the backup? What were the lines like at the other rides?

We had one crazy day at IOA when we were there but Universal was pretty calm.

[Patita]

that worries me. I have booked RPH only because the express line :sad2:

[BettyCv]

Wow, this is very disappointing news :(

I agree. We leave for our Universal vacation in one week.

Betty

[gschmerl]

Or maybe there was a malfunction at Mummy that caused the backup? What were the lines like at the other rides?

We had one crazy day at IOA when we were there but Universal was pretty calm.

That could be possible. The Mummy is the one ride where my on site express was backed up. It was because of malfunctions on the ride.

[IluvmyRott]

Those who are going to the parks in the next few weeks please keep us informed about this. I would normally never pay $200 a night for a hotel, so if the express line is not being properly handled, I will definitely cancel my reservation! :sad1:

[Mainebound]

Maybe they need to start making sure that these express passes are only used once per ride. When we were there, the attendants were not doing this. We only encountered the problem once.

They can probably bump the express pass price if it is getting too popular.

I agree. Our last two visits, our express passes were not checked/marked except for super popular rides like Mummy and MIB, and then only after the first hour or 2 of park opening.

[yaytezIOA]

I think really they need to stop selling Express......yeah right. But the only way the express will go down if the hotels are fully sold out, as they are this weekend, will be to limit the amount of express sold.

[damo]

What was the price of express passes this weekend?

[Fan2CSkr]

What was the price of express passes this weekend?
One day 2 Park
Between 30.99 and 40.99.

One day 1 Park
Between 25.99 and 35.99

Price em higher and sell less. I wonder what the summer will bring.

[lookingforward]

The mummy was not malfunctioning, it was just super crowded. Many tour groups were here and some of them got the passes automatically as part of their package. It seems to me a bit of overselling. I love Loews hotels so I don't mind spending the extra money but when you stay here you are buying the priviledge of express. It is not 'free' to hotel guests by any means. All three hotels were sold out so I am sure that added to the delays.

It is just not the same as it was, but everything changes. During busy hotel times (when they are charging upwards of 300 per room) they should cut back on overselling the express. There is just so many that the system can handle in such a way that the "perk" remains a perk.

We are still having a great time, despite this issue. The Portofino rocks, by the way. Everything about it has been a pleasure. Had dinner at Nascar and that was great too. Loved their remodel. More soon...

[inkkognito]

They definitely need to start marking those one-use Express Passes. The other day, hubby did a solo trip to USF (I was stuck working) and saw one family get quite belligerent when a Mummy TM marked off their pass. The dad said, "Why are you doing that? NO ONE else has done that all day!" (And mind you, this was after 4 p.m....so goodness only knows how long he had been using it.)

[Lisa P.]

All three hotels were sold out so I am sure that added to the delays.... During busy hotel times (when they are charging upwards of 300 per room) they should cut back on overselling the express. There is just so many that the system can handle in such a way that the "perk" remains a perk.
Makes me wonder what will happen if they actually open the hotel(s) mentioned in the "master plan" posted on another thread. If the Express Passes are a good moneymaker, but something's got to give, what will it be? :confused3

[AlexandNessa]

I agree ... we were there the first week of May, and MIB, Mummy, Jaws, and Hulk all had pretty bad waits in the Express Line. I mentioned this on the chat thread, but express passes were outnumbering hotel keys about 3-to-1. Sometimes I tend over-estimate, but Mike actually thought it was closer to 4 or 5 express passes for every hotel key.


Clearly they are over-selling. At the very least, they have underestimated the demand. Me thinks they need to RAISE their express pass prices significantly to curb demand. They are currently undervalued.


In addition, they need an efficient scanning system to ensure the "1 ride per express ticket" rule.

Fan, who specifically did you write your letter to? Guest relations?

[patster734]

I think it depends on day and time. Jurassic Park had a large Express line on Saturday, May 19, around 2pm. When we went back on it the next day, there was no wait.

[damo]

One day 2 Park
Between 30.99 and 40.99.

One day 1 Park
Between 25.99 and 35.99

Price em higher and sell less. I wonder what the summer will bring.

$25 is too low.

Jurassic Park lines were weird when we were there in February and the lines were really low. Twice when we went, the express line was almost out to the entrance.

[GemmaPixie]

Universal want to make money...the more express passes they sell the more money they make- plain and simple. Sad really...

[tlinus]

they should make less of them available. how many rooms are there total in the three onsite hotels? multiply that by the number of people in each room, that is plenty of express passes....does anyone know how many EP's are available for purchase each day? I would say cut that number in half ESPECIALLY when the onsites are filled to capacity!

we didn't encounter anything like the crowds you all are describing while we were in the parks on 4/26-5/1. The parks themselves were WAY crowded but the express lines were walk ons for the rides. The only day that we had a wait (very short one) was on Saturday.

[damo]

they should make less of them available. how many rooms are there total in the three onsite hotels? multiply that by the number of people in each room, that is plenty of express passes....does anyone know how many EP's are available for purchase each day? I would say cut that number in half ESPECIALLY when the onsites are filled to capacity!

we didn't encounter anything like the crowds you all are describing while we were in the parks on 4/26-5/1. The parks themselves were WAY crowded but the express lines were walk ons for the rides. The only day that we had a wait (very short one) was on Saturday.

Saturday was absolutely insane at IOA with the express line when we were there on 4/29. There was a battle of the bands that day and I am sure every kid had bought express. The express lines were crazy out to the doors on every ride...we headed over to Universal and all was well. I think the passes were really cheap that day since there is a low crowd expectation around then.

I recall the line for Dr. Doom being 90 minutes and Hulk was 2 hours. We could see the tail ends of the express lines when we were looking from the entrance. So not only were the express lines very long but the regular lines were insane as well. Thursday, Friday and Sunday were fine.

[tlinus]

Saturday was absolutely insane at IOA with the express line when we were there on 4/29. There was a battle of the bands that day and I am sure every kid had bought express. The express lines were crazy out to the doors on every ride...we headed over to Universal and all was well. I think the passes were really cheap that day since there is a low crowd expectation around then.

I recall the line for Dr. Doom being 90 minutes and Hulk was 2 hours. We could see the tail ends of the express lines when we were looking from the entrance. So not only were the express lines very long but the regular lines were insane as well. Thursday, Friday and Sunday were fine.

I agree!
The only not fine thing was not finding you AND we were staying at the same hotel!!!! :rotfl2: :rotfl2:
Got to set up a meeting place if it ever happens again!!!:thumbsup2

[AlexandNessa]

$25 is too low.

Jurassic Park lines were weird when we were there in February and the lines were really low. Twice when we went, the express line was almost out to the entrance.

ITA ... cut the # of express passes available in half and double the price. Same amount of $$ for Universal with < passses available.

I forgot how long the express line for JPRA was as well. It wasn't much shorter than the regular line.

[yaytezIOA]

They wont cut the number of passes available. Lets get real. If people are willing to shell out the money for them, and they are, they will still sell as many as they can get away with. The only thing they will do is enforce the one time ride deal. They'll get some complaints, but they'll do it.And what happens if they open those other two hotels? The one is going to have twice the rooms that PFB has. What happens to Express then? Will they make that hotel not eligible for express?

[AlexandNessa]

They wont cut the number of passes available. Lets get real. If people are willing to shell out the money for them, and they are, they will still sell as many as they can get away with. The only thing they will do is enforce the one time ride deal. They'll get some complaints, but they'll do it.And what happens if they open those other two hotels? The one is going to have twice the rooms that PFB has. What happens to Express then? Will they make that hotel not eligible for express?

True, but if they doubled the price, that would certainly curtail the demand. If Universal sells 1000 passes at $25 each or 500 passes at $50 each during a supposedly "slow" season, it's all the same $$ to them, and would certainly help with the express lines. For peak weeks, they should charge a lot more than $50 for express.

I don't even want to think about what the new hotel will do to the Express Lines. Personally, I hope it's a value hotel that's not eligible for Express. Right now, the resort experience/FOTL is the main reason we go to Universal. If the perk of FOTL becomes watered down by Universal overselling express passes (at an undervalued price) and not enforcing the 1x per ride rule, we will find another vacation venue ... which isn't hard for us to do. We would certainly be glad to take our big, bad vacation fund elsewhere. We already have Wait Disney World ... we don't want Unlimited Lines at Universal too.

[Rags]

This will be our first time staying on site an I was really excited about the express pass. Do you think it will be the same Labor day weekend? TIA:goodvibes

[bubba's mom]

True, but if they doubled the price, that would certainly curtail the demand. If Universal sells 1000 passes at $25 each or 500 passes at $50 each during a supposedly "slow" season, it's all the same $$ to them, and would certainly help with the express lines. For peak weeks, they should charge a lot more than $50 for express.

I don't even want to think about what the new hotel will do to the Express Lines. Personally, I hope it's a value hotel that's not eligible for Express. Right now, the resort experience/FOTL is the main reason we go to Universal. If the perk of FOTL becomes watered down by Universal overselling express passes (at an undervalued price) and not enforcing the 1x per ride rule, we will find another vacation venue ... which isn't hard for us to do. We would certainly be glad to take our big, bad vacation fund elsewhere. We already have Wait Disney World ... we don't want Unlimited Lines at Universal too.


exactly.....i totally agree!

i really hope some UO suits are reading this :rolleyes1

[damo]

This will be our first time staying on site an I was really excited about the express pass. Do you think it will be the same Labor day weekend? TIA:goodvibes

Probably not. The school groups wouldn't be there then. I don't think that as many families buy the express pass as would individuals.

[mayerobeyer]

Can anyone tell me what they are expecting the lines to be like this coming Thursday through Sunday (May 31-June 3rd)? We'll be staying onsite just for the express passes (my dad's legs can't take the super long lines). I picked that weekend because I had a feeling the crowds would be super low the weekend after Memorial day.

[damo]

Can anyone tell me what they are expecting the lines to be like this coming Thursday through Sunday (May 31-June 3rd)? We'll be staying onsite just for the express passes (my dad's legs can't take the super long lines). I picked that weekend because I had a feeling the crowds would be super low the weekend after Memorial day.

Lines should be good. Schools are just finishing up so the school groups should be done.

[christophfam]

The ONLY reason we are planning an end of June trip is because of FOTL. I wouldn't be caught dead in FL with the heat and crowds if I didn't think we would have short waits for the rides. I sure hope they get their act together soon or this will be the first and last peak season trip we take. Off season, we always end up at Disney.

[mayerobeyer]

Lines should be good. Schools are just finishing up so the school groups should be done.

Thanks, Damo. :thumbsup2 :thumbsup2

[inkkognito]

I understand their wanting to make money, but in a way the money that they made off Express is offset by what they lose from other disgruntled guests. Take hubby and I, a couple of DINKs with Premier Passes. We always come early and eat an expensive meal on property, and we drop money on games, t-shirts etc. on virtually every visit. FOTL after 4 with Premier is the main draw for us...if they hose the Express Lines, we will stop coming because if we want to wait in forever lines, Disney is a lot closer to our house. So they might make $$ on the Express passes, but that is offset by what they lose by alienating guests like us.

[bubba's mom]

The ONLY reason we are planning an end of June trip is because of FOTL. I wouldn't be caught dead in FL with the heat and crowds if I didn't think we would have short waits for the rides. I sure hope they get their act together soon or this will be the first and last peak season trip we take. Off season, we always end up at Disney.


We are going the last week of June this year...as we did last year. Last year the longest we waited in EP line was maybe 7 minutes..... :thumbsup2

[Rags]

Probably not. The school groups wouldn't be there then. I don't think that as many families buy the express pass as would individuals.

That's fantastic!! Thank you for putting my mind at ease! Even if the parks are crowded there is so much more to do citywalk, visiting other resorts etc. ! I can't wait!!!

[loribell]

Well I will be watching this closely. I will not pay the prices they charge for the onsite hotels if the FOTL perk is not much of a perk. I can stay at a much cheaper hotel and get to the park for opening, ride the rides we want and save a lot of money. FOTL is not free by any means, it is definetly paid for with the room cost.

Keep us posted!

[nymomof3]

what does this mean for all of us visiting in the summer in the extreme heat and humidity..its not fair with the prices of onsite rooms.. do people usually use these up by afternoon..so maybe the more popular rides would be better to ride in the evening when the lines aren't so bad.. which shouldn't be..you should be able to ride at any time of day without those crazy wait times..:mad: :sad2:

[Metro West]

what does this mean for all of us visiting in the summer in the extreme heat and humidity..its not fair with the prices of onsite rooms.. do people usually use these up by afternoon..so maybe the more popular rides would be better to ride in the evening when the lines aren't so bad.. which shouldn't be..you should be able to ride at any time of day without those crazy wait times..:mad: :sad2:Last summer it was busy most of the time..at Disney and Universal. I understand what you're saying about the wait times. I would be upset too if I paid $300 a night for that perk and had to wait a long time to ride. Remember...Universal started this because the free EP was making the lines too long...supposedly and they decided to make some $$$ of the people who really wanted the perk of the Express line. Frankly...if you're staying onsite, go to the parks in the morning and then relax by the pool until evening and go back. You don't want to walk around ANY park with the crowds, heat and humidity.

[tarheelmjfan]

what does this mean for all of us visiting in the summer in the extreme heat and humidity..its not fair with the prices of onsite rooms.. do people usually use these up by afternoon..so maybe the more popular rides would be better to ride in the evening when the lines aren't so bad.. which shouldn't be..you should be able to ride at any time of day without those crazy wait times..:mad: :sad2:


We live less than 1 1/2 hrs. from UO, but still stay on property 4 or 5 nights in July. We have had great experiences with the EP line. Getting up & going early doesn't work for us, so we never get to the parks early. My DH & I usually enjoy a relaxing breakfast, while our DS sleeps in. We usually get to the parks around 11 am, & always leave in plenty of time to dress for dinner. Hopefully, the lines this summer won't be any different. The recent reports do have me a bit concerned though. I guess we'll have to wait to see.

[damo]

Was there a problem at Easter? I would imagine that the crowds then would be similar to summer crowds and the express pass would be priced similarly.

[lindalinda]

Was there a problem at Easter? I would imagine that the crowds then would be similar to summer crowds and the express pass would be priced similarly.

The first night we were there the mummy line was 30 mins with express. That was a saturday night during Mardi Gras tho. (and it was Daughtry) The rest of the week there were no problems, lines were maybe 10 mins (express).

[nymomof3]

what will the ep prices be in july...maybe they'll raise those so not as many people will buy...hopeful thinking....

[bubba's mom]

what will the ep prices be in july...maybe they'll raise those so not as many people will buy...hopeful thinking....

Peak season they are more expensive. Check here: http://secure.universalstudios.com/webstore/shop/ticket-selection.aspx?Merchant=UOMainOnline&SalesCategoryGroup=UOMain&SalesCategory=UO2ParkUEPLive make sure to scroll down the page to find the price for your dates.....(will give you a better idea!)

[rie'smom]

The lines at WDW were insane last week. It was because of the millions of school kids. There must have been 50 groups. I'm hoping that Universal will have shorter lines Thurs.,Fri., and Sat. because that's when we're going!
I'm trying to convert my DB and his family to the good side :).

[bubba's mom]

The lines at WDW were insane last week. It was because of the millions of school kids. There must have been 50 groups. I'm hoping that Universal will have shorter lines Thurs.,Fri., and Sat. because that's when we're going!
I'm trying to convert my DB and his family to the good side :).

*ahem* the darkside ;)

[rie'smom]

*ahem* the darkside ;)

I know:lmao: . I just can't bring myself to think of Universal as the darkside!:thumbsup2

[robvia]

Lines will always be long during peak times of the day, especially between 11am - 4pm. In the past, Hulk would have a 20 minute wait for the express line around noon. The line goes down the stairs, same thing with The Mummy. If you walk up and the line is at the bottom of the stairs, that's about 20 minutes. If you haven't made it to the stairs yet, turn around and go somewhere else. That's why I tell everyone to leave between 11am - 4pm and go rest at your hotel. It's usually burning hot out, walk ways packed, long lines for everything.

The answer is to install more thrill rides to handle the crowds. Everyone goes to the newest, most thrilling ride. Sure, parents take children to the kiddie stuff, but I'm talking in general.

I don't hear people talking about Earth Quake that much. I haven't read, "Wow, we went to USF, rode Earth Quake and it was soooo coool." Yet I hear people talking about Hulk, and The Mummy all the time.

Lets hope that new HP lands comes thru.

[lookingforward]

As much as the long lines for express bugged me I can still honestly say we had a fantastic time. We go to US/IOA a few times a year so we did not feel compelled to stick it out in the parks all day. I enjoy the entire "feel" of the hotels. restuarants, parks, etc. and we absolutely LOVED the Portofino hotel. It is now our official favorite. Everyone and everything about the hotel was great, I just can't say enough nice things about it.

The "express mess" does need to be fixed if they plan on keeping their very expensive hotels full, but these wonderful places are still a bit less expensive than Disney deluxe and much, much nicer in my opinion (except perhaps for the AKL concierge floor :)

I will post a trip report later, but we are already planning another trip in July. I can't wait.

[ChisJo]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought there already was a restriction on the amount of EP they could sell in a day....has this changed??? I also thought there were black out dates - when did they start having unlimited sales of EP passes??

[Mainebound]

I know:lmao: . I just can't bring myself to think of Universal as the darkside!:thumbsup2

Hey, we've got a tough guy image to protect over here! ;) :rotfl2:

[damo]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought there already was a restriction on the amount of EP they could sell in a day....has this changed??? I also thought there were black out dates - when did they start having unlimited sales of EP passes??

We don't actually know if they have unlimited sales or not.

[bubba's mom]

i remember someone posting the "school groups" got them with their tickets....so, maybe that was in addition to the amount they normally would sell?? :confused3

[phamton]

Yes, they do have a limit on the amount of express they sell. It's been sold out several times in the last couple of weeks. On holidays like the 4th of July, they are usually sold out before noon. Many HHNs sell out of express.

[loribell]

I don't hear people talking about Earth Quake that much. I haven't read, "Wow, we went to USF, rode Earth Quake and it was soooo coool." Yet I hear people talking about Hulk, and The Mummy all the time.

Lets hope that new HP lands comes thru.

I actually really like Earth Quake. We ride it on every trip. BTTF though I had stopped riding because it had gotten way to rough for us to ride. I love the classic rides. Wish they would have just done a refurb on it to take out the roughness. Also really miss Kong, to bad they couldn't have left it and added the Mummy ride instead of removing something else. Or they could have even gotten rid of Twister. Do not care for it at all. Maybe because I live in tornado alley and have seen much worse damage right here at home. Don't need to see it as an attraction at an amusement park!



The "express mess" does need to be fixed if they plan on keeping their very expensive hotels full, but these wonderful places are still a bit less expensive than Disney deluxe and much, much nicer in my opinion (except perhaps for the AKL concierge floor :)


While I love the Universal parks and hotels just as much as I do the Disney ones I have to disagree with this statement. I know that I can always get the AKL & WL for less than the Universal hotels & very often the Contemporary. Now the Poly & GF are more expensive but not all the Disney deluxes are. Also for our trip in July I can get in to SSR or OKW or the Epcot resorts for less than I have been quoted for any of the Universal hotels. Just an FYI.

[XAVIER]

Whatever happened to the "maximum 15 minute wait" for onsite guests?
And can the people get their money back if the Express line is as long as the regular lines? Is there any sort of guarantee printed on the express tickets?

[mtry]

I thought that for the express pass you got on one time per ride only. We were there middle of March and I only saw 1 time somebody get there express pass marked so they couldn't return on that ride in the express line. We were there 3 days.

[lookingforward]

I actually really like Earth Quake. We ride it on every trip. BTTF though I had stopped riding because it had gotten way to rough for us to ride. I love the classic rides. Wish they would have just done a refurb on it to take out the roughness. Also really miss Kong, to bad they couldn't have left it and added the Mummy ride instead of removing something else. Or they could have even gotten rid of Twister. Do not care for it at all. Maybe because I live in tornado alley and have seen much worse damage right here at home. Don't need to see it as an attraction at an amusement park!




While I love the Universal parks and hotels just as much as I do the Disney ones I have to disagree with this statement. I know that I can always get the AKL & WL for less than the Universal hotels & very often the Contemporary. Now the Poly & GF are more expensive but not all the Disney deluxes are. Also for our trip in July I can get in to SSR or OKW or the Epcot resorts for less than I have been quoted for any of the Universal hotels. Just an FYI.

I wish I could get better rates at Disney. Usually with passholder and florida resident rates US/IOA wins out in the price catagory. OKW is a moderate although I have never tried SSR. In the club/concierge catagory US/IOA almost always is much cheaper. For instance, 305 for club floor at RPR and upwards of 475 for AKL concierge level (our absolute favorite :) The rooms are comparable between AKL and RPR (smaller). Portofino compares more to Grand Floridian or Poly in size..and sometimes Portofino is a better deal than HRH. This weekend I stayed at Portofino for 224 per night for a deluxe room. I do think there are more across the board discounts at US/IOA. NOW...in December I scored the Poly concierge garden view for 270 per night on a 40% off code :cool1:

[PlutoLuvr]

While I love the Universal parks and hotels just as much as I do the Disney ones I have to disagree with this statement. I know that I can always get the AKL & WL for less than the Universal hotels & very often the Contemporary. Now the Poly & GF are more expensive but not all the Disney deluxes are. Also for our trip in July I can get in to SSR or OKW or the Epcot resorts for less than I have been quoted for any of the Universal hotels. Just an FYI.

WDW discounts totally depends on where you live. I had a very interesting discussion with a CM a couple months ago when I was trying to decide between AKL and HRH.

We're in FL, APH'ers to both WDW and USO, have stayed at both too many times to count. The last few times I've tried to book a room -- any room -- over at WDW, the best discount I could get is 10 percent off. Even three months ago trying to get AKL, with FL resident discount (was not an APH'er at that time), the best they could do for their cheapest room was $260 a night. Compare that with the HRH who was offering me a $330 room for $129 a night for being a FL resident.

The CM said that WDW is offering very steep discounts right now specifically to the midwest and northeast. Now, three years ago, WDW was giving FL residents $200 per night rooms for $80. I asked about these 40 percent off PIN codes I've been reading about, and she said FL residents and APH'ers were not targeted with that promotion.

I want to stress the CM was extremely nice about this. She even added that employees of Disney as of late are in the same boat as FL residents and APH'ers. They know they've got our business.

So it really isn't black and white. WDW offers different markets different promotions at different times. You might have been able to secure a great rate at AKL, but someone calling at the same time as you may not be offered the same discounted rate on a room.

BTW, I love Earthquake, too :goodvibes

[ReallyFunMom]

Its still very handy to stay onsite but if you can get there early, you don't need it. It mostly seemed, if it was early, we walked on with the regular guest b/c there wasn't a line and later the express was too long to mess with. (Since we are close enough to have been a few times and can arrive at opening we are not use to waiting, spoiled.) I really built up Express to the kids based on previous stays but it didn't work like I'd expected. We didn't arrive at opening BECAUSE we had express, breakfast at Kitchen, wanted to be more laid back this trip so arrived at Universal 9:30 on Sunday. Neutron seemed hectic with express spilling out longer than the queue, we thought maybe the ride wasn't working so we left to walk on Jaws with regular line. MIB was fine for a couple rides after, it was still early, Express still working. Woody woodpecker had a shorter regular line than Express and the TMs said they were short staffed (Mem weekend!) so weren't really working it (no one to say "how many?") The regular line came from one end and Express the other but no one told you when to go so it was awkward about how to merge in, backed up the Express line so it hardly moved. Really needed a worker to hold back regular line and run one train regular, one express, or some sort of plan. There were 3 TMs talking to themselves but not the guests. Maybe they were burnt out and its a holiday weekend but I remember 2 TMs a few years ago running this coaster more efficiently and friendly. We tried to hit Neutron around 12:30 on our way out of Universal, short day, but it was over 30 min wait while regular line was an hour. I'm sure Express still helps ALOT but it definately is not what it use to be. IMHO.

[robvia]

Well of coarse everyone likes EarthQuake. Talk about taking out any ride and people will come out of the wood work saying they'll miss it. The parks can't keep every ride because the maintenance costs are too high.

Even Disney can't keep every ride, they're constantly updating. Do I miss "If You Had Wings" from 20 years ago when it was sponsored by Eastern? You bet, but they moved on to Buzz. Heck, I've even searched web sites that have a POV just so I could relive it and hear the song. I don't have the link off the top of my head, but if you search it's out there.

Some rides have longer lines than others, and it's usually the thrill rides. The other stuff adds to the experience, but at most parks, the newest, most thrilling ride has the longest line.

Getting back to the topic, I think Universal oversells the amount of express passes. At HHN last year, the lines were huge, and now we've got these reports saying lines are long. Can it be proven? Not directly, but when people complain about long lines, that's enough proof right there. Will they cut back? Maybe a little. I just wish they'd use that money to build a new thrill ride, instead of giving it to CEOs so they can have more vacation homes. Universal is making more money, even with less people attending. If they're going to add more hotels, and allow more people in the park, they need updated thrill rides to handle the large crowds.

[AlexandNessa]

I will be interested to hear from those who go during the peak of summer, especially 4th of July week. So please report back!

Also, please take note of how many express passes v. hotel keys you notice and report back on that too.

Boy, I'm demanding this morning. :goodvibes

TIA!

[damo]

Whatever happened to the "maximum 15 minute wait" for onsite guests?
And can the people get their money back if the Express line is as long as the regular lines? Is there any sort of guarantee printed on the express tickets?

I don't think there can be a guarantee. If rides break down, nobody can guarantee a short express line. I don't even think that they advertise a time anymore.

[loribell]

OKW is a moderate although I have never tried SSR. In the club/concierge catagory US/IOA almost always is much cheaper.

OKW isn't a moderate resort. It is a DVC resort. Most rooms have full kitchens in them as well as a laundry room & the rooms are huge. While the studios don't have that they do have ktichenettes. Although it is my least favorite of the DVC resorts I could never compare it to a moderate.

WDW discounts totally depends on where you live. I had a very interesting discussion with a CM a couple months ago when I was trying to decide between AKL and HRH.

We're in FL, APH'ers to both WDW and USO, have stayed at both too many times to count. The last few times I've tried to book a room -- any room -- over at WDW, the best discount I could get is 10 percent off. Even three months ago trying to get AKL, with FL resident discount (was not an APH'er at that time), the best they could do for their cheapest room was $260 a night. Compare that with the HRH who was offering me a $330 room for $129 a night for being a FL resident.

The CM said that WDW is offering very steep discounts right now specifically to the midwest and northeast. Now, three years ago, WDW was giving FL residents $200 per night rooms for $80. I asked about these 40 percent off PIN codes I've been reading about, and she said FL residents and APH'ers were not targeted with that promotion.

I want to stress the CM was extremely nice about this. She even added that employees of Disney as of late are in the same boat as FL residents and APH'ers. They know they've got our business.

So it really isn't black and white. WDW offers different markets different promotions at different times. You might have been able to secure a great rate at AKL, but someone calling at the same time as you may not be offered the same discounted rate on a room.

BTW, I love Earthquake, too :goodvibes


You know I never really thought about that. We always go in the summer so I always see better rates at the Disney resorts then I do at the Universal resorts. The best I have seen for the RPR is $239 per night.

By the way, I pulled up a trip plan from 2003 last weekend and we paid $85/night @ Coronado Springs & $169/night @ HRH. I am not comparing the resorts just wishing I could get those kind of rates again.;)


Anyway, to get back on topic, I insist on staying at one of the Universal resorts because of the FOTL perk. If I have to be at the park at opening to enjoy the benefits, when the lines are short anyway, then what is the point. I can stay at a cheap offsit hotel & be at the park for opening & still experience the short lines. Why spend the extra money for the hotel? I would rather spend it on food or souvy's.

[MWS94Rock]

I experienced the same problem on one day I was there. I went to the parks on a thursday, friday, and saturday (the week before Memorial Day) and Saturday was horrible. Express Pass lines were long considering the past two days we were there they were almost non existent. I dunno if they sell to many Express Passes or people just jump into the express line halfway through in some of the rides.

E.T. ride was downright horrible with the express pass line. It took us almost 25 minutes to get on the ride after getting our Interplanetary passes (btw, E.T. did say our names).

Dueling Dragons was also pretty bad in that people with express pass can't get in the line before you choose what dragon you want. Those regular lines people won't let you in. After a minute I had to force my way into that line.

[Nicole786]

Now i'm nervous for our upcoming trip. We'll be there Sun-Tues, Labor day weekend (tuesday being our travel day to Disney) and i figured we'd be "okay" with the express passes. I knew we'd have to wait, but i figured at the most 30 minutes, now im concerned :(

[patster734]

Jurassic Park express line on Saturday, May 19:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/patster734/Universal%20trip%20-%20May%202007/Universal038.jpg

Then next day on Sunday, May 20:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/patster734/Universal%20trip%20-%20May%202007/Universal064-2.jpg

[JMCDAD]

I too am getting nervous for our first trip this July
I keep talking up the FOTL to the wife an kiddies

:surfweb: popcorn::

[Mainebound]

By the way, I pulled up a trip plan from 2003 last weekend and we paid $85/night @ Coronado Springs & $169/night @ HRH. I am not comparing the resorts just wishing I could get those kind of rates again.;)



We stayed at HRH in 2004 for $160 a night too, and the reason we have not been back is because it cost twice that now in peak season.

But there are a lot of other advantages to onsite, particularly the close proximity to the parks. We plan on 3 nights at HRH in March 08, even if I have to sell one of my children to do it (kidding!).

[MWS94Rock]

if I had a trip coming up, I would ride all that I could in the first 4 hours, leave and go back to the hotel and relax. In the evening, come back and ride anything else you want to. I guess a basic plan would be get there at 830, leave at 1 and come back around 6 (assuming the park stays open until 9).

[nymomof3]

i dont get it..looking at the prices and the dates for july u would think they would charge more for the ep on 4th of july but instead it is cheaper than regular days,:confused3 i would think more people go on 4th of july so they would raise the price..go figure... i am so NERVOUS for our july trip..we loved fotl when we went last and im so upset that this is not what it use to be...:sad2:

[tarheelmjfan]

Anyway, to get back on topic, I insist on staying at one of the Universal resorts because of the FOTL perk. If I have to be at the park at opening to enjoy the benefits, when the lines are short anyway, then what is the point.

I agree! The great thing about staying onsite & getting FOTL for us is the fact that we don't have to rush to the parks in the morning, & we can leave in plenty of time to relax then dress for dinner. Our normal touring time is midday. So far, it has been a problem. Let's hope that continues. It seems that every spring there's a discussion about FOTL. It's been rumored in the past that it will discontinued for onsite guests, it will be suspended for purchase, etc. UO always steps up & does the right thing. People should continue to provide them with feedback on recent experiences, so they know your feelings from an onsite guest POV.


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/patster734/Universal%20trip%20-%20May%202007/Universal064-2.jpg

This is what we're used to seeing mid-July. I don't remember the last time we waited more than 5 minutes for JP.

[damo]

So, it sounds like it is the school groups that are causing the express line issues.

[tarheelmjfan]

The long line was on a Saturday. Do any of the school groups go on Saturdays? My son's school occasionally goes to the Orlando parks, but always on a week day.

[patster734]

The long line was on a Saturday. Do any of the school groups go on Saturdays? My son's school occasionally goes to the Orlando parks, but always on a week day.

We saw school groups on Saturday. They were wearing identical shirts. I was wondering if the local annual passholders, who were attending the park that Saturday, were the ones buying express passes when they saw the school groups.

Edited to add that we didn't see any school groups in the express lines, but then we had other plans that day and only did Spiderman and Jurassic Park River Adventure before leaving.

[tarheelmjfan]

Interesting..... It seems odd to have a field trip on a non school day to me, but whatever works for the school I guess. The fact that they can be there on a Saturday as well as weekdays is definitely good to know.

[patster734]

Interesting..... It seems odd to have a field trip on a non school day to me, but whatever works for the school I guess. The fact that they can be there on a Saturday as well as weekdays is definitely good to know.

I agree. When I was in school, I'd have nothing to do with it on the weekends, but then we didn't have field trips to Universal!

[damo]

The thing is, they are coming from out of town. It is a school trip, so they usually go back home on Sunday. When we were there the end of April, Saturday was absolutely swarming with school groups. Friday wasn't too bad (they were probably somewhere else) and Sunday was glorious.

[lookingforward]

OKW isn't a moderate resort. It is a DVC resort. Most rooms have full kitchens in them as well as a laundry room & the rooms are huge. While the studios don't have that they do have ktichenettes. Although it is my least favorite of the DVC resorts I could never compare it to a moderate.




You know I never really thought about that. We always go in the summer so I always see better rates at the Disney resorts then I do at the Universal resorts. The best I have seen for the RPR is $239 per night.

By the way, I pulled up a trip plan from 2003 last weekend and we paid $85/night @ Coronado Springs & $169/night @ HRH. I am not comparing the resorts just wishing I could get those kind of rates again.;)


Anyway, to get back on topic, I insist on staying at one of the Universal resorts because of the FOTL perk. If I have to be at the park at opening to enjoy the benefits, when the lines are short anyway, then what is the point. I can stay at a cheap offsit hotel & be at the park for opening & still experience the short lines. Why spend the extra money for the hotel? I would rather spend it on food or souvy's.


My mistake, I thought you were talking about Port Orleans for some reason.:lmao: Oh well, good prices are to be had all the way around if you get the right time of year and the right code. I got the 40% off pin and I live in Florida. To be honest, I love the Loews product much more than Disney's hotels, but will continue to stay at both...whichever is the best fit and buy at the time. Poly and Port Riverside are my next WDW trips and we are headed to the Portofino again in July. The only perk to living so close is you can zip up for a long weekend whenever the prices are good.:thumbsup2

[tarheelmjfan]

The thing is, they are coming from out of town. It is a school trip, so they usually go back home on Sunday. When we were there the end of April, Saturday was absolutely swarming with school groups. Friday wasn't too bad (they were probably somewhere else) and Sunday was glorious.


That makes sense. I was looking at it from the POV of my son's school going there. They go weekdays, but they're able to drive over & back the same day.

[ChisJo]

truth be told, I too am getting nervous about our trip in early December....We booked a night at HRH, despite the fact that we already have a condo booked for that night too. We wanted to take in the FOTL perks and hotel in such close proximity, since we are going to be there on the weekend. If the FOTL is going to be utilized by more people than the regular lines, why would I waste the money on the hotel?? I hope this is resolved....I would hate to be disappointed at USO/IOA.

[GrumpyFamilyof5]

So in everyone's opinion which day of the week is the slowest or is there really no slow day in summer. We're going July 1-4 which starts on a Sunday?? I'm thinking of staying on site, but what I'm reading here is starting to scare me...even though we're getting the military rate it is still higher then what we're used to at a hotel, is it even going to be worth it??:confused3 :confused:

[patster734]

So in everyone's opinion which day of the week is the slowest or is there really no slow day in summer. We're going July 1-4 which starts on a Sunday?? I'm thinking of staying on site, but what I'm reading here is starting to scare me...even though we're getting the military rate it is still higher then what we're used to at a hotel, is it even going to be worth it??:confused3 :confused:

So far, the only day of the week that's been bad for express is Saturday. I'd also like to add that even on Saturdays, the express line will be much quicker than the regular line. So for those of you staying on-property for upcoming trips, "Don't worry, Be Happy!"

[damo]

So far, the only day of the week that's been bad for express is Saturday. I'd also like to add that even on Saturdays, the express line will be much quicker than the regular line. So for those of you staying on-property for upcoming trips, "Don't worry, Be Happy!"

I agree.

[loribell]

But I am going to be there Friday, Saturday & Sunday!:sad2: :sad1:

[robvia]

That's why I tell people to go early, even if you have FOTL. The walkways are less crowded, and you can get front seat rides on the coasters.

There's another group of people who like to sleep in and take their time waking up. That's fine, but I wouldn't go to the park at 11am. If you're not going to wake up early, then you midas well make it a pool day, then go to the park around 4pm as the tired are leaving.

[phamton]

If the FOTL is going to be utilized by more people than the regular lines, why would I waste the money on the hotel?? I hope this is resolved....I would hate to be disappointed at USO/IOA.

If the express line is busy I can assure you that the regular line will be extremely long. The first week in December is not going to be near as crowded as July. I have never read any complaints about FOTL in the first part of December.

We're going July 1-4 which starts on a Sunday?? I'm thinking of staying on site, but what I'm reading here is starting to scare me...even though we're getting the military rate it is still higher then what we're used to at a hotel, is it even going to be worth it??:confused3 :confused:

The 4th of July weekend is one of the busiests times for all the themeparks. Even if the FOTL line wait is longer than usual, the standby line will most likely be 60-90 minutes long. You are going at a peak time so expect peak crowds.

[bubba's mom]

The 4th of July weekend is one of the busiests times for all the themeparks. Even if the FOTL line wait is longer than usual, the standby line will most likely be 60-90 minutes long. You are going at a peak time so expect peak crowds.

been there at that time last year and again this year. it was more crowded on the weekend, but still, never waited over 15 min. for EP line..... (probably didn't wait more than 10, but phamton is right...if the Ep lines are long, the standby's are longer...... we go 6/26- 7/1 and i'm not worried at all! ;)

[chobie]

Just got back. We spent Friday and Saturday at Universal and Sunday and Monday at Disney. We had no waits wtih our hotel keys, except for Saturday afternoon for Dueling Dragons we waited about 20 minuts but part of that was form them adding another train. We went back that evening about 7pm and got right on.

[Claymax]

truth be told, I too am getting nervous about our trip in early December....We booked a night at HRH, despite the fact that we already have a condo booked for that night too. We wanted to take in the FOTL perks and hotel in such close proximity, since we are going to be there on the weekend. If the FOTL is going to be utilized by more people than the regular lines, why would I waste the money on the hotel?? I hope this is resolved....I would hate to be disappointed at USO/IOA.

Don't worry any more, really.

We went to HRH last December and stayed Wed 13th and Thurs 14th and it was almost embarrassing to use the FOTL. We rode Mummy until we were silly from it, about 10 times in a row. Regular lines weren't bad but we still lapped some people. It was a walk on for us.

The only ride we waited was Fire/Ice and that's just because they filter you back into the line with everyone else so if it get crowded, everyone waits. Hulk had maybe 2 trains pass before you got on. You have to jump right up though as the regular passengers won't stand there and wait for the FOTL folks to make a move.

No worries at all in December. I'll be back at HRH this year Dec 5th and 6th.

[Lewisc]

Universal gives the time share hawkers express passes to use for promotions. I understand there is no limit to the number of the number of express passes that can get issued to those guests willing to "participate in an informative......."

I understand Mummy uses one loading area for Express Pass and one loading area for "regular" guests. I think that's fair but it basically limits express pass guests to half the capacity of the ride.

[dpayne1969]

Hello,
we were there from May 23-29 & I can say it was awful with not the fact of them over selling express passes but the "line cutters"! We were in line for jurassic park & a group of about 10 teenagers jumped the rope from the regular line & cut us in the express line.They did this all week long,very frustrating for my kids. The teenagers would get in the regular lines then halfway through they were jumping the ropes & getting in express lines. The problem there was the attendants were checking passes on entrance but once you boarded the ride they were not double checking your passes so the teens would call all their friends on their cells & laugh saying "hey,they aint checking passes dude" so by the end of the day you had these groups of teens going from ride to ride jumping ropes to get on. Did I complain yes I did all we got were excuses saying "we are under staffed right now"! This was our 3rd visit to the parks & I can say it is not like it used to be.When we first came in 2004 they checked our passes each time we went on,now its just "go,go,go".So that is our experience from this past week.

[nymomof3]

we'll be there in july and i know for a fact my husband will go crazy if teenagers are jumping the lines..he will definetely say something to them and then try to get them kicked out.. i just hope he keeps his cool and doesn't go off. they should have some attendants in between the lines if this is a occuring problem.is this something that happens often???????????

[MSUBB1]

We were at the parks May 3, 4, 5 and the crowds were noticibly larger on Friday the 4th (with school groups) and also on Saturday the 5th. We walked on to every ride on the 3rd, but had minor waits (15 or less) the other days. We did notice, thankfully, that they were checking passes at a couple of different places on the most popular rides, but they were't always marking off the express passes.

We have decided to plan around the weekends in general next time, and try to go Monday - Thursday.

[sr6888]

We were there May 25th thru the 31st and never had any of the problems mentioned in this thread. Almost every busy ride we went on they double checked the express lanes and our longest wait was 30mins for Hulk (our fault, we went at noon on Saturday!!!). The next longest wait was 15 min for Spiderman just before we did Hulk. We went to IOA on Saturday and to the Studios on Monday. I would guess our average wait those two days was no longer than 10 minutes. I kept thinking to myself that I would never go at a busy time without staying onsite since the regular lines for most rides was a minimum wait of 45 minutes.

[lookingforward]

We were there May 25th thru the 31st and never had any of the problems mentioned in this thread. Almost every busy ride we went on they double checked the express lanes and our longest wait was 30mins for Hulk (our fault, we went at noon on Saturday!!!). The next longest wait was 15 min for Spiderman just before we did Hulk. We went to IOA on Saturday and to the Studios on Monday. I would guess our average wait those two days was no longer than 10 minutes. I kept thinking to myself that I would never go at a busy time without staying onsite since the regular lines for most rides was a minimum wait of 45 minutes.


I love US/IOA and will continue to go there frequently. That said, 30 minutes for express is still quite a wait. My main contention is that it is not what it was a few years ago when we started going to the parks. MANY more people now have express access. Yes, during non-busy times there is no problem. Even 30 minutes is better than the regular line at 90 minutes...BUT it is still not what it used to be, in my opinion. The lines this weekend definately went down in the evening and the parks were open until 9 p.m so that did provide relief. We were at US on Saturday and it was mobbed. Express worked okay on Jaws, MIB (about 15 to 20 minutes) but Mummy was well over one hour on express. One positive was the Horror Make-up show. The line was HUGE and they let all express pass people in first. That group filled up 3/4 of the theater.

[BettyCv]

sr6888,

That is encouraging news. After reading the discussions on this board about passes not being checked and/or marked off, I sent an e-mail to guest services. Here is their response: (Does anyone know what they mean by "balancing both queues?")

"Thank you for contacting Universal Orlando®. As a guest of one of our three on-site hotels, you will enjoy free and unlimited Universal Express ride access to the rides and attractions just by presenting your hotel room key card. This does not provide front of the line access but, rather, use of the express queues with a shortened wait time. Please be assured that our attractions attendants have been trained to balance both queues. That means that, whether a guest uses express or not, we are going to make sure our queue experience as entertaining and fast-moving as possible. I understand your concern, however, and have forwarded your comments to the Attractions Management Team for their review.

Again, thank you for contacting us. We look forward to your visit."

Our IOA/USO vacation starts tomorrow. I will let everyone know how it goes!

Betty

[damo]

sr6888,

That is encouraging news. After reading the discussions on this board about passes not being checked and/or marked off, I sent an e-mail to guest services. Here is their response: (Does anyone know what they mean by "balancing both queues?")

"Thank you for contacting Universal Orlando®. As a guest of one of our three on-site hotels, you will enjoy free and unlimited Universal Express ride access to the rides and attractions just by presenting your hotel room key card. This does not provide front of the line access but, rather, use of the express queues with a shortened wait time. Please be assured that our attractions attendants have been trained to balance both queues. That means that, whether a guest uses express or not, we are going to make sure our queue experience as entertaining and fast-moving as possible. I understand your concern, however, and have forwarded your comments to the Attractions Management Team for their review.

Again, thank you for contacting us. We look forward to your visit."

Our IOA/USO vacation starts tomorrow. I will let everyone know how it goes!

Betty

They mean the regular line and the express line and how they keep both moving. Hopefully, they've received enough complaints lately that they are starting to crack down.

[lookingforward]

sr6888,

That is encouraging news. After reading the discussions on this board about passes not being checked and/or marked off, I sent an e-mail to guest services. Here is their response: (Does anyone know what they mean by "balancing both queues?")

"Thank you for contacting Universal Orlando®. As a guest of one of our three on-site hotels, you will enjoy free and unlimited Universal Express ride access to the rides and attractions just by presenting your hotel room key card. This does not provide front of the line access but, rather, use of the express queues with a shortened wait time. Please be assured that our attractions attendants have been trained to balance both queues. That means that, whether a guest uses express or not, we are going to make sure our queue experience as entertaining and fast-moving as possible. I understand your concern, however, and have forwarded your comments to the Attractions Management Team for their review.

Again, thank you for contacting us. We look forward to your visit."

Our IOA/USO vacation starts tomorrow. I will let everyone know how it goes!

Betty

Betty, great idea to email them! I will too.:thumbsup2

[tndisneyfan]

that worries me. I have booked RPH only because the express line :sad2:

It worries me too. We are leaving tonight for HRH, the only reason we are staying there is the express pass

[Timmy Boy]

Being a Team Member, I sometimes too have to balance the queues. It is really tough to pull full loads of regular line, then stop, look for express, fill another load with express, as the guests stare right at you. In my mind they're thinking "wow that's totally not fair."

I'm really into guest service, but if someone is cheating the system, then it's absolutely no. Also, when marking express, I do get a lot of "what?! they didn't tell us it's only once each attraction!!" I tell them that it is only once each attraction, and I point it out on the ticket where it says that. I tell them if they would like to talk Guest Services, they may.

Also, if the pass sellers are not telling them that it's once per attraction, then it is ENTIRELY Universal's fault. But sometimes I think that the guest is trying to scam the system and such. I've heard it all. From "we lost our express passes" to "they got really wet" (which sometimes I make them fish it out, and try to read them) to "can we go express, please? please?!? pleassseeee?!?!?!" :sad2:

[lookingforward]

Being a Team Member, I sometimes too have to balance the queues. It is really tough to pull full loads of regular line, then stop, look for express, fill another load with express, as the guests stare right at you. In my mind they're thinking "wow that's totally not fair."

I'm really into guest service, but if someone is cheating the system, then it's absolutely no. Also, when marking express, I do get a lot of "what?! they didn't tell us it's only once each attraction!!" I tell them that it is only once each attraction, and I point it out on the ticket where it says that. I tell them if they would like to talk Guest Services, they may.

Also, if the pass sellers are not telling them that it's once per attraction, then it is ENTIRELY Universal's fault. But sometimes I think that the guest is trying to scam the system and such. I've heard it all. From "we lost our express passes" to "they got really wet" (which sometimes I make them fish it out, and try to read them) to "can we go express, please? please?!? pleassseeee?!?!?!" :sad2:

I know that your job must be difficult! I do want to say that every US/IOA employee has been really nice under intense pressures, crowds, etc. Thanks!!:thumbsup2

[damo]

Universal gives the time share hawkers express passes to use for promotions. I understand there is no limit to the number of the number of express passes that can get issued to those guests willing to "participate in an informative......."

I understand Mummy uses one loading area for Express Pass and one loading area for "regular" guests. I think that's fair but it basically limits express pass guests to half the capacity of the ride.


That would only be true if they load them both equally. They can do three loads from regular, and one from express, etc.

[dpayne1969]

Just a follow up for me: Guest services called me back today & apologized for our inconvenience.I just want to let those who are going that this was our
3rd trip to Univesal & this was the first time we experienced something like this.The problem was the attendants were not checking the passes when boarding the rides.The rides have signs clearly posted to have your express pass out & ready to show ,so the attendants are supposed to be checking but I guess they were busy & I understand that but it did cause a back up ,not to mention my kids being frustrated.We love Universal & I am sure they will be taking care of this problem.Universal is great so all of you leaving soon dont worry I am confident guest services will crack down on this & if not please dont hesitate to file a complaint.Like the lady told me "we dont know of problems unless the public reports them to us".So rest assured we will go back to Universal again & again.I can also say that the rides where they were checking passes twice we were on & off in like 10 minutes.My son rode hulk 6 times in a row in about a 30 minute time period & the wait time for the regular line was at 45 minutes.So this gives you an idea of how fast pass should be when it is done right.Thanks for listening & have a great time everyone going especially you first timers.
UNIVERSAL ROCKS:cool1:

[bubba's mom]

Just a follow up for me: Guest services called me back today & apologized for our inconvenience.I just want to let those who are going that this was our
3rd trip to Univesal & this was the first time we experienced something like this.The problem was the attendants were not checking the passes when boarding the rides.The rides have signs clearly posted to have your express pass out & ready to show ,so the attendants are supposed to be checking but I guess they were busy & I understand that but it did cause a back up ,not to mention my kids being frustrated.We love Universal & I am sure they will be taking care of this problem.Universal is great so all of you leaving soon dont worry I am confident guest services will crack down on this & if not please dont hesitate to file a complaint.Like the lady told me "we dont know of problems unless the public reports them to us".So rest assured we will go back to Universal again & again.I can also say that the rides where they were checking passes twice we were on & off in like 10 minutes.My son rode hulk 6 times in a row in about a 30 minute time period & the wait time for the regular line was at 45 minutes.So this gives you an idea of how fast pass should be when it is done right.Thanks for listening & have a great time everyone going especially you first timers.
UNIVERSAL ROCKS:cool1:

Good to know you made a difference! .....and excellent advice! :thumbsup2


(i spend an awful lot of money at UO, and if there are problems, believe me, i WILL let them know! :thumbsup2 I am "big" on 'customer service' and we don't mind paying extra for convenience and good service, but when we don't get it....well then, that's a problem!)

[ReallyFunMom]

Hello,
we were there from May 23-29 & I can say it was awful with not the fact of them over selling express passes but the "line cutters"! We were in line for jurassic park & a group of about 10 teenagers jumped the rope from the regular line & cut us in the express line.They did this all week long,very frustrating for my kids. The teenagers would get in the regular lines then halfway through they were jumping the ropes & getting in express lines. The problem there was the attendants were checking passes on entrance but once you boarded the ride they were not double checking your passes so the teens would call all their friends on their cells & laugh saying "hey,they aint checking passes dude" so by the end of the day you had these groups of teens going from ride to ride jumping ropes to get on. Did I complain yes I did all we got were excuses saying "we are under staffed right now"! This was our 3rd visit to the parks & I can say it is not like it used to be.When we first came in 2004 they checked our passes each time we went on,now its just "go,go,go".So that is our experience from this past week.

I was there Memorial weekend and also witnessed line cutting, no second check of passes to prevent it and TMs complaining about understaffing. I have to agree with OP that hotel key is not what it use to be, at least not on a busy weekend, when you most want it. I'm not mad about the change from years past, they need to be profitable and selling express helps, it just may affect whether or not I stay onsite in the future. Cool hotels, though. If I could wave a wand and think just for myself, I'd like them to go back to some free passes distributed for the equity of it and just the onsite guests getting express after that. I feel most for the people that can't afford onsite and just scraped up enough for tickets so can't buy express. Some freely distributed express passes would be nice for them.

[lorax123]

Being a Team Member, I sometimes too have to balance the queues. It is really tough to pull full loads of regular line, then stop, look for express, fill another load with express, as the guests stare right at you. In my mind they're thinking "wow that's totally not fair."

I'm really into guest service, but if someone is cheating the system, then it's absolutely no. Also, when marking express, I do get a lot of "what?! they didn't tell us it's only once each attraction!!" I tell them that it is only once each attraction, and I point it out on the ticket where it says that. I tell them if they would like to talk Guest Services, they may.

Also, if the pass sellers are not telling them that it's once per attraction, then it is ENTIRELY Universal's fault. But sometimes I think that the guest is trying to scam the system and such. I've heard it all. From "we lost our express passes" to "they got really wet" (which sometimes I make them fish it out, and try to read them) to "can we go express, please? please?!? pleassseeee?!?!?!" :sad2:


I watch you guys in action every time we are at the park. Some times I feel really sorry for you all. You really have to bust your hump 90% of the time. And being caught in the no Express/ Express war has to be challenging. You really think they would have figured out better methods of implementing the Express and stand-by lines, to make it a lot less chaotic.

[GemmaPixie]

Why don't they only have the staff at the front of the express queue, just before you get on the ride checking express passes instead of at the entrance to the ride? I know it won't solve all the problems but at least it would stop people going under the ropes mid-queue

[lorax123]

They do have staff at the entrance and sometimes (like in ROTM) they post staff mid-Q to prevent jumpers.

It seems to me a lot of times Q's are just so understaffed.

DD frustrates me the most. There is hardly ever attendants (at least when I'm there) assigning groups (or individuals) to rows. I get annoyed waiting in the Q while you see cars with 1-2 seats open on nearly every row of the train.

Certainly not the staffs fault. The big-wigs don't want to spend the extra dollars to hire a couple more people to help manage the crowds.

[Letsbgoofy]

DD frustrates me the most. There is hardly ever attendants (at least when I'm there) assigning groups (or individuals) to rows. I get annoyed waiting in the Q while you see cars with 1-2 seats open on nearly every row of the train.


We are always at DD first thing in the morning, so I have never seen this happen because there aren't even enough people to fill half of the train.

Your post reminded me of my sons (17) complaint when he went to Six Flags in NJ for a class trip this spring. He was shocked to see how poorly trained the ride attendants were. He said he had never seen so many seats go unfilled, and there were over an hour waits on all the coasters. It was funny to hear someone who has always taken our Disney and Universal trips for granted talk about how amazing the people who work at both parks are compared with what he saw at Six Flags. He also blamed part of the problem on guests who were "too stupid to fill up the rows". You would think people could figure that out without having to be told by an attendant!

[Nicole786]

We are always at DD first thing in the morning, so I have never seen this happen because there aren't even enough people to fill half of the train.

Your post reminded me of my sons (17) complaint when he went to Six Flags in NJ for a class trip this spring. He was shocked to see how poorly trained the ride attendants were. He said he had never seen so many seats go unfilled, and there were over an hour waits on all the coasters. It was funny to hear someone who has always taken our Disney and Universal trips for granted talk about how amazing the people who work at both parks are compared with what he saw at Six Flags. He also blamed part of the problem on guests who were "too stupid to fill up the rows". You would think people could figure that out without having to be told by an attendant!

I think the reason for that in Dueling Dragons is because its a weight-timed ride. The sensors on the bottom indicate when the cars have reached a certain weight, so they are timed properly when they nearly collide during the ride. I wonder if its the same in six flags?

[robvia]

Filling the rows has to do with people wanting to ride with friends. It really doesn't matter who you ride with, but for some reason, people want everyone in their group to be in front and behind each other. Sure, I can see being next to a friend, but having the rest of your group in the row in front or behind you, is not needed. Yet people will wait and let a row go empty just because their friends are in the row next to them. If people wait for their friends at the exit, there would be less empty seats.

I agree, it comes down to a money issue with staff versus money. The bean counters will staff the least amount of people possible to save money.

Six Flags can't even be compared in this department. It's futile to even talk about them.

[lorax123]

I have been on DD also early in the mornings and there's no crowd. It's fabulosu then! Pretty much walk up, getting in the loading stable, ride, get off, get right back on. :) In 20 minutes you can have 4 back to back rides.

Other times, I've walked right up, and while there really is no wait, the boarding area just seems so chaotic! Usually some of the other gests will ask if there's a single or 2 people and let them cut ahead of them to get on a train, or I just ask the groups if I can cut ahead to get into a open seat.

It would just be so nice, and more efficient, if a TM was assigning groups to rows. If they did that it would cut posted wait times in half.

I just get frustrated seeing a gate close, 2 empty seats in the row, becuase a group of 3 is next.

But the experience at lot of other parks I've been to is just like the GA debacles. I always step up to ask a group if I can cut ahead to take an empty seat.

One ride I don't understand why anybody bothers to wait in the Stand-by line is MIB. Even when I have FOTL, I still use single rider. 90% of the time I wind up on the same car, or competeing car, with my party.

The stand-by line is a great Q. But 40 minute wait (or even 5!) does not compare to no wait at all.

[Letsbgoofy]

In 20 minutes you can have 4 back to back rides.

That's what we always do, and I always end up feeling sick for about an hour afterwards. It's so much fun, it's hard to stop myself. My DH and I quit at 4 rides last trip, DS and his friend quit after 7.

[Buzz's Buddy]

This is not good news for us. We're taking our first trip to Universal during our upcoming Disney vacation and have reservations at PBR from June 22-24. \

We are DVC members but we are staying onsite at Universal only for the convenience of the express pass. I hope a 45 minute wait is not routine because this is certainly not what we were expecting.

[Fan2CSkr]

This is not good news for us. We're taking our first trip to Universal during our upcoming Disney vacation and have reservations at PBR from June 22-24. \

We are DVC members but we are staying onsite at Universal only for the convenience of the express pass. I hope a 45 minute wait is not routine because this is certainly not what we were expecting.

This was the exception not the rule, for us anyway. I haven't seen anymore posts of this nature since the third week of may. School groups are over, you should be just fine. Hope you have a great time and enjoy PBH!

[Metro West]

DD frustrates me the most. There is hardly ever attendants (at least when I'm there) assigning groups (or individuals) to rows. I get annoyed waiting in the Q while you see cars with 1-2 seats open on nearly every row of the train.I agree with the placement of groups but not individuals. I often go alone and usually ride in row 2 uness they have an opening in the front row. I don't want to have to ride in a back row even if it is filling up space. I think the problem with the empty seats is they close the gates too soon. By the time someone makes it up to the gate, it's closed and the train is ready to go. BUT..I was at IOA on Sunday and the guy on duty was doing a great job yelling for singles or parties of 2 to fill up the rows. I think if they continue to do that, it shouldn't be a problem.

[goNDmay9]

guy on duty was doing a great job yelling for singles or parties of 2 to fill up the rows. I think if they continue to do that, it shouldn't be a problem.

I completely agree! In my experiences, DD is really the only ride that i have noticed the empty seats / rows and they seem to be the only ride that does not do the "party of 2 looking for 2" hollering thing.

I guess decades of going to disney and unviersal have us trained so well that is just bothers us! For some reason it drives me nuts too. Interesting that i only seem to notice it on DD.

[lorax123]

I completely agree! In my experiences, DD is really the only ride that i have noticed the empty seats / rows and they seem to be the only ride that does not do the "party of 2 looking for 2" hollering thing.

I guess decades of going to disney and unviersal have us trained so well that is just bothers us! For some reason it drives me nuts too. Interesting that i only seem to notice it on DD.

I'm glad it's just not me! It just drives me crazy, becuase at many times the ride really is basically a walk on. But, the lack of organization turns it into a 20 minute wait.

I really can't think of any other ride at Uni I notice this lack of organization either.

It just seems TMs hawking for parties of 1 or 2 to fill a row is the exception. The seem to be pretty loaded up with work as is, let alone looking to fill the cars.

[macraven]

i have been going solo to the parks.

i am very vocal when i see an empty seat.

i call dibbs on it very very loudly...........and i slip thru the gate at dd quickly so i grab any row that has an empty seat...

[basas]

My un-popular opinion: do-away with all Express pass and go back to one line.

[tropical depression]

My un-popular opinion: do-away with all Express pass and go back to one line.

running attractions with both sides open and all cars/trains on tracks at full capacity. the only extra line would be a single ridres, how much better could that be?

[Fan2CSkr]

My un-popular opinion: do-away with all Express pass and go back to one line.

Maybe not so unpopular with the local crowd that are spending a day in the parks. More unpopular with those (ME) that are coming and staying onsite and getting that perk! I love hotel express and would have a hard time adjusting if they did away with it. I'm not even sure I would visit as often as I do.

[AlexandNessa]

Maybe not so unpopular with the local crowd that are spending a day in the parks. More unpopular with those (ME) that are coming and staying onsite and getting that perk! I love hotel express and would have a hard time adjusting if they did away with it. I'm not even sure I would visit as often as I do.

:thumbsup2 Us too. In fact, if they did away with unlimited express for hotel guests, we wouldn't renew our APs when they came due.

[calgarygary]

Doing away with FOTL for onsite hotel stays would be successful if your goal is to reduce occupancy.

[goNDmay9]

:thumbsup2 Us too. In fact, if they did away with unlimited express for hotel guests, we wouldn't renew our APs when they came due.

Ditto for the Lewis'! And...while we do love staying onsite, i am not sure if we would continue to stay there without FOTL.

[macraven]

the fotl perk is a big draw for staying on site.

i wouldn't give it up.

hrh is kewl but not that kewl at the rates they charge if the fotl isn't available

[patster734]

Doing away with FOTL for onsite hotel stays would be successful if your goal is to reduce occupancy.

Totally agree! The backlash would be extremely bad for Universal if they did this.

[bubba's mom]

jumpin' on the bandwagon :crowded:

[yankeepenny]

here is a thought- with all the hype regarding the arrival of Harry come 2009, droves will want to see the place.
and some will stay in the hotels on site, and doing away with the FOTL at that time will get no complaints from the thousands of extra folks who might not have going to the park except for harry. just my two cents- or should i say Penny.......:goodvibes

[macraven]

i'm thinking UO will have new hotels budget style put up with no fotl or perks

that way we all win.

we pay $$$ and get fotl

value resort pays $ and no fotl..........but they still are on site.


just think if UO adds more hotels and increases over 1000 rooms on site.
.......there go perks at city walk........head of line wait list probably woulldn't exist then

[bubba's mom]

i'm thinking UO will have new hotels budget style put up with no fotl or perks

that way we all win.

we pay $$$ and get fotl

value resort pays $ and no fotl..........but they still are on site.


just think if UO adds more hotels and increases over 1000 rooms on site.
.......there go perks at city walk........head of line wait list probably woulldn't exist then

i couldn't agree more.....my exact thoughts. Besides, i'm sure they don't want the UO hotels to turn into what Disney has.....TOO many hotels to offer the (fotl) perks

[hastrobb]

So I am wondering in the busy summer months with the FOTL pass, how long is the average wait?

[patster734]

i'm thinking UO will have new hotels budget style put up with no fotl or perks

that way we all win.

we pay $$$ and get fotl

value resort pays $ and no fotl..........but they still are on site.


just think if UO adds more hotels and increases over 1000 rooms on site.
.......there go perks at city walk........head of line wait list probably woulldn't exist then

That's interesting. I wonder if the room keys will be colored differently than the other hotels' to help the employees tell the difference.

[tarheelmjfan]

We're another family that goes to UO regularly, because of FOTL for onsite guests. It's an experience like no other. We could actually drive over for the day, but never go unless we are staying onsite. Without FOTL, we'd be rethinking our vacation plans.


So I am wondering in the busy summer months with the FOTL pass, how long is the average wait?

We usually go in July, & the avg. wait is probably 10 min. It's not bad at all. You'll have a great time. :)

[tarheelmjfan]

i'm thinking UO will have new hotels budget style put up with no fotl or perks

that way we all win.

we pay $$$ and get fotl

value resort pays $ and no fotl..........but they still are on site.


just think if UO adds more hotels and increases over 1000 rooms on site.
.......there go perks at city walk........head of line wait list probably woulldn't exist then


That makes sense to me, but I wonder what the backlash would be. I'm sure there would be people complaining that there was a difference in the classes, & some were being treated as 2nd class citizens. They'd book the cheaper hotel knowing upfront about the lack of FOTL, then be irate because they were treated differently. :rolleyes: Naturally, they'd have to rant that all WDW resorts offer the same perks. Yeah, because those perks aren't as good. :rolleyes1 I'm concerned that adding hotel rooms at UO may affect the perks. As I've said before, if they remove FOTL for the 3 hotels they currently have, I wouldn't want to own stock in the Loews Corp.

[macraven]

don't get me started.
people that stay at deluxe at disney are treated much better than those at the values.

bus service is more prompt at the deluxe resorts over there ....




i don't think UO resorts would treat on site guests different.
but then, there are always the guests that are newbies that might think different and compare it to the other place.


done with rant, carry on....:rotfl:

[basas]

More unpopular with those (ME) that are coming and staying onsite and getting that perk! I love hotel express and would have a hard time adjusting if they did away with it. I'm not even sure I would visit as often as I do.

But really, how much longer can that last?

I thought I heard Universal was looking at expanding and building a few new hotels...? If the amount of people staying on property increased, they'd have no choice but to revise the system.

[macraven]

That makes sense to me, but I wonder what the backlash would be. I'm sure there would be people complaining that there was a difference in the classes, & some were being treated as 2nd class citizens. They'd book the cheaper hotel knowing upfront about the lack of FOTL, then be irate because they were treated differently. :rolleyes: Naturally, they'd have to rant that all WDW resorts offer the same perks. Yeah, because those perks aren't as good. :rolleyes1 I'm concerned that adding hotel rooms at UO may affect the perks. As I've said before, if they remove FOTL for the 3 hotels they currently have, I wouldn't want to own stock in the Loews Corp.


If i had the choice of paying $276 for a room with fotl or pay $175 without fotl, in case UO puts up a new hotel that does not include fotl and perks, i would pay the higher amount for fotl.

that is just how i am.

come to think, maybe if UO puts in a new hotel and the basic room charge is $120 a night with no fotl, wouldn't you think that the other 3 hotels would drop some in price?

[tarheelmjfan]

If i had the choice of paying $276 or a room with fotl or pay $175 without fotl, in case UO puts up a new hotel that does not include fotl and perks, i would pay the higher amount for fotl.

that is just how i am.

come to think, maybe if UO puts in a new hotel and the basic room charge is $120 a night with no fotl, wouldn't you think that the other 3 hotels would drop some in price?


You'll get no argument from me. We'd definitely pay the difference to stay at one of the original 3 to get FOTL, even if we had to sacrifice in other ways. I've just read too many times how some people feel entitled to things they're not willing to pay for. I worry that the negative PR may change things. I guess it all comes down to me not wanting my UO experience to change & hoping they'll take care of us as they always have. Not adding a bunch of hotel rooms would be a good way to assure that, but I don't see that happening. You can't blame a girl for wishful thinking. :teeth:

[lorax123]

If i had the choice of paying $276 or a room with fotl or pay $175 without fotl, in case UO puts up a new hotel that does not include fotl and perks, i would pay the higher amount for fotl.

that is just how i am.

come to think, maybe if UO puts in a new hotel and the basic room charge is $120 a night with no fotl, wouldn't you think that the other 3 hotels would drop some in price?

I'd consider paying that much. Depending on the time of year though.

But, i'm sure Loews has some type of agreement with Universal regarding FOTL access.

One time I actually did some rough math in my head regarding FOTL and the enumber of people using it.

I estimated 11 million yearly attendance, so 30,000 people a day on average in both parks. 2400 on-site rooms. An average of 3 people per room, so that's 7200 guests on-site on any given day. So, out of that, I figure a 50/50 split between the 2 parks, 3600 on-siters in each park. Out of those, probably only 50% are in a Q at any given time (the others are walking, shopping, eating), so 1800. Around 12 attractions each park, so that means in 12 Qs, there are 150 on-site guests. Then there should be about 600, non-FOTL guests in line at each of those 12 attractions at any given time (est. a higher % of non-FOTL in line, becuase they have longer waits).

Of course my numbers don't mean a darn thing. I'm just guestimating. I was really curious how they could do FOTL, since there have always been rumors of it's demise. I'm sure Uni. did lots and lots of projections to figure out the logistics of the system. But I really don't think FOTL access really hinders the capicity of attractions. I really don't see nearly as many people whipping out FOTL cards to use Express. I see alot more EPs during my stays.

Anyway, do you think I'm way off base? I remember seeing (back in '01) an attendant with a sheet of paper with hourly counts of guests using EPs (back when they were still free) and FOTL cards, this was on Spiderman BYTW. I asked him about it, he just said they were counting guests that day.

Under FOTL, there was a huge spike of guests in the AM, but by the PM it had dropped off considerably (I think around the 6pm hour we were like the 5th and 6th guests using FOTL). EPs started slowly, but by mid-afternoon dominated his chart.

I think too much.

But I'd love to hear real numbers from the source. But if we ever found out those, I'm sure white vans would be parked out in front of the house monitoring my every move.

[cbdmhgp]

So I am wondering in the busy summer months with the FOTL pass, how long is the average wait?

It really just depends on the month, the day of the week, and the time that you go. FOTL in the mornings is awesome. we get there as soon as the gates open, and we're done by 10:30 am, so we can do everything again. In the afternoon it starts to get crowded, but our longest wait last year in FOTL was 10 minutes, and that was for ROTM.:banana:

[bubba's mom]

I'd consider paying that much. Depending on the time of year though.

But, i'm sure Loews has some type of agreement with Universal regarding FOTL access.

One time I actually did some rough math in my head regarding FOTL and the enumber of people using it.

I estimated 11 million yearly attendance, so 30,000 people a day on average in both parks. 2400 on-site rooms. An average of 3 people per room, so that's 7200 guests on-site on any given day. So, out of that, I figure a 50/50 split between the 2 parks, 3600 on-siters in each park. Out of those, probably only 50% are in a Q at any given time (the others are walking, shopping, eating), so 1800. Around 12 attractions each park, so that means in 12 Qs, there are 150 on-site guests. Then there should be about 600, non-FOTL guests in line at each of those 12 attractions at any given time (est. a higher % of non-FOTL in line, becuase they have longer waits).

Of course my numbers don't mean a darn thing. I'm just guestimating. I was really curious how they could do FOTL, since there have always been rumors of it's demise. I'm sure Uni. did lots and lots of projections to figure out the logistics of the system. But I really don't think FOTL access really hinders the capicity of attractions. I really don't see nearly as many people whipping out FOTL cards to use Express. I see alot more EPs during my stays.

Anyway, do you think I'm way off base? I remember seeing (back in '01) an attendant with a sheet of paper with hourly counts of guests using EPs (back when they were still free) and FOTL cards, this was on Spiderman BYTW. I asked him about it, he just said they were counting guests that day.

Under FOTL, there was a huge spike of guests in the AM, but by the PM it had dropped off considerably (I think around the 6pm hour we were like the 5th and 6th guests using FOTL). EPs started slowly, but by mid-afternoon dominated his chart.

I think too much.

But I'd love to hear real numbers from the source. But if we ever found out those, I'm sure white vans would be parked out in front of the house monitoring my every move.


Wow :eek: you had some time to run some numbers and really think about this, huh? It makes sense, as i have often thought about how many are staying onsite vs off and not everyone onsite is actually IN a line all the time. (Your numbers make it a little more "real" to think about is all) I know for a fact that we would definately pay more to stay at a "FOTL hotel" vs a "non-FOTL" hotel....it is just that valuable in our opinion! Whatever UO decides to do, they should keep it in check. I think Disney would love to offer FOTL to their onsite guests, but they just got too big and can't do it :sad2: That is a main draw for UO and they know it ..... i think they will be sure to remember it when the new hotels come and like mentioned before, I'm sure they have some kind of "commitment" w/ Loew's and it doesn't sound like the new hotel will be a "Loew's" :rolleyes:

[GrumpyFamilyof5]

I say do what Disney does, specially if they build more hotels. Do a ticket in ticket out fastpass type thing during the day and have on selected days one of the parks stay open an hour or two later for the hotel guests??:confused3

[tarheelmjfan]

I say do what Disney does, specially if they build more hotels. Do a ticket in ticket out fastpass type thing during the day and have on selected days one of the parks stay open an hour or two later for the hotel guests??:confused3

Right now, UO's onsite perks blow away WDW's system. To implement a system like WDW's for onsite guests would be a huge step backwards.

[AlexandNessa]

I really hope it's not just wishful thinking that the new hotel be a value hotel with no FOTL. IIRC, the one new hotel more than doubles the current number of on-site rooms. Granted, not all hotel guests are there for the parks ... some are just convention fogeys who don't visit the parks at all.

If they double the number of rooms available and still want to offer unlimited express for on-site guests, they should also double the number of theme parks from 2 to 4. Or at least double the number of thrill rides. Or stop selling so many express passes. Sure, that would happen, and then I'd wake up ...:rolleyes1

So, here's one with all fingers and toes crossed that they cheap out with the new hotel and the only benefit those guests have is that they can walk to the parks without crossing a highway or can take the boat to City Walk.

I know it probably sounds snide to some, but TB. Right now, we find Universal a terrific value and a great, fun, convenient, and relaxing vacation. If the express lines are too taxed by either too many hotel guests, too many express passes being sold, or guests manipulating the system to use their passes more than once per ride, all those things go away for us. It is not our idea of a vacation to wake up and be at the front gate 15-30 minutes before the park opens. Why bother to stay on-site at all if that's what we'd need to do? FOTL differentiates Universal from all other vacations we take. Take away FOTL or make it so that the Express Lines are much longer than what they used to be, and Universal becomes just another vacation. Not THE vacation.

[bubba's mom]

.... we find Universal a terrific value and a great, fun, convenient, and relaxing vacation. If the express lines are too taxed by either too many hotel guests, too many express passes being sold, or guests manipulating the system to use their passes more than once per ride, all those things go away for us. It is not our idea of a vacation to wake up and be at the front gate 15-30 minutes before the park opens. Why bother to stay on-site at all if that's what we'd need to do? FOTL differentiates Universal from all other vacations we take. Take away FOTL or make it so that the Express Lines are much longer than what they used to be, and Universal becomes just another vacation. Not THE vacation.


i couldn't agree more........ it would be become a "Disney" vacation .....and if I want to wait in lines like at Disney, I might as well go to Disney! :sad2:

[slick_willy]

I'd consider paying that much. Depending on the time of year though.

But, i'm sure Loews has some type of agreement with Universal regarding FOTL access.

One time I actually did some rough math in my head regarding FOTL and the enumber of people using it.

I estimated 11 million yearly attendance, so 30,000 people a day on average in both parks. 2400 on-site rooms. An average of 3 people per room, so that's 7200 guests on-site on any given day. So, out of that, I figure a 50/50 split between the 2 parks, 3600 on-siters in each park. Out of those, probably only 50% are in a Q at any given time (the others are walking, shopping, eating), so 1800. Around 12 attractions each park, so that means in 12 Qs, there are 150 on-site guests. Then there should be about 600, non-FOTL guests in line at each of those 12 attractions at any given time (est. a higher % of non-FOTL in line, becuase they have longer waits).

Of course my numbers don't mean a darn thing. I'm just guestimating. I was really curious how they could do FOTL, since there have always been rumors of it's demise. I'm sure Uni. did lots and lots of projections to figure out the logistics of the system. But I really don't think FOTL access really hinders the capicity of attractions. I really don't see nearly as many people whipping out FOTL cards to use Express. I see alot more EPs during my stays.

Anyway, do you think I'm way off base? I remember seeing (back in '01) an attendant with a sheet of paper with hourly counts of guests using EPs (back when they were still free) and FOTL cards, this was on Spiderman BYTW. I asked him about it, he just said they were counting guests that day.

Under FOTL, there was a huge spike of guests in the AM, but by the PM it had dropped off considerably (I think around the 6pm hour we were like the 5th and 6th guests using FOTL). EPs started slowly, but by mid-afternoon dominated his chart.

I think too much.

But I'd love to hear real numbers from the source. But if we ever found out those, I'm sure white vans would be parked out in front of the house monitoring my every move.

Nice statistical analysis, but I'd say that for an average day, your numbers are off. First of all, with 2400 rooms, they would be booked at maximum capacity, and I don't think that happens unless it's a holiday or a special event. Maybe someone who works for Loew's will find this thread and let us know what percentage of the rooms (on average) are booked through the year. Also, as far as 50% of onsite guests waiting in a queue at any given time, I would say that there are probably less than that. IMHO, the average onsite guest takes things a little more leisurely than the offsite guests, because they can afford to with FOTL. I would think that they may be shopping, eating, taking photos, or just soaking in the atmosphere, unlike the offsite guests who tour commando style.


As far as the OP goes, I'm thinking along the same lines as Damo, perhaps there was a malfunction on the Mummy. ROTM, has a capacity of 2000 people per hour, so I can't see how the FOTL wait could be so long unless there was a break-down.

I think the reason that they moved from an Express Pass system to the Express Pass Plus/ FOTL for onsite guests was to boost occupancy at the onsite hotels. I'm sure that Universal has some sort of agreement with Loew's that has to do with FOTL and occupancy. How many people would pay $250 per night if there wasn't some sort of perk like FOTL?

[GemmaPixie]

I think a value hotel for Universal would be a smart move. For one, if the new hotel didn't offer FOTL, then the whole FOTL issue would be solved. Secondly, a lot of people enjoy Universal holidays but I'm sure there are many that would love to stay onsite, just to be close to the parks and citywalk but can't afford it. This way they can be onsite but not pay the deluxe prices. Also, those who enoy to do the park early in the morning could stay in the value hotels because if you are at the park before park opening, you can do the rides without FOTL.

[lorax123]

Wow :eek: you had some time to run some numbers and really think about this, huh? It makes sense, as i have often thought about how many are staying onsite vs off and not everyone onsite is actually IN a line all the time. (Your numbers make it a little more "real" to think about is all) I know for a fact that we would definately pay more to stay at a "FOTL hotel" vs a "non-FOTL" hotel....it is just that valuable in our opinion! Whatever UO decides to do, they should keep it in check. I think Disney would love to offer FOTL to their onsite guests, but they just got too big and can't do it :sad2: That is a main draw for UO and they know it ..... i think they will be sure to remember it when the new hotels come and like mentioned before, I'm sure they have some kind of "commitment" w/ Loew's and it doesn't sound like the new hotel will be a "Loew's" :rolleyes:

I'm so glad someone doesn't think I'm crazy! I wondered about the logistics to FOTL, but unless my guess are WAY OFF (like by an 10k people on site), it really seems like a viable system that could go on for quite awhile with no changes. Until they double the number of rooms onsite, and double attendance, but I don't see crazy jumps like that happening in the immediate future (well maybe if Harry Potter really takes off).

I think Disney could offer a system similar. I hate FP. I'd prefer buying FPs like the EPs at Uni. FP might be free. But it's inconvienient. i prefer to start at one end of the park, do those attractions and move to the next. I hate going to one section, getting a FP, then having to double back later! Never fails, I get FPs that occur at lunch time, or some other event.

I think Disney could do it, if they offered it to Deluxe resort guests, that pay for concerige level, and offer it at certain parks, certain days, for certain hotels. Stagger it! I'd really consider paying $3-500 a night for this.

Extra magic hours never worked for me either. I'd rather spend my trip relaxing and not worrying about being here or there at certain times, timing the crowds, etc. etc.. That's not a vacation.

I love FOTL, and I'm willing to pay for it, I've even paid for VIP tours during HHN. On the HHN RIP Tours, it cost about $400 ($125 RIP Tour, $60 passes) to get into the park on a peak night, figure the other $220 we paid for a APH room at PBH, That's a $700 night, once you figure food and drinks at HHN. Figure another $70 for food during the day for 2 people... We aren't rich, we just are willing to pay for convience and a little bit of luxury on vacation.

Of course we still try to hunt down the best deal possible!

[bubba's mom]

... We aren't rich, we just are willing to pay for convience and a little bit of luxury on vacation.

Of course we still try to hunt down the best deal possible!

us too! :thumbsup2 ....willing to pay that extra to get a little extra!

[macraven]

i guess i am just one of those type of people that will pay for what i want.
i try to use the AAA or AP for the discounts but if i couldn't, i would still pay those high costs to stay on site and have the fotl.

i blow a lot during hhn stays.
the room for 4 or 5 nights, the ep and hhn tickets.
and this year, i am doing the rip hhn tour.



but for me, it is worth it.

[lorax123]

i guess i am just one of those type of people that will pay for what i want.
i try to use the AAA or AP for the discounts but if i couldn't, i would still pay those high costs to stay on site and have the fotl.

i blow a lot during hhn stays.
the room for 4 or 5 nights, the ep and hhn tickets.
and this year, i am doing the rip hhn tour.



but for me, it is worth it.

Exactly our philosphy! I tried doing discount trips before and when all is said and done, we may have saved a couple hundred dollars. But, unless you really don't have the money, is it worth it? $200 savings, putting up with a crappy mold infested hotel room, drunken teenagers, no FOTL.... (this is all taken from a bad Howard Johnsons experience).

We cheap out on things for most of the year. It's nice to splurge!

[basas]

I say do what Disney does, specially if they build more hotels. Do a ticket in ticket out fastpass type thing during the day and have on selected days one of the parks stay open an hour or two later for the hotel guests??:confused3

And that is what I wish they would do. Open the park an hour early. Close the park a few hours later (although they should be keeping the parks open later for all guests too...why can't IOA stay open until 7 or 8, and the Studios 9 or 10 (in the off season)?).

But during regular operating hours, all guests should be treated equally.

[cbdmhgp]

And that is what I wish they would do. Open the park an hour early. Close the park a few hours later (although they should be keeping the parks open later for all guests too...why can't IOA stay open until 7 or 8, and the Studios 9 or 10 (in the off season)?).

But during regular operating hours, all guests should be treated equally.

I sent an e-mail to US/IOA suggesting that they should try that this summer. stay open till about 1 in the morning or so for the hotel guests:banana:

[tarheelmjfan]

I sent an e-mail to US/IOA suggesting that they should try that this summer. stay open till about 1 in the morning or so for the hotel guests:banana:


Just to clarify..... Are you suggesting they do away with FOTL for hotel guests, & add hours before & after normal park hours for them instead? If so, the people who would still pay to stay onsite would have a deserted park at 1 am. They would be staying in a much quieter & more empty hotel too. ;) I doubt there would be too many onsite guests that would rather have a couple extra hours than FOTL all the time. Maybe in the off-season, but not in peak seasons.

[bubba's mom]

I doubt there would be too many onsite guests that would rather have a couple extra hours than FOTL all the time. Maybe in the off-season, but not in peak seasons.


I'd rather have the FOTL than the extra hours (we are NOT morning people and DS just can't last till midnite-1am)

[tarheelmjfan]

I'd rather have the FOTL than the extra hours (we are NOT morning people and DS just can't last till midnite-1am)


Us too! Most of our park time is mid-day. We're not interested in getting up early enough to be at the park at opening. In the evening, we like to shower & dress for a relaxing dinner. UO's current onsite policy works perfectly for our touring style, which is why we have all but abandoned WDW in favor of staying at UO.

[bubba's mom]

Us too! Most of our park time is mid-day. We're not interested in getting up early enough to be at the park at opening. In the evening, we like to shower & dress for a relaxing dinner. UO's current onsite policy works perfectly for our touring style, which is why we have all but abandoned WDW in favor of staying at UO.

yep....us too! ::yes::

[basas]

I'd rather have the FOTL than the extra hours (we are NOT morning people and DS just can't last till midnite-1am)

Right. But they can't expand their hotel capacity very much without changing their system just as Disney couldn't have everyone staying onsite getting unlimited FP (the FP lines would be longer then standby).

[bubba's mom]

I know...and that's why we hope the new hotel is a "value" resort and doesn't offer FOTL..... I would pay the extra to stay in a resort that offers the FOTL..... (kinda what this thread has turned into)

[macraven]

when the fotl perk goes, i go.........

[bubba's mom]

when the fotl perk goes, i go.........

:rotfl2:



(sadly, i know what you mean) :rolleyes1

[disney's daughter]

New to Universal and the on site hotels.....Subscribing....:confused:

[lorax123]

:rotfl2:



(sadly, i know what you mean) :rolleyes1

Well. i'm not quite that drastic! If they lose FOTL, probably still go to the park, but not during peak seasons and I certainly would not pay much more than $129 a night to stay at RPR!

I also picture the next hotel being a value hotel. Limited if any FOTL perks.

Extra hours in the am & pm is for the birds!

[Nicole786]

A lot of people have mentioned that with the luxury of FOTL, you can take a nice leisurely stroll around the park because you dont have to worry about lines. This sounds great, and its one of the reasons i chose to stay at the HRH! My concern is that i will be at Universal Sept. 2 and 3rd (We are switching to disney on the 4th, so quite possibly the morning on the 4th as well) and its labor day weekend! (Sunday & Monday) Will i have the luxury, or will I have a FOTL issue?

[bubba's mom]

Well. i'm not quite that drastic! If they lose FOTL, probably still go to the park, but not during peak seasons and I certainly would not pay much more than $129 a night to stay at RPR!
Sadly, our 'usual' vacation time IS peak season (last week of June/first week of July)...so, not really too much choice there....plus the aggravation of takin' Bubba outta school...pia!

I also picture the next hotel being a value hotel. Limited if any FOTL perks.

Extra hours in the am & pm is for the birds!

I hope so too....let's all hope so! :wizard: and i couldn't agree more about early hours....i get up early everyday at home....vacation is for catchin' some ZZZZZ's.... :thumbsup2

[bubba's mom]

A lot of people have mentioned that with the luxury of FOTL, you can take a nice leisurely stroll around the park because you dont have to worry about lines. This sounds great, and its one of the reasons i chose to stay at the HRH! My concern is that i will be at Universal Sept. 2 and 3rd (We are switching to disney on the 4th, so quite possibly the morning on the 4th as well) and its labor day weekend! (Sunday & Monday) Will i have the luxury, or will I have a FOTL issue?

You should be fine.....it's in May when the 'school groups' decended down upon UO that the FOTL was a slight problem....besides, a lot of kids are back to school before Labor Day, so I doubt it would be all that crowded......

[vatmark]

Well I hope they don't change FOTL before we go in August 2008. That would be most disappointing.

And Disneys so called Extra Magic hours are anything but magical. Because Disney has so many on site hotels the lines during those extra hours are huge. If Universal builds more hotels and offers FOTL for all of them then I suppose the lines for FOTL will be huge as well. I'd definitely have to rethink my vacation then.

Annie

[macraven]

Well. i'm not quite that drastic! If they lose FOTL, probably still go to the park, but not during peak seasons and I certainly would not pay much more than $129 a night to stay at RPR!

I also picture the next hotel being a value hotel. Limited if any FOTL perks.

Extra hours in the am & pm is for the birds!



lorax, it is possible i would stay at the cheapest hotel on site if the fotl is done away with for hhn nights only.

other than that, i won't pay the high prices to stay on site and still buy the ep at the park.

[Selvan]

Just got back today. We stayed at HRH on 6-2 to 6-4. Only problems we had were a 20 min. wait at 11:00 on Sat. for MIB. This was our first ride, so we were concerned. We headed to Mummy after this with virtually no wait, then back to MIB with no trouble for the rest of the day. On Sun. one time there was a 25-30 min wait for Dudley, this was about 1:00 maybe. Nothing else had much more than 5 to maybe 10 min wait. Went back to Dudley later with hardly any wait. FOTL was definately worth it last weekend compared to the rest of the world out there. I did see them checking off the purchased express passes everywhere. Didn't see anywhere where they didn't mark them. One thing I will say for FOTL is that you miss some fun stuff on Mummy when you bypass the line. We went back to Universal on Fri. without FOTL and really enjoyed the setup to the ride going through the regular lines. We went in the single rider line for MIB ( we just couldn't say good-bye without 10 more times through) with no wait at all.

[damo]

Well, it really sounds like the system is working again. School groups are done, just normal crowds of people buying express pass and the system is back to normal.

[lorax123]

lorax, it is possible i would stay at the cheapest hotel on site if the fotl is done away with for hhn nights only.

other than that, i won't pay the high prices to stay on site and still buy the ep at the park.

I'd consider it for HHN too. But, the price would have to be right. After a full day at the parks, and HHN on top of that.

I'm sad now. We won't be at HHN this year! The DW is due with the 2nd rugrat mid-October. I'm still holding out hope I'll see some ridiculously cheap ($44 each way) Dings and convince the wife to go just one night! It is running until the first week in November you know :>

I don't know if I would be EPs for day time trips to the park... I think if FOTL were gone, we'd probably go off-season, Jan-Feb & Oct. The crowds are reasonable those times of year.

[tropical depression]

the hugh school class trips start hitting the parks the second week of May. there are kids up north who just got out of school last week because of snow days, so no vacation plans. it's a screwy time of year.

[macraven]

I'd consider it for HHN too. But, the price would have to be right. After a full day at the parks, and HHN on top of that.

I'm sad now. We won't be at HHN this year! The DW is due with the 2nd rugrat mid-October. I'm still holding out hope I'll see some ridiculously cheap ($44 each way) Dings and convince the wife to go just one night! It is running until the first week in November you know :>

I don't know if I would be EPs for day time trips to the park... I think if FOTL were gone, we'd probably go off-season, Jan-Feb & Oct. The crowds are reasonable those times of year.



this year the off season last day is oct 4th. my rate at hrh is very good for that day but it jumps for the next 4......


i totally and completely love hhn.......
tell your dw to try one night at hhn...........yea, i'm sure that will go over like a lead ballon

the cost for hhn this year has increased from last.
i can remember in 2000, my first year for hhn, was so cheap compared to what it is for 07

[macraven]

oops.......sorry for getting off track about hhn. i can't resist.

to stay on topic, yes, have not had issues with fotl being long in the time periods i go in the fall. :)

[PlutoLuvr]

Really the only time I can recall the FOTL being longer or the same as the regular lines have been situations where the parks are crazy slow, but the hotels are packed. I can remember two trips -- evacuations, actually -- to USO during Septembers when hurricanes were going mad all over the state. Mid to late September is about the slowest time of year to go to Orlando theme parks, but the hotels were sold out due to evacuations and really the only lines for rides were in the FOTL queues. Nothing drastic, but like 10 minutes for the regular line on Jaws and 10 minutes for the FOTL line on the same ride.

Very strange trips, to say the least. The parks (and FOTL queues) were probably 90 percent FL resident evacuees. Very hard to enjoy yourself when you're wondering if your home will still be standing in the next day or two. And there were so many of us together in the same lines. And to happen two years back to back is uber strange.

The hypothesizing about what the new hotel will be like and whether it will offer FOTL is an interesting discussion and not too far off topic, IMHO. I mean, if USO is overextending itself in the EP department, a new onsite hotel, as well as the upcoming crowds for the HP island will no doubt have an effect on EP in its current state.

DH & I were talking about it last night, and we'd be up for a value hotel. It would mean a lot more visits on site for us. There are so many factors! We're only a quick two-hour drive away, and most of our Orlando trips are long weekends, anyway. We never go during busy seasons, so FOTL, while it's nice to have, isn't usually necessary for the times we go. A big factor for us is what you see in my avatar. And I can't drink two or three of them and hope to drive offsite to my hotel or timeshare, so we have to factor in cab costs. A value hotel onsite would be a notch in the "con" column for FOTL purposes, but it would be a big notch in the "pro" column for onsite partying purposes and at a modest price -- something USO doesn't have currently.

Like others have mentioned, we REALLY hope they don't do away with FOTL and institute some kind of EMH system instead. Blech! We're sleeping in the mornings and we're off eating, drinking and enjoying nightlife in the evenings. Plus, the times we go are positively dead and the parks are practically empty anyway. I can't imagine it would be cost effective to keep all those employees working for just a few hotel guests.

It shall be interesting to see it all unfold!

[lorax123]

this year the off season last day is oct 4th. my rate at hrh is very good for that day but it jumps for the next 4......


i totally and completely love hhn.......
tell your dw to try one night at hhn...........yea, i'm sure that will go over like a lead ballon

the cost for hhn this year has increased from last.
i can remember in 2000, my first year for hhn, was so cheap compared to what it is for 07

At first it went over like a lead baloon, but then I showed her the site is up. Now she's jonesing to go.

Our first year was 2000 also! Remember the tickets were $19.95? Now it's on par with daily admission.

Sorry about the hi-jack.

[GreyStr0ke]

You should not be waiting anymore then 15 minutes in line for Express. If you find yourself waiting longer then that, go complain to Phamton :rotfl2:

Here's the proof:
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l105/MetallicaZer0/express.jpg

[GemmaPixie]

Word being average- could be more, could be less

[GreyStr0ke]

45 minutes is a lot more then 15 mintues though...

[phamton]

Word being average- could be more, could be less



:thumbsup2

Don't see me--I can't control how many people decide to ride at the same time as you. This isn't pizza delivery where you pizza is guaranteed in 30 minutes or your order is free. ;)

Sometimes when shows let out like Fear Factor, everyone heads for the nearest ride like Jaws or MIB. Just check the wait times and return at a slower time.

[bubba's mom]

i agree....if you stand in EP for 45 minutes, you better be waitin' 5 or less a bunch of other times to make up for that "average" :rolleyes1

[GemmaPixie]

Yes but if you think about it, they are taking an average from queue lengths all year round. So in the slow months, most of the time the queue would be a walk on or only a few minutes and then in the peak months they are much longer. They are taking an average which is pulled way down because (I think, correct me if I'm wrong), the express queue is only long for a small amount of the year.

[lorax123]

Hey check this out on Screamscape! Someone important read my post complaining about DD! Cool!


Park News - (6/18/07) According to a report sent in over the weekend, Universal was testing out some new traffic flow procedures inside the Dueling Dragons queue. According to the report there was a ride op stationed just outside the castle who would stop the flow from entering the castle until a group of about 10 had gathered and then they would let that group in and stop the flow again. Things were normal again though the castle itself until you picked Fire or Ice and then another ride op was stationed to find out how many were in your party and directed you into a specific row on the coaster just as they do on Incredible Hulk. According to our reader, this seemed to work out a hell of a lot better in the end and greatly reduced the chaos that you normally experience while waiting to board the coaster. I don’t know if this is something they are going to do on busy days throughout the summer or if this was just a one day test to observe some new traffic flow patterns in anticipation of the Harry Potter conversion which will surely drive the crowds back into the Dueling Dragons castle once again.

[macraven]

did the ride op also stop the ep line?

[lorax123]

I don't know Macraven. But I suppose they would. Usually the Express line merges with the regular just before you choose a dragon.

I hope this would be permenant. But, I doubt they would do this in the off-seasons.

[macraven]

i'm going early october this year.

i would hope it would be the same as it was for you.


even when the 2 lines merge together, it would still be a good thing.