Fax from Disney re: Surprise Mornings

[PJesse25]

Hi, All.

I work at a travel agency and we just got a fax from Disney announcing the discontinuation of the Surprise Mornings program. I just had to share the language with you. The fax begins with an announcement of the Character Caravan. It goes on to say:

"Many of our Guests chose not to take advantage of our Surprise Mornings (early Theme Park entrance) program. They told us they wanted more of the Disney Characters. We took it as a wake-up call. So we've replaced Surprise Mornings with a new kind of magic - now the friends your clients have come to love are coming to them."

Oh, brother! Take an amenity away from the guests and then tell them it's their fault!

Now, let me say that I love Disney World and took all of the recent cut-backs in stride. I was there October 26-30 and can honestly say I've rarely had a more pleasant trip to WDW. We saw everything we wanted to and were still able to stroll through the parks and linger over meals. I just find it amusing that they chose to word this announcement this way.

[All Aboard]

As fast as that email was spinning, how did you slow it down to read it?!?!? This is just absurd. The folks that didn't take advantage of EE are the ones that are sleeping in and are not going to be up early enough to see the Character Caravan. What a load.

[YoHo]

Why, it seems perfectly reasonably worded to me. I've seen numerous people report here that they either have never used Surprise mornings, or went to another park on those days. in both cases Surprise mornings wasn't being utilized. Surely there is more to it then that, but I wouldn't be surprised if lack of use wasn't part of it.

[Carl]

Every time that I've been to Disney there have been long lines waiting for whatever early entry park was going to be open that morning. And I also disagree with the statement that people going to the NON early entry parks were not making use of early entry. They WERE making use of the early entry by going to the park which did NOT have the early entry crowds.

[All Aboard]

Carl is absolutely right about EE crowds. Especially at MK. Folks were utilizing it and thus the outcry against this cut. I don't recall any change that WDW that has been met with this kind of criticism (at least here on the DIS). The caller said that they were getting lots of emails about it. It was being utilized. But it was an expense that was not matched with revenue (unless you try to determine how much of the room rate could be attributable to EE) That is, "we get $124 a night for this room, but without EE would could probably only charge $119".

Of all the folks that say "we never used EE anyway, so we won't miss it" how many do you think will be setting the alarm in order to see Mr. Smee in the food court?? My guess is somewhere in the neighborhood of zero. The groups that were getting up early to get a jump on Test Track, Tower of Terror, RnR, etc. are likely not interested in seeing characters in the morning. So, WDW has replaced a "used amenity" in their case with a worthless one.

For the groups that were getting up early to get a jump on Dumbo, Pooh, Pan, etc. MIGHT and I repeat MIGHT get up early to see Smee. I'll speak for that group and say you took away a very valuable amenity and replaced it with a near-worthless one. We can see characters just about anywhere in WDW. At all times of the day at all parks. Getting an hour and a half jump on the crowds at MK was fantastic.

No matter how you slice it, this was purely a financial move and had nothing to do with guest preference. Everyone falls into one of three categories. 1) Don't care about either one, 2) prefer EE, 3) prefer Character Caravan. Those who fall into category three could probably all fit comfortable on that double decker bus.

[YoHo]

But gcurling, you don't know that. And that's the point.

As to what Carl said, I agree. But does disney see it that way?

Avoiding the Park with EE may be utilizing it, but to Disney's way of thinking it may not be. I'm not sure. I'm willing to bet there was more thought to this then throwing darts at the board.

I might be willing to get up earlier to see the characters. Disney will certainly find out if it is a valuable perk.

[All Aboard]

I don't think it was "darts" I think it was "stones." WDW needed something to cover for the fact that they were cutting a great guest perq. AND, the union of which the characters are members had been promised more hours (per MKTiggerman). Two birds, one stone.

Honestly YoHo. I believe you've said that you did not take advantage of EE. Are you just jerking my chain when you say that you might get up earlier just to see three characters at the resort, but not to go to the parks??

YoHo, the EE issue is my proverbial straw just like Seven Seas Lagoon boat transporation was yours.

[YoHo]

I know, and I'm not jerking your chain. It depends on which characters. (You can always go down to the lobby on your way to breakfest.

[DeeP]

One point that I have yet to see mentioned in relation to the EE ending, is that very often many non Disney resort guests were also using EE. The times I used EE I was never checked for a resort ID. We are DVC members at BWV and many times I see people that are not staying at a Disney resort park at BW and take Disney transportation into the parks to use EE and to avoid paying the parking fees. So really Disney did not take a perk away from their resort guests they took it away from everyone including a lot of people that had no right being there in the first place! Maybe now with the added security at the resorts it will not be possible for non Disney resort guests to park at other resorts to gain access into the parks and avoid the parking fee. I hope so, being a DVC owner I spent a lot of money for my membership and I pay yearly dues to DVC, and it really burns me up to see non Disney resort guests using our facilities/perks and then having the nerve to brag about it! I know with the BW it is harder because non Disney resort guests can come to eat at one of the BW restaurants or to just enjoy the BW, but it was starting to get really out of hand with people using BWV parking lot as a free for all and never even stepping foot on the boardwalk or in one of the restaurants.
I think when attendence picks back up EE and E nights will be back in place, it only makes sense. Now there is no need for them with attendence down, so why pay extra wages for CMs to work an empty park? Once attendence is back up, Disney would be foolish not to institute EE and E nights--it is more hours of a lot of people in the parks eating more and buying more. I just hope when they do institute EE again they monitor is more closely so that it is really only Disney resort guest who are admitted. Why not have each guest show a resort ID at the turnstiles of each park along with their admission ticket? Then it will truely be a Disney resort guest perk!

[cindyfan]

I agree this is an absurd way of "announcing" the new Character Caravan!!
Doing away with EE is a huge mistake......IMHO!!
We DID tade advantage if it.......not always, but we did. We would get there early for the EE spend 3 to 4 hours at that park then move on to another. I really made it easier to "hop" Yes it did make the EE park more crowded, but that was because they let anyone in regardless of wether they were WDW resort guests!! I think that is where they made a mistake.

Anyway, how is this caravan thing going to work!!!!
What characters will go where!???? We usually get to see who we want by checking with the guide maps or asking a Cast Memeber and we plan it around the long lines and hot afternoons.

I just don't see where they think you can see more characters in the caravan !!!!!! :( Especially when you have so many character meals to choose from, and there are so many places in the park to see them.

Actually there were times we would see alot of characters at EE, BUT that isn't why we went to them!! We went to EE to avoid the long lines on the popular rides. Doesn't WDW realize that !!!

[Peter Pirate]

Very nicely said. I don't think anything is cast in stone, but I'm sure Disney doesn't want to "Give things" away, especially to non-Resort guests as they have been doing. I think that if the hue & cry is sufficient we could easily see a return of EE with more restrictions from abuse...Or dae I say it, a truly restrictive EE...For a fee (like E night).
:cool: :cool: :bounce: :cool: :cool:

[wdw4us2]

A lot of Florida residents (us included) have always used EE when staying on-site. We normally don't take one or two week trips, we take 3 day weekend trips. If you've ever tried to enjoy MK on a Saturday without EE, you know what fun it is to try and get your kids through Fantasyland without waiting 30-45 minutes per ride. When you use EE, the wait time is generally no more than 10 minutes!!! I would love to know who Disney "polled" for the info on the character interaction, but it has certainly never appeared on any poll I've taken. I understand that Disney is a business and that they have a bottom line, but people keep forgetting that they started cutting off "perks" BEFORE the 9/11 tragedy. I have emailed WDW Resorts about my displeasure about the elimination of EE and received a short email from them to acknowledge receipt and promised a more detailed reply at a later date. I hope it is a positive response! :)

[Captain Hook]

I just returned back from a wonderfull week at WDW, We never used EE in the past (we always avioded the park that had it on that day), I did get to see the Character Caravan at OKW. It came monday, wensday, and friday three characters for about an hour. Monday was Hook, Smee, and Gildeon: Wensday was Minnie, Pluto, and ? : Friday was Tweddle dee and dum, and the rabbit. The only people who where stopping to see them where parents like ourselves with children under 5. I hope in time the parks will regain the EE days and more important MK sees the rerurn of E night for all of us who are over 5.

[Bob O]

This is typical disney BS!!!! They discontuined the program to save money but for pr reasons are blaming the guests for its demise. I know my self that without early entry i wont stay on
site anymore!! And besides the loss of hotel revenue its also going to cost them less meals and souvenirs etc. From what ive read on this site and Deb's wdw site the caravan is a joke with only a couple of charachters for a short period of time and no proper replacement at all for EE. We alsways used EE and found it the best reason to stay on site and without it the rooms are overpriced for the value received,escpecially when you then eat most meals on site which are higher priced then off site. Disney can pull the wool over some eyes apparently but not all!

[KMovies]

The one I saw was "Baloo", "Rafiki" and "King Louie". It was very crowded with tons of families.

[cindyfan]

So let's put this in perspective:
A typical family staying on site for let's say 6 days, Sat through Friday, can "possibly " if they get up early and go down to the main lobbey, get to see at most 9 different characters.
Instead of: If they were able to go to EE for 5 of those mornings at 3 different parks and ride how many of the attractions? I'm guessing at this one.........maybe 20 rides. PLUS seeing how many characters before the "main" crowd shows up? Let me try to add this one up.......Once at MK EE we saw 4 of the dwarfs outside the entrance, then Alice in Wonderland's group, 3 of them that day, and Mickey, Minnie and Goofy before they headed to Toontown. It was a good morning! Then the next day at Epcot, we saw Pooh, Piglet and 3 other characters on our way in for EE.
Now that was 15 characters just 2 days!
And we don't even go to see the characters!! We were trying to avoid long lines!! Which we still were able to do!!!!

Hopefully, they will realize the error of their ways !!!! And go back to EE, and hopefully it will be long before we go in June!

[mktiggerman]

Originally posted by gcurling
I Two birds, one stone.

actually, I feel it's more of execs @ WDW adding 2+2 and coming up with 3. WDW execs have no say over characters, but they do have a say over EE. The NY execs that have control over the characters made this decision. I have known about the character caravan at least 10 days prior to the cancellation of EE.

[All Aboard]

I take Tiggerman's response as further evidence that the Caravan was not a conscious decision to find a suitable replacement for EE. Rather, a convenient "right place at the right time" item that mgt could point to as the replacement.

I'm not going to open another poll (my last two got locked - they don't seem to like polls much around here) but I have to suspect that the vast majority of folks who care about either EE or CC, would say that EE is much more valuable to them.

[Eeyore2U]

But how many, like me don't care about either?

BobO ~ If you don't like the BS don't go. It's that simple.

I think that Disney mistakenly tried to use this as a postive when it was totally unrelated to the suspension of EE.

Let's look at it this way. If 1000 guests are at WDW and 85% use either the a) previous EE park strategy or b) any park but EE strategy.What is the need? Where are the numbers to substantiate opening early? If the guests aren't there and only Disney would know since they have the numbers, I choose to beleive them. I'm sure when the annual report comes out it will substantiate it.

Also, if by all accounts, my first hand included, are no waits why would the EE or E night be offered? Should Disney be obligated to offer something they lose money on? Would any of us pay to have someone stand to do nothing?

Someone early on in the thread stated something about the noise being made regarding canceling of EE. I think this falls into the silent majority category. If it doesn't bother you, why say anything.

[Bob O]

I think when all is said and done the elimantion of EE will cost disney more then they will save by cutting it. We always used EE and the crowds were their to justify its continuation. I think over time they will lose alot of rooms nights by cutting it and the resulting money from people staying off site in meals/trinkets etc. I found it to be the main perk of staying on site, the other convience of closeness at epcot/MK resorts. Bit without the perk it will be easier to stay at a suite hotel which offers more room/meals at a significant cost saving. Disney need to fill more rooms, not less and by reducing one of their main perks doesnt encourage people to stay on site.

[All Aboard]

I think one of the main problems with this topic is that folks tend to believe that most folks think like they do. (Come to think of it, perhaps that's true of every topic.) I know that I am guilty of it. I think that EE was one of the greatest amenities. We used it on every trip, without fail.

I can attest that many, many others did as well. Often, we would have to wait for more than one bus at 7:00am on a Saturday or Monday morning on our way to MK EE. I can also attest that Saturday MK crowds are very large right now and EE would still be a highly valuable amenity. As for the other parks, I'm not sure. The one thing I can't figure out is why they cut Saturday MK EE.

As for WDW giving away something that was not making them any money. On this I disagree. The reason WDW introduced EE was to sell it as an amenity to fill the rapidly growing base of on-site rooms and help justify the fact that on-site room rates are (in general) quite a bit higher than off-site options. We've gone round and round about the quality of the All Stars and whether they belong at WDW. Many have likened them to Motel 6's. One of the chief reasons folks have mentioned on the Resort Board for choosing the All Stars over cheaper off-site alternatives is the existence of EE.

Early Entry was a major part of every print ad that WDW ran for its resorts. Costly, perhaps. Underutilized, maybe. But valuable - absolutely.

This will, no doubt, have an impact on on-site occupancies. Every decision does. The question is will the losses in guest revenue be greater than the savings for EE elimination. I guarantee there is somebody running those numbers. Now, how good of a job has he/she done at projecting the revenue impact? Who knows. Time will tell. Trouble is, it's often very difficult to assign cause and effect.

[daannzzz]

It is funny. The only reason I would think of not staying on site would be if it got too expensive or the resorts got run down and dirty. EE is a nice addition but I don't use it as much as many others. Even so if Disney cut all trasnportation from their hotels to the parks
(a stupid move and not a great choice of example but it will have to do) I would still stay at the Disney resorts as I love their hotels and always reant a car anyway. I would stay at Disney resorts even if there were not parks around.
I am surprised at how much more money people will pay per night just to get the EE advantage.
This is not to say that those of you who use EE all the time should not be disapointed. I think it was the wrong move for Disney to make ( among a few others these last few years). I also think the fax is rather condescending and is most likely wrong.

[Captain Hook]

I think the Character Caravan was put in place as alow cost alternative to give the resort guest some sort of entertainment. From what I saw last week Disney has no reason to keep EE. There just is noone in the park except for the weekends. The only line i waited in was for a backpack check when I entered the park. The longest wait was 10 minutes for most e ticket rides, cars running quarter full, and even on Holloween night in MK. The only way Disney will reinstate E nights and EE is for the guests to return to the parks.

[Bob O]

With disney forced to close hotels and not open hotels that are almost completed doesnt disney need to give people a reason to stay on site??? And with reduced park hours doesnt that make EE a even more important perk than before???
I dont think a caravan with 3 characters a couple times a week compares to EE.

[tasbm1]

EE was a WONDERFUL perk.
Having a small child, we could get on alot of rides, without long lines, at the beginning of the day and then take our good natured time doing everything else the remainder of the day. A childs energy level is alot higher early in the morning and even they slow down (just slightly) as the day goes on. While other people were standing in long lines for rides later in the day, we would use FastPass to get in some rides, catch shows, get character autographs, take long lunches, go swimming or just explore the parks. I have to be honest that it was the main reason I spent more to stay on Disney property because I knew the advantages of using EE. Without EE, I would be more likely to stay off site at a cheaper hotel rate, use the extra money to rent a car, and visit some other tourist traps in Orlando instead of spending the whole week at Disney.

[doombuggy]

Either somepeople are completely forgetting a few things or just not mentioning them, so I will.

Does everyone realize what's going on in our country right now?? Maybe it's just me because I have family in the military, and I live on the East Coast in a very large city. I work at a small company (and we are tied to the financial markets) and wonder if our company will end up closing. While I have a second job that I can depend on a little, it's not enough. Our travel industry is really suffering and so is the tourism business. WDW's division of the WDCO has bills to pay, just like the rest of us. We have all had to make adjustments to our lives as a result of the events of Sept. 11.

I know that I said this in another post, but I am going to say it again, so that more people can hear it. A co-worker of the company with which I have a part-time job with was on her way to Disneyland from Boston when her plane was hijacked and flowen into the WTC. Marianne will never be able to visit a Disney park again. She'll never be able to do anything again. Be happy that you are alive and able to go to a Disney theme park. Some aren't so lucky.

I agree with what someone said about people parking at the resorts to avoid the parking fees at the parks. If you try to park at the resorts & you don't have a room there, you are given a parking slip that has a time limit on it. Weather or not they check....

Just my opinion - I'm glad to be alive!

[All Aboard]

Nope Doombuggy, I don't think anyone has lost sight of the evnets and the impact on the travel industry. Many companies across America are facing reduced revenue right now and are making decisions on how best to soften the blow. They are also challenged with making decisions that will help to keep them strong in the event of a return to normalcy and a strengthened economy. The wise companies (and eventual long-run winners) will be the ones that maintain their customer base and keep their product as strong as possible.

In my opinion, WDW is making some decisions right now that don't fit that mold very well.

[d-r]

hey-
we got a new disney catalog yesturday, with an add to stay at all stars for $77 a night, most nights from 1/1/2 to 2/15/2 or something like that, it talked about early entry to the theme parks as the perk for staying onsite.

Also, we just got back from Disneyland on Sunday. They have early entry at disneyland EVERY morning. The printed information before hand said every morning except for Wed. and Sat., but they had it on Sat. as well. They do it differently there, people staying at "good neighbor" (non disney) hotels are eligible, and if you buy a multi day ticket you get one morning of early entry with it. You can also get a free breakfast with a package at buzz lightyear's (it isn't a bad breakfast either). One thing is, the three disney hotels (grand californian, paradise pier, and disneyland) are all the same direction from disneyland, whereas the transportation from the good neighbor hotels is in the other direction. The amount of people coming from the good neighbor hotel direction was HUGELY more, amazingly more, than the number from the disney hotel direction. Because we are used to eastern time, we went to early entry each morning. Overall, except for Sat. every attraction at disneyland was a walk on (including haunted mansion holiday, the mountains, small world holiday, indiana jones), and everything was a walk on at ca. adventure (there was about 5 minutes of line to ca. screamin and soarin over ca.) Ca. adventure had much shorter hours (10-6 weekdays, 10-9 sat.) whereas MK had longer hours (7:30 am early entry to midnight on Sat.) To give you a feel for the crowds, we experienced every single attraction in disneyland on Thurs., with the exception of autopia because we never got around to it (I am not exaggerating here, we did every single thing else) and we did every single attraction in CA. adventure on Friday (no exaggeration here, either, including tortilla factory - in fact, we did them all between 10 am and 5 pm, riding some many times and eating lunch at two different places (my wife and I wanted different things and just hung out with each other). Specifically, we rode pirates 5x, haunted mansion 5x, indiana jones 4x, space mt, star tours, matterhorn 3x, toad 3x, small world 2x, soarin 3 times (each row, cool), ca. screamin 3 times, grizzly 3 times, maliboomer 2x, and every other thing except autopia once. Saturday we split between them and rested and watched the electric parade, which we sat for on a park bench and no one stood in front of us. It was very hard to find something to eat, most of the restaurants in the parks were closed. The only time it felt crowded was Fri. night at the believe fireworks because people crowded on to main street for the snow, and Sat. night at disneyland (a one hour wait at haunted mansion holiday).

DR

[Bob O]

Im glad to see disneyland still being rum in a more common sense manner and im looking forward to going about 1 yr from now and hopefully EE wil still be a perk when i saty onsite.
I would agree with gcurling's last post. Every company has to evaluate what they do but by reducing on site perks it doesnt inspire people to stay on site when there are so many other options available, most alot cheaper with alot of amneties.

[poly3026]

Silly question...but since when and more importantly, why, do three characters need a bus? :rolleyes: And does three really make a caravan:confused: