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Cpt.JackSpearow
06-03-2006, 11:00 AM
Why do people put like, I am goth so deal with it or I believe in JC so you should to. I think it is something that should be cancelled out of the VMK dctionary because I see people get in fights over there religion in a room or something. I see goth clubs and other rooms to do witht his stuff. I think it is begining to be another problem in VMk because everyone is starting to do it and everyone is getting in fights.

What do you think :confused3

Nanoer
06-03-2006, 11:03 AM
backing you up 100%

Dragonlord11_7
06-03-2006, 11:08 AM
It's true... and nanoer ought to learn to not trick people into saying the craziest, dumbest stuff. ;)

OT: nanoer, where's my quote: "I'm not a cheikn, I'm a chicken."

kissmy_____katrina
06-03-2006, 09:17 PM
Same here. VMK is supposed to be about fun and hanging out with friends, but a lot of time all I see is people fighting with each other.

Maleficent2
06-03-2006, 09:20 PM
I am not agreeing or disagreeing with you....but as far as I know being a Goth is not a religion.

AlienNation
06-03-2006, 09:48 PM
I don't think there is any problem in it at all. We already have to seperate church and school... why should we have to serperate it in a game??? It is just a game. If people want it in their signature to show what they believe in let them. If people start fighting about it, report it and put them on ignore. And ok... so say they decide to take out the religious stuff, PEOPLE ARE JUST GOING TO FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO FIGHT ABOUT ANYWAYS. In all reality, the fighting probably has nothing to do with the differences in religions at all to begin with, just some smarty pants wanting to cause problems because it is "cool" or the "fun" thing to do.

And yes... goth isn't a religion, just a lifestyle/community like hip hop, punk, etc.

Loves Disney
06-03-2006, 09:52 PM
I am not agreeing or disagreeing with you....but as far as I know being a Goth is not a religion.

Actually Mal, it is. To be gothic is to worship a different style of living or culture. Very limited times, goth is considered a form a satanism. Unlike your typical religon, gothic worship isn't often held in congregation but sometimes done more privetly. Due to the nature and stereotype of gothics wearing black and other "dark" symbols, it more times than not, implys a worship of the devil. However, because "goth" can be worshiped in SO many different ways, it is certainly not limited to that stereotype. I for one, do not agree with this religon but that is totally besides the point lol.

I have no opinion on whether it can be said in vmk because I have not thought about it, to be honest lol.

Loves Disney
06-03-2006, 09:59 PM
Actually Mal, it is. To be gothic is to worship a different style of living or culture. Very limited times, goth is considered a form a satanism. Unlike your typical religon, gothic worship isn't often held in congregation but sometimes done more privetly. Due to the nature and stereotype of gothics wearing black and other "dark" symbols, it more times than not, implys a worship of the devil. However, because "goth" can be worshiped in SO many different ways, it is certainly not limited to that stereotype. I for one, do not agree with this religon but that is totally besides the point lol.

I have no opinion on whether it can be said in vmk because I have not thought about it, to be honest lol.


EDIT TO ADD:
While the percentage of Goth being used as an actual religon is VERY uncommon (most people dress and look Gothic because it is quickly becoming a fad), it still exsists.

Source: Gothic Religon (http://www.darkwaver.com/subculture/religion.php)

cteddiesgirl
06-03-2006, 10:05 PM
Actually, no. Goth is not a religion.
http://www.goth.net/goth.html
It is a lifestyle. There are Gothic Christians, Jewish, etc.

It is a stereotype that Goths are satanic.

Carrieberry
06-03-2006, 10:06 PM
Actually...

History and background
...The words Goth and Gothic have had many, largely unrelated meanings in the past.
The name of the Germanic Visigoth tribes that overthrew the Roman Empire. From this source arose the concept of a Goth as an uncivilized person, a barbarian.
...a style of architecture in Western Europe which was popular from the 12th to the 16th century.
...a style of horror/mystery literature that is dark, eerie and gloomy.
...Goth, as a modern movement, started as one component of the punk rock scene. As the latter faded, Goth survived by creating its own subculture.
...The first use of the term Goth in its present meaning is believed to have been on a British Broadcasting Commission (BBC) TV program. Anthony H. Wilson, manager of Joy Division described the band as Gothic compared with the pop mainstream. The name stuck.
...Their use of black clothing was originally "something of a backlash to the colorful disco music of the seventies." It also stuck.
....The movement first became established in the Batcave, a nightclub in London, England, in the early 1980's.
....Spreading to the U.S., it first became popular in California.
....Goth is featured in The Crow horror movies (1994, 1996). Other Gothic movies are the original Nosferatu, the color remake Nosferatu the Vampyre, and the Cabinet of Doctor Caligari.
....Popular music bands are the Bauhaus, Siouxsie and the Banshees, the Sisters of Mercy, Dead Can Dance, and many others.

Many Goths reflect popular culture and are probably nominal or devout Christians. Atheism, Agnosticism, the New Age, Gnosticism, Shamanism, Wicca, other Neopagan traditions, and other minority faith groups are represented more frequently than in the general population.

Goths often wear Christian crosses or Christian crucifixes, which many regard as a pre-Christian religious symbol. Others wear New Age/ancient Egyptian Ankh symbols. Some do this as expression of their religious beliefs, some for satire, and others because they like their appearance.

AlienNation said:
And yes... goth isn't a religion, just a lifestyle/community like hip hop, punk, etc.

This is correct
Goth or the Gothic lifestyle is CULTURE not a religion.

HeDiedxILive
06-03-2006, 10:09 PM
i don't think there is a problem with it in signatures. i am proud of my faith and i am not ashamed to show it.

what i DO disagree with is the arguing.

although mine does say "i know the King of Kings", i have not come across any problems with anyone. the only responses i get are "hey i know the King of Kings, too!" or "i heart your profile!"

it is nice to be able to befriend people who share a same main interest as i.

Loves Disney
06-03-2006, 10:15 PM
Alrighty then! lol. Goth isn't a religon. Man...all those people who told me it was have a lot of "esplanin'" to do! Lol. Thanks guys for informing me it wasn't... :thumbsup2 lol.

PeachyT
06-03-2006, 10:23 PM
EDIT TO ADD:
While the percentage of Goth being used as an actual religon is VERY uncommon (most people dress and look Gothic because it is quickly becoming a fad), it still exsists.

Source: Gothic Religon (http://www.darkwaver.com/subculture/religion.php)

Actually, the site you linked to states directly that it is not a religion... The opening paragraphs on the site:


There is no set belief system for Goths, although many seem to be agnostic. A person's religion and his or her gothic involvement have little to no affect on each other. Christians, atheists, Jews, agnostics, Satanists, pagans, and so forth are all represented within Goth. While there is an incredibly wide variety of religious beliefs and views, most Goths do not follow any sort of organized religion. Their personal spiritual beliefs are of a private nature.

Gothic is a fairly open-minded culture when it comes to exploring anything that is "not of the norm." Religion is no exception. Many Goths are likely to explore alternative religions and forms of spirituality rather than following a dominant organized religion. Some find paganism and Wicca to be appealing.

Disney Dreams
06-03-2006, 10:53 PM
Here's a question for you -

I have seen Christmas trees and many different colors of wreaths, but nothing for Channukah? Did VMK have anything at all for Channukah last year? If so - I would heart know - never seen it.

(And yes, I realize there are other religions that do not celebrate either, I am just asking about Channukah. :) )

-Jegrezo

Loves Disney
06-03-2006, 11:01 PM
PeachyT, I took it the parahgraph meaning more that it was a lesser common religon. It was my misreading (sometimes happens at 11 at night lol). But I understand I was wrong and made that mention in the post above. I am sorry it the post upset anyone...I should not be trying to read and understand things so late at night lol.

cteddiesgirl
06-03-2006, 11:03 PM
There was a Star of Mickey Pin. But I think that's all they had for Channukah.
Which is strange considering that Yavn's name is taken from Hebrew. :confused3

PeachyT
06-03-2006, 11:16 PM
PeachyT, I took it the parahgraph meaning more that it was a lesser common religon. It was my misreading (sometimes happens at 11 at night lol). But I understand I was wrong and made that mention in the post above. I am sorry it the post upset anyone...I should not be trying to read and understand things so late at night lol.

It didn't upset me, I knew goth wasn't a religion but, I actually did a google search on the topic and found the page before you posted it. When I saw you posted the page, I wanted people who didn't follow your link to see what the page actually said.

Here's a question for you -

I have seen Christmas trees and many different colors of wreaths, but nothing for Channukah? Did VMK have anything at all for Channukah last year? If so - I would heart know - never seen it.

(And yes, I realize there are other religions that do not celebrate either, I am just asking about Channukah. :) )

-Jegrezo

I think there was just the pin, but there were some pretty creative people in celebrating the holiday. I think there's a pic of Briar's room somewhere on here... boy how I loved going in there and sitting next to her while she cooked for us! :)

Beherenow
06-03-2006, 11:56 PM
I have no problem with people posting their belief in their signatures. That is what is there for. I do have a problem with people fighting over it. Everyone is entitled to their own belief. Disney has always made it a point to keep religion out out the business (read the Gospel According to Disney book). This was a very wise business decision. As long as we all agree to keep the peace and act nice :)

jazstar87
06-03-2006, 11:58 PM
I really don't see a problem, heck it is there belief, and this is america and vmk is base in america. Don't we have freedom of religion some where?
though vmk may not be the best place to express it, but if they want to go right ahead...
Heck, if you want to create your own religon it is not hard....

Religion:
1 a : the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

by this definition, you just need a superhuman, lets say yavn for instence, get people (or you can have your own private religion) to believe he is a superhuman or god, base by facts from history, of course. Boom! you have a religion! the vmk religion...


But many use goth as a style, dress in black and sort i kinda went through that phase but no so dark...i really don't want to talk about, kinda bad times... why do i say things?...

BriarRosie
06-04-2006, 12:26 AM
I think there was just the pin, but there were some pretty creative people in celebrating the holiday. I think there's a pic of Briar's room somewhere on here... boy how I loved going in there and sitting next to her while she cooked for us! :)


Yes, the Star of Mickey pin was the only Hanukkah item out there.
And Tea, I'll always make potato latkes (pan cakes LOL) for you anytime!
The picture of my room was taken before VMK decided to change the
crate dimensions, too. :rolleyes:

I still have my room basically unchanged, but I added a couple gold ropes
to keep kids from playing with the "candles" on the menorah. :)

caribbound
06-04-2006, 12:29 AM
I don't like listening to people fight about anything, especially when they get graphic with blows, kicks, knocks him out, etc type stuff. It doesnt matter what it's about.

I do smile when I read a signature that isn't begging for someone to please take them, but has something that's in common with myself. I would be one who would tell HeDiedxILive "I like your signature", :thumbsup2 and if we chatted or played some good pirate games, ask to be a friend. It's just like my son might be interested to see skateboarding or snowboarding in someone's signature b/c it's something he can relate to. I can't relate to "I'm cute, a cheerleader, taken by the best boy in vmk". Not that I can't be friendly or even "friends" with that person, but it's at a different level for one thing knowing the age difference and maturity. :Pinkbounc

One of my signatures has tongue in cheek "I heart Third Day" as part of it. Nothing else religious. It's because of so many I heart Green Day's out there. Those who know Christian rock music know Third Day as a group and will recognize me which is my purpose. Noone is standing on a bench with a blowhorn.
Tell them to lighten up and leave the room. :sunny:

CL_BlueReap
06-04-2006, 12:58 AM
Same here. VMK is supposed to be about fun and hanging out with friends, but a lot of time all I see is people fighting with each other.


I agree with you

SorcererDonald16
06-04-2006, 01:34 AM
As long as people aren't going around berating others if they don't agree with them, I see no problem with it. And if they are giving others trouble about beliefs, you can bet they're causing trouble about other things as well. The ye ole report button comes quite in handy at some times. :rolleyes1

I agree with what several people have said-- for a lot of people, one of their main hobbies/interests is their church, synagogue, etc. activities, or reading the Bible. That was my grandfather's favorite hobby, hands down. Second favorite hobby was Sunday school. I think it is nice to see something besides "Looking for the best looking boy" and the like. I have "Fan of the Braves" in my signature, mostly because I love my team and also because I like talking to others with that same interest. I'll be friends with any nice person, but there's an extra reason to be friends when you see someone have something in common with you. I haven't seen any problems over it yet myself.

In fact, someone asked me on Good Friday if I knew what day it was and what it meant. I said yes, and then they asked if I believed in "JC." Again, I said yes. We had a nice little chat about the day and the hope it meant to both of us, and we've been VMK friends ever since. Religion/spirituality is a major part of many people's lives, so to take it out of VMK would be kind of dicey to me. It gets into the whole "If you ban one thing, what stops you from banning X, Y, Z" kinda thing, you know? :confused3

And on the other side of the coin, JC is also what many people call Jungle Cruise (myself included if I'm not talking to a new player), so be careful what you wish for or it might be gone like lalalaness! :rotfl:

AlienNation
06-04-2006, 01:37 AM
As long as people aren't going around berating others if they don't agree with them, I see no problem with it. And if they are giving others trouble about beliefs, you can bet they're causing trouble about other things as well. The ye ole report button comes quite in handy at some times. :rolleyes1


That is the point tho. There shouldn't be any real problems with it anyways... because if that is gone, they will always find something else to fight about. It's a never ending battle.

Carrieberry
06-04-2006, 01:45 AM
That is the point tho. There shouldn't be any real problems with it anyways... because if that is gone, they will always find something else to fight about. It's a never ending battle.


Yup, uh huh exactly. Just like some people always find things to complain about. It is never ending....if it's not one thing it's another! :confused3

jazstar87
06-04-2006, 01:53 AM
true
the problem is that they just want to complain and don't want to fix the problem. Our lazy society....

McHootle
06-04-2006, 04:06 AM
hmm... This is a difficult one.... Whilst I don't mind people having religious sigs, what really annoys me in the game is when people start talking about it in the game... I don't mean just normal talking, I mean when people are rying to convert you. Don't laugh, I've seen this twice now!

I was sitting in Mark Twain and a player came into the room and started shouting all this stuff about "JC dead on the cross for you, you should follow him". Now this really annoys me, but I let it slide to see what would happen, sure enough he continued, I kindly asked him if he would stop as it was making me feel uncomfortable. He replied with some stuff about "JC would not make you fell uncomfortable" anyway... you get the idea anything I said he came back with some sort of religious comment. So I decided to report him, sure enough he disappeared but was shortly replaced by what appeared to be his clone who asked the room "who reported that player" I said it was me, he said "you just destroyed peoples freedom of speech!!". Well I'm sorry but that REALLY REALLY made me mad as he was destroying peoples right to choose, I just exited the room after a somewhat heated debate about the whole thing.

Now before you guys get all angry with me you should know that I myself am christian by faith but if there is one thing in this world that I truely hate, I mean I find it completely and utterly deplorable is people forcing their religeon on others. People have a right to choose the way they lead their lives, just because some people don't like it doesn't mean they should try and change it.

Sorry, rant over... Long story short:
Religion in sigs = doesn't bother me
Fighting about religion in VMK = bothers me alot
Trying to convert people in VMK = bothers me more

lovethattink
06-04-2006, 08:08 AM
Actually Walt Disney was named after his parent's pastor. Prayer had a huge impact on Walt and his career. Here are some links that are interesting.

http://www.disneydreamer.com/Waltfaith.htm

http://www.hollywoodjesus.com/disney_mouse.htm



Fighting is against vmk values...just don't do it.

HeDiedxILive
06-04-2006, 08:34 AM
I would be one who would tell HeDiedxILive "I like your signature", :thumbsup2 and if we chatted or played some good pirate games, ask to be a friend. It's just like my son might be interested to see skateboarding or snowboarding in someone's signature b/c it's something he can relate to. I can't relate to "I'm cute, a cheerleader, taken by the best boy in vmk". Not that I can't be friendly or even "friends" with that person, but it's at a different level for one thing knowing the age difference and maturity. :Pinkbounc

One of my signatures has tongue in cheek "I heart Third Day"



thanks! :goodvibes
and i totally, completely agree.

and i love Third Day! haha.

jasonpwns
06-04-2006, 08:52 AM
no dont take away cheese or us people put cheese us in the signture or dog they say spell it backwards they take those away ill be mad lol but do make the red when you put them together realigously

StitchfansJr
06-04-2006, 09:24 AM
I agree. 100%.

Switchfootrules
06-04-2006, 10:15 AM
I don't think there is any problem in it at all. We already have to seperate church and school... why should we have to serperate it in a game??? It is just a game. If people want it in their signature to show what they believe in let them. If people start fighting about it, report it and put them on ignore. And ok... so say they decide to take out the religious stuff, PEOPLE ARE JUST GOING TO FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO FIGHT ABOUT ANYWAYS. In all reality, the fighting probably has nothing to do with the differences in religions at all to begin with, just some smarty pants wanting to cause problems because it is "cool" or the "fun" thing to do.

And yes... goth isn't a religion, just a lifestyle/community like hip hop, punk, etc.


I agree. It doesn't matter how much you take out of VMK people are still gonna find something to fight about.

Captain Brain
06-04-2006, 11:51 AM
As you can tell by my DIS signature, I am a Christian. I would put "I heart JC" in my signature if I had room. I think that if VMK wants JC removed it will cause a lot of trouble from some.

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 12:26 PM
hmm... This is a difficult one.... Whilst I don't mind people having religious sigs, what really annoys me in the game is when people start talking about it in the game... I don't mean just normal talking, I mean when people are rying to convert you. Don't laugh, I've seen this twice now!

I was sitting in Mark Twain and a player came into the room and started shouting all this stuff about "JC dead on the cross for you, you should follow him". Now this really annoys me, but I let it slide to see what would happen, sure enough he continued, I kindly asked him if he would stop as it was making me feel uncomfortable. He replied with some stuff about "JC would not make you fell uncomfortable" anyway... you get the idea anything I said he came back with some sort of religious comment. So I decided to report him, sure enough he disappeared but was shortly replaced by what appeared to be his clone who asked the room "who reported that player" I said it was me, he said "you just destroyed peoples freedom of speech!!". Well I'm sorry but that REALLY REALLY made me mad as he was destroying peoples right to choose, I just exited the room after a somewhat heated debate about the whole thing.

Now before you guys get all angry with me you should know that I myself am christian by faith but if there is one thing in this world that I truely hate, I mean I find it completely and utterly deplorable is people forcing their religeon on others. People have a right to choose the way they lead their lives, just because some people don't like it doesn't mean they should try and change it.

Sorry, rant over... Long story short:
Religion in sigs = doesn't bother me
Fighting about religion in VMK = bothers me alot
Trying to convert people in VMK = bothers me more
ITA
I am Christian and I have problems with people trying to force their beliefs on others. Christian or not. If it's in your signature, I don't care. But if you go around telling people to believe the way you do, then it makes me uncomfortable. This is a game to have fun and enjoy the spirit of the parks. Not a place to preach your beliefs. Period.

Carrieberry
06-04-2006, 12:44 PM
ITA
I am Christian and I have problems with people trying to force their beliefs on others. Christian or not. If it's in your signature, I don't care. But if you go around telling people to believe the way you do, then it makes me uncomfortable. This is a game to have fun and enjoy the spirit of the parks. Not a place to preach your beliefs. Period.


I agree completely. Lets get back to the game and away from the preaching.

Peacefully
06-04-2006, 12:49 PM
I find it kind of funny. Today someone said "Do you all like my signature?!?" and it said "Cheese us is better than inferno, stitch hat, or green flips!" and I said "Yes, cheese does taste very good.".

I'm not really religious myself, but as long as they aren't trying to convert me, I don't really care what their sigs say. I didn't even know what king of kings meant before this thread.

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 12:49 PM
ITA
I am Christian and I have problems with people trying to force their beliefs on others. Christian or not. If it's in your signature, I don't care. But if you go around telling people to believe the way you do, then it makes me uncomfortable. This is a game to have fun and enjoy the spirit of the parks. Not a place to preach your beliefs. Period.

I agree!

After thinking more about, I was thinking the exact same thing as you, cteddiesgirl. I don't care if it is in a signature. If people don't like what it says in someone's signature, so be it, they don't have to look at the signature. lol. No one is holding them at gunpoint saying...read this signature or else! lol. However, when I see someone come into a room yelling at another person because what they are doing does not follow that person's religion, it becomes a problem. It is important to know that everyone has their own religion and an avatar in a virtual game will more likely NOT persuade a person to change religions lol. People can go yelling and discriminating others for their religion, but in the end, all that yelling was pointless lol. Why cry over the inevitable? I guess what I am trying to say is live and let live. lol. If people want to say such things in their signatures, let them lol. If one doesn't like what is said, one doesn't have to read it lol. Just don't start yelling at people because what they believe doesn't cooperate with what you believe lol (I use "your" in the general sense lol). VMK is not a religious congregation, it is a Disney game lol.

Disney Dreams
06-04-2006, 01:28 PM
Yes, the Star of Mickey pin was the only Hanukkah item out there.
And Tea, I'll always make potato latkes (pan cakes LOL) for you anytime!
The picture of my room was taken before VMK decided to change the
crate dimensions, too. :rolleyes:

I still have my room basically unchanged, but I added a couple gold ropes
to keep kids from playing with the "candles" on the menorah. :)

Okay - I have seen the Star of Mickey pin. I thought it was a police badge! :lmao: Honest.

I would love to see your room BriarRosie. I am already picture what I would like to do when the holidays get here, but I have not seen any Channukah rooms in vmk.

-Disney Dreams

KrazyPete
06-04-2006, 01:42 PM
I can't resist :)

Since God is a real part of a lot of people's lives, why can't they express that in VMK? I don't know how many times I have heard kids talking about Fall Out Boy. Fall Out Boy has nothing to do with VMK. In fact, quoting their lyrics on VMK would be considered "adult" language. Even so, you can put "I heart Fall Out Boy" in your sig. You can talk about how great Fall Out Boy is all that you want. You can even walk into a public area and say, "Who here likes Fall Out Boy?"

So why can't people put a message about God in their signature, Talk about how great He is in their rooms, and even preach it on the corner of virtual Main Street USA?

The things that we are passionate about in our in real lives spill over into our VMK life. It's perfectly natural and I don't see anything wrong with it. There are already rules in VMK that cover fighting and being disrespectful. We don't need any special rules targeted at religious people. That's just my opinion though.

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 03:40 PM
I can't resist :)

Since God is a real part of a lot of people's lives, why can't they express that in VMK? I don't know how many times I have heard kids talking about Fall Out Boy. Fall Out Boy has nothing to do with VMK. In fact, quoting their lyrics on VMK would be considered "adult" language. Even so, you can put "I heart Fall Out Boy" in your sig. You can talk about how great Fall Out Boy is all that you want. You can even walk into a public area and say, "Who here likes Fall Out Boy?"

So why can't people put a message about God in their signature, Talk about how great He is in their rooms, and even preach it on the corner of virtual Main Street USA?

The things that we are passionate about in our in real lives spill over into our VMK life. It's perfectly natural and I don't see anything wrong with it. There are already rules in VMK that cover fighting and being disrespectful. We don't need any special rules targeted at religious people. That's just my opinion though.
But the problem is that religion is a very touchy subject with many people. You can be passionate all you want about your religious beliefs, but they should not spill over into a child's virtual game. Maybe the other people you're trying to convert is passionate about their own beliefs. And therefore, an arguement starts.
VMK is not the place to try to convert people. If they ask you about your beliefs, then talk about it. But only as far as they want.
And people can talk about Fall Out Boy because it's really not nearly such a touchy subject. Maybe the person is not a fan (I know I'm not), but you don't know if a person you're trying to convert to your beliefs is Jewish, Agnostic, Muslim or Hindu. Trying to force your own beliefs onto someone is rude and inconsiderate and just plain wrong in a child's online game. It is really no place to preach about anything unless it's about safety and the VMK rules and values.

If you want to convert someone to your beliefs then go to your church or your neighborhood corner. I don't care. Just please don't do it in VMK. At the very least, do it only in your own rooms.

HeDiedxILive
06-04-2006, 03:50 PM
I can't resist :)

Since God is a real part of a lot of people's lives, why can't they express that in VMK? I don't know how many times I have heard kids talking about Fall Out Boy. Fall Out Boy has nothing to do with VMK. In fact, quoting their lyrics on VMK would be considered "adult" language. Even so, you can put "I heart Fall Out Boy" in your sig. You can talk about how great Fall Out Boy is all that you want. You can even walk into a public area and say, "Who here likes Fall Out Boy?"

So why can't people put a message about God in their signature, Talk about how great He is in their rooms, and even preach it on the corner of virtual Main Street USA?

The things that we are passionate about in our in real lives spill over into our VMK life. It's perfectly natural and I don't see anything wrong with it. There are already rules in VMK that cover fighting and being disrespectful. We don't need any special rules targeted at religious people. That's just my opinion though.


I completely agree. And that was a great example!
Religion doesn't have to be a touchy subject. Everyone has their own beliefs so why not express them? Say.. "i do not believe in JC" in your sig, if you think it is such a big deal. That is your opinion, so show it! It is supposed to be about our interests, and for many of us God is the basis of our entire lives. A simple "i heart the King of Kings" in a signature never hurt anyone. There is no reason why religious beliefs should be put on a soap box when there are many, MANY, other things people argue about in VMK.
When you take away a person's passion, what else do they have to live for? I think that a person's beliefs should affect every aspect of their lives, including a virtual game.

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 04:06 PM
I completely agree. And that was a great example!
Religion doesn't have to be a touchy subject. Everyone has their own beliefs so why not express them? Say.. "i do not believe in JC" in your sig, if you think it is such a big deal. That is your opinion, so show it! It is supposed to be about our interests, and for many of us God is the basis of our entire lives. A simple "i heart the King of Kings" in a signature never hurt anyone. There is no reason why religious beliefs should be put on a soap box when there are many, MANY, other things people argue about in VMK.
When you take away a person's passion, what else do they have to live for? I think that a person's beliefs should affect every aspect of their lives, including a virtual game.
Nevertheless, religion is a touchy subject. I am Christian myself. But if I want to learn more about God or Jesus, I'll go to church. Not a child's game.
Exactly how much do you think you can really get across with VMK's dictionary anyways? Do you really think that you can actually convert someone while they are trying to have fun in an innocent game?

People do not play VMK to be bombarded with religion. They play for the fun. If you want religion to affect your life. Fine. Just keep it to yourself. I certainly do.
Preaching to people who don't want to hear it is, as I said, rude and inconsiderate. If someone want's reliegion, they can go to church, read the bible, or watch religious programming.

I respect everyone's beliefs. Except for those that believe that everyone Has to believe the way they do. After all, that's a lot of why wars are fought in this world. If there were more people who didn't try to force their own religions on other people, then we wouldn't have most of the wars that have happened in this world. Including what is happening in the Middle East. If it wasn't for the terrorists trying to force their beliefs on others, then we wouldn't be having so many of our people dying over in Iraq.

So preach in your own rooms if you want, preach at your church, preach where ever except in the middle of public rooms on VMK.

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 04:09 PM
But the problem is that religion is a very touchy subject with many people. You can be passionate all you want about your religious beliefs, but they should not spill over into a child's virtual game. Maybe the other people you're trying to convert is passionate about their own beliefs. And therefore, an arguement starts.
VMK is not the place to try to convert people. If they ask you about your beliefs, then talk about it. But only as far as they want.
And people can talk about Fall Out Boy because it's really not nearly such a touchy subject. Maybe the person is not a fan (I know I'm not), but you don't know if a person you're trying to convert to your beliefs is Jewish, Agnostic, Muslim or Hindu. Trying to force your own beliefs onto someone is rude and inconsiderate and just plain wrong in a child's online game. It is really no place to preach about anything unless it's about safety and the VMK rules and values.

If you want to convert someone to your beliefs then go to your church or your neighborhood corner. I don't care. Just please don't do it in VMK. At the very least, do it only in your own rooms.

I agree with you 100%!! You pretty much took the words right my mouth! lol.

Cpt.JackSpearow
06-04-2006, 04:12 PM
I agree to all of you that agree with this

VMK is a virtual game. If your religion is going to be changed over a virtual game something must be stopped

HeDiedxILive
06-04-2006, 04:18 PM
Nevertheless, religion is a touchy subject. I am Christian myself. But if I want to learn more about God or Jesus, I'll go to church. Not a child's game.
Exactly how much do you think you can really get across with VMK's dictionary anyways? Do you really think that you can actually convert someone while they are trying to have fun in an innocent game?

People do not play VMK to be bombarded with religion. They play for the fun. If you want religion to affect your life. Fine. Just keep it to yourself. I certainly do.
Preaching to people who don't want to hear it is, as I said, rude and inconsiderate. If someone want's reliegion, they can go to church, read the bible, or watch religious programming.

I respect everyone's beliefs. Except for those that believe that everyone Has to believe the way they do. After all, that's a lot of why wars are fought in this world. If there were more people who didn't try to force their own religions on other people, then we wouldn't have most of the wars that have happened in this world. Including what is happening in the Middle East. If it wasn't for the terrorists trying to force their beliefs on others, then we wouldn't be having so many of our people dying over in Iraq.

So preach in your own rooms if you want, preach at your church, preach where ever except in the middle of public rooms on VMK.


I totally understand what you are saying, but I am here talking about it being in signatures. Not trying to "convert" people. I am actually offended by the term "convert." It is ridiculous, and way too religious for me. I am a passionate young woman for Christ, but I am by no means "religious." I have a relationship, not a religion. In any case, what is so wrong with finding a friend who shares the same passion in life? Saying "i heart Cheese us, too!" is completely different from saying "you have to believe in JC or you will dead for ever!"

milkabum
06-04-2006, 04:37 PM
Here's a question for you -

I have seen Christmas trees and many different colors of wreaths, but nothing for Channukah? Did VMK have anything at all for Channukah last year? If so - I would heart know - never seen it.

(And yes, I realize there are other religions that do not celebrate either, I am just asking about Channukah. :) )

-Jegrezo
I'm not sure this answers your question, but there was a pin with a dradle on it.
paw: Emily

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 04:37 PM
I agree to all of you that agree with this

VMK is a virtual game. If your religion is going to be changed over a virtual game something must be stopped


This is probably the best statement said on this thread so far lol.

DixieIrishRose
06-04-2006, 05:12 PM
As far as I am concerned as long as noone is trying to "convert" me or instigate a fight with me, I don't mind people asserting their beliefs in their titles.
It's perfectly normal for people to identify themselves by their beliefs.

Live and let live as long as it's kid friendly...

:)

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 05:21 PM
I totally understand what you are saying, but I am here talking about it being in signatures. Not trying to "convert" people. I am actually offended by the term "convert." It is ridiculous, and way too religious for me. I am a passionate young woman for Christ, but I am by no means "religious." I have a relationship, not a religion. In any case, what is so wrong with finding a friend who shares the same passion in life? Saying "i heart Cheese us, too!" is completely different from saying "you have to believe in JC or you will dead for ever!"
I even said earlier that I don't care if someone has it in their signatures. I'm talking about those that get up and start preaching in public areas.
A signature is something someone can read voluntarily.
But standing up and preaching to people in the public areas is disrespectful to everyone.

McHootle
06-04-2006, 05:47 PM
I even said earlier that I don't care if someone has it in their signatures. I'm talking about those that get up and start preaching in public areas.
A signature is something someone can read voluntarily.
But standing up and preaching to people in the public areas is disrespectful to everyone.

Exactly my point from earlier only far more concise LOL. Summed it up better than I did. I was in a ranty mood ;)

lovethattink
06-04-2006, 06:18 PM
I totally understand what you are saying, but I am here talking about it being in signatures. Not trying to "convert" people. I am actually offended by the term "convert." It is ridiculous, and way too religious for me. I am a passionate young woman for Christ, but I am by no means "religious." I have a relationship, not a religion. In any case, what is so wrong with finding a friend who shares the same passion in life? Saying "i heart Cheese us, too!" is completely different from saying "you have to believe in JC or you will dead for ever!"

I have a relationship too. Would be happy to have some fish talk with you. Although I am religious about Mcdonald's and for some reason I haven't become a BigMac yet, :confused3 . I don't think anyone's signature in VMK would affect my belief system. One of my best friends in vmk is goth and we've never had a problem. Hi Gothprincesss, if you're reading this! You rock!

Disney Dreams
06-04-2006, 06:37 PM
Wow! I did not know - and find it fascinating - that "JC" is even in the VMK dictionary. With all the many things we cannot say - we can say "JC"? That is really interesting to me. One has to wonder why that has been very carefully and decisively left in a very recently and thoroughly editted dictionary.

As to religion's place in VMK, I don't believe that VMK should place religion upon players, but if players chose to bring it into their games, rooms, and discussions, I think that is all part of what vmk allows us to do - share, create, and maybe even expand our thoughts.

Separate thought: Anyone have a picture of the pin with a dreidel on it? I KNOW I have never seen that one.

-Disney Dreams / Jegrezo

ShadowKittyKat
06-04-2006, 06:44 PM
Wow! I did not know - and find it fascinating - that "JC" is even in the VMK dictionary. With all the many things we cannot say - we can say "JC"?

No, we cannot say "JC" in any form of capital letters, spaces, etc.

This is a good thing. It has been in the dictionary, but it has been taken out because I know people have been using it; not the way VMK meant. They meant "Jungle Cruise", but others most likely thought differently...

Belle1997
06-04-2006, 06:45 PM
Well I think it is ok in sigs. Does no harm and it is nice to meet others who have the same interest that I do. Oh by the way. I do not think of myself as religious. To me it is a relationship not a religion. And a word to caution on people who profess their faith in there sigs. People watch how you treat other players and how you talk, so if you do put you are a Christian remember that how you act can influence what people think. Not your sig your actions speak louder than anything you write.

So If I put ancient in my sig is that wrong because it might offend the young who thing this game was made for there age group. No and if it does that is their issue.

If I put I hat the green car quest. Might offend the ones who got the car but will encourage others who think the same thing.

Yes religion is a touchy subject for many. And I never understood why. I have friends of all religions and we talk about are faith openly only because it is not an I am right you are wrong conversation. It is about understanding. I may not agree with their faith. But the biggest most important message that I have learned is to love your neighbour. And we are all nieghbours in one way or another. And if we love there is no issue.

:)

surfcruiser
06-04-2006, 06:53 PM
Actually Walt Disney was named after his parent's pastor. Prayer had a huge impact on Walt and his career. Here are some links that are interesting.

http://www.disneydreamer.com/Waltfaith.htm

http://www.hollywoodjesus.com/disney_mouse.htm



Fighting is against vmk values...just don't do it.


Thanks lovethattink, I HEART this kind of stuff. I spend countless hours researching what made Walt tick, and these links add a lot to that...

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 07:12 PM
Yes religion is a touchy subject for many. And I never understood why. I have friends of all religions and we talk about are faith openly only because it is not an I am right you are wrong conversation. It is about understanding. I may not agree with their faith. But the biggest most important message that I have learned is to love your neighbour. And we are all nieghbours in one way or another. And if we love there is no issue.

:)
Yes. My best friend and I have slightly different beliefs (both Christian but some differences) and we have always talked openly about those differences. And we found that if we can't agree on a certain thing, we just agree to disagree. We don't try to change what the other believes.
As I have friends all over the world thanks to the net, I have friends that are of many different religions and backgrounds. We can all discuss our faiths and the differences without being rude and overbearing.
I have found that those that are touchy about religion are those that have some sort of doubts about their faith. Or they are so deeply entrenched that they believe that everyone has to believe the way they do.

I get touchy only when someone is trying to force their beliefs on me. Then I usually end the conversation and leave. :D

AmberDaze
06-04-2006, 07:50 PM
Anyone have a picture of the pin with a dreidel on it? I KNOW I have never seen that one.

-Disney Dreams / Jegrezo

I too would like to see all vmk had during Chanukkah :).

Disney Dreams
06-04-2006, 07:56 PM
No, we cannot say "JC" in any form of capital letters, spaces, etc.

This is a good thing. It has been in the dictionary, but it has been taken out because I know people have been using it; not the way VMK meant. They meant "Jungle Cruise", but others most likely thought differently...

Ah - thanks for clarifying. I was in queue when I wrote the above post so I was not able to check, I was going off of what ppl had posted. Thanks, again,
Disney Dreams

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 08:08 PM
I too would like to see all vmk had during Chanukkah :).
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/10/starofmickeypin1fa.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Star of Mickey Pin

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 08:15 PM
No, we cannot say "JC" in any form of capital letters, spaces, etc.

This is a good thing. It has been in the dictionary, but it has been taken out because I know people have been using it; not the way VMK meant. They meant "Jungle Cruise", but others most likely thought differently...

In computer jargon, JC also means "Just Curious". ;)

AmberDaze
06-04-2006, 08:33 PM
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/10/starofmickeypin1fa.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Star of Mickey Pin

Do you have a pic?

KrazyPete
06-04-2006, 08:36 PM
There are some very good points being made. You are right that talking about a favorite music group doesn't create the same type of response in people as talking about religion. It is a hot button topic. But you can substitute whatever you want in the example. It's not offesive to me for someone to say, "Allah is god" in a public area of the game. It would be offensive for someone to tell me that I have to stop being an Evangelical Christian in order to play the game.

It's ok to bring Fall Out Boy to the game but check Jesus at the door? To tell a person of faith to keep it to themselves not only defies religion, it defies logic. ;)

maliboomer
06-04-2006, 08:39 PM
Yes, I'm pretty sure this was clarified but goth isn't a religion, just a subculture from that horrific period called the 80's which I'm so glad I missed.. by 14 days.
I like to steal pink paint and painbrushes from the Art Dept. and pretty-fy the poor ones at our school. They don't appreciate it as much :p.

I don't think it will be long until the P.C monster (hah.) makes it socially incorrect to publicly say your religion. And since that's the general god Disney worships, the signatures might go bye-bye as well.

Hmmm.

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 08:43 PM
In the Catholic religion (a sect of Christianity) , it is believed that the better Catholic will not run around screaming to the world of his or her faith. It is believed that the better Catholic will worship in private.

maliboomer
06-04-2006, 08:47 PM
Exactly, the M in VMK stands for Magic, not Missionary. :p

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 08:49 PM
Exactly, the M in VMK stands for Magic, not Missionary.

:rotfl2: That was good, Maliboomer...lol.

Captain Brain
06-04-2006, 08:55 PM
I think that if in RL WDW people can yell "Thanks Be to GOD for this beautiful day at EPCOT" than I should be able to say that I heart the King of Kings.

I know that you cannot be a missionary in VMK, that is just weird. I will say when I go to Town Square, as I do a lot, I will look at the flag and say: Cheese us bless am ic a. ;)

KrazyPete
06-04-2006, 09:04 PM
In the Catholic religion (a sect of Christianity) , it is believed that the better Catholic will not run around screaming to the world of his or her faith. It is believed that the better Catholic will worship in private.

I don't think we are talking about any type of public "worship" or "prayer." To an extent I agree with you. You should not put your faith on display so that people will notice what a "religious" person you are. But faith is not a "private" matter to be hidden away in prayer closets. In one way or another it effects everything you do. Even playing a game like VMK.

In the game I have met some people that I consider friends. I have not tried to convert anyone but I have promised to "talk to the big guy upstairs" when a VMK friend was going through a difficult time. I'm not proselytizing anyone but if you hang around me long enough it just comes out. It's real to me and it would be wrong for me to try to hide it.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what this discussion is about?

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 09:11 PM
I don't think we are talking about any type of public "worship" or "prayer." To an extent I agree with you. You should not put your faith on display so that people will notice what a "religious" person you are. But faith is not a "private" matter to be hidden away in prayer closets. In one way or another it effects everything you do. Even playing a game like VMK.



Actually, in the Catholic religion, you are told to pray alone in a closed room with no one else present. You are also told to keep faith private, to an extent. But this is just that religion, all these people must not be Catholics...or least not devout Catholics...that is just my observation.

KrazyPete
06-04-2006, 09:45 PM
Actually, in the Catholic religion, you are told to pray alone in a closed room with no one else present. You are also told to keep faith private, to an extent. But this is just that religion, all these people must not be Catholics...or least not devout Catholics...that is just my observation.

I'm familiar with the scripture about praying in private. I'm not a Catholic but I'm pretty sure they have do have corporate worship. However, I cannot speak intelligently on what a Catholic believes so I won't try.

In my limited understanding of the Bible and it's teachings, I cannot compartmentalize my spiritual life from secular one. That's the bottom line for me. I know not everyone reading this thread believes in God and those that do relate to Him in different ways. But, let me just ask this and I will go to bed and look forward to reading your thoughtful responses in the morning. ;)

If there is a God who created the universe. And if that God made Himself accessible to you so that you could have a relationship with Him. And in the context of that relationship you felt depth of His love and power of His grace. How could you keep that inside? Would that even be right?

Again, I'm not trying to convert anyone. I'm trying to explain why, from my point of view, religion is perfectly acceptable in a multiplayer game like VMK.

cteddiesgirl
06-04-2006, 09:57 PM
I don't think we are talking about any type of public "worship" or "prayer." To an extent I agree with you. You should not put your faith on display so that people will notice what a "religious" person you are. But faith is not a "private" matter to be hidden away in prayer closets. In one way or another it effects everything you do. Even playing a game like VMK.

In the game I have met some people that I consider friends. I have not tried to convert anyone but I have promised to "talk to the big guy upstairs" when a VMK friend was going through a difficult time. I'm not proselytizing anyone but if you hang around me long enough it just comes out. It's real to me and it would be wrong for me to try to hide it.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what this discussion is about?Actually, in the Catholic religion, you are told to pray alone in a closed room with no one else present. You are also told to keep faith private, to an extent. But this is just that religion, all these people must not be Catholics...or least not devout Catholics...that is just my observation.
Actually, I was not raised Catholic. But I was raised that your faith is between you and God. In my views, it is a private matter. It is a relationship between you and God. No one else come into that picture. If there is, then you are following that person's beliefs and not what your heart/conscience (God) is telling you.

That is the way I believe. If you listen and believe what someone is telling you is their truth over what your heart is telling you, then you are following that person and not God. And one person's "truth" may not be another person's. Therein lies the fact that faith is a very personal and private thing.

Some may believe the same way, many do not. And I can respect that.

I don't say that a person should check their faith or beliefs at the VMK "door". If they have faith, it cannot leave them when they are playing an online game. But they can control where and to whom they talk about that faith.

And KrazyPete, saying "Allah is God" may not be offensive to you or me, but it may be to someone who does not believe that. Would it be offensive to you if I said Satan is God? I certainly know it would be to many people. And yet, to those that worship him, he is their god.

Saying you'll "talk to the big guy upstairs" when a person is having problems is fine with me. It's really just people that get up and say "Jesus dead for you and you have to believe that way or else" that annoys me.
And isn't it funny that it annoys me when I'm Christian? It shouldn't should it? According to some anyways. ;)
But, I was raised that I should respect the fact that not everyone believes as I do. In fact, I don't believe the exact same things that my mom did. But I still believe that she is one of God's angels. As I also believe that everyone is God's child. And the way that they may or may not worship should be left up to them. Not us. That is why God gave us free will and a conscience.

But that's my belief. :)

Do you have a pic?
Uh...That is the pic. Do you not see it? :confused3

Loves Disney
06-04-2006, 10:08 PM
I am not about to go on and on about what I believe, as that has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with the topic at hand and Catholics believe a relationship with God is a one on one thing, not a two on the world thing. In this religious faith, it is believed that in order to have a personal relationship with God, the follower must devote his or her prayers to only God and not with the world. In this faith, to tell everyone your "prayers" is like telling everyone secrets about, say, a marriage relationship. Evidently a wife or a husband wouldn't want his or her partner to tell the world everything about him or her, right? It is asked, in this religion, why must a person yell to the world what he or she may believe? Isn't it fine just knowing that both the follower and God have a strong relationship?

Again, I am only backing up the Catholic religion as that is the one I know best. I cannot say what is believed in other religions (even as I may have an idea, I am not clear on facts). All I am saying is, the people in vmk who walk around preaching are not Catholics. If they were real Catholics they would understand this part of the belief.

All I am doing here is putting down the facts lol of this particular religion. Do with it what you may lol.

EDIT TO ADD: cteddiesgirl, I was writing this before you posted lol, sorry if the first part echoes what you wrote lol... :blush:

AND: I again agree with you! LOL.

caribbound
06-04-2006, 10:17 PM
Actually, in the Catholic religion, you are told to pray alone in a closed room with no one else present. You are also told to keep faith private, to an extent. But this is just that religion, all these people must not be Catholics...or least not devout Catholics...that is just my observation.
My guess is no, they're probably not, though some may be.

One of my best friends is a devout Catholic. In the past 8 yrs I've noticed her talking about stuff more like what I'd expect from an evangelical church. Do I doubt she has swayed from her foundation? No, yet I haven't spent enough time to ask (we haven't lived in same state since graduating 17 yrs ago). My apologies, I don't know enough about Catholic churches these days to know what activities are promoted. We were comfortable with church/faith stuff, because it was a topic we were both passionate about and ironically didn't challenge each other on as we did (at least she did me) on so many other things. In a school like UW Madison (40,000 kids) it's always good to have faith grounded friends.

OT, sort of, I think we should have a Cheese Us Greets Us :grouphug: meeting room a couple times so those who want to develop a faith based friends list can find them. I haven't seen many of you Dis people except DaraSue but I don't know many vmk names so wouldn't know if you don't have Dis in your sig. :confused3

KrazyPete
06-04-2006, 10:40 PM
I could not sleep. I'm drawn to this thread like a Zeta Girl to a gathering of Alpha Males. :teeth:

I have to think about this stuff for a while. You all make very good points and I can understand where you are coming from. It helps me get outside of my Evangelical worldview and try to see God from another perspective.

Explain to me how two people can have opposing personal views of God and both of their beliefs can be true. I understand that if I believe Jesus is God then that is what I perceive to be true. If someone else believes that Satan is God then that is what they perceive to be true. We both perceive that our beliefs are true but since our beliefs are contradictory either one of us is right and the other is wrong, or we are both wrong. Right?

Maleficent2
06-04-2006, 11:51 PM
boy has this thread strayed way :offtopic:

maliboomer
06-04-2006, 11:57 PM
^ Lol, mal, I was just about to say something about the raven paradox when I realized how far we'd strayed from the original topic.

cteddiesgirl
06-05-2006, 12:15 AM
I could not sleep. I'm drawn to this thread like a Zeta Girl to a gathering of Alpha Males. :teeth:

I have to think about this stuff for a while. You all make very good points and I can understand where you are coming from. It helps me get outside of my Evangelical worldview and try to see God from another perspective.

Explain to me how two people can have opposing personal views of God and both of their beliefs can be true. I understand that if I believe Jesus is God then that is what I perceive to be true. If someone else believes that Satan is God then that is what they perceive to be true. We both perceive that our beliefs are true but since our beliefs are contradictory either one of us is right and the other is wrong, or we are both wrong. Right?
Well, I believe that most people believe the way that is right for them. This is why faith is such a personal thing. You don't believe everything exactly they same way as your pastor right? Each person takes a part of faith that they feel is right for them. Some Christians believe that drinking any alcohol is against their beliefs. And yet Jesus drank wine. So for me, there is no religious belief to keep me from drinking (moderately). And yet both I and the teetotaler are both Christians. Just remember that there are many forms of Christianity and many differences in the people within on sect.
As for the Jewish, they do not believe that Jesus was the son of God (or God, depending on your view). And yet they still believe in God. It is what works for them. The Satanist believes that Satan is his/her god. That may be what works for them. I don't have to believe that. I don't even have to like it. But I have to respect that that is their belief and not try to shove my own beliefs down their throats. And they have to respect mine.
Isn't also amazing how it's mostly Christians actively trying to convert people and not those of other religions? :teeth:

But everything has to do with a person's personal experiences in life. No two people will have the exact same experiences. It's the same with faith. No two people will have the same experience with faith and so everyone will believe something slightly (or vastly) different.

And, as stated in One of my fave movies "Dogma"
Serendipity: When are you people going to learn? It's not about who's right or wrong. No denomination's nailed it yet, and they never will because they're all too self-righteous to realize that it doesn't matter what you have faith in, just that you have faith. Your hearts are in the right place, but your brains need to wake up.

and as for broadening your belief and faith from the same film:
Rufus: He still digs humanity, but it bothers Him to see the crap that gets carried out in His name - wars, bigotry, but especially the factioning of all the religions. He said humanity took a good idea and, like always, built a belief structure on it.
Bethany: Having beliefs isn't good?
Rufus: I think it's better to have ideas. You can change an idea. Changing a belief is trickier. Life should malleable and progressive; working from idea to idea permits that. Beliefs anchor you to certain points and limit growth; new ideas can't generate. Life becomes stagnant.

:)

boy has this thread strayed way :offtopic:
Yes it has. Was just thinking that. :)

But my point still remains that saying stuff in your signatures is fine with me. Just don't be preaching to all out on Main Street. I know there are Jewish and possibly Muslim, Wiccan, Agnostic, Hindu, Buddhist, Taoist, Sikh, Baha'i, Shinto, Vodun, and many more. And these people should not be practically forced to "hear" what people think they should believe.

Disney Dreams
06-05-2006, 03:18 AM
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/10/starofmickeypin1fa.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Star of Mickey Pin

Cool. So the Star of Mickey Pin and the Pin with a Dreidel are the same. Thanks for the photo. Maybe this year VMK will have a menorah. And how cool would it be if the candles could be "lit"?

Thanks again for the photo,
Disney Dreams

Disney Dreams
06-05-2006, 04:02 AM
... Explain to me how two people can have opposing personal views of God and both of their beliefs can be true. I understand that if I believe Jesus is God then that is what I perceive to be true. If someone else believes that Satan is God then that is what they perceive to be true. We both perceive that our beliefs are true but since our beliefs are contradictory either one of us is right and the other is wrong, or we are both wrong. Right?

KrazyPete, I think that your very wise question above represents the entire reason that the issue of religion has been heated amongst so many for centuries.

No one knows with 100% certainty who G-d is or how G-d came to be. The fact that the belief by one group or another cannot be proven, allows the differences of beliefs to continue. We have no possible way to know who is right or wrong.

If you and I were to disagree over whether or not an ice cube can be reduced to a liquid state, we could prove this to be true, very easily in fact. No one's beliefs about G-d can be proven, allowing one of the most heated debates of all time to continue.

The key, of course, is to learn to accept that others have differing views and that although they may not match mine, that does not matter. I am comfortable in my beliefs (which I feel no need to go into here) and understand that others may not believe the same as I. To accept that this is ok is truly what we - as a world community - need to learn. Sadly, this has eluded many of our fellow "global citizens" for centuries.

(Note: For anyone who is wondering, in the Jewish religion the word G-d is never written out in its entirety as someday the paper that the word is written on will be destroyed. Or in this case, the word will someday be deleted, whereby destroying or deleting the name of G-d. Just thought I would explain so that no one has to ask.)

Respectfully,
Disney Dreams

lovethattink
06-05-2006, 06:59 AM
boy has this thread strayed way :offtopic:

Yes Mal, it has. But amazingly it has remained a civil and thought provoking discussion.

In the Catholic religion (a sect of Christianity) , it is believed that the better Catholic will not run around screaming to the world of his or her faith. It is believed that the better Catholic will worship in private.

This is partially correct in my opinion. The Roman Catholic religion does believe in outreach to the community and thus showing the love of Christ through their actions. As for complete worship in private, I think if this was true, there would not be so many masses offered so many days and times of the week. The fact that so many catholic churches have weekly youth activites, senior events, dinners, etc. shows that they do believe in socializing with others, thus sharing their faith.

This from the Pope...Mission work not only philanthropic, Pope says

Jun. 02 (CWNews.com) - The goal of Catholic missionary work is not merely "philanthropic or social," Pope Benedict XVI (bio - news) writes in his message for the 80th World Mission Sunday.


Missionary work is the task of every Christian community, the Pope says, and the essence of that task is "to communicate God Who is Love." So missionaries must be motivated by love of God, and there work should help people enter into communion with God through his Church.

And here is a link with statements from the Pope about lay work. http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=44500








It's ok to bring Fall Out Boy to the game but check Jesus at the door? To tell a person of faith to keep it to themselves not only defies religion, it defies logic. ;)

Oh, the seeds...

Maleficent2
06-05-2006, 08:29 AM
Yes Mal, it has. But amazingly it has remained a civil and thought provoking discussion.


I hope it can remain so.

Loves Disney
06-05-2006, 08:31 AM
Lovethattink, of course Christians are reminded to share their loyalty to the commandments and get involved with events. In the Catholic religion, it is okay to worship openly with other members of that faith...it is expected to avoid such obvious worship in public places around people of a different faith. That is the reason I brought this particular religion into focus; vmk is a public place filled with people of various faiths.

That is all I meant when I said private prayer, just to clarify things lol.

I think this thread has remained somewhat on topic...I mean, in every post the poster is trying to back up his or her point and opinion when it comes to allowing signatures with faith mentioned. It may not be written in black type, but between the letters I can see that each post has remained on topic. Not only that, but this thread certainly does initiate thinking...

Maleficent2
06-05-2006, 09:09 AM
Why do people put like, I am goth so deal with it or I believe in JC so you should to. I think it is something that should be cancelled out of the VMK dctionary because I see people get in fights over there religion in a room or something. I see goth clubs and other rooms to do witht his stuff. I think it is begining to be another problem in VMk because everyone is starting to do it and everyone is getting in fights.

What do you think :confused3

It is no where near the orginial topic which was people having sigs with their religion in them. Should it be allowed?? your thoughts.....


As long as it stays a civil discussion it may remain.


Mal

lovethattink
06-05-2006, 09:26 AM
I think it should remain open.

HeDiedxILive
06-05-2006, 02:39 PM
as far as keeping your faith private... i have a hard time undertanding that. please realize that i am not bashing this way of thinking, but i cannot comprehend how anyone who has the love, joy, and passion of God in their hearts could keep it bottled up inside. i know i can't! He has done so much for me! He deserves to be praised, and raved about!

its hard for me to keep up with this thread, as much as i love it!

in any case,

sigs - yes
friendly discussion - yes
preaching "believe or else!" - no.




i would love some believers as VMK friends, i would not recognize any of you. we should arrange a meeting! :wave:

Loves Disney
06-05-2006, 02:57 PM
as far as keeping your faith private... i have a hard time undertanding that. please realize that i am not bashing this way of thinking, but i cannot comprehend how anyone who has the love, joy, and passion of God in their hearts could keep it bottled up inside. i know i can't! He has done so much for me! He deserves to be praised, and raved about!



I never said it was kept "bottled up". I said that for this religion, the faith can be openly and emotionally expressed in and around that religious group...i.e., mass, social events, charities, etc. I said while in prayer, the followers of this religion are supposed to pray in private. Also, I said that it is believed to NOT go around yelling this faith around in the open public...around people of different religions. I mean, I don't like to walk around hearing people screaming THEIR faith to me when it isn't something I believe. I respect them and what they may believe, but I don't need to hear it because I don't always agree with what they may say.

This is why I think it is fine for the signatures to read their faith, but they do not need to go around VMK singing and preaching it for people of other religions to hear. It is disrespectful, imho. It may also make some feel uncomfortable to hear words being spoken that totally contradict what they believe. Now, I am not saying that typing things that advocate simple prayer for better wellness or dreams is bad. I don't mind reading that. What I do mind is people saying things that would suggest their faith is better. I have seen some people say, "My king dead for us, you must live for him." Some people may find this offensive. Now, I am a Catholic, I won't deny that at all, and yet, things like that still get to me because I know how people of other religions may feel because I know how I would feel if I was not of this religion.

In short, VMK is NOT the place to speak of religion.

lovethattink
06-05-2006, 03:19 PM
I had a wonderful experience a few weeks ago meeting a VMK Dis family at the Animal Kingdom. We rode Everest, walked around and ate at the Flame Tree BBQ. Before we ate the dh of this family blessed the food. It was very nice to spend some time with fellow VMKer's at AK and pray with them. It made the meet all the more special that we had our belief in common as well! Was prayer called for? Why not? We'd do it at home, why not in public. Did we advertise it? No. Did other's see us? Maybe, but no one came to our table and told us we offended them.

Loves Disney
06-05-2006, 03:36 PM
I had a wonderful experience a few weeks ago meeting a VMK Dis family at the Animal Kingdom. We rode Everest, walked around and ate at the Flame Tree BBQ. Before we ate the dh of this family blessed the food. It was very nice to spend some time with fellow VMKer's at AK and pray with them. It made the meet all the more special that we had our belief in common as well! Was prayer called for? Why not? We'd do it at home, why not in public. Did we advertise it? No. Did other's see us? Maybe, but no one came to our table and told us we offended them.

Because you kept it to yourselves. ;)

Now, I am not going to debate religion, and the only reason I posted to this thread was because I don't think faith should be screamed out and around in vmk. I am not going to sit here and try to prove my religion as anything better. I am a Christian raised into and by a Christian family, but I am not one to scream, "Halleluiah" if you catch my drift. lol.

I am sensing this thread is starting to travel a more argumentative road, and I simply don't want to take part in that lol. That would contradict all I have said before.

Let me leave from this thread with a few rhetorical questions...

Would you (you, meaning general lol) go to someone and essentially say, "Believe what I believe otherwise you are wrong"? Because that is typically what is happening even though the wording may be different and the situation may not be so direct to it.

Why MUST people know what you believe? If someone doesn't ask you about your faith, why is it important to aware complete strangers that you believe in such-a-such religion? If you were totally secure of your faith, isn't it enough to just accept it instead of impressing it upon people who probably don't care? (I know this could be argued to a large extent, but I mean this in a rhetorical sense).

Now, I am not suggesting my faith in those questions, just throwing it out there for further thought. My time has far gone experation on this thread.

Master Gracy
06-06-2006, 06:12 AM
im a christian myself but i dont feel the need to express it on vmk.
yesterday I met someone whoses sig said "I heart the sun who died on the cross" and other similer statements.
I mean do you find people pressuring you into their religion in the real disney parks?(also i dislike cheerleaders, way too many of them in vmk :cheer2: :furious: )
thets my two cents...andy

lovethattink
06-06-2006, 06:45 AM
You know, I must not be running into the same Christians in vmk that other's are. The ones I have met have been great. They would never pressure anyone to believe only their way. They would never pick a fight with someone. Some of the DIS Christians I have run into in vmk and are wonderful are littlebelle, pinkgirlygirl, palmnut, bluemanlyguy, surfcruiser, missypooh, etc. I don't think our signatures reflect our religion. I know our names sure don't. But by being friends and chatting we discovered Jesus as our commonality. I don't think a single one of us shouted from the mountain top. It just came out in the course of discussion at some some point in the friendship.

Master Gracy
06-06-2006, 07:14 AM
religion brings people together in thet way, but as long as no one pressures you or tries to force their religion upon you its fine.

caribbound
06-06-2006, 11:29 AM
Isn't also amazing how it's mostly Christians actively trying to convert people and not those of other religions? :teeth:


And, as stated in One of my fave movies "Dogma"
Serendipity: When are you people going to learn? It's not about who's right or wrong. No denomination's nailed it yet, and they never will because they're all too self-righteous to realize that it doesn't matter what you have faith in, just that you have faith. Your hearts are in the right place, but your brains need to wake up.

and as for broadening your belief and faith from the same film:
Rufus: He still digs humanity, but it bothers Him to see the crap that gets carried out in His name - wars, bigotry, but especially the factioning of all the religions. He said humanity took a good idea and, like always, built a belief structure on it.
Bethany: Having beliefs isn't good?
Rufus: I think it's better to have ideas. You can change an idea. Changing a belief is trickier. Life should malleable and progressive; working from idea to idea permits that. Beliefs anchor you to certain points and limit growth; new ideas can't generate. Life becomes stagnant.

.

The sole basis of Christianity is that there is ONE God, and only ONE ticket to heaven. Different denominations with their own additions, which I was not raised with, for the most part don't disagree on the ONEness of that, with a few exceptions.
We have missionaries and such, because that is what Jesus comissioned beginning with the 11 disciples and Paul is a particularly good example for us to follow. For reference, so nobody thinks these are my ideas, Mark 1:17 and Mark 16:15-16, summarized by Jesus telling the disciples He will make them fishers of men (leaving the boat behind) and just before His ascension to heaven, to go into all the world and preach the good news. Also Matthew 28:16-20.

That doesn't mean someone of a different religion should be less valued any more than someone of a different age or race or hair color. My God loves them and expects us to also.

Regarding the movie, I've not seen it, have heard of it and am now intrigued that on a rainy week I'll have to borrow it from the library. popcorn:: Nonetheless, it is a fiction movie, just as The DaVinci Code is FICTION and proven false by art historians and theologians and such where the author claims to have facts. I've heard it's a good mystery novel, but way off base if people are going to believe the guy knows anything about history. :furious:

I mean do you find people pressuring you into their religion in the real disney parks? .
I'm on vacation with my family making sure my kids don't get lost when I'm in the parks so I don't talk to many people there. Plus I'm a quiet person by nature in a group setting, but can write a book. VMK is much more interactive and for some, relationship building. I've not found it so, but I'm new and I guess I've just not found the right friends yet. I still have people mailing for me to join their cute or boot game. Yeah. :rotfl2:

Signatures only state who a person is, whether they be sporty, religious, or desperate for taken. :sad2: It's a way of identifying who you might want to really be friends with, not just adding names to your list. People on stage of Mark Twain taking an extremist form of witnessing, especially if condemning, are giving Christianity the bad rep with negative feelings. I think having a simple witnessing signature and then being helpful with politeness, especially at the mountain maze for quests would have a much bigger impact.

This thread is losing it's original positive vibes and thoughtfulness. Be careful. :goodvibes

(thanks for the warning below on movie. ratedR doesn't bother me, constant swearing especially f--- does. thought I'd add this here rather than a whole new post.btw, I'm Terri also :) )

cteddiesgirl
06-06-2006, 11:57 AM
Regarding the movie, I've not seen it, have heard of it and am now intrigued that on a rainy week I'll have to borrow it from the library. popcorn:: Nonetheless, it is a fiction movie, just as The DaVinci Code is FICTION and proven false where the author claims to have facts by art historians and theologians and such. I've heard it's a good mystery novel, but way off base if people are going to believe the guy knows anything about history. :furious:

Actually, you might not want to see Dogma. It has been proven that many people find it offensive if taken seriously. It is meant to be kind of an almost black comedy. But it has sexual references, vulgar language (the f word is used very frequently by one of the characters), slight drug use and uses crude humor. So it's rated R. But beyond that, it brings up many points about what has happened with and in the Christian religion.
So if you want to watch it, go ahead. But be warned that you might now care for it. Also, keep in mind that the writer/director/producer/actor of the film was raised as and is Catholic. :)

BriarRosie
06-06-2006, 12:28 PM
If anyone wants an example of how annoying unsolicited forced talk about religion can be, allow me to share my experience. I've made no secret about being Jewish, as many know I've put together a Hanukkah themed room. I love the holidays, and I enjoy viewing Christmas decorations as much as the next person. My best friend is Catholic, and when religion has come up, it's been a natural part of conversation. Neither of us get offended by comparative talk about our religions.

So now that I've given my disclaimer, I'll share what does offend me.
Proselytizing by complete strangers. I've seen these folks on the Quad at college, and they were easily avoidable. But recently, I had an experience at my local library.

I happened to run into one of my friends at the library, and we stopped to chat near the exit when some young guy was hovering nearby. He interjected, saying, "Kim?" as if he thought he knew me. It was only an excuse to invade our private conversation, as he then tried to inform us about his faith. It was neither welcomed nor wanted, and what did I do?

Lambasted the poor sucker with my sharp tongue. By the time I was through with him, I hope he realized that he should not interrupt private conversations with forced talk about religion. I told him that he was incredibly rude for assuming that we weren't happy with our own faith, and that people will listen to others on THEIR own terms.

I find it ironic that those who wish to stop me solely to share views about their faith are the least likely to stop and listen if you turned the tables on them and wished to share views about yours.

Yes, it made me angry, and I'm sure it shows in my tirade. But overall, I don't mind if you put your faith in your signature. I find nothing offensive about that. I only find that if you force your faith on others, it's offensive.

Practice your faith in front of me. I don't mind! I would have enjoyed seeing lovethattink say a prayer over the food. There's a prayer in Hebrew for food, but I rarely use it. I tend to trot it out during the Jewish holidays. ;)
I've been to Catholic mass, in support of friends on their special days.

So yes, I do have an appreciation for people of other faiths.
Practice your faith. Live your faith. Just be aware that preaching the faith
to those who have established belief systems of their own may often annoy the heck out of them. ;)

Disney Dreams
06-06-2006, 01:07 PM
... But overall, I don't mind if you put your faith in your signature. I find nothing offensive about that. I only find that if you force your faith on others, it's offensive....


Exactly.

VMK_Princess_Chloe
06-06-2006, 02:57 PM
i don't think there is a problem with it in signatures. i am proud of my faith and i am not ashamed to show it.

what i DO disagree with is the arguing.

although mine does say "i know the King of Kings", i have not come across any problems with anyone. the only responses i get are "hey i know the King of Kings, too!" or "i heart your profile!"

it is nice to be able to befriend people who share a same main interest as i.


Amen!! I have commented to many people who have that in their signature.. that I do too. I am a Christian.. while I try to live by example and show others what it's about. I will not force it on anyone. It's not my place to judge anyone.. but it is my job to be a deciple and spread the word.. and if having something like "I know the king of kings" plants a seed in one persons life or sparks one persons interest to know more.. then i've done a good thing. There's nothing wrong with stating what you believe in and being proud of it. Fighting and arguing over it should be delt with and reported.. just as any fighting over anything should be.
But I'm sick of people telling me in a free country where I'm allowed to believe whatever I want.. that I can't freely express myself as a Christian. I will never stop expressing my self as a Christian and I shouldn't be forced to. As far as school use to go.. when I was in it.. I was in it when we could still say the pledge out loud and we were able to say "under God" and I always prayed anyway.. not allowed or in a big group.. but by myself.

KrazyPete
06-06-2006, 09:09 PM
I just found this over on VMK forums. Apparently a player recieved the following warning in the game.

http://home.earthlink.net/~ljames4723/staff.jpg

Here's a link to the original thread:
VMKForums.com (http://www.vmkforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63099)

EDIT:
This is not in the VMK values but it is number one under the "House Rules."

"In VMK when it comes to messaging, or chat of any kind, we don't allow obscene, racist, or sexually explicit language, nor do we allow chat or activities that are not consistent with the VMK site. We reserve the right to remove postings and communications that defame or insult anyone, as well as notes that are abusive or hateful. Political or religious statements are not appropriate in VMK. Any harassing comments or messages that might be construed as stalking will be deleted and made available to the proper law-enforcement officials." ~Link (http://vmk.disney.go.com/vmk/en_US/help/index?name=HouseRulesPage)

This rule is not new. The last update to the house rules was 04/17/06.

Witnessing Christian, consider thyself muzzled. Everybody else, watch yo'sef

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 03:47 PM
I do try to be really respectful of all beliefs, but I get hotheaded and sometimes say things that I usually regret when I see Christianity attacked. But that is not in VMK, it is mostly on the CB. Actually I have gotten several PM's here on the DIS commenting on my sig in a positive light in both DIS and VMK. I have had friends who are Atheists who I have talked with about our beliefs. I have stopped with them as I don't want it to get in between our friendships.

But I am sometimes to be ashamed to be christian because some of the things done in "God's Name." Not in the beliefs, but being stereotyped along with the minority. As someone said in a thread in the CB, you will never hear of the good stuff that churches do like fund raise for those hurt by Katrina and help give food to the homeless. It doesn't make good news. They would rather have news worthy story that says, "Christians Stone a Homosexual Couple" than the other stuff I mentioned.

I am sorry about my rant, if it affends you, I will gladly change it. As long as the fighting doesn't show up, I say the sigs should stay.

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 04:24 PM
Some Christians believe that drinking any alcohol is against their beliefs. And yet Jesus drank wine. So for me, there is no religious belief to keep me from drinking (moderately). And yet both I and the teetotaler are both Christians. Just remember that there are many forms of Christianity and many differences in the people within on sect.


Actually it is drunkeness that the Bible says is sinful because you are losing control of your actions which could lead you to do something you will regret. In the Bible body is considered to be the Temple of God and our souls are the caretakers, ( I think that is right, if I am wrong please correct me ) and if we lose control it is like the janitor taking the night off. Sorry that went off topic! :goodvibes

Captain Brain
06-07-2006, 04:53 PM
Hmm... Maybe they will start cracking down on people for saying: I heart Cheese us!

And front - I could just see you screaming Hallelujah, lol.

HeDiedxILive
06-07-2006, 05:16 PM
Actually it is drunkeness that the Bible says is sinful because you are losing control of your actions which could lead you to do something you will regret. In the Bible body is considered to be the Temple of God and our souls are the caretakers, ( I think that is right, if I am wrong please correct me ) and if we lose control it is like the janitor taking the night off. Sorry that went off topic! :goodvibes



ACTUALLY.... the word for "wine" and the word for "grape juice" in ancient Greek are the same.
And in any case, in biblical times the only choice they had was do drink fermented fluids, because they had no form of refrigeration. We have a choice, and Jesus was never drunk... :thumbsup2



Back on topic..........

The signatures bring people together the same way "I heart Fall Out Boy" sigs do. When my sig says "I know the King of Kings" my purpose is to meet other believers, not offend anyone or force anyone into my belief system.

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 05:20 PM
ACTUALLY.... the word for "wine" and the word for "grape juice" in ancient Greek are the same.
And in any case, in biblical times the only choice they had was do drink fermented fluids, because they had no form of refrigeration. We have a choice, and Jesus was never drunk... :thumbsup2



Back on topic..........

The signatures bring people together the same way "I heart Fall Out Boy" sigs do. When my sig says "I know the King of Kings" my purpose is to meet other believers, not offend anyone or force anyone into my belief system.

The thing about the fermented fluids I have heard, but wasn't sure if that was true.

Haha, I have never heard Cheese us before!

oh and I am a walking bill board to be banned then as I have Dis and a religious signature on VMK. lol

cteddiesgirl
06-07-2006, 06:14 PM
Actually it is drunkeness that the Bible says is sinful because you are losing control of your actions which could lead you to do something you will regret. In the Bible body is considered to be the Temple of God and our souls are the caretakers, ( I think that is right, if I am wrong please correct me ) and if we lose control it is like the janitor taking the night off. Sorry that went off topic! :goodvibes
I'm completely aware of that. Which is why I personally have no problems with drinking alcohol (in moderation). But I have family and friends who are Christian who believe that drinking Any alcohol is against their beliefs. And that includes wine.

ACTUALLY.... the word for "wine" and the word for "grape juice" in ancient Greek are the same.
And in any case, in biblical times the only choice they had was do drink fermented fluids, because they had no form of refrigeration. We have a choice, and Jesus was never drunk... :thumbsup2
Yes. And wine is nothing but fermented grape juice. So that is what they drank. In many cases, it was actually safer than drinking the water (considering everything they did in it).
But my point is that they drank wine, which has alcohol, and seen no religious problems with it. Jesus didn't get drunk because he chose to drink it in moderation. I'm not saying that I approve of going out and getting drunk every night. In fact I don't approve of it. And though I drink on occasion, I have not been drunk in more than 10 years.
So, I can not understand why some Christians don't approve of drinking any alcohol. Jesus drank wine without getting drunk. Why can't we? But, I respect that some believe that way and generally I choose not to drink around those people. But it also does not make either of us less Christian. We just happen to believe slightly differently. :)

caribbound
06-07-2006, 06:24 PM
Haha, I have never heard Cheese us before!

My 12 yr old had to point it out to me. I don't know if I never saw it or just didn't get it. I think I commented on the first religious sig I saw to him and he said 'oh yeah there's a lot of 'em.' , then read off a couple when he ran across them. I'm still trying to figure out the tag fairy thing. :rolleyes:

FYI :thumbsup2 Cheese Us Greets Us open in my room on Fri at 7:30 am vmk time (1/2 hour after it opens) for those who'd like to meet in vmk and add to your friend's list this way.
Search Caribbean_Gal or, if they allow it, the bold type as a room title. I'll keep it open for about a half hour or longer if there's interest. :dance3:

Loves Disney
06-07-2006, 06:28 PM
FYI :thumbsup2 Cheese Us Greets Us open in my room on Fri at 7:30 am vmk time (1/2 hour after it opens) for those who'd like to meet in vmk and add to your friend's list this way.
Search Caribbean_Gal or, if they allow it, the bold type as a room title. I'll keep it open for about a half hour or longer if there's interest. :dance3:

Because this room will be going against the vmk values, I suggest you be very careful. You will be walking a thin, tight line that has that high risk of snapping. You don't want to get banned...

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 06:45 PM
I understand and I am not accusing you teddie. Alcohol is just not my thing, I live in a border town so I see the affects a lot around me in school. Someone I was talking too in class said he almost died from alcohol poisioning and still goes and drinks. I don't agree with underage drinking at all.

But I do see where you are coming from Teddie and it just another one of those things that is misinterpreted in the bible.


I can understand not giving out personal info, but isn't religion and political bans also treading a fine line of freedom of speech and religion. Note: I do not agree with the fighting, just level headed debates among friends and signatures

cteddiesgirl
06-07-2006, 06:54 PM
I can understand not giving out personal info, but isn't religion and political bans also treading a fine line of freedom of speech and religion. Note: I do not agree with the fighting, just level headed debates among friends and signatures
Actually, since it is a site that is owned and run by them, they set the rules.
You can go out and speak whatever is on your mind on your local street corner and it would be against the law for them to arrest you and put you in jail becuase of it. Unless, of course, you're talking about plotting a terrorist action. ;)
But, if what you are saying or doing in VMK is a major disruption and causes fights (which politics and religion can do), then they have every right to ban you from ever using the site again.

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 09:20 PM
I think you misunderstand me. When someone goes around doing that whole inferno and brimstone act, seriously throw that person out. But what about all those things that say "I know the King of Kings" or "I glove Cheese us". My signature has never started any fights, and I have made several friends through that sig.

I am sorry if it sounds like I am picking on you. I really enjoy talking about one's beliefs and how they are percieved in today's society.

caribbound
06-07-2006, 09:39 PM
Because this room will be going against the vmk values, I suggest you be very careful. You will be walking a thin, tight line that has that high risk of snapping. You don't want to get banned...
Caribbean_Gal does not want to get banned if it's going to be for any length of time, like more than a week. :sad2: TrishaDiva wouldn't mind since I don't care for that name anyway. I may have to come up with a more discreet room title. It's not like we're holding church, just an organized time to meet to get on one another's friends lists so we can meet up again in the vast world of vmk.

cteddiesgirl
06-07-2006, 10:07 PM
I think you misunderstand me. When someone goes around doing that whole inferno and brimstone act, seriously throw that person out. But what about all those things that say "I know the King of Kings" or "I glove Cheese us". My signature has never started any fights, and I have made several friends through that sig.

I am sorry if it sounds like I am picking on you. I really enjoy talking about one's beliefs and how they are percieved in today's society.
I don't feel like I'm being picked on. :)

I'm not saying take out the signatures. I've even said I don't mind them. But, VMK does have a right to make their own rules and enforce them. And if they do find that some people are starting fights over them, then they might start banning for them.
And some people are extremely sensitive and/or argumentative about religion and politics. Haven't you heard about people in the workplace suing others for leaving voice mails saying "have a blessed day"? It has happened.

Saxsoon
06-07-2006, 10:25 PM
I don't feel like I'm being picked on. :)

I'm not saying take out the signatures. I've even said I don't mind them. But, VMK does have a right to make their own rules and enforce them. And if they do find that some people are starting fights over them, then they might start banning for them.
And some people are extremely sensitive and/or argumentative about religion and politics. Haven't you heard about people in the workplace suing others for leaving voice mails saying "have a blessed day"? It has happened.
Ok good, I am glad I wasn't coming off like that. But seriously "Have a blessed day." Wow. :guilty:

cteddiesgirl
06-07-2006, 10:31 PM
Ok good, I am glad I wasn't coming off like that. But seriously "Have a blessed day." Wow. :guilty:
Yes. A couple years ago, that happened.
I also had a co-worker who had that on her voice mail and whenever she left a voice mail for others, she would say that.
There was a complaint made so she had to stop saying it or they might be sued. :(

So I can understand why VMK might have rules about this kind of thing.

Disney Dreams
06-08-2006, 02:11 AM
I have tried to stay out of this thread for the most part, but I really need to make one point. I am certainly not looking to offend anyone or challenge anyone's beliefs. I believe that you should believe what you choose, so long as it does not hurt anyone else.

Now my point -
As much as having something like: "He died for you so you could live." or "I know the King of Kings" in one's signature can unite players, do people also understand that it can alienate players?

If that is the one comment someone has chosen to express themselves, it can be reasoned that this is of strong importance to this person. Someone such as myself, who does not believe those statements to be true, might feel awkward from reading those statements.

By holding a room gathering of players that believe these statements, or simply Christianity, I would be excluded. VMK is not about making people feel excluded. Now, we may get along great, play pirates well together, and help each other get great trades - but we would never find out due to the self-selection filtering of "I know the King of Kings."

Please understand that you could be alienating someone who could otherwise become your best vmk friend - simply because they do not believe the same as you when it comes to religion.

With respect to everyone,
Disney Dreams

maliboomer
06-08-2006, 03:18 AM
I don't really have any sympathy for the girl who had to delete her 'blessed' message, if she wants to have a greeting which everyone can feel warmed and welcomed by, she could choose something more universal...
I'm an atheist, but I don't think religion is stupid or silly.
But still, I don't see how mentioning your religion in anyway on a virtual game for kids is good, and as jegrezo said, it will probably just alienate people, which from my understanding is hardly Christian.

surfcruiser
06-08-2006, 04:58 AM
Ok good, I am glad I wasn't coming off like that. But seriously "Have a blessed day." Wow. :guilty:

Mildly interesting side note: The word "blessed" as it is used in scripture and in early English translations of the Christian Bible is translated from this word in the original language - "Happy."

Have a Happy Day,

lovethattink
06-08-2006, 07:39 AM
Sometimes I feel that freedom of speech is only ok when Jesus is left out of it. There is such a fine line...

Saxsoon
06-08-2006, 09:03 AM
Cruise, thanks for that enlightening post, lol

But Allah and Buhhda and all the other religions are allowed to be brought up in speech. It seems kind of odd you only mentioned Jesus and not religion as a whole. It does seems that way though, talk all you want about religion, but not Christianity.

HeDiedxILive
06-08-2006, 09:15 AM
Cruise, thanks for that enlightening post, lol

But Allah and Buhhda and all the other religions are allowed to be brought up in speech. It seems kind of odd you only mentioned Jesus and not religion as a whole. It does seems that way though, talk all you want about religion, but not Christianity.


Seems like plenty of things that have to do with Christianity are double-standard now days.

In schools, Christians are not permitted to publicly pray because it may offend others... say, a Muslim, or a Jew, or a Hindu, or an Atheist, or a whatever, etc.

But, the Muslim/Jew/Hindu/Atheist/whatever/etc. is allowed to openly practice their religion, because this is a free country, and we have to allow them to, as to not offend them.

Hmmm......



And as far as alienating people... we don't mean to. Everyone is welcome! Open up a "Fall Out Boy Fans" room! If it is not of your interests, then.. who cares? You wouldn't. You would just pass by it, not thinking "how rude, I am not included," but just finding something you enjoy more to do. If you want to come in, then come in! We accept everyone!

Saxsoon
06-08-2006, 09:47 AM
It is not like that they would say " Get out you no Cross ty on!" But really, I don't like Taken, so I steer away from those rooms.